John Wick vs The Purge

@abstractraze: Have you seen John Wick 3? Even though he has the feats in the first two movies to stomp this anyway, that makes this even harder for the Purge mercs.

I don't think so, when you have people with casual miniguns like here, which was intended to show in the second deleted video:

Not sure what the "casual" part means, but miniguns won't do anything to Wick. He can easily find cover, hit their blindspots, outmaneuver them, and cap them without them knowing. Furthermore, he has a basement to hole up in and take advantage of.

Then you have people with flamethrowers, that's just simply too much for him to handle:

Too much for him to handle? Flamethrowers have poor accuracy and a pretty limited range. He caps them before the flame reaches him.

I don't think you understand what Wick's been up against. He's fought snipers, ninjas, expert marksmen, and the world's best mercenaries, all of which have pretty insane amounts of resources at their disposal.

John Wick 3 spoilers below:

The Purge mercenaries can't beat that. A minigun is no more useful against an individual person than an assault rifle, and Wick has faced actually skilled mercenaries with rifles without an issue. Flamethrowers require you to get close to the target, which likely won't ever happen. Furthermore, the user needs a highly flammable tank of gas to use one, meaning that they'd have to enter alone or run the risk of exploding their own teammates and only helping Wick to survive even further. They can't sneak up on him and Wick has speed fast enough to disappear right before your eyes.

While I definitely see that Wick's house might burn down and be destroyed after a few hours, but OP doesn't require him to stay in his home at all; he just starts there. Once he goes on the run, nothing will change. He just continues to decimate incoming forces. He has unlimited ammo. He can't lose this.

Well, the thing is that during the purge movies, we are most likely talking about random events where we have seen one professional commando so far, which was indeed not that well skilled in comparison to the mercenaries from the third Jon Wick movie, but in the second scenario, all the purgers from the United States, knows about the existences of Jon Wick, and the thing is that maybe among the most skilled within the Purge-verse, they are less skilled in comparison to Jon Wick's foes, but they have way more resources, as I said, there are multiple ex-Special Forces divisions across the United States.

They would have Nett Warrior devices, alone such a thing would be Jon's death sentence:

Jon Wick can't permanently run during 12 hours, there will come the time where he has to take a breath and search refuge in a building, they will just track him down with their skill, long-range weapons could just perfectly cover open areas around the building and the flamethrowers would finish the job.

PS:

One more thing, the most skilled mercenaries in the entire Purge series, wasn't that well equipped, there is a probability that if we're talking about an entire nation, there could possibly be mercenaries with those sort of equipment, which is way superior than what the most proficient Purge mercenaries offered.

Bump

@abstractraze:

Well, the thing is that during the purge movies, we are most likely talking about random events where we have seen one professional commando so far, which was indeed not that well skilled in comparison to the mercenaries from the third Jon Wick movie, but in the second scenario, all the purgers from the United States, knows about the existences of Jon Wick, and the thing is that maybe among the most skilled within the Purge-verse, they are less skilled in comparison to Jon Wick's foes, but they have way more resources, as I said, there are multiple ex-Special Forces divisions across the United States.

This is all true. I'm not denying that they have resources and money and power. They simply can't beat Wick because he's that good. Also, the "most skilled" of the Purge universe are still limited to what we've seen on screen; you can't assume imaginary power levels here. That means that these fodder aren't touching Wick since they have no real decent feats.

They would have Nett Warrior devices, alone such a thing would be Jon's death sentence:

Jon Wick can't permanently run during 12 hours, there will come the time where he has to take a breath and search refuge in a building, they will just track him down with their skill, long-range weapons could just perfectly cover open areas around the building and the flamethrowers would finish the job.

Good luck with this. Have the Purge snipers shown the ability to hit someone as fast and as tactical as Wick? Because otherwise, it won't happen. Why do you have some insane obsession with flamethrowers? They are far less effective than an actual gun, since they are very flammable, not accurate, and cover short ranges. Wick could spot and avoid them easily.

You misunderstand the situation here. Wick goes on the run, but he doesn't get spotted in doing so; he'd run before he had to so that the odds would be in his favor. They wouldn't even find him for a while. By the time they do, he's already killing them. Every enemy that can shoot Wick would be shot before they got the chance. Having exposed heads behind cover? Dead. Running away or towards him? Dead. Surrounding him? Been done by actually skilled mercenaries, didn't work. Dead.

Nett Warrior devices mean nothing... They don't make people bulletproof. The High Table wanted Wick dead and they failed, and they have near infinite resources, so much so that they'd know if someone gave Wick bullets for a gun or even told him where pills were on a shelf seconds after his bounty went on.

One more thing, the most skilled mercenaries in the entire Purge series, wasn't that well equipped, there is a probability that if we're talking about an entire nation, there could possibly be mercenaries with those sort of equipment, which is way superior than what the most proficient Purge mercenaries offered.

This is just speculation, so we can't count that as actual evidence in a battle. Even then you ignore the fact that none of them are even close to the completely bulletproof agents attacking Wick (completely bulletproof armor doesn't even exist) and are not as skilled either.

Wick slaughters. 99% of everyone in this thread agrees, too.

He just a better version of Frank Grillos character. He mows through all of them.

@thespartanb345t said:

@abstractraze:

Well, the thing is that during the purge movies, we are most likely talking about random events where we have seen one professional commando so far, which was indeed not that well skilled in comparison to the mercenaries from the third Jon Wick movie, but in the second scenario, all the purgers from the United States, knows about the existences of Jon Wick, and the thing is that maybe among the most skilled within the Purge-verse, they are less skilled in comparison to Jon Wick's foes, but they have way more resources, as I said, there are multiple ex-Special Forces divisions across the United States.

This is all true. I'm not denying that they have resources and money and power. They simply can't beat Wick because he's that good. Also, the "most skilled" of the Purge universe are still limited to what we've seen on screen; you can't assume imaginary power levels here. That means that these fodder aren't touching Wick since they have no real decent feats.

They would have Nett Warrior devices, alone such a thing would be Jon's death sentence:

Jon Wick can't permanently run during 12 hours, there will come the time where he has to take a breath and search refuge in a building, they will just track him down with their skill, long-range weapons could just perfectly cover open areas around the building and the flamethrowers would finish the job.

Good luck with this. Have the Purge snipers shown the ability to hit someone as fast and as tactical as Wick? Because otherwise, it won't happen. Why do you have some insane obsession with flamethrowers? They are far less effective than an actual gun, since they are very flammable, not accurate, and cover short ranges. Wick could spot and avoid them easily.

You misunderstand the situation here. Wick goes on the run, but he doesn't get spotted in doing so; he'd run before he had to so that the odds would be in his favor. They wouldn't even find him for a while. By the time they do, he's already killing them. Every enemy that can shoot Wick would be shot before they got the chance. Having exposed heads behind cover? Dead. Running away or towards him? Dead. Surrounding him? Been done by actually skilled mercenaries, didn't work. Dead.

Nett Warrior devices mean nothing... They don't make people bulletproof. The High Table wanted Wick dead and they failed, and they have near infinite resources, so much so that they'd know if someone gave Wick bullets for a gun or even told him where pills were on a shelf seconds after his bounty went on.

One more thing, the most skilled mercenaries in the entire Purge series, wasn't that well equipped, there is a probability that if we're talking about an entire nation, there could possibly be mercenaries with those sort of equipment, which is way superior than what the most proficient Purge mercenaries offered.

This is just speculation, so we can't count that as actual evidence in a battle. Even then you ignore the fact that none of them are even close to the completely bulletproof agents attacking Wick (completely bulletproof armor doesn't even exist) and are not as skilled either.

Wick slaughters. 99% of everyone in this thread agrees, too.

I don't think so, he might be far more skilled, but we're talking about an entire nation and the Mercenaries shown in the movie 'Purge Election-Year', are tactical and skilled enough and such group of mercenaries represents a fraction of actual existent professional mercenaries in the U.S and especially if we're talking about a country who legalized the Purge.

That's not the case, they will corner him, they will coordinate their positionings very efficiently through the Nett Warrior devices and other alternate military communication technology, once Wick is cornered in some random building, flamethrowers would just finish the job, Jon Wick is completely vulnerable in narrow places, walls would be pretty useless because the fire would spread over blind spots and there won't be any chance for Jon Wick to shot from a window or even approach a window in order to shot back, maybe he has a chance from the second and from the third stage, but there will be tons of mercenaries with snipers and assault rifles around the building, once the flamethrowers entry the first stage, they will just keep advancing and keep clearing the first stage and the fire would just keep ascending/advancing and that's it.

Why I'm obsessed with the flamethrowers, it's because Jon Wick is just simply too fast to be faced with shotguns by less skilled people, I',m already assuming a fatal experience by the mercenaries with over 30-40 loses, those resorting to flamethrowers for a close approach instead of shotguns, machineguns and rifles, yes, it's lame but the best solution so far, flamethrowers are constant and won't allow Wick to counterattack with his exceptional reflexes, the flames would spread over blind spots, those pushing Wick back those increasing the pressure overall.

Now, I know why you're wondering about the flamethrowers, it's an obsolete weapon for actual modern wars, their last use, was for the Vietnam war, but such as the Napalm bombs, it was efficient in the jungle which is a narrow environment with a lot of mobility obstacles and sight limitations.

To be sincere, those agents weren't that greatly skilled and being completely bulletproof is good, but that's not the only thing what makes a good equipment, such as night vision, communication devices and so on, furthermore, Jon Wick had a chance because of the environment/place where they were fighting, he had advanced knowledge over the place and he could ambush far easier, otherwise, they would have killed him without problems.

Those are not speculations, just through the black market is possible to obtain those types of military equipment and ex-special forces would possess more than enough knowledge to buy such equipment.

Don't drag other people, you're discussing with me, make up your own argumentations, rely on yourself.

PS:

Another thing, we are limiting the mercenaries skills based on the most skilled special forces shown during the Purge franchise, now, there are a lot of them in the U.S , there could be worst or better of them, but okay, we can only judge based on what we have seen so far.

@abstractraze:

I don't think so, he might be far more skilled, but we're talking about an entire nation and the Mercenaries shown in the movie 'Purge Election-Year', are tactical and skilled enough and such group of mercenaries represents a fraction of actual existent professional mercenaries in the U.S and especially if we're talking about a country who legalized the Purge.

Again, in Parabellum around 5% of the world's population is after him. These assassins all have much more resources, skills, information, power, and influence than Wick. The High Table is implied to be above governments themselves in Wick's universe. An entire nation isn't going to be on Wick's ass as soon as this begins... They all have to gather gear, get into their cars, drive for hours to his house, and then try and kill him. With so many different groups and people doing this at once, traffic will build up and the entire group will be very disorganized. Sure, there are groups of 100 or so that will come and are skilled, but less-skilled fodder with knives and others will be crowding the area, making it extremely difficult to coordinate and find Wick. Wick would leave before they even surround the house and would easily leave undetected. After that, its several minutes before they find him again, and he's going on to kill all of them. Headshot after headshot after headshot, he'd have the tactical advantage and would have a planned escape route in advance, meaning that he'd be able to leave again before they could hit him.

That's not the case, they will corner him,

You don't do this to John Wick. He's fast enough to literally disappear before your eyes and then be directly behind you, and that's in the eyes of an extremely skilled aim-dodging ninja. Wick can't get cornered, because any visible target is dead or dying as they stand in the open. They'd have to be behind cover because Wick doesn't miss. This means that the Purge fodder either make a mountain of bodies to climb over trying to reach him or simply don't at all.

they will coordinate their positionings very efficiently through the Nett Warrior devices

You're under the assumption that all the Purge fodder are working under perfect teamwork; they aren't. They are simply bloodlusted against Wick, meaning that they just want to kill him. No other context here. This means that smaller groups of 15-50 can coordinate properly with tech, but not hundreds at a time. They all aren't from the same groups, they don't know each other. Furthermore, there are so many individuals here that coordination would be impossible since there's a crowd of thousands blocking the house anyways. The entire nation of Purgers is after him, meaning that there isn't much space here. All of this confusion makes finding Wick even harder, and by then Wick has stolen one of your precious flamethrowers, and likely some explosives as well, and is decimating them from a rooftop far away (with explosives, not flamethrowers.)

and other alternate military communication technology, once Wick is cornered in some random building,

Again, how would they find him in this random building at all? With a mob of thousands, they have no idea where he is (he has insane stealth feats as well) and he's waiting in an advantageous location that specifically prevents him from getting cornered.

flamethrowers would just finish the job,

He caps them dozens of meters away before that happens.

Jon Wick is completely vulnerable in narrow places,

So he doesn't go there? He doesn't have to put himself at a disadvantage... He kills the first few, spots the rest coming, leaves his house and settles in a nicer location that he knows to be safe. Do you think Wick doesn't have contingencies in place around his house? Of course, he does.

walls would be pretty useless because the fire would spread over blind spots and there won't be any chance for Jon Wick to shot from a window

Again, you're assuming that they have to range to reach Wick or even know where he is. Also, trying to burn down the building he is in is just asking for him to dip again to a better location.

or even approach a window in order to shot back,

By less accurate fodder with barely any accuracy feats at all. Plus, he'd find them before they found him. They don't have his presence at all times...

maybe he has a chance from the second and from the third stage, but there will be tons of mercenaries with snipers and assault rifles around the building,

Not immediately. They'd need to get there first. Furthermore, he's already dealt with snipers and assault rifles pretty easily. He's more accurate and also has an assault rifle and can take their weapons... They die.

once the flamethrowers entry the first stage, they will just keep advancing and keep clearing the first stage and the fire would just keep ascending/advancing and that's it.

Flamethrowers are useless here. Within a few minutes, there'd be hundreds of guys from NYC on his ass, though he'd have already left, meaning that the flamethrower guys, which are specialized fodder that doesn't randomly wander the streets, are in the middle of an extremely flammable mob. Using a flamethrower means sacrificing dozens of your own team's lives without even getting to Wick. With the guys with knives up front and the more specialized guys getting there later because of how far away they live, (at least several minutes) shooting at Wick at all is nearly impossible.

Why I'm obsessed with the flamethrowers, it's because Jon Wick is just simply too fast to be faced with shotguns by less skilled people,

Or guns at all? Shotguns have a better chance against Wick due to spread, but pistols, snipers, and rifles fail miserably. Flamethrowers lack the range here as well, so they aren't the holy grail that you make them out to be.

I',m already assuming a fatal experience by the mercenaries with over 30-40 loses, those resorting to flamethrowers for a close approach instead of shotguns, machineguns and rifles, yes, it's lame but the best solution so far, flamethrowers are constant and won't allow Wick to counterattack with his exceptional reflexes, the flames would spread over blind spots, those pushing Wick back those increasing the pressure overall.

Think thousands dead. If the entire nation knows where he is and wants to kill him, then the ones in his neighborhood come first, and they'd only have knives and basic guns. They get stomped. The enemies from neighboring NYC are better off, but their rifles and even military weapons are no match for Wick. Those "flamethrower" guys are pretty damn far away, and the rest of these mercenary groups are also pretty damn far. While some might be based in NYC, how many, in-canon, are there in the state of New York alone in the movies? Most occur in LA, with Election Year happening in DC. Only the latest film was on Staten Island, which is still far from Wick's Manhattan. They'd all have to take a 45-minute drive all at once, plus prep, in crowded Purge streets with crowds of murders all going the same place. So nobody in the first hour of this entire battle has any feats at all, considering that the Purgers in Wick's neighborhood have never been in a film at all.

Now, I know why you're wondering about the flamethrowers, it's an obsolete weapon for actual modern wars, their last use, was for the Vietnam war, but such as the Napalm bombs, it was efficient in the jungle which is a narrow environment with a lot of mobility obstacles and sight limitations.

Yes, a jungle. Against the Vietnamese. This is against John Wick in a suburban, open area with some cover.

To be sincere, those agents weren't that greatly skilled

What? They weren't skilled? The agents completely fodderized dozens of concierges from the Continental, all of whom had the best gear available in the hotel, so bulletproof vests, assault rifles, high-power pistols, etc. They also have pretty high implied levels of skill as well as decent feats. They easily hit the agents from far and still got destroyed, and they are the bodyguards loyal to Winston, meaning they are likely on-par with other assassins similar to Wick.

and being completely bulletproof is good, but that's not the only thing what makes a good equipment such as night vision, communication devices and so on,

Which they had? Lasers, they fought well in a dark hotel, they coordinated well... How wouldn't they have these? Also, night vision means very little because it has a limited range and eliminates peripheral vision, making it even easier for Wick to escape. Communications devices won't work for groups of more than 50 and the crowding makes it pretty hard regardless.

furthermore, Jon Wick had a chance because of the environment/place where they were fighting, he had advanced knowledge over the place and he could ambush far easier, otherwise, they would have killed him without problems.

You're saying that Wick only won because he knew the area? He's worked just as effectively in completely alien environments. Also, you're acting like his accuracy and combat feats have something to do with prep or that bypassing bulletproof armor doesn't count because of prep. Also, how does this argument even help you? The fight is in Wick's house and neighborhood. He clearly knows the area well and would ambush very well.

Those are not speculations, just through the black market is possible to obtain those types of military equipment and ex-special forces would possess more than enough knowledge to buy such equipment.

Okay... They would still be hours away from his house. Furthermore, it's speculation because the films have never shown this before. While I'm not saying it is wrong to assume that somebody would have access to these and would go for Wick, I am saying that they are completely featless with these types of gear and pretty much featless overall, so they wouldn't be effective with or without technology.

Don't drag other people, you're discussing with me, make up your own argumentations, rely on yourself.

I've made my own arguments... And I'm just pointing out how you're a vast minority here.

So since you wanted arguments, let's use statistics. 36 people in this thread have all agreed that Wick wins, with most of them agreeing that he stomps and several saying that he solos the Purge-verse entirely.

2 people, including you, think that he'd lose round one. See the discrepancy here?

PS:

Another thing, we are limiting the mercenaries skills based on the most skilled special forces shown during the Purge franchise, now, there are a lot of them in the U.S , there could be worst or better of them, but okay, we can only judge based on what we have seen so far.

Exactly my point. Can you post some feats that suggest that these mercenaries have any H2H, accuracy, or combat skill at all? Because Wick's enemies certainly do have these feats and Wick has them for sure.

Bump

If they kill his dog then he goes on a rampage. They dont stand a chance.

John Wick can Survive

John would end the Purge forever.

Round 2 they can just burn him in his house alive.

Too many people

Round 1 is a cake walk tho.

After seeing JW3 I can confidently say that John wick is basically capable of fighting the world. Espcially in New york.

I mean, John Wick faced this exact same situation in Wick 3 except the people targeting him were far more skilled

Stomps both rounds

So basically John Wick 3 with far lesser skilled foes. How doesn't Wick stomp?

It's like Parabellum but in casual difficulty.

Wick is way too skilled and ruthless for those chumps. He slaughters them all

JW clears

John has the upper hand in Scenario one, as everyone would underestimate who he is and he could easily just headshot everyone for sufficient ammo. Once he does run out of ammo, from what we've seen in Chapter 2, he smartly takes other weapons from dying or dead enemies, and can use things as projectiles. Scenario 1 is a hard-to-work-for win in Wick's favour.

Scenario 2 is slightly different. We must be more calculative and analytical and look upon each and every individual character, both in the JWU (John Wick Universe) and The Purge. Let's take a look at the Nazi Mercenaries hired by the Government to kick off the Purge. They are highly trained in combat and equipped with state-of-the-art weaponry because of the government funding. But something we see is how the mercenaries were tricked by the Crips, scene linked here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8MFxT9ILKY , and how John's stealth and intelligence is far above these guys, along with his equipped weaponry and H2H, the mercenaries are a big problem, but not because they are stronger physically or mentally, or smarter, but because of their numbers. This would most likely cause the downfall of John. But something John could do is pick them off, one by one. If we refer to the movie Safe House, which I think is great and something you should check out, Tobin Frost, the main anti-hero of the movie, is in a house with only a pistol and picks off the antagonists one by one while still in the house. If John can take this step, the mercenaries could be done for, and his only problem would be the amateurs who have nothing but weapons to use. If things go in John's favour, he takes the win. The mercenaries are not to be underestimated though, as they have shown high capabilities. So, to sum this up:

Round 1: Wick with a little to no challenge.

Round 2: Hand in hand, but siding with Wick.

This would be even eaiser than a normal day for John, he is accustomed to kill armed trained assassins, professional hitmans or experienced ex-military as his regular routine. Killing some bunch of stupid teenagers with guns for twelve hours is a child play.

Wick

This is JW3 but way easier. He wins both rounds

Oh so it’s John Wick 3 but easier. Wick clears

This basically happens in part 4 except the Purgers have no Chidi to make this a challenge for John. They all die.

Like others said, this is JW3 but a lot easier. He curbstomps and kills every one of them.

this aged like fine wine

R1 is far too easy for Wick, nerf him by putting him in his tired, injured state from the end of the second film and he still prevails without any issues.

R2 depends on the number of people sent after him and how well trained they are, if they’re just normal, random people like these films portray then the number doesn’t matter as much since Wick survives manhunts from trained assassins.