Featherine is literally an imagined fiction and character, dreamt up by (the most accepted theory) a little girl in Umineko who loves murder mystery novels and movies. She exists in the mind of a child, most likely. Dream of the Endless is enough to remove her from that child's imagination. Dream by himself ends Featherine, because Featherine is just a dream of a little kid.
Literally right after the door closed on the interview and she showed the book, she morphs into Featherine and Berkenstel is there. Maybe I didn't explain this at all the right way?
There is an earth, a "real world". Somewhere in this real world there is a child, a kid, a person who is young, who is dreaming everything you are experiencing in the game. In her dream, there is a real world, where the interview with the diary took place. Cameras flashing, the press and so on where characters debate and try to solve mysteries. That was not the real world of Umineko. That was the analogue of the real world in this childs mind who is dreaming all of this up. The writer there morphs into Featherine at the end. None of that is the real world.
That is the structure of Umineko. All talk of "the real world" and Featherine affecting "the real world" is dreamt up by a child.
Literally right after the door closed on the interview and she showed the book, she morphs into Featherine and Berkenstel is there. Maybe I didn't explain this at all the right way?
There is an earth, a "real world". Somewhere in this real world there is a child, a kid, a person who is young, who is dreaming everything you are experiencing in the game. In her dream, there is a real world, where the interview with the diary took place. Cameras flashing, the press and so on where characters debate and try to solve mysteries. That was not the real world of Umineko. That was the analogue of the real world in this childs mind who is dreaming all of this up. The writer there morphs into Featherine at the end. None of that is the real world.
That is the structure of Umineko. All talk of "the real world" and Featherine affecting "the real world" is dreamt up by a child.
Featherine being a literal dream of a little kid isn't going to be a problem for Dream of the Endless.
Okay, can you then explain to me how the heck she's using the red truth in the real world in this scene?
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You are known to argue meta bullshit. Everyone in the real world is above fictional characters, which includes DC or Umineko, even if it's a fictional presentation of earth. That's just logic. Every fictional author knows that. You can make some stupid suggsverse OP verse and the real world within the fiction is still above it. Featherines cosmology feats still counts, even when it's within a dream of the real world, since the real world is logically above it. Otherwise, she is human level after you logic. Featherine blinks.
Absolutely no one takes you serious, Michael.
@ovy7 Literally in every debate we had he twist my words with his own made up rules. It has almost no sense to debate with him, but I still do it, because I don't know why, lol.
I don't reffer to that thread, I reffer to every thread, BTW.
Oh shit!
Any way, back to the topic: After Michaels logic, Featherine is human level, because she is dreamt up by an girl from the ''real world'', when the real world is always above the fictional verse within the fictional verse. That argument is stupid, because it's just logic. Every fictional author knows that, lol. Her feats still count. Featherine blinks.
It makes no sense to say that I've said it is Meta when the argument is that it isn't Meta and its not the real world. Please, don't try to dodge my argument entirely and shout to others that I've said something I didn't.
Not long ago, Yas and a few others tried to link me to an author interview from Ryukishi and they insisted that it proves there is a Meta real world and Featherine can affect it. They didn't even read the article they were trying to use to justify it. There is a hefty paragraph in the article from the author that says nope, there is no real world Meta with Featherine being able to affect it. It made for a giggle or two on my end, and yet another to see that the same users fully ignore it and hope nobody else will go read that article.
Facts
Featherine can't affect the actual real world, because the author said she cant and there is no actual Meta. Not debatable unless you adhere to Death of the Author, which is the worst argument there is and just shoving your opinions as objective and factual data.
Featherine is a fiction contained in a fiction dreamed by a child. She would be ended with 0 effort by Dream of the Endless if both were allowed to fight in a neutral place and retain their powers, considering she is literally a dream.
@michaeljulius: Man... imagine if you said something right for once... You've clearly never read Umineko.
Featherine is a fiction in a fiction
Only in the Trick Ending, that is overshadowed by the Magic Ending, that is backed up by literally the rest of all of When They Cry.
There is a hefty paragraph in the article from the author that says nope, there is no real world Meta with Featherine being able to affect it.
Funny... because Ryukishi seemed to of made the Trick Ending for people who just wanted the truth and didn't care about the story (he seems to mock these types of people). Other When They Cry series both before and after use the Meta-World, and there is no debate and no alternate ending of it all being fake. Your Ryukishi article is fake. You are a fraud. You're also a DC wanker.
This debate is actually over. You have nothing further to say that means much of anything, because 100% of your statements are subjective. Your opinion. Totally voided of any objective data. The Author himself completely disagreed with you. As I said before, stop tagging me, because you can't debate like an adult it seems. I've no interest in debating you if you can't have a civil debate without insults. So please, don't tag me in the future. I won't tag you either after this point.
@michaeljulius: Man... imagine if you said something right for once... You've clearly never read Umineko.
Featherine is a fiction in a fiction
Only in the Trick Ending, that is overshadowed by the Magic Ending, that is backed up by literally the rest of all of When They Cry.
There is a hefty paragraph in the article from the author that says nope, there is no real world Meta with Featherine being able to affect it.
Funny... because Ryukishi seemed to of made the Trick Ending for people who just wanted the truth and didn't care about the story (he seems to mock these types of people). Other When They Cry series both before and after use the Meta-World, and there is no debate and no alternate ending of it all being fake. Your Ryukishi article is fake. You are a fraud. You're also a DC wanker.
@michaeljulius: The author himself and his works have openly disagreed with you. You're a fraud with no real facts or evidence. And I know you've never read Umineko. It's direct predecessor (Higurashi/When They Cry) had magic and the Meta-World in it without question.
And I'll tag you whenever I want. Block me if you can't take the heat.
OT: Aurora wins due to infinitely transcending a superior cosmology.
Disrespectful. Insulting. Ignoring what the author said in the article and claiming he said the literal opposite. Having no evidence to backup your claims what so ever, but then saying the same about me (the only one who posted the links and scans to disprove you). Fantastic debating there. I'm not going to tag you, don't worry. Won't block you either, just hoping you learn how to be civil sometime soon.
It concerns me when there is a link shared with the author saying clearly something. Then the superfans roll in like Droideka's from Star Wars out of nowhere and say please don't read that article, just trust me, he said the literal opposite. He didn't. Ryukishi disagreed with you and agrees with me on this.
Its all in the article. No reason to repost it again.
@michaeljulius: The video you sent doesn't even support your argument. LMAO You don't even understand the nature of the video because you never read Umineko. He is speaking of the parallels between the magic and human side of the story (both exist). Also this isn't even Ryukishi talking. The Youtuber merely gave thanks to him. Everyone in the comments is even complimenting the Youtuber for HIS theory. Again, you're a fraud. You don't even understand what you are sending.
@yasindermann: This man sent a video of a Youtuber giving a theory on Umineko and thought it was the author because the Youtuber gave thanks to the author. LOL Even the people in the comments were saying "Nice theory." (It was indeed a nice theory though.) But I hate when people pretend like they know what they're talking about. I saw you destroy him in the LT thread recently too.
@yasindermann: This man sent a video of a Youtuber giving a theory on Umineko and thought it was the author because the Youtuber gave thanks to the author. LOL Even the people in the comments were saying "Nice theory." (It was indeed a nice theory though.) But I hate when people pretend like they know what they're talking about. I saw you destroy him in the LT thread recently too.
I know. He wanks everything on next level. And that between me and him wasn't even a debate, TBH. He twisted my words again and said he is right. His points were basically invalid. Oh, wait, isn't this the typical kryptoninapride tactic?
What on Earth are you on about? The linked video was a reference structure of the child dreaming argument. Literally nowhere did I say that had anything to do with Ryukishi. It was a great youtuber explaining with scans and text on what the structure is. Why are you laughing at someone else when nowhere in my statement did I say that Youtube video link had anything to do with the author?
You were then given a link to a youtube video that explained the hierarchy, and nowhere did I say it was made by Ryukishi. But, for whatever reason that I cannot comprehend, you are confused by a text based interview article from the author and a youtube video link describing the structure of the series. Yikes.
The Featherine fan support group lost this when the author himself said you are all wrong in that interview. But ya, it seems I cannot have a civil debate with you, or Yas. Both of you seem uncivil and incapable of having a debate without insults and accusations.
@michaeljulius: The video you sent doesn't even support your argument. LMAO You don't even understand the nature of the video because you never read Umineko. He is speaking of the parallels between the magic and human side of the story (both exist). Also this isn't even Ryukishi talking. The Youtuber merely gave thanks to him. Everyone in the comments is even complimenting the Youtuber for HIS theory. Again, you're a fraud. You don't even understand what you are sending.
@michaeljulius: you are confused by a text based interview article
You talk about an article, then send a link to only a Youtube video, like that's the article or something. And you don't need to tell me how the structure works. I know the series better than you since I actually read it. Both the human and meta happen at the same time in the Magic Ending. Nothing contradicts it. Also Higurashi (the series before Umineko) confirmed that magic and the Meta-World is real.
The Featherine fan support group lost this when the author himself said you are all wrong in that interview.
Except Ryukishi never said this. You're lying out of your teeth. You don't even understand the meaning behind Umineko or what Ryukishi's messages were. You'll twist the great story of Umineko into something it isn't over some ridiculous debate about fictional characters fighting each other. All of this because you are a hyper DC fanboy who gets mad if DC doesn't win every time. You say I'm apart of the "Featherine fanclub", yet you will see me in multiple threads arguing against her. So I will leave with this...
Here's how to stomp Aurora as badly as you want: Combine every meta-wanked DC character, every god-tier, composite the cosmology, and add in the Presence. All of that should easily blink Aurora out of existence as much as you'd like. However...
@einefaust: I said Aurora wins via superior cosmology, and in Battler's case hax. Learn to read. I never argued for meta Umineko.
Wait... do you mean because I mentioned the META-WORLD? That's one of the names for the Witches Domain. It doesn't mean actual META. LOL You DC fans keep pretending like you know Umineko and proceed to completely embarrass yourselves by saying wrong things about the series like you're an expert. I'm slowly starting to dislike DC fans now. I don't see other fanbases doing this; only you guys.
So, Do you insist that Battler Ushiromiya is real person?
I thought this thread is about metafictional interpretation of each universe.
BTW,Composite DC cosmology murderstomps highly wanked Umineko as sungsam has stated in other thread.And,Composite DC cosmology is officially confirmed.Have you read Doomsday Clock?
And,How did you prove that Umineko has better cosmology than DC?
@einefaust: Composite DC does surpass Umineko's triple quantum infinite-D cosmology; but Battler's hax have been shown to ignore cosmology and power levels entirely. No one in DC has an answer to Endless Nine and the Golden Truth.
But this is about Aurora. She stomps non-composite DC. Composite DC stomps her. Also Umineko's cosmology has pretty much complete proof now (RT coming soon).
Battler has an ability called Endless Nine, which is a state of mind to where if you don't believe in something, it will not effect you, period. Usually Endless Nine is meant to deny just whatever the user deems supernatural, but Battler has perfected it to the point that he can simply decide to ignore an attack and it will not effect him. Since Endless Nine is a mental state, the only weakness is that if the user's mental state isn't 100% perfect for the ability (I.E. isn't 100% denying the target), then Endless Nine can start to get penetrated, such as when Bernkastel started to barely penetrate Ange's Endless Nine after she just learned how to use it:
However, this doesn't apply to Battler, as he has perfected Endless Nine and his mental state entirely to where nothing will intimidate him to where is faith wavers in denying whatever he feels like. We see him tank attacks from the Imperial Guard Corps when he was a Human, and Aurora's guards when he was the Game Master. Both were infinities above him:
Battler proceeded to throw the fight against Bernkastel, allowing himself to die so that it could help Ange learn what he was trying to teach her (plot stuff). Even Ange's non-perfected Endless Nine and Golden Truth denied reality itself on a conceptual level where her and her family died and let them live regardless:
Ange then proceeds to one shot Bernkastel with the Golden Truth (who is far above Ange in raw power):
And again... Ange's Endless Nine and Golden Truth is a joke compared to Battler's. DC being composite (excluding fully omnipotents) isn't saving itself from Battler.
Offensively, Battler has his Golden Longsword, which conceptually erases its target and erases the concept of evading, defending , enduring, and buying time against his attacks. Battler also has the Golden Truth, which essentially allows him to make anything he wants reality and fact. Here's how all conceptual weapons work in Umineko:
Battler has more properties on his Golden Longsword. So yeah, he still solos DC. (I could honestly care less if Battler could solo DC or not; but facts are facts.) Countering these types of hax with raw power alone is arbitrary and ironically NLF'ing raw power.
You must prove that Battler's Golden Truth can negate every setting including meta.
Meta is fake nonsense. No fictional character is real.
BTW,Doomsday Clock confirms everything is canon(Every cosmology in DC has been changing according to changes to superman).
If it is ok, GER in JOJO can negate every character including Omnipotent because it is confirmed GER can negate any willpower.
I know hardly anything about Jojo, so I can't comment. I know that he gets blitzed by any relevant DC multiversal being before he can do anything. And hax working on an omnipotent is stupid since they are literal perfection.
You must prove such ability can affect Endless and Endless can't affect Battler. Burden of Proof is on you.
I don't subscribe to raw power negating all forms of hax. It is baseless. A completely arbitrary idea made up by the versus community. There is no real logic to it. It's akin to VS Battle's Outerverse (aka a baseless arbitrary fan concept). You mention Sungsam, yet even Sungsam/@norsewinter has admitted that hax ignoring cosmology is a possibility, but doesn't mention it due to it potentially damaging his credibility in the eyes of normies, as fictional debating is more about being political than actually being honest (I completely agree). But I could care less about following the fan made standards of lower tier debaters these days (other people are starting to quit this nonsense as well). Now it's different if the hax is just some physical attack or has clearly shown a limit, but this is clearly not the case here. I have explained the ability. It is up to you to prove that DC has the means to bypass it.
You only expressed how Battler's power works. You still can't express how it can stomp composite DC or even Endless.
Because they have no means of countering "I don't acknowledge any of your attacks even existing, and thus they will not effect me; and I will overwrite anything you do by merely declaring it with the Golden Truth." Oh yes... please tell me how "B-b-but raw power" logically counters this.
It is only your taste, isn't it?
As Mr Mxyzyptlk said, The idea is more real than us in a sense.
If it is ok, GER in JOJO can negate every character including Omnipotent because it is confirmed GER can negate any willpower.
I know hardly anything about Jojo, so I can't comment. I know that he gets blitzed by any relevant DC multiversal being before he can do anything. And hax working on an omnipotent is stupid since they are literal perfection.
You must prove such ability can affect Endless and Endless can't affect Battler. Burden of Proof is on you.
I don't subscribe to raw power negating all forms of hax. It is baseless. A completely arbitrary idea made up by the versus community. There is no real logic to it. It's akin to VS Battle's Outerverse (aka a baseless arbitrary fan concept). You mention Sungsam, yet even Sungsam/@norsewinter has admitted that hax ignoring cosmology is a possibility, but doesn't mention it due to it potentially damaging his credibility in the eyes of normies, as fictional debating is more about being political than actually being honest (I completely agree). But I could care less about following the fan made standards of lower tier debaters these days (other people are starting to quit this nonsense as well). Now it's different if the hax is just some physical attack or has clearly shown a limit, but this is clearly not the case here. I have explained the ability. It is up to you to prove that DC has the means to bypass it.
You only expressed how Battler's power works. You still can't express how it can stomp composite DC or even Endless.
Because they have no means of counting "I don't acknowledge any of your attacks even existing, and will overwrite anything you do by merely declaring it with the Golden Truth." Oh yes... please tell me how "B-b-but raw power" logically counters this.
It is only your taste, isn't it?
As Mr Mxyzyptlk said, The idea is more real than us in a sense.
Come talk to me when I can meet Mxy in real life...
I have not said raw power negating all forms of hax. I only say that Hax negating every setting is only NLF, it has no basis. If it is OK, Cosmic Armor Superman is The platonic and metafictional Idea of Heroism itself, The idea can't be negated.So, CAS stomps max wanked Umineko.
Anyway,Burden of Proof is on you because you insisted Battler can negate Endless and entire DC setting.
BTW, The idea of DC universe and Superhero must outlive you and me. You should understand the idea is more powerful than powerless real person like us. It is the point of Grant Morrison's work and DC universe. If you don't want to understand, I have nothing to tell.
Anyway I completely agree that fictional debating is more about being political than actually being honest though.
So if I punch reeeaaaaalllyyyy hard or just try reeeaaalllyyy hard to raw power reality warp Battler out of existence, it will totally overcome his specific hax that denies the absolute conceptual truth of reality and everything else because he simply doesn't acknowledge it. Yeah, I can counter that by just punching or warping reeeaaaallllyyyy hard!
I have not said raw power negating all forms of hax. I only say that Hax negating every setting is only NLF. If it is OK, Cosmic Armor Superman is The platonic and metafictional Idea of Heroism itself, The idea can't be negated.
The idea can't be negated? The Red Truth cannot be negated under any means and never has, yet Endless Nine and the Golden Truth "lol GG" it. Again:
So yep... CaS gets destroyed.
So, CAS stomps max wanked Umineko.
Max wanked Umineko is VS Battle's stupid Outerverse wank where each step in the Witches Domain is above infinite-D on its own. I'd never support such cancerous wank.
And, The idea of DC universe and Superhero must outlive you and me.
Oh boy... Another Red Truth to neg.
I've added you to a PM. We'll get in trouble by the mods if we derail further here. This thread is about Aurora, not Battler. Composite Endless stomps the overhyped Aurora.
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