Guts vs Clare

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#51 Posted by TheMagicStik (2552 posts) - - Show Bio
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#52 Edited by Eisenfauste (17366 posts) - - Show Bio
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#53 Edited by dedragon3 (30 posts) - - Show Bio

@themagicstik: No godstomp at first Clare would win she be moving around tapping him and he be Like wtf. Then he would catch her guard and end her. Like anticipate where she would move next and in one swing decimate her.

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#54 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5902 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare

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#55 Edited by TheMagicStik (2552 posts) - - Show Bio

@themagicstik: No godstomp at first Clare would win she be moving around tapping him and he be Like wtf. Then he would catch her guard and end her. Like anticipate where she would move next and in one swing decimate her.

Clare is 100 times faster than Guts, she would never even be hit by him once, and a hit from Guts wouldnt deal too much damage to Clare and she would heal it off. One hit from Clare would annihilate Guts.

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#56 Edited by those_eyes (17291 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts kills the hot bitch. Um sorry for the language but is this there base forms ?Im' going only by the pictures and I hope that's what you mean.

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#57 Posted by Kuja9001 (557 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare slaughters him with even using a special technique.

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#58 Edited by dedragon3 (30 posts) - - Show Bio

@themagicstik: He would find a way to hit her he's fought demi God's and fast opponents. a hit from guts would cut her in 2 also he has beserker armor that can heal him and make him fight till he is skin and bones. I not saying that guts would just own her but guts would win in the end. That's what I think anyways.

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#59 Posted by Caerius (1 posts) - - Show Bio

Hello, i made a user account just to give some opinion, gatts faced the apostle elf, which could travel at super sonic speed, in the manga it states that when she reaches her top speed gatts can feel a boom in his body, aka a sonic boom, he was ale not only to dodge the attack but to counter it, also gatts has been able to break iron, rock and diamond hard weapon/skin, for last he wont be able to die unless by having his head cut off, but as we can see in the manga the berserker armor is pretty hard so much to withstand a lightning, great match up....

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#60 Posted by gokuss4z (3429 posts) - - Show Bio
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#61 Posted by those_eyes (17291 posts) - - Show Bio

@caerius said:

Hello, i made a user account just to give some opinion, gatts faced the apostle elf, which could travel at super sonic speed, in the manga it states that when she reaches her top speed gatts can feel a boom in his body, aka a sonic boom, he was ale not only to dodge the attack but to counter it, also gatts has been able to break iron, rock and diamond hard weapon/skin, for last he wont be able to die unless by having his head cut off, but as we can see in the manga the berserker armor is pretty hard so much to withstand a lightning, great match up....

Clare still is faster imo. She can move her sword so fast that she can cut her opponent to into dust before the opponent can react.

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#62 Edited by hizack123 (429 posts) - - Show Bio
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#63 Posted by Sovereign91001 (7483 posts) - - Show Bio

Still Clare.

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#64 Edited by StardustCrusader (3148 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare's still too fast.

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#65 Edited by 98115 (1748 posts) - - Show Bio

I haven't read the berserk manga (I will eventually) but I saw the movies and from what I saw there Claire should win a random encounter. but im not sure how strong he becomes.

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#66 Posted by darkseid1006 (4076 posts) - - Show Bio

gotta go Clare

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#67 Posted by batmanprep (1913 posts) - - Show Bio

Hmmm

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#68 Edited by thelocust619 (7871 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare is really broken fast at her best. Pretty positive this is a mismatch, she's several hundred times faster just at base. He has his armor? Cute...but Clare has Theresa.

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#69 Posted by JHG (333 posts) - - Show Bio

This: http://fatestayfelicia.deviantart.com/art/Death-Battle-Clare-vs-Guts-Pt-I-505062170 and this: http://fatestayfelicia.deviantart.com/art/Death-Battle-Clare-vs-Guts-Pt-II-532231574 happen.

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#70 Posted by JHG (333 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare wins.

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#71 Posted by Hey_Thatsmildlyadequate (1861 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare is too fast and she blitzes him

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#72 Posted by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

This wont be a curbstomp by any means, but if Clare is allowed to use her full power, she would take the majority. After all, her strongest form is pretty op, but then that only really applies to her on her best. Her base form is too weak and not versatile enough to take on Guts, even if he is just using his standard gear (before berserker armor).

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#73 Posted by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

Also, how the hell do you guys even think that Clare will win if the speed is equalized? I mean, the only thing Clare has over Guts is her speed after all. Otherwise her Claymore isn't any tougher than the Dragon Slayer (rather packs less punch due to being lighter), her ability to read the flow of yoki is useless against people who arent/part yoma, while her health factor is only good enough to heal minor wounds and reattach lost limbs in the heat of battle without backup (assuming those limbs aren't far away from the main body for too long, or shredded). And although Clare becomes slightly stronger and gets more limbs to attack with when awakened, the major boost is still mainly the then overwhelming speed increase.

By removing Clare's speed advantage, you are essentially removing her lone reason for winning. Since well, unlike Clare's case where speed is practically everything, Guts still has a superior arsenal to fall back on. He is fast enough to keep up with Clare in her base form, has about the same durability and stamina minus hf (although he can reattach and fix lost/broken limbs with berserk armor), got a generally greater striking power (considering the fact he can cleave through things tougher than steel in a swing, while Clare can only do so through repeated slashes). And on top of all that, he still has minibombs, arrows and throwing daggers that could limit Clare's movements (while doing considerable damage) + an arm cannon that would rip her apart if hit (possibly 1-hit-killing her).

Even if their speed isn't equalized, Guts is more than enough to give Clare a run for her money in generall. And possibly even capable of beating her if she is not using her awakened abilities. The only way Clare would win, is by using her full power, and that would mostly due to her awakened form being just significantly faster than Guts, even with Berserk armor. But if their speed is equalized, then that victory is out of the window. So better just use them at the level they are, rather than some arbitrary limitations.

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#74 Edited by Marishtar (2261 posts) - - Show Bio

@omegadynasty: I get it, this thread is pretty old, and many people don't knew Claymore.

But holy crap is this a missmatch, Clare curbstomps Guts like a insect.

And lets not even start with Soul Link, that would be a hardcore godstomp.

I rly rly like Guts, but people need to stop wanking him like this, he has exactly zero chance in this fight.

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#75 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

Clare decimates guts.

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#76 Posted by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

@marishtar:

Except the only way Clare would be "stomping" Guts, is through her Teresa form. Otherwise they are pretty even. Guts without B-armor is skilled and fast enough to fight against Clare with suppressed yoki. With the B-armor (without going berserk) he becomes strong and fast enough to compete with Clare at 10-30% yoki(the point where her eyes changes color and slight strains on face), Guts also gets the durability advantage, as the B-armor is also pretty tanky.

In complete Berserk mode, Guts should be able to beat Clare around 50-70% yoki (the point where she grows fangs and gets bigger muscles) as he becomes significantly more powerful and faster. But Clare at her "half awakened" mode, would be significantly faster, and although Guts would still be somewhat of a threat Clare would win cause she is then much faster and has better control with her abilities in that point. The only way Guts could beat half awakened Clare is if he is possessed by Schierke, who would give Guts the ability to completely control the Berserk mode + some otherworldly magic that could either take away Clare's speed advantage, and/or enchant his firepower superior to Clare at that form.

Its not until Clare uses Teresa's true power in where it turns into a curb stomp. Since in that case, she doesn't just become even faster, but way stronger and more durable as well + she gets a whole lot more techniques that are all in a level that Guts can't compete to even with Schierke's magic.

All in all, I say they are pretty even on their lower levels... But so far, Clare's strongest form is just beyond the current Guts' limits.

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#77 Edited by Marishtar (2261 posts) - - Show Bio

@zettovii: Even in her half awakened form is Clare so extreme much faster(and also stronger+more durable), that this is a complete curbstomp.

Also is Guts not fast enough for base Clare without B-armor(and windcutter or quicksword would easily turn him into pieces), Soul-link is something we shouldn't even start to think of.

It's irrelevant if we compare their base forms, advanced forms or best forms, Guts always looses badly(or even gets curb/godstomped).

Sry but Guts is simply completely out of his leauge here, and this isn't in the Berserk manga so he has no plot armor.

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#78 Posted by katrurius17 (1434 posts) - - Show Bio
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#79 Posted by CaptFalcon725 (1378 posts) - - Show Bio

Nothing about Claymore impresses me. Make mine Guts.

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#80 Edited by Marishtar (2261 posts) - - Show Bio

@captfalcon725: So you're more impressed by the far weaker, slower and less durable Guts?

I mean i find him pretty cool too, but he has absolutely zero chance to win this.

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#81 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

Nothing about Claymore impresses me. Make mine Guts.

Could you elaborate? As incredible as guts is, clare has consistently performed a few tiers better than him.

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#82 Posted by omnipotence88 (1209 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts

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#84 Edited by thelocust619 (7871 posts) - - Show Bio

@zettovii: Guts has no feats at all near Clare's strength and speed. He can't consistently react to supersonic speeds and most of his cutting value is in his sword's demon-slaying properties. While he's insanely above most beings in his universe, in a battle forum vs all fiction he's actually incredibly weak. Wall level and under supersonic. None of his gadgets or skills can close a gap this large, he literally can't touch her.

Of course he's the better character, but that's not what this is about.

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#85 Posted by Itachus17 (3760 posts) - - Show Bio

@omegadynasty: I get it, this thread is pretty old, and many people don't knew Claymore.

But holy crap is this a missmatch, Clare curbstomps Guts like a insect.

And lets not even start with Soul Link, that would be a hardcore godstomp.

I rly rly like Guts, but people need to stop wanking him like this, he has exactly zero chance in this fight.

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#86 Posted by LpnQ (3954 posts) - - Show Bio

Woah clare stomps hella hard. She doesnt even have to awaken.

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#87 Posted by deactivated-5b3daad020468 (2228 posts) - - Show Bio

Poor gutsu ?

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#88 Edited by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

@thelocust619:

Guts was able to keep up with Zod's "human" form in their latest duel though. They were both fighting so fast that not even Rickert (who is a pretty skilled fighter) could notice their moves until they moved into a different position alltogether. This was before Guts even got the Berserk Armor. He has gotten a lot more skilled and stronger since then. So I do say that he should be able to keep up with Clare (even if its just below 10% of yoki power) without the B-armor (which will force Clare to get a lot more serious with it however).

Techniques such as the QuickBlade and Wind Cutter might be a bit too fast to be blocked completely, but seeing as the Dragon Slayer is pretty large (almost as wide as the black swordsman himself), and Guts can move it lightning fast anyway.... He should still be able to defend all vital areas without much problem. Especially when he also has things like the minibombs and hand cannon that could limit Clare's movements through huge explosions (which may or may not deal serious damage in the process).

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#89 Edited by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

@thelocust619:

Just so you know, I'm not trying to argue that Guts is the better character or anything like that. I'm just saying that the only time this matchup is anywhere close to a curbstomp, is if Clare uses her inner Theresa. Otherwise they are a lot closer than what you'd think. And seeing as Berserk is still up and running, while beating a reality warper is one of Guts' life goals, maybe he eventually will get a powerup comparable to Clare's ultimate form. Until then, they are pretty matched, safe for at their (current) most powerful state.

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#90 Edited by thelocust619 (7871 posts) - - Show Bio

@zettovii: Guts v Zodd happened a long time ago in the manga, kid...heck, he wasn't even on the boat yet lol. Zodd isn't above supersonic either. Guts being FTE (faster than the human eye) is irrelevant, FTE is slow here. Guts would get helplessly one shot without his armor. Even with it, he literally can't move to defend himself. At all. He can't even percieve her attacks. She is that much faster. And stronger, but that's irrelevant. Her speed is enough.

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#91 Posted by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

@thelocust619:

Not even super sonic? He must be way beyond super sonic to not only fight in levels that a perceptive ex-merc cannot react to, but to also make long and wide range motions with a huge sword, repeatedly to multiple directions, all in levels that its untraceable until moved away from that general direction he was observed at. Its really no different from how the usual Claymore fights, and Clare hasn't really shown to fight any faster than that outside of awakened form or through Wind Cutter/Quick Blade (techniques which got limited use).

Also, you are underestimating the fact on how the size of a blade could make a huge difference. It not only grants Guts a greater striking power than Clare in general (which would give him the advantage on a head on clash), but it's width also allows him to defend a much wider radius with less movement. He does not need to match Clare's attacks blow for blow to block them. All he needs to do is turn the blade on it's broadside, and move it towards the general direction that the attacks come from. That way, practically all of the lethal attacks will be undone. While all Guts needs to do to keep blocking, is adjusting the direction.Something he can do with just one hand, and at speeds comparable to Clare... Leaving the other hand free to use bombs that at least would force Clare to back out, or deal lethal damage if caught. Giving way to Guts to land a decisive blow if she is not careful.

If the B-armor is included, not only will Clare have to deal with this previously mentioned factors... But now Guts will also have a pretty tanky armor, which the Claymore will have trouble cutting. When Clare on the other hand, although tougher than normal humans, is still pretty squishy, while her armor isn't tougher than regular iron (something the Dragon Slayer cleaves through like butter). So really, there are just many advantages that Guts has that would make up for Clare's speed.

Granted that with enough gap in speed and power those other advantages won't mean much... But the thing is, outside of that 1 form, the speed gap just isn't that great (less so when Guts got comparable upgrades until that point).

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#92 Edited by thelocust619 (7871 posts) - - Show Bio

@zettovii: No, that's just FTE. It's really not impressive in a battle forum. If you're talking movement speed, the tip of his sword may breach the sound barrier just due to its length, but that isn't representative of his reaction speed. Also, this arguement is mute because even if we say he's above supersonic he's still too slow.

And no, I'm not underestimating anything here. Clare's basic wind cutter outpaces hypersonic and mhs characters, Guts struggles to be supersonic. The sheer difference in speed far outweighs anything he can possibly do. It's not a matter of twisting his sword to block, the match starts and every part of him that isn't nailed down vaporizes no matter what position he chooses.

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#94 Edited by Wewlad80 (3411 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts Kills the annoying girl.

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#95 Edited by _Logos_ (1922 posts) - - Show Bio

People are pitting Gut's against the wrong characters. Clare is a specialized demonic meta fighter with far incredible speed. She would be more of a match for someone like Gorgon. That being said Gut's can still can fight against more agile characters even with his heavy sword by adjusting his technique, just not against meta level characters, unless they're big hefty demons or skill-less monsters.

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#96 Edited by Wewlad80 (3411 posts) - - Show Bio

@princeleif said:

People are pitting Gut's against the wrong characters. Clare is a specialized demonic meta fighter with far incredible speed. She would be more of a match for someone like Gorgon. That being said Gut's can still can fight against more agile characters even with his heavy sword by adjusting his technique, just not against meta level characters unless they're big hefty demons or skill-less monsters.

How Fast is she ? Supersonic like Tokyo Ghoul level ? maybe Hypersonic like Metal Gear Cyborg level ?

Or is she utterly Ridiculously fast (Atomic Samurai level) ?

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#97 Edited by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

@thelocust619:

Except that it does not look any slower than the movement shown in Claymore. Nor does Guts struggle to fight at those speeds... He fights at those speeds regularly (although mostly only using it on attacking, blocking and dashing at small distances). Going all dynasty warriors on mooks, while only bosses that are superior/equal on speed, strength and/or durability (or untouchable magic) being the only ones that give him difficulty. In Clare's case, she is def generally faster, but her usual combat speed isn't outside of his reaction range.

Wind Cutter is definitely faster than something that Guts would be able to block blow for blow, but with the width of his blade he will still be able to protect the vital areas, even if nothing else(which in Guts case, is more than good enough).

He still has the range and striking power advantage (so he could push her back if their blades clash). This holds true even against the Wind Cutter, which although fast, doesn't pack much power (as it trades power for precise and quick follow ups). The Quick Blade however would def pack a lot of punch + superior speed. But with Guts blocking range, he still will be able to defend against it with his speed.Not to mention that the Quick Blade also does put a lot of strain on Clare, so she can't relay on it too much.... Leaving most of the battle in combat speeds that Guts will react to without problem, + having those other constant advantages (range and strength + bombs and canon that can be used at any range).

The Berserk Armor closes the speed gap to an extent, while also increasing their strength gap + giving Guts durability advantage. And although Theresa is way faster for that to even matter (along with actually being stronger, no draw backs on using skills + more actual skills to use), that is not the case with Clare. As Clare only can get faster, while her strength only reaches to equal at best (unless you count Theresa's strength as her own, in which case...).

But yeah, its just not as onesided as you are making it out to be. Clare may be faster, but not faster to level that Guts' advantages won't matter. He is more than skilled enough to take her on, has better armor, greater blocking radius, more versatile arsenal, and generally greater striking power. The only thing he lacks is a final form that can rival Theresa, but he still will give her a hell of a fight if he got some magical back up. Not that he needs it to win on the lower levels.

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#98 Posted by thelocust619 (7871 posts) - - Show Bio

@zettovii: He struggles to fight at supersonic speeds. He does not struggle to move fte. Visual style means absolutely nothing here, you're making a huge mistake basing any kind of speed judgement off of how it looks. If we went off looks then Hajime no Ippo is stronger than Dragonball Z lol. No, feats and Statements are what count, and feats>statements. Clare's are simply several tiers above Guts paygrade.

Guts cannot move fast enough to block anything. Or even move at all. Or even see it. Or even think. She blitzes hs/mhs people, my dude. Just stop. If speed were equalized she'd probably still stomp but at least then there might be something to talk about. As it stands, Guts was casually outclassed by Claymore post-timeskip.

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#99 Posted by katanalauncher (3770 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts is supersonic, Claire is MHS. How is this a fight?

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#100 Edited by ZettoVii (52 posts) - - Show Bio

@thelocust619: Except that if we are going by statements, they barely mention how fast Clare and the other Claymores are.... Besides just saying that they are faster than a normal person can see and can move so fast they cause after images + some visuals of sonic booms.. All which is also shown and said on Berserk with Guts.

The only thing that is constantly more impressive with Clare's speed, is that she can constantly run with it, while Guts can only dash at short bursts (although he can constantly swing at speeds that causes sonic booms). So we can only really argue that Clare can run faster on the long run, but their striking speed aren't proven any faster besides Wind Cutter and Quick Blade (which got limited use, and are still manageble due to Dragon Slayer's size).

If speed was equalized, Guts would simply be more likely to win. While Theresa wouldn't any longer win via curbstomp, but rather after a tough battle.