Green Scar vs Immortal Hulk vs Current Hulk

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jay_z94

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#1  Edited By jay_z94

RULES:

  • No WBH, TOBA or TITAN.
  • Current Hulk includes Starship and Current PKJ run.
  • No morals, win by KO/Incapacitation/Death.
  • Start 100 metres apart on an indestructible Earth.

Please order them 1st, 2nd and 3rd place.

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jay_z94

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hatsonmelo

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Green Scar, said to be significantly stronger than Savage while Starship is just an intelligent Savage that can control the anger and Immortal is already confirmed to be sub-savage.

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Edgelord91

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#4 Edgelord91  Online

@hatsonmelo: immortal is sub savage in the mental scape DURING THE DAY.

OT- green scar. Explicitly stronger than savage, has the most training and control of his rage, can utilize the World breaker state which is confirmed superior to immortal

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hatsonmelo

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@edgelord91:

immortal is sub savage in the mental scape DURING THE DAY.

Not what I was referring to.

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There are multiple occasions within the IH arc where Savage was said to be stronger, and when IH got too angry he went to Savage.

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Edgelord91

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#6 Edgelord91  Online

@hatsonmelo: Fair enough on the former but the latter means nothing. Banner successfully repressed an enraged green scar in favor of Savage during the first meeting with Skaar

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jimohkolawol10

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Green scar wins.

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rajjarsalt

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#8  Edited By rajjarsalt  Online

Starship is probably the strongest due to power creep. By the end of Immortal Hulk, Thor grew into his full Odinson powers and was powerful enough to fight an Immortal Hulk who is stated by Marvel.com to be well above any previous Hulks.

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And as All-Father Thor is even stronger, perhaps even stronger than the Hulk, but Hulk had changed as well - Banner driving the Starship is the key to that respect.

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This is probably consistent with feats as Starship could play planet-busting god-ball at Level 1-2 and even smashed a planet for fun, while he was trading blows with Thor at Level 8. Iron Man unleashed the power of a Celestial to shoot his a$$. Not to mention doing stuff like harnessing the Thor/Hulk fights against the weight of Mjolnir.

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thedailybagel

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#9  Edited By thedailybagel  Moderator

Immortal Hulk is the weakest. Starship/current hulk vs Green Scar is a difficult one though. At this point it’s hard to argue against starship because some of his feats are outright better than anything Green Scar has done outside of his world breaker state, although if you take into account his other appearances under Pak that aren’t canon it’d be closer.

From a battle forum perspective I feel like you have to go with Starship. In universe I don’t have any doubt that Green Scar would still be considered top dog though.

Edit: By current I mostly mean Starship as it’s stipulated to include that. PKJ’s Hulk hasn’t really done much yet and has a few weird low showings in other appearances.

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thedailybagel

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#10  Edited By thedailybagel  Moderator
@hatsonmelo said:

Green Scar, said to be significantly stronger than Savage while Starship is just an intelligent Savage that can control the anger and Immortal is already confirmed to be sub-savage.

To be fair that was Savage Hulk from nearly 20 years ago. He’s clearly grown allot to the point of shooting eye blasts and letting off gamma bursts himself. I would agree that by intent it’s probably Green Scar, but it’s hard to deny that Starship just has better quantifiable showings than Green Scar does. Even scaling probably leans to starship, although things like decimating Ben and Red Hulk make that more debatable.

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jay_z94

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@thedailybagel: Completely agree! Current Hulk by feats just seems more impressive compared to Green Scar.

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rajjarsalt

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#12  Edited By rajjarsalt  Online

intent is off da charts

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hatsonmelo

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#13  Edited By hatsonmelo
@thedailybagel said:
@hatsonmelo said:

Green Scar, said to be significantly stronger than Savage while Starship is just an intelligent Savage that can control the anger and Immortal is already confirmed to be sub-savage.

To be fair that was Savage Hulk from nearly 20 years ago. He’s clearly grown allot to the point of shooting eye blasts and letting off gamma bursts himself. I would agree that by intent it’s probably Green Scar, but it’s hard to deny that Starship just has better quantifiable showings than Green Scar does. Even scaling probably leans to starship, although things like decimating Ben and Red Hulk make that more debatable.

Should note that 20 years in publication is only like 5 years in-universe due to how sliding timescale works and while Hulk did get the gamma burst thing and it was directly mentioned during Starship Hulk VS Thor that Hulk had fought harder in the past, so his stats were worse if anything (which makes sense with how the Starship works)

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Joe Fixit has better quantifiable than all these Hulks, but we know he doesn't win. As for scaling, not really given how all he has is scaling to OF Thor, who other Hulks have scaling too and has been total ass this past year.

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blackspidey2099

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@thedailybagel said:
@hatsonmelo said:

Green Scar, said to be significantly stronger than Savage while Starship is just an intelligent Savage that can control the anger and Immortal is already confirmed to be sub-savage.

To be fair that was Savage Hulk from nearly 20 years ago. He’s clearly grown allot to the point of shooting eye blasts and letting off gamma bursts himself. I would agree that by intent it’s probably Green Scar, but it’s hard to deny that Starship just has better quantifiable showings than Green Scar does. Even scaling probably leans to starship, although things like decimating Ben and Red Hulk make that more debatable.

Should note that 20 years in publication is only like 5 years in-universe due to how sliding timescale works and while Hulk did get the gamma burst thing and it was directly mentioned during Starship Hulk VS Thor that Hulk had fought harder in the past, so his stats were worse if anything (which makes sense with how the Starship works)

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Joe Fixit has better quantifiable than all these Hulks, but we know he doesn't win. As for scaling, not really given how all he has is scaling to OF Thor, who other Hulks have scaling too and has been total ass this past year.

Interesting, wasn’t it also mentioned that Thor kindly and mercifully held back the vast majority of his true power every time he fought Hulk because he felt bad for the overgrown beanstalk? Starship with the Titan boost is the only Hulk that can stand against a fraction of Thor’s might!

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jay_z94

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#15  Edited By jay_z94

@blackspidey2099: Even then, Starship Hulk was evenly matched against All-Father Thor in the previous issues, who is obviously above normal Thor lol. So I’m not sure what to think about BRB’s comments. In issue 3 it’s stated that Hulk usually holds back as well.

Then there’s also the fact that Donny Cates left around the same time and the issue with BRB’s comments was co-written with another writer who most notably wrote BRB comics…

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blackspidey2099

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@jay_z94 said:

@blackspidey2099: Even then, Starship Hulk was evenly matched against All-Father Thor in the previous issues, who is obviously above normal Thor lol. So I’m not sure what to think about BRB’s comments. In issue 3 it’s stated that Hulk usually holds back as well.

Then there’s also the fact that Donny Cates left around the same time and the issue with BRB’s comments was co-written with another writer who most notably wrote BRB comics…

Pretty sure Thor never used the Odinforce against Hulk, @rajjarsalt can confirm. He’s far too merciful to use such power against the green toddler. It’s also stated that Hulk never holds back, as our very own Hulk expert @hatsonmelo himself has shared!

Not sure what the relevance of your last sentence is.

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rajjarsalt

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#17  Edited By rajjarsalt  Online
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blackspidey2099

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jay_z94

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#19  Edited By jay_z94

@blackspidey2099: Thor is the All-Father here and has the odin-force. He didn’t use OF magic but the OF amps his physicals by default.

We are discussing what is said in the comic; if you’re going to agree with BRB that Thor holds back then you also need to agree where it says that Hulk holds back too.

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blackspidey2099

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@jay_z94: Except the All Power clearly no longer does that in its current incarnation. We even saw that Thor starts glowing gold when he uses it.

Where does it say Hulk holds back?

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DarkPsychicLord_Prime

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I wouln't bet on current Hulk, he was ko'd for like 35 panels by half a building falling on him.

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PooPooEater

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No matter who you think is stronger, immortal hulk showed better regen than green scar, he pretty much seemed unkillable. Where can I read about starship hulk, and whats the comic called @jay_z94?

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jay_z94

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I wouln't bet on current Hulk, he was ko'd for like 35 panels by half a building falling on him.

Which comic was that?

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jay_z94

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No matter who you think is stronger, immortal hulk showed better regen than green scar, he pretty much seemed unkillable. Where can I read about starship hulk, and whats the comic called @jay_z94?

Hulk Volume 5 by Donny Cates. Also the Banner of War story which is part of Vol 5.

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DarkPsychicLord_Prime

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@jay_z94 said:
@darkpsychiclord_prime said:

I wouln't bet on current Hulk, he was ko'd for like 35 panels by half a building falling on him.

Which comic was that?

Sensational She Hulk issue 3

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thedailybagel

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#26 thedailybagel  Moderator

@jay_z94 said:
@darkpsychiclord_prime said:

I wouln't bet on current Hulk, he was ko'd for like 35 panels by half a building falling on him.

Which comic was that?

It was She Hulk. He also has another one with kraven. I don’t take it too seriously when his solo clearly has him way above that level.

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TheDevil98

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Current Hulk's other showings outside of Starship/Banner of War arc drags him down a bit. Green scar is more consistent, so him.

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jay_z94

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#28  Edited By jay_z94
@blackspidey2099 said:

@jay_z94: Except the All Power clearly no longer does that in its current incarnation. We even saw that Thor starts glowing gold when he uses it.

Where does it say Hulk holds back?

Can you prove that having the OF doesn't amp his physicals by default? Because it always has.

Looking specifically at Thor with OF under Cates (as you're referring to current incarnation and that was the one who fought Starship Hulk), literally in the first issue of Thor he explicitly uses OF to make Mjolnir hover in mid-air, he wasn't glowing gold when he did this. There are many more times he uses OF without glowing gold, but again this is irrelevant as I'm saying the OF enhances his physicals, not that he used OF magic during the fight.

Regarding him usually holding back, it's from Banner of War issue 3 (Hulk Vol 5 Issue 7):

Banner - "He doesn't know! He doesn't know he's not in a simulation anymore! He doesn't understand that you're both real! That he can kill you! He's not going to hold back!".

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emperorthanos-

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#29 emperorthanos-  Moderator

Current Hulk isn't even starship anymore. And he hasn't done anything to impressive yet so Green Scar should win.

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jay_z94

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@emperorthanos-: I know current isn’t Starship but I included him because as you said, current hasn’t done anything impressive yet lol

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#32 emperorthanos-  Moderator

@jay_z94 said:

@emperorthanos-: I know current isn’t Starship but I included him because as you said, current hasn’t done anything impressive yet lol

Fair enough. Just contradictory since current is a result of Hulk being pissed about starship.

But yeah just Starship he should beat Immortal Hulk. Green Scar would be close but I guess the core feats should put him above.

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blackspidey2099

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#33  Edited By blackspidey2099

@jay_z94: I don't think it has consistently constantly amped Thor's physicals by default. Do you have scans of that being said? In Jurgens run Thor had to learn to use it and then specifically draw upon it once he mastered it as well. In JMS' run not only did Thor have to specifically use it, but it was also a finite resource that Thor actually ended up completely depleting. Ewing's statement seems pretty clear as well regarding Thor needing to consciously decide to use the Odinforce as to not waste it.

The example you're discussing is before he had the full OF and also I didn't mean that he glows gold every time he uses it, just when he's amping his stats with it. It is very explicitly mentioned every time he uses it though. And how do you think the OF enhances Thor's physicals if not through the effect of magic?

That statement doesn't say Hulk usually holds back, it just says Hulk won't hold back in this fight. Those are two different things that don't mutually imply one another.

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jay_z94

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#34  Edited By jay_z94

@blackspidey2099: I’m on my phone but when OF Thor fought Bor in JMS run (#600), he took a hit and said he’d be dead if he didn’t have OF, no glowing either. In Jurgens run he dented Cap’s shield with a hit and even Iron Man was shocked about how Thor did that, no glowing.

Again I’m arguing OF amps his physicals like strength and durability by default; this would be due to magic but it’s not the same as using magic to stop Mjolnir in mid-air or using magic to amp his lightning, etc.

It does mean that Hulk usually holds back. The only reason he isn’t holding back is because he thinks he’s in a simulation.

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blackspidey2099

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#35  Edited By blackspidey2099

@jay_z94: I know the feat you're discussing and it clearly seems to be Thor using the OF to survive Bor's attack, which is why he mentioned it. The glowing thing is only from Cates' run IIRC, but anyways Thor only had a portion of the OF in JMS run so he wouldn't have glowed regardless. Anyways the Cates example is far more relevant to this showing since both were written by Cates. We can clearly see that when Thor uses the OF to amp himself under Cates, he glows golden. He never did so against Hulk. Thus he was not using the OF.

No, it says Hulk isn't holding back now because he thinks he's in a simulation. It says nothing about Hulk's usual habits. And even if it did, there's nothing to suggest that Hulk's usual habits apply specifically to his fights against Thor, who is one of the most powerful beings Hulk has ever interacted with.

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jay_z94

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#36  Edited By jay_z94

@blackspidey2099: My point is that when he has OF, his durability is naturally higher, he doesn’t have to “turn it on”. He survived Bor’s attack because he has the OF. Also I edited my previous post to include the following: “In Jurgens run he dented Cap’s shield with a hit and even Iron Man was shocked about how Thor did that, no glowing.”

Under Cates he only glowed golden once; when fighting the storm that was in his hammer. There were multiple times in Cates’ run were he explicitly used Odin force and didn’t glow golden.

The comic is telling you Hulk won’t hold back now that he thinks he’s in a simulation. This literally means that Hulk usually holds back when he’s not in a simulation i.e. real life.

EDIT: Look at post #8 and #51; OF does amp Thor, all of this under Cates.

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thedailybagel

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#37  Edited By thedailybagel  Moderator
@hatsonmelo said:

Should note that 20 years in publication is only like 5 years in-universe due to how sliding timescale works and while Hulk did get the gamma burst thing and it was directly mentioned during Starship Hulk VS Thor that Hulk had fought harder in the past, so his stats were worse if anything (which makes sense with how the Starship works)

Joe Fixit has better quantifiable than all these Hulks, but we know he doesn't win. As for scaling, not really given how all he has is scaling to OF Thor, who other Hulks have scaling too and has been total ass this past year.

I don't think that means his stats were worse, Starship Hulk also encompasses Savage Hulk who was part of those "harder" fights that Banner was referring to, and gets scaling to Starship Hulk anyway because he powers it.

We know Joe Fixit's standard power level because he clearly doesn't perform at planet busting/infinite strength 99.9% of the time. Starship Hulk doesn't have anything to suggest that his feats were anything but his standard level. Why exactly would you put Green Scar above him aside from retroactively scaling him from Savage Hulk?

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Kevd4wg

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@jay_z94: I'd say it was shown in JMS's run that Thor did not always have the Odin Force given he told Iron Man the only difference between who he was in their fight and who he is normally is that he is not holding back, meaning he wasn't using the Odin Force

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rajjarsalt

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#39  Edited By rajjarsalt  Online
@kevd4wg said:

@jay_z94: I'd say it was shown in JMS's run that Thor did not always have the Odin Force given he told Iron Man the only difference between who he was in their fight and who he is normally is that he is not holding back, meaning he wasn't using the Odin Force

Aye! Thor also told Dr Strange that "some" of Odin's power was within him before giving it up to reforge the hammer.

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hatsonmelo

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#41  Edited By hatsonmelo
@thedailybagel said:
@hatsonmelo said:

Should note that 20 years in publication is only like 5 years in-universe due to how sliding timescale works and while Hulk did get the gamma burst thing and it was directly mentioned during Starship Hulk VS Thor that Hulk had fought harder in the past, so his stats were worse if anything (which makes sense with how the Starship works)

Joe Fixit has better quantifiable than all these Hulks, but we know he doesn't win. As for scaling, not really given how all he has is scaling to OF Thor, who other Hulks have scaling too and has been total ass this past year.

I don't think that means his stats were worse, Starship Hulk also encompasses Savage Hulk who was part of those "harder" fights that Banner was referring to, and gets scaling to Starship Hulk anyway because he powers it.

We know Joe Fixit's standard power level because he clearly doesn't perform at planet busting/infinite strength 99.9% of the time. Starship Hulk doesn't have anything to suggest that his feats were anything but his standard level. Why exactly would you put Green Scar above him aside from retroactively scaling him from Savage Hulk?

Savage's strength isn't a constant thing, he was likely just angrier in some of those fights than he was as Starship, which makes sense as we know the Starship can overheat but Hulk's anger itself doesn't. And like you just said, Starship is fueled by Savage's power so at best he'd be at the same level.

Joe Fixit has a lot more appearances which means much more room for anti-feats, Starship didn't appear outside his own solo and like 2 issues of Thor for Banner of War, but the point is quantifiable feats are far from the end all be all and hold less weight than fundamental in-verse logic, like how Starship is just powered by a weaker persona of Hulk than Green Scar, which is the only reason you could ever need for his victory.

@kevd4wg said:

@jay_z94: I'd say it was shown in JMS's run that Thor did not always have the Odin Force given he told Iron Man the only difference between who he was in their fight and who he is normally is that he is not holding back, meaning he wasn't using the Odin Force

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jay_z94

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#42  Edited By jay_z94

@kevd4wg: His fight against Iron Man doesn’t change the fact that having Odin Force does amp his durability, as is shown against Bor.

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jay_z94

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@rajjarsalt: Regardless, that “some” of Odin’s power amped his durability enough to keep him alive. Thor has the full power inside of him in Banner of War.

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MightyThorOdinson

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starship>green scar>immortal

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thedailybagel

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#45  Edited By thedailybagel  Moderator

@hatsonmelo:

Savage's strength isn't a constant thing, he was likely just angrier in some of those fights than he was as Starship, which makes sense as we know the Starship can overheat but Hulk's anger itself doesn't. And like you just said, Starship is fueled by Savage's power so at best he'd be at the same level.

When Savage came out against Stark and Thor he let off a gamma burst bigger than a holding back WBH which was an ability that only Green Scar had used previously, was shooting eye lasers and Stark called him a super hulk. I'd say he was angrier than he'd been in a long time honestly. That comes with being basically tortured by Banner in addition to not holding back. He also brawled evenly with Hulk-Thor who was a flat out planet buster.

Joe Fixit has a lot more appearances which means much more room for anti-feats, Starship didn't appear outside his own solo and like 2 issues of Thor for Banner of War

I wouldn't call it anti feats, Joe was mentioned frequently to be the weakest Hulk and was almost always portrayed that way, other character would also comment on that frequently... So had both feats and in verse logic to support that. The big feats are very obvious outliers even if you just look at his solo, Starship's are not.

, but the point is quantifiable feats are far from the end all be all and hold less weight than fundamental in-verse logic, like how Starship is just powered by a weaker persona of Hulk than Green Scar, which is the only reason you could ever need for his victory.

You are basing this "in-verse" logic on a statement made 20 years ago, two decades before starship was even a concept. Since then Hulk's powers have evolved allot and Savage Hulk has replicated abilities that only Green Scar displayed and even developed new ones.

As I said I'm sure Green Scar would still be portrayed as the most powerful if/when he appears again, but I don't think you can retroactively scale him above a current Savage Hulk because he was said to be stronger 20 years ago when Hulk's powers have changed since then. Like, if Savage Hulk got super angry and started beating on cosmic entities as his standard power level would you still say that Green Scar is above him? I'm just not sure where you think the line is to be able to say "yep that's fair enough, X Hulk > Green Scar". Also:

quantifiable feats are far from the end all be all and hold less weight than fundamental in-verse logic,

Do you always agree with this line of thinking? In-verse logic would dictate guys like Sentry to be one of the most powerful heroes in Marvel, which I'm sure we both heavily disagree with based on his feats and scaling.

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Strike3

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#46  Edited By Strike3

Immortal Hulk can quickly steal gamma energy.

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Kevd4wg

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@jay_z94: It shows hes not using the odin force at all times. The Odin Force was clearly not a factor in the iron man fight at all

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hatsonmelo

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@thedailybagel:

When Savage came out against Stark and Thor he let off a gamma burst bigger than a holding back WBH which was an ability that only Green Scar had used previously

You can't just assume its potency based on the size of the burst, and it's not even the first time Hulk has gamma bursted outside of WWH.

was shooting eye lasers and Stark called him a super hulk.

She-Hulk has shot gamma projectiles too, and Stark had never seen Hulk gamma burst before so he obviously thought something funky was going on (which it might have been given the panel where Titan seemed to be coming out for a second).

Also, why are we talking about this instance when this was after the Starship was destroyed? Even if you want to argue Hulk reached some new level at this moment, it can't negate Banner's statement that Hulk fought harder in the past.

He also brawled evenly with Hulk-Thor who was a flat out planet buster.

*Half-planet buster, but it's not like Hulk hasn't had feats like those before.

I wouldn't call it anti feats, Joe was mentioned frequently to be the weakest Hulk and was almost always portrayed that way, other character would also comment on that frequently... So had both feats and in verse logic to support that. The big feats are very obvious outliers even if you just look at his solo, Starship's are not.

Joe was the weakest, but the margin wasn't massive as a manifestation of him brawled evenly with Savage Hulk. The reason something can be an outlier is due to anti-feats, which Starship never had the chance to get due to so little appearances. Anyway, even Savage Hulk has better high-end quantifiable than Starship's godball thing if you want to ignore Fixit.

You are basing this "in-verse" logic on a statement made 20 years ago, two decades before starship was even a concept. Since then Hulk's powers have evolved allot and Savage Hulk has replicated abilities that only Green Scar displayed and even developed new ones.

First, it's not 20 years. Marvel operates on a sliding timescale. In the 60 years of publication, 15 years have passed in-verse. Therefore, in 20 years, 5 years have passed in-verse, and in that time there has been no stated change to Hulk's stats. Look at Cho Hulk VS Hulk in generations. Same power, 60 years difference, stalemate. And again, new abilities doesn't mean stronger, otherwise She-Hulk would be stronger for gamma breath.

Like, if Savage Hulk got super angry and started beating on cosmic entities as his standard power level would you still say that Green Scar is above him?

False equivalency. That would be an actual in-universe amp to his stats (this new stated "super" level of anger) unlike assuming Savage is stronger than ever without a stated stat increase and ignoring the blatant contradiction via Banner saying he fought harder in the past. I'd also just call it an anti-feat for the entities like Alicia hurting Death last year.

Do you always agree with this line of thinking? In-verse logic would dictate guys like Sentry to be one of the most powerful heroes in Marvel, which I'm sure we both heavily disagree with based on his feats and scaling.

Obviously no line of thinking can be correct 100% of the time, but yes it's generally correct. Most superheroes in Marvel are street tiers so Sentry being one of the most powerful is fine. I get the point you were trying to make though so I'll say that Sentry being the most powerful has direct proof otherwise, Green Scar>Savage doesn't and only has supporting evidence.

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jay_z94

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@kevd4wg: It doesn’t show that though as Iron Man and Thor’s comments are regarding Thor hitting Iron Man; “you’ve been working out”. Nothing about Thor’s durability.

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thedailybagel

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#50  Edited By thedailybagel  Moderator

@hatsonmelo:

You can't just assume its potency based on the size of the burst, and it's not even the first time Hulk has gamma bursted outside of WWH.

It was equal to 3000 gamma bombs, dusted Tony's celestial Hulkbuster and released enough radiation for Tony to refer to the world as "dying", let alone how big it was. It's the most powerful gamma burst Hulk has ever done outside of WBH going all out.

She-Hulk has shot gamma projectiles too, and Stark had never seen Hulk gamma burst before so he obviously thought something funky was going on (which it might have been given the panel where Titan seemed to be coming out for a second).

Also, why are we talking about this instance when this was after the Starship was destroyed? Even if you want to argue Hulk reached some new level at this moment, it can't negate Banner's statement that Hulk fought harder in the past.

As per this thread we aren't purely talking about Starship Hulk with Banner in charge. Current Savage Hulk scales to everything starship did and above that.

*Half-planet buster, but it's not like Hulk hasn't had feats like those before.

Two guys hitting each other to do that is obviously enough proof to suggest one can do it on their own, especially as Starship Hulk has planet busted anyway. He busted a planet, fought planet busters, and played volleyball with planetary cores against Hulks that could also planet bust and smash those cores by accident.

Joe was the weakest, but the margin wasn't massive as a manifestation of him brawled evenly with Savage Hulk. The reason something can be an outlier is due to anti-feats, which Starship never had the chance to get due to so little appearances. Anyway, even Savage Hulk has better high-end quantifiable than Starship's godball thing if you want to ignore Fixit.

The margin between Savage and Joe is substantial enough, although Joe isn't really relevant here. I don't know why you keep focusing on Starships lack of anti feats as any form of evidence to back your argument, it's a testament to how consistently powerful he was. Honestly I don't have any doubt that he would've done even crazier stuff under Cates had the run not been cut short.

I mean sure Savage Hulk in general has better outlier feats than Green Scar or Starship, the reason those two are considered to be so powerful is their consistency, and I guess statements in both cases.

First, it's not 20 years. Marvel operates on a sliding timescale. In the 60 years of publication, 15 years have passed in-verse. Therefore, in 20 years, 5 years have passed in-verse, and in that time there has been no stated change to Hulk's stats. Look at Cho Hulk VS Hulk in generations. Same power, 60 years difference, stalemate. And again, new abilities doesn't mean stronger, otherwise She-Hulk would be stronger for gamma breath.

Semantics, honestly. Hulk has obviously changed tons to the point of his entire origin and power source being retconned. Hulk's stats have been generally better ever since the core breach to the point of it being acknowledged by guidebooks and characters... Examples like Thor saying that Devil was vastly stronger than Hulk used to be and Devil is weaker than Savage, along with statements by Banner that his gamma is constantly evolving.

Cho was regularly confirmed to be weaker than current Banner outside of his Dark Cho state, it was quite a big plot point and mentioned multiple times.

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Stalemating a way earlier Hulk kinda lends credence to that.

False equivalency. That would be an actual in-universe amp to his stats (this new stated "super" level of anger) unlike assuming Savage is stronger than ever without a stated stat increase and ignoring the blatant contradiction via Banner saying he fought harder in the past. I'd also just call it an anti-feat for the entities like Alicia hurting Death last year.

What would you need to prove that starship (I'm using that term to include current savage as well) is stronger than Green Scar? He has multiple feats that are better than anything Green Scar did in a shorter period of time... Seems clear cut to me honestly.

Obviously no line of thinking can be correct 100% of the time, but yes it's generally correct. Most superheroes in Marvel are street tiers so Sentry being one of the most powerful is fine. I get the point you were trying to make though so I'll say that Sentry being the most powerful has direct proof otherwise, Green Scar>Savage doesn't and only has supporting evidence.

The only evidence you have is an outdated statement. I can agree that it's enough to suggest that Green Scar would be depicted as more powerful in universe, but you can't argue that from a battle forums perspective honestly, despite Green Scar being my favorite Hulk personality. Do you think you can upscale Green Scar based on what Starship does as well?