Flash Vs Superman

@dimlylitlantern: I don't know what to tell you. Most of the people here have agreed that Flash would stomp and for good reason. Stop waking Superman and accept the fact that on a regular basis, The Flash is just much faster. I won't reply to you anymore because you can't change the mind of a fanboy.

@mister_surreal: How am I the fan boy here? You are offering a way for Wally to win that he nearly never does. Superman, on multiple occasions, has been stated to be stronger than Flash and more powerful as a whole. Flash thought it was insane that Superman could fight Asmodel on his own while the entire League struggled against him. Flash defeated one white martian and was defeated by a few others. Superman is stronger than Martian Manhunter himself as well has having defeated some white martians himself. Flash isn't the strongest person in the DCU nor is he even close to being so. You mention speed steal as a way for Flash to win. Flash used speed steal against AMAZO with Superman's speed and it didn't last long. Flash can't seem to use speed steal against BR and Superman is even faster than him. You say that Flash is trillions of times faster based on one feat that Wally hasn't even come close to since. I can use outliers as well, but that would just be untrue to the character. I could easily say that Flash couldn't hurt Superman because he needed help to hurt Girder and Grodd and just ignore all of Flash's other showings like you are doing for Superman. That isn't helpful. I could also bring up instances in which even slower characters than Superman like MMH have kept up with a bloodlusted Flash before. Why are these not taken into consideration?

@dimlylitlantern: All of those factors have been taken into consideration, but none of them matter because The Flash is factual faster on a regular basis. What's to stop him from taking kryptonite and stabbing Supeman in the chest? What's to stop him from speed stealing? What's to stop him from using infinite mass punch? What's to stop him from phasing his hand into Superman's head? What's to stop him from going back in time and strangelling Superman as a baby? Nothing at all, but despite all of the ways that The Flash could easily beat Superman you won't accept them because in your eyes Superman just has to win. Superman is stronger, but baseless statements of him being more powerful mean nothing. At the end of the day, at their absolute fastest, The Flash is faster. He outran teleportation, which means that he moved faster than what is possible. Even if Superman could keep up with The Flash, he could just become intangible and evade all of his attacks. At the end of the day, Superman for all of his powers cannot do anything to Flash, because on a consistent basis, regardless of what you say, The Flash has speed feats that far outclass him. And your amount if reluctans to se that is what makes you a fanboy.

@mister_surreal:

What's to stop him from taking kryptonite and stabbing Supeman in the chest?

The fact that Kryptonite is a pretty rare substance, he would have to look for it maybe though the Batcave or Lex Corp, get around the defense systems specifically placed there so that no one steals such a material, then he would actively need to shape it into a knife. Superman isn't just going to wait for him to do that.

What's to stop him from speed stealing?

Superman can raise his body temperature to the point that Wally burns himself on touch. Besides, speed steal doesn't last for that long on Superman's speed.

What's to stop him from using infinite mass punch?

Superman himself? Do you believe he is just going to sit there and wait for it? WW has been hit by 3 IMPs before and has been just fine. Superman would be okay even if he were hit. He has been struck with far far worse.

What's to stop him from passing his hand into Superman's head?

Superman's own phasing, heat vision (which can hurt him even while intangible), Super Flare, Superman's own reaction speed, frost breath (can also hit intangible opponents, Superman's own density (which Flash has trouble getting though the Fortress of Solitude and other dense materials), etc.

What's to stop him from going back in time and strangelling Superman as a baby?

The fact that 1: Superman can also time travel and 2: even if Flash did try that, it wouldn't work. Did you not read Flash point? If he did so, that wouldn't kill Earth 0 Superman, it would just create a "time boom" and make another alternate universe.

Superman is stronger, but baseless statements of him being more powerful mean nothing.

Baseless? Superman stalemated Asmodel when the entire League was unable to. Superman has defeated Darkseid while the entire League hasn't. Superman has defeated the entire League before. Superman was the only League member that could easily defeat Imperiex probes (including Wally) without nearly dying. Superman Is stated multiple times (even acknowledged by Flash himself) to be the most powerful. Superman can tank planetary destruction. Superman can tank supernovas. Superman can tank double black holes. Superman has defeated enemies that Flash struggles with. How is my claim baseless?

At the end of the day, at their absolute fastest, The Flash is faster.

That isn't what I am arguing. Of course Flash is faster, he is the Flash. Speed is his thing. Just because he has the speed advantage, doesn't mean he automatically wins. Flash can be defeated in quite a few different ways.

He outran teleportation, which means that he moved faster than what is possible.

While amped by literally everyone on the planet moving the fastest they could, including heroes like Wonder Woman and Superman.

Even if Superman could keep up with The Flash, he could just become intangible and evade all of his attacks.

Superman has phasing as well. Besides, heat-visionand frost breath can still hit him.

And your amount if reluctans to se that is what makes you a fanboy.

I am fully willing to admit Flash is stronger if you prove it. That is something you haven't done. You say that Superman can't tag Flash? Why was MMH able to tangle with him then while blood-lusted? Why is it that Superman can change his perception with Flash? He has caught Flash. Exaggerating the Flash's power so much isn't going to get you anywhere.

@dimlylitlantern: I'm not exaggerating The Flash's power, you are just to stupid to consider any argument that someone brings up against you.

Flash.

@mister_surreal: I read both Flash and Superman. They are both characters that I enjoy quite a bit. I would not mind if Flash were stronger. Flash isn't stronger though. If Flash were stronger than Superman, than these panels wouldn't be the way they are: 1, 2, 3. That is how Wally did against an Imperiex Probe. Superman comes up and does this. Mind you that Superman waste around 5-12 of these probes by himself in this story arc.

@dimlylitlantern: I just love it when 95% of people agree that one character would win, but there is always that one idiot who makes bias arguments in an attempt to counter what is obvious to everyone else. Your stupidity knows no boundaries.

@mister_surreal: How am I bias? I am fine with Superman losing, but he isn't here. Randomly insulting my intelligence without even coming with a counter argument doesn't make you look good. Flash was nearly killed by an Imperiex probe while Superman destroyed multiple. Flash was highly impressed with Superman stalemating Asmodel while most the League was losing to him. Superman has beaten Darkseid while Flash isn't as strong. Flash even acknowledges Clark as being the stronger of the two.

@dimlylitlantern: Stronger, but he sure we hell isn’t more powerful. There is no arguement that you have made that counters Flash just sticking out his hands, taking Superman’s speed and using infinite mass punch over and over again. And another thing, Superman rarely goes back in time and he can’t do it nearly as efficiently as The Flash. All Wally has to do is run backs in time and kill a weaker Clark, there no counter to that. I already won this argument, you are just a deleuded fanboy grasping at straws. If no one can sawed you clearly bias opinion, then there is no hope for you.

@mister_surreal: can green lartrens stop flash? Does they have enough power?

@supermanthor: In character, The Flash would allow Green Lantern to create at least one construct. But if Wally is blood lusted, then he would kill them before they had enough time to create anything.

@mister_surreal: also anthor question can someone with the strength of Superman and hulk break Green lartens hand if they want to so they can't use there ring

@supermanthor: They could, but it wouldn’t be easy. Their shields are extremely durable and can repair themselves.

4600 th post flash wins

@supermanthor: So you agree that The Flash wins?

@mister_surreal: since the beginning I know flash will beat Superman . It's just I have questions lol

@mister_surreal:

Stronger, but he sure we hell isn’t more powerful.

Explain Imperiex and multiple League statements of Superman being the most powerful then.

There is no arguement that you have made that counters Flash just sticking out his hands, talking Superman’s speed and using infinite mass punch over and over again.

In order to speed steal an opponent, Wally almost always needs to touch an opponent. Superman can negate this by either raising his body heat to the point Wally would burn himself or just Super Flare, which he can now use without much power loss, and defeat him instantly. Also, speed steal doesn't last that long against people that also happen to be crazy fast. Like AMAZO with Superman'sspeed and Cheetah: 1, 2, 3. You are simply ignoring the clear limits placed on Wally's abilities which just comes off as sloppy. An IMP works entirely on relative speed. If Superman also happens to be traveling under light speed, what Wally needs to do in order to preform the technique in the first place, it is going to do less damage. Besides, WW took 3 IMPs and was just fine. Superman happens to be more durable than WW.

And another thing, Superman rarely goes back in time and he can’t do it nearly as efficiently as The Flash. All Wally has to do is run backs in time and kill a weaker Clark, there no counter to that.

There is no way that this is an argument that is being used seriously. Superman rarely goes back in time so it is invalid? Flash actively avoids time travel due to the massive repercussions it has. Have you not read Flashpoint? Or at least got a basic idea of the arc? Barry goes back in time to save his mom from death and he ends up creating another universe entirely. Barry did not fix anything in his own timeline but changed an entire timeline of a different universe. Wally killing Clark as a child would not do anything to Earth-0 Superman.

I already won this argument, you are just a deleuded fanboy grasping at straws. If no one can sawed you clearly bias opinion, then there is no hope for you.

You have literally stated numerous things that Wally straight cannot do to win. Speed steal really did wonders against AMAZO, Zoloman, Cheetah, Black Racer, and Thawne right? No, it doesn't work all the time they way you say. If it did, Flash would not lose to anyone. Something he does even when not holding back. Time travel literally has an entire massively significant storyline to why it doesn't work. The IMP is countered by relative speed and durability. Zoom would be dead if he was hit by a white dwarf star, but survives because he was moving around Wally's speed. WW takes 3 IMPs and is just fine and barely injured. All of this is shown in comic. I am not a "fanboy" if I am pointing out the glaring holes in your argument.

@supermanthor: At least you have common sense, unlike some other people.

@dimlylitlantern: Right, because using inconsistent feats is a great arg argument. So if you are going to use those PIS feats that you keep bringing up. If they are both blood lusted, the there is nothing stopping Flash from using time-travel. Superman could try but he is not going back in time before Wally. There is nothing that Superman has that suggests that speed steal can’t on him. At this point, I don’t even have the energy come up with another argument. Flash wins, everyone here but you gets that. So get in into your thick skull and give up.

@mister_surreal: Bro, don't be a child.

@mister_surreal:

Right, because using inconsistent feats is a great arg argument.

You have suggested Flash do 2 or 3 things Flash has never done to win. Name a single time Wally went back in time to kill someone in the present. Name one time Wally stole someone's speed and placed a billion IMPs. If you can, tell me which one of them is as strong as Superman.

So if you are going to use those PIS feats that you keep bringing up.

What PIS feats? Asmodel is PIS, Imperiex, Darkseid, etc? You don't like it so it must be PIS. That isn't how a debate works. I could list more people that Flash couldn't deal with that Superman could.

If they are both blood lusted, the there is nothing stopping Flash from using time-travel.

Read Flashpoint. It would do nothing.

There is nothing that Superman has that suggests that speed steal can’t on him

You mean the fact that AMAZO had Superman's speed, Wally steals it and AMAZO can still move afterwards?

At this point, I don’t even have the energy come up with another argument. Flash wins, everyone here but you gets that. So get in into your thick skull and give up.

You have made no real argument. The argument you made is "Flash wins because I say so". Show me Flash completely blitzing Superman to the point Superman can't do anything. Show me Flash beating someone Superman could not. Show me someone telling Flash that he is the strongest in the League with Superman in the room. Maybe address the points I have made, to get rid of the doubt in my mind instead of ignoring them and getting angry that I actually read comics. Literally do anything that implies an actual argument.

@mister_surreal: lol thanks

Wally stomps.

@dimlylitlantern: Bro, don’t be a troll. First off, Amazo had more than just Superman’s power due to him looking at The Flash, the whole argument that Wally couldn’t use speed steal on him is invalid. And no, the argument that “Flash wins because I say so” is based off of feats that they have been consistently shown that you simply won’t listen to.

Since these two are acting out of character, Wally could go back in time and kill Clark if he wanted, the same way that Clark could go for the “throw the moon at the Earth attack”. I also didn’t say that Wally would get a “billion” infinite mass punches in, only a few. You are being a hypocrite, you dismiss nearly all of Wally’s canon and consistent feats but make it out to seem that I’m doing the same to Clark.

I know how powerful Superman is, but his power level means nothing when he can’t consistently tag Wally. The only time that Superman ever does is when the plot requires him to, because Wally can easily outrun him 99.9% of the time. Everything that I have said is within Wally’s shown and consistently capability, you just don’t want to a accept it.

No argument that anyone makes ever he good enough because it ends in Flash winning. The reason why my recent arguments havn’t been stellar is because you exhaust me. Why don’t we just agree to disagree over a meaningless debate and leave it at that?

@alsimmons77: Preach.

Flash stomps

@supermanthor: So, you like Hulk?

Yup

@mister_surreal: yes

@mister_surreal:

And no, the argument that “Flash wins because I say so” is based off of feats that they have consistently shown that you simply won’t lsiten to

Okay. If you want to argue consistency, I'll ask you a consistency question. Name 3 times Wally went back in time to kill someone and I'll give it to you. I might not even touch the fact that Superman could probably follow him through the time stream like the Black Racer is able to.

First off, Amazo had more thanjist Superman’s power due to him looking at The Flash, the whole arguement that Wally couldn’t use speed steal on him is invalid.

That doesn't matter. If Wally's speed steal works the way you think it does, AMAZO shouldn't have been able to move at all. At that point Superman was the fastest person AMAZO had copied. Tell me why AMAZO could move post speed steal.

Since these two are acting out of character, Wally could go back in time and kill Clark if he wanted,

I am telling you, that wouldn't do anything. Flashpoint goes into explicit detail as to why.

the same way that Clark could go for the “throw the moon at the Earth attack”

Why would Clark do that? He can and has thrown planet busting punches at others while on the planet. It isn't even out of character.

I also didn’t say that Wally would get a “billion” infinte mass punches in, only a few.

A few IMPs isn't doing anything to Superman. WW took three and wasn't even slowed down.

You are being a hypocrite, you dismiss nearly all of Wally’s canon and consistent feats but make it out to seem that I’m doing the same to Clark.

I could list quite a few things Superman could do to win that are supported by the comic to win. You haven't mentioned anything Flash has done. Most things you have mentioned, would be ineffective.

I know how powerful Superman is, but his power level means nothing when he can’t consistently tag Wally.

He can and has tagged Flash on multiple occasions. Even if he couldn't what is Wally going to move as fast if the entire battle field is ice or magma? What about an earthquake or a hurricane? He could fly thus limiting Wally's range of motion. A whole bunch of things Superman can do.

The only time that Superman ever does is when the plot requires him to, because Wally can easily outrun him 99.9% of the time

The only time anyone does anything is because the plot requires it. That is how comic characters work. You are really underestimating how fast Superman is. Flash is faster, but Superman can keep up if need be.

Everything that I have said is within Wally’s shown and consistently capability, you just don’t want to a accept it.

Show me then. You have stated 3 main things: Speed steal, IMP, Time travel. Speed steal wears off quickly on characters as fast as Superman. Cheetah and AMAZO are proof of this. The IMP has been tanked by WW and Zoom, two characters Superman is more durable than. Durability and relative speed are taken into account with it which is why both characters took them so well. Superman happens to have both. Time travel has an entire story arc dedicated to the flaws of that idea. Show me proof if you are so passionate about this idea.

Why is the fact that Superman wins not even taken into consideration? Wally hasn't really done much to say that he wins over Superman of all people to such a degree.

@dimlylitlantern: Do you think you could post scans for Superman time traveling. I don’t recall him ever doing that in Post Crisis or New 52.

@dimlylitlantern: Dude, I already gave you ways that Wally could win and reasons as to why Clark would do nothing to him. I’m done with this arguement. Move on.

Pretty sure he's trolling. That user name in combination with everything he says is just lolzy.

@diydeath said:

That is very true.

@kanyecosby said:

Don't waste any your time with that person, they'll just pull up random PIS fulled feats and make baseless arguments.

@kanyecosby: Clark is fast enough to operate the Cosmic Treadmill. Not to mention he is faster than Black Racer. A character that can chase Barry and Wally though the Speedforce, which is a harder barrier to breach than the time barrier.

@mister_surreal: None of the methods that you have stated for Wally to win work. Simple as that. I have already explained this concept above. Either bring proof, or I will be forced to invalidate your claims as baseless.

And what PIS feats? Please indulge me.

@dimlylitlantern: Let it go.

@mister_surreal: You have a page worth of responses stating nothing canon. Wasting someone's time like this probably isn't ideal for future reference.

@dimlylitlantern: The irony of that statement is fantastic. Now, I will give you one last warning. Stop harassing me or I'm going to start flagging.

Salty superman fans cant accept flash wins this one while on the toilet if not holding back

@lord_titan_: I know right?

@lord_titan_: It would be advised to make an argument that holds instead of randomly insulting people that have a different opinion. Bring evidence, implication, likely scenarios. Don't be a sheep and automatically conform to everyone else's opinion if you don't share it. This is a thread because there are two sides to the argument.

Flash in a good fight

Sup win

@dimlylitlantern: Eh, there's no need, doesn't need to be 94 pages long, a flash not holding back has done unspeakable things, there are so many ways he could end superman as people have already suggested its not funny

With moral on, it can honestly go either way.

@lord_titan_: Any non-holding back S-tier superhero can do unspeakable things. Superman is consistently stated to be the League's strongest member for a reason. Please, tell me in what way can Wally end Superman. He couldn't vibrate though him that easily as it is shown pretty often that Flash has slight difficulty vibrating through hyper dense material like Superman is made of. Not to mention that Superman can vibrate too. Speed steal is proven to not last that long on those with Superman level speed and I doubt Wally could capitalize on it. Time travel has an entire arc dedicated to why it wouldn't work. The IMP is completely relative and has failed to take WW out. If you want to say that there are multiple ways that Flash wins, telling me how would be a start. Proof and evidence go a pretty long way.