Harry, Ron, Hermione & Snape vs Lucius, Narcissa & Bellatrix

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ANTHP2000

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Round 1: Book feats only
Round 2: Book + Movie feats

Battle inside the Forbidden Forest
Who wins?
No. Snape doesn't solo.

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Full123

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The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

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ANTHP2000

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@full123: She is the MVP sure, but can Lucius and Narcissa take care of the kids? If they can, can they do it before Bella takes out Snape? We know he is losing but he isn't down easily.
I doubt Bellatrix can handle all 4 of them at once. They can tag team her if they win. I feel like it's more complicated than that.

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cpt_nice

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Don't see Bellatrix solo-ing, but she can easily defeat Snape. Lucius is not a great duelist but he is competent enough to at least hold off the trio with Narcissa, who does not have any duelling feats iirc. Team 2 every time.

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ValarMelkor

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Honestly Bellatrix solos.

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Full123

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@anthp2000: Lucius already has shown he cannot take care of the kids, and Narcissa has no dueling feats.

Bellatrix already took three guys on the trio's level effortlessly, and though theoretically Snape should break her, he doesn't have enough dueling feats.

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USSJ3071

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i can surely infer that narcissa is a peg above any 7th year, having graduated herself and knows dark arts from being in the black family

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ANTHP2000

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#9  Edited By ANTHP2000

@ussj3071: Agreed. She was reffered as a Dark Witch after all. Add in more experience and she should be above both Harry and Ron the least. Not to mention that she is mst likely above Malfoy who is high-tier student.

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AlphaQ

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Team 2. Bella can stalemate the trio for a time (are people forgetting she was stalemated by Hermione, Ginny and Luna, who're inferrior to the trio?) while Narcissa and Lucius double team Snape.

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ANTHP2000

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#11  Edited By ANTHP2000

@alphaq: I'm pretty sure Bella can beat the trio. It was mentioned that she almost killed Ginny so it can be argued that she was winning.
I never thought of switching the matchups. Nice one and seems promising.

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AlphaQ

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#12  Edited By AlphaQ

@anthp2000: I agree that she was probably winning too. Put Harry>Ginny, on account of being the best student, Hermione = Hermione and Ron>Luna, neither really have too many feats but at least Ron didn't spend the book in a dungeon.

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alextheboss

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@full123 said:

The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How does she solo? I thought Snape is supposed to be one of the strongest wizards? With the three as back up they should take Bellatrix 10/10. I'm pretty sure Voldemort liked Snape better than Bellatrix, and Voldemort likes power, based off that it's possible Snape takes a majority over her by himself.

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ANTHP2000

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@alextheboss: Nope...First of all, I agree that she doesn't solo, but he is not beating her by himself.
By spectulation and abilities, Snape is high tier, but Bellatrix has feats to be put above every other wizard or witch outside of Dumbldore, Grinnweland and Voldemort. Snape has no duelling feats overall, and magical abilities is just one part of duelling skill.

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ValarMelkor

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@full123 said:

The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

@valarmelkor said:

Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How does she solo? I thought Snape is supposed to be one of the strongest wizards? With the three as back up they should take Bellatrix 10/10. I'm pretty sure Voldemort liked Snape better than Bellatrix, and Voldemort likes power, based off that it's possible Snape takes a majority over her by himself.

Snape doesn't really have any good dueling feats to be honest. The one duel that he was in that I remember he ran away from. I remember Dumbledore talking about how Bellatrix and Lucius were originally Voldemort's favorites but as they kept failing their missions in the later books Snape rose up in Voldemort's ranks and I think this was mainly because of what a great spy he was, not really for his dueling skills.

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Full123

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@alextheboss: Voldemort also likes power in the way that he likes political power. And what better "power" is there other than taking over the school of his most feared enemy, which he thought Snape was doing? That's why Voldemort likes Snape more than Bella or Narcissa.

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ANTHP2000

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@alextheboss: Also, he did become furious after Molly killed Bellatrix and tried to kill her immediately.

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PhoenixoftheTides

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@leo-343 said:

Team 2 with Bellatrix being the obvious MVP.

It's not a wipeout by any means, but I think Bellatrix is the decisive factor. I think the kids can take Lucius and Narcissa because they have talent, grit, and nerve on their side while the Malfoys are just weaker-willed. But once Bellatrix defeats Snape, because I think he will go for her knowing the teens are not a match for her, she'll destroy the three pretty quickly.

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HitTheAssasin

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#20 HitTheAssasin  Online

Bellatrix isnt soloing shit.IMO Snape should beat her. Team 1 6/10

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alextheboss

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@alextheboss said:
@full123 said:

The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

@valarmelkor said:

Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How does she solo? I thought Snape is supposed to be one of the strongest wizards? With the three as back up they should take Bellatrix 10/10. I'm pretty sure Voldemort liked Snape better than Bellatrix, and Voldemort likes power, based off that it's possible Snape takes a majority over her by himself.

Snape doesn't really have any good dueling feats to be honest. The one duel that he was in that I remember he ran away from. I remember Dumbledore talking about how Bellatrix and Lucius were originally Voldemort's favorites but as they kept failing their missions in the later books Snape rose up in Voldemort's ranks and I think this was mainly because of what a great spy he was, not really for his dueling skills.

Snape only ran away though because he was really a good guy.

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alextheboss

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@alextheboss: Also, he did become furious after Molly killed Bellatrix and tried to kill her immediately.

Would Snape lose to Molly though? lol

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Full123

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@alextheboss: I heard that JK Rowling only made Molly defeat Bellatrix for the classic love trumps hate trope, and not because she could actually do it.

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ANTHP2000

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@alextheboss: No, he wouldn't, and without plot, Bellatrix wouldn't either. Rowling already addressed Bellatrix's loss as something that shows love>evil and plot deviced stuff like that. She was asked in an interview.

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ValarMelkor

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@valarmelkor said:
@alextheboss said:
@full123 said:

The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

@valarmelkor said:

Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How does she solo? I thought Snape is supposed to be one of the strongest wizards? With the three as back up they should take Bellatrix 10/10. I'm pretty sure Voldemort liked Snape better than Bellatrix, and Voldemort likes power, based off that it's possible Snape takes a majority over her by himself.

Snape doesn't really have any good dueling feats to be honest. The one duel that he was in that I remember he ran away from. I remember Dumbledore talking about how Bellatrix and Lucius were originally Voldemort's favorites but as they kept failing their missions in the later books Snape rose up in Voldemort's ranks and I think this was mainly because of what a great spy he was, not really for his dueling skills.

Snape only ran away though because he was really a good guy.

I know but still his dueling feats are nearly nonexistent. Actually, I just remembered, he beat Harry at the end of Half Blood Prince but that still doesn't put him anywhere near Bellatrix. Maybe she can't outright solo, but her team definitely wins.

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deactivated-57d57a3174063

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I don't remember any notable feats from Narcissa really. I can safely assume the kids can handle her and Lucius while Snape can stall Bellatrix if he can't beat her. Then the kids and Snape all gang on Bellatrix.

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Kal-L

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@full123 said:

@anthp2000: Lucius already has shown he cannot take care of the kids, and Narcissa has no dueling feats.

Bellatrix already took three guys on the trio's level effortlessly, and though theoretically Snape should break her, he doesn't have enough dueling feats.

What do you mean by 'theorically' ?

@valarmelkor said:
@alextheboss said:
@full123 said:

The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

@valarmelkor said:

Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How does she solo? I thought Snape is supposed to be one of the strongest wizards? With the three as back up they should take Bellatrix 10/10. I'm pretty sure Voldemort liked Snape better than Bellatrix, and Voldemort likes power, based off that it's possible Snape takes a majority over her by himself.

Snape doesn't really have any good dueling feats to be honest. The one duel that he was in that I remember he ran away from. I remember Dumbledore talking about how Bellatrix and Lucius were originally Voldemort's favorites but as they kept failing their missions in the later books Snape rose up in Voldemort's ranks and I think this was mainly because of what a great spy he was, not really for his dueling skills.

Snape only ran away though because he was really a good guy.

Mcgonagall was already pressuring so much so that he wasn't able to subdue her and had to hide behind an armor, the arrival of Flitwick, Slughorn etc would have meant his death.

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LordOfTheLight

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Harry solos Lucius, Snape solos Bellatrix, Ron and Hermione together make short work of Narcissa, Team 1 in a one sided contest.

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Kal-L

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@alphaq said:

Team 2. Bella can stalemate the trio for a time (are people forgetting she was stalemated by Hermione, Ginny and Luna, who're inferrior to the trio?) while Narcissa and Lucius double team Snape.

That's how I see the fight going on.

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Full123

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@kal-l: It mean, in theory, Snape is a talented enough wizard to take Bella, but doesn't have enough dueling feats.

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Cregan_Stark

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I believe that Snape and Bellatrix would be an excellent fight and I'm going to say that they go at it for a long while.

Before you start saying that Snape is featless and blah blah blah, I completely understand that we never got to see a full out Snape fighting in the books. It is my belief that due to his knowledge and versitity, that he's a top notch wizard.

I do believe that Lucius and Narcissa should realistically beat Harry, Ron and Hermione. The three might put up a fight for a little bit but they are outclassed here. If you include adult versions then I'd say team Snape wins comfortably. But as it's the younger versions, they lose.

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Knightsofdarkness2

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@leo-343 said:

Team 2 with Bellatrix being the obvious MVP.

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ANTHP2000

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@cregan_stark: Agreed with your short analysis and while Snape would lose to Bella most of the time I think it was clear that he can content with her.

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alextheboss

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@leo-343: that still doesn't mean she would solo.

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alextheboss

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Kal-L

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@full123 said:

@kal-l: It mean, in theory, Snape is a talented enough wizard to take Bella, but doesn't have enough dueling feats.

I do not see where you take that from, sure he is talented but to what kind of talent does his that make him that strong 'in theory'.

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VashtaNerada88

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@kal-l said:
@full123 said:

@anthp2000: Lucius already has shown he cannot take care of the kids, and Narcissa has no dueling feats.

Bellatrix already took three guys on the trio's level effortlessly, and though theoretically Snape should break her, he doesn't have enough dueling feats.

What do you mean by 'theorically' ?

@alextheboss said:
@valarmelkor said:
@alextheboss said:
@full123 said:

The only one here worth a damn is Bellatrix. She solos.

@valarmelkor said:

Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How does she solo? I thought Snape is supposed to be one of the strongest wizards? With the three as back up they should take Bellatrix 10/10. I'm pretty sure Voldemort liked Snape better than Bellatrix, and Voldemort likes power, based off that it's possible Snape takes a majority over her by himself.

Snape doesn't really have any good dueling feats to be honest. The one duel that he was in that I remember he ran away from. I remember Dumbledore talking about how Bellatrix and Lucius were originally Voldemort's favorites but as they kept failing their missions in the later books Snape rose up in Voldemort's ranks and I think this was mainly because of what a great spy he was, not really for his dueling skills.

Snape only ran away though because he was really a good guy.

Mcgonagall was already pressuring so much so that he wasn't able to subdue her and had to hide behind an armor, the arrival of Flitwick, Slughorn etc would have meant his death.

i apologize if you didn't want to be tagged in this but this part has always bugged me, and i was hoping one of you could clear it up. (i only made it to book 4 in HP series)

When Mcgonagall is attacking Snape to oust him from hogwarts, in the movies, he doesn't actually attack her back and takes a more defensive stance. On top of that, he is able to redirect her attacks to take out the carrows? (if im not mistaken) who are on either side behind him.

I'm not sure how the events played out in the books but in your guys opinion do you feel he is comfortably above her in dueling skill? (enough so he didn't want to go all out on her, and at the same time confident enough to let her take the offensive instead of just retreating. I mean IMO, we knew Snake was good and what he did seemed like it would have been the only real way of assisting them without directly turning on the deatheaters)

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Full123

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@vashtanerada88: Snape WAS on the defensive in the vs. McGonagall instance. He was given orders by Dumbledore to let Hogwarts run as normally as he could in the situation. Attacking or harming the teachers was definitely a no-no for Snape. But we don't know how much power he has.

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ANTHP2000

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@full123 said:

@vashtanerada88: Snape WAS on the defensive in the vs. McGonagall instance. He was given orders by Dumbledore to let Hogwarts run as normally as he could in the situation. Attacking or harming the teachers was definitely a no-no for Snape. But we don't know how much power he has.

This. He didn't want to hurt her, but if McGonagall was going all out then it's safe to assume that he would be better than her going all out. However, I'm not sure if Minerva was also going all out, so we can't know much for sure.

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Full123

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@anthp2000: McGonagall was pretty mad at Snape, but I don't think she was going all out.

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ANTHP2000

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@full123: Yeah, it's not like she was bloodlusted, so at this point we can only spectulate.
HOWEVER, I am 99,9% sure that Rowling said somewhere in an interview that in a serious duel, Minerva would still win, so I'm siding with her. That's IIRC though.

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VashtaNerada88

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@full123 said:

@vashtanerada88: Snape WAS on the defensive in the vs. McGonagall instance. He was given orders by Dumbledore to let Hogwarts run as normally as he could in the situation. Attacking or harming the teachers was definitely a no-no for Snape. But we don't know how much power he has.

This. He didn't want to hurt her, but if McGonagall was going all out then it's safe to assume that he would be better than her going all out. However, I'm not sure if Minerva was also going all out, so we can't know much for sure.

cool thanks guys! Minerva was possibly my favorite in the books/movies she always seemed like she was the type that was "speak softly & carry a big stick" While not as aggressive as practically any of the other witches/wizards, it's good to know she was a force to reckoned with.

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cpt_nice

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Honestly Bellatrix solos.

How? She could not soundly defeat three students weaker than the main trio

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cpt_nice

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And I swear if one more person says Snape can beat Bellatrix I will throw the seven books at them and demand they actually read them.

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alextheboss

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@cpt_nice said:

And I swear if one more person says Snape can beat Bellatrix I will throw the seven books at them and demand they actually read them.

Aren't you just saying Ballatrix wins because Snape has a lack of feats? That's not really a compelling argument.

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cpt_nice

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#48  Edited By cpt_nice

@cpt_nice said:

And I swear if one more person says Snape can beat Bellatrix I will throw the seven books at them and demand they actually read them.

Aren't you just saying Ballatrix wins because Snape has a lack of feats? That's not really a compelling argument.

News flash, we tend to argue on this website that the person with better feats can usually beat the person with bad or no feats.

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cpt_nice

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@alextheboss: And I dare you, make a compelling argument Snape can beat Bella.

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Vertigo-

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#50  Edited By Vertigo-

Bellatrix could solo with med-high diff.

lol at Snape beating Bellatrix though in a 1v1