Ichigos Yamamoto Kenpachi Vs Ziggy

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AdamTheDarkness

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Ziggy vs Bleach 4 Powerhouses

True Bankai Ichigo

Dangai Ichigo

Bankai Yamamoto

Bankai Kenpachi

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Lilgodperv

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Ziggy crushes them.

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Lilgodperv

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#3  Edited By Lilgodperv

Ziggy casually destroyed granbell by waving his hand.

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He also is faaaaaaar stronger than a weakened Xenolith whose gravity flex could affect the entire planet and even pull the cosmic sea that streches throughput the cosmos.

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MasterBuster666

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#4  Edited By MasterBuster666  Online

My god, Ziggy brutalizes.

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DikKhardly

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#5  Edited By DikKhardly

It's not like Ziggy can blow up planets DBZ style. His supposed "planet-level" feat is done by manipulating the gravity of the planet, causing it to collapse on itself, rather than actual strength.

There's no evidence that he could pop planets Asura's Wrath or DBZ style, nor he has any relevant speed feats to react to Ichigo, Kenpachi or Yamamoto reducing him into red mist before his brain neurons could process anything.

Not to mention the said planet is extremely small and there's no evidence that it's size is anywhere comparable to Earth.

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Lennoxrenon

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@dikkhardly: wouldn't Planetary destroying Gravity hax literally be far superior to AP ?

Aint Gravity drain also possibly conceptual by statements ?

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Trideca001

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#8  Edited By Trideca001

Ziggy should take this Ngl.

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Aristeaus

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@dikkhardly: wouldn't Planetary destroying Gravity hax literally be far superior to AP ?

Aint Gravity drain also possibly conceptual by statements ?

No. Breaking a planet apart is just a matter of force. It doesn't really matter if its physical or Gravitational. You could argue that gravitational is easier as it should effect the planet omnidirectionally, where as punching a planet needs to bust it from a single point.

Ziggy certainly has the power to win, but the issue is that Edens Zero characters have meh speed. One could argue that he gets blitzed here, though I am uncertain.

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Lilgodperv

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#10  Edited By Lilgodperv

@Aristeaus: who said they have meh speed?

Shiki can easily dodge lasers that use ether energy. A bigger and more stronger version of such laser can wipe out a planet in seconds from a distance. He can also catch a lightning bolt when he was physically Frozen inside ice, he can also casually dodge Omni-directional energy bullets.

Also Eden zero is an advanced verse and has bullets far faster than our world.

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Aristeaus

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@Aristeaus: who said they have meh speed?

Shiki can easily dodge lasers that use ether energy. A bigger and more stronger version of such laser can wipe out a planet in seconds from a distance. He can also catch a lightning bolt when he was physically Frozen inside ice, he can also casually dodge Omni-directional energy bullets.

Also Eden zero is an advanced verse and has bullets far faster than our world.

I mean... you just did. All of that is pretty meh.

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Lilgodperv

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#12  Edited By Lilgodperv
@dikkhardly said:

It's not like Ziggy can blow up planets DBZ style. His supposed "planet-level" feat is done by manipulating the gravity of the planet, causing it to collapse on itself, rather than actual strength.

There's no evidence that he could pop planets Asura's Wrath or DBZ style, nor he has any relevant speed feats to react to Ichigo, Kenpachi or Yamamoto reducing him into red mist before his brain neurons could process anything.

Not to mention the said planet is extremely small and there's no evidence that it's size is anywhere comparable to Earth.

It's not like Ziggy can blow up planets DBZ style. His supposed "planet-level" feat is done by manipulating the gravity of the planet, causing it to collapse on itself, rather than actual strength.

There's no evidence that he could pop planets Asura's Wrath or DBZ style

False.

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Ether gear can literally change the ether into the body into physical strength and durability.

On top of that with gravity ether gear users can literally change the density of a body be it theirs or others. As shiki can not only change the density of his body to fly but also make other objects less denser to lift extremely heavy objects. Also he can do the opposite by increasing the density of his body.

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In this attack shiki never used Omni directional gravity to destroy a city block. He only used a punch on someone and the force from him completely destroyed the city block and made a giant hole.

All in all Ziggy who is far stronger than shiki can literally change his density or use his ether gear to make himself stronger and punch a planet away if he ever felt like it.

nor he has any relevant speed feats to react to Ichigo, Kenpachi or Yamamoto reducing him into red mist before his brain neurons could process anything.

Next please stop with the speed bullshit. Bleach doesn't even come close to light speed or ftl. And Ziggy scales above 10% shiki who could literally react to lighting bolt when he was frozen inside ice and catch it.

Not to mention the said planet is extremely small and there's no evidence that it's size is anywhere comparable to Earth.

Also there is literally no proof that says granbell is small. This is literally every ez lowballers say. "EdEn ZeRo PlANet SmALl", the best argument ever when it isn't.

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Lilgodperv

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@Aristeaus: Bleach also doesn't have much impressive speed anyways.

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Gorilla_D_Ruffy

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As much as I like Bleach i'm pretty sure they get blitzed and one-shot here

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Aristeaus

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@Aristeaus: Bleach also doesn't have much impressive speed anyways.

Why yes it does. Mimihagi has a legit LS speed feat, and Yhwach reacted to that. Both Aizen and Ichigo fought a Yhwach that powered up twice after that.

Kenpachi, assuming CFYOW is allowed, is faster then all of them.

But again, I did clarify that even I am uncertain of their winning. Ziggy is a problem if he doesn't go down fast.

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Lilgodperv

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@Aristeaus: Can you post the ls feats?

Also remember that Ziggy himself can use Omni-directional gravity that has a planetary+ range and can affect everything in a fraction of a second. Whats stopping Ziggy from crushing them instantly?

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BrownZeus

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@lilgodperv:

Also remember that Ziggy himself can use Omni-directional gravity that has a planetary+ range and can affect everything in a fraction of a second. Whats stopping Ziggy from crushing them instantly?

Though I often like to debate bleach and my mind is quite firm on this topic I would like to talk about the potency of Zigg's gravity.
So Ziggy can turn power into strength? That's great.
That doesn't mean he could even hope to crush the team given how tough they would be, let's delve further:

On the topic of gravity, the ability to crush a planet can be considered an easier feat than crushing the Bleach side in this instance, that is because of what we who like to discuss fiction call AP.
Ziggy has planetary-range gravity manipulation, and he can use gravity on a planetary range all at once, by the nature of how gravity works in this case there is not a lot of gravitational power needed to dismantle a planet. Gravity is what holds a planet together, and if Ziggy can just neutralize the planet's gravitational pull it fails to produce 0-G the planet would dismantle itself apart from the energies that operate on it, a planet's self-dismantling then, in this case, would be further exacerbated by geodynamics; tectonic activities, mantle convection, and other subsurface movements and forces that shape and influence the planet's crust would basically disintegrate most of the planet in an extremely violent way that I can't even hope to grasp!

Yet... all it takes is for Ziggs to cancel out the 1G that we, simple weak humans can withstand. Sure 0G in this case would lead to a human's death as well, but the process of a planet in the scenario above would probably do more damage to the basic human body since all 0G would lead to is a vacuum, a lack of pressure. For all the craziness of space did you know our Blood Vessels can withstand the internal pressure of the blood within without exploding in the vacuum of space?

Surely Ziggy can achieve the destruction of a planet in a more aggressive manner than discussed above, but what I am going with here is more about what @Aristeaus said:

No. Breaking a planet apart is just a matter of force. It doesn't really matter if its physical or Gravitational. You could argue that gravitational is easier as it should effect the planet omnidirectionally, where as punching a planet needs to bust it from a single point.

Because of how Ziggy's power works I would draw the conclusion that Ziggs despite having achieved a feat of planetary range still failed to flex on the level of potency anywhere near planetary, and I seriously doubt crushing stone with pressure will affect the Bleach characters here who mind you are basically all, by the way their verse works what we could call "made with and of pressure" themselves. These are seriously tough individuals in a small package, their size would not make them susceptible to how a planet just would tear itself apart from even the weakes decrease in G forces and so far I think way less tough characters could survive the pressure that Ziggs can manipulate around.

A way more impressive feat for Ziggy in the AP department, though far less impressive in range would be pulling a Dr. Manhattan on some of the cast/people in Eden Zero through sheer omnidirectional gravity forces acting from the inside out:

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Ziggy fodders by actual feats.

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Lilgodperv

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@lilgodperv:

Also remember that Ziggy himself can use Omni-directional gravity that has a planetary+ range and can affect everything in a fraction of a second. Whats stopping Ziggy from crushing them instantly?

Though I often like to debate bleach and my mind is quite firm on this topic I would like to talk about the potency of Zigg's gravity.

So Ziggy can turn power into strength? That's great.

That doesn't mean he could even hope to crush the team given how tough they would be, let's delve further:

On the topic of gravity, the ability to crush a planet can be considered an easier feat than crushing the Bleach side in this instance, that is because of what we who like to discuss fiction call AP.

Ziggy has planetary-range gravity manipulation, and he can use gravity on a planetary range all at once, by the nature of how gravity works in this case there is not a lot of gravitational power needed to dismantle a planet. Gravity is what holds a planet together, and if Ziggy can just neutralize the planet's gravitational pull it fails to produce 0-G the planet would dismantle itself apart from the energies that operate on it, a planet's self-dismantling then, in this case, would be further exacerbated by geodynamics; tectonic activities, mantle convection, and other subsurface movements and forces that shape and influence the planet's crust would basically disintegrate most of the planet in an extremely violent way that I can't even hope to grasp!

Yet... all it takes is for Ziggs to cancel out the 1G that we, simple weak humans can withstand. Sure 0G in this case would lead to a human's death as well, but the process of a planet in the scenario above would probably do more damage to the basic human body since all 0G would lead to is a vacuum, a lack of pressure. For all the craziness of space did you know our Blood Vessels can withstand the internal pressure of the blood within without exploding in the vacuum of space?

Surely Ziggy can achieve the destruction of a planet in a more aggressive manner than discussed above, but what I am going with here is more about what @Aristeaus said:

No. Breaking a planet apart is just a matter of force. It doesn't really matter if its physical or Gravitational. You could argue that gravitational is easier as it should effect the planet omnidirectionally, where as punching a planet needs to bust it from a single point.

Because of how Ziggy's power works I would draw the conclusion that Ziggs despite having achieved a feat of planetary range still failed to flex on the level of potency anywhere near planetary, and I seriously doubt crushing stone with pressure will affect the Bleach characters here who mind you are basically all, by the way their verse works what we could call "made with and of pressure" themselves. These are seriously tough individuals in a small package, their size would not make them susceptible to how a planet just would tear itself apart from even the weakes decrease in G forces and so far I think way less tough characters could survive the pressure that Ziggs can manipulate around.

A way more impressive feat for Ziggy in the AP department, though far less impressive in range would be pulling a Dr. Manhattan on some of the cast/people in Eden Zero through sheer omnidirectional gravity forces acting from the inside out:

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Though I often like to debate bleach and my mind is quite firm on this topic I would like to talk about the potency of Zigg's gravity.

So Ziggy can turn power into strength? That's great.

Every ether gear user can turn the ether into strength. Ether is basically what is chakra/ spiritual energy/ki in other verses.

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Ether gear users basically uses ether to perform superhuman feats. It's has nothing to do with Ziggy converting power in strength.

That doesn't mean he could even hope to crush the team given how tough they would be, let's delve further:

On the topic of gravity, the ability to crush a planet can be considered an easier feat than crushing the Bleach side in this instance, that is because of what we who like to discuss fiction call AP.

Ziggy has planetary-range gravity manipulation, and he can use gravity on a planetary range all at once, by the nature of how gravity works in this case there is not a lot of gravitational power needed to dismantle a planet. Gravity is what holds a planet together, and if Ziggy can just neutralize the planet's gravitational pull it fails to produce 0-G the planet would dismantle itself apart from the energies that operate on it, a planet's self-dismantling then, in this case, would be further exacerbated by geodynamics; tectonic activities, mantle convection, and other subsurface movements and forces that shape and influence the planet's crust would basically disintegrate most of the planet in an extremely violent way that I can't even hope to grasp!

Yet... all it takes is for Ziggs to cancel out the 1G that we, simple weak humans can withstand. Sure 0G in this case would lead to a human's death as well, but the process of a planet in the scenario above would probably do more damage to the basic human body since all 0G would lead to is a vacuum, a lack of pressure. For all the craziness of space did you know our Blood Vessels can withstand the internal pressure of the blood within without exploding in the vacuum of space?

Your entire essay actually fails because gravity powers in Eden zero isn't normal gravity manipulation but manipulating gravity in a conceptual level where time space and concepts can be affected with gravity.

A gravity user in Eden zero can not only affect concepts like pain, but can all make memories fall and powers falls into them. Also it's power is infinite

Ziggy has planetary-range gravity manipulation, and he can use gravity on a planetary range all at once, by the nature of how gravity works in this case there is not a lot of gravitational power needed to dismantle a planet. Gravity is what holds a planet together, and if Ziggy can just neutralize the planet's gravitational pull it fails to produce 0-G the planet would dismantle itself apart from the energies that operate on it, a planet's self-dismantling then, in this case, would be further exacerbated by geodynamics; tectonic activities, mantle convection, and other subsurface movements and forces that shape and influence the planet's crust would basically disintegrate most of the planet in an extremely violent way that I can't even hope to grasp!

Yet... all it takes is for Ziggs to cancel out the 1G that we, simple weak humans can withstand. Sure 0G in this case would lead to a human's death as well, but the process of a planet in the scenario above would probably do more damage to the basic human body since all 0G would lead to is a vacuum, a lack of pressure. For all the craziness of space did you know our Blood Vessels can withstand the internal pressure of the blood within without exploding in the vacuum of space?

Also Ziggy can not only simply manipulate gravity but can create gravity fields to destroy entire worlds.

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A weakened Xenolith's gravity actually crushed the entire planet to the point it ceased to exist as shown in the panel where the planet used to exist

Because of how Ziggy's power works I would draw the conclusion that Ziggs despite having achieved a feat of planetary range still failed to flex on the level of potency anywhere near planetary, and I seriously doubt crushing stone with pressure will affect the Bleach characters here who mind you are basically all, by the way their verse works what we could call "made with and of pressure" themselves. These are seriously tough individuals in a small package, their size would not make them susceptible to how a planet just would tear itself apart from even the weakes decrease in G forces and so far I think way less tough characters could survive the pressure that Ziggs can manipulate around.

A way more impressive feat for Ziggy in the AP department, though far less impressive in range would be pulling a Dr. Manhattan on some of the cast/people in Eden Zero through sheer omnidirectional gravity forces acting from the inside out

:

Overall your entire argument fails as the ez universe gravity does more. Also in Eden zero Shura who is far weaker than post time skip shiki could basically do things like Dr Manhattan as he crushes people into blood smear. Also gravity users can crush specific body parts as shown by shura crushing shiki's eye.

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BrownZeus

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Aristeaus

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@Aristeaus: Can you post the ls feats?

Also remember that Ziggy himself can use Omni-directional gravity that has a planetary+ range and can affect everything in a fraction of a second. Whats stopping Ziggy from crushing them instantly?

I was diagnosed with covid yesterday and am currently in the middle of, what I can only describe as, the worst fever I have ever had by a long shot. It takes me a while to respond, and I don't even wanna fool with image attachments right now. My Apologies. If I regain my composure anytime today, I will do so. I will say it does require some scaling though for LS to be reached.

As for Gravity, please remember that Dangai Ichigo, arguably the weakest or 2nd weakest person on the team, not only withstood a full incantation Aizen's Hadou 90, but he also casually used physicals to break the gravity. A torrent of gravity so great as to warp space and time.

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Lilgodperv

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#22  Edited By Lilgodperv

@Aristeaus: take care dude and get well soon.

Also we don't have much feat of hadou 90 kurohitsugi which only one shotted a bos weaker tier captain and eye monsters. Also we only know it's time space distortion only by aizen other than that we literally have not seen anything noteworthy about it.

Also ichigo broke out if the spell to be exact.

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DerTilt

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GL against someone who can casual destroy a planet,has fate manipulation,Wormholes and can steal your abilitys

And lol at garbage speed.Witch reacting to the bombs.

If one bomb, can destroy a small planet. And 20,000 of them went off at the same time destroying many planets, without Calcing you should already know what a low end result might be versus a high end.

If the same explosions is traveling through space destroying multiple planets at the same time instantly no matter how you look at it it's FTL.

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DikKhardly

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@dertilt: Show me any Eden's Zero character blowing up a planet with a single punch.

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DerTilt

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@dertilt: Show me any Eden's Zero character blowing up a planet with a single punch.

I can show you how someone destroying a Planet by just swining his hand or how Müllers canon washed a Planet away with a shot

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DikKhardly

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#26  Edited By DikKhardly

@dertilt: Again, show me any EZ character blowing up a planet with a single punch or raw strength. "Swinging his hand" isn't a proof.

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Dimitri1220

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@dikkhardly: The power that Ziggy uses to destroy a planet is the same power that he uses to punch. No idea why you think you’re doing something by asking that question

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joshua755

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@jdogg: what manga is ziggy from

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DikKhardly

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#29  Edited By DikKhardly

@dimitri1220: Proof?

Destroying a planet (a very small planet at that) with a punch isn't the same as destroying a planet by manipulating it's gravity, thus creating a chain reaction that "destroys" the planet. There's no feats in EZ that suggest, say, Ziggy can blow up a planet like Frieza did to Planet Vegeta. It would be disingenious to assume Ziggy is some uber strong planet buster when he doesn't have feats to support that claim.

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Dimitri1220

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@dikkhardly: Where does it say Xenolith destroyed Forests with a punch? And the planet Ziggy destroyed is regular sized.

And what do you mean proof? My guy, have you not read a single chapter of Eden’s Zero? The main character’s Ether Gear can be used for long range attacks as well as close combat and both require the same energy/power. You’re the one who needs to prove that it’s hax.

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DerTilt

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@dertilt: Again, show me any EZ character blowing up a planet with a single punch or raw strength. "Swinging his hand" isn't a proof.

Why should i have to post such a feat?This guys can take their own Gravity like its nothing

How about you showing me Bleach can destroy a hill?Not just cut it?

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CosmicEmperor

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@jdogg: what manga is ziggy from

Edens Zero.

Ziggy solos the verse.

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DerTilt

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Lilgodperv

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#34  Edited By Lilgodperv

@dimitri1220: Proof?

Destroying a planet (a very small planet at that) with a punch isn't the same as destroying a planet by manipulating it's gravity, thus creating a chain reaction that "destroys" the planet. There's no feats in EZ that suggest, say, Ziggy can blow up a planet like Frieza did to Planet Vegeta. It would be disingenious to assume Ziggy is some uber strong planet buster when he doesn't have feats to support that claim.

This lowball is actually hilarious. There is literally nothing in the series that says he manipulated the gravity to create some chain reaction.

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First and foremost ether is the source of all power in the universe. Without it everyone dies. Ether gear uses manipulate ether into the body and convert it to perform superhuman feats in the Verse.

Having different abilities are just unique to different ether gears.

Next Ziggy literally shattered granbell and there is literally nothing that says any chain reaction did it. It's your own lowball.

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If that is not enough then we have multiple statements from various people that says foresta was completely erased from the universe by Xenolith's gravity power.

So this again debunks your stupid claim completely.

Next, Dead end crow was able to break the Eden zero's shield and sent it flying. These shields previously could tank a concentrated explosion from 20000 planet vaporizing bombs.

Everything you said doesn't make any sense and has been debunked now. So Stop downplaying things you don't know shit about.

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DikKhardly

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#35  Edited By DikKhardly

@lilgodperv: @dertilt:

Ignoring that ridiculous downplay, in the same fight Dangai Ichigo literally flicks away concentrated 12 fragors with a single swing of his sword which is literally thousands of times better feat than him erasing a mountain with air pressure. There's no other feat in Eden's Zero that comes close to that other than some hyperbole bullshit.

.. Nothing in those pages state "concentrated force of 2000 planet vaporizing bombs", nor they say ether is "the source of all energy in the universe".

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Lilgodperv

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@lilgodperv: @dertilt:

Ignoring that ridiculous downplay, in the same fight Dangai Ichigo literally flicks away concentrated 12 fragors with a single swing of his sword which is literally thousands of times better feat than him erasing a mountain with air pressure. There's no other feat in Eden's Zero that comes close to that other than some hyperbole bullshit.

.. Nothing in those pages state "concentrated force of 2000 planet vaporizing bombs", nor they say ether is "the source of all energy in the universe".

Ok so flicking fodder level fragor is better feat than casually crushing planets and destroying shields capable of tanking 2k planet vaporizing bombs. I see see you are those bleach wankers who say universal orihime cause she blocked yhwach's slash.

.. Nothing in those pages state "concentrated force of 2000 planet vaporizing bombs", nor they say ether is "the source of all energy in the universe".

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Oh sorry, I mean the 20k bombs were going to wipe out the space sector and planets close to the sector. If you actually read the series then I don't have to explain every shit going on.

Yeah I get it now it's no using wasting time on the likes of you.

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Lilgodperv

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@dertilt: Nono bro fragor is 5d universe level cause aizen is in a higher dimension according to some of the smartest bleach debaters.

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DerTilt

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Eustasskid86

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#40  Edited By Eustasskid86

some moderator block this

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DikKhardly

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#41  Edited By DikKhardly

@dertilt: It doesn't have to be planet-busting to be above anything in EZ.

Aizen is so much more powerful than Ulquiorra to the point he could atomize him with his reiatsu.

Which means a single Fragor triumphs Lanza, and could destroy Las Noches many times over and unless you think Las Noches is 100 meters in diameter because of inconsistent visuals (like the small town level Seireitei bullshit) then you could downplay it all the way to wall-level attack like some people here always do. Regardless, a single Fragor could destroy a small-country many many times over. Ichigo flicked away 12 of those with a single swing of his sword and he was toying with Aizen the entire fight.

There's not a single feat in Eden's Zero that comes close to planet busting except for some verse-specific weapon and manipulating the gravity bullshit.

@lilgodperv:

Show me any named character in EZ busting a planet with a single punch.

You can't. Because there's none and that manga panel proves nothing.

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Lilgodperv

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#42  Edited By Lilgodperv
@dikkhardly said:

@dertilt: It doesn't have to be planet-busting to be above anything in EZ.

Aizen is so much more powerful than Ulquiorra to the point he could atomize him with his reiatsu.

Which means a single Fragor triumphs Lanza, and could destroy Las Noches many times over and unless you think Las Noches is 100 meters in diameter because of inconsistent visuals (like the small town level Seireitei bullshit) then you could downplay it all the way to wall-level attack like some people here always do. Regardless, a single Fragor could destroy a small-country many many times over.

There's not a single feat in Eden's Zero that comes close to planet busting except for some verse-specific weapon and manipulating the gravity bullshit.

@lilgodperv:

Show me any named character in EZ busting a planet with a single punch.

You can't. Because there's none.

YESSSSSS COUNTRY LEVEL FRAGOR. That's what I have been waiting for.

Show me anyone in bleach actually busting an island with a punch.

You can't cause there is none.

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DikKhardly

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#43  Edited By DikKhardly

@lilgodperv: Kenpachi stopped a country-busting meteor dead-on, atomized it with a casual strike while not even using Nozarashi (see the anime while he's cutting the meteor) and no SIGNIFICANT damage was done to Seireitei. Which means he cancelled out a country-busting KE, which means each of Shikai Kenpachi's powerful swings are powerful enough to erase a country off the map. Dangai Ichigo has transcended all shinigami which means he could atomize Bankai Yamamoto or Shikai Kenpachi with a single swing of his sword

See, it's not that hard. We have feats to scale from but EZ doesn't have any feats that could suggest anyone could blow up a planet.

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Lilgodperv

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@dikkhardly: lmfao scaling. Now you will say seritei is country sized and what not right 👍.

Please actually show us any country or island busting on panel instead of scaling.

Thus far you haven't brought a single scan that shows us any legit island busting feats, forget about country, continent or planet level.

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Dimitri1220

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#45  Edited By Dimitri1220

People’s brains turn to mush when debating against Mashima’s series on ComicVine. This case study’s gotta be researched.

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DerTilt

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@dikkhardly: Show us Clorox frauds destroying a hill with a punch

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Trideca001

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Ziggy still pretty much solos ngl

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DerTilt

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Seems like Hilllevel Fragor aint enough for Ziggy

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