So, I think Janemba has greater potential power. He can completely restructure entire realms, in ways we never really see Odin do.
But when it comes to actually translating that power into destructive force in a 1v1 scenario, I think Odin (when written well) does it better. Odin has his fair share of fights that are quite similar to the Goku vs Beerus one, where they were causing quakes across reality that destroyed celestial bodies off in the distance.
And while you could definitely argue this isn’t the most consistent thing for Odin, I think it crops up often enough (particularly when against Hell Lord type entities) for it to be relevant here. And really, Odin kinda needs his higher end feats to compete here anyways.
With that said, agility and skill is still a thing. I think both have swords that would deal devastating damage to their opponent, and it’s entirely possible for Janemba to land fight ending cuts due to the more agile and aggressive nature of DBZ fights.
@zetsu-san: isn't there a big speed difference too?
Comics always ignore speed gaps and just have everyone capable of reacting to anyone. lol
I think Janemba should retain a speed edge, but there's really no point in having the battle in the first place if we're going to assume Janemba can confetti Odin in the blink of an eye.
@zetsu-san: Beg to differ. Realms? Odin put 9 Universes into a Hut and is a casual Galaxy buster. Also far wiser, and More poweful, dudes got multiversal feats (his verse also>>>That verse). Scaling Odin is definitely above.
Also speedbis Irrelevant to characters of Odins Tier. Time stop, And Jax that negates any speed
@zetsu-san: To be fair, you are right in comics to an extent but in DBZ and other animes/mangas, speed is actually often a very big factor. I mean Perfect Cell vs Trunks was even all about that, with Trunks having power, but being too slow for Cell
@zetsu-san: Beg to differ. Realms? Odin put 9 Universes into a Hut and is a casual Galaxy buster. Also far wiser, and More poweful, dudes got multiversal feats (his verse also>>>That verse). Scaling Odin is definitely above.
Also speedbis Irrelevant to characters of Odins Tier. Time stop, And Jax that negates any speed
WOW, okay, umm... I think I know which story arc you're referring to, but you somehow managed to just like... get absolutely everything wrong.... Somehow... Pretty sure this isn't even the first time you've done this, but whatever.
Odin never put any universes inside of a hut. He DID however lock himself and Cul inside of a Hut, where they sat playing games with the promise that Cul would be freed if he won:
Gallery
The prison cell was stated to be "the size of the universe", but I think that's likely referring to Asgard itself, which was a dead universe at the time.
I don't know where you got the "9 universes" from, but Odin DID rip and seal away ONE "Realm", particularly the 10th Realm:
And while it's true that the Realms are sometime referred to as "full universes", depending on the story, in this case; it's quite clear he only sealed away the landmass at the center of the realm, hence why Loki and Thor were able to enter the 10th Realm's space using the rainbow bridge normally and then once they broke the dimensional seal they passed directly into the plane itself:
Gallery
If the above doesn't make that clear cut enough for you, what Odin did to the 10th Realm is more or less the exact same as what he did to Asgard when he decided to make it Cul's prison:
Gallery
Again, in the above you can see that entering Asgard's surrounding space is easy and can be done the normal way, but the landmass itself is surrounded in a dimensional bubble. In the third scan, Loki even directly states that the situations are the exact same, with the only difference being that Odin made the 10th Realm invisible as well.
And let's not forget that the whole reason Odin did this in the first place, was the avoid a battle he was incapable of winning normally:
If he could just casually reshape entire realms/universes in the way you are describing, he would not have needed to do the above. He would have just nuked the 10th Realm out of existence, or used his power to subjugate them and win the war. Instead, an angry and bloodlust Odin, chose to seal them away, as what was explicitly his "only choice", to avoid an endless war that would have consumed and destroyed the 9 Realms.
Funny, where was Odin's time stop when his daughter was getting stabbed in the heart?
Gallery
Yea, yea I know, the Odin Force didn't quite "rise" just yet... But that's another important thing to cover here. Everyone talks about Galactus and how his power fluctuates based on how much he's "fed", but no one ever mentions how Odin is essentially the exact same. The Odin Force is not a static thing with a set amount of power, nor is it something that can be utilized infinitely. It fluctuates, it comes and goes. Hence why he frequently has to enter the "Odin Sleep" to bring it back.
Huge feats in the galaxy to universal range are not things Odin can just casually throw out willy nilly, they require he be at the peak of his Odin Force, and they frequently deplete him. He's also just not a consistent character, generally speaking.
And really, when is the last time Odin used "time stop" as a tactic for winning a fight? More importantly, when is the last time he used time stop on a Hell-Lord level entity, capable of warping reality across an entire universe sized hell, and breaking the concept of death itself?
@zetsu-san: To be fair, you are right in comics to an extent but in DBZ and other animes/mangas, speed is actually often a very big factor. I mean Perfect Cell vs Trunks was even all about that, with Trunks having power, but being too slow for Cell
While it's true that speed is important to DBZ's battles and general chain scaling, it's not as though all the characters operate at specific quantifiable speeds that are consistent all throughout the series.
High speeds in the ftl+ ranges, even in the context of combat speeds, aren't non-existent in comics. Even Thor gets them on occasion.
The gap just tends to get ignored whenever the writers need 2 characters to get a proper brawl. I just can't imagine someone of Odin's status being put up against a speedster and being portrayed as a complete statue, even if the other person is explicitly moving ftl or whatever.
I mean hell, even Hulk intercepted an amped Quicksilver who was circling the planet so fast, he was causing global pentagrams to form.
Time hax can only counter speed if you are fast enough to use it lmao, idk why people turn off their brains to what is obvious. Not to mention Janemba is the physical embodiment of a concept, with reality warping that works on higher dimensional planes.
@zetsu-san: I think he was referring to the battle between odin and seth which was shaking the marvel multiverse or the fight with surtur which shook the 9 realms\universes
@zetsu-san: I think he was referring to the battle between odin and seth which was shaking the marvel multiverse or the fight with surtur which shook the 9 realms\universes
No, he very explicitly claimed Odin put the 9 Universe "inside a hut".
I'm aware of Odin's feats against Seth, Surtur, and Infinity, and even referenced them in my initial post.
That said, considering Goku was shaking reality just by powering up, I'd say Goku and Janemba are fairly comparable on that end as well.
Again, I favor Odin when it comes to actually applying their power to an actual destructive effect in the immediate vicinity, I just think Janemba showed that he has a conceptually higher overall power potential.
only chance for janemba to win is by speed blitz outside of that odin outhaxes him in every regard
I mean he’s so disgustingly faster he would only not have the first move if he was standing still. Plus Janemba is a pretty accomplished reality warper, what’s stopping Janemba from spamming clones of himself and Odin to fight odin? He does do this btw
@zetsu-san: Beg to differ. Realms? Odin put 9 Universes into a Hut and is a casual Galaxy buster. Also far wiser, and More poweful, dudes got multiversal feats (his verse also>>>That verse). Scaling Odin is definitely above.
Also speedbis Irrelevant to characters of Odins Tier. Time stop, And Jax that negates any speed
I don't know where you got the "9 universes" from, but Odin DID rip and seal away ONE "Realm", particularly the 10th Realm:
And while it's true that the Realms are sometime referred to as "full universes", depending on the story, in this case; it's quite clear he only sealed away the landmass at the center of the realm, hence why Loki and Thor were able to enter the 10th Realm's space using the rainbow bridge normally and then once they broke the dimensional seal they passed directly into the plane itself:
Gallery
If the above doesn't make that clear cut enough for you, what Odin did to the 10th Realm is more or less the exact same as what he did to Asgard when he decided to make it Cul's prison:
Gallery
Again, in the above you can see that entering Asgard's surrounding space is easy and can be done the normal way, but the landmass itself is surrounded in a dimensional bubble. In the third scan, Loki even directly states that the situations are the exact same, with the only difference being that Odin made the 10th Realm invisible as well.
And let's not forget that the whole reason Odin did this in the first place, was the avoid a battle he was incapable of winning normally:
If he could just casually reshape entire realms/universes in the way you are describing, he would not have needed to do the above. He would have just nuked the 10th Realm out of existence, or used his power to subjugate them and win the war. Instead, an angry and bloodlust Odin, chose to seal them away, as what was explicitly his "only choice", to avoid an endless war that would have consumed and destroyed the 9 Realms.
Funny, where was Odin's time stop when his daughter was getting stabbed in the heart?
Gallery
Yea, yea I know, the Odin Force didn't quite "rise" just yet... But that's another important thing to cover here. Everyone talks about Galactus and how his power fluctuates based on how much he's "fed", but no one ever mentions how Odin is essentially the exact same. The Odin Force is not a static thing with a set amount of power, nor is it something that can be utilized infinitely. It fluctuates, it comes and goes. Hence why he frequently has to enter the "Odin Sleep" to bring it back.
Huge feats in the galaxy to universal range are not things Odin can just casually throw out willy nilly, they require he be at the peak of his Odin Force, and they frequently deplete him. He's also just not a consistent character, generally speaking.
And really, when is the last time Odin used "time stop" as a tactic for winning a fight? More importantly, when is the last time he used time stop on a Hell-Lord level entity, capable of warping reality across an entire universe sized hell, and breaking the concept of death itself?
@rajjarsalt: First is a cool black-hole/star+ level feat with some conceptual "fabric of reality" type implications. Which is still really really good, and again one of the reasons I think Odin's better at utilizing his power (Though he certainly has better showings in other arcs). Also should take into account that the whole ordeal was a major anger/rage moment for Odin.
Second is nice, but not necessarily dependent on Odin, Thor, and Loki actually "winning" (that's not to say I don't think they would have won, but I do think all details should be taken into account) just causing so much irreparable damage to the 10th Realm that it no longer matters who wins.
Also, consider that Loki tricked most of the Angel forces into kamikazeing themselves. lol
@rajjarsalt: First is a cool black-hole/star+ level feat with some conceptual "fabric of reality" type implications. Which is still really really good, and again one of the reasons I think Odin's better at utilizing his power.
Second is nice, but not necessarily dependent on Odin, Thor, and Loki actually "winning" (that's not to say I don't think they would have won, but I do think all details should be taken into account) just causing so much irreparable damage to the 10th Realm that it no longer matters who wins.
Also, consider that Loki tricked most of the Angel forces into kamikazeing themselves. lol
Well, I was meaning that that's the complementary feat to the one referred above. As that curse he spat had enough power to supply energy demands for the realm until modern times, and then threatened to destroy Heven via implosion, it should be better than only destroying it. Add it to his wind that unbound Heven from the Tree and it should be more than enough imo
@rajjarsalt: First is a cool black-hole/star+ level feat with some conceptual "fabric of reality" type implications. Which is still really really good, and again one of the reasons I think Odin's better at utilizing his power.
Second is nice, but not necessarily dependent on Odin, Thor, and Loki actually "winning" (that's not to say I don't think they would have won, but I do think all details should be taken into account) just causing so much irreparable damage to the 10th Realm that it no longer matters who wins.
Also, consider that Loki tricked most of the Angel forces into kamikazeing themselves. lol
Well, I was meaning that that's the complementary feat to the one referred above. As that curse he spat had enough power to supply energy demands for the realm until modern times and was still strong enough to destroy Heven, it should be better than just destroying it.
Eh, sort of. I agree that "logically" it's a more impressive feat, but in the context of the story, I think it's still presented as something he did because he couldn't just bust it. He was angry and bloodlusted, so there's no reason for him to choose to spare them, especially since Odin from back then has genocided entire races before.
It's not uncommon for magic type powers to end up with situations where a character can perform magic to do one specific thing, and even though that one specific thing is extremely impressive when thought of in physically quantifiable terms, it doesn't necessarily mean they can apply that same level of power to just anything.
In fairness though, there are other arcs that show offensive feats in that range as well as better, which I referenced in my initial post here.
@zetsu-san: I think he was referring to the battle between odin and seth which was shaking the marvel multiverse or the fight with surtur which shook the 9 realms\universes
No, he very explicitly claimed Odin put the 9 Universe "inside a hut".
I'm aware of Odin's feats against Seth, Surtur, and Infinity, and even referenced them in my initial post.
That said, considering Goku was shaking reality just by powering up, I'd say Goku and Janemba are fairly comparable on that end as well.
Again, I favor Odin when it comes to actually applying their power to an actual destructive effect in the immediate vicinity, I just think Janemba showed that he has a conceptually higher overall power potential.
@rajjarsalt: First is a cool black-hole/star+ level feat with some conceptual "fabric of reality" type implications. Which is still really really good, and again one of the reasons I think Odin's better at utilizing his power.
Second is nice, but not necessarily dependent on Odin, Thor, and Loki actually "winning" (that's not to say I don't think they would have won, but I do think all details should be taken into account) just causing so much irreparable damage to the 10th Realm that it no longer matters who wins.
Also, consider that Loki tricked most of the Angel forces into kamikazeing themselves. lol
Well, I was meaning that that's the complementary feat to the one referred above. As that curse he spat had enough power to supply energy demands for the realm until modern times and was still strong enough to destroy Heven, it should be better than just destroying it.
Eh, sort of. I agree that "logically" it's a more impressive feat, but in the context of the story, I think it's still presented as something he did because he couldn't just bust it. He was angry and bloodlusted, so there's no reason for him to choose to spare them, especially since Odin from back then has genocided entire races before.
It's not uncommon for magic type powers to end up with situations where a character can perform magic to do one specific thing, and even though that one specific thing is extremely impressive when thought of in physically quantifiable terms, it doesn't necessarily mean they can apply that same level of power to just anything.
In fairness though, there are other arcs that show offensive feats in that range as well as better, which I referenced in my initial post here.
Tbf the second feat was a new addition to canon, but for the primary feat, I thought it was basically the difference between tearing a world out of orbit and destroying it outright, and for the tier in question, that should be semantics.
Yeah that's true, a specific thing shouldn't automatically be applied generally - however I was thinking the mechanics of this one are worth consideration. Thor/Loki showed that getting through such a spell would take absurd quantities of force, like a cosmic storm that shakes worlds directed to the area of a fingertip. And draining the spell's energies would be suicide.
Though considering this is a thing about vengeance, Odin wasn't even that mad compared to his wife.
Though considering this is a thing about vengeance, Odin wasn't even that mad compared to his wife.
Nah, I'd say they aren't comparable. Odin's is a fast and explosive rage that burns out fast. Freya's is cold begrudging spite. It's like comparing a guy who punches a hole in the wall during an argument, to a chick who slowly and methodically keys your car, pops your tires, and shits in your bed a day later.
Though considering this is a thing about vengeance, Odin wasn't even that mad compared to his wife.
Nah, I'd say they aren't comparable. Odin's is a fast and explosive rage that burns out fast. Freya's is cold begrudging spite. It's like comparing a guy who punches a hole in the wall during an argument, to a chick who slowly and methodically keys your car, pops your tires, and shits in your bed a day later.
Jesus Christ lol
Anyways, I think Odin creating this dimension ought to suffice.
Though considering this is a thing about vengeance, Odin wasn't even that mad compared to his wife.
Nah, I'd say they aren't comparable. Odin's is a fast and explosive rage that burns out fast. Freya's is cold begrudging spite. It's like comparing a guy who punches a hole in the wall during an argument, to a chick who slowly and methodically keys your car, pops your tires, and shits in your bed a day later.
Jesus Christ lol
Anyways, I think Odin creating this dimension ought to suffice.
Log in to comment