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#51 Posted by Nathaniel_Christopher (3301 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

@Nathaniel_Christopher said:

This is all assuming that Cyclops would hit Dooku to begin with. As it is, The Force would warn him in time to dodge the attacks.

A fact I already acknowledged, but can we be sure Dooku could evade his optic blast long enough to cross half a mile distance?

He could use TK to send any object at the team as a attack or distraction.

Proof that Dooku can telekinetically affect matter from hundreds to thousands of feet away?

Or just screw with their minds.

Again, proof that Dooku can telepathically affect people from hundreds to thousands of feet away? More importantly, when has Dooku ever penetrated mental shielding of the degree that some of the X-Men members possess? He has entered and scanned Obi-Wan's mind with partial success, and that required time on his part. Obi-Wan was susceptible to his probing at some length but not altogether, and he was in no position to draw very heavily on the Force to bolster his mind. I fail to see why someone like Wolverine, whose mental shields have been tested against high level telepaths, would be so easy for Dooku to influence, let alone influence him and the other X-Men characters simultaneously, all the while dodging blasts from Cyclops and traveling half a mile.

I was simply stating it in terms of my post.

I wasn't trying to imply he could effect them from that range. I think he'd be moving forward while all of this was going on. Once close enough he could then of course simply throw something at them with TK. In terms of dodging, I don't see why he wouldn't be able to. He'd know the blasts were coming and from where, and the force enhances his reflexes. Also didn't mean to imply he'd take them all down with telepathy. More that it'd be a combination of things.

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#52 Posted by Jezer (3409 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

@Jezer said:

retarded that poster was.

'Kay, not sure what the necessity in this comment was.

No "necessity"

@Jezer said:

Sometimes you just can't resist commenting even if its an old post.

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#53 Posted by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nathaniel_Christopher: I am still not convinced. People keep mentioning what Dooku is able to do without providing any specific examples of his powers in play for these purposes or how he would assess his present situation and respond to it. For instance, I have never once seen Dooku operate his Force Speed for anything more than increasing his reaction time, processing speed, and combat speed. No instances of him running at superhuman speeds have ever been shown to my recollection. Could he apply his Force Speed for that purpose? I believe so, as characters in his general speed class can run invisibly fast, but the fact that there are no examples of it is detrimental to a case being formulated for Dooku. I also have never seen any agility feats from him to substantiate the claim that he could avoid Cyclops' blast long enough to cover half a mile. Dooku is, after all, a Makashi practitioner; agility is not his strong-suit, as Makashi is more precise and refined or proper, so to speak, relying on foot work rather than sporadic leaping motions. It is conceivable that he is an Ataru master as well (Ataru being an acrobatic form), given that Yoda, his surrogate master, and Qui-Gon, his student, focused on Ataru and given that Dooku taught Grievous to be a master of all lightsaber forms, but even then, Dooku himself has stated that he prefers to practice one lightsaber form so that he can become a master of that form instead of using his time to learn all forms but not master any of them. However, even if he does know Ataru or other agility-based combat styles, Makashi is a normality for him, and he has no especially good agility feats. This leaves us with him simply running the distance, but as I said, he has no movement speed feats, only combat speed feats. So this basically devolves into a speculative argument that he can run and evade Cyclops' blast based on powers he should have, a case I simply have a hard time buying into. 
 
Now, to correct an assertion I said earlier: while Cyclops can increase the beam radius of his blast to the point that it would be too broad to be deflected by Dooku's lightsaber, I overlooked the fact that Dooku could swing his lightsaber fast enough to form a shield out of its blade and parry it that way. But is Dooku even capable of redirecting that much concussive force coming at him? Possibly, if Cyclops' morals prevent him from emitting it with much force. But as we saw when Dooku dueled Anakin, enough raw force behind a blow can stagger and weaken him. Anakin, as a Djem So master, relies on speed and strength to overcome enemies in skill matches. Makashi lacks the "kinetic output" (as the RotS novelization put it) to repel the blows of a seasoned Djem So swordsman. It is within the realm of possibility that the same would happen here: Cyclops could just project too much force for Dooku to efficiently defend against with his lightsaber. With that said, it again falls back on the idea that he can run the distance and avoid his blast the whole time, and I find that difficult to believe, at least for a majority. If Dooku came in close, I absolutely agree that he would win this. He has many options at his disposal and many advantages over the opposing team: He has Force perceptions to discern enemy tactics, superior combat speed/reaction time to any of them, telekinetic powers he can use, Force Lightning, Dun Moch, etc. But he has to cross the initial gap to do any of this, and that is where my doubts come in.
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#54 Posted by umbrafeline (5919 posts) - - Show Bio

is dooku jedi or sith in this fight?

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#55 Edited by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@umbrafeline said:

is dooku jedi or sith in this fight?

I would assume a Sith, since the most recent usable version of Dooku was a Sith, and since most people know him as a Sith Lord anyway. Also, Dooku has few feats as a Jedi. The only ones that come to mind are moving his blade in a blur when he was only twelve, beating Mace Windu in lightsaber combat, and being a notable user of Telekinesis.
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#56 Posted by Joygirl (21036 posts) - - Show Bio

Recall that this is a marina, with boats, buildings, etc. They may be far away, but come on guys. It isn't a mile-long expanse of desert for Cyclops to spew lasers across. Dooku can weave through the buildings and get close that way.

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#57 Posted by JediXMan (42073 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

X-Men. Cyclops + 1000 yd. starting distance seems like a formula for victory to me.

Morals on + lots of cover with civilians + precog. I am rather confident that Dooku can close the distance here.

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#58 Posted by Jedi Wolverine (188 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going for the X-Men here - provided that there are no civilians present which the OP doesnt state one way or the other.

I'm actually going to take the battle to Dooku instead of viceversa.

Cyclops will constantly keep up a barrage of optic blasts that Dooku will have no choice but to notice with blocks/parrys and dodges.

During this time the rest of the X-Men split into two teams and use a pincer movement to nail Dooku.

Wolverine and Gambit one way and Beast and Armor the other.

These guys are pretty quick and when they get into close proximity - 50 yards or so - Gambit can add to Cyclops barrage with the addition of explosions at Dooku's feet or whereever he sees fit.

These two actions are going to stagger and 'overload' Dooku i believe and all it takes is a strike from Beast or Wolverine once the last few yards are closed and Dooku goes down. Hes not going to survive being stabbed by Logan or having his head punched just once by Beast who has very high strength/striking power.

There is nothing to suggest Dooku has feats of Durability to withstand that kind of physical damage.

If Dooku takes his eye of the ball for even a moment with the 4 X-Men rushing him then Scott nails him.

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#59 Posted by Nathaniel_Christopher (3301 posts) - - Show Bio

I understand where you're coming from and I don't like to use other's feats to boost a character's chances or speculate however I think in this situation they could be used, if only for the fact thast they all draw from the same power source. For example, using the Force to enhance one's speed and reflexes is a basic Force Power (In Dooku's time at least). We've seen both Yoda and Mace, two of Dooku's contemporaries use it. Given that, it'd seem to me as if it would be more likely for him to have access to the skill than not. It can even be explained why we've never seen him use it as he's never been in a situation where it'd be required and as you said, his dueling style isn't suited for it.

I simply don't see him deflecting Cyclops optic blasts at all personally, especially not if Scott hits him with full power.

I think it just comes down to whether or not you think he has access to Force Speed or not. If he does, when you combine that with his other abilities, I could see him getting in close and stomping. If not, then it relies soley on his ability to dodge and possibly counter. Given the fact he can see and sense his opponents, i'd personally think he'd be able to telekinetically attack them or throw something at them, but you're right when you say there's no proof he could.

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#60 Edited by Iju (167 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

@Iju said:

how can compare to telepathic powers? dude, he HAS them. jedis can do ANYTHING. all dooku has to do is use the force and tell them to kill theirselves. END OF BATTLE. you REALLY need to look at the star wars series...such a person like you who would say that....*shakes head* just proves your ignorance..dooku has LIGHTING POWERS..but why am i going to far? all he needs to to is to tell all of them to kill theirselves

Not really sure why you responded to a post made months ago, but anyway. I have never seen Dooku telepathically influence another character with mental shielding before, such as the X-Men have, and I have read every major appearance Dooku has. And not to be demeaning, but I found your comment about Jedi being able to do anything humorous.

is ok if you find what i say humorous. that doent mean its not true..and YOU are wondering why i came here made months ago? dude, you're doing the same thing...

ANYWAY.... with the force, the jedi/sith can do litteraly ANYTHING. just because YOU haven't seen dooku take mind control, doesnt mean he hasn't. i really dont care about the comics. its the movies i care about. and the movies are way more reliant that the comics, anyway. there is also lots more to dooku than you think. just look at the Clone Wars. dooku can choke someone from far away. this doesant have to be a close contact fight...

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#61 Posted by ReVamp (23015 posts) - - Show Bio

Dooku.

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#62 Posted by Jedi Wolverine (188 posts) - - Show Bio

@Iju said:

@Silver2467 said:

@Iju said:

how can compare to telepathic powers? dude, he HAS them. jedis can do ANYTHING. all dooku has to do is use the force and tell them to kill theirselves. END OF BATTLE. you REALLY need to look at the star wars series...such a person like you who would say that....*shakes head* just proves your ignorance..dooku has LIGHTING POWERS..but why am i going to far? all he needs to to is to tell all of them to kill theirselves

Not really sure why you responded to a post made months ago, but anyway. I have never seen Dooku telepathically influence another character with mental shielding before, such as the X-Men have, and I have read every major appearance Dooku has. And not to be demeaning, but I found your comment about Jedi being able to do anything humorous.

is ok if you find what i say humorous. that doent mean its not true..and YOU are wondering why i came here made months ago? dude, you're doing the same thing...

ANYWAY.... with the force, the jedi/sith can do litteraly ANYTHING. just because YOU haven't seen dooku take mind control, doesnt mean he hasn't. i really dont care about the comics. its the movies i care about. and the movies are way more reliant that the comics, anyway. there is also lots more to dooku than you think. just look at the Clone Wars. dooku can choke someone from far away. this doesant have to be a close contact fight...

First up your statement is simply untrue - The Jedi/Sith are extremely powerful (top tier) but able to literally do anything? No.

Are Palpatine, EU Luke, Yoda etc very powerful? Yes but certainly not able to do 'anything'...............

Dooku perhaps has the chance to use Force Choke on an opponent if he had the concentration to do it, im not sure that he is as powerful as Vader with this ability if you want to go by the films only - regarding your comment above. However this is academic as Dooku will be pummeled by Optic Blasts straight off the bat and WILL have his concentration broken.

Also Silver2467 and JediXMan are pretty much authorites - or as close as damn it - when it comes to Starwars knowledge on this site so perhaps a bit more respect is called for.

Your StarWars movie knowledge < Silver2467 StarWars EU knowledge it would appear.

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#63 Posted by Joygirl (21036 posts) - - Show Bio

Quick question: Isn't there a form of force shield? Yoda did it in Soul Calibur, can't recall if they can actually use the Force to create barriers or not. Seems plausible.

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#64 Posted by Nathaniel_Christopher (3301 posts) - - Show Bio

@Joygirl said:

Quick question: Isn't there a form of force shield? Yoda did it in Soul Calibur, can't recall if they can actually use the Force to create barriers or not. Seems plausible.

Yes there is. Like with any barrier though it won't last forever.

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#65 Posted by Joygirl (21036 posts) - - Show Bio

But it can hold for long enough to get behind a building or some such. He has too many methods of attack, defense, and crowd control not to eventually win this.

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#66 Posted by Jedi Wolverine (188 posts) - - Show Bio

@Joygirl said:

Quick question: Isn't there a form of force shield? Yoda did it in Soul Calibur, can't recall if they can actually use the Force to create barriers or not. Seems plausible.

Good tactic for Dooku to use but im not so sure that a shield put up could withstand Scotts blasts - these are concussive in force (if im not mistaken) and if shielded against would perhaps still knock Dooku back somewhat.

Im sure Scott took out a chunk of a mountain before with his blast so Dooku is going to have his hands full - i could see Dooku dodging to be a better tactic

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#67 Posted by Nathaniel_Christopher (3301 posts) - - Show Bio

@Joygirl said:

But it can hold for long enough to get behind a building or some such. He has too many methods of attack, defense, and crowd control not to eventually win this.

It could. Honestly though, dodging the blasts and hiding behind some buildings is the best way to go. Wolverine of course would be able to find him because of his sense of smell, but Dooku will always know where they are via the Force, so its no great loss if he loses sight of them for a while.

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#68 Edited by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@JediXMan said:

@Silver2467 said:

X-Men. Cyclops + 1000 yd. starting distance seems like a formula for victory to me.

Morals on + lots of cover with civilians + precog. I am rather confident that Dooku can close the distance here.

Maybe. 
 

@Nathaniel_Christopher

said:

@Silver2467

I understand where you're coming from and I don't like to use other's feats to boost a character's chances or speculate however I think in this situation they could be used, if only for the fact thast they all draw from the same power source. For example, using the Force to enhance one's speed and reflexes is a basic Force Power (In Dooku's time at least). We've seen both Yoda and Mace, two of Dooku's contemporaries use it. Given that, it'd seem to me as if it would be more likely for him to have access to the skill than not. It can even be explained why we've never seen him use it as he's never been in a situation where it'd be required and as you said, his dueling style isn't suited for it.

I simply don't see him deflecting Cyclops optic blasts at all personally, especially not if Scott hits him with full power.

I think it just comes down to whether or not you think he has access to Force Speed or not. If he does, when you combine that with his other abilities, I could see him getting in close and stomping. If not, then it relies soley on his ability to dodge and possibly counter. Given the fact he can see and sense his opponents, i'd personally think he'd be able to telekinetically attack them or throw something at them, but you're right when you say there's no proof he could.

Dooku does have Force Speed, as he has displayed in just about every fight he has been in, but I have never seen him operate it for superhuman running speed or very good agility. And that is why this could become a somewhat speculative argument. 
 
EDIT: In Dooku's Jedi one-shot, there was a scene where Quinlan Vos escapes a battle running superhumanly fast, and Dooku catches up to him. Quin has shown the ability to run in a blur before; so presumably, he would run similarly fast here. However, how long it took Dooku to catch up with him is never stated, and how far away Quin ran is never stated either. As well, Quin did stop running and talk before Dooku emerged; so whether this actually counts for much of a running speed feat is arguable, especially since, in the first scan, Dooku is shown walking in Vos' direction, rather than running.
Gallery image 1Gallery image 2
 
@Iju said: 

is ok if you find what i say humorous. that doent mean its not true..and YOU are wondering why i came here made months ago? dude, you're doing the same thing...

What? 
 

ANYWAY.... with the force, the jedi/sith can do litteraly ANYTHING.

Right... 
 

just because YOU haven't seen dooku take mind control, doesnt mean he hasn't.

Actually, it does. If he has no feats with Mind Control, there is no reason to assume he would bring it to bear here or that he would be successful with it against characters with telepathic resistances. 
 

i really dont care about the comics. its the movies i care about. and the movies are way more reliant that the comics, anyway.

I have no idea what this has to do with anything, but if you rely on the movies, then Dooku would be stomped. His feats in the movies are nowhere near impressive enough to suggest he would win this. And he never used Mind Control in the movies either.
 

there is also lots more to dooku than you think.

LOL @ this. I have read just about everything Dooku has appeared in, but there is more to him than I think?
 
Alright.
 

just look at the Clone Wars. dooku can choke someone from far away. this doesant have to be a close contact fight...

Show me Dooku using Choke from hundreds to thousands of feet away.
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#69 Posted by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@Joygirl said:
Quick question: Isn't there a form of force shield? Yoda did it in Soul Calibur, can't recall if they can actually use the Force to create barriers or not. Seems plausible.
There is, but Dooku has never used it before.
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#70 Posted by umbrafeline (5919 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

@umbrafeline said:

is dooku jedi or sith in this fight?

I would assume a Sith, since the most recent usable version of Dooku was a Sith, and since most people know him as a Sith Lord anyway. Also, Dooku has few feats as a Jedi. The only ones that come to mind are moving his blade in a blur when he was only twelve, beating Mace Windu in lightsaber combat, and being a notable user of Telekinesis.

what force powers does dooku have?

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#71 Posted by JediXMan (42073 posts) - - Show Bio

@Iju said:

its the movies i care about. and the movies are way more reliant that the comics, anyway. there is also lots more to dooku than you think.

just look at the Clone Wars. dooku can choke someone from far away. this doesant have to be a close contact fight...

Now hold on.

Either it's JUST the movies, or you are forced to include the comics when talking about the Clone Wars - as characters like Asajj came from you know, the COMICS. Pick ONE: Either it's JUST the movies, or you are including it all as one thing (which I do and everyone should)

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#72 Edited by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@umbrafeline: Dooku has the basic Farseeing/Sense/Vision and other perception related abilities, and of course physically enhancing ones, like Jump and Speed. 
 
With Speed, he has various common feats: 
 
Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3
 He moves his blade in a blur (Dooku was only twelve, IIIRC, when he did this; so he was still inexperienced at the time). 

There was a flash of surprise on Lorian's face when he noted the coldness in Dooku's gaze. He stumbled backward as Dooku came at him furiously, his lightsaber a blur of color and motion.

--Taken from Legacy of the Jedi
  
Dooku throws blows imperceptibly fast. 

Skywalker leapt for him again, and this time Dooku met the boy's charge easily. They stood nearly toe-to-toe, blades flashing faster than the eye could see, but Skywalker had lost his edge: a simple taunt was all that had been required to shift the focus of his attention from winning the fight to controlling his own emotions.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith

He throws kicks before falling pieces of broken battle droids hit the ground. 
Kenobi reached the top of the stairs and a single slash of his lightsaber dismantled both droids. Before their pieces could even hit the floor Dooku was in motion, landing a spinning side-stamp that folded Skywalker in half; he used his last burst of dark power to continue his spin into a blindingly fast wheel-kick that brought his heel against the point of Kenobi's chin with a crack like the report of a huge-bore slugthrower, knocking the Jedi Master back down the stairs. Sounded like he'd broken his neck.
Wouldn't that be lovely?
--Taken from Revenge of the Sith
 
He moves his blade fast enough to generate several blurs simultaneously forming a red "lace." 

The blinding scarlet blur of Dooku's lightsaber split the air, slashing a burning line along Yoda's side before chopping his desk in half.

Then their blades clashed together in a lace of fire, green and red: but the green burned hotter. Slowly, slowly, Dooku gave way: and in the dark, drunken Vjun air, Yoda was terrible to behold.

--Taken from Yoda: Dark Rendezvous 

He makes two blurs at once, drawing an X with his blade. 
Dooku couldn't suffer another moment of it.
"No, no, stop, stop," he yelled, coming to his feet and striding to the middle of the training circle, his arms extended to both sides. When he was certain that he had their attention, he swung to Grievous. "Power moves served you well on Hypori against Jedi such as Daakman Barrek and Tarr Seir. But I pity you should you have to face off against any of the Council Masters." He called into hand his courtly, curve-handled lightsaber and drew a rapid X in the air—a Makashi flourish.
--Taken from Labyrinth of Evil

Dooku has also beaten characters such as Grievous, who can throw a couple dozen blows a second, in duels; beaten Obi-Wan, who can deflect blaster fire from entire armies, in duels; beaten Anakin, who could move his blade fast enough to appear to have multiple blades and cover himself in light, in duels; and fought Yoda, who is faster than characters such as Grievous, Obi-Wan, and Anakin. 
 
Telekinetically, Dooku easily collapsed boulders on Tholme and Chokes Quinlan Vos. 
Gallery image 1Gallery image 2
Dooku shows moderate Force Flight: 

Dooku leaned forward, and his cloak of armorweave spread like wings; he lifted gently into the air and descended to the main level in a slow, dignified Force-glide.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith
 
He moves his lightsaber invisibly fast: 

A twitch of the Force brought his lightsaber to his hand with invisible speed, its brilliant scarlet blade angled downward at his side.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith  
 
He breaks part of a stone ceiling onto Yoda. 

A wave of Dooku's free hand sent a piece of machinery flying at the diminutive Jedi Master, seeming as if it would surely crush him. But Yoda was ready, waving his own hand, Force-pushing the flying machinery harmlessly aside.
Dooku clutched up at the ceiling, breaking free great blocks that tumbled down at Yoda. But small hands waved and the boulders dropped to the sides, bouncing across the floor all about the untouched Master Yoda.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones 
  
Knocks over a crane onto Anakin and Obi-Wan. 

"Fought well, you have, my old Padawan," Yoda congratulated, and his lightsaber bean to move out, just a bit, forcing Dooku back. 
"The battle is far from over!" Dooku stubbornly argued. "This is just the beginning!" Reaching into the Force, he took hold of one of the huge cranes within the hangar and threw it down at Obi-Wan and Anakin.  
"Anakin!" Obi-Wan cried. He grabbed at the plummeting crane with the Force, and Anakin, startled awake, did so, as well. Even working together, they hadn't the strength left to stop its crushing descent.  
But Yoda did. 
Yoda grabbed the crane and held it fast, but in doing so, he had to release Dooku. The Count wasted no time, sprinting away, leaping up the ramp to his sail ship. As Yoda began to move the fallen crane harmlessly aside, the sail ship's engine roared to life, and all three Jedi watched helplessly as Count Dooku blasted away.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones 
 
He throws Obi-Wan across a room and then breaks a walkway onto him. 

While Kenobi's bonelessly limp body was still tumbling toward the floor far below, Dooku sent a surge of energy through the Force. Kenobi's fall suddenly accelerated like a missile burning the last of its drives before impact. The Jedi Master struck the floor at a steep angle, skidded along it, and slammed into the wall so hard the hydrofoamed permacrete buckled and collapsed onto him.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith
 
None of his TK feats are particularly amazing, but it is worth noting that none of them required much effort on his part. 
 
Dooku knows Lightning as well, but the best Lightning feat he has is killing several Kiffar warriors, which, while decent, is not extaordinary. 
No Caption Provided
He uses Lightning and Telekinesis at the same time. 

But this was no simple warrior enemy. Dooku's hand shot out toward the charging Jedi, sending forth a Force push as solid as any stone wall, and a burst of blue Force lightning, unknown to Jedi, charged all about the trapped and lifted Jedi Padawan. Anakin managed to hold onto his lightsaber as he went up into the air, held there by the power of the Count. With a wave of his hand, Dooku sent Anakin flying across the room, to crash into a distant wall, where he slumped down, dazed.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones
  
Dooku has some other abilities, such as Doppelganger. 

Tracking Dooku to the Techno Union foundries on Metalorn, Anakin valiantly faced the Count again and, to the young Jedi's surprise, seemingly defeated the Sith Lord. But it was in fact another of Tyranus' tricks. Dooku created a Doppelganger, a weaker dark side manifestation of himself, to detain Anakin and further lure him to the dark side. Count Dooku escaped once again.

--Taken from The Official Star Wars Fact File #116
  
He knows Dun Moch: 
Dooku slipped aside from an overhand chop and sprang backward. "I sense great fear in you. You are consumed by it. Hero With No Fear, indeed. You're a fraud, Skywalker. You are nothing but a posturing child."
He pointed his lightsaber at the young Jedi like an accusing finger. "Aren't you a little old to be afraid of the dark?"
Skywalker leapt for him again, and this time Dooku met the boy's charge easily. They stood nearly toe-to-toe, blades flashing faster than the eye could see, but Skywalker had lost his edge: a simple taunt was all that had been required to shift the focus of his attention from winning the fight to controlling his own emotions.
--Taken from Revenge of the Sith
 
And Dooku has other non-combat useful abilities, like Beast Control, Detoxify Poison, or suppressing other Jedis' abilities.
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#73 Posted by Chaos Prime (11585 posts) - - Show Bio

Ok Guys/Gals just done a slight Edit - The Marina is Unpopulated for this encounter & i have put in Bold now that CD has use of the Dark Force which was in the OP..

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#74 Posted by umbrafeline (5919 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

@umbrafeline: Dooku has the basic Farseeing/Sense/Vision and other perception related abilities, and of course physically enhancing ones, like Jump and Speed.

With Speed, he has various common feats:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3
He moves his blade in a blur (Dooku was only twelve, IIIRC, when he did this; so he was still inexperienced at the time).

There was a flash of surprise on Lorian's face when he noted the coldness in Dooku's gaze. He stumbled backward as Dooku came at him furiously, his lightsaber a blur of color and motion.

--Taken from Legacy of the Jedi

Dooku throws blows imperceptibly fast.

Skywalker leapt for him again, and this time Dooku met the boy's charge easily. They stood nearly toe-to-toe, blades flashing faster than the eye could see, but Skywalker had lost his edge: a simple taunt was all that had been required to shift the focus of his attention from winning the fight to controlling his own emotions.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith

He throws kicks before falling pieces of broken battle droids hit the ground.
Kenobi reached the top of the stairs and a single slash of his lightsaber dismantled both droids. Before their pieces could even hit the floor Dooku was in motion, landing a spinning side-stamp that folded Skywalker in half; he used his last burst of dark power to continue his spin into a blindingly fast wheel-kick that brought his heel against the point of Kenobi's chin with a crack like the report of a huge-bore slugthrower, knocking the Jedi Master back down the stairs. Sounded like he'd broken his neck.
Wouldn't that be lovely?
--Taken from Revenge of the Sith


He moves his blade fast enough to generate several blurs simultaneously forming a red "lace."

The blinding scarlet blur of Dooku's lightsaber split the air, slashing a burning line along Yoda's side before chopping his desk in half.

Then their blades clashed together in a lace of fire, green and red: but the green burned hotter. Slowly, slowly, Dooku gave way: and in the dark, drunken Vjun air, Yoda was terrible to behold.

--Taken from Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

He makes two blurs at once, drawing an X with his blade.
Dooku couldn't suffer another moment of it.
"No, no, stop, stop," he yelled, coming to his feet and striding to the middle of the training circle, his arms extended to both sides. When he was certain that he had their attention, he swung to Grievous. "Power moves served you well on Hypori against Jedi such as Daakman Barrek and Tarr Seir. But I pity you should you have to face off against any of the Council Masters." He called into hand his courtly, curve-handled lightsaber and drew a rapid X in the air—a Makashi flourish.
--Taken from Labyrinth of Evil

Dooku has also beaten characters such as Grievous, who can throw a couple dozen blows a second, in duels; beaten Obi-Wan, who can deflect blaster fire from entire armies, in duels; beaten Anakin, who could move his blade fast enough to appear to have multiple blades and cover himself in light, in duels; and fought Yoda, who is faster than characters such as Grievous, Obi-Wan, and Anakin.

Telekinetically, Dooku easily collapsed boulders on Tholme and Chokes Quinlan Vos.
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Dooku shows moderate Force Flight:

Dooku leaned forward, and his cloak of armorweave spread like wings; he lifted gently into the air and descended to the main level in a slow, dignified Force-glide.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith

He moves his lightsaber invisibly fast:

A twitch of the Force brought his lightsaber to his hand with invisible speed, its brilliant scarlet blade angled downward at his side.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith

He breaks part of a stone ceiling onto Yoda.

A wave of Dooku's free hand sent a piece of machinery flying at the diminutive Jedi Master, seeming as if it would surely crush him. But Yoda was ready, waving his own hand, Force-pushing the flying machinery harmlessly aside.
Dooku clutched up at the ceiling, breaking free great blocks that tumbled down at Yoda. But small hands waved and the boulders dropped to the sides, bouncing across the floor all about the untouched Master Yoda.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones

Knocks over a crane onto Anakin and Obi-Wan.

"Fought well, you have, my old Padawan," Yoda congratulated, and his lightsaber bean to move out, just a bit, forcing Dooku back.
"The battle is far from over!" Dooku stubbornly argued. "This is just the beginning!" Reaching into the Force, he took hold of one of the huge cranes within the hangar and threw it down at Obi-Wan and Anakin.
"Anakin!" Obi-Wan cried. He grabbed at the plummeting crane with the Force, and Anakin, startled awake, did so, as well. Even working together, they hadn't the strength left to stop its crushing descent.
But Yoda did.
Yoda grabbed the crane and held it fast, but in doing so, he had to release Dooku. The Count wasted no time, sprinting away, leaping up the ramp to his sail ship. As Yoda began to move the fallen crane harmlessly aside, the sail ship's engine roared to life, and all three Jedi watched helplessly as Count Dooku blasted away.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones

He throws Obi-Wan across a room and then breaks a walkway onto him.

While Kenobi's bonelessly limp body was still tumbling toward the floor far below, Dooku sent a surge of energy through the Force. Kenobi's fall suddenly accelerated like a missile burning the last of its drives before impact. The Jedi Master struck the floor at a steep angle, skidded along it, and slammed into the wall so hard the hydrofoamed permacrete buckled and collapsed onto him.

--Taken from Revenge of the Sith

None of his TK feats are particularly amazing, but it is worth noting that none of them required much effort on his part.

Dooku knows Lightning as well, but the best Lightning feat he has is killing several Kiffar warriors, which, while decent, is not extaordinary.
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He uses Lightning and Telekinesis at the same time.

But this was no simple warrior enemy. Dooku's hand shot out toward the charging Jedi, sending forth a Force push as solid as any stone wall, and a burst of blue Force lightning, unknown to Jedi, charged all about the trapped and lifted Jedi Padawan. Anakin managed to hold onto his lightsaber as he went up into the air, held there by the power of the Count. With a wave of his hand, Dooku sent Anakin flying across the room, to crash into a distant wall, where he slumped down, dazed.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones

Dooku has some other abilities, such as Doppelganger.

Tracking Dooku to the Techno Union foundries on Metalorn, Anakin valiantly faced the Count again and, to the young Jedi's surprise, seemingly defeated the Sith Lord. But it was in fact another of Tyranus' tricks. Dooku created a Doppelganger, a weaker dark side manifestation of himself, to detain Anakin and further lure him to the dark side. Count Dooku escaped once again.

--Taken from The Official Star Wars Fact File #116

He knows Dun Moch:
Dooku slipped aside from an overhand chop and sprang backward. "I sense great fear in you. You are consumed by it. Hero With No Fear, indeed. You're a fraud, Skywalker. You are nothing but a posturing child."
He pointed his lightsaber at the young Jedi like an accusing finger. "Aren't you a little old to be afraid of the dark?"
Skywalker leapt for him again, and this time Dooku met the boy's charge easily. They stood nearly toe-to-toe, blades flashing faster than the eye could see, but Skywalker had lost his edge: a simple taunt was all that had been required to shift the focus of his attention from winning the fight to controlling his own emotions.
--Taken from Revenge of the Sith And Dooku has other non-combat useful abilities, like Beast Control, Detoxify Poison, or suppressing other Jedis' abilities.

from what i read here about the count and what i know of the xmen involved, i say its going to be close and the sith shall prevail ^_^

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#75 Posted by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio

Hm. Seems I'm the only one who thinks the X team wins. 
 
How unusual.

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#76 Posted by Jedi Wolverine (188 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467 said:

Hm. Seems I'm the only one who thinks the X team wins. How unusual.

In fact i believe the X-Men win too if you read my posts and points above.

I believe they could take Dooku though certainly not easily.

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#77 Posted by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@Jedi Wolverine said:

@Silver2467 said:

Hm. Seems I'm the only one who thinks the X team wins. How unusual.

In fact i believe the X-Men win too if you read my posts and points above.

I believe they could take Dooku though certainly not easily.

Oh. Sorry for overlooking your comments.
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#78 Posted by Bo88gdan (5453 posts) - - Show Bio

X men FTW

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#79 Posted by Iju (167 posts) - - Show Bio

@JediXMan said:

@Iju said:

its the movies i care about. and the movies are way more reliant that the comics, anyway. there is also lots more to dooku than you think.

just look at the Clone Wars. dooku can choke someone from far away. this doesant have to be a close contact fight...

Now hold on.

Either it's JUST the movies, or you are forced to include the comics when talking about the Clone Wars - as characters like Asajj came from you know, the COMICS. Pick ONE: Either it's JUST the movies, or you are including it all as one thing (which I do and everyone should)

its the movies. MOVIES FOREVER!!!! :)

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#80 Posted by Strider1992 (18501 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Dooku would probably take this.

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#81 Edited by Pharoh_Atem (44247 posts) - - Show Bio

I am going what Darth Tyranus but my mind can be changed.

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#82 Edited by steelhound56 (1076 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sufferthorn said:

@jashro44: Irrelevant, Wolverine alone could take Dooku in my opinion. There is no possible way Dooku will be able to avoid Cyclops attack with his Lightsaber, and Gambit, who can create explosive power in any minor object would simply be too much.

I don't think Beast would have a prayer though.

And what is Wolverine going to do against someone like Dooku? Jedi Masters and Sith Lords (even one as old as Dooku) display far greater movement, reaction, and combat speed than anyone on the X-Team.

Assuming Dooku is bloodlusted, he could take out Cyclops, Beast, Gambit and possibly Armor by using The Force to affect their internal organs. He has displayed the ability to do so with Asajj Ventress, someone who could actually resist with her own Force power. Since no one on the X-Team is Force Sensitive, they have no such protection.

He can make any X-Team member without significant regererative ability suffer any fatal internal injury. This includes, but is not limited to, anuerysms, heart attacks, or suffocation via a crushed windpipe. Wolverine isnt invincible due to his adamantium skeleton either. He still has spaces inbetween his ribs, and Dooku's fighting style Makashi, which emphasizes on thrusts and stabbing attacks. Dooku could easily pierce Wolverine heart through his ribs to incapacitate him for a time while he deals with the other team members

Dooku has displayed enough reaction and combat speed to fight multiple Jedi opponents at once, and has bested Mace Windu in combat (one of the Order's best swordsmen)

A lightsaber as a weapon is nothing to balk at. It will cut everybody on this team, exception of Wolverine, which it will cut to his adamantium skeleton. And Dooku is one of the best swordsmen in the SWverse.

He also possesses Jedi precog ability and perception. Think of it like a Spider Sense on steroids. He can feel the surroundings of whatever environment he is in through The Force, granting him clarivoyance on the battlefield.

In combat, Dooku sees things right before they happen. And due to his Jedi training he can read intention (i.e. he will know whenever Scott is going to fire a blast, or Gambit throwing cards etc.)

Dooku is too much for the X-Team to handle.

He doesnt stomp, but the X-Team dies

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#83 Posted by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@steelhound56 said: 

And what is Wolverine going to do against someone like Dooku? Jedi Masters and Sith Lords (even one as old as Dooku) display far greater movement, reaction, and combat speed than anyone on the X-Team.

Assuming Dooku is bloodlusted, he could take out Cyclops, Beast, Gambit and possibly Armor by using The Force to affect their internal organs. He has displayed the ability to do so with Asajj Ventress, someone who could actually resist with her own Force power. Since no one on the X-Team is Force Sensitive, they have no such protection.

He can make any X-Team member without significant regererative ability suffer any fatal internal injury. This includes, but is not limited to, anuerysms, heart attacks, or suffocation via a crushed windpipe. Wolverine isnt invincible due to his adamantium skeleton either. He still has spaces inbetween his ribs, and Dooku's fighting style Makashi, which emphasizes on thrusts and stabbing attacks. Dooku could easily pierce Wolverine heart through his ribs to incapacitate him for a time while he deals with the other team members

Dooku has displayed enough reaction and combat speed to fight multiple Jedi opponents at once, and has bested Mace Windu in combat (one of the Order's best swordsmen)

A lightsaber as a weapon is nothing to balk at. It will cut everybody on this team, exception of Wolverine, which it will cut to his adamantium skeleton. And Dooku is one of the best swordsmen in the SWverse.

He also possesses Jedi precog ability and perception. Think of it like a Spider Sense on steroids. He can feel the surroundings of whatever environment he is in through The Force, granting him clarivoyance on the battlefield.

In combat, Dooku sees things right before they happen. And due to his Jedi training he can read intention (i.e. he will know whenever Scott is going to fire a blast, or Gambit throwing cards etc.)

Dooku is too much for the X-Team to handle.

He doesnt stomp, but the X-Team dies

Commendable argument. Most (not all) of the users who said that Dooku wins never gave much in way of reasons for why he wins; so I appreciate you doing so. Personally, I still think the X team would win, but this post in particular at least verifies that the subject is debatable.
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#84 Posted by steelhound56 (1076 posts) - - Show Bio

The only catch in my argument is that Dooku would have to close at least 950 yards before he could do any of what my argument entails. The best defense he could hope to muster is that the X-Team knows about him, but they dont know where he is exactly.

They just know he is 1,000 yards away in a general direction. Dooku shouldnt try to blitz. He should use the time its going to take the X-Team to close the distance between them to set up an ambush tactic of some sort. IIf Dooku has full knowledge of the X-Team, he would know they are extremely dangerous and could very well defeat him.

Here's what Dooku does if he has the brains God gave a bantha...

He lets the X-team come to him. While they are closing the distance (which would take them about 5 min.) He moves into the buildings that are part of the battlefield, and uses his Force perception to sense his enemies approach to his current location (both Logan and McCoy have enhanced senses of hearing and smell).

Summers would likely set Wolverine as the vanguard of the attack, as he can track Dooku once he has his scent, and is the most durable of the group. While Logan scouts, the rest deploy into their devised attack strategy. Summers is a great tactical mind, and would keep the team close, but in tactically sound positions to cover one another. Logan tracks the Count rather quickly, and the two engage in battle, with some "bubs" involved in the ensuing confrontation, Logan being in character and all.

Dooku has the advantage against Wolverine one on one, and since he has knowledge of Logan's abilities, he will know he can't bring him down permanently. Dooku would likely TK Logan into a building, and collapse the roof on him, taking him out of commission for the time being.

Basking in his victory over the mutant, Dooku begins to monologue about how foolish Wolverine was for confronting him one on one. Several mentions of the power of the Dark Side will be in there somewhere. Midway through his gloating, The Force snaps at him of impending danger. Dooku moves without thought as a full power optic blast nearly takes his head off.

During the fight, Wolverine commed in Dooku's position to Scott. Dooku finds himself facing the remainder of the X-Team. Dooku assesses that Scott and Gambit are the two biggest threats on the field, due to their sheer destructive power. With blinding speed, Dooku brings his lightsaber to his right hand, drawing his lightsaber into a Makashi flourish. "Come on then, whelps. I haven't got all day." Dooku states in a snide, contemptuous manner.

The X-Team moves to destroy the Sith Lord, but Dooku moves quicker. The Dark Side renders the Force subservient to his whim, unlike those Jedi fools back in his own reality. And as well organized, well thought out as his foe's plan of attack is here, they do not know the power of the Dark Side. Gambit and Scott move simultaneously to attack the Count. The X-Men, incredible their powers might be, still have to track their target and aim to strike. Dooku allows no such time to be afforded

Both Gambit and Scott miss their mark. Where they moved fast, Dooku was faster. He now stands 30 feet from where he had stood just a moment ago. "My my, it seems that you fools might be a challenge after all." Dooku taunts the X-Team, using the subtle art of Dun Moch to cloud their intention and feed anger into their judgement. "But it seems this farce needs to end. I dont have time to waste on bugs like you."

Dooku once again moves with incredible speed, and closes the distance between Scott and himself in the blink of an eye. Scott moves to activate his visor, but Dooku already knows what he plans to accomplish. The Force had told him of Scott's intention before he had even begun to move. In a blur of red light, Dooku amputates the man's arm at the elbow, and follows his slash with an elegant thrust through the mutant's heart. The fool falls to the ground, with a smoking hole in his chest.

Dooku does not have time to relish his victory. There is a battle on, after all. The Force touches him with a searing intensity aimed at his left shoulderblade. While he had disposed of his first opponent, the rest are now moving to destroy the Sith Lord. Dooku feels the card lancing through the air towards his back, he feels the impending fury of the blue one's savage strike. He knows what destruction the girl in the glowing armor can bring. He even knows the frusturated rage that the clawed one is using to cut his way out of his stone imprisonment. He knows all of this in less than a split second. And he moves to bring about the end for these insects just as quickly.

The slightest push of the Dark Side redirected the glowing card straight into the chest of the shaggy blue animal leaping at him. The card detonates upon impact, sending the animal spinning through the air to thud noisily on the ground below, unconscious. Summoning the Force to his service, he leapt to avoid the armored woman's strike. He raised an eybrow in mid leap as he saw the deep crater in the ground produced by the blow. I will have to be careful of that one Dooku mused as he pivoted halfway through his leap to face the one who threw the exploding card. He was in motion before he touched the ground, channeling his rage and hatred into lancing blue forks of lightning, sprouting from his fingertips and hitting his opponent square in the chest.

He relished his screams of pain and fear through the Force, using it to further fuel his Dark Side powers. He was forced to relent his barrage however, as the girl had moved in for another attack. No matter. He wont be getting up. Dooku thought as he pivoted to face his next victim. The smell of burnt hair and charred flesh filled the air as the man behind him fell to the ground, badly burned but still alive. The girl's power was absolutely astonishing, each missed blow having the impact force of a turbolaser cannon on the surrounding terrain. Dooku spent lavishly on his Force reserves to augment his agility and reflexes to avoid the girls onslaught. His lightsaber wasnt having an effect on the girl's glowing armor either. Using a burst of Dark Side energy, he propelled himself away from his assailant, using the little time afforded to gather the Dark Side around him for a vicious counterattack.

The armor protects the girl from external influence, but not internal The Sith Lord realized as he reached out past himself, taking hold of the girls neck through dark tendrils of the Force. For all her destructive power, she is still a mere insect. Dooku snapped the poor girls neck with a thought. As he let go of the body, Dooku looked at the scene around him. His shoulders rose and fell from the exertion. He was not a young man, and he tired more quickly than he did in his younger days. The fight is not over Dooku heard the Force whisper in his ear.

Hot pain lanced through his left shoulder as a blue blur of claws, teeth, and hot fury bore down upon him. The Beast recovered from the redirected attack quicker than anticipated, and now used his superhuman strength and agility to avoid the Count's flourishing lightsaber and attack in unexpected and savage vigor. One thrust from Dooku missed wide, and Dooku paid for his missed attack by having two feet slammed into his chest, sending the Sith Lord into the air. This needs to end quickly Dooku thought while using the Force to dampen to blow and ride the impact to land on his feet. As he touched down on the ground, Dooku gathered the Dark Side to him once again, melting away the pain in his left shoulder and erase the years age had weighed upon him.

The blue creature, lost in savage berserker rage, threw himself at the Count. Mid leap, something slammed into him like a brick wall, sending him hurtling in the air. Using his enhanced agility to right himself before he hit the ground, the creature landed on all fours, stalking the Count with predatory grace. Dooku swept his lightsaber into a low guard, prepared for the attacking monster. The blue creature ran at him in a zigzag pattern, avoiding chunks of rubble thrown at him by Dooku. He darted to the side, and attempted to flank the Sith. All too easy Dooku thought as he pivoted to face the creature. Leading his lightsaber in a crossbody slash, he saw the eyes of the creature narrow as his blade streaked towards him.

Suddenly, the blue creature leapt over his head, and Dooku's vision was filled by a plethora of glowing pink cards. With a scream of Dark Side energy, Dooku used the Force to sweep most of the cards aside,their stored kinetic energy proving difficult to influence. The few getting through hammered the Count in his shin and left arm, flipping Dooku onto his back. Rage filled the Count's body and thoughts as he fell ungracefully onto the ground. Feeding his Dark Side powers from the pain of his broken arm, the Count outstretched his right arm toward the blue monster leaping for the kill.

Dooku's hate struck McCoy full force. The power of the electricity sent Beast flying away from the Count, making his body involuntarily spasm as the electricity coursed through his body. Fighting through the pain, Beast struggled to stand, only to be hammered back to the ground by the increasing intensity of the electric malestrom unleashed by the Sith Lord. Dooku was once again on his feet, eyes yellow and full of rage as he plunged himself deep into the Dark Side. "FOOLS! HOW DARE YOU STRIKE AT YOUR BETTERS!!" The Dark Lord bellowed. His voice seemed to fill the air, crackling with power like the electricity coursing through his body. The creaure's hair burned away, and McCoy's mind was filled with pain as his brain cooked inside of his skull. When Dooku relented, his blue adversary was reduced to a smoking, charred heap.

In a fit of rage, Dooku reached out through the Force to pluck the burned man from the ground. He used the Force to crush the man's windpipe, leaving him to die in agony and despair. Assured of his opponent's demise, he turned his attention to the man who had just clawed his way through the rubble tomb Dooku had collapsed on him. Seemingly no worse for the wear, Logan looked at the Sith with the promise of hell in his eyes. "You're going to die for what you've done here today, bub." Logan spat as he extended his adamantium claw and rushed the Count.

The Count raised an eyebrow with as much dignity as he could muster. "Yes, perhaps I will. But not by your hand, and certainly not today." He reignited his lightsaber and met the mutant head on. The battle had tired him greatly, and he was loosing blood from the wound in the left shoulder. Pain lanced across his chest as the clawed freak scored a shallow hit across his chest, tearing the armorweave fabric of his tunic as if it were made of butter. The Count used what remained of his Force energy to immobilize his attacker, locking him in place as if he were made of stone. In one quick, clean thrust between his ribcage, the Sith impaled the freak through the heart. Logan looked at him with furious disdain, sputtering through the blood in his mouth "This aint over, you bastard."

The Count stated coldly "Yes, it is." He withdrew his lightsaber in an elegant fashion, and released his soon to be alive adversary to crumple on the ground. Gritting his teeth, Dooku limped from the battlefield. Bloody, broken, but alive, Darth Tyranus climbed into his ship and set a course for the portal that he had taken into this dimension. The ship touched off the ground on its repulsorlifts, and screamed for the darkness of outer space...

And there you have it, as I envision it would happen. The Count wins, but doesnt get off easily. He has a few broken ribs, a shattered left arm, and his left shoulder torn open

But he's alive, and his opponents are not

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#85 Posted by Chaos Prime (11585 posts) - - Show Bio

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