Current luffy vs barragan

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War_monger

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Vs

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Win by death

No soul crush &no coC haki knock out

Starts 20m apart

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Morningstar999

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If he blitzes, Luffy stomps.

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Yray

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Barragan can't even perceive luffy and do anything to reach or come in contact with luffy so not sure how there's a slight chance of him winning

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Luffy blitz and oneshots

Inb4 barragan can age willpower/ambition (lmao)

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Astraea

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#4  Edited By Astraea

Luffy should be faster and stronger

But Barragan aging hax is passive IIRC

So I'll go with Luffy. (Due to speed and Ryou)

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Delein

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either luffy blitzes or he gets passively aged...could og either way.

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Occhidifalco11

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Luffy blitz and one-shots

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Akira21

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Luffy oneshots

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Raziel2014

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#8  Edited By Raziel2014

Baraggan stomps terribly,

those claiming Blitz have honestly not seen bleach because they forgot Baragan Time Dilation field which slows everything down, for baragan fighters like luffy are the easiest to kill

speed is literally the most irrelevant thing against Baragan yet people claiming he wins because of it lol, how is speed going to help when you cant even hurt your enemy and if you do you die, luffy cant do anything about Respira as its a 360 AOE attack, haki aint helping him and he has no Range attacks either.

lastly the speed fiasco of fiction, you are under the assumption that luffy is actually faster than baragan without any canon statement to back it up, people should leave speed out of vs because its all base on fan perception, the actual canon has Mid tiers at Top speed of 200kmph.

some even think he cant age Haki, the guy can age Souls, Kido and all Physical things yet he cant age a simple Haki you have to be a pretty high on one piece to believe such BS.

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shirso

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Luffy blitzes and one shots with the ranged CoC + CoA attack

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exauce

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@shirso said:

Luffy blitzes and one shots with the ranged CoC + CoA attack

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FaradaySloth

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#11  Edited By FaradaySloth

Speed is irrelevant to Barragan due to the time dilation which is potent enough to make quint to six digit mach characters become the speed of a turtle instantly, but not surprising that the same people here don't know what or how time dilation works.

Oh, and I haven't even gotten to the aging aspects that's straight passive and can cover multiple city blocks, potent enough to decompose objects that otherwise would take tens of thousands to millions of years even. So shockingly, the same people who don't know how time dilation works, likely won't know how Respira or shit, aging manipulation works.

Or if they do know how both aspects work, they'll just say Luffy has resistance to them, just because he's Luffy, oh and remember a couple feet in One Piece is the size equivalent to about a cubic kilometer in Bleach, so Luffy must clearly "have" the ability needed for "resistance." Fake it till you make it I guess.

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LimitBreaker1

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Speed is irrelevant to Barragan due to the time dilation which is potent enough to make quint to six digit mach characters become the speed of a turtle instantly, but not surprising that the same people here don't know what or how time dilation works.

Oh, and I haven't even gotten to the aging aspects that's straight passive and can cover multiple city blocks, potent enough to decompose objects that otherwise would take tens of thousands to millions of years even. So shockingly, the same people who don't know how time dilation works, likely won't know how Respira or shit, aging manipulation works.

Or if they do know how both aspects work, they'll just say Luffy has resistance to them, just because he's Luffy. Fake it till you make it I guess.

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Saxz

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This is bad match up, I think Zoro would ROFL stomp with Long range attacks and law would make a joke out of him.

But Luffy might get his ass aged if he attempt a blitz, good that he has COO to prevent that, but that buys him a stalemate at best but that stalemate wouldn't last long with his low movement speed.

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shirso

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Seems people don't get how Luffy's new ability works. He is essentially blasting Ryou into his opponent and hurting them from range without having to make direct physical contact:

It doesn't matter if Barragan's time dilation slows down his punch, the Ryou would still deal internal damage and kill him. Inb4 Barragan can age different energies from out of verse because he could age Kido.

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Saxz

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@shirso:

Seems you don't know how respira works, He can't get that close to barragan without dying.

And since when does aging hax have to do with energy type??

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shirso

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@saxz said:

@shirso:

Seems you don't know how respira works, He can't get that close to barragan without dying.

He will get blitzed before he can go into his Released form.

And since when does aging hax have to do with energy type??

Because energy doesn't really "age" in the real world, so we shouldn't assume what applied to Kido would also apply to other forms of energy. If his powers were described as decaying energy in general or had feats of affecting various different forms of energy that'd be one thing. We know that's not true though, for instance, his powers clearly don't affect light, as he can be seen.

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Saxz

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#17  Edited By Saxz

@shirso:

That would be true, but look at the OP this is released Barragan.

It wasn't just Kido, He literally aged a blast from a missile, fireball, shockwave and all. So yeet goes that argument. It wouldn't really matter if energy ages in the real world, people don't fly and shoot laser beams in the real world, Point is; this is Fiction and he made aging energy his ability.

But it's ultimately irrelevant because energy don't last forever, even the sun the longest lasting energy I can think of Runs out of time.

The light part is a weak argument, its one of the things we just chuck up to fiction so the narrative can continue. Like supersonic characters not making sonic booms and burning up their clothes.

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Wot_m8

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#18  Edited By Wot_m8

Barragan is easily the worst opponent for Luffy, he cannot blitz coz of time dilation. CoA or CoC would never even make contact, Luffy would die before he reaches since the range of Respira is like multi-blocks while CoA or CoC Ryou seems to be working from very close range. Like, less than a foot.

Best case scenario, Luffy one shots Barragan and gets dusted immediately afterwards. Close range fighters cannot take Barragan.

Zoro would be a way better opponent to beat Barragan due to his range.

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shirso

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@saxz said:

@shirso:

That would be true, but look at the OP this is released Barragan.

He can still be blitzed before he increases its AoE too much. And @war_monger does Barragan start in base or released form here?

It wasn't just Kido, He literally aged a blast from a missile, fireball, shockwave and all. So yeet goes that argument. It wouldn't really matter if energy ages in the real world, people don't fly and shoot laser beams in the real world, Point is; this is Fiction and he made aging energy his ability.

Soi Fon's Bankai explosion is also going to be entirely reiatsu based like a Kido, so? He has proven he can affect reiatsu and as stated in Bleach, reiatsu is indeed a form of energy that decays eventually. We shouldn't apply reiatsu's weakness to other forms of energy out of verse.

But it's ultimately irrelevant because energy don't last forever, even the sun the longest lasting energy I can think of Runs out of time.

That's a misunderstanding, energy never decays in the real world, it can only be converted to another form. The sun will eventually die because it will run out of enough Hydrogen atoms to sustain nuclear fusion and generate energy.

To give an example, the light emitted from stars9 billion years (that's more than half the age of the universe !)ago can be captured by NASA telescopes. Because energy doesn't decay or age in the real world.

The light part is a weak argument, its one of the things we just chuck up to fiction so the narrative can continue. Like supersonic characters not making sonic booms and burning up their clothes.

Indeed, I'd chuck it up to PiS if he had feats of affecting different forms of energy besides reiatsu which has been explicitly stated to be susceptible to aging unlike energy in real world.

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FaradaySloth

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Hm, like I mentioned, apparently a couple feet in One Piece's world is the equivalent of multiple city blocks I'm guessing.

Inb4 Barragan can age different energies from out of verse because he could age Kido.

Ok so Luffy doesn't have any Reiatsu/Spiritual pressure which means

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Luffy, the weaker spiritual force, absorbs the impact of his blows.

GG, no re. Also doesn't have Reikaku, which means Luffy can't even see nor sense Barragan, meaning Luffy doesn't even know who he is fighting with.

I love these games

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Saxz

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@shirso said:
@saxz said:

@shirso:

He can still be blitzed before he increases its AoE too much. And @war_monger does Barragan start in base or released form here?

you're thinking, About the black miasma he uses for attack, that's different. He has a passive defense that extends 2 meters about him.

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Soi Fon's Bankai explosion is also going to be entirely reiatsu based like a Kido, so? He has proven he can affect reiatsu and as stated in Bleach, reiatsu is indeed a form of energy that decays eventually. We shouldn't apply reiatsu's weakness to other forms of energy out of verse.

Most form of energy fade out eventually, it isn't about reiatsu. so is Haki a form of energy that last forever??? Because I have seen people run out of Haki and Haki discharged as aura fades out.

And secondly the missle isn't pure reiatsu, it's being coverted to a missile through an ability and posses the properties of a missile. Yes it is reiatsu based but not like a kido that's just pure energy. It's like Chakra-elemental transformation ninjutsu.

That's a misunderstanding, energy never decays in the real world, it can only be converted to another form. The sun will eventually die because it will run out of enough Hydrogen atoms to sustain nuclear fusion and generate energy.

To give an example, the light emitted from stars9 billion years (that's more than half the age of the universe !)ago can be captured by NASA telescopes. Because energy doesn't decay or age in the real world.

Lol if you're using that Logic, matter doesn't decay either but gets converted from one form to another, That doesn't stop barragan from making it irrelevant. I am not saying the energy is going to "decay" like biologically. I mean it's going to lose its potency/fade away/burn out with time. Like an explosion lasting for only few seconds.

And you're mistaking, the core of Barragan's ability is a time hax not a biological decay/aging hax, it's still just variant of his time abilities, like the time dilation, he fast forward time to ensue decay. That's why he can affect energy he just transforms them to a state they would be thousands of years later. If Barragan ability was a degradation hax you'd have a point

If you're making this argument for Haki, then you're saying the Energy Luffy releases would stay unchanged in the atmosphere forever or at least for thousands of years. Haki has no such feats.

Fires don't last forever, so does shockwaves, they fade away with time, Barragan deflecting the blast wasn't about reiatsu.

The point you made with Light is a good one, but Haki isn't light, it's just another aura type energy that fades away after being discharged.

Indeed, I'd chuck it up to PiS if he had feats of affecting different forms of energy besides reiatsu which has been explicitly stated to be susceptible to aging unlike energy in real world.

Bruh, this isn't about reiatsu and most energy don't stay in the same state forever, they burnout and fade away. I gave you an example with the sun, fires, lightning, explosion, shockwaves,

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shirso

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#22  Edited By shirso

@saxz: Yeah I know Barragan essentially time accelerates his targets, somewhat like Deer King from Toriko, and I already showed you forms of energy like light in the real world not decaying for billions of years. Stuff like fire or lightning aren't good examples, because again, the energy itself isn't decaying, it's just the fire is running out of fuel, or the lightning is getting absorbed by the target it hits. For matter it's a bit different, if you lay a concrete block out in the open, it's going to break down eventually due to exposure and what not, and Barragan just accelerates the process, but energy isn't affected like that.

I just feel we shouldn't apply the weakness of Reiatsu and reiatsu based constructs, a form of energy that's explicitly noted to age and decay with time, to other forms of energy, especially out of verse, but we are at an impasse now.

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Expo7

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Luffy blitzes and oneshots

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Saxz

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@shirso:

It's the other way round, Light isn't a good example because light has a weird relationship with time, that's why I can dare you to bring up another example, but it will be the only example you can bring up, and Haki isn't Light.

The problem is you're mistaking, all forms of energy are susceptible to time one way or another, it isn't a special weakness for reiatsu, Barragan just stated the obvious. Some may last thousands or billions of years but if it isn't for eternity it's susceptible to his time acceleration.

I proved to you that Most energy do burnout with time, no energy last forever, be it fires, lightning or nuclear explosions, if fires last forever then they would continue to burn even after the fuel gets exhausted, but that isn't the case, same with lightning, they all have a life cycle they burn through. I am not saying the energy would die or get destroyed, matter/energy can't be destroyed(mostly), I am Saying both energy and matter have a life cycle they burn through before being converted or transformed to whatever.

The sun has to be the biggest mass of energy around, Hypothetically if he was that powerful what do you think would happen if Barragan used time acceleration on the sun?? It would blow past all its billions of years life cycle and eventually turn into a white/black dwarf, dead stars that emit no energy. Yeah, that's my point, Being susceptible to time isn't a weakness for reiatsu. It's a weakness in general, burden of proof is on you to show Haki doesn't have that weakness.

Barragan said it himself, the only weakness to his ability is eternity so you're proving Haki can last for an eternity.

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SkySanji

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Luffy blitz and oneshots any Espada

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EcoBlitz

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#27  Edited By EcoBlitz

Ah yes the haki can age literal willpower argument has surfaced

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shirso

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@saxz:

It's the other way round, Light isn't a good example because light has a weird relationship with time, that's why I can dare you to bring up another example, but it will be the only example you can bring up, and Haki isn't Light.

Light is the easiest example because it doesn't get dispersed easily unlike other forms of energy such as heat, sound or vibrations which are easily dispersed into the surroundings.

If you want another example, think of Newton's First Law. Any object in motion, will stay in motion with the same velocity for eternity unless some external force is applied. That's Kinetic energy not decaying for eternity.

The problem is you're mistaking, all forms of energy are susceptible to time one way or another, it isn't a special weakness for reiatsu, Barragan just stated the obvious. Some may last thousands or billions of years but if it isn't for eternity it's susceptible to his time acceleration.

They are susceptible in the sense they can get dispersed or absorbed or transformed into another form, whatever, but they don't decay as I am sure you know.

I proved to you that Most energy do burnout with time, no energy last forever, be it fires, lightning or nuclear explosions, if fires last forever then they would continue to burn even after the fuel gets exhausted, but that isn't the case, same with lightning, they all have a life cycle they burn through. I am not saying the energy would die or get destroyed, matter/energy can't be destroyed(mostly), I am Saying both energy and matter have a life cycle they burn through before being converted or transformed to whatever.

The energy that the fire releases into the surroundings as heat and light isn't going anywhere, it's just that the fire itself is running out of fuel, the lightning bolt is just getting absorbed into whatever target it strikes and the energy is heating up the target, causing chemical reactions, or whatever.

The sun has to be the biggest mass of energy around, Hypothetically if he was that powerful what do you think would happen if Barragan used time acceleration on the sun?? It would blow past all its billions of years life cycle and eventually turn into a white/black dwarf, dead stars that emit no energy. Yeah, that's my point, Being susceptible to time isn't a weakness for reiatsu.

Yeah, if Barragan was that powerful and used his ability on the sun he would accelerate the fusion process and cause it to burn through all its fuel instantly, however the light and heat the sun has already released isn't going to go anywhere or be "aged".

It's a weakness in general, burden of proof is on you to show Haki doesn't have that weakness.

If it was something like heat or sound Barragan might have had a chance since those easily disperse into their surroundings, like a hot object eventually cools down, but that doesn't hold for light or haki.

Barragan said it himself, the only weakness to his ability is eternity so you're proving Haki can last for an eternity.

Any form of energy can last for an eternity under ideal conditions lol. Place a very hot object in a pure vacuum, and it's going to stay hot forever, generate vibrations in a completely lossless medium and those vibrations are gonna stay forever. That's just how energy works. Reiatsu is special in that regard.

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Jieldre

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This is gonna turn messy

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wabanana

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I seriously question the intelligence of anybody who says Luffy blitzes and one shots. Barragan wins just by existing

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Yray

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its far more retarded to think a manifested concept (willpower/ambition) can be aged or decayed ..if this isn't the definition of reach then i don't know what is

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Omnihater

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Haki.

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FaradaySloth

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Haki doesn't need to be aged to be rendered useless in this fight.

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Ob1Toe

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@faradaysloth: but but but but but..... where are barragans internal durability feats???? muh ryou

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TDHT

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Luffy gets aged anyways it never covers his entire body so why bother

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Bink_69

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Depends on if Haki can age. If it can, then Luffy loses here

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IndomitableRegal

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I'm not gonna pretend to be a Luffy expert, but Barragan is a terrible opponent for anything resembling CQC.

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Edgelord91

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Luffy shortened his lifespan back in impel down. Barragan dust him

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Occhidifalco11

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Luffy still blitz and one-shots

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Saxz

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@shirso said:

@saxz:

Light is the easiest example because it doesn't get dispersed easily unlike other forms of energy such as heat, sound or vibrations which are easily dispersed into the surroundings.

If you want another example, think of Newton's First Law. Any object in motion, will stay in motion with the same velocity for eternity unless some external force is applied. That's Kinetic energy not decaying for eternity.

They are susceptible in the sense they can get dispersed or absorbed or transformed into another form, whatever, but they don't decay as I am sure you know.

Maybe decay or aging is the wrong word, Light and K.E and some forms of energy do act like that without interference but so does matter.

you're just rehashing the law of conservation of matter/energy. I know they can't be destroyed, it goes the same for energy as well as matter, by this logic a human doesn't decay, it just get transformed into baser elements like gas, liquids and salts.

The energy that the fire releases into the surroundings as heat and light isn't going anywhere, it's just that the fire itself is running out of fuel, the lightning bolt is just getting absorbed into whatever target it strikes and the energy is heating up the target, causing chemical reactions, or whatever.

Yeah, if Barragan was that powerful and used his ability on the sun he would accelerate the fusion process and cause it to burn through all its fuel instantly, however the light and heat the sun has already released isn't going to go anywhere or be "aged".

If you claim a lightning isnt "dying" but just losing its charge or a flame/sun isn't "dying" but just being converted to heat and light, well you're not wrong. But by that logic a human isnt "decaying" either just getting converted/absorbed by something else, Rocks don't really decay either most of them have being here since the formation of the solar system, they just get changed from one form to another.

If it was something like heat or sound Barragan might have had a chance since those easily disperse into their surroundings, like a hot object eventually cools down, but that doesn't hold for light or haki.

Any form of energy can last for an eternity under ideal conditions lol. Place a very hot object in a pure vacuum, and it's going to stay hot forever, generate vibrations in a completely lossless medium and those vibrations are gonna stay forever. That's just how energy works. Reiatsu is special in that regard.

Lol you still don't get it, it isn't just energy, basically all matter would act that way if you force those ideal conditions. Let's see, you talk about light/heat in space right, good now throw a human in space he doesn't decay, it would just float around probably for eternity if it doesn't come across any external interference, most Rocks wouldn't change their composition without interference either. So Humans and rocks won't decay now? Because Barragan has feats of affecting both.

And if you're still going the light route, Planets which are made of rocks as long as they aren't Desyroyed or interfered ,even last longer than the stars which produces those Lights.

It isn't a reiatsu thing though, Barragan was able to age rocks and if we're being technical they can last longer than light or most form of energy in ideal conditions or without interference. Although these are all besides the point because Barragan doesn't battle in those specific ideal conditions you're bringing up, which makes almost everything susceptible to his abilities.

A kido would naturally dissipate into reishi or whatever with time, Chakra/Ki/nen or most aura construct also dissipate with time, since I am yet to see any of those construct lasting forever after made.

You're yet to show said feats of Haki construct lasting forever without dissipating into whatever, the Haki shield the admirals put up at marineford was gone as soon as they stopped pouring energy into it. These are showings that Haki does indeed dissipate into the atmosphere like most forms of energy.

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Gilateen

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Luffy stomps every Espada.

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Delein

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Luffy shortened his lifespan back in impel down. Barragan dust him

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FaradaySloth

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@delein said:
@edgelord91 said:

Luffy shortened his lifespan back in impel down. Barragan dust him

Nice pickup, considering Barragan managed to turn stone to dust in a second at most, this would only mean it'd take minuscule fractions of a second for Luffy to suffer the same fate.

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Morningstar999

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Barragan turns him into dust.

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Edgelord91

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Mikesterling200

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@tdht: he has future sight so he's just going to use haki at that part of his body

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TDHT

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deactivated-607e9bb17db48

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Barragan wins via hax

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CHt82

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crxckerkiid

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@faradaysloth: The time slow would be useful if Luffy wasn't leaps and bounds faster than the characters that Barragan was beating.