Itachi & Kakashi vs Charlotte Katakuri

Fight to death, incap

No prep/random encounter

Both sides have knowledge

Itachi is not Sick, Kakashi has 1 Mangekyou Sharingan

Location: Brulee's Mirror World

Katakuri has no counter to Itachi's genjutsu. He gets mentallly torchured for days or Kamui sniped

Team 1 without much troubles.

Itachi (healty and determined to win Itachi should be far stronger and faster, by Zetsu statement) and Kakashi are genius, especially with knowledge, hax and team work.

Also Katakuri can see a bit the future, but if that future is an illusion? A Genjutsu made fake world? And both of them use Genjutsu.

@kuro_the_artist:

Katakuri has no counter to Itachi's genjutsu.

He can know that it's coming by looking into the future, and then simply not look into Itachi's eyes to prevent their activation.

Can fight with Observation haki instead of sight.

He gets mentallly torchured for days

One Piece characters have weeks worth of stamina so this is not as big a deal as it sounds...

or Kamui sniped

Katakuri's #1 speciality is last-second dodges. No way is any weaker version then DMS Kakashi sniping him.

@ladyadeline:

(healty and determined to win Itachi should be far stronger and faster, by Zetsu statement)

Which he'll more then need, to be to keep up with casual building-lifting top-tier One Piece characters, who scale from the speed of light.

You can not pretend that a 16 foot guy like Katakuri, built for speed, is the physical inferior to Itachi or Kakashi.

Itachi and Kakashi are genius,

And Katakuri is stated as inhuman. He was such a protege that apparently he was capable of walking from straight out of the womb and as far as just about everyone has seen, his back has never once touched the ground.

especially with knowledge,

Knowledge goes two ways. If anything, Katakuri benefits more from knowledge since Sharingan abilities have more strict conditions.

hax

Katakuri has just about the best Anti-hax set-up out there.

and team work.

2 v 1 wont be enough.

@gnomishness: Never said that Itachi/Kakashi are faster than him. Didn't even try to say that. I've just stated that prime and healty Itachi is better than his Edo and ill versions. Katakuri light speed is meh. Highball.

But this is a 2 Genius Team. With hax arsenal:

Kamui, Kotoamatsukami, Tsukuyomi, Izanami, Gengutsu, Amaterasu, Yasaga Magatama, Susanoo with Yata and Tostuka Blade, explosive clones, lightning clones and several other jutsu. Katakuri's haki is impressive but how could he keep up against soo many hax and enemies? With full knowledge Itachi can oneshot him with Tostuka Blade, Kotoamatsukami or Izanami, while Kakashi and arguably several clones distacts Katakuri.

Katakuri gets overwhelmed here. 1 vs 1 he wins, but not against the 2 at the same time with full knowledge.

This is the first time I will use this statment for a naruto debate so here goes

"Team Naruto has too much hax for katakuri to deal with".

?

Never said that Itachi/Kakashi are faster than him. Didn't even try to say that. I've just stated that prime and healty Itachi is better than his Edo and ill versions. Katakuri light speed is meh. Highball.

I wasn't really taking speed into account anyway when thinking about this fight, since One Piece speeds are so difficult to define. However since you brought it up, I was worried you'd rely on it for one of your points and gave a preemptive explanation of why you shouldn't.

But this is a 2 Genius Team. With hax arsenal

The hax won't be effective: Let me explain.

Kamui

I have addressed how useless it would be due to the proficiency Katakuri has at dodging, but I haven't addressed how taxing it is for Kakashi and how it's not exactly the sort of thing he can spam. It's honestly a stretch to even assume he can do it in tedium with anything else, since we never saw any of that outside of DMS Kakashi anyway.

Kotoamatsukami

I'd like to point out that this move can only be used once every 10 years and that the way Itachi uses it, from within the crow, taking prep time to set up. Not like that matters since Katakuri will know not to look at it, and how to avoid doing so thanks to his Observation Haki.

Also, it can only be fired once in this fight even if there is prep, so it won't contribute much to the spam, surely.

Izanami

This is the only move here that has any potential of working at all. Even so, it would be incredibly difficult to get off since it requires a sequence of events to pass before it gets activated, and in this fight, I suspect it would only take one sequence of events for Katakuri to utterly win.

Genjutsu

With this you've just spouted a catch-all term. If you're talking about the sort of nameless Genjutsu Itachi is capable of by doing stuff like wiggling his finger, I'd like to point out that this only works due to sight, which Katakuri doesn't actually need to rely on thanks to Observation Haki. And that we've never seen him do that in conjunction with anything else, so as far as we know, it is incredibly concentration intensive.

Amaterasu,

One of the few things that have a chance of landing. However, considering the Raikage, it doesn't appear instantly lethal to humans, and consider how the Juubi got rid of it and how Naruto got rid of it need the end of the final fight (both by isolating the burning part and separating it from them) Katakuri should be capable of doing the exact same thing with clumps of his Mochi.

Yasaga Magatama,

Obviously Katakuri is capable of dodging it, but even if he wasn't, that attack doesn't have the necessary feats to seriously injure him anyway.

Susanoo

Not really an attack, but I'd address it anyway by saying that this technique was stated deal incredible physical damage to the user in the form of backlash if you only have the regular Mangekyou Sharingan (which are Itachi's eyes). And that Itachi, even while he isn't sick, has not feats of keeping this technique active for more then a few moments. In a practical sense, it's only useful to Itachi as a way to block a last-ditch effort skill, except we haven't seen even a single move from Katakuri that the man isn't capable of spamming.

Also, stuff like "Strength Mochi" is arguably strong enough to bust through the small-mountain level defense anyway.

Yata

Also a defense instead of an attack, but I'd like to point out this thing has no feats even a hundredth as remarkable as it would need to be to be relevant here. And that even at it's worst, it only protects from one direction, while Peerless Donuts can be fired from any angle regardless of the user's spacial positioning.

Tostuka Blade

There is no way they'll hit Katakuri with that. He can literally morph himself around the blade to let it go through his chest without touching him.

explosive clones, lightning clones

The attack portion of these moves won't do enough dame to Katakuri to even slow him down, both move are very intensive and rarely used by their users due to that, and nether are the sort of thing which could be spammed.

As for the fact that they are clones? That is indeed relevant since it allows them to multitask the flurry of their hax a bit better, making it actually possible to have a continuos stream of it. However, such a strategy would exhaust them after the very first volley and Katakuri has enough endurance to survive that long. Especially when much of the stuff can be avoided by just turning his head.

several other jutsu

Can you name them? Because I can't think of anything else revenant enough to even potentially damage Katakuri besides easily exploitable Raikiri variants.

Katakuri's haki is impressive but how could he keep up against soo many hax and enemies?

Two enemies do not make an army. Especially when nether of these enemies are Naruto.

Katakuri has proved himself capable of effortlessly dodging attacks from multiple people at once before at the wedding.

Also, if he's capable of fully dodging an spread-shot attack like kong-organ that attacks him many places at once, he should be capable of dodging attacks from multiple people.

With full knowledge Itachi can oneshot him with Tostuka Blade

You need to hit with Tostuka Blade to one-shot, and that won't happen in a million years. Remember, it's not like Katakuri is actually intangible. Anyway, you're overestimating how easy it is to land that attack in general. Supposedly Nagato was only hit by it due to his lack of mobility; something which Katakuri most certainly does not lack.

Kotoamatsukami

He can just look a different direction.

or Izanami

But will he really use that right off that bat? Seems a bit out of character.

Also, it sacrifices one of his eyes, inhibiting most of his other techniques.

while Kakashi and arguably several clones distacts Katakuri.

Katakuri is far enough ahead in strength that clones won't even slow him down. And if we're talking about the deception aspect of them, Observation Haki can prove which will be real. Also, this one move would alone completely exhaust Kakashi.

Finally, with full knowledge, Katakuri hides behind a curve in the mirror-world and stealth-snipes Itachi to death with a jelly-bean before the two even know where he is, avoiding Sharingan protection by doing thing from behind Itachi.

Team should take this......low dif actually.

kakashi was able to kamui an entire tailed beast (The 8 tails). Katakuri isnt dodging it in the slightest. Itachi also has clones and susanoo and a half dead itachi whos also blinding can react to lightning while kid kakashi can split lightning. Healthy Itachi is TERRIBLY worse than blinding half dead itachi. I also like how ppl forget sharingan is a precog ability two. 2 of them with level 3 tomoe are fine and since they have knowledge, no mirror sorcery or none of that garbage is gonna work. Especially since they'll be on high alert from knowing about it.

just those reasons alone get them the win. I can see this as just being one of those anbu missiions they went on except there was a bit of trouble this time. I dont see how katakuri wins. Team should win 8/10

Probably Katakuri.

@oreo6:

kamui’ing the 8 tails doesn’t really mean much here.

Kid kakashi’s lightning feat is pretty much an outlier, and we don’t know what really happened there.

Itachi’s “reaction” to lightning was thought activated, not an actual dodge or anything of the sort. That barely even counts as reaction. It likely won’t help him here.

Sharingan precog isn’t actual precog, it helps determine the path that physical attacks will take based on their current movement.

Katakuri schools both of them he out stats them both physically and any hax they throw towards him he would be able to avoid them via superior speed and future sight..not to mention with one direct punch from Katakuri that lands on them means death because they have laughable physical durability

@ourmanuel: It means alot actually since the 8 tails is mountain sized like all the other tailed beasts are supposed to be. Katakuri isnt escaping an AOE that big

Nothing about is an outlier so im just gonna ignore that. Ppl usually throw the word outlier around since they cant comprehend something. Not flat out saying ur one of em but since idk u and majority of ppl do it then imma assume ur the same. We already know what happened since gai said he named his move lighting cutter due to cutting the bolt. Thats all we need and the anime also showed us.

It was thought activated? What even is that? Anyways no. Itachi looked dead at its nose and reacted. Saying anything else without evidence is foolish beyond foolish. And it most certainly will help him since hes healthy and at full power like i already said above.

And it also makes things appear slower to the uchiha in use and allows for reading of the opponent. Sasuke used it to EASILY close the gap aginst a Naruto who DESTROYED him in speed at the time. Anyways either way it foesnt help katakuri at all.

Again they have info and are already elite and experiemced ninjas whi have already worked together before. Katakuri will never get an opening. I can even see kakashi kamuing eveey single attack he throws since in the war he was using that jutsu alot.

And if its DMS kakashi then he would no sell katakuri.

@insanemonk: Itachi took attacks from KCM Naruto. Laughable durability my butt bro.

Katakuri

Team wins

Team wins hard

Katakuri

Either Genjutsu or Kata one shots and considering he can see in the future ... I dont see him falling for it.

Katakuri wins.

Their only chance is Genjutsu, Kamui, And Tosuka Blade But Katakuri does have Future sight.

Kata has knowledge so he knows not to look into itachis eyes.

They literally can’t do anything to him

With haki he can fight with his eyes closed and still actively see into the future.

He can counter all of their moves by just turning his body into Mochi.

His striking is casually greater than g2 luffy who can do this

https://youtu.be/wbmYcwwep2I

So unless anyone can provide scans of either Kakashi or itachi tanking striking at least on this level then they can’t even handle a non haki imbued strike from kata.

@oreo6: itachi didn’t take any attacks from naruto, naruto blocked his attacks while they were talking about sasuke.

Then he avoided a non cloaked bee and put him in a genjutsu to which bee escaped.

@skrskr: it's just wank from the Naruto side who have no real arguements this is why the Solo King solos memes started because of the Itachi wank

@skysanji: it’s just crazy to me how blatantly blind or bias people can be.

It's crazy because his character is amazing, but people are ruining it for me

With knowledge Katakru should win, because as long as he avoids being put under genjutsu he should be able to deal with them with his future sight. However he may have some problems breaking through Itachi's susanoo. Itachi also has the yata mirror and totska blade, so in his full susanoo form he could be a real problem. However Katakaru should have better endurance, so if worst comes to worst, he should be able to outlast Itachi.

@alextheboss: lolol, you didn't even mention Kakashi once

@skysanji: He can’t do much here. He is basically all offense, so Katakuri counters him.

@alextheboss: Kakashi is not all offense. The Zabuza fight (literally the first thing in the series where you see Kakashi work) shows this and Kakashi notes he is terribly out of shape. Later in the series he fights and does fairly well against Pain. Kakashi is a strategic genius and very dangerous to just write off.

Still, Itachi solos anyone who does not have an immediate genjutsu counter or is simply outside of his ability to injure. Katakuri is neither.

@SouskueMadara: Kakshi’s sharingan allows him to counter jutsu users, it won’t help him much against Katakuri.

And Katakuri has knowledge, so he can fight with his eyes closed with observation haki to avoid being put under genjutsu. I agree with no knowledge Itachi would have a good chance of winning.

@alextheboss: You do not need eye contact for all types of genjutsu and it isn't something Kakashi uses much beyond his clones.

@SouskueMadara: Has Kakashi ever shown genjutsu that would be relevant in this fight?

Team loses, Itachi can not keep up against someone like Charlotte and Kakashi can't carry his weight.

Giving them knowledge means Katakuri would just blitz at the beginning of the fight.

The team wins.

@skrskr: If i block a nuke, is it still impressive?....alright then. Itachi blocking and withstanding KCM Naruto is not "ass durability".

Also they have info on kata as well so what the heck can he do? Not only do tgey have info but there leagues smarter than him in just raw intelligence and battle smarts unless im missing something.

Nah. Maybe one on one itd be pretty decent but both of them working together clap kata.

@oreo6: you missed the point

Itachi never tanked anything serious from naruto, naruto literally just blocked itachis h2h while they talked about sasuke.

There is no feat to be granted here, itachi and kakashi have 0 physical durability feats to say they can tank the video I linked above and that is just gear 2 no haki imbued luffy, kata was fodderizing gear 2 luffy haki imbued strikes to the point where Luffy’s arms were taking damage just trying to trade with him.

How would you even hope to quantify them being smarter than him?

He can literally constantly see into the future while having complete spatial awareness to his surroundings even with his eyes closed, he can turn his body into Mochi like a logia to avoid any damage or just straight up avoid them with his speed.

Unless you can show some form of physical durability that allows them not to get one shot then there is no conversation to be had here, you aren’t even aware of katas abilities but you are blindly back the team out of pure fanboy bias.

Kata can literally transmutes the entire area surrounding him into Mochi, Mochi that could restrain luffy who is way stronger physically than either on the team.

OP characters had better striking feats than most of Naruto by the Alabasta arc. Katakuri was trading blows with G4 Luffy. Team gets folded and oneshot

@skrskr: Yes he did. He was blocking his attacks. Just cause he didnt take a rasen shuriken or something like that doesnt even matter. This is still KCM Naruto. And he didnt just block, Naruto was swinging back.

Did u seriously just try to tell me how can i quantify them being smarter?.....yeah u lost me big time. How about the fact that itachi scored the 2nd highest test score in the history of the leaf and him having kage level intelligence all at the age of SIX, as well as kakashi being a jonin as a kid as well, joining the anbu at a young age as well as itachi and becoming a sensei. Wat has katakuri done? Eat freaking donuts ??

Id like to see his mochi avoid a kamui or a fireball jutsu from incinerating. Yes id love to see that. How about his mochi avoiding the totsuka blade? Id DEFINITELY love to see that.

I already know about kata. I already mentioned them, ur letting ur salt type ur words for you rn. Try to relax alright. Be mature. Thank you.

I already talked about durability. KCM Naruto. Anything else? And i didnt see what u posted above. Could u repost it?

Anyways im still going with team on this one, salt or no salt.

@comicvinepoozer1: I guess ur one of those ppl that dont look at versatility or other elements in a fight. Raw strength alone. Kata gets clapped XD jk. Well kinda jk. kakashis Susanoo would wreck kata in physical attributes but in this scenario when he doesnt have it, kata folds em in raw power. Altogether, nah.

@oreo6: post scans of him tanking a serious attack from the manga or walk away, and regardless KCM naruto has 0 relevant striking feats to even compare to the one I posted, and if you disagree post a scan to prove me wrong.

He didn’t block anything impressive at all and if you disagree POST SOMETHING TO BACK YOUR STATEMENTS.

I mean how would you quantify their intelligence would let them overcome his future sight and stat advantage in any way...

He literally could avoid everything you listed and because you are saying these things I can tell you know jack shit about katas feats, he will literally see all these things coming before they do with future sight, and will dodge or turn his body into Mochi and take 0 damage. Like what aren’t you understanding about this? He just flat out avoids Tostuka Blade because it has 0 speed feats relevant and kata would know to avoid it because guess what .....FUTURE SIGHT....

So post something to back your statements and until you do they have 0 durability feats to say they can even tank a simple haki imbued strike from kata.

@skrskr: I already agreed he didnt tank anything serious but he still handled punches from KCM Naruto. the same KCM Naruto that scales to raikage and killer bee. Hell, an even weaker version of him was able to slam kurama whos the size of a mountain. He also brute forced his way out of the 4 tails mouth even while he was biting down on him.

Oh cause his 10 second futurw sight is so overwhelming. Tbh 3 tomoe sharingan is a way more impressive technique than kats future sight :/ Kats future sight isnt gonna keep him from losing. Only delay it.

No he cant and now u kinda sound like a fanboy dude...katas mochi cant keep him from being sealed by totsuka blade. Not even gonna hve that argument with you.

Oh wow. I didnt know mochi was fireproof. Hell. I didt even know mochi was amaterasu proof or space manipulation proof ? damn one piece is OP.

Ur talking as if katas the only one who can dodge. Ur saying he'll dodge there attacks and hit them with mochi. Why cant team dodge as well Especailly with two level 3 sharingan users....u sound crazy. 10 second future sight isnt a W taker.

And speaking of zero durability feats. Kata has no feats for a lightning blade getting shoved through his chest. And dont even bring up the mole cause that has nothing on a chidori. Wat are even katas striking feats? He aint putting a dent in itachis susanoo even with his doughnut punches or other mochi techniques.

Also somce team individually is hella smarter than kata and they have info, they would just eat the mochi anyway probably ? just like luffy did. U talk as if all of katas attacks will hit even when team has sharingan which would help them with anything kata has as well.

Anyways ur turn.

@skrskr: Stat advantage my ass. And besides ur asking how intelligence that FAR surpasses ur oppnent keeps u from losing...think about that question bruh bruh.

@oreo6: scales to what? neither of them have striking feats to compete with the video i sent above and if they do post them.

"size of a mountain"

as you can see by naruto holding his tail kurama was not the size of a mountain inside naruto, also he was in sage mode which in raw power level is weaker than kcm but in strength is massively superior to kcm, all of narutos best strength feats come from sage mode so unless you can provide comparable strength feats for kcm your point is moot, also i cant believe you would blatantly lie about kuramas size just because you thought i wouldn't bring scans out. also he never tanked any punches from naruto, do you even read the manga? these are both the only scans where they interacted and all naruto did was casually block and then dodge him, so please show durability scans for itachi tanking anything since you were blatantly lying about him tanking kcm narutos strikes (which have 0 relevant feats anyways)

3 tomoe sharingan is more impressive than constantly seeing into the future while have complete spatial awareness and sensing akin to sage mode? yeah you are trolling for sure.

i never said katas mochi would stop him from being sealed, learn to read... i said he could easily avoid it and he would know to due to his future sight.

see you do not understand how his awakened paramecia powers work, when he turns his body into mochi to avoid chidori, fireball jutsu, or kamui you aren't attacking his real body anymore you are just hitting mochi which he can endlessly regenerate. awakened paramecia are the same as logia except it isn't passive like logias which is why he abuses his future sight to always know when to transform him body into mochi. also huge lol at fireball jutus doing anything when killer bee can casually disperse it in base mode.

katas strikes are stronger than gear 2 luffy who can do this https://youtu.be/wbmYcwwep2I

so please show any physical durability feats for itachis sussano that can withstand this, and then realize how this is non haki gear 2 luffy and kata was fodderizing luffys gear 2 haki imbued strikes.

In turn you have blatantly lied about feats for the team, continuously lowballed kata without any proof and have provided 0 evidence to back any of your claims.

Either solos. Chakra is superior to Haki anyways so I fail to see the relevance of it.

@skrskr: https://www.google.com/search?q=nine+tails+attacks+leaf+village+manga&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwiAqrvi7cnfAhURN98KHZn7BrIQ2-cCegQIABAB&oq=nine+tails+attacks+leaf+village+manga&gs_l=mobile-gws-wiz-img.3..33i10.58573.59067..59181...0.0..0.179.789.0j5......0....1.........33i299.6C4ClE1cp3k&ei=FO8pXIDQD5Hu_AaZ95uQCw&client=ms-android-sprint-us&biw=360&bih=273#imgrc=bsuRJ-yFYyBxSM Put that in ur URL

Alright so now that im done with that.

@oreo6: this proves absolutely nothing, you said when naruto tosses kurama he was mountain sized, and I showed you an actual scan of said feat to show you when he threw kurama he wasn’t the size of a mountain.

Unless naruto is the size of a football field in the scan I posted when he threw kurama he wasn’t the size of a mountain.

Also he was in sage mode, which has much better physical strength than kcm by feats.

You have proven absolutely nothing and you are just making yourself look bad at this point.

@skrskr: ppl always use that dumb excuse "It was in his head". Yeah ight sure. Not even gonna bother with that. A tailed beast bomb was going to kill him yet its not real cause its in his head. Hes visibly getting wounded yet its not real cause its on his head ?

Anyways, bias ignored.

So ur saying sage modes power is stronger than a tailed beast power...the more you type dude....the more you type... Anyways ignoring that as well unless u can prove that amount of crap that u just dribbled onto this thread ?

U talk about fodder points but ur logic is hot garbage. Thats like saying if we see goku in ssj punch mountains apart but in ssj2 we only saw him punch a building then that means ssj is stronger than ssj2. Cmon dude. U can honestly do better than this.

I lied about Kuramas size!?....you know i had respect for you but its all gone now..it really is. And its hypocritical too cause u said i didnt know crap about kata but u dont know crap about kurama. Inform urself before debating. didnt think i had to teach u that especially considering how many posts u made which are also probably all crap.

Did i say he tanked? I said he blocked.

Lesson #2 You should read what ppl type. Blocking a nuke is still impressive is it not? This is just dragging on now. Also KCM Naruto has all the relevant feats unless u can show katakuri being stronger.....dont worry ill wait. Im loving this.

No....3 tomoe is more impressive than 10 second future sight that still didnt prevent him from getting socked by luffy on a few occasions XD but alright dude. Also yes u most certainly did say his mochi would protect him from totsuka blade. Learn to lie better.

I already know that hes a paramecia but what IM SAYING since ur so damn dense for some reason is that kata CAN NOT. Let me put it in quotes for you. "CAN NOT" TANK..a chidori. And i still think there faster unless proven otherwise so a chidoris hitting hom oneway or another. The sucker was leaking from his mole.

His mochi wont avoid kamui. More evidence u dont know Naruto. Kamui would suck him in, mochi or not and would bfr him. If he snipes his head then even if hes mochi, his head either made of mochi or not would is still gettin sniped. Mochi is still physical unless u can prove that too. Oh crap. Are those the scans im hearing!?

Killer bee did that only cause he had samehada which eats chakra......MORE EVIDENCE u dont know Naruto! ?? ur making this too easy man.

In turn uve completely STILL havent shown anything i havent countered and are getting so salty over nothing. Ur salt started pouring even before i started clowning ur sorry ass debating self. Thought this would be fun but then ppl like u exist. And i already told u i didnt see the vid u posted but now that u sent it again, i can see it.

Edit: Welp i saw it and while its impressive I dont see that being stronger than a kirin. Kirin destroyed something way bigger than that and susanoo ate that shit like it was fruit loops and that was a itachi who wasnt even at 50% lol. So i still dont see kata doing anything major.

@skrskr: Ur argument is a fallacy cause ur using the authors drawimg to support ur claim. Kurama is mountain sized. Technically no mountain in anime or manga history is a mountain cause its in a screen and the screen is smaller than even our house. Hes mountain sized. Get over it dude.

Sage mode isnt stronger than KCM and i alreasy explained why thats false with the ssj example....Your desperate. Nothing more. Nothing less.