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#151 Posted by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: How is Cap's shield named, then?

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#152 Posted by OptimusPalm (2382 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: I think it’s clear the random Sakaarian axe is far stronger than other races weapons (Humans). I also think it’s clear WW’s sword is far stronger than other races weapons (Humans).

Having a name makes the weapon important, it doesn’t necessarily make it stronger.

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#153 Edited by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio
@nucleon said:

@ipvman: How is Cap's shield named, then?

I'm pretty sure it's "Captain America's Shield."

@optimuspalm said:

@ipvman: I think it’s clear the random Sakaarian axe is far stronger than other races weapons (Humans). I also think it’s clear WW’s sword is far stronger than other races weapons (Humans).

Having a name makes the weapon important, it doesn’t necessarily make it stronger.

It's importance signifies it's strength. Generally the more important the sword is the stronger it will be, fictionally speaking. The named weapons are almost always the strongest weapons of whichever respective race. Point being, the name is what distinguishes the fodder from the non fodder weapons.

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#154 Posted by Rajjar (1772 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon said:
@rajjar said:

Hulk is the strongest one there is.

No more than 4.

One.

DD does have superior energy abilities.

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#155 Posted by Rajjar (1772 posts) - - Show Bio
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#156 Posted by plotweapon16255 (7711 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk is basically a fodder for doomsday, no matter how many is against him they can't win.

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#157 Posted by supremthor69 (580 posts) - - Show Bio
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#158 Posted by OptimusPalm (2382 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: That’s a lot of head cannon there.

No, a weapon’s importance does not signify its strength. Just like a weapons name does not signify its strength.

A weapons names signifies its importance.

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#159 Posted by Syntix (532 posts) - - Show Bio

C’mon definitely not 1, not more than 10.

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#160 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@optimuspalm: If you can't understand that in the majority of fiction a weapon's importance is directly correlated to it's strength then we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one. Fact of the matter is the Sakar weapons are fodder compared to Wonder Woman's sword, Stormbreaker, Mjolnir, etc. Unless it's named it's generally not an important or relevant weapon. Maybe not fodder to Earth weapons, but fodder in relation to their weapons.

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#161 Edited by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman said:

@optimuspalm: If you can't understand that in the majority of fiction a weapon's importance is directly correlated to it's strength then we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one. Fact of the matter is the Sakar weapons are fodder compared to Wonder Woman's sword, Stormbreaker, Mjolnir, etc. Unless it's named it's generally not an important or relevant weapon. Maybe not fodder to Earth weapons, but fodder in relation to their weapons.

I would not (and will not) put "WW's sword" on the same level as Stormbreaker, Mjolnir or even Cap's shield/BP's claws. We all know that these MCU items are unique, by their composition, history or enchantment. That's quite clear, and alluded to many times in the movies. Such gear would have had its history regardless of who wielded it - they're not props, but entities of their own.

On the other hand, WW's sword is simply "WW's sword", just like Steppenwolf's axe was "Steppenwolf's axe" - an extension of the character, something that wouldn't even exist if the character wasn't there to wield it. We never heard anything about it being made with a special allow, or being enchanted, or having a background of any sort. We simply assume that they are somewhat "special" because they came from "special" societies.

It that sense, WW's sword, which only got more feats than the oversized Sakarian gladiator weapons because it appeared on the screen more often, is pretty much on the same level.

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#162 Posted by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar said:
@nucleon said:
@rajjar said:

Hulk is the strongest one there is.

No more than 4.

One.

DD does have superior energy abilities.

He does - it's his strongest attack. But once past that, the Hulk doesn't have much energy attacks to amp Doomsday with - he's got a big freakin' AX instead - WW was doing wonderfully against it with IMO much less.

If he had no access to cutting weapons, then yes - Two Hulks would be necessary to mangle DD with their bare hands, snap his neck or spine, you know, no easy task. But with an oversized axe?

One. =)

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#163 Edited by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon: I believe it's called The Sword of Athena in most wikis and guides. Steppenwolf's axe is the Electroaxe. Mjolnir and stormbreaker are overall more powerful weapons due to the various different abilities they grant the user, but Wonder Woman's sword still has the best piercing feat of severing Doomsday's hand. So it's far beyond fodder Sakar axes in that regard, and Stormbreaker.

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#164 Posted by Bayman007 (1543 posts) - - Show Bio

@death4bunnies said:

@bayman007:

Again who’s to say that her gear isn’t just durable amazon metal that she “channels” her power through.

It would make sense given Ares explanation of her powers.

Even her current gear, in a similar way as her solo movie gear.

I don’t think the bracers were special. Remember when she first used them, the other Amazons seemed surprised.

If you consider that her lasso ‘The Lasso of Truth’ compels you to tell the truth, this isn’t just Wonder Womans power alone, but the magical item that she is using. As for her bracelets, there is definitely more to them than Diana simply clicking 2 pieces of durable amazon metal toghether. They have to trigger, and they also can charge and hold on to a lightning bolt like a battery.

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#165 Edited by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman said:

@nucleon: I believe it's called The Sword of Athena in most wikis and guides. Steppenwolf's axe is the Electroaxe. Mjolnir and stormbreaker are overall more powerful weapons due to the various different abilities they grant the user, but Wonder Woman's sword still has the best piercing feat of severing Doomsday's hand. So it's far beyond fodder Sakar axes in that regard, and Stormbreaker.

What you wrote is pretty baseless: Sakar's weapons did the job alright, to spectacular effect even, and overall they have a more positive record than WW's blade. They didn't fail whereas WW's swords did, many times. Like Death4bunnies wrote, the argument that WW's sword is powerful because it can cut DD is circular.

You know what they are called because WW has a CB background and a Wiki - but none of these are any official. From what we have seen and heard in the movies - and like Ares confirmed - there's absolutely nothing special about WW's swords. The power comes from her.

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#166 Posted by Bayman007 (1543 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman:

Her bracelets are called the Bracelets of Submission, and off course she wields the Lasso of truth. All named, all magical. By no means generic like the weapons used in the Ragnarok arena. It doesn’t really matter when Wonder Woman’s gear has decent feats that place them above this Axe anyway. By feats, it doesn’t stand a chance against DD.

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#167 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon: And like I told death4bunnies, her sword has never failed. It did cut Steppenwolf and you mistook that sword for the one she used on Ares. And regardless, it still has the greatest feat. So you're logic isn't working; you can't attribute having a positive or negative record to overall power level. The power level is what it's capable of, and Wonder Woman's sword is capable of greater piercing feats than Sakar fodder axes, or Stormbreaker.

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#168 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@bayman007: Yeah I doubt they could even cut Doomsday.

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#169 Edited by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman said:

@nucleon: And like I told death4bunnies, her sword has never failed. It did cut Steppenwolf and you mistook that sword for the one she used on Ares. And regardless, it still has the greatest feat. So you're logic isn't working; you can't attribute having a positive or negative record to overall power level. The power level is what it's capable of, and Wonder Woman's sword is capable of greater piercing feats than Sakar fodder axes, or Stormbreaker.

The argument is circular, because what's being discussed here, all of this part of the conversation, is point out if Doomsday is any resistant to piercing/slashing/cutting damage. So right here, he is no reference - his resitance is even put into doubts. Now you say that WW mangled DD because the sword she used was any special? Your guess, because there's nothing to that effect, and even hints to the contrary, notably by Ares who said the power came from her.

What I say, is that the weapons might be inherently magical, yes, but as of now, they just forged with forgotten techniques that would make them more durable than the human average. And so were Sakar's gladiator weapons such as the one Hulk uses here to cleave Doomsday in half. =)

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#170 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon: Yes, and for that very reason they can't pierce Doomsday. It took a weapon as powerful as Wonder Woman's sword, and will Wonder Woman's skill to injure him, so Sakar fodder weapons are simply not up to the job. That's what is being discussed here. And so because the weapons Hulk uses will not be able to damage Doomsday, and Doomsday would be able to regenerate immediately should he do, it would take a tremendous amount of Hulks to even injure him.

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#171 Edited by OptimusPalm (2382 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: Would you agree that an advanced race with advanced tech would have advanced weapons?

If not, why would this advanced race make subpar weapons?

Edit: I just want to understand your reasoning.

We’re discussing what would happen if Hulk was to connect with a full swing of a Sakaarian axe. I see 3 possibilities:

1) The weapon breaks upon impact.

2) The impact will push DD away much like Thor did to Hulk, because DD’s skin is too tough to break.

3) The impact cuts DD.

Considering the forces Sakaarian weapons were exposed to with no noticeable damage, i’d say #1 is the least likely.

Considering DD has already been pierced by a durable weapon, i’d say another durable weapon swung by a far stronger person than WW would also pierce DD.

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#172 Posted by Bayman007 (1543 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder Womans Sword withstood DDs heat vison, much like her Shield. Typically the stronger the weapon, the higher the melting point. This Axe doesn't have the feats to suggest it is anywhere near her Sword. They are not in the same bracket unless proven otherwise.

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#173 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@optimuspalm: Yes. But unless it's given some sort of significance (name for example), it's still a random weapon of whatever respective race. Is every Asgardian spear Gungrir now? You seem to be missing my point on that one. You're saying a weapon doesn't have to be named/important to be strong, but my point is that most times in the scope of fiction a named weapon will be stronger than less important or relevant weapons, regardless of the overall quality of the race's arms.

I would disagree considering that Sakar's weapon's have no feats to presume they could pierce Doomsday, and Hulk as little to no skill with bladed weapons to presume he'd suddenly become Diana. He didn't even have a piercing feat with it. So just because Hulk swings hard doesn't mean he could pierce Doomsday with an axe with no suggestion it has the capability to even damage him.

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#174 Posted by OptimusPalm (2382 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: But we’ve been discussing what would happen IF he did connect. Changing your stance makes me think you have no real answer for that, other than “fodder weapons” of course.

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#175 Posted by imperialbuttlicker (231 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll say 20 hulks are enough

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#176 Posted by imperialbuttlicker (231 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon said:
@imperialbuttlicker said:
@thatoneguy2958 said:

@imperialbuttlicker: did you? Did you read the replies on here? Nothing special or magical about the sword. Literally. End of story.

So yeah, DD gets cleaved in half by 1 hulk all rounds end of story.

The fact that Amazons are mythical humans created by Zeus and their weapons are, It's safe to say that it's magical.

Oh and Diana's sword has been capable of cutting down a car and huge bricks, show me a feat of Hulk's axe that is capable of doing so

Cutting cars and bricks? Ha ha ha - Cap can do it with his shield. That's the Hulk we have here - the Hulk with a big freakin' AX. Cars, bricks and 30mm rounds, really ??? That's rather pathetic isn't it?

When did Cap has shown to cut cars and bricks in half? His shield is not a piercing weapon. And you can't compare one feat with the other since Hulk hasn't shown cutting capabilities with his axe in movies

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#177 Posted by GladiatorS (199 posts) - - Show Bio
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#179 Posted by Jacthripper (14969 posts) - - Show Bio

In the box office? Probably just one.

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#180 Posted by death4bunnies (1143 posts) - - Show Bio

@imperialbuttlicker:

Actually as far as cutting stone, the Hulk axe is at least on par with Diana’s sword.

If you watch the Sakarr fight, these weapons break the ground with seeming ease. Now a lot of that power comes from hulk; but as far as durability of weapons, and ability to break rock, the Skarr axe has similar feats.

In fact, aside from cutting DD, there is a comparable Hulk axe feat to all of Diana’s sword feats.

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#181 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: But we’ve been discussing what would happen IF he did connect. Changing your stance makes me think you have no real answer for that, other than “fodder weapons” of course.

I literally just explained to you what would happen if it made contact. It most likely wouldn't pierce him because Hulk doesn't have axe feats to say it could. No one's changing stances, you just refuse to accept that for some reason.

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#182 Posted by Lord_Doom159 (322 posts) - - Show Bio

Infinite

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#183 Posted by Subline (7849 posts) - - Show Bio
No Caption Provided

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#185 Posted by deactivated-5c6891767abb2 (1820 posts) - - Show Bio
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#186 Edited by tethadam (236 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk and Thor was compared to having the power of a nuke by general ross, so 1.

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#187 Posted by LeonardSnart (2803 posts) - - Show Bio

Banned thread, if it wasn't the better question would be how many current versions of Doomsday does it take to beat current Hulk

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#188 Posted by plotweapon16255 (7711 posts) - - Show Bio
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#189 Edited by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: I literally just explained to you what would happen if it made contact. It most likely wouldn't pierce him because Hulk doesn't have axe feats to say it could. No one's changing stances, you just refuse to accept that for some reason.

WTF - The Hulk's got cutting feats: Norton-Hulk easily cut military vehicles in two using jagged pieces of scrap metal, on the university's campus. He also dig into a Leviathan using a piece of their armor he tore off.

I don't see why it's so hard to admit that he can cut DD, since WW did so with a lot less strength and a more or less equivalent weapon. What are DD's piercing-resisting feats anyway, 30mm bullets? It can't be serious. And no, a nuke isn't piercing damage.

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#190 Posted by azrael1973 (2786 posts) - - Show Bio
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#191 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon said:

@ipvman: I literally just explained to you what would happen if it made contact. It most likely wouldn't pierce him because Hulk doesn't have axe feats to say it could. No one's changing stances, you just refuse to accept that for some reason.

WTF - The Hulk's got cutting feats: Norton-Hulk easily cut military vehicles in two using jagged pieces of scrap metal, on the university's campus. He also dig into a Leviathan using a piece of their armor he tore off.

I don't see why it's so hard to admit that he can cut DD, since WW did so with a lot less strength and a more or less equivalent weapon. What are DD's piercing-resisting feats anyway, 30mm bullets? It can't be serious. And no, a nuke isn't piercing damage.

I've lost interest in this topic and you have yet to present anything in the way of an actual premise or evidence for why Hulk is a better swordsman than Wonder Woman and why his fodder axe is stronger than her sword. You also seem to be completely neglecting Doomsday's regeneration in this scenario, so good luck with your agenda.

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#192 Edited by Nucleon (3206 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman:I've lost interest in this topic

To heck with the condescending tone. When people genuinely lose interest, they just stop answering. I'm tired of people who can't man up to their own deeds. Are you telling me you can't let go of this thread of your own, and that you now count on me to do it in your stead? Assume yourself, dammit. It's a public board and I'll tag who I damn well please [/steamoff].

and you have yet to present anything in the way of an actual premise or evidence for why Hulk is a better swordsman than Wonder Woman

What is that "better swordsman" codswallop? You really think the twain behemoths are going to duel, with graceful, precise parades and fentes? The Hulk's definitely fast enough to hit whoever stands before him.

and why his fodder axe is stronger than her sword.

I and others must have explained it about a thousand times by now; There's nothing that sets WW's swords apart from the oversized Sakarian gladiator weapons - it's just that Doomsday's resistance to piercing damage is quite mediocre. And no, nukes are no piercing attacks.

Furthermore, everybody agrees the Hulk is much, much stronger than WW. I can see why you pretend a loss of interest - you just can't score a single point.

You also seem to be completely neglecting Doomsday's regeneration in this scenario, so good luck with your agenda.

Keep the good luck for yourself when Doomsday will "regenerate" its severed head with a spike. I don't need any and neither does a single Hulk here.

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#193 Posted by OptimusPalm (2382 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: You explained nothing more than your opinion, and using the word “explained” is actually giving you more credit than you deserve.

On topic, although I do agree with others that Hulk could pierce DD (being far stronger than WW and using a very durable piercing weapon), I don’t think 1 Hulk is enough here. 4 or 5 Hulks would be enough to overwhelm DD.

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#194 Posted by macleen (3445 posts) - - Show Bio

not enough

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#195 Posted by ThEBeStOfTheBeST (11157 posts) - - Show Bio
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#196 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@nucleon: Pipe down steamy, I'm simply not interested in entertaining this ridiculous thread any longer. Your arguments aren't helping. You said Hulk was faster than Wonder Woman. I can't score a point? You're not even in the game.

If you want a substantial debate feel free to tag me in the MCU Hulk vs DCEU Doomsday thread. I'd be interested in hearing your argument for Hulk under proper circumstances.

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#197 Posted by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

@optimuspalm: I was explaining why Wonder Woman's sword is superior to Hulk's Sakar axe. That has been my point since the beginning. If you want to think cutting into stone is equal to severing the hand of a being that can tank and get stronger from a nuke, that's your prerogative. But I don't think Hulk could pierce Doomsday at all so we'll just have to agree to disagree here.

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#198 Posted by Shadow411 (875 posts) - - Show Bio

No less than 1/1000 of a hulk but more than 1/1,000,000 of a hulk.

On an honest note...

R1: Goes to Hulk, DD could potentially be KO’d by a Physically superior being. And Hulk has shown much higher striking feats than DD. The only striking feat he has that wasn’t trash was his energy blasts, and I don’t see them being much of an issue since Superman pretty much just tanked them with no trouble. And this is the same Supes that was KO’d by a relatively small piece of a marble monument. So, Hulk isn’t getting damaged and since DD don’t evolve, this is a one-sided battle.

R2: This is like the classical Hulk v Wolverine. Except in this scinerio, Hulk has terrible regen by comparison. Hulk will undoubtedly cut off DD’s arm, which I don’t see being an issue since WW’s nameless sword did it and it’s 1/10 the size (Mass) of hulks axe, and Hulk is vastly stronger than WW. But anyways, DD evolves and pushes his spear arm through hulks brain. But I could see like 10 Hulks just going crazy on him until he’s like a bunch of little hunks of meat on the ground. 1 V 1 in R2, DD stomps. 10 V 1 and the hulks stomp feel like 2 could slice him up enough to drop him, but, he regens fast af and you’re not cutting that same arm off again... so I’d say 5 is cutting it close, but much more and it’s not even a fight.

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#199 Posted by OptimusPalm (2382 posts) - - Show Bio

@ipvman: Yet what do you say when we ask you for WW’s sword feats other than cutting DD? “It cut stone!”

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#200 Posted by deactivated-5c6891767abb2 (1820 posts) - - Show Bio

@tethadam said:

Hulk and Thor was compared to having the power of a nuke by general ross, so 1.

ok i know but this current hulk is being nerfed and nerfed. and if we go by statements so dd can adapt limitlessly + overpowers tectonic plate sfifter