Darth Sidious vs Darth Tyranus, Darth Vader and Darth Maul

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KigreTheViking

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Vs.

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Rules:

- In character

- No prep

- Perfect teamwork

- Fight takes place on Kashyyyk

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Bat_Siri

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Maybe Sidious, Not Really Sure

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GeorgeWBush

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Sidious loses all

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pr0d1gy

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Sidious get's LOL STOMPED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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DarkDefender

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Team.

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WollfMyth

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Which Sidious we talking about? RotS would likely lose, but I see D.E. taking them.

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Erkan12

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Team for sure, Maul & Dooku's presence prevents any speedblitz attempt, with Vader - Dooku - Maul's collective TK is enough to deal with Sidious' TK either, the team takes the majority.

The only way I see Sidious is winning this, if he one-shots Vader with his lightning or if he can blitz him with saber then he can deal with Dooku / Maul in a good fight.

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DarkDefender

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@wollfmyth: Too much speed and too much skill for the team.

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Holocron24

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Team

Sidious is a force to be reckoned with but Dooku's technical skill, Vader's Tk and Maul's speed is the perfect combination to seal a victory for his former apprentices

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WollfMyth

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@darkdefender: Not neccesarily. Maul was being humiliated by Sidious in a duel with the aid of Savage, despite Sidious holding back a fair bit. And this is Sidious well before his power growth in D.E., which suggests he'd be capable of defeating Maul quickly. Similarly, Sidious can end Dooku quickly as well, seeing as how he boasts dramatic physical advantages over him, alongside a more brutal fighting style, hence why he could take him down a lot faster than Yoda. And Vader's not really all that different, as he could also be taken down quickly in a duel. Not to mention just how easily Sidious can dispatch either Maul or Dooku with telekinesis mid-combat. So, if Sidious plays his cards right, he can win this.

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owie

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#12 owie  Moderator

I'll go with Sidious. I don't see a huge reason for the Vader/Dooku/Maul team to be so significantly better than the Windu, Kolar, Tiin, Fisto team that he stomped fairly easily. Most of the Sith team is better than most of the Jedi team, but as a group the Sith team is not vastly more powerful. The Sith team is clearly better than the Maul/Opress team Sidious also stomped--let's say roughly two to three times as good--but I'm not sure that difference is enough either, considering that Sidious seemed to be toying with Maul and Opress.

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DarkDefender

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#13  Edited By DarkDefender

@wollfmyth: I'm not arguing that Sidious isn't greater then each individually and I acknowledge it's a possibility that he could take out one of them and then beat the remaining two but I think the team is skilled enough to support each other by pressuring Sidious when he's focusing on one of them and I believe they have the combined stamina to outlast him.

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WollfMyth

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#14  Edited By WollfMyth

@darkdefender: That's reasonable. But it's also a possiblity that Sidious would just overwhelm one via speed/strength(likely Dooku), dispatch another with TK(likely Maul) and proceed to quickly defeat the last(likely Vader) before the other two have a chance to get up and aid him.

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DarkDefender

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#15  Edited By DarkDefender

@wollfmyth: I think it's possible for Sidious to do this to one of them but unlikely he'd have the time to do this against both. Tbh I think the Dooku scenario is less likely to succeed given he'll have Vader and Maul lending support. Sidious's best bet is to TK/electorcute Maul at the beginning of the fight.

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WollfMyth

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@darkdefender: Which he'll probably do. Sidious is an arrogant fracker, but he's aware of how capable his apprentices are. Dispatching Dooku/Maul with TK as of D.E. would be cake-walk for him so I see that happening, definitely.

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ShootingNova

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#17  Edited By ShootingNova

There's no stomp, but Sidious dies. Not saying I can't imagine a scenario where he'd win, though.

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DarkDefender

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@wollfmyth: Dispatching Dooku? It's possible but I wouldn't bet on him being able to do so fast enough before Vader and Maul engaged him.

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ShootingNova

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A simple telekinetic blast from Sidious could probably send any of them except Vader flying.

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DarkDefender

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@shootingnova: Like I said with Dooku's it's possible and Maul definitely but the question is would he have the time to draw in that kind of power given how fast his opponents are? Unless he focuses on one of them I don't think so.

Also yes I know drawing the force doesn't take longer then a brief moment but again each on the team have covered distances extremely fast.

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ShootingNova

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@darkdefender: He doesn't need to draw on anything. A casual Force Push from Sheev would send either Dooku or Maul reeling. Sheev's also faster, so he has ample time to shove them away.

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Vierus10

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team

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DarkDefender

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@shootingnova: I thought it took force users ( even powerful ones ) a moment to draw in their power to overwhelm opponents who are close to their level?

Also if Vader resists and then engages Palpatine won't the others simply recover and join the duel? I can't imagine a casual force wave by Palpatine with no build up would permanently take out both Maul and Dooku.

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ShootingNova

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I thought it took force users ( even powerful ones ) a moment to draw in their power to overwhelm opponents who are close to their level?

Well, I'd have thought that even in Canon it was painfully clear that Maul and Dooku are nowhere near Sidious' level of Force Power. In Legends it's written down like the law.

Also if Vader resists and then engages Palpatine won't the others simply recover and join the duel? I can't imagine a casual force wave by Palpatine with no build up would permanently take out both Maul and Dooku.

Vader can resist a casual Force Blast, but with enough effort he'd suffer a similar fate. And sure, they wouldn't be permanently K.O'd, but they could still be briefly incapacitated (ala Maul in the Mandalore duel) or knocked off a ledge into a river or something. With the imbalanced levels and everything that makes up Kashyyyk's environment, simply knocking away your opponent can make things considerably easier.

Besides, it won't take long for Palpatine to outduel Vader between his much greater speed/agility and superior skill, provided he doesn't hold back.

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Cosmic_Lantern

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Yoda's dueling would actually make this a better matchup IMO. Sidious no longer has the edge in sabers can be overwhelmed if not careful, Vaders presence gives them a good shot of not getting Tk'd.

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DarkDefender

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#26  Edited By DarkDefender

@shootingnova said:
@darkdefender said:

I thought it took force users ( even powerful ones ) a moment to draw in their power to overwhelm opponents who are close to their level?

Well, I'd have thought that even in Canon it was painfully clear that Maul and Dooku are nowhere near Sidious' level of Force Power. In Legends it's written down like the law.

Also if Vader resists and then engages Palpatine won't the others simply recover and join the duel? I can't imagine a casual force wave by Palpatine with no build up would permanently take out both Maul and Dooku.

Vader can resist a casual Force Blast, but with enough effort he'd suffer a similar fate. And sure, they wouldn't be permanently K.O'd, but they could still be briefly incapacitated (ala Maul in the Mandalore duel) or knocked off a ledge into a river or something. With the imbalanced levels and everything that makes up Kashyyyk's environment, simply knocking away your opponent can make things considerably easier.

Besides, it won't take long for Palpatine to outduel Vader between his much greater speed/agility and superior skill, provided he doesn't hold back.

I didn't say Maul is but I thought Dooku was. So then why do you think the team could win?

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ShootingNova

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#27  Edited By ShootingNova

@darkdefender: It all depends on how Sidious approaches this, to be honest. Lavish expenditure of his reserves on telekinetic blasts probably nets him the win, but if he stays in a duel for too long, he's gone.

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buildhare

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Team in a close one

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LondonBFR

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#29  Edited By LondonBFR

The only person within the force-choke-range of Sidious, is Maul.

My element doesn't accept telekinetic strangulation against an out-of-combat Dooku nay projecting his force defenses. With that in mind, team wins every time in a sword fight.

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MErulezall

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Which Sidious we talking about? RotS would likely lose, but I see D.E. taking them.

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echostarlord117

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Yeah, I think it should be made clear which versions we're using. I mean, I'll just assume this is RotS in which case he'll lose. It will still be a good battle, though.

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LondonBFR

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@wollfmyth said:

Which Sidious we talking about? RotS would likely lose, but I see D.E. taking them.

DE will loose even worse than ROTS.

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WollfMyth

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LondonBFR

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@wollfmyth:

Outside of his ability to conjure force storms (a non-facto in this thread) he really hasn't done anything to warrant what your saying. And that's ignoring the disadvantage that utilising a clone body puts him at.

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WollfMyth

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@londonbfr: And yet he's canonically stated to have grown in power and is capable of stomping D.E. Luke under normal circumstances(who went on to become Vader's superior).

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Lucano

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#37  Edited By Lucano

The team gets stomped like the Jedi team.

He can even speed blitz any of them and then handily take down the surviving two.

As a Force user, he is vastly superior to the three of them, together. And a better duelist also. The team has as many chances as the Jedi team...

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noobsnowman

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Team.

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schillenger420

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Palpatine has no issues with this, as he see's such a thing as the way of the Sith. He drops Maul with his lightning before ever drawing a saber, and then using his superior dueling ability/force power humiliates Vader and Dooku.... but he doesn't kill them. Instead he tells them to fight too the death, and whoever wins get's to be/stay his apprentice. The Emperor for the win, the strongest of his potential rivals is now his apprentice and the others are dead.

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Kundelar

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@erkan12 said:

Team for sure, Maul & Dooku's presence prevents any speedblitz attempt, with Vader - Dooku - Maul's collective TK is enough to deal with Sidious' TK either, the team takes the majority.

The only way I see Sidious is winning this, if he one-shots Vader with his lightning or if he can blitz him with saber then he can deal with Dooku / Maul in a good fight.

I believe that Vader's death to Sidious' lightning in ROTJ was a plot device because Vader needed to die. If he had his lightsaber and was ready for combat, he could probably absorb it with his light saber which has been shown to be reasonably effective against all force lighting attacks in canon. If it were a 1v1, Sidious could easily outspeed Vader to hit him in an unprotected spot with the lightning, but with 3v1 I don't think he would be able to get that positioning.

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freesid_stf123

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Team if this is ROTS Sidious. I would defend DE Palpatine for a majority.

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LondonBFR

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#42  Edited By LondonBFR

@wollfmyth said:

@londonbfr: And yet he's canonically stated to have grown in power

And there are sources that state Vader has become more powerful in the two years before Return of the Jedi, yet it's not convincing enough to make a real difference, as his best force feats are pre-trilogy showings. As for his master, the DE accolades hint that it's his skill and knowledge in the force that have been refined, not that his overall connection has been strengthened. And if it has, it's by a negligible amount; still disregarding how poorly his clone bodies house that power.

is capable of stomping D.E. Luke

Who is not comparable to this team even when enhanced by his family members .

under normal circumstances

On Byss. Perhaps the most potent dark side enriched environment in Star Wars lore. Feeding palpetine, while draining Luke.

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VictorGnome

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Darth Vader would solo if he was not so vulnerable to lightning. Give him a powerful Jedi-sith to back him up and protect him from that attack (Count Dooku) and he stomps. Now, in my opinion, Darth Maul would just be overkill, but still, bringing two siths to back Vader up is better than just one, so now he definitely wins 10/10 of the matches.

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Erkan12

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#44  Edited By Erkan12
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TheVivas

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Vader gives the team a victory.

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micah007123

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#46  Edited By micah007123

I think it depends on if Sidious is serious. Maul was just powerful/skilled enough to challenge him one on one for more than a few seconds while Sidious was holding back. If Sidious has the same attitude he had during his fight with Maul and Savage, I think the Team could kill him. Especially considering Dooku and Vader make much better partners than Savage imo.

Now if Sidious attacks seriously I see Maul falling quickly then Dooku and Vader go down after putting up somewhat of a struggle.

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TheVivas

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The team would have an easier time winning than Sidious would.

If give them the nod more often than not, unless Sheev decides to abuse the Force.