Doctor Strange vs The Extinction Team

- Current Strange, Pre AVX, Colossus is Juggernaut

- In Character but serious

- Standard Gear

- Basic Knowledge

- Win by any means except bfr

- Start 50 feet away

Bump

Strange takes this, his hax is on a completely different level. Even while having most of his magical power drained, he fought on par against the Imperator, who can channel the power of a supermassive black hole and who almost killed every single Sorcerer Supreme across dimensions and each Sorcerer Supreme are comparable to the low-level Cosmic Hierarchs.

Bump

Extinction Team

There's literally nothing they can do to harm him. He fodderizes them.

Doctor Strange as long as he isn’t jobbing.

Strange.

@king-ragnar: Magik's soul sword can definitely harm him. Her sword has cut through his spells in the past

Yeah, Magik is a real challenge with her anti-magic soul sword, plus time and space teleportation.

His current incarnation is also a bit unstable. He just had a big win against the Faltine, but he's also been kind of up and down in other ways. Most of this team doesn't matter, but they might provide distraction while Mags, Danger, Emma, and Magik take him on simultaneously at different levels. He does sometimes have trouble in a multi-directional fight, hard to concentrate on everything at once.

Like said before, big one is Magik. If he can overcome her, he has this. However, I'm sure if he could over power her soul sword.

Extinction Team

Starnge

Leaning towards Extinction Team, with Magik as the MVP.

Strange would have to deal with an incredibly powerful telepath, 3 physical powerhouses (Namor, Colossus, Danger), 3 ranged attackers (Magneto, Storm, Cyclops), and wild card/jack of all trades (Hope) all while handling Magik as well. That's way too much.

I'm leaning towards the Extinction Team.

Should we also include the Phoenix in this fight for Hope Summers?

Probably the team.

Wouldn't Hope be the second most important person in this battle for the e-team? She would basically have all the mutant powers on the battlefield.

To answer without the Phoenix,

Colossus will be a problem with his Juggernaut powers. Research has shown that Juggernaut has beaten Doctor Strange before and seeing as Colossus had comparable power to Cain, Strange would likely have as difficult a time as he did with the regular Juggernaut.

Then we have Magik obviously who has beaten Strange in AvX and has beaten Dormmamu. So, Strange won’t be having an easy time there.

Emma Frost is also another huge problem. Yes, many tens to allude to Moondragon, but Moondragon never impressed me to begin with. Her feats have always either been few and unimpressive or composed of assistance from the Mind Gem. Emma is much more skilled at telepathic combat, a lot more cunning, and has been regarded one of the top five telepaths at one point. Also, according to Emma Frost, wielding magic is using your mind to wield primal forces, indicating Emma knows exactly how to stop a magic user.

Magneto already has the rep, so I doubt I’d need to go in-depth on him.

Cyclops, while not useful on the battle itself, is a great strategist and can direct as needed.

Danger could be useful as a distraction, bringing in her personal mini danger room.

As for Storm, while I can’t go into the goddess form since we don’t know the extent of its abilities, Storm could technically provide distraction where necessary.

And as stated before, Hope Summers is a jack of all trades. So, any mutant that goes down can be replaced by Hope. And she has mimicked multiple mutants before without strain, so she is one of the most useful for this battle outside of the magic users.

@pyrofn: Research has shown that Juggernaut has beaten Doctor Strangebefore and seeing as Colossus had comparable power to Cain, Strange would likely have as difficult a time as he did with the regular Juggernaut.

Not under normals circumstances, no. The only ones I remember was when Juggernaut briefly had the capacity to use magic/spells and when Strange was imprisoned inside Cyttorak's Crimson Cosmos without his normal access to magic.

Then we have Magik obviously who has beaten Strange in AvX and has beaten Dormmamu. So, Strange won’t be having an easy time there.

A Non-Sorcerer Supreme Strange, while inside the Limbo and even completely off-panel. Illyana has also only beaten a dying/weakened Dormammu, Strange at least has gone against a fully-powered one.

Anyway, Extinction Team takes it for now.

For now, at least. Strange has recently leved up and it seems that Waid is having him face Galactus in the next issue, who knows what might happen or how powerful the character truly became then?

Dormammu was weakened because Limbo ( which Magik can completely control and is actually a part of her) was destroying the Dark Dimension. Magik pulled off what it took several other Hell Lords to do when they merged their realms in order to weaken Dormammu IIRC. This is more a feat for Magik than a way to use the battle to lowball her achievement.

If this was morals off Magik could just let Limbo infest and take over the battlefield giving her total control over it. Technically she could just merge Limbo with any planet, dimension, area, etc.. and just absorb it in her.

@chiq said:

That's actually a completely different achievement though. The battle/victory itself against Dormammu and the circumstances which were pivotal for the event to unfold are two separated things...The latter is extremely impressive, while the former is not.

Why wouldn't having total control over an entire dimension to the point that she can actually absorb everything not be impressive? Have any other Hell Lords exhibited that kind of control? Can their Hell realms individually destroy the Dark Dimension?

@chiq said:

That's not what I meant. My point is that defeating Dormammu given his weakened state during that storyline isn't impressive, but her control over Limbo during those issues is a complete story and feat altogether.

But it's her total control of Limbo that lead to his defeat. Limbo just isn't a location for Magik it's a weapon. She's always dragged opponents there, and on a couple of occasions spat out Limbo on earth so she could use it as her battlefield.

@chiq said:

Yes, but:

1- The Dark Dimension is one of the Splinter-Realms which are directly connected into the Limbo, which obviously makes it easier for all to happen.

2- That's not going to have the same effect on every opponent because not every being drags most of their power straight out from a dimension or a specific location.

The circumstances leading to a victory over Dormammu can't be applied to every character, but doesn't make it less impressive that she has control over an entire reality like Limbo and can manipulate at will. That's what I, again, meant. Magik, in the end, still defeated Dormammu in a battle only after certain circumstances allowed her to directly attack his power-source(Even if unknowingly) and weaken him...It's not the same as overpowering a fully-powered Dread One, which is another thing I've been saying.

I disagree with point 1. The only thing that's stopping her from brining Limbo into every battle is morals. Even Belasco (who is weaker than her) easily sucked in Earth to Limbo. SS Strange couldn't stop it from happening. Limbo was also able to infect and destroy practically every timeline during Inferno. Limbo is an ominiversal nexus which means it's connected to practically everything.

I agree with point 2.

@chiq: I disagree with point 1. The only thing that's stopping her from brining Limbo into every battle is morals. Even Belasco (who is weaker than her) easily sucked in Earth to Limbo. SS Strange couldn't stop it from happening. Limbo was also able to infect and destroy practically every timeline during Inferno. Limbo is an ominiversal nexus which means it's connected to practically everything.

I'm not saying she can't suck other dimensions into Limbo, I'm saying the Dark Dimension's status as one of the Splinter-Realms makes it easier for that happen.

@alphaelli: To be fair, Magik's power comes from Limbo and Limbo was in just much of a sorry state as the Dark Dimension was. Also, Dormammu had taken over Limbo if I recall. So the fact that her influence over Limbo was overpowering his own, which in turn was overpowering his influence over the Dark Dimension; is pretty telling IMO.

@alphaelli: I honestly can't see the difference in effort it requires Magik sending a part of Limbo to Earth or the Dark dimension. Anyway, we've derailed this thread long enough. Sorry for that.

@mylittlefascist said:

Yes, but you can't compare the cases simply because of that. The effects on Dormammu, for example, were actually severe enough to be killing him unlike with Illyana. Also, Doctor Strange already makes pretty clear during his flashback dialogue with Magik in the seventh issue that Dormammu could've been exiled from the Dark Dimension by a motive they don't know(So, unrelated to Magik) and it means that Magik wasn't overpowering his influence over the DD because there was most likely none of it...Hence why the character came directly after the Limbo to stop the convergence. All you can say is that her control over Limbo is better than his, which doesn't tell much when is her dimension and part of her, not some neutral territory.

@alphaelli:

were actually severe enough to be killing him unlike with Illyana.

Actually, I could have sworn it was said that her power was killing her as well, but it's been a while.

@mylittlefascist said:

Pretty sure her powers until that moment were just broken like Cyclops' optic blats, not something that would cease their existence completely like was with Dormammu per his own words. Plus, even if was, there's always the matter of at what rate it was actually killing them. Dormammu did seem pretty desperate to deal with the whole Limbo-DD thing, for instance.

@alphaelli: Meh... I'm just upset you were here derailing a thread without me, instead of working on you know what. =P

@alphaelli: 1) You mean this one? Sorry, on comicvine mobile. Only have non-clickable links.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18519/606370-doc1.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18519/606369-doc2.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18519/606368-doc3.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18519/638453-strange.jpg

Context is always welcome in my book.

2) With the case in mind of Strange falling for the Limbo trick once, do you believe that Strange will be on guard against magic pulling Limbo to the battlefield? Given how often Magik does resort to Limbo for much more difficult opponents, it probably won’t be so far-fetched to believe that she would eventually resort to that tactic.

And if her bringing Limbo to the Dark Dimension was what contributed to her victory against Dormmamu, would it not mean that same tactic could work every time against Dormmamu? If Dormmamu were so powerful, should he not have been capable of denying her?

Magik hold shim off. Magneto or Cyttorak end his life.

Stalemate.

@pyrofn:1) You mean this one? Sorry, on comicvine mobile. Only have non-clickable links.

Yes, it's from DSSS#44 and Cyttorak's Crimson Cosmos was affecting both Strange's body and some incantations during that instance:

Gallery

2) With the case in mind of Strange falling for the Limbo trick once, do you believe that Strange will be on guard against magic pulling Limbo to the battlefield? Given how often Magik does resort to Limbo for much more difficult opponents, it probably won’t be so far-fetched to believe that she would eventually resort to that tactic.

Of course, like, Strange isn't dumb to fall for the same tricks every time and when having the knowledge he already does about Illyana. He has already dealt with similar situations in the past when at full-strength and now is only more powerful after the training with Eoffren.

And if her bringing Limbo to the Dark Dimension was what contributed to her victory against Dormmamu, would it not mean that same tactic could work every time against Dormmamu? If Dormmamu were so powerful, should he not have been capable of denying her?

Because as I already said above, Doctor Strange already implied during the flashback dialogue with Magik in Uncanny X-Men(2013)#7 that Dormammu could've been exiled from the Dark Dimension since the beginning, which is a reason of why couldn't stop the converge and came after the Limbo itself. We also don't know many of the circumstances surrounding the character before the story-arc, like...For how long was that going on to have those effects on Dormammu? Plus, Dormammu already found easier ways to supply his strength after that storyline like souls as shown in Unbeatable Squirrel Girl II#26. In the end though, assuming Dormammu and T. Hothrun are indeed the same person or something like that, he can simply turn off her spells these days as did with Strange given his apparently control over all magic.

Namor, Colossus and Danger are fodder. Strange already put Emma to sleep with one word. Scott and Erik don't add anything, neither do Storm or Hope. Besides Magik (who isn't that much of a threat anyway), everyone else is pretty much fodder.

One on one, they would be fodder. But a team of 9 X-Men, who have great teamwork and a versatile powerset, are far from fodder if they're coming at him all at once. That is way too much for him to deal with alone when being attacked in many different ways and on all fronts.