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#1 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio
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Darth Malgus & Satele Shan

VS

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Darth Bane & Darth Zannah

  • All combatants are at their respective peaks
  • Location: Geonosis Arena
  • Standard gear & equipment
  • Morals off
  • No prep
  • The opposing teams start 15 meters apart from each other

Who wins and why?

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#3 Posted by Greysentinel365 (2921 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus is essentially Bane lite and Satele has no business here.

Team 2 takes it.

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#4 Posted by DarthFallax (1462 posts) - - Show Bio

Satele is a weak link, and Team 2 *should* have better teamwork. Team Banites.

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#5 Edited by foxerdes (8605 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus is essentially Bane lite and Satele has no business here.

lol

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#6 Edited by the_wspanialy (2675 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus and Satele.

Malgus' feats are far less circumstancial than Bane's. I have no clue how the fight between Satele and Zannah would go.

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#7 Posted by Azronger (3516 posts) - - Show Bio

Either Bane or Zannah solo.

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#8 Posted by Tenebrous_Way (78 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus is a better warrior than anyone there and Satele can hold her own against Zannah. Team 2.

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#9 Posted by Richard96 (3762 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus is MVP but Shan is a weak link.... I don’t know

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#10 Posted by YousufKhan1212 (2172 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1, most likely.

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#11 Edited by WollfMyth209 (13068 posts) - - Show Bio
@greysentinel365 said:

Malgus is essentially Bane lite and Satele has no business here.

Team 1 takes it.

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#12 Edited by Necromancer76 (3399 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1. Satele is a weak link. Both Bane and Zannah are arguably better than Malgus as well.

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#13 Posted by JediXMan (41253 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1.

Moderator
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#14 Posted by Old_Blighty (733 posts) - - Show Bio
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#15 Posted by darthbane77 (2068 posts) - - Show Bio

Bane and Zannah, good fight though.

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#16 Edited by Greysentinel365 (2921 posts) - - Show Bio

@old_blighty: Bane and Zannah are team 1 in the title and team 2 in the OP.

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#17 Posted by Old_Blighty (733 posts) - - Show Bio
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#18 Posted by Emperordmb (1962 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus is essentially Bane lite and Satele has no business here.

Team 2 takes it.

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#19 Posted by SithRevenant (605 posts) - - Show Bio

The Emperor's Wrath 'ruined' Darth Baras who was powerful enough to trick members of the Dark Council into believing he may be the Sith Emperor's Voice. An Emperor who is renowned for stomping three previous iterations of the Dark Council.

Darth Nox dominated Darth Thanaton, who had previously one-shotted a Darth Nox who hadn't yet gained three Sith spirits.

Cipher Nine managed to defeat Darth Jadus, the most powerful Sith in the Empire per the Emperor himself, who had managed to hold a Harrower-class Dreadnought together after an internal explosion destroyed it.

The Grand Champion of the Great Hunt managed to defeat six Jedi masters and knights whilst surrounded prior to defeating Darth Tagren.

Malgus fought all four of these prior to putting them all on their knees with Force lightning, and then leaping at and Force waving them before they could react. The battle was described as intense before he was defeated and yet it's implied that he not only survived defeat but even survived the ensuing self-destruction of the Emperor's Fortress with him in it.

Satele Shan managed to crush multiple Hex droids despite an enraged Eldox Ax failing to put a dent in one of them with the Sith's own attempt at telekinesis. She's also capable of teleporting faster than the Outlander could swing a lightsaber, and shielding her mind from the tidal wave in the Force caused by the Emperor's death.

They win.

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#20 Posted by RedHeathen (1207 posts) - - Show Bio

This is a fantastic match-up. I need to read more about SS before giving my answer, so I'll get back tomorrow or maybe the next day.

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#21 Posted by Slayedigneel (1607 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1.

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#22 Posted by xolthol (246 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus feats are far better than Bane ones : during his prime he faces a combine team of wrath of the emperor 2 and darth Nox and some powerful non force sensitif people (cipher 9 and the winner of the great hunt) or the hot and the barsen'tor and the new leader of the chaos squad and a famous smuggler. And he nearly win.

For satele against zannah she isn't able to break her guard but I don't see her being hurt by zannah in any way: zannah cannot attack her with her lightsaber (really not her way of fighting) and satele don't be really impact by her illusions : she lives in a time where people are always using DS illusions so she knows how to shield her from this. So I think she can hold her own until malgus join her to kill zannah. Moreover I don't know if a powerful telekinetic blast of satele cannot overwhelm zannah defenses.

To me the only argument in favor of Bane and Zannah is that their used to work as a team. But I don't think this is enough to hive them the win.

So Malgus and Satele take this.

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#23 Edited by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio

@xolthol: While I don't agree that Malgus' feats are far better than Bane's, I do think Malgus is underrated. He's definitely in Bane/Vader-tier, IMO.

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#24 Posted by xolthol (246 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: gives me facts for bane that could place him equal to Malgus? Personnaly didn't remember any one.

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#25 Edited by Necromancer76 (3399 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: Bane and Vader aren't in the same tier. Bane and Malgus are probably at the top of theirs if we exclude all the featless Rule of Two Sith (which would put prime Zannah above both of them), while Vader is above them by a solid tier (IMO).

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#26 Posted by silvanus (406 posts) - - Show Bio

Bane doesn't have too much impressive feats without orbalisks. I'll give it to team 2, but by a narrow margin.

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#27 Posted by Richard96 (3762 posts) - - Show Bio
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#28 Posted by RedHeathen (1207 posts) - - Show Bio

@xolthol: While I don't agree that Malgus' feats are far better than Bane's, I do think Malgus is underrated. He's definitely in Bane/Vader-tier, IMO.

I agree with you on this. I think that Malgus is underrated, but so is Bane.

Bane is not <<<< Vader. He is way too underrated in this forum. I do agree that Bane is < Vader, but not by as much as @richard96 indicates.

They are both beneath Vader, but they are huge powerhouses who could contend with Vader. They are all similar.

I think this fight gets down to Zannah and Shan, and I'm having problems with this. Although, I do think that Shan is a better duelist than Zannah. If she can keep Zannah from using sorcery, then she most likely will win. If there is a break in Shan's use of her saber, then Zannah will have time to use her sorcery and will likely win.

I think this battle comes down to timing.

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#30 Edited by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio

@necromancer76 said:

Bane and Vader aren't in the same tier. Bane and Malgus are probably at the top of theirs if we exclude all the featless Rule of Two Sith (which would put prime Zannah above both of them), while Vader is above them by a solid tier (IMO).

What puts Vader solidly above Bane? Granted I think Vader>Bane, but the difference isn't vast, IMO.

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#31 Posted by Necromancer76 (3399 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: Solid isn’t the same thing as vast. Regardless, his dueling is better and force feats like bringing down a cathedral come to mind.

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#32 Posted by Greysentinel365 (2921 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: Vader is miles ahead due to Banite/Dooku and Maul scaling.

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#33 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio

bringing down a cathedral come to mind.

Bane's Lehon feat matches this, tbh.

Vader is miles ahead due to Banite/Dooku and Maul scaling.

How do Vader/Maul/Dooku benefit from Banite scaling?

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#34 Edited by Richard96 (3762 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: @redheathen:

Malgus and bane are similar, but Vader has a such better scaling than both of them that isn’t even funny. Besides, he has even considerably better feats.

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#35 Posted by Laurus (598 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1.

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#36 Posted by Necromancer76 (3399 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: Bane had multiple circumstances in his favor when he performed that feat, one of which being a darkside amp from the temple itself. Vader, however, was weakened when he performed his feat.

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#37 Posted by the_wspanialy (2675 posts) - - Show Bio

@necromancer76 said:

bringing down a cathedral come to mind.

Bane's Lehon feat matches this, tbh.

Bane was amped when he performed that feat.

@greysentinel365 said:

Vader is miles ahead due to Banite/Dooku and Maul scaling.

How do Vader/Maul/Dooku benefit from Banite scaling?

Oh dear Lord, here we go again.

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#38 Edited by Helloman (13980 posts) - - Show Bio

Team one wins.

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#39 Posted by SithRevenant (605 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_wspanialy: Bane grew massively since PoD, so that amp is irrelevant.

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#40 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio

Malgus and bane are similar, but Vader has a such better scaling than both of them that isn’t even funny.

Which are? I need material for my Vader wank.

\

he has even considerably better feats.

Malgus dominating the Empire's Fury puts him really close to Vader, IMO.

Bane had multiple circumstances in his favor when he performed that feat, one of which being a darkside amp from the temple itself.

Yeah, but this was Bane prior to growing in power and reaching his prime.

@dawn_of_ages said:
@greysentinel365 said:

Vader is miles ahead due to Banite/Dooku and Maul scaling.

How do Vader/Maul/Dooku benefit from Banite scaling?

Oh dear Lord, here we go again.

?

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#41 Posted by Necromancer76 (3399 posts) - - Show Bio
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#42 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio
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#43 Posted by Necromancer76 (3399 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: What proof do you have that he grew a lot, if at all

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#44 Edited by Dawn_of_Ages (535 posts) - - Show Bio

@necromancer76:

End of POD Bane>Lehon Bane who busted a temple.

Rather than have Bane tear the Sith apart, Kaan sent assassins to kill him. Bane only got stronger however.

--Taken from: The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

Orbalisk Bane before the orbalisks fully develop>POD Bane.

"Bane reached inward to call upon the dark side, drawing it not only from himself but also from the orbalisks fastened to his chest and back. Feeling an incredible surge of power beyond any he had known before, he released it in a burst of energy. The hallucinations that had plagued his wounded mind ever since the detonation of the thought bomb vanished, instantly and utterly annihilated by his newfound power.He was stronger now than he ever had been, and he knew the visions of the dead Sith would haunt him no more."

--Taken from: Rule of Two

Ten years into the infestation then he should be obviously be more powerful and has far more orbalisks attached to his body. And DoE Bane is even more powerful than peak orbalisk Bane.

(credit to Emperordmb for the quotes)

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#45 Posted by Richard96 (3762 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages:

Vader is the 80 per cent of ROTS sidius, who, per the banite scaling, is a god compared to bane.

Vader brought down cathedrals and freighters while massively pre prime

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#46 Posted by Tenebrous_Way (78 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages:

Vader is the 80 per cent of ROTS sidius, who, per the banite scaling, is a god compared to bane.

Vader brought down cathedrals and freighters while massively pre prime

If I'm not mistaken, Vader only brought down the freighter that had it's engine damaged. Malgus in Deceived did prevent one from taking off despite the full engagement of it's engines (to the point the engines started to whine) for a significant ammount of time - and that's considering he didn't want to damage the freighter as he tought his lover had been there. That's also before he received a massive upgrade after killing his lover and twelve years before his prime; years where the novel describe that "his understanding of the force grew daily".

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#47 Posted by Richard96 (3762 posts) - - Show Bio

@tenebrous_way:

Fair enough, but there is still the cathedral plus the banite scaling (even scaling from dooku, a guy who easily ragdolled several large cruisers and used then to make a barrier).

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#48 Posted by Tenebrous_Way (78 posts) - - Show Bio

@richard96: bringing down buildings isn't superior than manipulating ~40m ships, to be honest, especially considering how powerful their engines are.

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#49 Posted by Richard96 (3762 posts) - - Show Bio

@tenebrous_way:

That cathedral was so big that it was described as a labyrinth... besides, was it official stated that the ship malgus held in place was 40 m long?

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#50 Posted by Tenebrous_Way (78 posts) - - Show Bio

@richard96: My approach is that a ship that is accelerated at it's full power directly at the building would destroy it, since it's physically equivalent to what Malgus did. I also forgot to add that Zeerid modified the engines to be even more powerful than those of a stock freighter.

About the size, all that's given is that it's slightly larger than average light freighter and significant smaller than some 500m large freighters. So, considering most small freighters have 30m length, it should be pretty safe to assume ~40m minimum for the ship in question.