Deadpool.
Deadpool VS Red Hood(Jason Todd)
I don't think Jason Todd will get stomped THAT badly. He could at least somewhat hold is own against Deadpool in a fight.
@nighthunder: Spite my a$$, Todd is probably more skilled than Wade and got Batman gadgets.
@leonkarlen123: What's Todd going to do to Pool?
All Blades son. Jason is a capable sword fighter and also marksman. Deadpool's key factor is his healing factor.
@jack_: Since OP didn't specify KO or not we can suggest it is to KO because otherwise this is an eternal fight.
He can basically put a bat bomb in his mouth or slice him open with his swords. He can use smoke grenades to blind him.
@leonkarlen123: Deadpool is no pushover when it comes to combat, and he's been given prep, no?
Also, Jason doesn't have smoke grenades or bat bombs. He does have a machete and two pistols.
@jack_: Actually during Red Hood he used smoke grenades and bombs
Deadpool b**** slaps Jason Todd...
Wade has prep and a healing factor, he should stomp. If his prep/traps don't work though then I say Jason.
Deadpool
Although I cannot stand Deadpool and Jason Todd is one of my favorite characters in the DC Universe... Deadpool simply beats Red X due to his annoying healing factor. Btw, before anyone tries to correct me for saying Red X, Jason Todd should've became Red X not Red Hood.
Although I cannot stand Deadpool and Jason Todd is one of my favorite characters in the DC Universe... Deadpool simply beats Red X due to his annoying healing factor. Btw, before anyone tries to correct me for saying Red X, Jason Todd should've became Red X not Red Hood.
There was a point to him becoming Red Hood. Red X would've had little meaning in comparison.
@siafon: Except for Taskmaster with his hands tied behind his back, an entire Skrull warship, and many others.
The prep is just too much for Jason. Even without prep, Jason couldn't deal with his HF. DP without HF might be a more fair battle.
If it's a decently written deadpool version trying vs Red hood then it could go either way with Dp taking 5.5 out of 10. If its dp from Cable v. Deadpool or war of dp's then deadpool stomps. However Redhood stomps if we're using a shitty joke dp
Wade doesn't even need the prep to put Jason down
I totally disagree with you. Based on the majority of the issues, where Red Hood appears, he displays amazing martial arts skill. Fighting prowess IS A HUGE advantage in favor of Jason. Deadpool wins under these circumstances, since preparation is involved though.
Wade doesn't even need the prep to put Jason down
I totally disagree with you. Based on the majority of the issues, where Red Hood appears, he displays amazing martial arts skill. Fighting prowess IS A HUGE advantage in favor of Jason. Deadpool wins under these circumstances, since preparation is involved though.
Deadpool has fought and performed better against more top tier martial artists than Jason will ever hope to contend with. He's fought Daredevil and Silver Sable simultaneously and held his own, given Wolverine trouble and even taken the advantage in some situations, stalemate Iron Fist in a short scuffle, fought evenly with Killmonger who usually either defeats Black Panther or stalemates him, and even been able to give the entire Avengers trouble. Jason has no chance of replicating any of these feats.
Deadpool is a Batman level martial artist, if not slightly below, at the very least when he's serious. Jason Todd on the other hand is decisively outclassed by Bruce in terms of martial arts prowess and is generally not even as good as Nightwing, who would also handily lose to Deadpool and the opponents he faces such as Iron Fist and Daredevil.
Deadpool has fought and performed better against more top tier martial artists than Jason will ever hope to contend with.
Batman, Lady Shiva aren't top-tier martial arts that Red Hood has not only fought? Let's go into the outcome of those fights later.
He's fought Daredevil and Silver Sable simultaneously and held his own,
Silver Sable isn't that good and Daredevil is for sure not more skilled than Batman. Beating Shiva and Bruce two DC master martial arts sounds much better than "holding his own" against those two less skilled.
given Wolverine trouble and even taken the advantage in some situations, stalemate Iron Fist in a short scuffle, fought evenly with Killmonger who usually either defeats Black Panther or stalemates him,
I don't know which fight you're referring to, but Wolverine doesn't use his skills often, because of that would like to know which one? Ironfist isn't more skilled than Batman even if he is, beating holds more than only stalemating. Wrong comparison because Killmonger isn't in Batman or Lady Shiva's league.
and even been able to give the entire Avengers trouble. Jason has no chance of replicating any of these feats.
If I remember correctly, it was when he first appeared and that's long ago and there was context involved fore sure, which loses its validity more or less.
Deadpool is a Batman level martial artist, if not slightly below, at the very least when he's serious. Jason Todd on the other hand is decisively outclassed by Bruce in terms of martial arts prowess and is generally not even as good as Nightwing, who would also handily lose to Deadpool and the opponents he faces such as Iron Fist and Daredevil.
Batman and Lady Shiva are better than most of the characters you mentioned and Jason beat them. Daedpool hasn't won even against half of those even they are inferior to those two of DC. He even subdued Cassandra Cain in a shirt fight that again is better to most of those you mentioned.
I think you have an incorrect perception of Red Hood or you subliminally avoid the objectivity when it comes to what they both have done and are capable of. Jason evidently is superior in terms of hand-to-hand skills to Deadpool.
@nathaniel_adam said:
Deadpool has fought and performed better against more top tier martial artists than Jason will ever hope to contend with.
Batman, Lady Shiva aren't top-tier martial arts that Red Hood has not only fought? Let's go into the outcome of those fights later.
Jason has fought Batman, but he's never beaten him. Furthermore, almost every single time he's fought Bruce the latter was holding back in the time period where Jason is performing well. Once Batman decides to end the fight, he does. Jason has only to my knowledge fought Lady Shiva and defeated her in the New 52, where she is not only drastically different as a character but also not that impressive in comparison to her Pre-Flashpoint counterpart. Before New 52, the only time Jason "fought" Lady Shiva was way back in Batman vol.1 #427 when he was still Robin, and he didn't even fight Shiva directly. He just interfered after Bruce and Shiva had an extended stalemate and both he and Bruce overwhelmed her.
The difference is, Deadpool can defeat Batman. Healing factor aside, Wade is more skilled and has fought more skilled and notable combatants consistently than Jason and that is a fact. If you're going to dismiss the actual outcome of these fights and the results, so can I. Jason has fought Batman and Lady Shiva. Deadpool has fought Daredevil, Wolverine, Iron Fist, Sabretooth, Punisher, Bullseye, etc. Nothing you have said refutes my original point that Wade has indeed fought and performed better against a larger roster of top-tier martial artists.
He's fought Daredevil and Silver Sable simultaneously and held his own,
Silver Sable isn't that good and Daredevil is for sure not more skilled than Batman. Beating Shiva and Bruce two DC master martial arts sounds much better than "holding his own" against those two less skilled.
Silver Sable herself isn't top-tier but she is still a highly trained mercenary and compliments Daredevil in the fight, who himself is an incredible martial artist with extensive knowledge in pressure points and possibly Marvel's most gifted acrobat. While Matt isn't as technically skilled as Bruce, in terms of sheer martial arts he's still able to give Batman a genuine run for his money. He's a superior acrobat and probably barely edges Batman out in terms of pressure point knowledge. This is more than I can say for Jason.
Back to my point that I addressed earlier, Jason has never defeated a thoroughly impressive incarnation of Lady Shiva. What has Lady Shiva even done in the New 52? All I recall is her beating Nightwing when he was semi-distracted and still sustaining a previous rib injury. Even when he beat Lady Shiva in the New 52 it was due to a shortcut technique that Shiva herself taught him in Red Hood and the Outlaws #26. But this isn't even completely consistent either since Jason was seen losing to Shiva in Red Hood and the Outlaws #21, just five issues before. Chesire was there but she didn't seem to actually be fighting, more so conversing with Shiva, and Jason only escaped by making his helmet explode. Either way, beating Shiva in the New 52 isn't something to brag about, nor is it even something Jason can pull off all the time, certainly not by pure technical skill.
As for Jason legitimately defeating Batman, I'll cite my previous argument where I debunk Red Hood being able to evenly fight Batman Pre-Flashpoint.
There are many factors you are leaving out of these scans that are fairly crucial. For one, Batman was holding back severely against Jason Todd. This is evident in the dialogue and when you compare the feats of Bruce and Jason Post-Crisis and New 52. Not only that, but Batman lays a brutal beatdown on Jason once he decided to fight more seriously. Even in the animated adaptation this is very clear. Jason is not on par with Batman.
Pay attention to the dialogue. You can post many Red Hood versus Batman fights that usually occur in Under The Hood, which is the same story arc of the scans I've posted above. However, they've all taken place before the final encounter, were usually brief, and were with a skeptical and holding back Bruce. Guess what happens when Batman explicitly states he won't hold back anymore?
http://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/124784/5165684-ca.png
Well, what happens is what most of us would expect. The student has not surpassed the master yet. Not even close. Batman lays it on Jason and it is very clear in the art, dialogue, and consistency of past feats that Jason is simply outmatched.
In terms of the New 52, the only time we see Jason "beat" Bruce is a single panel where Jason is standing over Batman with a gun to his head with absolutely no context at all. Batman is even muttering "Jason..." in that panel, so it's obvious even in the New 52 Bruce was still trying to reach out to Jason and reason with him. That's not impressive in any right at all.
I don't know which fight you're referring to, but Wolverine doesn't use his skills often, because of that would like to know which one? Ironfist isn't more skilled than Batman even if he is, beating holds more than only stalemating. Wrong comparison because Killmonger isn't in Batman or Lady Shiva's league.
Logan may not use his skill against canon fodder much, and sometimes he even initially doesn't utilize his skill properly against some more notable combatants. However, overall, Logan has a huge experience advantage from his extended lifetime and has constantly proved his martial arts prowess. He's used his skill against many notable characters. He's beaten Iron Fist in a sparring session, defeated Captain America, Daredevil, etc. This is not to mention the fact that Logan has been documented in many handbooks as mastering every single martial arts style on Earth.
Regarding Danny, it's highly debatable that Iron Fist is more skilled than Batman actually. Danny has fought Logan, Nightcrawler, and Colossus all together by himself purely hand-to-hand. Though this is an older version of Wolverine that wasn't as skilled and he did use chi against Colossus, it's still incredibly impressive. He's also defeated Sabretooth while blind in Iron Fist vol.1 #14. That isn't something Batman would be able to replicate even with full gear. Around the time that issue was written Sabretooth was commonly see having an advantage against Wolverine in fights, arguably his peak.
Killmonger may not be as technically skilled as Batman or Pre-Flashpoint Shiva (honestly it's debatable with New 52 Shiva), he's still an incredibly gifted fighter and physically dominating. His strength was enough to overpower T'Challa who himself was peak human. He's been able to give T'Challa solid fights in close quarters combat because of this before he got a significant strength boost. Yet in Deadpool vol.1 #44, Wade was able to stalemate Killmonger with a strength upgrade after he had taken a hit from both Giant-Man and She-Hulk.
None of the feats above I have mentioned can Red Hood replicate, nor would he be able to contend with anyone who is capable of those feats.
If I remember correctly, it was when he first appeared and that's long ago and there was context involved fore sure, which loses its validity more or less.
Incorrect. His first debut was in New Mutants vol.1 #98. He practically mops the floor with the entire Cable's New Mutants team. IIRC, he had prep, so that might be the context you are talking about. However, in Deadpool vol.1 #44 where he gave the Avengers trouble by himself there was no context. Similarly, in Cable and Deadpool vol.1 #31, Wade was able to give an ensemble of Hercules, Goliath, and Captain America trouble right after he had just been fighting Iron Fist (who was posing as Daredevil). Falcon and Danny were also present during this feat, though Deadpool only directly combats the three I mentioned above. Yet again this is another feat that Jason would not be able to replicate.
Batman and Lady Shiva are better than most of the characters you mentioned and Jason beat them. Daedpool hasn't won even against half of those even they are inferior to those two of DC. He even subdued Cassandra Cain in a shirt fight that again is better to most of those you mentioned.
Better in what context? Because in a fight most of the characters I have mentioned would either stalemate Batman or outright defeat him. If not, they'd still give him more of a challenge than Jason ever could. Daredevil, Bullseye, and Punisher are arguably inferior to Bruce in the sense that they would lose in a fight against him, yet they would all still be able to soundly defeat Red Hood. Your ABC logic is at the very best incredibly flawed because of this. Then there's characters like Wolverine, Iron Fist, and Captain America. Wolverine and Iron Fist would both defeat Batman and are also better than Bruce in terms of martial arts prowess, or at the minimum at his level. Captain America himself would stalemate Bruce and in terms of pure technical martial arts knowledge, Steve is only a bit below Bruce himself. Yet Deadpool has stalemated Steve in hand-to-hand combat, stalemated Iron Fist, and done pretty well against Logan and even gained the advantage against him in both Wolverine vol.2 #155 and Wolverine Annual '99, both of which are in Logan's own title.
Lady Shiva in terms of pure martial arts knowledge Pre-Flashpoint is usually Batman level if not above. IIRC, Batman was watching Connor Hawke and Lady Shiva fight in hand-to-hand combat and remarked that he had had lasted longer than even Bruce could against her, indicating that Shiva was for the most part Bruce's superior in the martial arts department. And then we have the showing in Batman vol.1 #427 where he was stalemating her. This completely outclasses anything New 52 Shiva is capable of to such a large degree it isn't even funny. It's almost common knowledge that New 52 Shiva pales in comparison to Pre-Flashpoint and that she's pretty much just a jobber at this point.
Cassandra Cain in the New 52 as far as I'm aware isn't as impressive as her Pre-Flashpoint version either, and like you said it was a short fight where Cassandra was, according to even Dick Grayson's own words, trying to protect him.
And even then, I have already had an extensive argument in the past as to why Deadpool can match Cassandra Cain in terms of martial arts prowess. Whether or not Cassandra is superior to Logan and Iron Fist in terms of martial arts prowess is also highly debatable. As I have detailed earlier in this post, both Danny and Logan have incredibly impressive hand-to-hand combat feats that can contend with almost any top-tier DC martial artist you can think of.
I think you have an incorrect perception of Red Hood or you subliminally avoid the objectivity when it comes to what they both have done and are capable of. Jason evidently is superior in terms of hand-to-hand skills to Deadpool.
No. The evidence clearly points the the exact opposite assertion. Let's look at some of the evidence.
- Able to stalemate Kraven the Hunter, who often fights Spider-Man himself and even seemingly gain the advantage before being zapped in Deadpool vol.1 #11.
- Performed well and fought evenly with a practically bloodlusted Bone Claw Wolverine in Deadpool vol.1 #27.
- Defeats Bullseye in close-quarters combat while trying to protect someone else in Deadpool vol.1 #28.
Quite honestly I think there's just been a rampant romanticisation of Jason Todd's capabilities by cherry picking and over hyping his feats. Ignoring the context for Jason Todd's "stalemate" with Batman and his showings against newer incarnations of characters who have been impressive in the past but either lacking in showings or job in the present does not make him a top-tier martial artist compared to people like Batman, Wolverine, Iron Fist, etc.
So yes, Wade is more skilled than Jason and he would beat him in a fight, healing factor or not.
@darktiger: Because Deadpool already has the innate advantage of his healing factor. Then the OP for unknown reasons gave the character with the clear advantage prep time on top of it.
If Jason had prep I'd say he wins due to superior skills. However with how the battle is setup, Jason has absolutely no chance to win.
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