Hybrid Kaido vs Current Garou vs 8 Gates Guy vs Bankai Kenpachi

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StealthGrey

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Poll Hybrid Kaido vs Current Garou vs 8 Gates Guy vs Bankai Kenpachi (127 votes)

Kaido murks 29%
Garou statues 38%
Guy wrecks 6%
Kenny stomps 27%

Fight to the death

No restrictions

No morals/full bloodlusted

No prep with only basic knowledge

Starting distance: 30 feet apart

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 • 
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Dbzisfodder1

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I smell bait

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Xebec

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#3  Edited By Xebec

Kaido > Garou (current) > Kenny > Guy

my opinion = fax

ur opinion = creditless

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PaleBlood

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Guys wins, Kaido doesn't belong here.

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The_MetaBee

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one peice fans are built diffrent thinking kaido can stand here. anyways bankai kenny might scale to dangai ichigo. the shockwaves alone kill kaido and injure guy to the brink of death. garou is the only one that could be left.

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Ilikecarti

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Its obviously Bankai Ken> current Garou> Kaido> Slow glass canon. Guy is to slow for anyone here and he is on a timer...

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Coadamol

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garou negs all of them easily

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terrorkinggrimm

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between garou and kenny 🤷‍♂️

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Yray

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Between kaido & kenny garou and guy are fodder

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Boby501

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Kenpachi>>>>>Garou>Guy>Kaido

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Omnihater

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This is between Kaido and Guy, Kaido is faster but Gai has more stats, Kaido could win if just avoids Gai and oneshits him (because Gai is somehow fragile in this form)

Kenny and Garou get fodderized.

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NinjaRizer

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Bankai Kenny >>>>> Guy => Garou > Kaido.

Kenpachi is planet level, stop putting him against people for below him, as this is a mismatch.

Kaido should be facing the likes of Bazz-B and BM Naruto rather than facing characters of this tier.

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SkySanji

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Kaidou> Kenpachi >>>>>>Garou>>>>>>>Guy

Guy can’t touch anyone here even if he does have the power to kill them

Garou is just fodder to Kaidou and kenpachi

Kaidou is too fast for kenpachi

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TorrusSilver

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TorrusSilver

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Yray

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Planet lvl kenny ..lmao

Bm naruto and buzz b same tier as multi continental character?..

🤡

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NinjaRizer

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#17  Edited By NinjaRizer
@yray said:

Planet lvl kenny ..lmao

Bm naruto and buzz b same tier as multi continental character?..

🤡

Is Ichigo planet level?

You understand I can immediately point out your hypocrisy with your multi-continental Kaido?

I dare you to say no planet-level feats. I dare you.

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Mamba23

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#18  Edited By Mamba23

Those saying kaido wins🤡

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NinjaRizer

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#19  Edited By NinjaRizer
@torrussilver said:

@ninjarizer: That's funny

@torrussilver said:

@ninjarizer: Lmao at planetery kenpachi

Damn right he is. Wanna have a go at debunking it? It'll be fun, why not!

If you refuse to read and continue to hold your opinions, guess what, you automatically lose due to committing a logical fallacy:

Invincible ignorance fallacy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invincible_ignorance_fallacy#:~:text=The%20invincible%20ignorance%20fallacy%2C%20also,argument%2C%20ignoring%20any%20evidence%20given.

And ANOTHER fallacy too:

Appeal to the stone

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_the_stone

Get to debunking, GhostWarren :)

The Bleach Power Systems

Simply put, there exist two main power systems that are concerned with fighting. It is Reiryoku, and Reiatsu.

Reiryoku is Spiritual Power/Energy. It exists within every Soul Reaper, and grants them heightened response times, control and reaction speed:

No Caption Provided

Reiatsu, which is spiritual pressure, is Reiryoku exerted. It exists as long as the Soul Reapers heart functions, and grants them heightened durability and attack power:

You must consciously exert your Reiatsu, otherwise, your attack power and durability will falter. Examples:

Aizen vs Ichigo.

Aizen is mortally wounded by a fodder Ichigo.
One page later he swats away the same Getsuga Tenshou with his bare hands, receiving no damage.

Ichigo vs Kenpachi.

Ichigo increases his Reiatsu, cuts Kenpachi, and blocks his strikes.
Because he relaxed his Reiatsu, Kenpachi bifurcates his blade.

Now, what happens when a person exerts their Reiryoku into Reiatsu (pressure) to attack?

It is far stronger.

Summary:

  • Reiryoku is Spiritual power/energy. This exists in every soul.
  • Reiatsu is Spiritual pressure. Shinigami use this to attack and create attacks.
  • Reiatsu is Reiryoku exerted, essentially Reiryoku under pressure.
  • Attacks with Reiatsu are far stronger than Reiryoku alone, as it is pressurized.

The Power of the Soul King husk

The Soul King husk uses Reiryoku ONLY in order to carry out its roles. There are several reasons why we know this is a fact.

  • It is never stated to have Reiatsu.
  • It has no Reiatsu because it has no beating heart (Gerard is the Heart of the Soul King). Reiatsu ceases to exist once a person's heartbeat ceases.
  • The Soul King is stated to not be able to exhale, or rebel. It cannot exert itself.
  • SK Yhwach, who was dead and has no beating heart, was sealed as pure Spiritual Energy (Reiryoku). He was a corpse, and has no heartbeat.

Evidence here:

Now it's established as a fact that he's only using his Reiryoku, let's look at what he actually does.

The Soul King has one role. To prevent the destruction of the Bleach worlds, caused by a chaotic Soul Flow, using his Reiryoku as fuel.

I'll unequivocally prove all these claims using on-panel feats, statements, and CFYOW.

Yhwach states that the Soul Society is made unstable by the vast amount of Konpaku that flow through it and that when the Soul King dies, all the worlds would cease to exist:

On panel you see the destruction caused to the worlds from the destruction of the boundaries.

The flow of souls would first destroy the boundaries, then the planets themselves:

States the boundaries were almost destroyed, states the world was surrounded by an incredible force causing worldwide earthquakes from the destruction boundaries alone.

The Soul King uses his Reiryoku as fuel, as Hikone was going to be used as fuel for the new system:

No Caption Provided

What doesn't the Soul King do?

He doesn't control the flow of souls.

The souls flow anyway, regardless of his input. He simply exists to stabilize the destructive nature of the soul flow, hence why he is used as fuel to make the system that makes the three realms continue.

He doesn't balance the souls.

Shinigami do this. They literally do it actively, and the Soul King cannot do this, he isn't sentient.

We know, therefore, that the Soul King's Reiryoku, is being used as fuel to stop the destruction of multiple worlds, which we see on-panel. This is the energy he holds within himself.

For example, look at what a much weaker Soul Flow could produce in terms of energy:

It was able to create an energy that could draw two dimensions together, and destroy them both in a massive collision, stated multiple times:

Kubo in his sketches also depicts the destruction of planets at the end of the Soul King's life:

Clearly depicts planets being crushed into oblivion, ringed planets, moons.

Again, back to the beginning. What would happen if the Soul King, was able to use his Reiryoku, as Reiatsu, to attack? What if he was alive?

That is the force of a Reiryoku that can prevent the destruction of worlds, for millions of years, while being used as fuel. His energy is running out.

Summary:

  • The Soul King uses his Reiryoku, not Reiatsu.
  • He stops the destruction of the Bleach cosmology using his energy as fuel.
  • Many media sources depict and state exactly what would happen, on panel and in statement form.
  • This same energy can be used to attack if he was sentient, in the form of Reiatsu.

Hikone had enough Reiryoku to be the Soul King:

No Caption Provided

Obviously, Base Kenpachi was on his level, if not above it, meaning he's planet level.

Don't be lazy, you say this everytime, maybe you'll try and debunk this once.

Same goes for you, @yray, with your multi-continental Kaido (instant hypocrisy)

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JuzaCloud

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Bankai Kenpachi is not needed here. I'd say Shikai Kenpachi without his eye patch is enough to beat everyone here. Garou is the fastest though.

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Ilikecarti

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#21  Edited By Ilikecarti

No way people actually think fodder Kaido beats Ken. Like wha

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Boby501

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If Yamma is Star level due to Bankai than Bankai Kenny is at least multi planet buster.

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NinjaRizer

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No way people actually think fodder Kaido beats Ken. Like wha

Regardless of whether people accept planet level Kenpachi, even the common level Kenpachi is at is far, FAR above Kaido, and in the entire verse of One Piece by feats alone, no scaling.

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Omnihater

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This dude keeps with this shit when i already debunked that smh.

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Ilikecarti

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@ilikecarti said:

No way people actually think fodder Kaido beats Ken. Like wha

Regardless of whether people accept planet level Kenpachi, even the common level Kenpachi is at is far, FAR above Kaido, and in the entire verse of One Piece by feats alone, no scaling.

Agreed. Ken doesn't need to be planetary to one-shot Kaido...

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NinjaRizer

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#26  Edited By NinjaRizer
@omnihater said:

This dude keeps with this shit when i already debunked that smh.

You know you didn't debunk it right? You committed two fallacies:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invincible_ignorance_fallacy#:~:text=The%20invincible%20ignorance%20fallacy%2C%20also,argument%2C%20ignoring%20any%20evidence%20given.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_the_stone

If I'm wrong, go to the thread where I absolutely manhandled you on the Bleach canon (everyone could see that except you) and find a single scan that you posted to debunk me:

Heres the thread (Pages 2 and 3)

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/hybrid-kaido-vs-shikai-kenpachi-2186234/?page=3

Link any post where you posted a scan, any post (doesn't exist, obviously, look forever).

This is the same guy that said Soul King Husk >>> Prime Soul King (complete nonsense) and that the Soul King got all his power from his name (rancid headcanon)

Are you going to be so self-righteous that you think you, could debunk me, without posting a single scan? Remove your finger from your ass.

Good job though, if you still believe this stuff :)

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Omnihater

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@ninjarizer:

You know that there is not need to bring scan to be right? You at leats know how to debate?

I asked ONE single question, you didnt bring the proof, neither anyone bring to this single day.

Bring proof of the SK doing what he "can" do WITHOUT being sealed, i dont want narratives or anythig, bring the proof or concede.

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Jko1

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#28  Edited By Jko1
@juzacloud said:

Bankai Kenpachi is not needed here. I'd say Shikai Kenpachi without his eye patch is enough to beat everyone here. Garou is the fastest though.

How fast is Garou? Cause here we have

Kaido being ftl

Guy being relativistic.

Kenny being MHS+.

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terrorkinggrimm

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Kaido is irrelevant here bruh

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JuzaCloud

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#30  Edited By JuzaCloud

People forget just how many massive power ups Zaraki has.

Removal of eye patch power up

Two handed sword swing power up

Shikai power up

Bankai power up

He destroyed a gigantic meteor in Shikai with his eye patch still on and with a one handed swing. He already can be argued to beat everyone here at this level. This version of Zaraki could easily drop Sage Centipede that awakened Garou just fought. This version of Kenpachi could also wreck one eyed Juubidara just like 8th gate guy did.

Then against Gerard, Zaraki used Shikai without his eye patch and a two handed swing. That's a massive power up. This version of Zaraki could go heads up with full power Juubidara unlike Guy.

Finally, Bankai Kenpachi gets an even more massive power up. They don't stand a chance.

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NinjaRizer

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@omnihater:

You know that there is not need to bring scan to be right? You at leats know how to debate?

Oh, so you REALLY think you can debunk me without posting a scan?

I asked ONE single question, you didnt bring the proof, neither anyone bring to this single day.

Oh, wait, whats this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invincible_ignorance_fallacy#:~:text=The%20invincible%20ignorance%20fallacy%2C%20also,argument%2C%20ignoring%20any%20evidence%20given.

A logical fallacy that you committed. Guess which other logical fallacy you comitted?

Bring proof of the SK doing what he "can" do WITHOUT being sealed, i dont want narratives or anythig, bring the proof or concede.

Here's the other logical fallacy:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Nothing like a good old strawman.

You seem to think that I was arguing that the Soul King husk can do whatever he can do without being sealed.

That's not my argument, it has nothing to do with what I was trying to say. I'll make clear now, so you finally realize, it's actually YOU who has the burden of proof.

My point is that they have the Reiryoku (the spiritual power) to perform the feat that the Soul King does. They have this Reiryoku, WITHOUT being the Soul King.

It is directly stated that Aizen, Ichigo, AND Hikone can assume the role of the Soul King, it doesn't matter if they haven't done it, they can.

It is a fact that Reiryoku can be converted to Reiatsu in order to attack. Obviously I can prove this unequivocally (both statements), so this is my point. You have the burden of proof to disprove these statements:

  • Prove that Aizen and Hikone do not have Soul King husk level Reiryoku.
  • Prove that Reiryoku doesn't convert to attack power.

If again, you double down on your ignorance by saying this nonsense again:

Bring proof of the SK doing what he "can" do WITHOUT being sealed

Don't ever say you debunked me with this headcanon garbage. Sub someone else in.

You're like a fighter who's been knocked out yet is still contesting the stoppage.

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StealthGrey

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Still no votes for Guy?

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Omnihater

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@ninjarizer:

>You seem to think that I was arguing that the Soul King husk can do whatever he can do without being sealed.

Concession accepted.

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JuzaCloud

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@jko1 said:
@juzacloud said:

Bankai Kenpachi is not needed here. I'd say Shikai Kenpachi without his eye patch is enough to beat everyone here. Garou is the fastest though.

How fast is Garou? Cause here we have

Kaido being ftl

Guy being relativistic.

Kenny being MHS+.

Gariu is FTL

And how do you have Zaraki so slow? He's easily way above MHS+. Zaraki is relativistic to FTL depending on which version and at one point.

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NinjaRizer

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@jko1 said:
@juzacloud said:

Bankai Kenpachi is not needed here. I'd say Shikai Kenpachi without his eye patch is enough to beat everyone here. Garou is the fastest though.

How fast is Garou? Cause here we have

Kaido being ftl

Guy being relativistic.

Bankai Kenny being FTL (can react to Hikone, who is high-relativistic, in base form)

Garou is at least 4x FTL from feats alone.

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xraydog

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this poll is almost funnier than the yamcha vs ichigo poll. rip guy you didnt have a snowball's chance in hell

ot: kenny if he can catch garou lol the other two are non factors

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NinjaRizer

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#37  Edited By NinjaRizer
@omnihater said:

@ninjarizer:

>You seem to think that I was arguing that the Soul King husk can do whatever he can do without being sealed.

Concession accepted.

Can you believe the balls on this guy?

He constructs a strawman, which is nothing to do with my argument, and when I ignore the strawman, he thinks I conceded.

This is fodder tier debating.

But alas, even though this has nothing to do with my argument, I can easily debunk his insolence, with his own words.

Look at what you said on the other thread:

Mmmm nope, the soul king before was a person without the capabilities of doing what he was able to do, then the 5 beings sealed him to maintain the worlds and use his powers to split the worlds as well.

You said the (Prime) Soul King before was a person without the capabilities of doing what he was able to do. Maintain the worlds, and create the worlds.

Therefore, you are stating the 5 Elders GAVE the Soul King his power, as he didn't have this power beforehand:

Therefore, four questions shall be afforded to you.

If they could grant this power why did they state that the Prime Soul King's power was the only power who could perform this feat:

Why did they go through the effort of removing a power they could grant by just sealing someone and renaming them the Soul King:

No Caption Provided

Why couldn't they have just named one of THEMSELVES the Soul King and performed this feat themselves?

Everybody on this thread, pay attention to what he said in the last thread:

Mmmm nope, the soul king before was a person without the capabilities of doing what he was able to do, then the 5 beings sealed him to maintain the worlds and use his powers to split the worlds as well.

He was sealed under the name of Soul king, names gives powers/abilities, its not so hard to understand.

Now read this scan:

No Caption Provided

Interesting. One of the 5 Elders was determined to be sealed as the Linchpin, but he didn't have the power?

@omnihater thinks the 5 Elders gave the Soul King his name and subsequently his powers, but why was the Shiba ancestor searching for a technique when they already had the technique (renaming) according to him?

Oh, the last question.

Will you concede with dignity?

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Omnihater

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@ninjarizer:

Im not reading anything of that, when the thing im asking for can be putted in one quote or Scan.

Bring me a proof of SK affecting/destroying the worlds without being sealed, in his prime or in his husk version.

Ill wait.

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terrorkinggrimm

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@omnihater: show me one continent busted in one piece 😭

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NinjaRizer

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@ninjarizer:

Im not reading anything of that, when the thing im asking for can be putted in one quote or Scan.

Bring me a proof of SK affecting/destroying the worlds without being sealed, in his prime or in his husk version.

Ill wait.

Can we all see this? LOL

I'm going to quote from the page detailing the invincible ignorance fallacy:

The invincible ignorance fallacy,[1]also known as argument by pigheadedness,[2]is a deductive fallacy of circularity where the person in question simply refuses to believe the argument, ignoring any evidence given.

simply refuses to believe the argument, ignoring any evidence given.

simply refuses to believe the argument, ignoring any evidence given.

Credit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invincible_ignorance_fallacy

Do you guys agree that this guy has been fodderised?

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NinjaRizer

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@omnihater: show me one continent busted in one piece 😭

Shhhh, don't say this. He'll choke on his hypocrisy :O

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Omnihater

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@ninjarizer:

Bruh, your argument is that SK is planetary even without the seal right?

Where is the evidence of that :skull:

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Mee09

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#43  Edited By Mee09

I didn't realize Comic Vine had Kaido over Kenpachi now as well lol

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Ilikecarti

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NinjaRizer

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#45  Edited By NinjaRizer

@mee09 said:

I didn't realize Comic Vine had Kaido over Kenpachi now as well lol

They don't.

If anyone does, they are akin to flat earthers and conspiracy theorists.

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Mee09

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#46  Edited By Mee09

@ninjarizer: I would hope so lol.

The scaling for One Piece here is very bizarre these days.

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terrorkinggrimm

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huntercuistot

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Kenpachi >> Kaido > Garou >> Guy

Kenpachi wins, with Kaido being his toughest match.

Awakened Garou solos tho, just give it some time

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NinjaRizer

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#49  Edited By NinjaRizer

@ninjarizer:

Bruh, your argument is that SK is planetary even without the seal right?

Where is the evidence of that :skull:

You are indeed ineffectual.

Bring someone else, your status as a competent debater has been revoked, and if you claim that you debunked me out of this thread again, I'll link this thread and it'll embarrass you.

Look at this guy, he says :

Where is the evidence of that

Posts the evidence:

Im not reading anything of that, when the thing im asking for can be putted in one quote or Scan.

How would you even know this?????

You're getting flattened time and time again, over and over, I'm convinced you likely want to covert your entire being into a doormat, soil, or otherwise any substance that lay beneath one's feet.

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Yray

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@mee09 said:

I didn't realize Comic Vine had Kaido over Kenpachi now as well lol

They don't.

If anyone does, they are akin to flat earthers and conspiracy theorists.

The irony...

Says the guy that calls kaido BM naruto and bazz b tier and argues with faulty statements and assumptions as foundation for his claims.

Bruh