General Grievous vs venom

Round 1-Grievous

Round 2- Venom

Round 3-Grievous

venom shuts down his cybernetic suit and then he takes control of him

@dmnb2wavy:

how does canon gg have comparable strength feats to comic venom?

“he kicked extremly thick metal door ( that weights around 8 tons) like 10+ meters, which would be like sending human flying hundreds of meters( since human weights only 100 kg), basicly like what Zod did to Clark in MOS,”

not sure how impressive compared To venom.

venom scales to Spider-Man who lifts tanks which can weigh up to 60 tons

“He was able to destroy Mandalorian helmets( they are basicly nearly indestructible in star wars),“

can you quantify it with feats.

“he was also able to trade blows with beings that can harm him and that is impresive since GG was able to no sell being force pushed with enaguh force heavily dent extremly thick durasteel wall and tank exsplosion that destroys ship“

thats Not how that works. By this logic cap can scale to Spider-Man In strength bc they can ”trade blows” does the person that hurts grievous actually over power him? Or have similar durability to grevious? how big is the ship anyway And how durable is durasteel?

And how are blasters faster than bullets?

“They can move 7/8 times faster than Qui Gon while he was moving so fast he was literaly blur, 400 kmh arrow is not blur for example, and logically star wars is much much more advanced than the earth, so they will not use things slower than bullets”

can you post a scan or a link. As for that last part about being advanced you would assume they are faster than bullets unless there is something stating that. They can use blasters bc probably they are more convenient ( no bullets, no reload ) and they are more powerful instead of them being outright faster.

@dmnb2wavy:

venom scales to Spider-Man who lifts tanks which can weigh up to 60 tons

“Peter is not 60 toner consistently, he is around 25 toner and Venom is stronger yes but Peter has still hurt him with his hits and sending 8 tons 10+ meters is honestly above that as strength feat”

can you prove he is 25 tons consistently? Honestly I argue he is 40-50 tons consistently and venom also has a feat of him lifting a tank.
also how is sending 8+ tons 10+ meters better than lifting and smashing a 60 ton tank?

also Spider-Man ( enraged) has a feat of sending 2099 iron man into a Small building and splitting it in half

can you quantify it with feats

“It can no sell powerful explosions, “

but how big? Spider man can hurt and one shot tombstone on some occasions and he no sold building explosions

“i can try to find some feats if you want but it should allow him to hand with Venom”

not really with what’s presented

thats Not how that works. By this logic cap can scale to Spider-Man In strength bc they can ”trade blows” does the person that hurts grievous actually over power him? Or have similar durability to grevious? how big is the ship anyway And how durable is durasteel?

1. “Cap hurting Peter does show his hits are not much weaker, “

not much weaker? Are you suggesting cap can hit with the force of a building explosion?

“i mean if Peter hits where much stronger he would kill himself with his own punch which is not what happends, Peter can tank hits from beings that can hit as hard as he can“

yeah no. this Is fiction we can’t apply that logic here. daredevil Can “trade blows” with Spider-Man but that does not mean he is anywhere close to as durable or as strong.

also peter can hurt characters that are far more durable than himself ( like cage, iron man,ext) and tank hits from characters that are stronger than him. again as I said this is fiction We can’t apply strength= durability bc then I can say Spider-Man takes all of iron man durability and Luke durability feats

2.“No force users do not overpower him they can hurt him with their hits and those force users can also tank hits from other force users as strong as them, yet GG hurts them just as much if not more than those force users, you see my point, my point is basicly he can hurt himslef with his own hits”

fine

3. “They are pretty big, like f35 planes or litle bigger”

so basically it’s worser than tombstone building explosion feat?

“Yes

We see it moving much faster than Qui Gon while he was moving like a blur( just see how much bigger distance it crossed comapred to Qui Gon), it crossed 8 meters in time it took Qui Gon to cross like a meter or less

And actually blasters do need to reload they do not have infinite ammo, something that advanced would not be slower than bullets but yeah they do have feats to show that“

I never seen blasters needing to reload the only thing I know is they over heat But yeah this is good.

he can definitely blizt venom and win

EU GG crub stomps hundreds of Venoms

@dmnb2wavy:

can you prove he is 25 tons consistently? Honestly I argue he is 40-50 tons consistently and venom also has a feat of him lifting a tank.

“He does not have many feats in 50-ton range and is generally stated to be around 25 toner“

he has at least 4 50 ton feats to my knowledge and so? Spider-Man has went above 25 tons all the time. Even if Spider-Man was not 50 tons he would still be at 40 tons which from my knowledge should be more consistent than 50.

also how is sending 8+ tons 10+ meters better than lifting and smashing a 60 ton tank?

“I know people that can lift 150 kg and smash it, but they cannot send something that hard flying for even few meters much less 10+ meters, sending it 10+ meters more than makes up for any less weight”

okay one post the scan and 2 is that even consistent for grevious? I watched some clips and his hits barely do any damage to Jedi and he got slightly over powered by clones.

also Spider-Man ( enraged) has a feat of sending 2099 iron man into a Small building and splitting it in half

“He only cut part of the building if i am not wrong and iron man does not weight more than 20 kg and that is honestly not consistent, Peter consistently does not hit that hard“

This is Peter enraged which is why he is hitting harder and this feat is better than grievous feat. Also no this is consistent with the fact Spider-Man has another feat of pulling a building apart and catching half of a building from falling.

but how big? Spider man can hurt and one shot tombstone on some occasions and he no sold building explosions

“Well i will try to find some big exsplosion feats and post them”

“Can you post that feat? I mean building level tanking, Spiderman hits are not building level consistently, even Deathstroke has tanked building level explosions, is Batman now building level as well since he hurt him, that is not consistent“

Yes spider man is building lvl when he fights seriously. When he holds back )which he does a lot) that’s when he is Not building lvl. Also lol you do realize batman has like multiple building lvl feats right? I argue that Batman could be building lvl but that’s a discussion for another day.

Gallery

not much weaker? Are you suggesting cap can hit with the force of a building explosion?

“No, but neither can Peter, not even close”

he has knocked out characters who tanked a building explosion.

yeah no. this Is fiction we can’t apply that logic here. daredevil Can “trade blows” with Spider-Man but that does not mean he is anywhere close to as durable or as strong.

also peter can hurt characters that are far more durable than himself ( like cage, iron man,ext) and tank hits from characters that are stronger than him. again as I said this is fiction We can’t apply strength= durability bc then I can say Spider-Man takes all of iron man durability and Luke durability feats

“Just because it is fiction does not mean basic logic does not apply, Deardevil cannot trade blows with bloodlusted Spiderman that is why that is wrong”

fine And no it’s still not wrong as the cap example still stands.

“Cage is not really more durable than Peter consistently when it comes to blunt force, he is street level,”

umm yes he is. Luke fights mid tiers more consistently.

“Iron Man is but Peter hurting somone who no sells nukes is PIS and we both know it, just like him hurting Hulk, that is why that logic is wrong as well”

okay yeah I can agree it’s pis

so basically it’s worser than tombstone building explosion feat?

“Well Peter hits are not building level so i do not see your point here”

they are so moving on

actually I take my statement back he can’t blizt

“He really can by feats“

nope

Also from what I’ve seen in clone wars canon dude( or machine) is a class canon

“No, he is not glass canon, he is very durable for his tier, he is no Hulk but he is durable neaugh to tank Venom hits“

Yeah no I’ve seen some clips from the clone war series. Would you like to explain why grevious lost to jar jars and got his suit cut through by a at best peak lvl character? Or how clones could hold him in place and cut through his armor with grappling hooks?

hell you even stated that Jedi were just as strong or around his strength lvl which is why they don’t really get hurt but jedi get hurt by bounty hunters so what are they also just as strong too? Grevious being 8 tons is not consistent it seems. His hits barely do any damage at all

Venom needs a couple of hits to take out grievous

“He needs more than that but GG needs only one with Saber”

nope grevious is not that durable

Overall 616 venom would beat canon grievous

“He really would not“

nope

@dmnb2wavy:

he has at least 4 50 ton feats to my knowledge and so? Spider-Man has went above 25 tons all the time. Even if Spider-Man was not 50 tons he would still be at 40 tons which from my knowledge should be more consistent than 50.

“He is consistently 25 toner, he has fetas above it just like Batman has feats on high tier level but it is not cosistnet”

nope he is consistently above prove he is not above that lvl.

okay one post the scan and 2 is that even consistent for grevious? I watched some clips and his hits barely do any damage to Jedi and he got slightly over powered by clones.

“1. Because Jedi are really durable like i siad, Kanan has tanked AT Walker blasts, same blasts can destroy houses and buildings“

Lol yet they get injured by regular bounty hunters? Also wft regular blaster fire has killed Jedi in one of three hits I argue that’s just plot armor and inconsistent. Also post the scan.

2. “Show me him being overpowered by clones and that lis lifting strength, “

https://youtu.be/Kte-jKKyNOo

2:20 and also lifting is not that far beyond striking.

“to overpower somone you need lifting that does not contradict him hurting somone and sending something flying with a kick which is striking strength”

you would obviously need be around the same strength to send someone flying like that and I Asked for the scan which you have yet to send.

Yeah no I’ve seen some clips from the clone war series. Would you like to explain why grevious lost to jar jars and got his suit cut through by a at best peak lvl character?

“1. When did he lose to Jar Jars”

it was his race my mistake

“2. Because their wepon can cut him? That is not strength feat, just like Wolverine cuts Hulk”

there weapons don’t seem to be anything special and you would need to be at a certain strength lvl to cut something. Also terrible example wolverine claws can basically cut through anything

Or how clones could hold him in place and cut through his armor with grappling hooks?

“That are pricing durability and that is a feat for hooks “

so apparently it’s a feat for everyone else lol okay.

“and GG consistently easily overpowers Clones”

post scans plus it was two clones post a scan of him easily overpowering two clones at the same time

This is Peter enraged which is why he is hitting harder and this feat is better than grievous feat. Also no this is consistent with the fact Spider-Man has another feat of pulling a building apart and catching half of a building from falling.

“1. Even bloodlusted Peter does not have feats to make this consistent”

nope Post evidence as to why.

“2.. That is lifting strength ( him holding building) and this is striking strength( iron man feat) that is why that is not consistent“

lol no this is consistent with the fact he has building lvl strength. While lifting and striking are different overall the fact he can do both in striking and lifting suggests that its consistent plus lifting and striking are not that different from each other.

Yes spider man is building lvl when he fights seriously. When he holds back )which he does a lot) that’s when he is Not building lvl.

“He really is not building level even when he is bloodlusted by feats“

yes he is.

Also lol you do realize batman has like multiple building lvl feats right? I argue that Batman could be building lvl but that’s a discussion for another day.

“I never saw the building being destroyed there so how does that make him building level?“

are you being serious? One look at Spider-Man text he says that was a building and two the explosion is bigger than the buildings in the for front

he has knocked out characters who tanked a building explosion.

“And Batman has knocked out chracters that tank continetal level damage, is Batman now continetal buster?”

inconsistent and stupid example. building lvl is consistent for Spider-Man as he has three feats or four feats in that area.

fine And no it’s still not wrong as the cap example still stands.

“It really does not”

yeah no.

umm yes he is. Luke fights mid tiers more consistently.

“So do many street levelers but he is still street level and is consistently hurt by street-level htis”

nope that was in the past post scans of him getting hurt by street lvl characters in moderate times.

i can post two scans of street lvl heroes such as Deadpool and daredevil hurting their hands while punching like cage.

nope

“That is not an argument”

you didn’t post up a argument so this counter is irrelevant until you post a argument.

hell, you even stated that Jedi were just as strong or around his strength lvl which is why they don’t really get hurt but jedi get hurt by bounty hunters so what are they also just as strong too? Grevious being 8 tons is not consistent it seems. His hits barely do any damage at all

“1. Jedi consistently stomp bounty hunters”

post scans.

“but yes in star wars bounty hunters ( which are mostly superhuman aliens are that strong) well Jango Feat is peak human but he is peak human-like Samurai Jack is( Samurai Jack is technically peak human but we know how strong he is) but mostly without PIS Jedi stomp them in fight that is why GG feats are consistent”

nope 1. post scans of bounty hunters being above peak human, 2. Nope it’s consistent for bounty hunters to at least stand their ground And hurt Jedi. also gg feats are not consistent you still have yet to post the scan and he only had one feat on that lvl. You asking for consistency for my character but where is it for grevious?

nope grevious is not that durable

“He is durable enaguh“

nope

nope

“That is not an argument“

lol and so was most of what you said.

grvious best feat is what not even building lvl? Spider-Man has consistent building lvl strength and venom three or four shots him

@dmnb2wavy:

“Lets agree to disagree,”

fine

“you do not understand difference between lifting and striking( 2 completly difirent things,”

I do but your acting like they are massively far apart from each other, Newsflash they aren’t. at best Spider-Man striking or lifting would be 4 to 5 tons apart Or maybe a little bit more.

“having few feats of lifting parts of the building does not make one building level punch consistent, “

yes it does. I can ask you to prove me wrong but again you never do. Funny thing you talk about consistency when grevious has like one feat that is anywhere close to venom or Spider-Man strength lvl. Lol that one feat of grevious is the only thing keeping you in the debate.

“they are completly different ), you think that Spiderman and Batman are building busters( lol)”

lol Your acting like building lvl is such a stretch for spider man honestly it really isn’t. I gave you consistent feats in the area just accept that your wrong and move on. and Batman has consistent building lvl feats Like I said but that’s not what we are talking about here. You still have not proven me wrong on spider man so what your doing is just running away at that point. Don’t just lol and run away debate me on the topic.

, “you do not understand that pricing durabiltiy is different than blunt force durability, “

I do but again you need to be at a certain strength lvl to pierce something otherwise you can’t cut it. I’m using your realistic logic against you btw and even if I was to not to accept this logic venom can make axes to cut grevious if he wanted to.

“not to mention many other wrong thigns, “

lol sure we can talk about how you barely posted any evidence I asked for in these last hours?

“sorry but i do not believe i can change your mind no matter what i siad here, so lets agree to disagree”

yeah sure what You said was actually dumb you can change people minds if you actually know what your talking about. If you actually knew what you was talking about you could change my mind but clearly you don’t so you can’t. I would of of just accepted the agree to dis agree but what your doing is actually just insulting My intelligence acting like you actually know what your talking about

@dmnb2wavy:

yeah sure what You said was actually dumb you can change people minds if you actually know what your talking about. If you actually knew what you was talking about you could change my mind but clearly you don’t so you can’t. I would of of just accepted the agree to dis agree but what your doing is actually just insulting and really stupid

“I never insulted you in any of my posts but well lets see your argument if you say someone can change your mind”

• lol you did in your last post. Seriously if you think that was not insulting...... I’m gonna leave it at that.

nope he is consistently above prove he is not above that lvl.

“That is not how it works, you need to post many consistent feats to prove he is on that level not few, this is 70 years old character, having few feats does not make it consistent”

• and how old is grevious? 30 or 40 years? And a few feats is consistent enough. It’s not like beta ray bill has many planet busting feats( he has like 2 from my knowledge) but yet people place him at planet lvl. Same with iron man who has only full one mountain lvl feat ( to my knowledge) and another mountain lvl feat with help and yet he we place him at mountain lvl.
• Honestly why is building lvl a stretch for spider man when other characters we place at high lvls even tho they barely do anything at the lvl they are supposed to be at?

Lol yet they get injured by regular bounty hunters?

“That would be feat for those bounty hunters, that is how that works when we know how somone is durable if you hurt him it is a feat for you”

• nope Prove the bounty hunters are super humanly strong( can at least lift or hit with the force of 5 tons with a scan)

Also wft regular blaster fire has killed Jedi in one of three hits I argue that’s just plot armor and inconsistent. Also post the scan.

• [SWR] [Hit by force from blast of explosive AT-DP fire] (https://gfycat.com/CheapEvenDutchshepherddog)

“Blasters are heat-based wepon while those blasts from walkers are more exsplosion( meaning blunt force) type of wepon, so completly diffirent2”

• post a scan stating this.
• also is this even consistent? post more scans of Jedi tanking this lvl of blast. And post a scan for the walker so I can know why it’s impressive.

2:20 and also lifting is not that far beyond striking.

“That is not overpowering, “

• did I say it was? If I did my mistake.

“for the most part he was not even moving or trying to do anything,

• mmmmm no he was trying to escape and yet he could not go no where.

“he was fighting Jedi while they were trying to pull him yet none of them could evne move him, “

• albeit he still could not go anywhere which is my point.

“the only part where you could argue is overpowering is where they pulled him down when he was holding celling but that he was only holding it with his fingers, basicly few clones using their entire body overpowered strength of his fingers( that is like few % of your body strength) that does not mean they are clsoe to him and then he easily overpowered them when he jumped, so that is not anti feat and no agian lifting and striking are very different”

• lol this is a anti feat. While I agree grevious is stronger it’s not by much. if He was that much stronger that he could easily kick 8 tons in a far distance clones could not over power him or stop him at all. He would just swing them like kids.

you would obviously need be around the same strength to send someone flying like that and I Asked for the scan which you have yet to send.

Here is scan

https://gfycat.com/frenchsimpleamericancurl

• ummmm okay so 1. how do we that’s 8 tons and 2. post A scan of it showing how far it goes. At best that seems like a 5 ton feat honestly And 3. Does he have any more scans on this lvl?

“No really, no, lifting and striking are 2 completly different things in fiction,”

• lol so now your using the in fiction excuse? huh funny anyway

“so no you would not, Flash, for example, hits harder than Superman but is nowhere near as strong when it comes to lifting”

• terrible example the flash uses speed to amp his strikes unlike Superman. the flash physically is not strong like spider man or Superman

“or Goku, for example, his strength is nothing special but he hits harder than Superman”

• no dbz is just inconsistent that’s honestly all it is. Goku withstood the weight of a black hole and was able to move throughout it. so the example does not stand.
• if your gonna hit me with a example hit me with a good one otherwise I can just dismiss it.

there weapons don’t seem to be anything special and you would need to be at a certain strength lvl to cut something. Also terrible example wolverine claws can basically cut through anything

lol I do but again you need to be at a certain strength lvl to pierce something otherwise you can’t cut it. I’m using your realistic logic against you btw and even if I was to accept not to accept this logic venom can make axes to cut grevious if he wanted to.

“1. No, you do not some weapons are just super sharp, you do not need great force if your wepon is sharp enaguh, so no you are using my logic aginst me wrong way”

• yeah no if we are using realistic logic you would not be able to cut something super durable no matter hard sharp it is.
• try getting a sharp sword and cutting something like bullet proof glass

“2. he can, i agree but GG will cut him first since he is fasters“

• He isn’t faster. actually where do you cap grevious speed Mach 1 or Mach 2?

o apparently it’s a feat for everyone else lol okay.

“if something can cut or hurt somone with established durabiltiy feats? Yes it is a feat for that“

• this Only works if a series is actually consistent with their strength lvl.
• your only feats of strength is with grevious and I’m not sure if that feat is even 5 tons. Honestly your just scaling off grevious one feat. I have yet to see any other jedi or clones pull of any strength feats that suggest that they can hang with grevious in strength or even have 3 ton lifting or striking.

post scans plus it was two clones post a scan of him easily overpowering two clones at the same time

“He did it here when he pulled them

https://gfycat.com/aggravatingshadowygemsbok“

• The page is not found. Just post the scan.

nope Post evidence as to why.

“Because he does not have many feats on that level to make it consistent, he literaly has one striking feat on that level in 70 years of history, he needs like 15,20 at least to make it consistent”

• lol wft 15 or 20? That’s way to high to be consistent. No 4-5 feats is consistent enough as to why I already stated before. also Namor has one mountain lvl feat and yet we consider him mountain lvl don’t we?

lol no this is consistent with the fact he has building lvl strength. While lifting and striking are different overall the fact he can do both in striking and lifting suggests that itsconsistent plus lifting and striking are not that different from each other.

“That is not how it works, he needs many striking feats on that level to prove that feat consistent not lifting, i can lift some big rock, but can i destroy it with a punch? Not even close”

• yes that’s exactly how that works if we are being realistic striking and lifting would not be that much apart from each other. hell humans can lift more than they strike if I’m remember correctly

yes he is.

“Not an argument”

• not a counter post a argument

are you being serious? One look at Spider-Man text he says that was a building and two the explosion is bigger than the buildings in the for front

“.I want to see the building being destroyed not Peter saying something or size of exsplosion, damage is what matters here and how do we know he no solled it?”

• no peter states it himself and you see a explosion the size of a building in the distance thats enough evidence. also didn’t I post the next scan of him still awake? I over exaggerated the no selling part tho still he was not that fazed by it.

inconsistent and stupid example. building lvl is consistent for Spider-Man as he has three feats or four feats in that area.

“Same is with Peter feat tbh “

• lol seriously? Building lvl is not that Far thatched. Continental is a big stretch.

“and no even if he had 3 feats on that level that would not make it consistent for 70 years old chracter and he does not, he has lifting feats on that level”

• yes by the logic that we use for other characters on this site it would be indeed consistent. or are you going to find three feats of mountain lvl striking from iron man or namor ?

yeah no

“Then say why? I mean you need to do beter than to say nope or no”

• sure

nope that was in the past post scans of him getting hurt by street lvl characters in moderate times.

i can post two scans of street lvl heroes such as Deadpool and daredevil hurting their hands while punching like cage.

“Feats from past are just as good as feats from modern times”

• not good if they are not consistent with the current version.

“and Luke has many anti feats do you really want me to post them?“

• post the modern ones

“Deardevil is pretty weak, he is around a wall level or less that does not mean much, “

• This isn’t the point you said he gets hurt by street lvl characters so it’s irrelevant

“same is with Deadpool when it comes to striking, Peter is much stronger than them so that is why he can hurt Luke”

• the same thing applies

you didn’t post up a argument so this counter is irrelevantuntil you post a argument.

“But i did, he can blitz blaster timers and fight people that can move so fast world is frozen in time,”

• 1. honestly you never caped a speed for them so I don’t know it’s impressive. like Mach 1 or Mach 2. okay post a scan for last part if they could move while everyone else is froze ( and not moving in slow motion) I will concede to grevious winning. Btw when Hercules got spider man power he could see bullets in slow motion and so could cap

“Venom, on the other hand, is around as fast as Spiderman who can still be tagged and mached by Wolverine, Captian America and chracters like that despite being faster than them by a small amount”

• why is cap a bad thing? He can see bullets in slow motion and move after they are fired, and wolverine can slice bullets after being fired. So this is not a anti feat.

post scans.

“Ashoka blitzes and stomps 4 of them here

those are Mandalorians, best of the best

That is one example and yeah i cannot remember Obi-Wan really being hurt by them much”

• those are fodder bounty hunters lets be honest. Cad bane was able to beat her.
  and more importantly top bounty hunters like jango could face off against Kenobi for some time. Ahsoki fighting the “best of the best” at such a young age seems like garbage writing. there was a mando capable of fighting against maul for some time Also btw.

nope 1. post scans of bounty hunters being above peak human, 2. Nope it’s consistent for bounty hunters to at least stand their ground And hurt Jedi. also gg feats are not consistent you still have yet to post the scan and he only had one feat on that lvl. You asking for consistency for my character but where is it for grevious?

“1. If they are aliens and have shown good feats we can asume that they are superhumans”

• nope I want actual prove of this. Them being a alien does not mean anything. I still need feats.

“2. It really is not, without PIS Jedi stomp them with ease and even if they did hurt them like i siad that would be a feat for them you are arguing that Batman is building level yet you do not wnat to accept that this is a feat for them. Really?”

• nope I would like actual feats of them being this strong not scaling. Also Batman actually has building lvl feats. when I say he can be building lvl I’m not scaling off other characters to do so. Also that’s mainly in durability.
• anyway as I said before physically I never seen a jedi, bounty hunter or clone do anything physically impressive. If you can post at least 2 scans of them lifting or punching with the force of 3-5 tons I will concede otherwise i won’t.

nope

“He has feats to tank more than few hits from Venom and he will one-shot him”

• nope he gets one or three shot. Building lvl >>>> anything grevious did.
• hell honestly venom Does not even have to be building lvl to beat grevious in a few blows. He scales above Spider-Man who has consistent 30 to 50 tons feats.
• i have yet to see anything suggesting he could survive 15 tons of force let alone 25.

grvious best feat is what not even building lvl? Spider-Man has consistent building lvl strength and venom three or four shots him

“Spiderman is not building level by feats, “

• by feats he is

“he really does not have consistent feats on that level, “

• what you said before contradicts this anyway iron Man and namor have less feats for their lvl of strength.

“whatever you want to accept the fact or ignore it is up to you”

• lol fact no it’s your opinion so state it like it is.

yes it does. I can ask you to prove me wrong but again you never do.

“I can lift heavy rock but can i destroy it? No, there, done“

• one you can’t lift a heavy rock and 2 you do realize that at best your striking and lifting would be 2-5 tons apart realistically?

lol spider man is and Batman has consisted building lvl feats. You still have not proven me wrong on spider man so what your doing is just running away at that point.

“I do not have to, fact that he has no consistent feats on that level proves you wrong without me and i really cannot say how much Batman being building level is laughable, same is with Spiderman“

• Yeah no same can be said for other heroes, building lvl is not a stretch considering he actually has building lvl feats and Batman also has feats but again a topic for another day so idk you keep bring it up. and you have no consistent feats for grevious so idk why you’re bringing up consistency in the first place

lol sure we can talk about how you barely posted any evidence I asked for in these last hours?

“Well, you did not post anything as well, “

• you didn’t ask.

“your arguments were "nope, no" and i assumed that you know GG feats from his RT even without me posting it”

• my arguments were not nope you didn’t post a argument so I have no reason to go in dept. also I I'm not going to look up a thread of the person I’m debating. it’s your job to post evidence and make sure it’s canon

@dmnb2wavy:

“I really did not want to insult you but I do not want to argue abotu that point it is useless, you are free to think what you want“

• fine whatever

• Okay I’ll give you that however your wrong about gg not having many fights in clone wars. He had at least 5 if I’m not mistaken

“And Peter had like thousands, fact that he has much fewer fights than Peter justifies him needing much fewer feats for something to be consistent”

• you only posted one feat that’s it nothing consistent about that

Nice low Showings I can post a lot of feats going above so it’s means nothing honestly.

• these anti feats are not consistent for even his 25 ton lvl statement unlike grevious who only has one feat in 10 years of his career.

“I know but i know he is above those feats consistently but he is consistently not building level just like how he consistently is not bellow wall level as well“

• He is tho

“Now i want to address something, how strong is Peters lifting strength? i think that he is around 30 tons but you think that he is around 50 tons, you yourself said that

"Honestly I argue he is 40-50 tons consistently"

So he is around that level consistently( according to you) and you also said that lifting and striking is very similar and can difference can only be in few tons, so how then can you argue he is constantly building level, you need far more than 50 tons to destroy building( even samll building), you need tousends of tons of force, even MMA fighters can kick with 1 ton of force, so how then can he be that strong? He cannot, so you need to eaither need to admit that lifting and striking are complelty difirnet or you need to admit that he is not building level, it is that simple“

• okay first prove you need more than 50 tons to destroy a building with a source.
• second you realize we use wrecking balls that only weighs 6 tons to destroy buildings?
• and third look a explosion calc you don’t néed 50 tons worth of force to destroy a small building if so prove me wrong with a actual source not speculation

“GG has few feats on that level and that is enaugh for how litle fights he had, Peter had hundreds of times more fights, we cannot judge them by same standards”

• you only have one feat that’s it

nope he has one mountain striking feat, if he has more post them

“He has destroyed Mountain with shockwave, “

• with help from the thing and two other characters ( very important)

“spilled man-made island in half,“

• Which is far less than mountain busting so irrelevant

“and has consistently fought and one-shot people who no solled nukes and Mountain level attacks“

• Who has he one shot with mountain or nuke lvl durability? Post it

and spider man has been able to hurt Luke cage( who has building lvl feats) tombstone( with a building lvl feat) and venom who also has a building lvl feat.

“Cage has way more feats on bellow peak human level then he has on a building level and before you scream that some of those feats are old that is fine unless he got stronger they are usable, and he is said to only get a few times stronger so they are all useable”

• post it you keep stating it but have yet to post anti feats

• like what? Post them all. And honestly the fact that both of your anti feats fall below 25 tons shows they aren’t consistent. Btw iron man has many anti feats, so does hulk, dr doom, thanos, and Thor but as I will say does that mean they are less powerful than the lvl they are supposed to be at?

“I alredy showed 4 if i posted all of his Anti feats i would not finish ever“

• go ahead it would honestly be irrelevant anyway

“, how about fact that Captian America hurt him iwth his hits consistently “

• okay and? Spider-Man has hurt iron man consistently

“and Peter even once comapred his punch to Atomic Bomb so it really hurts him, “

• and Spider-Man compared morlun hits to hulks and Thor’s so we should not take what he says seriously

“is Cap now building level since Peter can tank hits from people as strong as he is consistently?“

• Is spider man now mountain lvl bc he fights with mid tiers consistently? Yeah that’s the lvl of question you are asking anyway you realize cap has consistently hurt namor?

“The thing those characters are meant to be on level they are, Peter was never meant to be building level“

• Lol iron man is not meant to be mountain lvl. his own marvel power grid states he can only lift 100 tons
• honestly you talk about how that spider man is not consistent in the building lvl but iron man is not consistent either
• I can post many anti feats of him struggling with something below mountain lvl

• it is as I said he has three feats four feats that are building lvl

“He does not have even once, lifting parts of the building does not justify striking feat and i addressed that feat as well”

• but iron man splitting a idsland does? him destroying a top of a mountain with shock waves with help does? But him one shoting characters through scaling does?

• no super man is large building lvl which is having The strength to lvl skyscrapers. which is a big difference imo. I’m Not saying peter is large building lvl I’ve should’ve stated he is small building lvl. Small building lvl is not that much for peter.

• also dceu super man just being building lvl is arguably wrong he is definitely above that lvl with his tech tonic plate statement .

• lol seriously? you consider Luke street lvl and yet he could break buildings with the shock wave of his punches.
• not only that Spider-Man is building lvl

”Well you should have specified that but still, he is not on any building level”

• he is prove with a source he isn’t

“Superman tectonic feat has been debunked milions of times alredy“”

• no it hasn’t. people disagree bc it’s a statement and we have no on screen evidence

“And can you show me that feat? And like i siad Luke has way more feats to prove he is street leveler then that he is some multi-building level character you are saying he is( since you said he destroyed it with shockwave )”

here

Gallery

“You have said that milions of tiems alredy but problem is that he is not“

• You also said no millions of times but I guessed itching changed

And that’s supposed to be impressive? even daredevil can can do something like that.

“Well DD is superhuman by MCU and RL standards and that feat is in 5-ton range“

• Obviously dd would be super human by real life standards but that’s honestly pretty much all peak humans in comics.
• prove it with a calc that it’s in the 5 ton range

• ummm what? First what are you talkIng about.

• 2. Jedi still get tagged by blasters so they can’t statue them

• edit: never mind I’ve seen it. he didn’t statue blasters lol there is nothing suggesting that

“1. You have seen the feat

“2. They cannot statue it forever, eventualy they will start moving and can tag them,”

• this makes absolutely no sense. If you can statue something you will never get tagged by it.

”besides Obi-Wan has deflected blasters from an army of 10000 droids at once so yeah,”

• post a link and isn’t this from the eu?

“Also Jedi can get cuaght of guard or are not using their full speed,”

• seriously? Doest the force allows them to know who is shooting him or not anyway?

... “Just like Superman got tagged many times by slow things and other speedsters as well”

• many problems with that first when they get tagged we call it jobbing and pie bc there is no way they should get tagged by something that slow.
• but in Star wars it’s established that Jedi gets tagged by blasters in a consistent bases so no it’s not a good comparison

“3. Nothing sugests that, how about fact that he shots them so fat they all look like they are fired at the same time and they all hit Emperor the same time, so yes he did, honestly you need to be fair when you judge feats, there is alredy to much lowballing on bettle forums”

• your reaching with the statueing thing honestly. I want a clear example of statue ing not speculation
• No one would agree that this is statueing and I’m not lowballing your just reaching

• here is spider man statueing bullets( btw the people shooting the bullets are far apart from each other)

• would be nice to see a scan proving this

• and those peak humans are just as fast as cap as you say those are feats for them.

• and prove gg is faster

“1. You did”

• like wgat?

“2. Those peak humans are faster than Cap by feats”

• baded on what? Can they see bullets in slow motion?

”3. Well he can fight Jedi that have super speed in-universe, so they are faster than peak humans“

• there “super speed” has never been replicated so their super speed is just inconsistent.

• so your only evidence is visuals? Got it so with no clear evidence I dismiss your claim.i actually want a statement not shady visuals. The explosion they send would just mean the blast are more powerful not that they can’t cut like blasters.

“I am sure there is some guidebook that describes blasters but i do not have scan right now but visuals are good enaguh evidence when nothing contradicts it, you are acting like they do not matter“

• I want actual prove not speculation.
• for all we know they can be exactly the same thing but at blasters are just more powerful

“Fact is blasters are plasma, they burn and cut things while those blasts punch just explode, so yeah“

• Okay from the cartoon That I’m not sure is canon or not here is boba blaster disintegrating someone
• https://gfycat.com/unconsciousparallelharrierhawk

• 1. this is a cartoon short that I’m not sure is even canon or not. I want something from the actual canon

• 2. Theses are two different models of walkers so I’m assuming they have different lvls of power

“1. A cartoon is a canon, they are made by Disney so yea”

• okay? lol your gonna have to do better than that honestly . give me something stating it’s canon

“2. I am just showing how strong walkers can be but i will find some feats for this model as well“

• Cool

he wanted to escape the situation. The Jedi themselves said make sure he does not escape

albeit he still could not go anywhere which is my point.

• yeah no he wanted to escape that was the whole point of pinning him down. At this point your just arguing with the context of the story

• it’s still a anti feat He got pinned by clones the same ones who he can over power

“He did want to escape but not while clones were pulling him, Jedi just said to them to make sure in case he tried, but he did not while he fought Jedi, they tried to pull him but failed miserably when he tried to escape he easily pulled them”

• honestly at this point idc you can have this point

• prove this. give me a comparison to something if the same size and quantify it

I need evidence that’s it’s above 5 tons and

This feat does not even seem that impressive honestly

“Cubic meter of steel is around 8 tons this is around the same size so yeah it weighs 8 tons”

• fine

“The door alone weighs 8 tons but fact that he sent if 10 meters make it far above that, that is like sending normal human flying for 1 kilometer, that is a feat in hundreds of tons range to tousends of tons range, i have seen people that know physics very well put Zod sending Superman flying 250 meters on the level and this feat is above that since Clark only weights 100 kg“

• Prove it with a calc otherwise your just speculating

• so he has what at best 5 ton above striking strength until you prove otherwise? you do realize that 30 tons is still massively above that right?

“His striking is far above 5 tons”

• not far above but definitely above 5 tons

• it isn’t like I said your striking isn’t that much different then your lifting. At best it’s like a something amount of pounds to 1 ton difference that’s it. You still haven’t proved me wrong on this. anyway let me ask this do you think spider man can lift 5 more tons than he can strike?

“1. I addressed that, you debunked yourself, so either concede that you are wrong here or admit that Peter does not have building-level striking“

• How? I never debunked myself if so state how I did
• im not wrong prove you need thousand of tons worth of force to destroy a small building

“2. I think that his lifting and striking are similar levels by feats but that is not always true for evrey character“

• My point exactly

• he rarely does this the flash does it more consistently

• bc we have no evidence

• the speed does help

“1. We do not know that“

• We do know this.

“2. But it is possible“

• sure why not

• I say it’s inconsistent cuz it is and lol dbz is heavily inconsistent again I know this bcuz I’m a dragon ball fan.

• we have the omi king not being able to keep up with dyspo, we have piccolo struggling to bust a moon even tho Roshi did it years back, we have goku failing to lift 40 tons on each limb, goku being impressEd by a planet lvl attack( even tho he is planet lvl) goku being hurt by bullets, krillon being hurt by bullets

• i can go on ( honestly all day ) but that’s not what we are discussing

• I’ll agree comics are more inconsistent but dB is not that far off honestly. Oh and I meant dbs

“None of that is DBZ, that is DBS and i was talking about DBZ not mess that is DBS“

• Yes it is do you watch dbz?
  you can look up piccolo destroying the moon and him huffing and puffing even tho Rossi did it years back with ease

• ummm yeah no you do realize if this was the case Buu saga goku would not be able to catch a punch From Nam-Ek Frieza? It’s pretty obvious that lifting and striking goes hand and hand Otherwise goku could not grab a punch from Frieza

• just basic physics

“That is the far point but he has no great quantifiable feats, like moving a moon or planet”

• well There is no reason for them move a moon or planet .

• and then you ended it in saying “even“. like basic logic applies to reality and fiction which it doesn’t bc at that point its just Realistic logic.

“The basic logic is not same as realistic logic, the basic logic is that Peter cannot have punch strong enaugh to instatly kill himself since he has tanked hits from people as strong as he is constantly, that is basic logic, not realistic logic”

• That isn’t basic logic actually without a example go ahead and explain what basic logic means

ummmm seriously? If you actually think you can cut bullet proof glass then you should buy it and try it yourself. It’s bullet proof glass for a reason your not strong enough to break it.

“Maybe i do not have a sword sharp enough?”

• then post a link of someone doing it then I will concede that venom losses

• nope Logan claws have feats to suggest he can cut hulk

• and really? I said basically which matters a lot. Your trying to make me sound a lot less intelligent than I actually am with that move.

“The reason they have those feats is that they are sharp, just like Hulk has planetary feats because he is strong”

• 😂yeah okay post something or anything suggesting someone can cut through bullet proof glass with a sword and I will just concede and say venom losses

“Here is a video where Kyloe hill says that he says ( on 1 minute and 18 seconds) you eaither need great force or blades sharp enaugh and he explains it that if you had blade sharp and durable enaugh you could easily cut anything, not just bulleptroof glass

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-lO2s-5aBM&t=267s

So will you concede now?“

• Nice try but These are using wolverine claws not actual realistic swords or blades.
• funny i was actually Close to conceding

• Why? You haven’t post any scans so post evidence as to how.

“We have both agreed how fast are blasters and GG can blitz blaster times and mach Obi-Wan who easily moved as fast as exsplosion“

• honestly your evidence as to why its faster than bullets now looking back doest make much sense to me. Mind explaining why it’s faster than bullets?
• who did he blizt that was a blaster timer?
• post a link

no. Bc your not willing to calculate the feat I will

• ——————time skip now after some time of testing i have found To send something 10 meters that weighs 8 tons requires only get this 8.9 tons of force. Which is laughably below spider man so no he is no where close to venom in strength so no grevious gets one shot If he gets damaged by just 8.9 tons of force

“Hahhaha, you do realize what you did? You did not calculate how much force you need to send 8 tons flying 10+ meters, no, you calculated with how much force would object that has 8 tons and moves 10 meters per second hit you at that speed, 2 completly difirent things”

• ohhh alright then calculate the feat your self Honestly you keep speculating how strong it is give me a calc with some real eviidence
• otherwise every time you bring it up I will just dismiss it

• nope I need feats for the aliens to prove they are super human. Either way it does not matter grevious best strength feat is only 8.9 tons

“How do we know that Spenwolf form DCEU Is superhuman? He has feats on that level and he is alien, “

• you mean besides him slamming his weapon and causing a massive shock wave ? Or him getting punch through walls by super man?

“same is here if they have good feats and they are not humans that is enaugh”

• except none of the showed feats in the 8.9 range

“And no his best feat is far above that you used the wrong formula, you calculated something very difirent”

• funny I know so calc it yourself. if your opponent has to calc a feat to quantifiable that’s bad

• nope 4 feats is enough and also so now your saying namor is not mountain lvl? My logic is not bad you can find a lot of characters barely have feats on the lvl they are supposed to be at.

“1. He does not have even one“

• Um yes he does

“2. I never siad that about Namor“

• No you implied as you said that applies to namor as well

“I alredy did”

“i can easily lift 5, 10 kg rock but i cannot destroy it”

• Wow irrelevant.

• tombstone barely got hurt by the rpg and only said ouch. The building explosion left actual bruises on him. tombstone getting hit by a rpg is the same as Me saying ouch to a pinch Or saying ouch when I stub my toe

• tombstone was right at the center of the explosion

“1. Fact that he still got hurt and had trouble standing up debunks him having building level durabiltiy,”

• he didn’t have trouble getting up your assuming that
• you Do realize characters get hurt below their lvl like all the time?

“building busting if tousends of times above RPG, so him being hurt disproves him tanking exsplosion”

• Did I state building busting?
• you really do like to jump lvls lol

“when you stub your toe that is pricing not blunt force attack so that does not matter”

• it does actually. The fact is he was barely affected by it and showed zero bruises while for the building lvl attack he had bruises

“and pinch strong enaugh to make you say ouch is not tousends of times weaker than punch, so that proves you wrong as well“

• lol Okay need I post scans of hulk getting hurt by bullets then?

“2. No, he was not, he was very far from it like you would say, prove me wrong”

• are you blind? He caused the explosion himself

• iron man has at least 10-20 feats of him exceeding just 100 tons. This is why I honestly don’t care about marvel power grids when they directly contradict what they write

“Thing is Iron man has consistent feats that debunk that, Cage does not“

• yes cage does.
• cage has feats of him destroying building with the shock waves of his punches causing seismic activity, shattering a golem the size of a small building? Clashing with the thing causing a building to be destroyed in the back round
• ext.

“And you are right he is highest street leveler but still street leveler, destroying building with shockwave is mid tier stuff”

• then I guess he is mid tier

• honestly from what I’ve seen of past Luke he can also be argued as a low mid tier considering he has damaged iron man suit, fought with the thing and fought dr doom.

“Go one noones thread and you will find far more feats of Luke Cage being hurt by Deardevil level things then he does have feats of fighting high tiers and he also debunks that that thing, Doom and Iron Man feats“

• No post them

• okay what I meant by street lvl was like cap, daredevil or wolverine lvl strength not mid to high tiers like spider man.

• also when has characters weaker than daredevil have consistently injure Luke?

“1. Peter is not high tier, or even close to it, nor mid tier, he is still street leveler“

• cThat’s literally exactly what I said you need to slow down and just read

“2. I do not want to post milions of feats just read Noone's part when he talks about playing with big boys“

• Nope do it
• what? I never said weak street characters can harm strong ones

1.

“1. I did with a scan of them moving far faster than Qui Gon and you agreed with me that they are faster than bullets, so yeah i would say they are around mach 3,4 at least”

• I know but moving faster than bullets is not that impressive to spider man who did the same thing when a bullet so basically at his back. I’m sure I can calculate that to Mach 3 or 4 honestly

“Yeah we agree that blasters are as fast as Peter but GG can blitz people that fast, that is my point”

• prove blasters are as fast as peter.
• peter has moved away from a bullet when it was 2 inches away from him
• thats actually above at least Mach 4 actually

• Idk what your stating here. there is no scan so...... is this a novel feat?

“Yeah that is feat form novel“

• is it canon?

• the same for this

“I already posted it that is a feat from the novel“

• Could not seen it but is it canon?

• lol are you actually being serious? This is not statue ing gravity is the movie trope of the samurai. I want real feats of statue ing something

“That is not what i meant, they all fell the same time, gravity took several seconds to catch up, they did not instantly fall like they usually do, that is my point, she stauted gravity there you can find that on her RT as well“

• Lol idc this is something that happened bc of the samurai trope of gravity falling to catch up. Btw here is wolverine statueing gravity

• seriously? Your evidence is from a cartoon that I’m not sure is canon or not

• and what your describing is not even happening

“1. It is”

give me a official statement

“2. It is, he jumps and he and Vader are moving while Gravity is statued, Luke does not start to fall instnatly like you do when you jump, he is just standing in the air until vader pushes him and Luke cannot fly or levitate, that is his speed, the feat is pretty clear”

• seriously? Mind telling why this is impressive anyway
  
  
  wolverine can also statue gravity

Gallery

• if so venom one shots

“No, he gets blitzed“

nope spider man can move as fast as any Jedi until proven otherwise

• except he has moved faster than bullets many times so no. Plus as he stated bc he can see bullets in slow motion he can actually dodge them proving my point

“Dodging something does not make you faster than that“

it does when it like 2-3 inches behind you

“When did he move faster than them?”

Gallery

sure

“That is not bullet timing, that is aim blocking”

no no it’s not. you can clearly see that he shot the bullets And wolverine Ran after they were fired that’s bullet timing

also wft is aim blocking?

• no he didn’t they fought for at least 1 to 2 minutes.https://youtu.be/sISGRCgJDhA

”Cad Bane was using his jetpack to fly and shoot them with blasters( which they esily deflected) he never fighted Obi-Wan there, “

that’s exactly the same as fighting tho

“he only fought Obi-Wan for few secodns where Obi-Wan stomped him in one move( saber fight), “

he didn’t stomp him in one move there were three clashes before he got disabled

“and then Obi-Wan turned his attention and looked in other direction “

obi can see from the corners of his eyes he didn’t turn his head completely to the side.

“and Cad Bane use that to catch him off guard and grab him and electrocute him, but in fight, he got stomped in one move””

• it was not one move and either way thats your definition of a fight my includes the blasters

• what feats? Your best feat is him sending someone 5 meters.

“Which is a superhuman feat“

in real life in fiction not so much

Lol many things wrong here first spider man actually has a small building feat supporting him hurting a character who tanked a building lvl explosion

“He really does not and i alredy addressed that”

he does actually

two I never said batman is building lvl in ap and skyscraper lvl? Lol wft and why are you jumping lvls? anyway durability wise he has actual feats of tanking building explosions not scaling like I said before so that’s not even a good comparison

“Yes you did

And no he does not,”

😂😂😂😂😂bro please and honestly please tell me where the fuck do you see me saying batman has building lvl ap?
bc no where in that post do I say he has building lvl ap

“if that was true, people like Deathstroke would not harm him or are they also building level?”

possibly

none of the bounty hunters or jedi have feats that show how strong they are.

its like scaling spider man to iron man bc he hurt him a couple times.

Thing is that was PIS this is consistent

spoder man hurting iron man is also consistent so what is your point?

nope now that I actually calculated your feat he does indeed get one shot

“Your calc is completly wrong, you used the wrong formula, you calculated wrong thing so no he does not get one shot”

then calc it yourself

grievous is not faster and venom is not getting one shot by sabers. two or four stabs won’t stop him

“He is by feats and yes he is, feats of him surviving some cuting his head off?”

nope not by feats, no he isn’t, and no Need of proof when he won’t land that.

honestly at this point is doesn’t matter the fact is grevious best feat is only 8.9 worth of force. You stated yourself he can hurt himself with his attacks meaning he gets one shot by someone who is stronger than 25 tons worth of force

“Thing is your calc is wrong“

you keep saying it’s wrong but where is your calc?

Wow you should of calc it before saying that bc your massively wrong

“Sweet irony“

Lol funny isn’t it

ummn When? correct me if I’m wrong but the best is 0.85 tons of force

“That is best punching feat yes for MMA fighters but they can kick nearly 2 times more then they punch”

great

nope but his feat is only 8.9 worth of force

“Debunked“

where is your calc

the explosion that destroyed the ship is most likely around 2.5 tons worth of force possibly 3-5. honestly not that impressed

“Yeah explosions that destroys entire ship is only 2 times stronger than a punch from MMA fighter' hahaha makes snese”

lol then prove otherwise seriously you do a lot of speculating on your part.

if you want to know how I got this number here

“I am not going to read the entire book trying to find something obviously wrong”

Sure then post something proving otherwise

have you tho?

“Yes“

no

lol no you can’t lift 5-10 tons

“hahaha, did i say 5,10 tons? hahaha i meant 5,10 kg, i made mistake in writing”

ard

what is this? Fantasy land?

“I meant kg instead of tons but my point still stands“

no it really doesn’t

yes by common sense. Or do you actually think that we humans are capable of lifting 5 tons? Oh wait.....

“No that was a mistake in writing but no you need to prove that, common snese means nothing and is not an argument when there are many things debunking that both in fiction and reality”

lol did you not just try to prove that the ship exploding is common sense? Bc you actually have yet to have proof of your claims

No you didn’t or else I would of answered

“When you say nope you need to provide feats as to why which i did in the beginning“

no you didn’t you only provided feats when I asked

sure fine I can post scans of Spider-Man moving way faster than bullets that’s why he won’t get blitzed

“No, you cannot show him consistently moving way faster, only faster than them“

Actually I can and already did

lol you didn’t prove no one wrong the fact daredevil strikes can hurt Spider-Man and basically trade blows with him actually makes zero sense

“Thing is he cannot, not without PIS, he cannot trade blows with bloodlusted Spiderman and should not be capable of hurting him much, but litle? Why not”

fine

I definitely said this but the fact is daredevil can still harm Spider-Man which by the fact spider man can lift 25 tons makes zero sense.

“He should not be capable of really putting him down but he should be capable of hurting him litle“

Fine

if you want a reason why cap was trading blows with Pete that was in a iron spider suit

if you want another example we have spider man trading blows rhino who is stronger

“Iron Spider only makes him more durable

Cap has also hurt Rhino and evne knocked him out“

That is heavily pi’s and what prove does it only make him more durable?

honestly tho you can have grevious durability being this high he still gets one shotted.

“Not really he has no feats to one-shot him“

calc it seriously I hate this speculation

nope Quote it

“I alredy did“

😂😂😂that quote means nothing

strength wise outclassed and speed wise the same.

“No, strength is comperable but he stomps in speed“

Sure prove it