Dr. Strange & Dr. Fate Vs. Loki & Circe

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#1 Posted by Die Stupid Zombie (101 posts) - - Show Bio

They have a week preparation time. 
The battle takes place in an open meadow, so that way no can interrupt the fight.
The battle will consist of three rounds. 
Each team are at max potential during each round.
Whichever team loses Round 1 gains an ally for the second round.
Round 3 includes everyone.
 
Round 1: Dr. Strange and Dr. Fate Vs. Loki and Circe
 
Round 2: Dr. Strange and Dr. Fate Vs. Loki and Circe
             Team 1 Ally: Shaman              Team 2 Ally: Felix Faust 
 

The Mystic Hands of Dr Strange
The Mystic Hands of Dr Strange
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Round 3: Dr. Strang e, Dr. Fate, and S
No Caption Provided
haman Vs. Loki, Circe, and Felix Faust
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Circe
Circe
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#2 Posted by Die Stupid Zombie (101 posts) - - Show Bio
No Caption Provided
Idk my pic of Loki vanished so here one is. :)
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#3 Posted by AtPhantom (14434 posts) - - Show Bio

Ima go with team 1.

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#4 Posted by Belladonna (12084 posts) - - Show Bio

Team two.

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#5 Posted by Crom-Cruach (8935 posts) - - Show Bio

At full power? I'd go with the Sorcerer Supreme and the bearer of the Helm of Fate

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#6 Posted by Strafe Prower (13013 posts) - - Show Bio

Good match.Dr. Fate seals the deal for Team 1 though.

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#7 Posted by Son Of Storm (11577 posts) - - Show Bio
Team 1
@Charmix said:
" Team two. "

BLASPHEMY!!!

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#8 Posted by Die Stupid Zombie (101 posts) - - Show Bio
@Strafe Prower: Thanks, I really try to think through who I want to pit against each other. haha But I must agree good match. I myself am kinda leaning towards team 2 though. Still unsure.
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#9 Posted by Strafe Prower (13013 posts) - - Show Bio
@Die Stupid Zombie:
You should ask AtPhantom to explain what Dr. Fate can do at full power.
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#10 Posted by AtPhantom (14434 posts) - - Show Bio

On a normal level, Strange and Fate would absolutely wipe the floor with the other team. They are universal level beasts. Granted they've been taken down a few pegs lately (though Fate is showing signs of recovery, he can already raise recently dead), but I still think they win. I don't know much about Shaman, but Felix? He's maybe worthy to kiss Fate's boots, on a good day.

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#11 Posted by Die Stupid Zombie (101 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom: 
I wasn't intially ging to put Felix Faust, I was going to two put Enchantress, but I decided since Loki and Circe are already God(dess) that it wouldn't be entirely far to pit them against three Gods.
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#12 Posted by Son Of Storm (11577 posts) - - Show Bio
@Die Stupid Zombie said:
" @AtPhantom:  I wasn't intially ging to put Felix Faust, I was going to two put Enchantress, but I decided since Loki and Circe are already God(dess) that it wouldn't be entirely far to pit them against three Gods. "
Not really Doctor. Strange has taken cosmic lvl beings before.
Not to sure about Fate....Phantom?
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#13 Posted by AtPhantom (14434 posts) - - Show Bio
@Die Stupid Zombie: It's cool. Like I said, I don't know much about Shaman, so they might be a match and all. I'm just saying that as far as DC magic goes, he's rather low level.
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#14 Posted by bellach (11 posts) - - Show Bio

This one really is a no brainer. Both Fate and Strange could solo on this one so the two of them together obliterate all comers. Throw in Faust and enchantress, team two will need at least that much power to have a prayer. Remember that Dr Fate basically has the powers of  (or can at least call on the powers of) all the Lords of Order. That means he has the abilities of all the "good" gods from Egyptian, Greek, Roman, and Norse mythology. He also wears tha amulet of Anubis around his neck which allows him to call on some of the powers of the evil gods too.  As far back as the 85 Immortal Dr Fate mini (admittedly more powerful than current but you did say most powerful or full potential) at the end of a battle with a Lord of Chaos the Earth is a complete wasteland (all life destroyed). Fate raises a hand his eye lights up whispers a spell and rebuilds everything as it was (al life on Earth returned as if nothing happened). That's pretty much his power level for most of the SA. the only times he was ever depicted as having power limits from 65 to COIE was when he faced teh Spectre ( so that there could be a reason for Spectre to be more powerful).
 
 
Strange at his most powerful has made Loki look like a tool and is also a world breaker.

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#15 Posted by beatboks1 (10241 posts) - - Show Bio
@bellach said:
" This one really is a no brainer. Both Fate and Strange could solo on this one so the two of them together obliterate all comers. Throw in Faust and enchantress, team two will need at least that much power to have a prayer.
i agree they could both solo in the first battle, but it would take both of them to beat the 4 you mention ( granted Faust wouldn't add much in this mix of company)
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#16 Posted by AtPhantom (14434 posts) - - Show Bio
@bellach said:
" TRemember that Dr Fate basically has the powers of  (or can at least call on the powers of) all the Lords of Order. That means he has the abilities of all the "good" gods from Egyptian, Greek, Roman, and Norse mythology."
This is completely wrong. The Lords of order and chaos have nothing to do with Gods.
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#17 Posted by beatboks1 (10241 posts) - - Show Bio

Sorry but your wrong. The lords of Order and chaos have over the centuries posed as Deities to mortals to gain greater power from their worship. That's been printed multiple times in Dr Fates titles (also in Phantom Stranger stories and other DCU mystics). Also the spells he's used throughout the years have been based on this fact. Spells like "Amon Ra you who are light shine through this servant that your light may ......" the end varied depending on the desired result. This was but one of dozens of spells calling on the powers of the Lords of Order (some spoken some thought). Nabu was the only Lord of order who didn't do this and assumed a mortal form. Other "gods" who were known Lords of Chaos include Anubis, Osiris, Hades, Pluto, Ares.  So in actual fact the "gods" ( at least any who aren't LOO or C)are weaker versions of them.
 
Where you may think this doesn't fit is because of the Greek gods in WW.  However it was established in the mid 90's that when the LOO or Chaos left a guise if there was still faith in it that faith manifested itslef into a mystical geing ( in the same way that, that faith gave greater power to the LOO & C), in hte case of the Greek Gods they created teh Amozons so that they would always have someone to worship them and hense keep them existing.
 
During the 90's Dr Fate (when Kent and Inza were brought back ) it was also established that the almighty reated teh Lords of Order and Chaos so that the constant struggle for balance between them would result in the creation of life throught the universe. So as far as CDU is concerned they are the source ( or at least seed) of creation.

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#18 Posted by bellach (11 posts) - - Show Bio

What Beatboks said, Theres a lot more to back it up but that covers the basics.

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#19 Posted by AtPhantom (14434 posts) - - Show Bio
@beatboks1: Completely wrong. All Gods on Earth come from the God wave, an energy wave which struck Earth millions of years ago. They had nothing to do with Lords of chaos or order.  Whatever the Fate books said, it clashes with the greater DC cosmology. Greater cosmology wins.
 
Also, Calling on Amon Ra for power? Means nothing. You don't think he could pool his magic from elsewhere than just lords of magic? Magicians do it all the time. Hell, Ra has appeared in JSA, and he had nothing to do with Lords of Order.
 
Also, Gods were created millions of years before humans. Ergo there was nothing to worship them then. Therefore the worship theory doesn't hold up.
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#20 Posted by SilverGalford (3422 posts) - - Show Bio

team 1 for the win
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#21 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom said:
" @beatboks1: Completely wrong. All Gods on Earth come from the God wave, an energy wave which struck Earth millions of years ago. They had nothing to do with Lords of chaos or order.  Whatever the Fate books said, it clashes with the greater DC cosmology. Greater cosmology wins.  Also, Calling on Amon Ra for power? Means nothing. You don't think he could pool his magic from elsewhere than just lords of magic? Magicians do it all the time. Hell, Ra has appeared in JSA, and he had nothing to do with Lords of Order.  Also, Gods were created millions of years before humans. Ergo there was nothing to worship them then. Therefore the worship theory doesn't hold up. "
well put
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#22 Posted by bellach (11 posts) - - Show Bio

As I said there are more than just Dr Fate stories to back up this concept. This theme has been held up through the tales and titles of other DCU mystics like Phantom Stranger, Spectre, John Constantine and others ( not to mention non mystics like Wonder Woman). In any case what your referring to is comparing the chicken and the egg. The Lords of Order and Chaos pre exist this and the last universe (therefore well before the source and the "god wave"). The retcon that made their war create life etc basically has the energy expended as a result of their war causing the "source" and therefore the "god wave" The Source of Kirby's fourth world was kept mostly out of coninuity until this retcon. The worship thing is also a chicken and the egg scenario (held up in WW's own reboot as the reason for the amozons existence), they had to existed to get worship first (coutesty in "most" cases because of theLOO/C) and then exist because of it after. This is also the reason why characters like Uncle Sam ( the "spirit" of Amercan freedom) and Sandman exist.
 
If you read more of the "mystic" books of the DCU this whole concept was created to allow contrary belief systems to co-exist within the DCU, all with Judea/christian/mulsim/budist (depicted ambiguiously as all)god sitting  at the top of the power tree.

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#23 Posted by beatboks1 (10241 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom said:
" @beatboks1: Completely wrong. All Gods on Earth come from the God wave, an energy wave which struck Earth millions of years ago. They had nothing to do with Lords of chaos or order.  Whatever the Fate books said, it clashes with the greater DC cosmology. Greater cosmology wins. 
I was going to explain in greater detail but see I've been beaten to it. I thought I was clear that the concept was played out in more then just Dr Fate (believe I mentioned other DCU mystics and WW), though I'll grant I didn't expand to explain that they are the source of the "source". 
 
So your argument is weighing up a concept played out in New God's, Superman and 2 or 3 mini series against a concept played out in over a dozen DCU titles ( maybe mor but tghat's definitely how many I've collected)and calling the one with less print "greater". Considering that your "greater DC cosmology" concept contradicts other printed DCU belief systems and power bases, when the concept I'm referring to allows them and yours to co-exist and hold sway I'd say the concept I've referred to is the "greater cosmology.
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#24 Posted by oceanmaster21 (15395 posts) - - Show Bio

honestly i have to give it to team 2 loki and circe will win after a good battle go team circe:)

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#25 Edited by Tomekeeper (40 posts) - - Show Bio

I thought Classic Loki was portrayed as Classic Strange's equal when they met? Strange won the encounter, barely, against an Astral Projection of Loki and IIRC straight up admitted that he would have been screwed if Loki had shown up in the flesh (although I guess that might just be because Loki's physically tougher) However, team 1 takes it as Dr Fate takes out Circe and Strange and Fate together destroy Loki.

I think that with Faust to back Circe up Round 2 might just go the other way, don't know enough about Faust to say for sure.

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#26 Posted by dami24434 (4589 posts) - - Show Bio

@tomekeeper: Dr strange was still pretty fresh,during that encounter,he was still new to magic

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#27 Posted by Revan- (7959 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1 easy.

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#28 Posted by Helloman (30115 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1 wins.

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#29 Posted by ivan_jimenez86 (1107 posts) - - Show Bio

MISMATCH!

These two mystical doctors possess enough powers to make it as if we asked "WHO?" whether or not we knew anyone from team 2!

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#30 Posted by xMangog__Beastx (4756 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump

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#31 Posted by Evil-Incarnate (7329 posts) - - Show Bio

Mismatch team 1 every time

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#32 Posted by AntitheticalOpinion (266 posts) - - Show Bio

Dr. Fate alone could probably solo to be honest.

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#33 Posted by The_Badman (2725 posts) - - Show Bio

The Doctors stomp. Circe lacks combat feats against other sorcerers and Loki is a tier below everyone here.

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#34 Posted by GodxDarkxOpal (528 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2

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#35 Posted by RampageTheFirst (8002 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1.

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#36 Posted by King-Ragnar (4914 posts) - - Show Bio

Kent and Strange.

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#37 Edited by deactivated-5c522ab96172e (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

A weakened/depowered Strange was shown stalemating Loki already in Avengers(2018)#6 and Kent should be capable of defeating Circe, so Team 1 wins.