• 67 results
  • 1
  • 2
Avatar image for immoralimmortal
#1 Posted by immoralimmortal (1150 posts) - - Show Bio

random encounter, who wins?

Avatar image for ckarma
#2 Posted by cKarma (142 posts) - - Show Bio

Bardock blitzes and one shots

Avatar image for rabii99
#3 Posted by Rabii99 (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

Bardock holds a massive advantage in AP/DC being planet/multi-planet level while Kakashi is not even mountain level, Kamui Shuriken could BFR small mountains but that's not destroying them. However, Kakashi's speed feats are much better and tends to go for Kamui snipes in-character. Bardock gets his head sniped.

Avatar image for precrisisbardock
#4 Posted by PreCrisisBardock (8909 posts) - - Show Bio

@rabii99: Kakashi couldn’t even Kamui snipe pain, he gets blitzed he wouldn’t be able to perceive bardock

Avatar image for rabii99
#5 Posted by Rabii99 (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

@precrisisbardock: "DMS Kakashi" is not the one that fought pain. Speed feats for Bardock?

Avatar image for gaoron
#6 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

Unless this is TB Bardock Kakashi wins.

Avatar image for yamiyodare
#7 Posted by Yamiyodare (1417 posts) - - Show Bio

Bardock wins.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#8 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio
Avatar image for jimcrim
#9 Posted by jimcrim (235 posts) - - Show Bio
Avatar image for weebbicboi
#10 Posted by weebbicboi (1455 posts) - - Show Bio

Kakashi could win this actually

Make it speed equalized and he beats any DB character (who doesn't have existence erasure) in 1v1 lmao /s

Avatar image for precrisisbardock
#11 Posted by PreCrisisBardock (8909 posts) - - Show Bio

@rabii99: @xyzen: Let’s pretend like Kakashi kamui snipes on site according to you guys.

Bardock still blitzes

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#12 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@precrisisbardock: read the Kaguya fight, he did it multiple times. DB speed is overrated Bardock isn't blitzing anything.

Avatar image for rabii99
#13 Edited by Rabii99 (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

@precrisisbardock: Let's pretend that DMS Kakashi tends to job and that all of his offensive abilities aren't related to Kamui snipes.

Loading Video...
Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#14 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@rabii99: that's what I'm saying, every attack he did was a "Kamui snipe" but let's low-ball because of the pain fight 300 chapters ago.

Avatar image for gaoron
#15 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: Eh if anything it's the Naruto verse speed that is overrated on this site but yeah DMS wins against base Bardock due to hax, SSJ Bardock is debatable but Kakashi probably loses and TB Bardock solos the verse.

Avatar image for precrisisbardock
#16 Posted by PreCrisisBardock (8909 posts) - - Show Bio

@rabii99: @xyzen: He used a Kamui Raikiri which is jobbing in itself because hitting someone < looking at someone and sniping them to another dimension.

Not to mention Kaguya wasn’t even seriously harmed by it.

Prove again how Kakashi doesn’t get blitzed? Bardock is 10x chars who easily evade relativistic attacks.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#17 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: every verse is overrated in some way, DB is vastly overrated tho. Naruto gets overrated in DC like people saying he can bust a moon but he's underrated in speed.

Avatar image for rabii99
#18 Posted by Rabii99 (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: Yeah, I don't really understand the comparison between DMS six paths chakra Kakashi and pain arc Kakashi.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#19 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@precrisisbardock: that's not the only Kamui snipe he did.... I don't quite feel like debating with someone who doesn't know the characters full moveset.sorry.

Avatar image for gaoron
#20 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: DB gets both lowballed and highballed a lot, it's 50/50 tbh. And no, Naruto speed is nowhere close to underrated, he gets wanked to LS/FTL speeds on CV by plenty of users.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#21 Edited by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: Naruto has 3 LS feats, and people ignore them. That's lowballed not wanked.

Dragonball is not 50/50 the wank and bias for that series reached such levels it was banned. It is the most overrated verse of all time. Except maybe OPM. And watch I'll get flamed for saying that because of how toxic the verse is.

Avatar image for rabii99
#22 Posted by Rabii99 (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: C'mon dude, you should know that teleporting Kaguya to another dimension and kamui sniping her are both useless.

Avatar image for gaoron
#23 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: Naruto has 3 LS feats, and people ignore them. That's lowballed not wanked.

Naruto has 0 light speed feats, the only debatable one is light fang and Naruto dodged it only in the anime. You just proved my point.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#24 Edited by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: No you proved my point, it's lowballed not wanked. The Author went out of his way to say it was LS all 3 times yet you know better right?

Avatar image for gaoron
#25 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: No you proved my point, it's lowballed not wanked. The Author went out of his way to say it was LS all 3 times yet you know better right?

We must be reading different mangas then. Kishi never said Naruto is LS, databooks that are full of hyperboles said light fang is LS and Naruto dodged in anime only scene, that's it. If you talk about "beams of light", they are not LS, Goku before DBZ even started dodged Piccolo's "beams of light" too.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#26 Edited by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: You can clearly tell the difference between a hyperbole and Kishimoto saying it's a beam of light. Kishimoto isn't the author of DB so not comparable.

Like I said you've proven my point, you're down playing for no other reason than to downplay.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#27 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

And now I'm done here I don't much care for DB debates. Like I said the verse is vastly overrated.

Avatar image for gaoron
#28 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: You can clearly tell the difference between a hyperbole and Kishimoto saying it's a beam of light. Kishimoto isn't the author of DB so not comparable.

Like I said you've proven my point, you're down playing for no other reason than to downplay.

So let me get this straight:

light beam in Naruto = light speed

light beam in DB = hyperbole

Ok buddy lmao

Avatar image for ultimatesage
#29 Posted by UltimateSage (3196 posts) - - Show Bio

8000+ posts and you can't tell the difference between a hyperbole and a fact....?that's sad...lmao

Online
Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#30 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: No one claimed that. You're the one who doesn't understand the difference between hyperbole and a statement.

Like I said I'm done here please don't tag me back to this thread, DB is the bottom of the barrel when it comes to Shonnen debates.

Avatar image for gaoron
#31 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

No one claimed that.

You didn't have to, the moment you called DB speed overrated and Naruto speed lowballed while both have the same "beams of light" speed feats was enough.

You're the one who doesn't understand the difference between hyperbole and a statement.

Readed enough Naruto databooks entries to know the difference, thank you.

Like I said I'm done here please don't tag me back to this thread,

Sure

DB is the bottom of the barrel when it comes to Shonnen debates.

Your double standards and fanboyism in this thread show otherwise.

Naruto is the bottom of the barrel when it comes to Shonnen debates.

Perfect.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#32 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: you've proven every single one of my points, I have nothing left to do.

Dragonball is very inconsistent that's why the "beam of light" argument doesn't work, one second Goku is FTL and the next he's running at speeds well below that on snake way.

Naruto on the other hand built up, you have Guy bending space which is nearly LS, then you have Naruto reacting to and moving out of the way of 3 light attacks. Which shows a growth.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#33 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: And considering you're upset over my subjective opinion on DB being bad, I'd say you're the only one who's being a fanboy here. You can debate one side without getting butthurt over someone else not liking a series.

Avatar image for gaoron
#34 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: you've proven every single one of my points, I have nothing left to do.

Since you can't prove any of your claims someone has to, no need to tkank me really.

Dragonball is very inconsistent that's why the "beam of light" argument doesn't work, one second Goku is FTL and the next he's running at speeds well below that on snake way.

Sakura reacting and tagging Kaguya, Sasuke failing to dash couple meters in time it takes Sakura to yell multiple words, Boruto keeping up with Momoshiki, Gaara reacting and tagging Momoshiki, Naruto travel speed being reacted by some fodder on train, Himawari and Kawaki reacting to those "beams of light".

Don't make me laugh, since Naruto and Sasuke got their sage power ups Naruto become an inconsistent mess that wishes to have as consistent power ladder as DBZ.

Naruto on the other hand built up, you have Guy bending space which is nearly LS,

Yes, the fastest character in the verse. Anyone has to yet replicate Guy's bending space feat.

then you have Naruto reacting to and moving out of the way of 3 light attacks. Which shows a growth.

One is an anime only feat, next 2 are obvious hyperboles to which Himawari and Kawaki can react to. Meanwhile saiyan saga mid tiers dodge attacks that travel to Moon on a single panel.

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: And considering you're upset over my subjective opinion on DB being bad, I'd say you're the only one who's being a fanboy here. You can debate one side without getting butthurt over someone else not liking a series.

Noone is upset, just pointing out your blatant fanboyism and hypocrisy. Compared to you I can actually put aside my feelings towards the series and debate without bias. You should try it.

Avatar image for helloman
#35 Posted by Helloman (30115 posts) - - Show Bio

Stalemate.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#36 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: you're clearly not putting your feelings aside, I mean look at you. Ignoring context now. I'll let you be before you blow a gasket, that is what the DB fanbase is known for.

You lost me at Sakura being anywhere close to Kaguya... It's like you didn't read the Manga.

Avatar image for gaoron
#37 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: So no rebuttal? Got it.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#38 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: I've clearly stated multiple times I have no intentions debating this, you only made it worse by getting angry for no reason, then you ignored the context of a couple scenes and tried to use it as an anti feat.

So why would I argue here? You're not even arguing why Bardock would win you're arguing why DB isn't trash which is a subjective matter not something you can disprove I just don't like it.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#39 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: I'll tell you what, since this is all off topic and pointless. Lay down why you think Bardock wins and I'll counter.

Avatar image for gaoron
#40 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: I've clearly stated multiple times I have no intentions debating this,

Then why are you still here? Just concede and move on. You even told me to not tag you, which I did, only for you to engage me again lol

you only made it worse by getting angry for no reason

When did I got angry? Don't flatter yourself like that. If anything it's you who are salty here :/

, then you ignored the context of a couple scenes and tried to use it as an anti feat.

There is no context. Those are just low showings and inconsistencies that every series have, Naruto is no exception especially after sage power ups which broke entire power structure in the series.

So why would I argue here?

Because you clearly want to prove how Naruto is more consistent than DB in speed when it's completely opposite?

You're not even arguing why Bardock would win

Maybe it's because I already said base Bardock loses? I don't know...

you're arguing why DB isn't trash which is a subjective matter not something you can disprove I just don't like it.

Wut? No, I don't care about your taste. We're arguing about speed of characters not quality of the shows. If you want to talk about which series is better and all that go to different board, here are battle boards where you argue which character is stronger/faster/more powerfull etc.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#41 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: Post #39.

And that wasn't a debate between these two characters it was over DB being overrated which it is. Now explain why Bardock wins and we can debate this

Avatar image for gaoron
#42 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen said:

@gaoron: Post #39.

And that wasn't a debate between these two characters it was over DB being overrated which it is.

Yes, your argument was that DB is overrated because it's inconsistent. I proved Naruto is just as inconsistent if not more and you have yet to refute that.

Now explain why Bardock wins and we can debate this

That was my first comment in this thread:

Unless this is TB Bardock Kakashi wins.

TB Bardock blitzes and one shots with a punch that erased part of history of a timeline, travels back in time to kill Kakashi as a baby or straight up stomps with SSB tier stats.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#43 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron:

1.) If this is TB Bardock I concede.

2.) I did refute it, everything you posted has context you ignored or was something that happens on all anime even DB ( talking during an action scene)

3.) I agree Kakashi loses bad if this is anything other than base Bardock.

Avatar image for gaoron
#44 Edited by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: What's the context for Gaara or Boruto reacting and tagging Momoshiki who is Naruto level in speed? What's the context for Kawaki reacting and blocking "beams of light"? What's the context for Naruto running not being completely FTE to fodders? What's the context for Sakura reacting to Kaguya attack? I could go on...

You know what has context? Goku's snake way travel. First we know with Roshi example that characters travel speed is lower than their combat. Second we know for a fact Goku was exhausted as hell after the travel which suggests he slowed down after a while so it's unknown what was his speed when fully healthy.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#45 Edited by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron:

Neither Gaara of Boruto did anything to Momoshiki, Boruto used a move he couldn't see that's it. Gaara had a split second showing which ended and he for destroyed (this happens in DB all the time characters like krillin doing well against people like Goku)

Momoshiki isn't Naruto level in speed, Naruto has half his power drained before that fight. He was at 50% or less.

Sakura reacted to a wild attack it wasn't like she reacted to Ash bone or Kaguya's blitz.

Kawaki is PIS it's the only one that doesn't have context nor does it make sense.

I'll concede my snake way point but, it does work in my favor, Naruto took a direct hit from a large explosion and had half his power drained before fighting Momoshiki so saying Momoshiki is Naruto level in speed isn't correct.

What Fodder has Naruto not been FTE too?

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#46 Edited by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: and again, if this is TB Bardock I don't have an argument I was thinking the Bardock who got worked by Frezia.

Avatar image for gaoron
#47 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen:

I'm talking about purely speed here not damage output, both Gaara and Boruto reacted and tagged Momoshiki. So either both Gaara and Boruto have Naruto level speed (LS as you claimed) or Momoshiki and Naruto are not LS. And unless you are talking about DBS where Goku jobs and holds back nearly every fight Goku was always FTE to Kurilin, be it 23rd Budokai, Saiyan Saga or Namek. Can give you scans if you want them.

Proof it effected his speed? Chakra reserves don't nerf your speed to a point you are Gaara/Boruto level. Sasuke has way lower reserves than even 50% Naruto and he's still comparably fast.

True, but Naruto couldn't move fast enough to save Sakura from them meaning those wild attacks are still in Naruto speed tier and those Sakura would be aswell. If you are debating for LS Naruto then Sakura should be atleast 1/10 of that based on that showing.

So you agree Kawaki blocking "beam of light" is an inconsistency, yet still argue that those same "beam of light" is LS? If you are willing to accept such huge inconsistencies what exacly stops DB beams of light from being LS? Especially when Piccolo blast travelled to the Moon in couple seconds at best.

Even if we assume Naruto was somewhat slower in that fight (which doesn't have any clear proof) Sasuke was still there and still had problems with Momoshiki. And Sasuke should be in Naruto's speed range, right?

In Boruto, some fodder was escaping in a train, Naruto run to get him but that fodder still was able to tell he's being chased by him. Would post a video but I'm on phone.

All in all I don't see how DB speed is inconsistent or "overrated" compared to Naruto. They have similar minor inconsistencies and comparable high end speed feats that range around relativistic (talking purely saiyan saga here).

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#48 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron: The only thing he tagged him with was the vanishing Rasengan, and Gaara had him with AOE sand then he for destroyed.

Sasuke was also weaker transportation to different relms makes him weak and he transported a lot of people.

I agree with the last part I guess. Both have PIS moments

Avatar image for gaoron
#49 Posted by Gaoron (8965 posts) - - Show Bio

@xyzen: Boruto kept up with Momoshiki in h2h too for a while, it wasn't just a vanishing rasengan. Gaara still reacted and catched blitzing Momoshiki.

I know they were weaker, I just don't think their speed was effected all that much by it

Glad, we finally figured that out.

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc746539ff3b
#50 Posted by deactivated-5cc746539ff3b (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

@gaoron:

1.) I think that was anime only, I could be wrong. But like I the new author has weird ways of doing things example: Kawaki

2.) Well chakra does increase speed and both had been drained.