DIO Vs. Starkiller

DIO Sama

Starkiller

Versions

• DIO as of Stardust Crusaders after drinking Josephs's blood.
• Starkiller as of The Force Unleashed 2.

Rules

• Fight to the Death.
• No BFR.
• Combatants start 10 meters from each other.

Can the mightiest bloodsucker of them all beat the secret apprentice?

Dio stomps.....

Dio smashes him into bloody paste with millions of punches after he stops time, and then laughs at the fodder.

Dio can't harm him, he caps at like flooe level to (at best) small building level. Time Stop doesn't help given that he has no substantial ways to harm SK.

Firstly, even with lowball DIO is a 10 toner in Part 1, The World is at least multi block level and can be scaled to small town by Jolyn meteor feat. All of this doesn't even matter cause SK is a glass canon and all his durability feats comes from Force aug, which is useless in stopped time.

Secondly, even floor level DIO murks him with hax, he can crush his heart with phasing, freeze to negate durability or even mind control him. stingy eyes will also split him to pieces.

Lastly, DIO is vastly faster and can turn him into a plie of meat in 10 second of stopped time with FTL punches.

OT: Dio stomps everytime.

@t-undertaker: ftl punches? part 7 Dio was comparable to Jhonny in speed and the latter is barely a bullet timer, even in Part 3 the whole LS/FTL thing doesn't hold up (part 3 and 7 the world are the same) there are so many anti-feats in Jojo for the ftl meta that it's not even funny.

Bump

I agree.

This is true too however.

I shouldn't debate on my own thread but,

Why would an alternative timeline have the same World as Dio part 3? They are not even from the same user. Please post the anti feats you are addressing so I could discuss them. cause for now characters like Polnareff has consistent FTL feats for other characters to scale of them. he easily perceived explicitly stated light speed character (Hanged man), dodged him, and has tagged him twice. The only reason he couldn't kill him sooner was that he didn't know where he was coming from.

Note in both Anime and Manga versions, He reacts to it just before he reaches the coin( OVA version as well). even the first time he tagged him he swung after he started moving.

Couple that with him deflecting sunbeams stated to be LS, and there is no denying his speed.

Still, I am not even addressing other FTL feats JOJO has like Joseph and Caesar reacting to the Red Stone's laser at point-blank range, Kars reacting to a UV ray at point-blank range, Jotaro having an FTL statement, RHCP moving at light speed.

Chariot blitzed Hangman, an amped version fought evenly with SP, SP combat speed was ~<Za Warudo. if you want to discuss this further, give me a dm cause I don't want to debate on my own thread.

If Dio has FTL or even LS feats, he's ridiculously faster than SK, nor does SK have any TP resistance feats to suggest TP wouldn't work on him, provided Dio has significant TP feats of his own. To my knowledge, Starkiller has never even had someone attempt to mentally manipulate him.

Augmentation is also something that Force users have to actively call upon, with the passive application being fairly minimal, by all accounts.

Force users are also interesting when it comes to durability. They're not glass cannons, but without calling upon barriers or Force defences, their natural or even augmented durability is usually not enough to compete with, say, a high-tier from a superhero franchise. Significant enough piercing force, such as from a knife or sword, can also kill them, hence why Force users use lightsabers so much.

Dio never showed the ability to phase his stand through anything. Only Jotaro did, and not even in battle.

@eredin12: I agree SK wins and tbh I don't think Dio's Stand is even building level. His best feat is matching Star Platinum, who couldn't break a tractor in 2 seconds. I don't think his punches are more powerful than RPG's.

Lawl, how durable do you think legends force users are? Palpatine, when he was way below this version of SK, withstood a TK wave that shook stars, that's planetary durability.

cant sk destroy planets?

@the_metabee: No. Not even close. No Force user (outside of the Ones, Abeloth and the other deities like the Bedlam Spirits) can destroy a planet. Drain? Yes. Raze a planet's surface? Yes. Destroy a planet itself? No. In both cases, these were acts well beyond Starkiller's level.

@somedud: Lawl, how durable do you think legends force users are? Palpatine, when he was way below this version of SK, withstood a TK wave that shook stars, that's planetary durability.

I hope you're not referring to the Plagueis passage.

Dio stomps

For clarification: no, Starkiller is not fighting the hyperdrive engines. He's fighting the sublight engines. Starships have to build up to a sufficient speed to jump to Hyperspace (a separate dimension), whereas here it was stated to be stationary:

"There was a stocky ship hanging just outside the air lock, obviously waiting to scoop them up and take them elsewhere."

The ship doesn't actually start trying to move until after SK has dealt with the spider droid:

Already straining under the droid’s weight, the floor sagged and gave way. The droid’s lasers switched off, entirely too late. The sharp tips of its eight legs scrabbled for purchase, leaving deep scratches in the floor, which only gave way further. With a grinding of metal, the droid dropped out of sight and crashed through the levels below, one after the other. Almost before it had vanished from sight, Starkiller was moving. The external door was shut, but he forced it open and braved the renewed storm of air to see outside. Juno and her captor were no longer visible. The stocky ship’s trio of engines was firing, pulling it away from the frigate. Starkiller reached out to catch it, too late. The craft barely wobbled as it receded into the distance, and vanished into hyperspace.

SK was essentially pulling a stationary ship in the novel, which is considered to be more "grounded" than the Wii.

As for pulling it back, before hyperspace can be achieved, the nav computer needs to be programmed, which can take a couple of minutes, sometimes longer, to do. So whilst Boba landed on the ship, put Juno in the cargo hold, and then climbed to the front to start programming it whilst activating the sublight engines, SK had begun to grab the ship and yank at it.

So even if we use the Wii version, SK was slowly pulling a vastly sub-LS ship back towards the hangar that it had just left and didn't have time to build up speed from, during which Boba was more focused on plotting the nav com.

Starkiller cannot overpower Dio's regen. Not to mention, he has no counters for time being stopped.

Gallery

Weaker characters can do this. Nothing stops Dio from stopping time, and turning Starkiller into grinded meat.

This is just not how AP/DC works. If you have the AP then you surely have the destructive capacity to much you're own AP. It's just like saying tats has multi-continental DC but planetary AP. AP=DC, if he doesn't have the DC then he also doesn't have the AP.

His durability feats mainly come from his Force defenses as is the case for most Force users. Force augmentation only really increases a Force user's ability to tolerate pain and keep their physical systems functioning after taking what would normally be a fatal amount of damage, their baseline durability remains otherwise unaffected for the most part. Without their defenses, Force user's are indeed glass cannons compared to most in their tier.

Starkiller should logically be capable of powering his Force defenses with all the energy that he puts into his other abilities such as lightning or telekinesis but even going solely by feats a Starkiller who had utilized a great deal of his energy reserves beforehand was still able to shield himself from the multi-kilometer explosion he himself caused in order to disintegrate the Salvation as can be seen here:

I'd be interested in seeing the Jolyn feat myself, I've seen a bit of JoJo but don't tend to debate for it. :P

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To be fair, Force shields have been shown to keep out extraneous energy inputs such as high and low temperatures with Starkiller notably shielding himself from temperatures found in the outer layers of a star:

"He needed to maintain the Force shield against the sort of heat he might find in the outer layers of a star. He also had to keep in mind the target ahead - a target he couldn't see through the plasma, but had to hit square-on" - The Force Unleashed II.

I doubt he'd be capable of mind control considering Palpatine's own attempts were not sufficient.

You'd have to go into more detail with Dio's phasing and "Stingy Eye" abilities.

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Could I see the FTL feats for Dio you're referencing? Probably haven't gotten far enough along in the anime but not familiar with them myself. Also, how much faster than light is Dio exactly in your estimation?

Intriguing that it's labelled a "debunk" when he failed to address the lack of logic in his own arguments that I merely pointed out.

The novel stipulates that the ship is stationary, ergo he was not fighting the engines. As for "jumping to hyperspace", this was not achieved until after the nav com was plotted and fed into the astrogation system, which in turn can take several seconds to do. Once that was achieved, the Slave I then had a second or two during which to accelerate, and then jump to Hyperspace, both of which occurred only after SK's hold was broken.

So no, there's no "contradiction" here, nor is there a "debunk". SK is tugging at a stationary (novel) or vastly sub-LS moving ship (Wii), or not at all (every other depiction). In all of these cases, Slave I is not moving anywhere close to the speed of light, and we've already witnessed how quickly Slave I can build up speed to Hyperspace (around two seconds):

So when SK is pulling at it, it's in this stage:

Hm, quite a difference in speed, isn't there? It's almost as though SK is grabbing a ship that's leaving a hangar, rather than one in mid-flight.

Curious. You'd think someone who relies on out of context game gifs would actually check the games themselves to make sure that he's not being dishonest, but what do I know?

And for further reference:

Grip is broken:

Ship escapes:

Its simple. IF he has never shown such levels of destruction (DC) then he's DC isn't on that level, and we know that DC=AP. So If he's DC isn't on that level then he's AP isn't as well. There is no reason for you to bring Naruto here, a verse that can barely be scaled above continental.

Ship was stationary before they tried to escape lol, ofc anyone with logic knows that we are talking about part after they tried to escape, after it left hangar, when it was not so much stationary then

Oh good, so you mean when it's moving at this visibly not LS velocity? Let's play "spot the difference".

Clearly moving then stopping to begin going into hyperspace like the previous gifs, isn't it? Almost as though it's using those magical devices called "sublight engines".

I am afraid not, we see him pulling it back, it moves back and instantly milisecond after his hold was broken due to distraction it instantly jumps into hyperspace:

Except it wasn't a millisecond, which you would know if you'd actually played the game. It was around two seconds, the time it took Slave I to jump to hyperspace in the gif I posted above:

Almost as though the ship moves forward to move away from other objects, build up momentum, then jumps, and SK was simply stopping the first bit to gain initial speed to jump-start the process.

And no, the game does not take priority, since the creator has said multiple times that it's exaggerated and not to be taken as a literal demonstration of Force user's capabilities.

Novel never mentions any of this happening, in both it starts moving at FTL speed after he is down, and is gone by time he gets up, game also came after novel and takes priority now due to Legends not having any hierarchy any more

Have you actually read the book, or is this your usual technique of cherry-picking?

"There was a stocky ship hanging just outside the air lock, obviously waiting to scoop them up and take them elsewhere."

Annnnd two pages later, after he's dispatched the droid:

Already straining under the droid’s weight, the floor sagged and gave way. The droid’s lasers switched off, entirely too late. The sharp tips of its eight legs scrabbled for purchase, leaving deep scratches in the floor, which only gave way further. With a grinding of metal, the droid dropped out of sight and crashed through the levels below, one after the other. Almost before it had vanished from sight, Starkiller was moving. The external door was shut, but he forced it open and braved the renewed storm of air to see outside. Juno and her captor were no longer visible. The stocky ship’s trio of engines was firing, pulling it away from the frigate.

The ship starts accelerating away, and then:

Starkiller reached out to catch it, too late. The craft barely wobbled as it receded into the distance, and vanished into hyperspace.

It would have taken you two minutes to check, if you actually read the book.

Now ofc ship was moving vastly sub LS when he was pulling it back, but that is due to his TK that overpowered hyperspace engines it activated to try to break free, after his concentration was broken, it instantly jumped into hyperspace, in milisecond, which would not be case if engines were not turned at full power from before, since it takes at least several seconds to build hyperspace power

What a load of rubbish based in nothing but lies. The ship was using its sublight engines, not the hyperdrive. Here's a diagram, to help:

The big yellow-orange things are the sublight engines, and they're what are firing to give the ship distance. SK grabs it, pulling it back, during which Boba is plotting the nav com. It then carries on moving, at which point it's ready to travel to lightspeed, which it does when it's stationary after accelerating:

Something that did not happen here. Which you would know...if you actually checked. Slave I's engines take around 2.3 seconds to build up enough speed to reach Hyperspace, which it was not doing when SK grabbed it. What it was doing is what's shown in this gif; gaining space to begin the process:

Starkiller is grabbing a ship employing sublight engines to move away from a hangar and gain space in which to begin the process, during which he pulls it back, before being forced to release it. When this happens, the ship has built up just enough speed to begin the process and then has the 2.3 or so seconds it needs to rapidly accelerate. In short, SK is stopping a ship moving far slower than the SoL.

Next time, do some research before coming up with patently dishonest arguments and whining about how you've "debunked" them by shouting loudly and spamming the same thing over and over. Getting the last word isn't the same as delivering well-written, well-crafted arguments, and it doesn't prove your superiority just because not everyone has all week to stay arguing such a logically devoid claim where you dance around their arguments and regurgitate the same rubbish like it's going out of fashion.

Dio is not ftl nor even lightspeed, but he can win via timestop and beating the breaks off of Starkiller

That's when scaling comes in count. If X character1 is lets say planet level by feats and no anti feat or bad scaling that disproves he's planet lvl scaling. Then X character2 comes in can easily match even though X character2 hasn't shown any feats that would put him in the planet level ranges. X character2 being able to match X character1 already puts him in that tier of power. But just because he doesn't have any planet level feats to suggest he can destroy a planet, but he has scaling. And with that scaling we can decisively assume he can bust a planet if nothing else contradicts that. So SK doesn't have no planet level feats nor scaling to be put any where near close that tier of power (AP/DC).

Nope, it was not moving at LS when it left hunger, nobody said it was either, epic fail, instead what happened is after it left hunger, it stopped adjusted its position and started moving, he easily caught it with TK and started pulling to himself, to try to counter that it used its hyperspace engines, it was not moving at FTL speed, it used hyperspace engines to try to do so, his TK proved to be to strong though and was pulling it back still, winning in thug of war untill he was interupted it and jumped at FTL speeds miliisecond after

So you have absolutely no basis - once again - for SK holding back a ship at LS velocity, only for him pulling one back when its using its sublight engines. Next time you want to try and make a point, ensure it's coherent and not your usual nonsense.

To bad for you that i did, unlike you BoD. it is common knowledge that scenes like that can happen at the same time, and not nesserily one after th eanother, and we have proof of that here, after he is interupted scene cuts to ship itself, we see it being pulled back

The cut shows the ship's response as soon as the grip is cut, but nice try at deflection. Even per your absentee logic, the ship would then need the two seconds it displayed in the other depiction of the game to accelerate in order to make that jump, which occurred only as SK's grip faltered and the camera cut to show the ship using those two seconds to build up speed before SK could get back up. This means that SK is still only stopping the ship's undeterminable initial velocity needed to kickstart the process, which has never been detailed in-universe or out-of-universe.

Congratulations; you've proved SK can stop a ship moving at an undetermined, unquantifiable, vastly sub-LS velocity! Great wank for the character, on a scale that relative fodder like Deceived Malgus hasn't pseudo-replicated!

He reached out with the Force as Razor continued its rise, tried to take it in his mental grasp. Its ascent slowed. He held forth both of his arms, made claws of his hands, and shouted with frustration as he sought to hold back the power of the ship’s thrusters.

He felt a tightness in his mind, the string of his power being drawn taut, stretching, stretching. He would not release the ship. Its thrusters began to whine. He held it, teeth gritted, sweat soaking his body, his breath a dry rattle through his respirator.

and then after his concentration broke , millisecond after, it starts hyperspace jump:

Except that's not what happened. Your attempt to manipulate how scenes work is noted, however.

Yea we know it was stationary before they tried to escape , it is irrelevant though

Once again, dancing around the novel explicitly stating that it moved away via its sublight engines prior to Hyperspace.

Due to it jumping into hyperspace ofc, that is why they were moving away from frigate, as we saw above, ships move some distance in universe first at LS/FTL before they enter hyperspace dimension, hence why last Jedi fleet impact happend in the first place

Jesus Christ, you're genuinely this delusional. If a ship is firing its engines, the propulsion carries it in the direction it is facing. The two are not related as the ship is gaining distance. You are clutching at straws, and it's pathetic.

Per your ridiculous logic, the ship would still only be using this momentum to gain distance, with the acceleration to Hyperspace happening in the two seconds between it stopping and then shooting forwards. That means the sublight engines are moving at an utterly unquantifiable and thus unusable speed for whatever VS Battle calculations you try to abuse.

Literally most of your posts

This comeback is as poor as your arguments.

just like here, you cannot even read lol,

If you're going to try and insult someone's reading comprehension, best learn how to use primary school spelling and grammar, hm?

nobody said it used hyperspace engines when it left hugner when he first grabbed it, it used them in secodns after when he was overpowering other engines and pulling it back, to try to break free, as we saw due to it jumping into hypersapce in milisecond after his hold was broken

Wow, what a startling revelation! It's almost as though you've cherry-picked part of the point yet again, and ignored the overall point that the ship was still moving away from the hangar when SK grabbed it on both occasions, which is why it's barely moved away from its original position when he grabs it again!

Astounding. Your inability to formulate even a basic argument never ceases to amaze. I've also noticed that you've chosen to drop the idiotic attempt to ignore the additional time it took to plot the nav-computer before he could even begin the hyperdrive sequence, which means that at some point between SK grabbing it and the ship jumping, he spent a few seconds plotting the system and powering it up rather than trying to build up that speed.

So yes, quite right; "sit down", Eredin. It might give you time to think of some half-decent arguments that don't revolve around pitiful attempts to scrutinise pixels to cling to a moronic claim. Not that you'd have the humility to do that, as you seem to believe "the last word" is the epitome of winning a debate and will inevitably keep replying with more or less the same arguments until I get bored and move on after this.

Time stop + FTL punches = ggs

Can you point to the rule in Rule section he cant defend against your lowballing and highballing debating? All I see him is arguing against the SW lies your putting out every SW thread on this site. Which you do often. Im not the only one who has had it with your SW hype and lies. Ruins so many threads.

Funny thing, you can IGNORE him if your so bothered. I have started to Ignore your nonsensical posts often now. It does wonders. Just BLOCK him lol. It helps mate.

@eredin12: @breakofdawn I need you two to continue to not reply to or talk about one another. You're both doing it.

Time stop is such a dumb power that makes the whole thing pointless... Although Dio does win

Time stop is such a dumb power that makes the whole thing pointless... Although Dio does win