@death4bunnies: I don't see what that would change really. Carol might react to a long distance blitz, but once the fight goes cqc, she isn't gonna be doing much.
@death4bunnies: I don't see what that would change really. Carol might react to a long distance blitz, but once the fight goes cqc, she isn't gonna be doing much.
Carol wins and is also a more experienced aerial fighter
Carol has never fought another humanoid in the air like Superman has. Superman has better applicable experience.
Facing multiple opponents > facing one especially when they're actively shooting stuff at you
She faced spacecraft fighters which are nowhere near as durable or capable as Superman. Not comparable situations.
Example: facing 5 4yr olds, throwing stuff at you, or facing one person of equal strength and stature to you. Which is a harder fight and more applicable to fighting an entirely different person similar in stature and strength to you?
Carol wins and is also a more experienced aerial fighter
Carol has never fought another humanoid in the air like Superman has. Superman has better applicable experience.
Facing multiple opponents > facing one especially when they're actively shooting stuff at you
She faced spacecraft fighters which are nowhere near as durable or capable as Superman. Not comparable situations.
Example: facing 5 4yr olds, throwing stuff at you, or facing one person of equal strength and stature to you. Which is a harder fight and more applicable to fighting an entirely different person similar in stature and strength to you?
He faced aircraft fighters far less experienced than what she faced and performed nowhere near the level Carol did. Therefore her combat experience is better. Facing Zod doesn't really generate any comparison since Zod has 0 experience in such fighting.
Can someone show me these feats of Superman fighting at like tens of thousands of times the speed of sound or him fighting FTL in combat speed. Because I have seen these movies and they are just not in them.
Can someone show me these feats of Superman fighting at like tens of thousands of times the speed of sound or him fighting FTL in combat speed. Because I have seen these movies and they are just not in them.
Shes has had more training tho right....Airforce...6 years with Starforce, then 20 years a a space superhero.
She seemed pretty skilled again Thanos.
And did she bruise Thanos? Who do we attribute those bruises to?
She is certainly more skilled than Superman I did not say she wasn't. Strictly in terms of fighting humanoid combatants of great strength and speed during flight is something that Superman has more experience with.
Can someone show me these feats of Superman fighting at like tens of thousands of times the speed of sound or him fighting FTL in combat speed. Because I have seen these movies and they are just not in them.
I think there I a Snyder Statement WOG thing that says Flash is SOL(or can be biut he scared or something) then they extrapolate it to Superman.
So WOG says flash might be SOL, and that gets scaled to superman.
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I think WOG Feige said Carol can move planets, but for some reasons secondary sources only count on the forum for DCEU and the resulting scaling from those statements of course.
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If there is another reason they think he SOL I dont know what it is.
Carol wins and is also a more experienced aerial fighter
Carol has never fought another humanoid in the air like Superman has. Superman has better applicable experience.
Facing multiple opponents > facing one especially when they're actively shooting stuff at you
She faced spacecraft fighters which are nowhere near as durable or capable as Superman. Not comparable situations.
Example: facing 5 4yr olds, throwing stuff at you, or facing one person of equal strength and stature to you. Which is a harder fight and more applicable to fighting an entirely different person similar in stature and strength to you?
He faced aircraft fighters far less experienced than what she faced and performed nowhere near the level Carol did. Therefore her combat experience is better. Facing Zod doesn't really generate any comparison since Zod has 0 experience in such fighting.
When did Superman face aircraft fighters?
Facing Zod is better than facing nameless spaceships if you want experience that will help with fighting a humanoid being that can fly and has super strength.
@crunch5481: He is not a trained fighter though. He has no skill he has some experience but Carol is an actual trained fighter with experience against foes of comparable power to her before she got her powers which would translate here as well. She is the more skilled fighter, the stronger fighter, the faster fighter. This is not a contest.
@thealmightykue: Carol might beat Clark in a race but not she isn’t faster in combat speed. Skill doesn’t matter if she can’t tag him and the strength gap isn’t wide enough.
@thealmightykue: Carol might beat Clark in a race but not she isn’t faster in combat speed. Skill doesn’t matter if she can’t tag him and the strength gap isn’t wide enough.
In space she should be a little more free to bullrush around right?
I think the strength Gap is pretty wide, she carried the Bentiar spacecraft 1000s of lightyears at lightspeed+++.
Do you think she could bullrush Superman across a lightyear or 2?
@death4bunnies: Objects don’t have weight in space. Clark causally carried a big apartment complex with people inside it. Carol won’t be going at full speed right off the bat and Thanos has also reacted to her bulrush before while weakened.
@death4bunnies: Seems like he was scared of overall combat hence him “pushing” things and running away, but I don’t see why he’d be any slower, especially since he got spooked by Superman and was still getting pressured.
@death4bunnies: Objects don’t have weight in space. Clark causally carried a big apartment complex with people inside it. Carol won’t be going at full speed right off the bat and Thanos has also reacted to her bulrush before while weakened.
Ummm, ye Objects still have mass in space....Do you think you can just push a floating spacestaion in space??
Do you understand what kinda astronomical force would have to be applied for her to carry a large spaceship lightyears??
Objects dont have weight in space is not how any of this works, they still have mass, notice you jumping doesnt push around the earth.. its in space shouldn't it be weightless?
Its the mass of the object, and carrying and propelling a spaceship lightyears at light speed ++++ I way more impressive than carrying a apt building.
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Lets do a quick poll.
Any viners that want to at the end of your post go ahead and tell us what your vote is for the most impressive strength feat.
Clark causally carried a big apartment complex with people inside it.
or
Carrying the Benatar to earth from outside out solar system at light speed ++++.
@death4bunnies: he traveled to the CWverse with Cyborg’s help, i don’t think it’s shown how he traveled back in time, though Flash does that in the comics by running fast afaik.
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I’m arguing Supes has relativistic (sub SoL) reactions since he reacted to a blitz, but was still clearly slower even when Flash was stumbling backwards. Flash’s running speed should scale to SoL from his punching speed and he has no reason to move slow against SM, especially after noticing that SM can track him.
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nah I’m not biased for the DCEU. I doubt anyone else places Thanos, Thor, etc at mach 10-20 reaction speed. Just trying to be fair for the DCEU
She overpowered Thanos in their struggle for the gauntlet for strength.
From her knees she stands up pushes Thanos back and then pushes him down. Thanos has a large leverage advantage yet is still shoved down. And once CM pushes him down he is unable to move her at all.
Many claim she was amped but the evidence isn't substantial. They either point out the barn scene which was her simply trying to keep him from closing his fist or they say she absorbed energy from the gauntlet and often say she was glowing brighter than she usually does which is also wrong. Captain Marvel can glow really bright.
Furthermore they’re directors statements about CM that hint towards her being superior to Thanos physically at least strength wise.
“It’s interesting seeing the Avengers with Captain Marvel. I think that she dimensionalizes them in a really great way. Just from a pure power standpoint and what her abilities are. If you’re talking about a collection of heroes, and you’re gonna go face Thanos, who we believe still has the gauntlet. She is as powerful, if not more powerful than Thor, and you suddenly have hope again. Because they all know what happened at the end of the last movie, he walked through them like they were paper.”
This quote pretty much flat out says she is stronger than Thor who while weaker than Thanos made him have to put work into overpowering him physically. Thor was their in Endgame yet the avengers still didn't have any of the "hope" as the directors call it as they had in IW. They only start believing they can win when CM arrives due to the sheer amount of power she brings to the table.
""Anthony [Russo] came up with the great idea -- this was a reshoot, by the way, at the last minute -- he had the great idea that Thanos pulls the power stone out of the gauntlet, and then he punches her with the raw power stone," he continued. "That is a fantastic use of that prop and that story point, because that’s what you want. And we had to find a way that he could sideline Captain Marvel for a minute, because she’s so powerful, there’s no way to do it.""
This one pretty much proves she didn’t absorb energy from the gauntlet and that Thanos needed the powerstone to beat her. Without the stone it is made clear that CM would have defeated Thanos. And Thanos literally could not move CM. He physically was not strong enough to overpower her. He needed the powerstone. They also would have certainly mentioned it here if she absorbed energy from the gauntlet.
There are more statements other than these but these two clearly show that CM wasn’t amped in the scene and that she clearly is meant to be physically stronger than Thanos. Who scales above Thor and Hulk who are both physically comparable to Superman.
Thor first.
He could open the Iris which was massive.
Probably well into the 100k plus ton range if not much more.
He also did this.
While in the end unquantifiable considering he broke ice that was holding back multi million ton rings saying it at least translates into possibly in the high hundreds of thousands of tons of strength isn't a stretch if not being conservative.
Thor crushed Iron Man's armor which was calced by Film theory to be 1700 tons of force. This is with is literal finger tips.
Also the majority of these feats come from the respect thread from @amcu on Thor. This is one of the feats he found on Thor's strength as well.
Thor breaks out of 10+ chains.
This dragon failed to break a single chain.
This dragon could go threw rock and stone like butter.
In this video and in the script it is confirmed the dragon was shaking the ground like an earthquake.
The dragon was also able to fly at what appears to be supersonic speeds. (There seems to be a sonic boom around Thor.)
I will reiterate I am literally just paraphrasing amcu's respect thread here.
And he has more feats like ripping up a spaceship and regularly tossing around cars and such with zero effort on the lower end. Thor is a 100k tonner easily.
Hulk has feats such as lifting Avengers HQ which is a really large building while millions of gallons were on it. And he scales above Thor.
And CM scales head and shoulders above both in physical strength.
For individual strength feats she is not lacking ether. she was capable of carrying the guardians ship across thousands of lightyears effortlessly.
The ship is no slouch in size either.
The ship likely weighs hundreds maybe even thousands of tons. She also accelerated it past light speed. Not only does this shown insane endurance but also ridiculous strength. Moving something of this size at such speed is insane. Low key probably the one of the best strength feats in the MCU.
She also has of course the missle feat.
This was calced by @divinevisitor to be a 100k plus feat.
"The Missile has the following stats:
Length: 32m
Mass: 209,600kg
Speed: 7000m/s
The Kree Missile that Carol catches is about 17 Brie Larson’s long, making it about 28.9m. Slightly smaller than the R-36 but the Kree Missile is slightly wider at the base/fins so i would say they could be compared with some degree of accuracy.
Now Carol catches the missile as it’s travelling through the Atmosphere which would be re-entry speed however after having caught the missile she is only fighting against the thrust of the engine and its Mass to keep it stationary, a thrust capable of having the missile travel at 7,000m/s at maximum output. Having found a clip of the scene on Youtube it appears Carol catches the missile at 24.5s and the Missile appears to come to a standstill at 31.5s for an impact duration of 7 seconds.
Which provided an Average Impact Force of 209.6MegaNewtons or 23,560short tons-force.
If we take that as the Mass she is effectively lifting then we can work out how much force she needed to apply to push the missile back.
Next we need to workout the distance thrown and final speed of the missile in order to work out it’s acceleration. It appears that Carol takes 2 seconds to build up the strength and throw the missile which is thrown approximately 10 missile lengths, that being 289meters based on its length relative to Brie Larson and takes about 3 seconds to move this distance.
Meaning Carol can probably lift in the region of 115,700 short tons or 104,961.27tons."
This is a lowball to. It puts the speed of the missile at a mere 7km a second. It was in all reality going much faster.
It was going well over double 7 kilometers a second. Either way insane feat. Even if you call the calc bogus and ignore what divine says about it you can visually see it is well above every feat performed by Superman.
Next on to durability CM also has the clear advantage. First she no sold a headbutt from Thanos.
Which is one of his most powerful attacks, it did more damage to Ironman and Thor than his punches did and it straight up knocked Thor out. He is never seen again after this.
I think this alone should prove her blunt force is superior to Superman
Thanos wasted both Thor and Hulk with his striking yet CM no sold his attack. She is pretty much in a different tier then Hulk and Thor in durability.
Thor in endgame was nearly knocked out in 4 attacks from Thanos.
Thanos consistently decimated Thor with his strikes as well.
Thor has insane durability.
Thor has tanked shots from Kurse like theses.
He tanked around 20 plus shots from Kurse got up and then fought Malekith. This is impressive because Kurse hits really hard.
Kurse oneshots an energy field generator threw an energy field. This is impressive because the energy field has feats such as this.
Which is impressive because these ships are insanely powerful.
Thor tanked 20 punches from a character who has building level striking on the low end maybe multi building level striking.
Going straight for the throat Thor was at the epicenter of the Sokovia explosion. The explosion that disinigrated a city. He was only KO'd by this. His durability is at least small city level.
He has more flashy feats like this rough landing.
Or being at the epicenter of this powerstone explosion while recovering from a beating from Thanos.
He can no sell getting dragged through metal.
He withstood this throw. Here are some calcs on the force behind this throw.
He tanked getting slammed and dragged threw rock by a fire dragon.
He tanked what could have legit been tens of thousands if not more of tons of rock falling on him.
He could withstand blast from Gungnir.
The same weapon effortlessly killed frost giants.
Even without it CM has better stand alone feats of durability most notably rain fire.
The rain fire feat which was one shotting leviathans and wakandan ships.
Every shot causes massive damage. Yet as seen here was completely ineffective against CM.
And she has feats such as these.
I imagine that the ship was ramming her at extremely high speeds and was likely outputting a ridiculous amount of force. Full stop Supes gets ragdolled by hits that are outputting not even a tenth of the force as what CM literally just belly bumped into.
If you calced this you would likely get insane amounts of force. And we see here they were no slouch in size.
They appear to be many times longer than CM and are obviously much thicker than she is.
CM also no sold flying threw this.
Which had enough force to expand to this size.
The missiles where previously shown doing this.
This is insane durability feat as CM didn't even register explosions.
Next let's go to damage output.
CM has shown more than effective against Thanos striking wise.
Thanos before his fight with CM and after shows he was bruised extensively from their fight. And it is around the spots CM punches as well. This imo can't be a coincidence and is meant to show that CM bruised him.
This is a pic of Thanos after his fight with Cap and Wanda and he clearly isn’t that bruised.
CM punches Thanos and you can see bruises.
An even better visual of Thanos to show he wasn’t already bruised is when he was suspended in air by Wanda.
And here is one more pic of Thanos after his fight with CM that shows how damaged his face is.
Thanos had been in a literal war zone before this but he had clearly healed or was unaffected by most of what he had tanked. He went from looking fresh faced to damaged in his fight with CM.
Whenever people say Thanos tanked CM’s strikes I sigh a little because Thanos most definitely did not tank them he withstood them but CM only punched him twice and energy blasted him once had she popped of an actual combo on him instead of reaching for the gauntlet endgame likely would have ended then and there.
As for Thanos throwing her when she reached for the gauntlet it is overhyped. CM was left vulnerable when she reached for it and he took advantage of it and threw her when she could offer little to no resistance.
Harming Thanos is impressive for a multitude of reasons mainly she hurt him more then Hulk did in 2 punches to Hulks 12 and arguably scales above Mjolnir as well.
Mjolnir creates a massive shockwave that rips up solid concrete from the ground and shatters the glass of a building ridiculously far away.
Thor bullrushed Loki hundreds of meters maybe even a kilometer across the bifrost threw multiple metal walls with it.
It caused a massive shockwave that killed ripped a tank in half when Thor slammed it into caps sheild.
It caused another shockwave that leveled a large portion of a forest.
Mjolnir throws ragdolled Malekith hard enough to ragdoll those within his vicinity.
Ragdolls a 30-60 ton tank with a strike.
Thor strikes a giant 20 foot tall Malekith hard enough to send him flying and crashing into his spaceship with enough force to create a crater in the metal of his ship.
Mjolnir can be thrown through multiple Asgardian level Frost Giants.
Thor ragdolled Malekith across the sky with it.
It can create massive shockwaves that can disintegrate Surtur's superhuman fire demons and stagger Surtur himself.
Mjolnirs best strike was the Sokovia strike. While the actual busting of the landmass was the vibranium spire Thor still caused a shockwave that destroyed multiple buildings and seemed to level an entire city block at bare minimum.
Pre ragnarok Thor is multi building level with his strikes and city block level when given time to charge up his strikes.
And here is some scaling.
Thanos took this absolute beat down from Mjolnir with less visual damage then what he took from CM. And not to mention none of these feats are as impressive as Sanctuary 2 which I will get into later.
As for Hulk she definitely scales above his striking power as well.
First he could ragdoll Thor.
More feats include some like these.
He ravages Hulkbuster vertically threw a building.
He tears threw a building like it is air.
His clash with Hulkbuster causes a shockwave that shakes cars around them and ragdolls people who are in a building that is at least a 100 feet away.
He strikes the thousand plus pound Ultron across Sokovia. Ultron at least went a kilometer away. Ultron likely weighs thousands of pounds maybe a couple tons. This feat is ridiculous.
And he one shot kills a leviathan. Leviathans can fly through skyscrapers casually and no sell Ironmans artillery. The momentum of the leviathan is insane as it didn't slow down at all when going through buildings.
He ragdolls the multiton Hulkbuster hundreds of feet away.
Backhands what is likely multiple tons of metal hundreds of meters against its momentum into another machine destroying both.
Jumps threw buildings casually.
He also shatters a 40-60 ton boulder.
He blitzes straight threw a heavily armored bunker.
One shots a chitauri chariot. The same chariots could withstand getting hit by a Leviathan that was going threw buildings like butter.
He punches Abomination into the ground hard enough to shake the cars around them.
He punched threw hard packed concrete with ease and shook the road around him.
Ragdolls Hulkbuster with a knee.
Hulk has building level striking comfortably. The Leviathan feat is likely a multi building level striking feat.
As stated CM scales well above that.
CM also has individual feats of striking that are insane.
She could shatter a bridge and ragdoll Kree with the AOE of her casual punches even before she had fully realized her full potential.
This bridge was sizeable as well.
The notion of her only busting "Fodder ships" is baseless. She is still destroying tons of metal at high speeds every time she destroys one. She is outputting tons of tons of force for each ship. And she destroys many of these ships.
And it is even more impressive when you realize that those ships are really durable.
One could no sell hitting the ground at what had to be supersonic speeds seeing as how it dove through the planets atmosphere in seconds.
If Superman destroyed an object as big as those ships with a single punch the vine would go insane. CM's visual effects often cause people to lose a sense of scale but these ships are massive. And they are durable.
CM also carved threw Thanos' army like butter. She did the most individual damage of any avenger to the army. She ran threw it with utter ease. It was made clear that nothing in the army was stopping her.
She also has the Sanctuary 2 feat which is without a doubt the best non god tier striking feat in the MCU. By god tier I mean Surtur, Celestial, infinity stones, Dormammu, and Ego.
And let's talk about Sanctuary 2. It is a solid 4 kilometers in size.
Here is an image of a Q ship to give you a sense of scale.
Sanctuary was ungodly in size considering this as this is how big they were in comparison to Sanctuary.
It is like 15 plus times bigger than a Q ship. This isn't even including the fact that like 6 q ships could fit in those hole thingies. To further put things into scale it is over twice the size of Sokovia.
Sanctuary either way weighs tens of millions of tons assuming it is straight hollow. To be frank it probably weighs like 50 million plus tons. The holes CM makes in it probably is her tunneling threw over a million tons of metal straight up.
The holes literally dwarf the remains of Avengers HQ. In order to destroy that much of the ship and decimate that much metal would take insane amounts of force. The script states the engine of the ship explodes; this doesn't actually affect much as the massive hole in the ship comes entirely from CM. Sanctuary should scale above the drop pods in durability which it contains within it. Which are notoriously durable.
They can no sell being dropped from space. Drop ships are contained within Q ships and Sanctuary 2 visibly contains two Q ships inside it at the time CM flies threw it. It could hold more stacked in on it. And CM actually flies threw one meaning she likely flew through a few drop ships. And Sanctuary is likely designed of the same metal as them and is likely even more reinforced then them. Which means it isn't "featless" The metal it is made out of has feats and they are impressive to say the least.
And on page 131 of the avengers endgame script it is stated that the second time she hit it the ship listed in other words it tilted which just adds to the power of the feat by a great deal. Easily the best striking feat in the MCU barring the god tiers as I said. And far better then the WE feat which consists of Supes hitting the exposed portion of the ship causing it to explode.
Not to mention the accuser ship feat. Which is also an insane striking feat.
This ship is likely around 2000 meters long and hundreds of meters tall. Another feat out of Superman's weight class.
And she has powerful energy blast that should scale to or above her striking in output.
CM outstats Superman in everything. Triple scaling over Thor seals the deal in physical strength and everything else I made clear as to why I believe her to above Supes.
Speedwise in space CM showed supersonic speed as she maneuvered from Earth to space in seconds and fought at said speeds the entire time. The entire space fleet was wiped out in under a minute once she started moving.
For a quick opinion on Superman.
His best bullrushes are city block level. By best I mean him going all out max level just going in. And I am actually kinda tentative with city block level. The only reason I put them there is the WE feat. His consistent bull rushing power is multi building level at best imo. Here is a ton of bullrushes from Superman. Tbh the only feat here I would consider more than multi building level would be his bullrush to Zod's ship and even then it only rocked the ship and pierced a small portion of it. Probably just multi building level.
His striking power just standing is building level. Here are standing punches from him and they aren't better than building level. I post a ton of feats so I don't get called a lowballer lol.
These are Superman's feats. I must say Superman usually prefers bullrushes over punching except against Steppenwolf where he just punched him around. I also must say without his MOS clashes none of his striking feats are really even city block level.
Superman is a building buster with his strikes. With his bullrushes he is a multi building buster. This is below CM who is a building buster at least with her base strikes maybe more going of scaling and is multi city block level with her bullrushes imo.
Durability wise he peaks at sub megaton nuke level which is below Sokovia by alot and blunt force wise while he can tank a ton of shots that send him threw buildings he gets worn down as seen at the end of the DD fight. Where he was panting heavily and was noticeably worn down. Doomsday has casual city block level striking and when going all out has at least multi city block level striking scaling off how easily he overpowered Clarks bullrush. Clark was worn out and in bad shape after only a few hits from DD. (Less than a handful of hits had him in rough shape).Furthermore he was KO'd in both his Faora and Nam ek fight and near the beginning of the DD fight though that was a still recovering Superman.
Strength wise most of his feats are below 25k tons or at that level which would mean CM rips him in half with two fingers. Through some extrapolation and a debate with Divine visitor I once had I personally place him at a little over a 100k tonner. Which still means he is significantly weaker than CM to the point of getting absolutely manhandled strength wise.
Furthermore Heat vision wise he could melt metal and the like but considering CM casually no sold reentry I highly doubt it would be too effective. Certainly not as effective as CM's energy blast will be on him. Freeze breath is pretty much featless and considering how CM no sells the depths of space I once again highly doubt how effective it would be.
In conclusion CM as already stated is simply superior to Superman in everything except speed and she is better aerial combat wise then him as well. With feats including her final battle at the end of CM which I can confidently say was high hypersonic and her ability to search an entire planet in minutes.
She overpowered Thanos in their struggle for the gauntlet for strength.
From her knees she stands up pushes Thanos back and then pushes him down. Thanos has a large leverage advantage yet is still shoved down. And once CM pushes him down he is unable to move her at all.
Many claim she was amped but the evidence isn't substantial. They either point out the barn scene which was her simply trying to keep him from closing his fist or they say she absorbed energy from the gauntlet and often say she was glowing brighter than she usually does which is also wrong. Captain Marvel can glow really bright.
Furthermore they’re directors statements about CM that hint towards her being superior to Thanos physically at least strength wise.
“It’s interesting seeing the Avengers with Captain Marvel. I think that she dimensionalizes them in a really great way. Just from a pure power standpoint and what her abilities are. If you’re talking about a collection of heroes, and you’re gonna go face Thanos, who we believe still has the gauntlet. She is as powerful, if not more powerful than Thor, and you suddenly have hope again. Because they all know what happened at the end of the last movie, he walked through them like they were paper.”
This quote pretty much flat out says she is stronger than Thor who while weaker than Thanos made him have to put work into overpowering him physically. Thor was their in Endgame yet the avengers still didn't have any of the "hope" as the directors call it as they had in IW. They only start believing they can win when CM arrives due to the sheer amount of power she brings to the table.
""Anthony [Russo] came up with the great idea -- this was a reshoot, by the way, at the last minute -- he had the great idea that Thanos pulls the power stone out of the gauntlet, and then he punches her with the raw power stone," he continued. "That is a fantastic use of that prop and that story point, because that’s what you want. And we had to find a way that he could sideline Captain Marvel for a minute, because she’s so powerful, there’s no way to do it.""
This one pretty much proves she didn’t absorb energy from the gauntlet and that Thanos needed the powerstone to beat her. Without the stone it is made clear that CM would have defeated Thanos. And Thanos literally could not move CM. He physically was not strong enough to overpower her. He needed the powerstone. They also would have certainly mentioned it here if she absorbed energy from the gauntlet.
There are more statements other than these but these two clearly show that CM wasn’t amped in the scene and that she clearly is meant to be physically stronger than Thanos. Who scales above Thor and Hulk who are both physically comparable to Superman.
Thor first.
He could open the Iris which was massive.
Probably well into the 100k plus ton range if not much more.
He also did this.
While in the end unquantifiable considering he broke ice that was holding back multi million ton rings saying it at least translates into possibly in the high hundreds of thousands of tons of strength isn't a stretch if not being conservative.
Thor crushed Iron Man's armor which was calced by Film theory to be 1700 tons of force. This is with is literal finger tips.
Also the majority of these feats come from the respect thread from @amcu on Thor. This is one of the feats he found on Thor's strength as well.
Thor breaks out of 10+ chains.
This dragon failed to break a single chain.
This dragon could go threw rock and stone like butter.
In this video and in the script it is confirmed the dragon was shaking the ground like an earthquake.
The dragon was also able to fly at what appears to be supersonic speeds. (There seems to be a sonic boom around Thor.)
I will reiterate I am literally just paraphrasing amcu's respect thread here.
And he has more feats like ripping up a spaceship and regularly tossing around cars and such with zero effort on the lower end. Thor is a 100k tonner easily.
Hulk has feats such as lifting Avengers HQ which is a really large building while millions of gallons were on it. And he scales above Thor.
And CM scales head and shoulders above both in physical strength.
For individual strength feats she is not lacking ether. she was capable of carrying the guardians ship across thousands of lightyears effortlessly.
The ship is no slouch in size either.
The ship likely weighs hundreds maybe even thousands of tons. She also accelerated it past light speed. Not only does this shown insane endurance but also ridiculous strength. Moving something of this size at such speed is insane. Low key probably the one of the best strength feats in the MCU.
She also has of course the missle feat.
This was calced by @divinevisitor to be a 100k plus feat.
"The Missile has the following stats:
Length: 32m
Mass: 209,600kg
Speed: 7000m/s
The Kree Missile that Carol catches is about 17 Brie Larson’s long, making it about 28.9m. Slightly smaller than the R-36 but the Kree Missile is slightly wider at the base/fins so i would say they could be compared with some degree of accuracy.
Now Carol catches the missile as it’s travelling through the Atmosphere which would be re-entry speed however after having caught the missile she is only fighting against the thrust of the engine and its Mass to keep it stationary, a thrust capable of having the missile travel at 7,000m/s at maximum output. Having found a clip of the scene on Youtube it appears Carol catches the missile at 24.5s and the Missile appears to come to a standstill at 31.5s for an impact duration of 7 seconds.
Which provided an Average Impact Force of 209.6MegaNewtons or 23,560short tons-force.
If we take that as the Mass she is effectively lifting then we can work out how much force she needed to apply to push the missile back.
Next we need to workout the distance thrown and final speed of the missile in order to work out it’s acceleration. It appears that Carol takes 2 seconds to build up the strength and throw the missile which is thrown approximately 10 missile lengths, that being 289meters based on its length relative to Brie Larson and takes about 3 seconds to move this distance.
Meaning Carol can probably lift in the region of 115,700 short tons or 104,961.27tons."
This is a lowball to. It puts the speed of the missile at a mere 7km a second. It was in all reality going much faster.
It was going well over double 7 kilometers a second. Either way insane feat. Even if you call the calc bogus and ignore what divine says about it you can visually see it is well above every feat performed by Superman.
Next on to durability CM also has the clear advantage. First she no sold a headbutt from Thanos.
Which is one of his most powerful attacks, it did more damage to Ironman and Thor than his punches did and it straight up knocked Thor out. He is never seen again after this.
I think this alone should prove her blunt force is superior to Superman
Thanos wasted both Thor and Hulk with his striking yet CM no sold his attack. She is pretty much in a different tier then Hulk and Thor in durability.
Thor in endgame was nearly knocked out in 4 attacks from Thanos.
Thanos consistently decimated Thor with his strikes as well.
Thor has insane durability.
Thor has tanked shots from Kurse like theses.
He tanked around 20 plus shots from Kurse got up and then fought Malekith. This is impressive because Kurse hits really hard.
Kurse oneshots an energy field generator threw an energy field. This is impressive because the energy field has feats such as this.
Which is impressive because these ships are insanely powerful.
Thor tanked 20 punches from a character who has building level striking on the low end maybe multi building level striking.
Going straight for the throat Thor was at the epicenter of the Sokovia explosion. The explosion that disinigrated a city. He was only KO'd by this. His durability is at least small city level.
He has more flashy feats like this rough landing.
Or being at the epicenter of this powerstone explosion while recovering from a beating from Thanos.
He can no sell getting dragged through metal.
He withstood this throw. Here are some calcs on the force behind this throw.
He tanked getting slammed and dragged threw rock by a fire dragon.
He tanked what could have legit been tens of thousands if not more of tons of rock falling on him.
He could withstand blast from Gungnir.
The same weapon effortlessly killed frost giants.
Even without it CM has better stand alone feats of durability most notably rain fire.
The rain fire feat which was one shotting leviathans and wakandan ships.
Every shot causes massive damage. Yet as seen here was completely ineffective against CM.
And she has feats such as these.
I imagine that the ship was ramming her at extremely high speeds and was likely outputting a ridiculous amount of force. Full stop Supes gets ragdolled by hits that are outputting not even a tenth of the force as what CM literally just belly bumped into.
If you calced this you would likely get insane amounts of force. And we see here they were no slouch in size.
They appear to be many times longer than CM and are obviously much thicker than she is.
CM also no sold flying threw this.
Which had enough force to expand to this size.
The missiles where previously shown doing this.
This is insane durability feat as CM didn't even register explosions.
Next let's go to damage output.
CM has shown more than effective against Thanos striking wise.
Thanos before his fight with CM and after shows he was bruised extensively from their fight. And it is around the spots CM punches as well. This imo can't be a coincidence and is meant to show that CM bruised him.
This is a pic of Thanos after his fight with Cap and Wanda and he clearly isn’t that bruised.
CM punches Thanos and you can see bruises.
An even better visual of Thanos to show he wasn’t already bruised is when he was suspended in air by Wanda.
And here is one more pic of Thanos after his fight with CM that shows how damaged his face is.
Thanos had been in a literal war zone before this but he had clearly healed or was unaffected by most of what he had tanked. He went from looking fresh faced to damaged in his fight with CM.
Whenever people say Thanos tanked CM’s strikes I sigh a little because Thanos most definitely did not tank them he withstood them but CM only punched him twice and energy blasted him once had she popped of an actual combo on him instead of reaching for the gauntlet endgame likely would have ended then and there.
As for Thanos throwing her when she reached for the gauntlet it is overhyped. CM was left vulnerable when she reached for it and he took advantage of it and threw her when she could offer little to no resistance.
Harming Thanos is impressive for a multitude of reasons mainly she hurt him more then Hulk did in 2 punches to Hulks 12 and arguably scales above Mjolnir as well.
Mjolnir creates a massive shockwave that rips up solid concrete from the ground and shatters the glass of a building ridiculously far away.
Thor bullrushed Loki hundreds of meters maybe even a kilometer across the bifrost threw multiple metal walls with it.
It caused a massive shockwave that killed ripped a tank in half when Thor slammed it into caps sheild.
It caused another shockwave that leveled a large portion of a forest.
Mjolnir throws ragdolled Malekith hard enough to ragdoll those within his vicinity.
Ragdolls a 30-60 ton tank with a strike.
Thor strikes a giant 20 foot tall Malekith hard enough to send him flying and crashing into his spaceship with enough force to create a crater in the metal of his ship.
Mjolnir can be thrown through multiple Asgardian level Frost Giants.
Thor ragdolled Malekith across the sky with it.
It can create massive shockwaves that can disintegrate Surtur's superhuman fire demons and stagger Surtur himself.
Mjolnirs best strike was the Sokovia strike. While the actual busting of the landmass was the vibranium spire Thor still caused a shockwave that destroyed multiple buildings and seemed to level an entire city block at bare minimum.
Pre ragnarok Thor is multi building level with his strikes and city block level when given time to charge up his strikes.
And here is some scaling.
Thanos took this absolute beat down from Mjolnir with less visual damage then what he took from CM. And not to mention none of these feats are as impressive as Sanctuary 2 which I will get into later.
As for Hulk she definitely scales above his striking power as well.
First he could ragdoll Thor.
More feats include some like these.
He ravages Hulkbuster vertically threw a building.
He tears threw a building like it is air.
His clash with Hulkbuster causes a shockwave that shakes cars around them and ragdolls people who are in a building that is at least a 100 feet away.
He strikes the thousand plus pound Ultron across Sokovia. Ultron at least went a kilometer away. Ultron likely weighs thousands of pounds maybe a couple tons. This feat is ridiculous.
And he one shot kills a leviathan. Leviathans can fly through skyscrapers casually and no sell Ironmans artillery. The momentum of the leviathan is insane as it didn't slow down at all when going through buildings.
He ragdolls the multiton Hulkbuster hundreds of feet away.
Backhands what is likely multiple tons of metal hundreds of meters against its momentum into another machine destroying both.
Jumps threw buildings casually.
He also shatters a 40-60 ton boulder.
He blitzes straight threw a heavily armored bunker.
One shots a chitauri chariot. The same chariots could withstand getting hit by a Leviathan that was going threw buildings like butter.
He punches Abomination into the ground hard enough to shake the cars around them.
He punched threw hard packed concrete with ease and shook the road around him.
Ragdolls Hulkbuster with a knee.
Hulk has building level striking comfortably. The Leviathan feat is likely a multi building level striking feat.
As stated CM scales well above that.
CM also has individual feats of striking that are insane.
She could shatter a bridge and ragdoll Kree with the AOE of her casual punches even before she had fully realized her full potential.
This bridge was sizeable as well.
The notion of her only busting "Fodder ships" is baseless. She is still destroying tons of metal at high speeds every time she destroys one. She is outputting tons of tons of force for each ship. And she destroys many of these ships.
And it is even more impressive when you realize that those ships are really durable.
One could no sell hitting the ground at what had to be supersonic speeds seeing as how it dove through the planets atmosphere in seconds.
If Superman destroyed an object as big as those ships with a single punch the vine would go insane. CM's visual effects often cause people to lose a sense of scale but these ships are massive. And they are durable.
CM also carved threw Thanos' army like butter. She did the most individual damage of any avenger to the army. She ran threw it with utter ease. It was made clear that nothing in the army was stopping her.
She also has the Sanctuary 2 feat which is without a doubt the best non god tier striking feat in the MCU. By god tier I mean Surtur, Celestial, infinity stones, Dormammu, and Ego.
And let's talk about Sanctuary 2. It is a solid 4 kilometers in size.
Here is an image of a Q ship to give you a sense of scale.
Sanctuary was ungodly in size considering this as this is how big they were in comparison to Sanctuary.
It is like 15 plus times bigger than a Q ship. This isn't even including the fact that like 6 q ships could fit in those hole thingies. To further put things into scale it is over twice the size of Sokovia.
Sanctuary either way weighs tens of millions of tons assuming it is straight hollow. To be frank it probably weighs like 50 million plus tons. The holes CM makes in it probably is her tunneling threw over a million tons of metal straight up.
The holes literally dwarf the remains of Avengers HQ. In order to destroy that much of the ship and decimate that much metal would take insane amounts of force. The script states the engine of the ship explodes; this doesn't actually affect much as the massive hole in the ship comes entirely from CM. Sanctuary should scale above the drop pods in durability which it contains within it. Which are notoriously durable.
They can no sell being dropped from space. Drop ships are contained within Q ships and Sanctuary 2 visibly contains two Q ships inside it at the time CM flies threw it. It could hold more stacked in on it. And CM actually flies threw one meaning she likely flew through a few drop ships. And Sanctuary is likely designed of the same metal as them and is likely even more reinforced then them. Which means it isn't "featless" The metal it is made out of has feats and they are impressive to say the least.
And on page 131 of the avengers endgame script it is stated that the second time she hit it the ship listed in other words it tilted which just adds to the power of the feat by a great deal. Easily the best striking feat in the MCU barring the god tiers as I said. And far better then the WE feat which consists of Supes hitting the exposed portion of the ship causing it to explode.
Not to mention the accuser ship feat. Which is also an insane striking feat.
This ship is likely around 2000 meters long and hundreds of meters tall. Another feat out of Superman's weight class.
And she has powerful energy blast that should scale to or above her striking in output.
CM outstats Superman in everything. Triple scaling over Thor seals the deal in physical strength and everything else I made clear as to why I believe her to above Supes.
Speedwise in space CM showed supersonic speed as she maneuvered from Earth to space in seconds and fought at said speeds the entire time. The entire space fleet was wiped out in under a minute once she started moving.
For a quick opinion on Superman.
His best bullrushes are city block level. By best I mean him going all out max level just going in. And I am actually kinda tentative with city block level. The only reason I put them there is the WE feat. His consistent bull rushing power is multi building level at best imo. Here is a ton of bullrushes from Superman. Tbh the only feat here I would consider more than multi building level would be his bullrush to Zod's ship and even then it only rocked the ship and pierced a small portion of it. Probably just multi building level.
His striking power just standing is building level. Here are standing punches from him and they aren't better than building level. I post a ton of feats so I don't get called a lowballer lol.
These are Superman's feats. I must say Superman usually prefers bullrushes over punching except against Steppenwolf where he just punched him around. I also must say without his MOS clashes none of his striking feats are really even city block level.
Superman is a building buster with his strikes. With his bullrushes he is a multi building buster. This is below CM who is a building buster at least with her base strikes maybe more going of scaling and is multi city block level with her bullrushes imo.
Durability wise he peaks at sub megaton nuke level which is below Sokovia by alot and blunt force wise while he can tank a ton of shots that send him threw buildings he gets worn down as seen at the end of the DD fight. Where he was panting heavily and was noticeably worn down. Doomsday has casual city block level striking and when going all out has at least multi city block level striking scaling off how easily he overpowered Clarks bullrush. Clark was worn out and in bad shape after only a few hits from DD. (Less than a handful of hits had him in rough shape).Furthermore he was KO'd in both his Faora and Nam ek fight and near the beginning of the DD fight though that was a still recovering Superman.
Strength wise most of his feats are below 25k tons or at that level which would mean CM rips him in half with two fingers. Through some extrapolation and a debate with Divine visitor I once had I personally place him at a little over a 100k tonner. Which still means he is significantly weaker than CM to the point of getting absolutely manhandled strength wise.
Furthermore Heat vision wise he could melt metal and the like but considering CM casually no sold reentry I highly doubt it would be too effective. Certainly not as effective as CM's energy blast will be on him. Freeze breath is pretty much featless and considering how CM no sells the depths of space I once again highly doubt how effective it would be.
In conclusion CM as already stated is simply superior to Superman in everything except speed and she is better aerial combat wise then him as well. With feats including her final battle at the end of CM which I can confidently say was high hypersonic and her ability to search an entire planet in minutes.
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