Gabramalek vs Beerus and Hades

@god_vulcan: So what is his physical durability? Does he have regen or some immortality?

He traded blows with Post-Transcendence Shihoon who tanked numerous Big Bang lvl punches and was dishing out comparable damage. So I would say multiversal once he uses the 9th commandment.

And while he isn't immortal, he countered existence erasure by simply rewinding time.

@valor_175: I'll let you know when my schedule permits yet another CaV. And most of Gabramalek's feats were posted here if you want to gauge him, and if you're looking for info on Hades then @thedarkpaladin is the right person to ask (and whoever he later tags).

@god_vulcan: Team loses badly then

@gaoron: It's rather close actually considering Hades is here.

@god_vulcan: creation =/= destruction Hades is not doing anything here if Gabramalek can tank repetitive universal attacks.

@gaoron: Creation takes the same amount of energy as destruction. More so when you take into account that Hades maintained the existence of his universes with his own power. Not that it matters. Characters far inferior to him have universal/multi-universal feats anyway. It comes down to who makes the first move between Hades and Gabramalek. Beerus is outclassed here.

Anyway, tagging some Saint Seiya experts to see what they think of this match:

@fallschirmjager@captainganon@zokologue3@agent9149

@thedarkpaladin: Not really. Creation has nothing do to with destructive power. And Beerus > Hades in that aspect. Hades has no way to hurt his opponent via dc and strikings.

It does, though. Creating multiple universes requires the exact same amount of energy it would take to destroy them. Beerus and Goku failed to destroy their own universe in multiple clashes, making their battle inferior to the combined might of 3 Gold Saints producing an attack equivalent to the Big Bang. Hades also shattered multiple God Cloths and has a plethora of hax at his disposal. Beerus doesn't really have many options here other than Hakai, which has only been used effectively on fodder from his end anyway.

@thedarkpaladin: No thats just mean Hades has amazing creation abilities. Gremmy created pocket dimension with stars in it but he is not even planetary in power.

Did Hades ever overpower those 3 gold saints attack? And no him beating them seperated doesn't count. Hax is his only way to win and so is Beerus.

And thats not how hax works, either you have resistance/counter for it or not, doesn't matter if it was used on fodders or not. I dont know where you got that from.

@gaoron:

No thats just mean Hades has amazing creation abilities. Gremmy created pocket dimension with stars in it but he is not even planetary in power.

Abilities which require multi-universal energy in order to create and sustain them. This is also consistent with his feats of overpowering multiple God Cloth Saints at once, each of them would easily defeat all 12 Gold Saints nigh effortlessly. The battle against Thanatos proved that much. I don't know who Gremmy is or the feat you're referring to. Care to show it?

Did Hades ever overpower those 3 gold saints attack? And no him beating them seperated doesn't count. Hax is his only way to win and so is Beerus.

He did one better. Withstood and overpowered the combined force of 5 God Saints and only suffered negligible injury:

https://imgur.com/a/96QaF

Athena's Exclamation is only the combined Cosmo of 3 Gold Knights. Then we have Shaka and Shinjima whose clash created and destroyed multiple universes, another feat that eclipses anything Beerus can hope to achieve.

And thats not how hax works, either you have resistance/counter for it or not, doesn't matter if it was used on fodders or not. I dont know where you got that from.

What you're doing is arguing a blatant no limits fallacy. If we go by your line of reasoning, Sasuke or any fodder Sharingan user can Genjutsu GG Beerus, Whis and Zeno, simply because they lack TP resistance feats. Unless the technique in question has been shown to function on or near the level of the character Beerus is up against, there's no reason to assume it constitutes an automatic win against characters far outside of his own tier.

Creation=/=Destruction. Destruction comes when there's already matter and energy present. Creation comes from nothingness. Both operate differently but Destruction is a stronger force because the way of the universe is towards randomness, not uniformity. Also in terms of the order from disorder, Destruction is more powerful because of the second law of thermodynamics. In conclusion, Destruction>>Creation. Just like Beerus said, "Before creation comes Destruction!" since even big bang was a destructive expansion of space before it created the Universe we know now..

Hades really haven't shown Universal D.C or striking TBH. Hakai can also work on beings equal (also immortal) or little above as shown by the manga MSSBJ Goku.

One such example is Arceus from Pokemon. He created the Universe and Dimensions and yet can't even beat a basic Pokemon and doesn't have any durability on the level.

@thedeathstar:

To be fair, Hades does scale from characters with universal destruction and creation feats, which is already more than Beerus has shown on his own. It took multiple clashes from him and Goku to replicate the power of Athena's Exclamation, and that amount of power was stated to be enough to destroy them both, along with Whis and everything else in the universe. Hades also maintained the existence of his realms--one of which was said to be endless--and that would require a substantial amount of energy, more so than just the energy needed to create them.

I'm also not sure how the second law of thermodynamics proves destruction is more powerful than creation. Do you mind elaborating on that?

As for Arceus, I don't know much about the anime version, other than the fact that he was knocked out by a meteor of some sort, but what basic Pokemon did he fail to create? .

The Second Law predicts the end of the universe. It implies that the universe will end in a ‘heat death’ in which everything is at the same temperature. This is the ultimate level of disorder; if everything is at the same temperature, no work, force, matter, acceleration, or creation can be done, That is W=F*S=M*A*S and all the energy will be destroyed up as the random motion of atoms and molecules. Here, Destruction is neglecting other forces including creation.

Wait! It's hades and beerus vs Gabramalek then why did you put Bronze cloth Pegasus into this battle?

I was going to say "Hades stomps" until i saw **speed equalized**

This Gabramalek is quite OP and hee shares some feats with hades like:

-erasing someone from existence

-Controlling casuality

-Creating universes

-Strong TK powers, strong enough to move planets.

-Void manipulation

-Space-time manipulation

-Concept manipulation

-reality warping

...Etc

Well his time manipulation won't work on hades (god form) since he is acausual, and hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm that's all.

Don't know much about gabramalek, can you give use feats about his durability and resistances?

@thedeathstar: The theory of heat death relies on the universe reaching a state of thermal equilibrium, which to my understanding, happens when all working energy transfers to heat energy. This is a process that is thought to happen naturally over a long, drawn out period of time, though, and it's a bit different than actually destroying all matter in the universe, or the very fabric of space-time itself, with your own power.

I've always looked at it like building a house: It requires energy to take basic materials and turn them into an organized structure. Even more so to maintain that structure, i.e., maintenance. However, if left alone for a long enough period of time, the building will decay and eventually be destroyed through a natural process thanks to entropy. Looking at it that way, it seems more difficult to create and maintain something than it does to destroy it.

@thedarkpaladin: I wish I knew who this Gabramalek guy is. However Beerus would be a non-factor, if Gabramalek is near Hades' level.

@captainganon: The posted some information for Gabrammalek on the first page if you want to check it out (post #8). I'm not too sure about his durability, but he has some pretty insane feats from the looks of it.

@thedarkpaladin: I read it, but it says he only has these powers INSIDE his own universe. Am I wrong?

@captainganon: Someone already brought that up. Read post 12 or read post 8 carefully again.

Everwhere he's at is his own universe.

You're not wrong, but I believe his powers enable him to essentially take control of other universes and make them his own space.

This feat puts Beerus above the rest in these battles.

Beerus one shot a character that was breaking the 4th wall. It's then on-panel that Beerus can in fact destroy anything. It doesn't matter if Gabramalek has a million different powers because Beerus has the one shot fight ender.

You are surely joking!

You are surely joking!

@thedarkpaladin: @god_vulcan:

@god_vulcan said:

Okay then. I'll still have to check on the anime, just to be sure!

bump

zeno would hounestly stomp

Why is Beerus here? He is fodder. He dies in the crossfire between Gabramalek and Hades

@thegreatlordd:

Zeno isn't here.

i know peoples said he would lose.

@caocao:

Why is Beerus here? He is fodder. He dies in the crossfire between Gabramalek and Hades

actually although i agree beerus would lose, none of them posses the phyical capacity to make beerus look weak. he in terms of dc and is above macroversal ,he is above time and has many haxes. so he is definatly not dying from the crossfire, specially from hades, don't know much about the other character. but hades never destroyed a universe on panel, going by statement beerus is easily above macroversal.

hades can not stomp beerus via statement

Gabramalek possibly

Also Beerus is fodder here.

Ok, my bad. I thought it was a Garamalek vs Beerus VS Hades Match, so Hades could use "Lost Canvas". But he is with Hades in a Team, so this wouldn´t hit Beerus. Well, you don´t need to destroy a universe to beat someone like Beerus if you have a good Hax. Beerus has the Power to destroy the Universe, but not the predisposition to be a 4-D Charakter, like Hades and Gabramalek. Hades Hax will be enough to eliminated Beerus.

Gabramalek is like Zeno, but he has way more feats as you can see in the startpost. He against Hades is a hard Match, but Zeno isn´t here a relevant factor in this fight. Destruction Power isn´t all and Hakai won´t work against 4-D Charakters (Before you ask, Zamasu would erased with the Universe by Zeno, who should be 4-D, so Zeno´s Power is complete on a other Level like Beerus)

We have an 4-D Charakter against an 3-D and 4-D Charakter. So Beerus is a little bit outmatched here.

EDIT: I must correct my Answere. If i understand, then Hades has only 4-D Powers, but himself he isn´t 4-D. Better i researched it.

So i agree with you.

Ok, my bad. I thought it was a Garamalek vs Beerus VS Hades Match, so Hades could use "Lost Canvas". But he is with Hades in a Team, so this wouldn´t hit Beerus.

beerus wouldn't need a protection, he can take care of him self, i think these days after zeno came, peoples think beerus is weak, well he isn't.

Well, you don´t need to destroy a universe to beat someone like Beerus if you have a good Hax.

the fact that beerus himself opperates at a universal level and beyond, someone that has has universal hax can't stomp him. don't neglet the fact that beerus can simply nullify things at a universal level, as he did it to the universal blast in dbs. also his punches would be enough to harm hades as beerus threatened to destroy the macroerse with them(three punches).

Beerus has the Power to destroy the Universe, but not the predisposition to be a 4-D Charakter, like Hades and Gabramalek. Hades Hax will be enough to eliminated Beerus.

it was also stated that beerus can nulify energy at universal level, he can erase the physical body and spiritual plane, and he can erase anything as stated by whi. and he him self is compeletely immune to his own types of attack...although i agree they would defeat him it would definatly not be in a stomp as their feat(hades) opperates at only universal level. hades is probably more haxed but most of them would not work on beerus.

Gabramalek is like Zeno,

was he ever stated to have the power to erase an entire multiverse with a blink of an eye?

but he has way more feats as you can see in the startpost.

i am not going to argue about a character that is just a fairy tail. also i don't know much about him.

He against Hades is a hard Match,

Destruction Power isn´t all

it isn't but hades has shown to get hurt by it.

and Hakai won´t work against 4-D Charakters

it is not your dementional level that decides your imunity to some attack, has gabramalek ever taken an attck that erases him from existence?

(Before you ask, Zamasu would erased with the Universe by Zeno, who should be 4-D, so Zeno´s Power is complete on a other Level like Beerus)

i am well aware of that.

We have an 4-D Charakter against an 3-D and 4-D Charakter. So Beerus is a little bit outmatched here.

who said beerus is only 3d level,scaing him from casual jiren feat and merged zamasu, i am preatty sure he is 4d level. don't forgate that characters much weaker than him could warp reality.

@thegreatlordd:

Then call out those people in another thread.

why didn't you tell them that when they brought zeno in. all i did was reply.

@littllejeikkie:

was he ever stated to have the power to erase an entire multiverse with a blink of an eye?

So you're telling me you haven't even brushed up on his feats? Come on man

@god_vulcan:

So you're telling me you haven't even brushed up on his feats? Come on man

are you serious?was that all he did, don't even know why he is here, if his feats are only planetery level. the only good feat there was him being able to copy any attack and him being able to create a dimantion.

90% of the feats you mentioned were alredy done in dbz.. creating a planet is the casual jobb of the kais..

porunga casually created a planet and his powers are far below nemek frieza

Beerus is outclassed here. He's Skyfather level character, not abstract level yet.