VS
Rules-
Start on opposite sides of the Brooklyn Bridge
Perfect Team Work
Round 1- Morals on- Win by KO
Round 2- Morals off- Win only by death
Fight here.
@lordkaos@ashetdust@gladeusex@batvibe12@pyrofn@geekryan@storm_calling@warlockmage@comic_book_fan@onsipin@jagernutt@weatherwitch21@thunderbolt30@the_living_tribunal_24@lan_fan@payneintheass@trixie@shepardoakenprime@xmangog__beastx@corapvp@diarrhearegatta@aqualion0@martinceld@darthphoenix@emmafrostxmen@thevivas@ginman333@kenshiro3051996@captfalcon725@morpheus_@newecho@koays@nandope@renny@scarlet_wiccan@theinsufferable@evil-incarnate@del_torro@adamtrmm@marvelfan1992@waitomegastorm@weatherwitch21@cruelrain@kasya_carey@lukadoncicmvp@lordofallhumans@princess_fiona@crimsonfoxfire@supkent
@ashetdust: Lol if I just put Exodus people would just argue that it's the Emma & Dust fight all over again
Exodus has already brawled equally with Emma before in telepathy for a bit, and Quicksilver's fast enough to knock out Storm before she can really get her momentum.
Once she's knocked out, he harasses Emma while Exodus deals with her mentally.
@stormcell: no she cannot solo, I don’t even think they can win round 2
Round 1:
Emma can beat Exodus, as she’s been shown to lock his other mutant abilities in the past
With morals on I see Quicksilver losing to storm
Round 2:
Quicksilver solos I guess unless Emma can react
Round 1:
Emma can beat Exodus, as she’s been shown to lock his other mutant abilities in the past
With morals on I see Quicksilver losing to storm
Round 2:
Quicksilver solos I guess unless Emma can react
Quicksilver is no threat here. He's not faster than the speed of thought, hence he had to take Isotope E when fighting Exodus to run faster than thought to avoid getting mindblasted. He's not taking Isotope E here, so either Emma or Storm can deal with him. Emma has speed of thought on her side while Storm can attack with less than a conscious thought.
As for Exodus, he loses to either Storm or Emma.
Edit: I think it was called Isotope E that Quicksilver took when he battled Exodus. If not, it was some kind of power boosting agent.
Here is another instance where Exodus was distracted by a psychic fight against Thena, and She-Hulk used that opportunity to deck him:
Here, Quicksilver had to be boosted by Isotope E to be faster enough to avoid Exodus's mental attacks:
So, again, Quicksilver is not faster than the speed of thought at his natural power levels. He's a non-factor in this fight.
Quicksilver solos
@stormcell:enough with this storm solo nonsense. She is definitely insanely powerful and lethal and people definitely lowball her here on comicvine (mostly because of you) but let's not pretend she is going to solo both QS and Exodus
Scans Spoilered due to broken formatting from the website:Scans and context courtesy of @noone1996
storm being tagged and failing to tag
Scans might not be in order but basically what's happening:
Scan 1: Valkyrie easily tags and one-shot KO's Storm with her hammer. Storm was flying and saw the hit coming. Couldn't dodge or stop her; Scan 2: Storm literally gets tagged by a "mach 1" punch. That's a speed of sound punch. Slower than a bullet; Scan 3: The Wasp manages to tag Ororo with her sting; Scan 4: Colossus lands on a table with a pie on it and not only does it hit her in the face, but Piotr even warns her before it hits her. She still cannot dodge; Scan 5: Cyclops manages to punch her in the face; Scan 6: Storm tries to fly past Shaw who grabs her casually; Scan 7: Ragnarok, Thor's clone, blasts at Storm with lightning and she cannot react to it. She just flinches. Good thing Sue Richards was there; Scan 8: Spider-Man tags a blood-lusted Storm with a punch; Scan 9: Sentinel tags a flying Storm with a backhand; Scan 10: Sentinel grabs her; Scan 11: An insulated robot manages to tag her easily despite her seeing it coming; Scan 12-13: Nightcrawler not only casually dodges her, but he tags her several times. She's mind-controlled and blood-lusted here too; Scan 14: An alternate reality Dr. Doom easily tags Storm; Scan 15: A Doombot throws an object at her that she not only cannot dodge, but which her winds cannot stop; Scan 16: Despite being warned by Professor X, Storm gets tagged and grabbed by Dr. Octopus; Scan 17: The Danger Room's gun tags Storm despite her seeing it coming; Scan 18: A bug alien, which was trading blows with and fighting Thing as an equal, tags Storm easily; Scan 19: A brood alien tags and slams Storm despite her trying to blast it away; Scan 20: Storm gets speedblitzed and stomped; Scan 21: The Red Ghost's apes stomp her. They not only tag her and shoot her out of the sky, but the ape then proceeds to grab and slam her head against Angel's for the KO; Scan 22: Ahab tags and cuts Storm with his bladed staff. She definitely sees it coming and is emitting electricity
Scan 1: Fails to tag Spider-Man; Scan 2: Fails to tag Falcon and he tackles her which knocks her away; Scan 3: Repeatedly fails to tag Kraven the hunter; Scan 4: Not only tagged 5 times from Nightcrawler who is clearly just goofing around, but misses him after shooting lightning; Scan 5-6: Storm misses Sabretooth's unconscious body due to Jack O' Lantern.
Even currently in the Dawn of X Era. And that's already with her "sky lightning" which you people claim to be some sort of FTL undodgeable attack
@martinceld: Not debating for Storm here as i feel like Exodus would deal with her casually.
Even currently in the Dawn of X Era. And that's already with her "sky lightning" which you people claim to be some sort of FTL undodgeable attack
The context before that Storm mentions that they're holding back (issue one kill no man rule) hence why Batroc was able to tag/dodge everyone despite the fact Storm/Iceman having the abilities to dead freeze every villain around them.
@hellionvulcan: holding back has nothing to do with her getting tagged. If she were really as fast as they claim she consistently is, she would have dodged. Also, they have many times stated how storm can modulate the power of her attacks so she would have fired weaker bolts, not slower bolts. Like in Uncanny they said she was only firing "warning" shots at Magneto so they were weaker and that's why he was no-selling them. She would have done the same here in that she would fire weaker bolts. Or like in Marauders issue 4 where she hit the human soldier twice, those were obviously weaker bolts
@stormcell: only Emma can take Exodus
Storm doesn’t have the damage output to KO him, in a recent comic she couldn’t even KO a human with lightning
@lukadoncicmvp: Classic Quicksilver (pre 90's amp and beyond) is slower than lightning. Current version is way beyond that at this point.
@professorrespect: glad to hear it. I always hated how slow he was.
Guess Storm team loses again. Quicksilver KOs Emma, who needs telepathy to fuck with Exodus, so she can't stay in diamond form.
Team Exodus fodderizes. Exodus has the TP not to get absolutely routed long enough to punch Emma in the face, and Quicksilver can keep Storm distracted at-worst.
Exodus blocked attacks from Black Knight, Cyclops, and Storm with a barrier while holding Scarlet Witch, Jean Grey, Quicksilver and Crystal at the same time and subduing them with his telepathy. (Avengers #369)
And Storm is going to solo him...?
Emma can hold Exodus with TP until Storm defeats Quicksilver and then goes to help her.
If they want to use the Emma holding Exodus strategy, then the battle is over in a split second since Storm can do a battlefield-wide attack--while shielding her teammate from the effects of her elemental barrage--to hit Exodus and Pietro at the same time while Emma engages Exodus in psychic combat.
@stormcell: this could work to take out Quicksilver, but I think against Exodus it would take longer since he has shields.
@geekryan: So? I can pull up other stories where Storm displayed much higher power levels than anything Exodus has accomplished. Non-PIS'd Storm would murderstomp Exodus.
We have a feat of Exodus blocking Storm's attack as well as Cyclops and Black Night, while also telekinetically and telepathically subduing Scarlet Witch, Jean Grey, Quicksilver, and Crystal.
So please, do present a feat of Storm attacking or harming Exodus in another situation.
BUT, more importantly.....YOU SAID THE SECRET WORD!!!
CONGRATS!!!!! Let's take a look at some of your greatest hits shall we?
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@stormcell says:
Storm runs mid-tier gauntlet:
Again, the instances you bring up are PIS according to internet rules.
Note how Scott was terrified Storm's hurricane would level NYC, but she calmly explains how it was not an issue since she has total control over her powers. Yup, the Val thing was PIS.
Jean & storm vs Rachel & Polaris
Again, neither Jean or Rachel are getting past Ororo's mental defenses without some very serious PIS.
Storm vs omega levels
If Storm wanted to attack Vulcan internally by taking control of the electrical impulses in his brain, could he contest her for it? Yes. Could he beat her? Not without PIS.
he only reason he's ever been able to survive a fight with her is because she holds back even more against him than she does other characters, and then she gets PIS'd on top of it.
In other words, they'd have to break through Storm's barrier first, and given that Storm is more powerful than either Jean or Exodus, good luck with them doing that without PIS.
It should also be noted that Storm defeated the combined power of Bogan (a Xavier-level psychic entity) PLUS Rachel while she was showing signs of a Phoenix possession. This feat alone would make any instance of Rachel (or any other psi) messing with Storm's mind PIS. As far as seven telepaths getting into her head over the past year or so, that just shows that her mental defenses are being PIS'd.
4) The only way I see Jean beating Ororo would be if she connected with a TK assault. Her TP would be useless against a non-PIS'd Ororo.
The way I see it, any of these characters can beat Ororo just like she can beat any of them. However, what we are looking at here is who would most likely be the victor in a fight without PIS? Who would have the greater advantage in a fight? The answer is Storm. She has a total advantage over the other characters in a one-on-one with any of them.
Anywho, it still doesn't matter. I posted scans of Storm defeating far better telepaths than Rachel. So, any scan with Rachel getting into Ororo's head is PIS. End of story.
I repeat: any instance where Jean or Rachel or any other psi invades Storm's mind against her will is PIS unless she's caught off-guard.
Jean & storm vs magneto
Even under these circumstances PIS was needed to weaken Storm for Magneto to win.
Magneto hasn't redirected a lightning bolt from Storm in decades. It was PIS when he did it anyway back in the day (and what he actually did was create an interference field which deflected the bolt back at her after it bounced off).
This is why Storm was always written as a far gentler fighter when she battled Magneto than when she fought any other foe. It was done to give him a chance at winning. On top of her fighting him with kid gloves, she was also PIS'd in the power department
That said, Classic Magneto would have the advantage against Jean in a one-on-one fight, but would totally lose to a non-PIS'd Ororo. Pitting the two women together against Magneto is a total overkill.
Sienna Blaze has FAR MORE raw power than Magneto, and Storm summoned winds strong enough to redirect Blaze's full power. Magneto cannot stand up to Ororo without some serious PIS writing her down.
Jean vs emma Rachel
That said, a non-PIS'd Emma could take Jean alone telepathically
Rachel jeen jean vs nova exodus candra
To be honest, Jeen draining psionic energy from Galactus (unless it was only ambient psionic energy he was giving off) was total PIS
I still maintain that all Jeen did in that PIS Galactus story was drain the ambient psionic energy given off by everyone on that planet to hit Galactus.
Teen Jeen beating Emma Frost was total PIS.
It only makes Jean look bad when you try and make these claims. Jean is no slouch as a psi, but she's clearly not as powerful as a non-PIS'd versions of the following characters: Emma, Nova, Exodus, Xavier, X-Man, Legion, Stryfe, etc.
Jean Rachel nate vs apocalypse sinister stryfe
Jean tossing him with her TK is pure PIS.
Jean vs Onslaught
The Pink Phoenix/Galactus feat was total PIS. There was nowhere near enough power on that planet to even scratch an itch on Galactus.
One more thing, I don't know why people try to use the Gladiator vs. Jeen fight as meaning anything. Gladiator's power levels are never constant since its based on his confidence, and gets PIS'd all the time when he fights the X-Men.
Given all of this, I'll admit that Jean could beat Gladiator telepathically without PIS if she were given the opportunity to get into his head. He's weak against telepathic foes.
Jean vs Storm
The Jeen punching Galactus instance was pure PIS for a ton of reasons. Galactus was lowballed tremendously there to prop up Jeen. It was really sad.
PIS doesn't count. I brought up scans of Storm beating psis far more powerful than Jean Grey. All you've done is come up with an instance where Storm's mental defenses has been ignored (which is what usually happens when Storm is placed on the same team as Jean Grey).
Bogan combined with Rachel, Emma Frost, all of whom Storm has defeated with her mental defenses. Jean is not winning this fight without some serious PIS against Ororo.
5) Storm getting mind-controlled by Mary was PIS. Jean losing to Mary was her being in-character since she loses most of her psi fights anyway.
Jean grey vs exodus
Storm is immune to lightning depending on who's writing. Since she's been given immunity in some stories, that makes the instances where she's harmed by it PIS.
That said, looking at the Exodus vs. Rachel, Iceman, Rogue, Wolverine, Cannonball, Gambit and Beast fight, I don't think Jean would stand a chance against him even now without PIS.
5) I agree that Emma would not prevail against Xavier, but she should beat Jean in a fair fight if the PISfactor did not come into play to give Jean the win.
So, just like Unlimited #1 PIS'd Storm, the issue you're referring to PIS'd Emma because that is a limit she had long surpassed. Truthfully, I believe this was likely done to Emma to try and justify making Jean an omega mutant while removing the title from Emma who had been one for years before this.
) Jean getting past defenses Xavier could not is laughable given Xavier's high end feats. It's complete PIS unless she was boosted by Cerebro, Cerebra, or the Phoenix Force at that time.
As far as her putting an illusion in Magneto's head, that was PIS given his mental defenses in early years. Again, Magneto has been devalued in the 2000s to prop up Jean.
You have no proof that Emma was fighting a weaker Exodus. Also, Emma has the telepathic feats to take on a non-PISExodus, unlike Jean Grey.
Omega level mutants strongest to weakest
Iceman's defeat of Stranger was pure PIS, by the way
Hickman’s omegas
As far as Jean penetrating minds Xavier could not, it's PIS unless she was being boosted by the PF, Cerebro, Cerebra, or some other external means. Xavier's feats are better than hers.
Iceman vs storm
Iceman isn't going to be stealing control of the moisture in Ororo's body from her without some serious PIS writing Storm down, nor is he going to be able to withstand an attack from Ororo if she targets the electrical impulses in his brain with her control over the subatomic electron particle.
This is comics. Characters are PIS'd all the time for the sake of the story. Storm has been the biggest victim of PISamong the X-Men over the years.
3) Iceman vs. Stranger was pure PIS
1) And again, Iceman beating Stranger was pure PIS for reasons I've already posted.
I still don't think it would make a difference whether or not Iceman has his morals on or off for reasons already presented to debunk that. Iceman would lose against Ororo unless she's being PIS'd.
Also, I'm not sure I buy Thor being pierced by ice. That was probably PIS against his invulnerability. However, I would assert that Bobby could pierce Ororo if she stood there and did nothing while he attempted it.
Moving on, Thor was totally PIS'd in that fight against Bobby.
Also, I don't care about the Thor vs. Iceman fight either. It was pure PIS against Thor. I showed scans of Thor using FAR more power in other fights than he used against Bobby.
You mean high tiers are constantly being PIS'd to prop Iceman up .
Thor was PIS'd BADLY when he fought Bobby, and that's just the way it is regardless of your personal feelings on the subject which you obviously wish to be otherwise.
Also, Bobby impaling Thor with that ice spike was pure PIS
In short, this Iceman vs. Thor fight doesn't do Bobby any good since it's riddled with PIS.
As for Storm vs. Iceman, she's a much bigger threat to him that Thor would be even if Thor was not PIS'd in this fight. Her powerset grants her a unique immunity to most of Bobby's attack plus she has her internal attacks.
Jean vs Apocalypse
I already proved in another thread that Jeen affecting Galactus was also PIS given his durability feats.
It's still canon that Gladiator gets PIS'd when he fights the X-Men.
If you want to try and argue that drew on psionic energy from Galactus and the PF, neither was putting out anywhere near enough energy to hurt Galactus. That much free floating energy would at the minimum destroy a solar system given his feats when he's not PIS'd.
This Jean vs. Gladiator thing is a shining example of the problem I have with the character, and it wasn't even necessary to do this PIS. The writer could've had Jean reasonably clobber Gladiator with a TP attack. Instead, they PIS'd him by scaling him back so that he tied with her in a physical collision.
Jean won't beat him without the Phoenix Force OR him being PIS'd.
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That's over 50 cases of "herp derp PIS"! WOW! World record!
So the only way for Emma and Storm to win is...
Storm holds off Exodus for a few seconds (maybe less) while Emma one shots Quicksilver. Then Emma rushes over to engage Exodus in TP and wins in a long fight
Emma is the mvp
@cruelrain: he can’t outspeed TP
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