HST vs Fairy Tail

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FT has all the members prior to being disbanded but Post TS feats are applicable for those who have

Current Luffy and Ichigo

KCM Naruto

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Mije_101

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Fairy Tail gets wrecked.

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colliderz

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Gomu Gomu No Bijuu Dama Tenshou

GG

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Leo-343

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...what?

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saikyo3000

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Either one of HST solos.

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loumast

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@colliderz: Soooooooo much this. I can only imagine Luffy pulling his arm back all shredded XD haha

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HST

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DarkRaiden

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Fairy Tail. Laxus, Erza, Gray, Gildarts gg. Also Fairy Law gg

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#9  Edited By colliderz

Fairy Tail. Laxus, Erza, Gray, Gildarts gg. Also Fairy Law gg

lol care to explain? Starting from why they won't get blitzed right off the bat

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Gomu Gomu No Bijuu Dama Tenshou

GG

This version doesn't have Bijuu Dama.

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#11  Edited By Mije_101

@colliderz: He's still not over the Yusuke vs Naruto thread.

He's just coated in salt, trust me.

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comicvinepoozer1

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Fairy Tail wins due to my bias

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roronuffy

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As I say everytime Fairy Tail gets put up against these guys: Fairty Tail needs speed feats. Until it has one they get speed blitz soloed by any one of the HST main characters.

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thatguywithheadphones

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As always, the HST clean house.

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Aesop

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Speedblitz gg

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@darkraiden said:

Fairy Tail. Laxus, Erza, Gray, Gildarts gg. Also Fairy Law gg

lol care to explain? Starting from why they won't get blitzed right off the bat

Laxus moves at lightning speed (literally as lightning) and Natsu has reacted to him and others to him and so on. So they have pretty decent speed. Plus even low tiers like Lucy are fast enough to dodge sniper fire they can't see, which is near hypersonic. And Lucy's super slow compared to everyone here.

They win due to Laxus' lightning and power, Gildarts ability to town bust by....falling down and his ability to cut/dissemble even an infinite point of gravity. Erza......is Erza. 'Nuff said. (Seriously, she has armor for everything, took on 100 high level monsters at once and has anti-magic armor). She's fast, strong, was a townbuster a while ago.

Gray has freezing magic that should freeze any of them if they get caught (iced shell). And Natsu can eat anything and has his powerful fire attacks. And has taken down and fought with Dragons who are mountain busting at the least. Before his amp.

And of course, fodder keeps everyone busy and Fairy Law kills everyone who's an enemy.

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#17  Edited By colliderz

@darkraiden:

Laxus moves at lightning speed (literally as lightning) and Natsu has reacted to him and others to him and so on. So they have pretty decent speed. Plus even low tiers like Lucy are fast enough to dodge sniper fire they can't see, which is near hypersonic. And Lucy's super slow compared to everyone here.

So essentially what you are saying is no different then Kalifa and Kakashi reacting to lightning which then gets scaled throughout their entire cast respectively... FT characters doesn't even have speeds in two digit Mach, them having lightning speed is inconsistent as hell anyway your logic is a double standard so regardless HST is still fast enough to blitz

They win due to Laxus' lightning and power, Gildarts ability to town bust by....falling down and his ability to cut/dissemble even an infinite point of gravity. Erza......is Erza. 'Nuff said. (Seriously, she has armor for everything, took on 100 high level monsters at once and has anti-magic armor). She's fast, strong, was a townbuster a while ago.

Laxus' lightning what? Luffy already whopped the floor with a lightning manipulator who happens to be leagues above Laxus

Infinite gravity=black hole=star level+.... Hold on do you imply Gildarts is star level?

So just because she blocked Kaguya's sheath release attack which merely spanned through 10-15 buildings Erza is considered a town buster?

Gray has freezing magic that should freeze any of them if they get caught (iced shell). And Natsu can eat anything and has his powerful fire attacks. And has taken down and fought with Dragons who are mountain busting at the least. Before his amp.

In character Gray won't use ice shell plus everyone in team HST is capable of speed blitz and one shot him.

Motherglare is the only dragon Natsu has beaten and that's only because he was amped by Atlas regardless HST is already above mountain level anyway...

And of course, fodder keeps everyone busy and Fairy Law kills everyone who's an enemy.

You mean the fodders who will get KOed from the start by Luffy's Haki

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@darkraiden: First off, would like to say that Laxus in no way shape or form can move at Lightning speed. He transforms himself into magical lightning which doesn't equate into lightning speed. For such an incredible feat, something like that needs to be stated. It's kinda like saying that current Natsu's fire can never be any hotter than real fire even though he melted an arena with his fire. If it isn't proven by statement or feats then it can't be used as an argument otherwise suddenly every character that has every used lightning as a weapon will be lightning speed.

Gildarts does have enough power to destroy a town, though that his most impressive feat so far since we haven't seen Gildarts do anything more than that. Anything more would be speculation and assumption. That infinite point of gravity you are talking about is probably that black hole that Blue Note made? Once more it is a magical black hole, not a real one which would have done more than bring rocks to its location. More like a real black hole would have swallowed the entire planet in a matter of minutes...

Erza is powerful and extremely diverse so you are correct about that so far but you can't just say "'nuff" said because yo gotta prove why she's tough and fast enough to take the other characters. She def isn't faster than KCM Naruto or current Luffy from what I know of their abilities...idk about Ichigo so I don't watch Bleach though so imma leave that for someone else to argue ^.^

Gray's ice magic feat was when he froze Mard Geer and his thorns which were easily broken through by the man and also was only used against objects...iced shell is a suicide spell which shud work but only if he has reaction speed to not get blitzed. Totally depends if he's feeling suicidal but I ain't 100% sure. I know KCM Naruto can blitz him but idk enough about the others for that.

Natsu cannot eat everything, this forum uses stated or shown feats to prove one character is stronger than another. So far he can eat fire and a small bit of etherion (which almost killed him) and "maybe" lightning since we didn't actually see him eat it in the manga from what I remember...also I nvr seen a dragon that he has taken down mountain bust b4. Can u provide scans plz?

Fairy Law worked against Jose who is a chump compared to these characters and requires a long time to cast properly from what I've seen. If these characters are as fast as I think they are then they shud blitz anyone that tries it. Tbh, I just don't see FT winning. Plz tell me if you disagree :P

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Leo-343

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And DarkRaiden succeeds again by baiting two more people.

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@leo-343: I'm new to the forums :P I felt like everyone deserves a chance to explain their opinion ya know?

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@darkraiden:

So just because she blocked Kaguya's sheath release attack which merely spanned through 10-15 buildings Erza is considered a town buster?

I agree that Fairy Tail loses, but Erza is small town level with Armadura Fairy Armor. She destroyed a floating island when she clashed with Knightwalker.

The full size of the island is the top panel

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@strictlyanime: Even a small town is pretty big while that island looks kinda like a pretty close knit neighborhood from where I'm looking at it. Ya sure it's small town level? Then again the clash didn't happen on the island itself so if the shockwave alone did that then the dmg itself should be even greater. I think maybe medium sized village level if dis-including Erza Knightwalker's contribution into the shockwave. What you think?

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Leo-343

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@rektpride: It's fine, I agree, just a heads up: DR likes baiting Naruto fans.

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#24  Edited By StrictlyAnime

@strictlyanime: Even a small town is pretty big while that island looks kinda like a pretty close knit neighborhood from where I'm looking at it. Ya sure it's small town level? Then again the clash didn't happen on the island itself so if the shockwave alone did that then the dmg itself should be even greater. I think maybe medium sized village level if dis-including Erza Knightwalker's contribution into the shockwave. What you think?

A Small village is somewhere around the place Gildarts destroyed, and I could see that being Erza's level as well.

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RektPride

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#25  Edited By RektPride

@strictlyanime: If that's a small village then I think that Erza is at least medium-sized village. *-.- Thnx for the scan! :D

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@darkraiden:

Laxus moves at lightning speed (literally as lightning) and Natsu has reacted to him and others to him and so on. So they have pretty decent speed. Plus even low tiers like Lucy are fast enough to dodge sniper fire they can't see, which is near hypersonic. And Lucy's super slow compared to everyone here.

So essentially what you are saying is no different then Kalifa and Kakashi reacting to lightning which then gets scaled throughout their entire cast respectively... FT characters doesn't even have speeds in two digit Mach, them having lightning speed is inconsistent as hell anyway your logic is a double standard so regardless HST is still fast enough to blitz

They win due to Laxus' lightning and power, Gildarts ability to town bust by....falling down and his ability to cut/dissemble even an infinite point of gravity. Erza......is Erza. 'Nuff said. (Seriously, she has armor for everything, took on 100 high level monsters at once and has anti-magic armor). She's fast, strong, was a townbuster a while ago.

Laxus' lightning what? Luffy already whopped the floor with a lightning manipulator who happens to be leagues above Laxus

Infinite gravity=black hole=star level+.... Hold on do you imply Gildarts is star level?

So just because she blocked Kaguya's sheath release attack which merely spanned through 10-15 buildings Erza is considered a town buster?

Gray has freezing magic that should freeze any of them if they get caught (iced shell). And Natsu can eat anything and has his powerful fire attacks. And has taken down and fought with Dragons who are mountain busting at the least. Before his amp.

In character Gray won't use ice shell plus everyone in team HST is capable of speed blitz and one shot him.

Motherglare is the only dragon Natsu has beaten and that's only because he was amped by Atlas regardless HST is already above mountain level anyway...

And of course, fodder keeps everyone busy and Fairy Law kills everyone who's an enemy.

You mean the fodders who will get KOed from the start by Luffy's Haki

I have no idea who Kalifa is but Kakashi has never reacted to lightning on panel. Not actual lightning. And there's no double standard, Laxus literally turns into lightning when he does that one move. And Lucy being hypersonic with reactions still scales Fairy Tail to be really fast.

Gildarts faced a guy who had a gravity move that was stated to be a point of infinite gravity and dissembled it. I'm not saying it, just parroting the manga back to you.

And Erza' s island buster actually. I forgot the time she clashed with an alternate Erza and they busted an island.

Pretty sure Gray does use iced shell in character (or how else would we know about it) and he's taken hits from very powerful people. No one in the HST is oneshotting or blitzing.

Natsu physically punched down a dragon who's roar decimated entire parts of a town and was at least mountain busting (the explosion was far above mountain busting by scale). HST isn't far enough above mountain busting to be able to take Natsu easily is the point. No one in Fairy Tail is being KO'd by Luffy's Haki.

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@leo-343 said:

@rektpride: It's fine, I agree, just a heads up: DR likes baiting Naruto fans.

I don't bait anyone. They literally just assume I do because we disagree. it's pretty strange.

@darkraiden: First off, would like to say that Laxus in no way shape or form can move at Lightning speed. He transforms himself into magical lightning which doesn't equate into lightning speed. For such an incredible feat, something like that needs to be stated. It's kinda like saying that current Natsu's fire can never be any hotter than real fire even though he melted an arena with his fire. If it isn't proven by statement or feats then it can't be used as an argument otherwise suddenly every character that has every used lightning as a weapon will be lightning speed.

Gildarts does have enough power to destroy a town, though that his most impressive feat so far since we haven't seen Gildarts do anything more than that. Anything more would be speculation and assumption. That infinite point of gravity you are talking about is probably that black hole that Blue Note made? Once more it is a magical black hole, not a real one which would have done more than bring rocks to its location. More like a real black hole would have swallowed the entire planet in a matter of minutes...

Erza is powerful and extremely diverse so you are correct about that so far but you can't just say "'nuff" said because yo gotta prove why she's tough and fast enough to take the other characters. She def isn't faster than KCM Naruto or current Luffy from what I know of their abilities...idk about Ichigo so I don't watch Bleach though so imma leave that for someone else to argue ^.^

Gray's ice magic feat was when he froze Mard Geer and his thorns which were easily broken through by the man and also was only used against objects...iced shell is a suicide spell which shud work but only if he has reaction speed to not get blitzed. Totally depends if he's feeling suicidal but I ain't 100% sure. I know KCM Naruto can blitz him but idk enough about the others for that.

Natsu cannot eat everything, this forum uses stated or shown feats to prove one character is stronger than another. So far he can eat fire and a small bit of etherion (which almost killed him) and "maybe" lightning since we didn't actually see him eat it in the manga from what I remember...also I nvr seen a dragon that he has taken down mountain bust b4. Can u provide scans plz?

Fairy Law worked against Jose who is a chump compared to these characters and requires a long time to cast properly from what I've seen. If these characters are as fast as I think they are then they shud blitz anyone that tries it. Tbh, I just don't see FT winning. Plz tell me if you disagree :P

I agree that Laxus' lightning attacks aren't considered lightning speed, but when he literally turns into lightning to move, I don't see what else that could be. It's literally lightning moving from one spot to another. Not a projectile, but actual lightning. So I disagree about that.

Gildarts destroying a town puts him....well way above it because he did it on accident. So we know it's casual. Nothing can be said for sure, but we can at least note that he put literally negative effort into it. And the black hole is the one from Blue Note. The issue isn't that it's magical (usually you're right it needs statements or feats) but that it was literally stated right on panel to be a point of infinite gravity. Do I believe it to be star+ black hole level? No. Do I think it shows that Gildarts can Disassemble nearly anything? Yes.

Erza 'nuff said is half joke half true for readers of the series. I don't think Naruto or Luffy are fast enough to blitz her or slow enough to be blitzed. But that's bad for them since she has enough random ass powerful feats to beat them IMo. Especially physically.

Gray has inherited the same magic that froze an entire village, couldn't be melted by Natsu's flames, and froze a fire dragon. That should be enough. Gray might not be suicidal off the bat, but it's an option if he gets beat down/friends are about to die.

Natsu has eaten god flames (which were stated not be able to be eaten), dragon flames, lightning (he can literally use and store lightning) pure magic as in etherion (gave him a belly ache btw) and the other dragonslayers have eaten things like shadows and light so it's pretty safe to say that Natsu can eat anything.

Fairy Law is so powerful that Makarov wouldn't use it in conjuction with Grimoire Law because it'd kill everyone IIRC (or so he thought). And this was people with island busting feats and durability. It should be enough for the HST

Dragon mountain busting and beyond: http://i7.mangapanda.com/fairy-tail/333/fairy-tail-4198991.jpg

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@darkraiden: Idk, you seem to be relying on some interesting logic on some of them. Laxus indeed turns into lightning to move, but to say that lightning that was formed by magic is as fast as natural lightning is extremely faulty logic. Case in point, when Laxus fought Natsu with lightning-enhanced punches, he at most made small holes in the ground with his physical attacks. Someone moving at the speed of lightning and attacks that do as much dmg as real lightning would completely destroy the entire building with one punch. Period. Lightning for the split instant it hits the ground is hotter than the surface of the sun, yet the building still stood. At least initially. To assume that Laxus' lightning is like natural lightning is essentially pissing on what real lightning can do. Case in point, Natsu's fire can no go beyond what real fire can do which means magic doesn't = natural. Based on Laxus' speed feats when not considering that, then it isn't impressive at all. At most supersonic and thats pushing it tbh unless you got some good manga feats I haven't considered.

The town you mentioned wasn't rly a town...at most it was a small village when looking at the feat. The amount of houses literally barely reached the 20's and that's assumption. Problem is that outside of that and his fight with Blue Note, we have no idea his capabilities. To assume more than he has already done is just that, assumption which can be done with anyone. Best use shown feats. Gildarts' feat with the black hole isn't impressive because despite what Blue Note stated, it turned out to be hubris. If a character claims they can do "A" but was proven wrong then it isn't a feat. The black hole barely lifted rocks so it's impossible for it to be "infinite gravity", like Memento Mori, and the Genises Zero, they were proven wrong in their caster's assumptions. Literally happens all the time in FT. Gildarts' limit seems to be based on Acnologia which is small island buster for now. (Not country buster since we don't know circumstances like how big the country was, was it one-shotted, how long it take to attack, did he pepper with same attack against Tenrou Island, is it a truth or fiction?) And before you state that Gildarts said Acnologia was holding back., he stated that when Acnologia was literally swiping at FT mages with physical strength. Not until afterwards did Acnologia use his Dragon Roar, and since Gildarts was there and he can disassemble anything, why didn't he do it at that moment? Cause he can't, so he DOES have limits.

Erza is faster than Wendy who is fast enough to respond to sniper bullet so yes Erza is indeed fast and extremely versatile. Albeit I personally believe KCM Naruto truly is Lightning Speed (which I can explain thoroughly if ya want) but I'm pretty sure that Luffy and Ichigo are of similar speed at the very least, so no blitzing there.

Yes, Grey has indeed inherited the magic from Silver...but those are Silver's feats. Not Grey's. To assume that he can do the same thing now is assumption. Until we see similar feats then he con't be insta-freezing. (Does he know ice shell? Idk tbh, if this is bloodlusted then I can see it but it requires a long charge-up to do if I recall so he can be taken down before he finishes)

Once more wierd logic, he ate quite a few things so far but to assume he can eat EVERYTHING is way out there. We use feats in this forum right? So to assume when he can eat some things that now he can eat all things don't count, unless he has been seen eating it then he officialy can't eat them. At least I'm pretty sure thats how this works otherwise everyone will be doing the same thing like "Oh! Naruto punched a Zetsu and turned into a tree thus if Naruto punched someone then they can turn into a tree too!" get it? Ya gotta show the character can do it before you can use the argument.

Fairy Law and Grimoire Law, Makarov was worried they would destroy both guilds with the explosion from the magic, but they didn't have island busting durability. Hades at most had extremely-small mountain durability last time I checked and was defeated by Acnologia with pure strength (though he was wounded at the time so not best example) and took a guild-busting attack with a big wound in his titan form (Jupiter Cannon was stated to only destroy the guild not the area around it) Yet I also didn't hear that either were worried about themselves, only the guild in the crossfire in a relatively small island. AKA, the low durability mages could tank it.

I concede the point about dragons being mountain-busting ^.^

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@darkraiden: Idk, you seem to be relying on some interesting logic on some of them. Laxus indeed turns into lightning to move, but to say that lightning that was formed by magic is as fast as natural lightning is extremely faulty logic. Case in point, when Laxus fought Natsu with lightning-enhanced punches, he at most made small holes in the ground with his physical attacks. Someone moving at the speed of lightning and attacks that do as much dmg as real lightning would completely destroy the entire building with one punch. Period. Lightning for the split instant it hits the ground is hotter than the surface of the sun, yet the building still stood. At least initially. To assume that Laxus' lightning is like natural lightning is essentially pissing on what real lightning can do. Case in point, Natsu's fire can no go beyond what real fire can do which means magic doesn't = natural. Based on Laxus' speed feats when not considering that, then it isn't impressive at all. At most supersonic and thats pushing it tbh unless you got some good manga feats I haven't considered.

The town you mentioned wasn't rly a town...at most it was a small village when looking at the feat. The amount of houses literally barely reached the 20's and that's assumption. Problem is that outside of that and his fight with Blue Note, we have no idea his capabilities. To assume more than he has already done is just that, assumption which can be done with anyone. Best use shown feats. Gildarts' feat with the black hole isn't impressive because despite what Blue Note stated, it turned out to be hubris. If a character claims they can do "A" but was proven wrong then it isn't a feat. The black hole barely lifted rocks so it's impossible for it to be "infinite gravity", like Memento Mori, and the Genises Zero, they were proven wrong in their caster's assumptions. Literally happens all the time in FT. Gildarts' limit seems to be based on Acnologia which is small island buster for now. (Not country buster since we don't know circumstances like how big the country was, was it one-shotted, how long it take to attack, did he pepper with same attack against Tenrou Island, is it a truth or fiction?) And before you state that Gildarts said Acnologia was holding back., he stated that when Acnologia was literally swiping at FT mages with physical strength. Not until afterwards did Acnologia use his Dragon Roar, and since Gildarts was there and he can disassemble anything, why didn't he do it at that moment? Cause he can't, so he DOES have limits.

Erza is faster than Wendy who is fast enough to respond to sniper bullet so yes Erza is indeed fast and extremely versatile. Albeit I personally believe KCM Naruto truly is Lightning Speed (which I can explain thoroughly if ya want) but I'm pretty sure that Luffy and Ichigo are of similar speed at the very least, so no blitzing there.

Yes, Grey has indeed inherited the magic from Silver...but those are Silver's feats. Not Grey's. To assume that he can do the same thing now is assumption. Until we see similar feats then he con't be insta-freezing. (Does he know ice shell? Idk tbh, if this is bloodlusted then I can see it but it requires a long charge-up to do if I recall so he can be taken down before he finishes)

Once more wierd logic, he ate quite a few things so far but to assume he can eat EVERYTHING is way out there. We use feats in this forum right? So to assume when he can eat some things that now he can eat all things don't count, unless he has been seen eating it then he officialy can't eat them. At least I'm pretty sure thats how this works otherwise everyone will be doing the same thing like "Oh! Naruto punched a Zetsu and turned into a tree thus if Naruto punched someone then they can turn into a tree too!" get it? Ya gotta show the character can do it before you can use the argument.

Fairy Law and Grimoire Law, Makarov was worried they would destroy both guilds with the explosion from the magic, but they didn't have island busting durability. Hades at most had extremely-small mountain durability last time I checked and was defeated by Acnologia with pure strength (though he was wounded at the time so not best example) and took a guild-busting attack with a big wound in his titan form (Jupiter Cannon was stated to only destroy the guild not the area around it) Yet I also didn't hear that either were worried about themselves, only the guild in the crossfire in a relatively small island. AKA, the low durability mages could tank it.

I concede the point about dragons being mountain-busting ^.^

Real lightning doesn't bust buildings though. And I'm not talking about his lightning punches I'm talking about when he turns into lightning and moves. That's it. As for Supersonic, as mentioned before, even Lucy and Wendy dodged Sniper bullets (mach 3 at least).

A village is a town is a village. Just saiyan. And Blue Note wasn't proven wrong, Gildarts just disassembled his attack before it could do anything. You can't assume that Gildarts can't disassemble Acnologia just because he didn't. That opens up A LOT of assumptions to who can do what and just confuses things.

Naruto, Ichigo, nor Luffy are lightning speed. But regardless I agree with no blitzing.

Gray by proxy gets Silver's feats. Same way a power copier gets feats from someone they copied and so on. It only makes sense. It's just the limits of devil-slaying ice magic.

Natsu ate pure magic. Equalized that's chakra, reiatsu and haki. Non equalized he (and other dragon slayers) still ate pure magic, lightning, and shadows. Like....shadows aren't even tangible. And they ate them. And Zetsu is literally made of tree/wood things so it's not the same.

Gildarts and Erza at the time had at least island level durbaility. If Fairy and Grimoire law can oneshot them it can oneshot the HST as they don't have above island level durability.

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Yhwach can solo FT, probably. Add in all the rest of Bleach, as well as Naruto and OP; and well...FT stands zero chance.

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FT isn't winning this. Ichigo alone should pose too much of a problem. Luffy could be handled by Gildarts. That's about it though. Ichigo and Naruto aren't getting beat by anyone from FT guild.

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yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

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@ratava: That's not all Gildarts has done though. He busted a hill with a single punch iirc.

And Erza drilled a hole through an island with a nameless armor :3

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@ratava: That's not all Gildarts has done though. He busted a hill with a single punch iirc.

And Erza drilled a hole through an island with a nameless armor :3

yeah but those were the mentioned feats:

And Erza' s island buster actually. I forgot the time she clashed with an alternate Erza and they busted an island.

thats was not an island busting feat.

- it was the last all-out-attack of two ezras

- the floating island is only "island"by name, it size was maybe city-block (+) level

= no island busting + combined effort

Gildarts destroying a town

- again, we see the size of that "town" above in the scan in posted

= no town busting lol

Natsu physically punched down a dragon

- again out of context, natsu was thrown by atlas flame

= not a feat under natsus own power

but thats nothing new, that "special" person who posted those feats has a lot of problems with context/hyperbole

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@darkraiden:

I have no idea who Kalifa is but Kakashi has never reacted to lightning on panel. Not actual lightning. And there's no double standard, Laxus literally turns into lightning when he does that one move. And Lucy being hypersonic with reactions still scales Fairy Tail to be really fast.

By calling it ''not actual lightning'' you are creating yet another double standard considering Laxus' lightning also happens to be magic which again is not natural I don't remember Lucy's feat but being merely hypersonic does not justifies you are lightning speed which is at worst three digit in Mach

Gildarts faced a guy who had a gravity move that was stated to be a point of infinite gravity and dissembled it. I'm not saying it, just parroting the manga back to you.

You are parroting back something that doesn't makes sense unless you believe Gildarts is star level+

And Erza' s island buster actually. I forgot the time she clashed with an alternate Erza and they busted an island.

They busted an island which has what not no proof of being any larger then a city block

Pretty sure Gray does use iced shell in character (or how else would we know about it) and he's taken hits from very powerful people.

He was willing to use it once because it was a personal matter and had internal conflicts as a character, Iced Shell=Dead Gray. There is no reason for him to use a suicide attack here

No one in the HST is oneshotting or blitzing.

You are yet to show feats to suggest this

Natsu physically punched down a dragon who's roar decimated entire parts of a town and was at least mountain busting (the explosion was far above mountain busting by scale). HST isn't far enough above mountain busting to be able to take Natsu easily is the point.

First off all as I said Natsu was amped by Atlas so beating dragons is not a everyday power level for Natsu also this versions of HST are all above mountain level with decent margin

No one in Fairy Tail is being KO'd by Luffy's Haki.

Prove it

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@darkraiden: Tahts just it, you can't assume his literal "change into lightning" can be as strong and fast as real lightning if none of his attacks actually has been shown to that extent. You're assuming he can because you want him to, to assume he can do something so ridiculously good, you need someone stating how fast he is going or how fast lightning is. You can't just say Laxus' lightning isn't as strong as real lightning but is as fast as real lightning because his magical lightning has been proven to not be as strong, So there is no way it can be as fast. Only as strong and fast as his magical lightning. Which isn't that fast or strong.

The instant an "infinite point of gravity" was placed it should have swallowed up the entire island they were on at the time. A black hole can swallow PLANETS, and that is indeed an infinite point of gravity. To say that it isn't a real black hole and then turn around and say it is an infinite point of gravity makes NO sense because if it isn't then it *can't* be an infinite point of gravity. Hyperbole, pure and simple no matter which way you hash it. Like Memento Mori and Genesis Zero that follows it. You can't say that villains haven't said that their magic are awesome and then proven wrong before so this is the same damn thing.

Ok you're logic with Natsu, Gildarts, and Gray is essentially this: "You can't prove that they can't do it"...

That's stupid. Of course I can't but that isn't even the point. You need to prove that they CAN do it not that they cannot. If I assume that based certain instances that a character can do *A* and ignoring the circumstances around it then suddenly he can do it whenever the hell he wants. The Zetsu example is made from wood-style chakra, NOT literal wood. Since chakra is equalized by withother energies...Naruto cna one-shot everyone and turn them into wood because his chakra is literally that powerful. The argument I made is yours with those FT characters in a nut-shell. Suddenly Naruto doesn't have a limit to his strength cause I can say that "The Raikage can move at light-speed because that one time he was moved he didn't get hurt at all!!!! So you can't prove that he can't move at light-speed!" Same argument. You can't assume that these character have something when it isn't even shown, if you do then the shit I just listed is truth as well.

Btw, you still haven't explained why Gildarts couldn't stop Acnologia's attack. Plz explain why he can disassemble anything when he couldn't stop that eh?

To assume that Grey got all of Silver's powers is wierd again because it wasn't stated that thats how DS powers works. The best example is that he got a new sword which he doesn't know how to use properly, the sword = DS magic. You made your assumption based on literally nothing. Silver gave Grey the power, not the knowledge to be blunt. Like how Ur gave Grey the power of Ice-make magic, he had to learn how to use it still.

Btw, Natsu ate a very small piece of that pure magic. Literally he grabbed a rock of ethernion and took a little bite out of it. Then he had what looked like a massive seizure where he was chocking and his pupils disappeared to enforce the fact that he almost died taking that power. Kinda skipped through that when you mentioned his feats. If that happens to him with a little bit, what the hell would happen if he tries to *eat* HUGE amounts at once since...ya know....all of the characters have a LOT of energy.

Gildarts couldn't stop Acnologia's attack otherwise he would have and Erza at the time barely stopped Jupiter Cannon which was stated to destroy the guild and nothing else. She barely stopped a building-buster with her strongest armor. You're thinking Erza later in the series and even then that durability feat you claimed is somewhat suspect.

Once more, it isn't you gotta prove you can't do it. It's that you gotta prove that they can. That goes for everyone.

Btw I can't speak for Luffy or Ichigo so I don't know their current powers well but I will leave other debaters to argue in their stead. I only know Naruto and FT pretty well so yeah I do in fact think KCM Naruto can blitz. I guess I will show you later but not now.

Lastly...Wendy pushed Lucy out of the way. Not Lucy herself. WENDY did. Pluz that was much MUCH later in the series which speaks nothing about Laxus' speed feats in the near beginning. Not even gonna mention that Natsu matched him in the speed department in the last skirmish in that fight...unless you're gonna tell me that early Natsu is lightning-speed too?

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Toriko>>>>>>>>>Bleach>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>naruto>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Fairy Tail>>>>>One Piece

I hope this helps!

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@darkraiden: Tahts just it, you can't assume his literal "change into lightning" can be as strong and fast as real lightning if none of his attacks actually has been shown to that extent. You're assuming he can because you want him to, to assume he can do something so ridiculously good, you need someone stating how fast he is going or how fast lightning is. You can't just say Laxus' lightning isn't as strong as real lightning but is as fast as real lightning because his magical lightning has been proven to not be as strong, So there is no way it can be as fast. Only as strong and fast as his magical lightning. Which isn't that fast or strong.

The instant an "infinite point of gravity" was placed it should have swallowed up the entire island they were on at the time. A black hole can swallow PLANETS, and that is indeed an infinite point of gravity. To say that it isn't a real black hole and then turn around and say it is an infinite point of gravity makes NO sense because if it isn't then it *can't* be an infinite point of gravity. Hyperbole, pure and simple no matter which way you hash it. Like Memento Mori and Genesis Zero that follows it. You can't say that villains haven't said that their magic are awesome and then proven wrong before so this is the same damn thing.

Ok you're logic with Natsu, Gildarts, and Gray is essentially this: "You can't prove that they can't do it"...

That's stupid. Of course I can't but that isn't even the point. You need to prove that they CAN do it not that they cannot. If I assume that based certain instances that a character can do *A* and ignoring the circumstances around it then suddenly he can do it whenever the hell he wants. The Zetsu example is made from wood-style chakra, NOT literal wood. Since chakra is equalized by withother energies...Naruto cna one-shot everyone and turn them into wood because his chakra is literally that powerful. The argument I made is yours with those FT characters in a nut-shell. Suddenly Naruto doesn't have a limit to his strength cause I can say that "The Raikage can move at light-speed because that one time he was moved he didn't get hurt at all!!!! So you can't prove that he can't move at light-speed!" Same argument. You can't assume that these character have something when it isn't even shown, if you do then the shit I just listed is truth as well.

Btw, you still haven't explained why Gildarts couldn't stop Acnologia's attack. Plz explain why he can disassemble anything when he couldn't stop that eh?

To assume that Grey got all of Silver's powers is wierd again because it wasn't stated that thats how DS powers works. The best example is that he got a new sword which he doesn't know how to use properly, the sword = DS magic. You made your assumption based on literally nothing. Silver gave Grey the power, not the knowledge to be blunt. Like how Ur gave Grey the power of Ice-make magic, he had to learn how to use it still.

Btw, Natsu ate a very small piece of that pure magic. Literally he grabbed a rock of ethernion and took a little bite out of it. Then he had what looked like a massive seizure where he was chocking and his pupils disappeared to enforce the fact that he almost died taking that power. Kinda skipped through that when you mentioned his feats. If that happens to him with a little bit, what the hell would happen if he tries to *eat* HUGE amounts at once since...ya know....all of the characters have a LOT of energy.

Gildarts couldn't stop Acnologia's attack otherwise he would have and Erza at the time barely stopped Jupiter Cannon which was stated to destroy the guild and nothing else. She barely stopped a building-buster with her strongest armor. You're thinking Erza later in the series and even then that durability feat you claimed is somewhat suspect.

Once more, it isn't you gotta prove you can't do it. It's that you gotta prove that they can. That goes for everyone.

Btw I can't speak for Luffy or Ichigo so I don't know their current powers well but I will leave other debaters to argue in their stead. I only know Naruto and FT pretty well so yeah I do in fact think KCM Naruto can blitz. I guess I will show you later but not now.

Lastly...Wendy pushed Lucy out of the way. Not Lucy herself. WENDY did. Pluz that was much MUCH later in the series which speaks nothing about Laxus' speed feats in the near beginning. Not even gonna mention that Natsu matched him in the speed department in the last skirmish in that fight...unless you're gonna tell me that early Natsu is lightning-speed too?

It helps that Laxus moves in a literal flash of lightning when he does that move. It looks like lightning, moves like lightning, so it's lightning.

I've never said or implied 'prove they can't.' for anyone. That's an asinine debating tactic. I just stated what they've done and that why it leads me to the conclusion that they can do what they can do (Gildarts can disassemble most things, Gray has Silver's feats, Natsu can eat pretty much anything). I'm not saying you have to prove a negative, hell I wouldn't even say there's hard proof for these things, I just told you the instances that led me to believe they can do what I said they can do.

As for the infinite gravity point, it was very very small and while it would normally take out a planet, it's also an anime/manga AND magic meaning it could have protection against that, same way the blackhole gun in Saints Row doesn't swallow up the planet or the black holes in Hitman Reborn don't swallow up the planet or how the blackholes in comics don't always instantly swallow up planets.

And Gildarts didn't stop Acnologia's attack because...I don't know. Maybe it was too fast. Maybe he was out of magic. Maybe it was too big (which doesn't make too sense because he busted a town). Maybe it doesn't work on dragon magic. Maybe he didn't think of it. I can't honestly tell you because it'd be pure assumption. And it's irrelevant to this fight. It's like asking why Deidara didn't just bomb everyone with C0 when he came back as a zombie. Or why Sasuke didn't genjutsu A when he had the chance. Or Naruto for that matter. Or why didn't Naruto just attach exploding tags to his clones and take out all of his enemies? Or why the Yamanaka clan doesn't just mind control everyone. Or why Ichigo doesn't use his super speed when running up the stairs. Or why didn't Naruto speed blitz like...anyone ever. Or why didn't he dodge that sword, etc.

Concerning Gray and his skill, that's a fine point but I'm talking about the power of devilslaying magic. Gray already has the skill as he has ice-make magic (plus you learn magic btw, you're not given it usually) so I'm just adding the pure power that devilslaying magic has to his existent skill feats.

I honestly don't remember Natsu almost dying, but he's eaten more powerful things since like Laxus's lightning. So he should be fine here.

And oh yeah, Wendy is the one with the hypersonic feat. Good catch.

And I'm not saying Laxus is lightning fast in speed. Only when using that one move. I'm saying people like Natsu are lightning timers at best. Which should allow them to not be blitzed. That's all.

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@ratava said:

yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

The Gildarts one is just a matter of people using the incorrect feat

The sheer volume of water he displaced should indicate that he could bust a small island like Tenrou

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Mije_101

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#40  Edited By Mije_101

@thehunter said:

FT isn't winning this. Ichigo alone should pose too much of a problem. Luffy could be handled by Gildarts. That's about it though. Ichigo and Naruto aren't getting beat by anyone from FT guild.

Casually slipped in a little bait I see lol.

I doubt you'll get much out of it;Most One Piece fans are likely secure enough in the superiority OP displays over FT to engage you on this one.

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@ratava said:

yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

The Gildarts one is just a matter of people using the incorrect feat

The sheer volume of water he displaced should indicate that he could bust a small island like Tenrou

yeah, water..... and honestly, that is not really impressive...

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@ratava said:
@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:

yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

The Gildarts one is just a matter of people using the incorrect feat

The sheer volume of water he displaced should indicate that he could bust a small island like Tenrou

yeah, water..... and honestly, that is not really impressive...

*sigh* You say not impressive, yet people found Ichigo doing the exact same thing to be quite the feat.

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Ratava

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@ratava said:
@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:

yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

The Gildarts one is just a matter of people using the incorrect feat

The sheer volume of water he displaced should indicate that he could bust a small island like Tenrou

yeah, water..... and honestly, that is not really impressive...

*sigh* You say not impressive, yet people found Ichigo doing the exact same thing to be quite the feat.

1. i dont know what bleach or what other people think have to do with this. for me its not impressive, weve seen even better feats from other ft-chars

2. but since you brought it up - yeah, those people are right - that "feat" from ichigo is more impressive - its much more impressive.

in the fairy tail picture you can cleary see the individual people standing on that sheet of ice, in the bleach-picture you see a house (a big one with several people inside) that is in comparsion even a little smaller than that sheet of ice. the amount of water that got vaporized is so much, much more as what gildarts has displaced its not even funny

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@ratava said:
@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:
@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:

yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

The Gildarts one is just a matter of people using the incorrect feat

The sheer volume of water he displaced should indicate that he could bust a small island like Tenrou

yeah, water..... and honestly, that is not really impressive...

*sigh* You say not impressive, yet people found Ichigo doing the exact same thing to be quite the feat.

1. i dont know what bleach or what other people think have to do with this. for me its not impressive, weve seen even better feats from other ft-chars

2. but since you brought it up - yeah, those people are right - that "feat" from ichigo is more impressive - its much more impressive.

in the fairy tail picture you can cleary see the individual people standing on that sheet of ice, in the bleach-picture you see a

house (a big one with several people inside) that is in comparsion even a little smaller than that sheet of ice. the amount of water that got vaporized is so much, much more as what gildarts has displaced its not even funny

Aside from Dragons who has pulled off a feat similar to this? The only one I can think of is Natsu punching out Ikusa-Tsunagi.

Also I isolated the house, the sheet of ice, and the monster from the second scan. There is barely a size difference between the first two. Hold on a second, are there even people standing outside of that house to be seen to begin with? Even if there are I would consider the ability to see them or lack there of a difference in attention to detail between the two artist. Both images are an overhead view, if there are people there they should be visible to some degree.

No Caption Provided

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@mije_101: Don't care and it's not a bait. I will prove my argument when asked *shrugs*

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@ratava: It is not an island busting attack, but destroying that island is not just a city block feat either. Gajeel's feat of putting a little hole on the much smaller island is already around MCB in Destructive Capacity. Surely, destroying half of it with just the shockwave of the collission of their attacks would make the two at least town level.

I really can't argue for that village thing, that indeed obviously wasn't a town.

It counts as the power of one of his forms. It doesn't really matter now since the form wasn't permanent, but if it wasn't, I fail to see how Atlas' throw factored in much considering much more solid physical attacks from Atlas didn't even faze Motherglare.

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#48  Edited By Ratava

@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:
@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:
@strictlyanime said:
@ratava said:

yeah a lot of hyperbole from the usual people

heres gildartz - the mighty townbuster

No Caption Provided

thats not even city-block size

and ezra never busted an island, she and her counterpart together busted a maybe city-block+ sized floating rock called "floating island".

The Gildarts one is just a matter of people using the incorrect feat

The sheer volume of water he displaced should indicate that he could bust a small island like Tenrou

yeah, water..... and honestly, that is not really impressive...

*sigh* You say not impressive, yet people found Ichigo doing the exact same thing to be quite the feat.

1. i dont know what bleach or what other people think have to do with this. for me its not impressive, weve seen even better feats from other ft-chars

2. but since you brought it up - yeah, those people are right - that "feat" from ichigo is more impressive - its much more impressive.

in the fairy tail picture you can cleary see the individual people standing on that sheet of ice, in the bleach-picture you see a

house (a big one with several people inside) that is in comparsion even a little smaller than that sheet of ice. the amount of water that got vaporized is so much, much more as what gildarts has displaced its not even funny

Aside from Dragons who has pulled off a feat similar to this? The only one I can think of is Natsu punching out Ikusa-Tsunagi.

Also I isolated the house, the sheet of ice, and the monster from the second scan. There is barely a size difference between the first two. Hold on a second, are there even people standing outside of that house to be seen to begin with? Even if there are I would consider the ability to see them or lack there of a difference in attention to detail between the two artist. Both images are an overhead view, if there are people there they should be visible to some degree.

No Caption Provided

you are totally missing the point, the fact that the house and the sheet of ice are about the same size from a similar point of view shows that the bleach feats is much more impressive. i dont really understant how someone cant see that.

there is nothing to debate

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@mije_101: Absolutely. Do you have any qualms to my argument If yes, why?