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#51 Posted by deactivated-5a90ca82ccb5f (6669 posts) - - Show Bio
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#52 Posted by WollfMyth209 (16518 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold: Mxy toying with multiverse was in non-cannon Supergirl comic.

Proof it's non-canon?

As for Emperor Joker, he only showed universal power/feats, so i'll go with that, and unless there is proof/feats that back up that Emperor Joker statement that he can do multiversal things(which there aren't).

Yet he was destroying everything that was, is and will be with his antics... That's the multiverse.

He hasn't above universal feats, so speculating is pointless.

He does.

And Unbound Spectre, one of the most powerful versions of him who busted universe, was struggling very hard against universal beings like Nabu, who wasn't even trying to fight back that much and defeat Spectre,

Dear lord the misinformation. Nabu is beyond just universal, and he noted something was draining Spectre of his power, an all-out Spectre practically one-shotted Nabu and the Spectre defeated beings that would slap Nabu silly(like Princess Amethyst). He's not "struggling very hard" against universal beings, and he's casually stomping beings on that level, if anything.

and Wizard Shazam, who was actually at his weakest and by his own words "could barely stand/walk", yet gave Unbound Spectre a heck of fight, and was actually gonna win, if not the that little tricky draining thing.

Except Spectre was stomping him, despite Shazam having prep and being in his nexus of power. Spectre got tagged once or twice and nothing more, and healed relatively quickly.

Unless they feats above that universal category, then they would be, but they didn't, they just are above and have defeated universal beings, which puts them in the same category but above them.

They do. They're far ahead of beings that are far ahead of universe-busters, hence they're at least multi-universal. But in Michael and Lucifer's case, they actually have multiversal feats.

Also by logic of statement, it is like saying Molecule Man defeated Beyonder, who is multiversal, so now Molecule Man is megaversal(though he isn't).

He defeated a nerfed Beyonder, so he isn't, no. Pre-Retcon Beyonder was murking Molecule Man.

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#53 Posted by FirstHunter (3460 posts) - - Show Bio
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#54 Posted by ginman333 (3036 posts) - - Show Bio

Was leaning towards team 2, but noticed this is life bringer galactus with the nullifier. That gives team 1 two LT or greater level players. Exitar feels like a bit of a weak link here - wasnt he defeated by the avengers/sentry???? Im almost feeling like Galactus and Scathan should team up to defeat one of them while the other two are fodder and lose. When galactus and scathan are finished with one brother they turn their attention to the other brother for the win.

Team 1 with high difficulty.

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#55 Posted by WollfMyth209 (16518 posts) - - Show Bio

@firsthunter: :mmm:

I mean, even it being non-canon, scaling from Emperor Joker and Mxy literally merging multiple realities in Batman/Superman in order to play a game of chess with the Joker puts him above just "universal".

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#56 Posted by FirstHunter (3460 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

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#57 Edited by Grayhold (122 posts) - - Show Bio

@wollfmyth209:

Proof it's non-canon?

Supergirl: Cosmic Adventures in the Eighth Grade

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mister_Mxyzptlk

Yet he was destroying everything that was, is and will be with his antics... That's the multiverse.

Nope, he was not destroying multiverse, just universe. Also everything can mean universe as well. And given the context of the story and power level Mxy it can be definitely said that it was about universe.

He does.

Then post them.

Dear lord the misinformation. Nabu is beyond just universal,

Sadly, there is no proof to back that up, unless you can magically pop them into existence.

and he noted something was draining Spectre of his power,

Context please, what Nabu actually said is that Spectre during DoV should have drained the magic of the universe, but it was not inside Spectre, in fact he said that it was inside Eclipso, and that Eclipso fooled him, so it was just average regular power level Unbound Spectre.

an all-out Spectre practically one-shotted Nabu

Context, again. Nabu was not trying fight back that much and defeat Spectre, in fact Nabu actually wanted Spectre to kill him, so that 8th age of magic would end, and 9th would start.

and the Spectre defeated beings that would slap Nabu silly(like Princess Amethyst). He's not "struggling very hard" against universal beings, and he's casually stomping beings on that level, if anything.

Comics show otherwise, he struggled against suicidal Nabu.

Except Spectre was stomping him, despite Shazam having prep and being in his nexus of power. Spectre got tagged once or twice and nothing more, and healed relatively quickly.

Read Day of Vengeance JSA-tie-in, Shazam wasted the amp, and even more so, in fact Shazam wasted so much power that by his own word he could barely stand, and that he has failed the world. And even in that very weakened state Spectre was dominating only first part of the battle, in the middle till the end the dominance went to Shazam, then Spectre used neat trick like draining small amount of magic that Shazam had inside of him. Just to add a few things, it took Spectre more time draining Captain Marvel of his magic energies, than against Shazam(which shows how little power Shazam had at that time).

They do. They're far ahead of beings that are far ahead of universe-busters, hence they're at least multi-universal. But in Michael and Lucifer's case, they actually have multiversal feats.

Just because you are far ahead of universal beings doesn't you mean you are multiversal, unless you have feats on that scale. As for archangels they don't have multiversal feats, the best feat is Lucifer using Michael's power to create cosmoc, which was stated by writer that it is universe + many dimensions, and stated countless times to be universe.

He defeated a nerfed Beyonder, so he isn't, no. Pre-Retcon Beyonder was murking Molecule Man.

Nerfed/Retconed/Cosmic Cube Beyonder showed multiversal feats. My argument still stands.

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#58 Edited by Grayhold (122 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

Both would solo Odin quite handily.

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#59 Edited by deactivated-5a853424245e3 (4168 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold:

He said that for him, multiverse is a universe with many/infinite dimensions, which is just basic universe. So in short in his view Multiverse = A universe + Many/Infinite Dimensions.

He said a universe and multiverse describe different aspects of the same thing. Their difference is only in structure between Marvel and DC, which is frankly, irrelevant.

The God is the being that is omnipotent, Neither Ellaine nor Presence are that

Except that's exactly what they are. Everyone refers to Yahweh as God, with a capital G, and furthermore, they're both referred to as omnipotent. This couldn't be anymore obvious from the narration, as well as what the content itself is based on.

they are just a gods

They're not treated or written that way and you'll be hard pressed to find any evidence to support that claim.

and if we go deeper, the fact is Presence didn't even create DC, it was created by higher being(which have affected him).

There isn't a single scan that will support this, because it's counterfactual. Yahweh, as he stated in Lucifer #75, was shaped by external forces. Mike Carey clarified these forces were the same mentioned in Sandman #8 (i.e., the dreams of the people brought him into existence).

They are just nigh-omniscient/omnipotent/omnipresent, just like regular gods like Thoth.

There's no evidence to suggest this.

Lucifer and Michael didn't create multiverse, in fact it was created by Overvoid, just read Multiversity, or Crisis on Infinite Earths, or History of DC Universe, or any other book recaping the story of the universe, the details are in there

I have read them, and they don't support what you're saying, especially when we have retellings of how it happened in Lucifer.

in fact DC was not even a multiverse, the Overvoid originally created a universe, then it became multiverse because of Krona or Monitor(depending on continuity).

Debate semantics all you want, they're the same thing in the Lucifer narrative, which is still currently going/relevant.

Multiversity/Crisis on Infinite Earth/History of DC Universe/and so on as well as Grant Morrison dissagree with you.

I find it amusing you completely ignore the Sandman/Lucifer canon in favor of Grant Morrison, a man who uses said canon in his own work. But please, by all means, show me your scans so I can debunk your points further.

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#60 Edited by Grayhold (122 posts) - - Show Bio

@cruelestashley:

He said a universe and multiverse describe different aspects of the same thing. Their difference is only in structure between Marvel and DC, which is frankly, irrelevant.

What he really said that for in his view concept that we call multiverse is that for him, Multiverse is a Universe that has many dimensions in it, that's what he said, nothing less, nothing more.

Except that's exactly what they are. Everyone refers to Yahweh as God, with a capital G, and furthermore, they're both referred to as omnipotent. This couldn't be anymore obvious from the narration, as well as what the content itself is based on.

Just someone refers otherone as THE GOD, doesn't mean he has powers of omnipotence. Beyonder was refered as THE GOD, so was Galactus and Living Tribunal.

And current Lucifer's series by default makes argument invalid.

They're not treated or written that way and you'll be hard pressed to find any evidence to support that claim.

Actually they are in current Lucifer's run.

There isn't a single scan that will support this, because it's counterfactual. Yahweh, as he stated in Lucifer #75, was shaped by external forces. Mike Carey clarified these forces were the same mentioned in Sandman #8 (i.e., the dreams of the people brought him into existence).

Can't argue against this one.

There's no evidence to suggest this.

Current Lucifer's run acutally is pretty solid evidence, just read it.

I have read them, and they don't support what you're saying, especially when we have retellings of how it happened in Lucifer.

Even if we assume that Michael and Lucifer created DC, then well they created just the universe, the rest that Krona or Monitor because of their actions made a universe into multiverse would still be canon, which still would put Lucifer and Michael into Universal level category.

Debate semantics all you want, they're the same thing in the Lucifer narrative, which is still currently going/relevant.

Mke Carey already gave details about that, he already said that Multiverse is a Universe with many dimensions in it, not that Multiverse is a place with many universes(our view of concept of the multiverse).

I find it amusing you completely ignore the Sandman/Lucifer canon in favor of Grant Morrison, a man who uses said canon in his own work. But please, by all means, show me your scans so I can debunk your points further.

Multiversity is the current cannon, deal with it.

As for scans read Multiversity or Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Also Lucifer was the previous cannon, it's all just retcons, even current Lucifer's run is before the New-52/Current Cannon happening, because of too many retcons of universal concepts and differences.

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#61 Posted by FirstHunter (3460 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

Both would solo Odin quite handily.

How so? I'd like to see how someone who thinks their strength is as low as you do can make that case.

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#62 Edited by Grayhold (122 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

Both would solo Odin quite handily.

How so? I'd like to see how someone who thinks their strength is as low as you do can make that case.

Odin has galaxy busting energy ouput(shown both by feats and stated by Tom Brevoort), but he doesn't have reality warping on that scale, while both Michael and Lucifer possess universe busting power and universal reality warping. And i don't think low of Michael/Lucifer, i just don't wank them or overhype them.

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#63 Edited by FirstHunter (3460 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:
@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

Both would solo Odin quite handily.

How so? I'd like to see how someone who thinks their strength is as low as you do can make that case.

Odin has galaxy busting energy ouput(shown both by feats and stated by Tom Brevoort), but he doesn't have reality warping on that scale

Odin has Multi-Galaxy busting feats while depowered and has warped reality on a Universal scale before though.

And that's not even factoring Composite version.

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#64 Posted by Grayhold (122 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:
@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

Both would solo Odin quite handily.

How so? I'd like to see how someone who thinks their strength is as low as you do can make that case.

Odin has galaxy busting energy ouput(shown both by feats and stated by Tom Brevoort), but he doesn't have reality warping on that scale, while both Michael and Lucifer possess universe busting power and universal reality warping. And i don't think low of Michael/Lucifer, i just don't wank them or overhype them.

Odin has Multi-Galaxy busting while feats by depowered and has warped reality on a Universal scale before though.

I haven't seen him doing above multi-galaxy things, and warping reality on universal scale? Odin? That's beyond his power. But if you could show scans it would be good.

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#65 Posted by WollfMyth209 (16518 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold: Supergirl: Cosmic Adventures in the Eighth Grade

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mister_Mxyzptlk

A wikipedia page isn't definitive proof.

Nope, he was not destroying multiverse, just universe. Also everything can mean universe as well. And given the context of the story and power level Mxy it can be definitely said that it was about universe.

Except the Spectre specifically notes:

No Caption Provided

"Not just your universe, but everything that is, was or will be" is beyond just the universe, it's the multiverse.

Sadly, there is no proof to back that up, unless you can magically pop them into existence.

Nabu holds a universe in both Fate's amulet and helmet, that's already two universes within a being significantly less powerful than him.

Context please, what Nabu actually said is that Spectre during DoV should have drained the magic of the universe, but it was not inside Spectre, in fact he said that it was inside Eclipso, and that Eclipso fooled him, so it was just average regular power level Unbound Spectre.

Except Eclipso was further draining him, hence the Spectre was "diseased and maddened" and "days of struggle" against magic weakened him(I'll get to that later).

Context, again. Nabu was not trying fight back that much and defeat Spectre, in fact Nabu actually wanted Spectre to kill him, so that 8th age of magic would end, and 9th would start.

Nabu didn't want to die, he just knew he had no other choice but to die since he can't kill the Spectre given how far above him the spirit of Vengeance is. He did indeed resist the Spectre and still got one-shotted once Spectre went all-out.

Comics show otherwise, he struggled against suicidal Nabu.

They really don't. Amethyst is inferior to the Spectre, yet she's by all accounts far ahead of Nabu.

Read Day of Vengeance JSA-tie-in, Shazam wasted the amp, and even more so, in fact Shazam wasted so much power that by his own word he could barely stand, and that he has failed the world.

Wasted the amp? How? He didn't fight anyone. Also scans for him saying he can "barely stand"? In fact, Shazam notes he's "in his place of power" and that the Spectre is the one weakened from days of struggle:

No Caption Provided

Shazam seems to imply he's heavily amped and the Spectre is weakened, hence the advantage shifts considerably to him.

Keep in mind that after his fight with Shazam, he still kept on rampaging and losing even more power due to the struggle and Eclipso's interference. He would've been in an even worse state when he fought Nabu.

And even in that very weakened state Spectre was dominating only first part of the battle, in the middle till the end the dominance went to Shazam, then Spectre used neat trick like draining small amount of magic that Shazam had inside of him.

The middle part was Shazam just pelting Spectre with magically amplified objects that the Spectre casually healed from:

No Caption Provided

Just to add a few things, it took Spectre more time draining Captain Marvel of his magic energies, than against Shazam(which shows how little power Shazam had at that time).

That Captain Marvel was amplified by every single magic user from the planet(including Doctor Fate, Phantom Stranger, etc.) and the Spectre was toying with him until he got drained. When Spectre didn't toy with him, this happened:

No Caption Provided

I somehow doubt you've read these comics in-depthly, or maybe you just have selective memory.

Just because you are far ahead of universal beings doesn't you mean you are multiversal, unless you have feats on that scale. As for archangels they don't have multiversal feats, the best feat is Lucifer using Michael's power to create cosmoc, which was stated by writer that it is universe + many dimensions, and stated countless times to be universe.

The point of my post isn't that they're "multiversal", although yes they are, it's that beings far inferior to beings far inferior to them are universal, hence they're not just universal, they're multi-universal, at least.

Nerfed/Retconed/Cosmic Cube Beyonder showed multiversal feats. My argument still stands.

Hence Molecule Man is above multiversal, but below megaversal. Fairly easy to grasp.

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#66 Edited by FirstHunter (3460 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:
@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:
@grayhold said:
@firsthunter said:

@grayhold:

Somewhat off-topic

Who would you think would win between Composite Odin VS Lucifer/Micheal?

Both would solo Odin quite handily.

How so? I'd like to see how someone who thinks their strength is as low as you do can make that case.

Odin has galaxy busting energy ouput(shown both by feats and stated by Tom Brevoort), but he doesn't have reality warping on that scale, while both Michael and Lucifer possess universe busting power and universal reality warping. And i don't think low of Michael/Lucifer, i just don't wank them or overhype them.

Odin has Multi-Galaxy busting while feats by depowered and has warped reality on a Universal scale before though.

I haven't seen him doing above multi-galaxy things, and warping reality on universal scale? Odin? That's beyond his power. But if you could show scans it would be good.

Here.

If you want some more just ask.

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#67 Posted by deactivated-5a853424245e3 (4168 posts) - - Show Bio

@cruelestashley said:

@jardinain2 said:

@cruelestashley: Before we continue our text walls; Do you think Lucifer and Michael can be beaten in the first place?

As a team? Or individually?

Both.

Individually--let's talk about that first. I think the biggest key factor is prep, because with prep, Lucifer can take on nigh-omnipotent beings and win (see: the Titans). If he didn't have prep, while he put up a decent fight, he would've been killed. So this is nigh-omnipotent to the highest degree possible, because the Titans were usurping the throne of God and the process was nearly completed.

Next, if we look at Lucifer #25-6, we can see a very interesting altercation between him and Death. People like to assume that Lucifer scared Death away, but that wasn't the case at all. If we look at her first appearance in the narrative:

#25
#25

We can see she knows it's not time for him to die yet. The way this cliffhanger is set up implies that in the next issue he might die, right? Well, no. One of Death's functions is that she knows when everyone's going to die, no exceptions. This is all she was referring to, and it's made plainly clear in the next issue, which I'll get to in a moment.

#26
#26

This is the scan everyone uses to justify Lucifer > Death. The problem with this is, the statements are misinterpreted. Lucifer isn't saying Death has no claim on him in the sense that she can't hurt him, he's just saying he doesn't intend on dying. Death of course rebuttals with the fact she never said she had a claim on him. Furthermore, she implies her reasoning for visiting Lucifer was entirely to talk:

No Caption Provided

And per The Books of Magic, we know Death can visit beings easier when they're close to dying. So anyway, she asked when she was going to get another chance (i.e., when is Lucifer going to be so injured, or when is someone going to sacrifice their life for his, again that she'll be able to have such a conversation?). What's more is, the above scan is also used in conjunction with the one afore, as if to show Lucifer intimidated Death; however that's proven false if we read onward:

No Caption Provided

"The next miracle". Notice how she used the same phrase in the scan above? It's because her main purpose was to ferry Elaine to the afterlife:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3

If we go back to the scan where Lucifer threatens Death, the important thing to note is that his threat is hinged on the fact he thinks he's going to live. He intends to live, so Death better factor that into her words, right? But what if he wasn't going to live? The implication here is that Death would have power over him. So while I think Lucifer would take a majority over Death normally, it seems she would take the majority if he was dead, or perhaps in her realm.

So, can certain people kill Lucifer? Yes, but no one weaker than Death of the Endless, who frankly would also solo these guys. Now, with prep is a different story, because Lucifer nearly died due to Izanami's, which is why he was in the above predicament.

Onto Michael--I would say more or less the same thing, minus him doing things as significant as Lucifer would with prep.

As a team, I don't think anyone short of the Beyonders are going to be a threat.

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#68 Posted by deactivated-5a90ca82ccb5f (6669 posts) - - Show Bio

@cruelestashley: Sorry when i said both i meant both examples, as a team and alone. but thanks.

Any who thankfully you aren't one of those people who only think an omnipotent can kill Lucifer or Michael...

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#69 Edited by deactivated-5a853424245e3 (4168 posts) - - Show Bio

@grayhold:

What he really said that for in his view concept that we call multiverse is that for him, Multiverse is a Universe that has many dimensions in it, that's what he said, nothing less, nothing more.

Mke Carey already gave details about that, he already said that Multiverse is a Universe with many dimensions in it, not that Multiverse is a place with many universes(our view of concept of the multiverse).

What he said is on the previous page--you don't get to say he said any more or less than what he did. The fact is, he said they're used interchangeably to describe different aspects of the same thing. In fact, I'll bring the tweet right back here:

Just someone refers otherone as THE GOD, doesn't mean he has powers of omnipotence. Beyonder was refered as THE GOD, so was Galactus and Living Tribunal.

Except the character is the same God of the covenant that existed in the Pre-Crisis universe, and also the same God that's constantly referred to as the biblical God. He, as Elaine, demonstrated facets of his omnipotence numerous times. The narrative would not continually lie about the fact he is the omnipotent God, especially not for over seventy plus years over dozens of separate writers. What you're suggesting is that there's some sort of conspiracy that the God character is not the God character, which is absurd.

And current Lucifer's series by default makes argument invalid.

How? Lucifer Vol. 2 has already implied the Yahweh present is not Yahweh. And if you're referring to Elaine's socializing, it changes nothing--she tried to get along with lesser gods, so what? She is also a god, but she is currently the God.

Actually they are in current Lucifer's run.

You've cited one example I've invalidated--any others?

Current Lucifer's run acutally is pretty solid evidence, just read it.

I read every issue that comes out and update multiple respect threads based on my findings each month.

Even if we assume that Michael and Lucifer created DC,

It's not an assumption, it's what's canon:

Lucifer #26
Lucifer #26

then well they created just the universe, the rest that Krona or Monitor because of their actions made a universe into multiverse would still be canon, which still would put Lucifer and Michael into Universal level category.

That's a nice theory, but you haven't presented any scans to support it.

Multiversity is the current cannon, deal with it.

And again, so is The Sandman and its spinoffs, which are canon to Morrison's works.

As for scans read Multiversity or Crisis on Infinite Earths.

I'm not going to dig for evidence to support your claims--support them yourself.

Also Lucifer was the previous cannon, it's all just retcons, even current Lucifer's run is before the New-52/Current Cannon happening, because of too many retcons of universal concepts and differences.

Lucifer Vol. 2 is running currently, so no, little, if anything has been retconned.

@cruelestashley: Sorry when i said both i meant both examples, as a team and alone. but thanks.

Any who thankfully you aren't one of those people who only think an omnipotent can kill Lucifer or Michael...

Yeah, I gave examples for both--but I only went in depth for one, because I figured it would suffice. If you want, I can analyze it further. Also, no, Lucifer and Michael have been beat by less than omnipotent forces, so that'd just be silly to say.

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#70 Posted by WF_Mxyzptlk (6794 posts) - - Show Bio

@wollfmyth209:

I'm fairly sure that's non-canon.

Doesn't action comics 975 pretty much establish that all Mxy appearances (down even to the freaking lego games) are canon?

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#71 Posted by AdamAmeen (988 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1

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#72 Posted by omriamar (7068 posts) - - Show Bio

@ataraxy said:

Lucifer solos. Michael solos.

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#73 Edited by WollfMyth209 (16518 posts) - - Show Bio
@wf_mxyzptlk said:

Doesn't action comics 975 pretty much establish that all Mxy appearances (down even to the freaking lego games) are canon?

I think it just establishes that Mxy transcends simple continuity and/or is aware of alternate realities of himself, and amongst those realities are WF Mxy and SPCA Mxy.

Within the main DC multiverse(s), WF and SPCA aren't canon.

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#74 Posted by Lordflawlez (1289 posts) - - Show Bio

What a fucking joke

lucifer solostomps, micheal godstomps

both of them together cant be beaten by anything short of omnipotent.

Infinite power+ infinite will, what could stop that?

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#75 Edited by SirNeko (4396 posts) - - Show Bio

@wollfmyth209 said:
@wf_mxyzptlk said:

Doesn't action comics 975 pretty much establish that all Mxy appearances (down even to the freaking lego games) are canon?

I think it just establishes that Mxy transcends simple continuity and/or is aware of alternate realities of himself, and amongst those realities are WF Mxy and SPCA Mxy.

Within the main DC multiverse(s), WF and SPCA aren't canon.

World's Funniest is part of the infinite DC Multiverse, unless you can prove me that there are multiple 5th Dimensions, WF Mxy is canon.

Mxy isn't the only canon character in a non-canon storyline. Superman Prime One Million is a future version of All-Star Superman which is a non-canon storyline.

OT: Michael and Lucifer can solo curb.

No Caption Provided

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#76 Posted by FlakeKing (465 posts) - - Show Bio

Awesome thread and Great arguments on both sides! I'm leaning towards Michael and Lucifer tho. Wasn't it said that both of them can create multiple Multiverses if they combine their powers? Just asking.

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#77 Posted by LordFortis (63 posts) - - Show Bio

My opinion Angels wins. They has almost limitless power. I am sure that, Celestials or Galactus can never to their.

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#78 Posted by NVC1801 (129 posts) - - Show Bio

Lol Amethyst is not above Nabu. Nabu is the most powerful Lord of Order. Dr Fate has universal feats and one multiversal feat. And Nabu is far stronger than Dr Fate.

Lucifer and Michael wins here.

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#79 Posted by TheVoidofDeath (2143 posts) - - Show Bio

Brothers

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#80 Posted by cosmic_reign (3510 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1

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#81 Posted by ToHellAndBack23 (115 posts) - - Show Bio

Lucifer and Michael

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#82 Edited by primebonnick (4291 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2 the others just aren't on their level

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#84 Posted by pastepotpete1 (3357 posts) - - Show Bio

team 1 .. didnt molecule man have problems with celestials ?

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#85 Posted by RavenSupreme (564 posts) - - Show Bio

either of the angels solos

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#86 Posted by ThEBeStOfTheBeST (11178 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2.

Online
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#87 Edited by PoisononousVenom (115 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2 wins 10/10 times

Michael or Lucifer themselves can solo. Michael has literally infinite power(Power of God/The Presence), and effortlessly beat a unbounded Spectre. Lucifer has infinite "creation" warping(Will of God/The Presence), and shaped his own multiverse where he is God. Michael + Lucifer is a ubercurbstomp and nearing God's level in DC Comics. Individually each of the brothers are multiversal+.

Lucifer and Michael are canon within DC. Originally within Vertigo Comics, the word "multiverse" and "universe" are used interchangeably. A infinite universe is literally the exact same as an infinite multiverse. There is no difference between two things that are infinite. If there were a difference then one of those things would not be infinite...

Anyway, Galactus is a single molecule in comparison to any of the brothers. The Celetsials are higher up in the food chain, but again they are still far below Michael and Lucifer.

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#88 Posted by WollfMyth209 (16518 posts) - - Show Bio

Still team 2.

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#89 Posted by MrStranger (1894 posts) - - Show Bio

Still team 2.

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#90 Posted by Lan_Fan (13300 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, team 2 should win.

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#91 Posted by ThEBeStOfTheBeST (11178 posts) - - Show Bio

Still the angelic brothers.

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#92 Posted by RampageTheFirst (7567 posts) - - Show Bio

Lucifer and Michael.

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#93 Posted by BruceVeidt (3570 posts) - - Show Bio