Darth Vader, Darth Nihilus and Darth Malgus vs Yoda, Mace Windu, Obi-Wan Kenobi and Qui-Gon Jinn

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franky666

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All Feats. Bloodlusted. To Death!

Darth Vader
Darth Vader
Darth Nihilus
Darth Nihilus
Darth Malgus
Darth Malgus

VS

Yoda
Yoda
Mace Windu
Mace Windu
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Qui-Gon Jinn
Qui-Gon Jinn

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franky666

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Bump

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deactivated-5bfd5d714c687

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Would it be possible for Jinn + Kenobi to resist drain? Due to their attunement and connection to the force?

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ShootingNova

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#4  Edited By ShootingNova
@zaluk said:

Would it be possible for Jinn + Kenobi to resist drain? Due to their attunement and connection to the force?

No.

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deactivated-5bfd5d714c687

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@shootingnova: Then is there anything stopping Yoda from getting drained?

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Jackofalltrades2

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#6  Edited By Jackofalltrades2

@zaluk:

Yes.

Yoda being more powerful than Nihilus.His drain isn't some sort of NLF.

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WollfMyth209

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Bloodlusted Yoda could honestly solo.

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SithRevenant

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Nihilus arguably drains Jinn and Kenobi from the start. Windu can arguably defeat Malgus or Nihilus on a darker day, Vaapad at max could arguably loop Nihilus' power back at him.

Yoda defeats any one of them in single combat but if he faces Vader then it'd take much longer than any other fight.

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echostarlord117

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Lord_Tenebrous

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Kenobi, Malgus, and Vader have no feats that match telekinetically ragdolling a 1200 meter centurion-class battlecruiser, multiple 600 meter interdictor-class hyperspace capital ships, and presumably hundreds of Sith fighters typically 7 meters, all pulled from a blasted gravity well.

Yoda takes Nihilus.

Mace takes Malgus, he is a near equal to Yoda afterall.

Vader takes Kenobi, but dies to the others.

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Greysentinel365

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Kenobi or Yoda can oneshot. Mace and Obi-Wan can beat, Malgus can take Jinn and die to everyone else.

The problem is Vader. If multiple of the Jedi are left after they're done with the others they can take him.

If they don't there be problems. Though whether dead Jedi are problems depends on your point of view.

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SithRevenant

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The only chance the Sith have is if Nihilus' comparable feat to pre-ROTJ Palpatine means he can possibly hold Yoda off. But that obviously leaves Vader and Malgus to try and kill the other three. Jinn is obviously the weakest but not weak enough that he's easily beaten by either Sith. Mace and Kenobi are such hard fights that neither Vader or Malgus are going to be able to expend the energy required to properly kill Jinn.

Jedi win by surgically dissecting the Sith until Nihilus is overwhelmed.

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anti-bully

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#13  Edited By anti-bully

Yoda and Mace take it.

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Lord_Tenebrous

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No one bar Yoda can one-shot, MAYBE Mace. To say Kenobi can, is laughable fanfiction especially when he is the weakest Force sensitive here save Qui-Gon.

Kenobi has no valid feats that are even remotely comparable to telekinetically ragdolling a 1200 meter centurion-class battlecruiser, multiple 600 meter interdictor-class hyperspace capital ships, and presumably hundreds of Sith fighters typically 7 meters, all pulled from a blasted gravity well. Heck, Obi-Wan doesn't even have drain resistance.

Also, forgot about Qui-Gon. Him + Kenobi beat Vader, and the rest I already detailed in my original post.

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LordOfTheLight

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Lmfao

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/darthant66/blog/addressing-misconceptions-1-darth-nihilus/134237/

Kenobi being weaker than anyone other than Qui Gon too is priceless

Jedi team take it easily here

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Greysentinel365

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#16  Edited By Greysentinel365

Kenobi has demonstrated casual mountain level TK at his peak and years before his prime generated a Force Light powerful enough to push back an entire planet trying to drain him to a skeleton.

Not to mention he has contended with MF Anakin in a force battle who is a confirmed Sidious and Yoda tier force user. Both of which have accolades which place them as being more powerful than Nihilus.

Also, Vader, who was able to stalemate someone like Starkiller was equal with Ben Kenobi who was weaker than RotS Kenobi. So yes. By multiple methods of scaling in RotS Kenobi is at least equal to or more powerful than Nihilus and possess powers that can one-shot him.

Finally the feats the above user is trying to boast about only come from the words of a crew member. The same language ("raised" tore ship from" etc) have been used to describe Kyp retrieving the Sun Crusher from Yavin. Yet Kyp used to force to activate the engines and pull it out himself. As Nihilus likely did with the Ravager.

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LordOfTheLight

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Kenobi has demonstrated casual mountain level TK at his peak and years before his prime generated a Force Light power enough to push back an entire planet trying to drain him to a skeleton.

Not sure if it was the whole planet though. You cannot use that.

The power was stated to be equal to an army of Sith though, so that is quite impressive nonetheless

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Greysentinel365

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@lordofthelight:

Not sure if it was the whole planet though. You cannot use that.

The nexus was powerful enough to affect Kenobi lightyears away in hyperspace. Yes, it was absolutely planet sized at bare minimum. Likewise all of that power was channelled through a single artefact which explicitly focused on and tried to kill Obi-Wan. Which he then fought off.

I absolutely can use that.

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LordOfTheLight

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@lordofthelight:

Not sure if it was the whole planet though. You cannot use that.

all of that power was channelled through a single artefact which explicitly focused on and tried to kill Obi-Wan. Which he then fought off.

That is not yet certain. Unless it is stated?

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Greysentinel365

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@lordofthelight: It's made painfully clear in the novel. But if you need it outright stated in objective third person

A Jedi youngling in the Temple is taught many things. First among them is this: Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering. Beware the dark side, Jedi.

And the second lesson goes: Mastery of self is the only mastery that matters.

Obi-Wan feared greatly his self-mastery would fail.

The world outside, the world beyond his inner world, involved walking beneath an inimical sun, upon the skin of a planet that was trying to kill him, toward the stronghold of an enemy bent upon his destruction.

Wild Space

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ArkhamAsylum3

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Kenobi or Yoda can oneshot. Mace and Obi-Wan can beat, Malgus can take Jinn and die to everyone else.

The problem is Vader. If multiple of the Jedi are left after they're done with the others they can take him.

If they don't there be problems. Though whether dead Jedi are problems depends on your point of view.

What has Vader done to make him remotely a problem to the Jedi? He'd die to everyone on team 2 besides Jinn lol.

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deactivated-5d1a45e3e76be

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Jedi team, unless Vader menages to defeat Yoda.

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Reap_ii

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Yoda and Mace duo the other 2 eat popcorn and enjoy the fight

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ArkhamAsylum3

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#25  Edited By ArkhamAsylum3

@mastercilghal said:

Jedi team, unless Vader menages to defeat Yoda.

How does Vader even stand a chance at defeating Yoda when he was stalemated by a post-prime Kenobi?

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@arkhamasylum3: Vader is generally considered Sidious’s most powerful apprentice. And he wasn’t being stalemated by Kenobi . I’ll write a small post to demonstrate that. Just give me a few hours.

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Bayman007

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Team 2.

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TheOneWhoKnocks

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Yoda beats any of the 3, Mace beats any of the 3 and Obi-wan and Qui-gon duo the last one.

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@arkhamasylum3: ok, here is my explanation for why Vader was not stalemated by Ben Kenobi. I'm gonne quote several passages from the Death Star novel by Micheal Reaves and Steve Perry, which provides what is possibly the most detailed version of the fight.

Hints at Vader fighting cautiously

there are several points within the description, which, i might add, was largely from Vader's point of view, where the dark lord implies he is fighting very cautiously ( and by extension, defensively) , fearing what Obi Wan could to him:

"there had always been in Vader a small bit of worry about this day. not much, just a trace. [...]

he did not wish them to interfere, but even to warn them off would take concentration that he could not afford at the moment. Should his attention falter, Obi Wan could kill him in the blink of an eye"

source: death star

not only that, but if also read carefully the entire sequence ( and to an extent the movie itself), you can see Vader taking a defensive approach for the entirety of the fight.

Vader's undeniable superiority over Ben

there are several points thorough the fight wherein it is made quite clear that Vader is the superior combatant out of the two, both in regards to the force and skill with the lightsaber:

"Vader blocked the attack easily. Obi-Wan attacked again, and again, Vader blocked each strike.

If the old man thought he could rattle him by attacking instead of defending, he was mistaken. Vader riposted, sped up his timing, and took the initiative, forcing the erstwhile Jedi to defend.

He still had some skill, his old Master did, but he was out of practice. Vader could feel it through the Force.

Obi-Wan twirled and blocked a slash, then wove a defensive pattern with his blade. The Force was still with the old Jedi; he was able to anticipate Vader's strikes and block or parry them. But after a quick exchange, Vader felt the energy shift in his favor. "Your powers are weak, old man."

There had always been in Vader a small bit of worry about this day. Not much; just a trace. He had been sure, in his useful arrogance, that he had been stronger, had been better than the Jedi Knight who had been his teacher, and the memory of what Obi-Wan had done to him would never be erased. He had been a superior fighter even when he had been Anakin Skywalker, and yet Obi-Wan had defeated him.

Could he win now?

It was as if the old man could read his thoughts:

"You can't win, Darth. If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine."

Vader knew that Obi-Wan was taunting him by using the Sith honorific, but he would not allow himself to be baited. Obi-Wan lunged again, attacking, but Vader was ready. Their sabers clashed, sparks spewed, the stink of ozone wafted over them, but Vader stood his ground. The blades slid along each other's length, then stopped, bound together in the magnetic handle guards, the men face-to-face.

Vader shoved, hard, and they broke the clash. Obi-Wan retreated a step.

Vader felt the fierce anticipation of victory pound in his heart. "You should not have come back," he told the old Jedi.

Another exchange - four, five, six attacks and blocks - and Vader knew the old man was weakening. The Force might be strong in Obi-Wan, but the dark side was stronger in Vader. It let him anticipate his adversary's strikes and counter them almost before they began.

Obi-Wan knew it, too. He began a retreat, backing away, his lightsaber itself seeming weaker as he moved.

Vader backed Obi-Wan past an open blast door leading to the forward dock where the Rebel freighter was being held under guard. The old man was obviously tiring.

You're mine, old man, Vader thought.

But just as he was ready to deliver the final strike, Obi-Wan managed a fast series of attacks, and Vader had to move quickly to avoid the strikes. Even as old and weak as Obi-Wan was, his technique was accomplished enough that a foolish move on Vader's part could still be fatal.

A group of stormtroopers standing in the dock became aware of them. Vader felt rather than saw them notice the strange duel, and sensed the troopers heading toward them.

He did not wish them to interfere, but to even warn them off would take concentration that he could not afford at the moment. Should his attention falter, Obi-Wan could kill him in the blink of an eye."

source: death star

so, what we have is this:

  • Vader immediately understands Kenobi is out of practice, and the advantage quickly shifts to him.
  • Vader, despite not being nearly as arrogant as he was once, admits he was and is a superior fighter (which is corroborated by multiple sources).
  • Both Obi Wan and Vader himself recognize Vader as the more powerful force user of the two.

i don't know about you, but i think this is more than enough proof of Vader's superiority over Kenobi, not to mention his more impressive feats in other medias.

conclusion

so let's reiterate my points and add a minor factor:

  1. based on both the movie and the novel i used, Vader was taking an extremely cautious approach, not because Kenobi was necessarily better than him, but because he took him seriously as an opponent and didn't want to make the same mistake he made on Mustafar.
  2. As detailed in the novel, Vader was the superior overall fighter, and his victory was practically assured, had Kenobi continued to fight.
  3. i will also add that this was before Vader's prime, which came 4 years later.
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Lord_Tenebrous

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A) Kenobi's "planet" feat was accomplished with max effort and with a massive circumstantial amp. When he was actually in his grounded limits, the nexus overpowered him and was driving him to insanity. Bail had to carry him on his shoulders. Moreover this was AOTC Kenobi who did it. So the fact that people are trying to peddle the lie that AOTC Kenobi is a planet-level Force user is beyond hilarious.

B) Don't know what's more entertaining: AOTC Kenobi being planet-level, or ROTS Vader being Yoda-tier. Same guy who couldn't even decisively overpower an exhausted and hindered Dooku while significantly amped? Able to be hurled back by Kenobi's overloaded power? Unable to speedblitz Serra Keto? Unable to even compete with Sidious? Has 0 feats remotely close to Yoda, Mace and Sidious' stuff? Aside from the Theta Storm, which involved max effort, a huge amp, and he was on the brink of death the entire time, and it being Yoda-tier was from a subjective opinion. Sure. Totally confirmed.

C) Literally confirmed by the authors that Nihilus telekinetically hauled his fleet. End of story.

D) Kenobi has zero feats even remotely close to to telekinetically ragdolling a 1200 meter centurion-class battlecruiser, multiple 600 meter interdictor-class hyperspace capital ships, and presumably hundreds of Sith fighters typically 7 meters(roughly as large as a TIE fighter), all pulled from a blasted GRAVITY WELL. Kenobi doesn't even have drain resistance. Nihilus easily, effortlessly, and casually one-shots him. That's just an indisputable fact.

E) No one here bar Yoda, maybe, just maybe Mace, can one-shot Nihilus. And it's extremely unlikely that this easy win would happen given Yoda is factually given difficulty by Dooku's lightning, and Dooku's own best feat is easily levitating a 215 meter Sith cruiser in conjuntion with other unknown vehicles. Not on par with Nihilus' accomplishments.

Obi-Wan one-shotting is absolutely nothing more than laughable headcanon and fanfiction.

So with that, I depart this thread.

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dark_globe

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bloodlusted yoda and mace could clear this on their own .
they don´t even need obi wan and jinn .

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deactivated-5cae4704c27f5

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@greysentinel365: A) Malgus can beat Kenobi lol.

B) Vader never stalemated Starkiller who was able to overpower him while exhausted beyond relief in TFU " and wiped him out easily in TFU 1 the second SK broke Vader's psychological hold over him.

OT-Yoda>Nihilus.

Mace>Vader.

Jinn+Kenobi<Malgus.

Team 2, good fight.

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KeenCraft

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So a team of literal fodder vs Yoda, Obi-Wan, Mace and Jinn

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anti-bully

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GreySentinel put a thumb in my ass while wearing a Kenobi mask. Pls ban him @jedixman

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ArkhamAsylum3

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#35  Edited By ArkhamAsylum3

@greysentinel365:

Also, Vader, who was able to stalemate someone like Starkiller was equal with Ben Kenobi who was weaker than RotS Kenobi. So yes. By multiple methods of scaling in RotS Kenobi is at least equal to or more powerful than Nihilus and possess powers that can one-shot him.

Vader got stomped in TFU and lost while exhausted in TFU 2. I know you want to wank Kenobi but using Starkiller is not the way to do so.

>Starkiller contends with Sheev.

>Sub Post-Prime Kenobi am I right?

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KeenCraft

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Only Nihilus gets some swings or powers off

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WollfMyth209

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Yoda solos.

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P.S. Qui-Gon stomps.

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