Composite Boba Fett and Jango Fett vs General Grievous (composite)

The Fetts replaced the Jedi in the battle of Hypori, desperate to get their next kill after being hired by Jabba for the sake of collecting his chassis. Do they win? Or do they get slaughtered? Composite versions, and the Fetts and Grievous have the same starting distance as the Jedi in the Battle of Hypori scenario.

The Fetts (composite)

VS

General Grievous (composite version; the High Ground is not included)

Setting (inside) :

Same distance as Hypori, as said before. No prep; high-end feats for all.

Composite for the Fetts doesn't add anything for them, as all their best stuff is basically within Legends.

That also said, they can't really win this. Grevious is far faster than them, Boba's beskar armor can have him last longer than Jango, but it's not really gonna help him otherwise. Jango doesn't really have anything to help him here, armor or weapons wise so....this is pretty much Boba vs Grevious and this is really only due to the beskar armor Fett eventually gets post-ROTJ.

Boba Fett takes Grievous. Especially after Grievous kills Jango

@precrisisbardock: Does he stand a chance if GG went after him first?

@tg_15: Grievous can’t really cut through his armor, and he doesn’t know that. He could try to attack and just get blown apart while Boba tanks the hits. Plus he’s facing two experienced Jedi killers, he’s gonna have a hard time focusing on them both.

@precrisisbardock: GG doesn't have to cut through his armor, he can also go for the exposed openings in the armor. Blunt force also is doable, his armor isn't gonna protect him there.

@wolfrazer: What’s the first thing Grievous is gonna do like anyone that attacker him in legends?

@precrisisbardock: I'm confused by your question. Asking, what's the first thing he does? He obviously uses his lightsabers, but he also does incorporate melee attacks which is shown quite a few times.

@wolfrazer: I mean first thing he’s gonna do is try to tag him. In which Boba and Jango would light him up

what of GG's speed and durability?

I'm inclined to think the Fett's 6.5/10. Bobba on his own gave Vader a run.. I know its legends, am I wrong to include that with these conditions? Experience, versatility, and literally sharing a brain with relation to battle acumen.. They have a case that can be made for a small majority IMO.

1. Boba isn't covered head-to-toe in Beskar, his joints and chest are protected somewhat but his legs are wide open, along with other clear gaps in his armor. Only his plating is Beskar.

2. Grievous has smashed through lightsaber-proof material before.

3. The internal rupturing of Boba's organs, bones breaking and blunt force trauma to the skull would be more than enough to kill or KO him.

4. Grievous is far, far faster than either Boba or Jango can react to. The only reason very powerful Jedi can keep up with Grievous is due to their precognition, and the only reason Boba or Jango have kept up with any Jedi as powerful as them are due to their armor and jetpacks. Physically speaking, Grievous is multiple times faster than even the likes of RotS Kenobi or Mace Windu, it's just that they have precognition and Force senses to help them keep up. Not only are Boba and Jango not superhumanly fast, they also lack precognition, so they are far slower than Grievous.

5. They have no way to harm Grievous. Grievous has shrugged off being inside exploding starships, being at the centre of an energy factory explosion so powerful it shook the entire moon, shrugged off blasters, etc, so even if they can hit Grievous (who is fast enough to dodge an entire armada of clone troopers/vehicles trying to hit him, or palm blaster bolts away) anything that lands will be laughed off. Grievous' armor is powerful enough to survive a direct hit from a laser cannon, the most powerful weapons in the Fetts' arsenal is a single jetpack missile each, which is woeful compared to a laser cannon in terms of destructive power and speed.

Grievous would, quite simply, dodge or walk through everything they have to offer, and oneshot them both before their brains can register it. As someone who has read/watched all of the material all three characters have been in, and made respect threads for each, trust me when I say this is a terrible idea for a thread. The Fetts are unenhanced beings, Grievous is so superhuman he can outright blitz any Jedi that isn't a 1%er exception like Obi-Wan. If you want to talk about Jedi killers, Grievous has personally killed hundreds of Jedi and has even destroyed armies of hundreds of clones who were supported by Jedi with his bare hands.

Vader shrugged off everything Boba threw at him and backed him into a corner, and the only reason he didn't kill him is because Boba was holding an artifact Vader wanted. In a normal battle, Vader would kill Boba very quickly. Boba doesn't have any weapons that could hurt Vader or Grievous in a serious way.

@in-sidiousvader

Like, if we are re-doing the Hypori battle... what can Jango and Boba do that Ki-Adi-Mundi, Shaak Ti, Aayla Secura, K'Kruhk, Tarr Seirr and a large squad of clone troopers backed up by the lasers cannons on a shuttle can't? Because all of that combined wasn't enough to take Grievous down. He was toying with 5 Jedi at once. They couldn't even sense him coming despite having precognition and omni-directional awareness granted by a universal energy field.

Like, seriously? You need to acquire a sense of scale to be able to watch that and then think even 20 Fetts would be enough to deal with Grievous.

@i_like_swords: Okay I see the points you are making, I do own that comic and IIRC your statements do ring true. Only, Jango gave Kenobi a solid run on Kamino, who fought as a near equal to Vader in ANH. You think that with his clone son vs the creature that was killed by Kenobi they cant get a small vicotry here?

Well, ANH Kenobi is better than AotC Kenobi for one. Next, Jango used his starship laser cannon and jetpack missile to blow Obi-Wan up and disarm him of his lightsaber before he even got close to him. And then in hand-to-hand, the main advantage Jango had was his durasteel armor. Grievous would be able to rip through that armor with his claws like he did in Son of Dathomir.

Also, using RotS Kenobi beating Grievous and comparing him to AotC Kenobi, is a false equivalency for a number of reasons. I will let you think about what they might be.

@i_like_swords: Every time I see a thread with your name in it, I often find it full of condescending tones and hostile in nature. Thank you for your standard CV approach. I will let you think about what they might be.

Jeez, people are so soft on CV

Try KMC then we talk

@g_race: Cry more, I guess?

right on point, keep it up, you are doing great. on topic, I see how folks think GG can win this.

@i_like_swords: Gg lol

@precrisisbardock: Haha :P At least you can handle a little bit of snark in a debate.

OT-Grievous solidly.

Even though we're not usually on the best of terms I pretty much agree with Sword's reasoning and had similar views.

The thing is Grievous is insanely fast even in comparison to top tier Force sensitives. Their Force precognition is the only thing that gives them a fighting chance against his speed and even then it's only partly successful.

The Fetts only have peak human speed maybe a bit more. That's fast enough to compete with Jedi but not nearly fast enough to compete with someone like Grievous who can move at speeds faster than ROTS Kenobi can 'remotely' achieve.

The electrodrivers that powered Grievous's limbs could move them faster than the human eye can see; when he swung his arm, it and his fist and the lightsaber within it would literally vanish: wiped from existence by sheer mind-numbing speed, an imitation quantum event. No human being could move remotely as fast as Grievous, not even Obi-Wan - but he didn't have to. ~ ROTS NOVEL

"The metal arm bent but did not break. An instant later, too fast for even Jedi reflexes to avoid, Grievous' other arm struck Obi Wan. It was like being hit with a metal construction bar. Obi Wan's shoulder and half his side went numb, then flared into pain." ~ ROTS JN

And no this isn't Stover hyperbole, Grievous needs to be that much faster to combat Jedi precognition and still seem fast for them. That's precisely why he's such dangerous threat to the Jedi and why only the top 4 Jedi have a chance and beating him.

Really all the Fetts can do is keep to the air and evade. They can't do anything to harm him. If Grievous closes the distance there're dead.

@kilius: If we're using OCW feats as well, Grievous' jumping speed and strength is so dramatic he could probably snatch them both out of the air mid-flight and have them crushed to death before they hit the ground, lol.

since you asked nicely LOL.

Boba could potentially SOLO in an excellent fight. With his sonic emitter he can easily completely disable GG, and his gear is strong enough to rip GG to pieces given enough time. Jango is overkill, GG is good, but it is worth noting that Jango Fett did much better against Windu in the AOTC novel than GG did against WIndu in LOE. Since both of them can dodge around him and have equipment to deal with him I don't see GG taking a majority, thus Fetts take it in an 8/10.

With prep, maybe

Without it, Grievous dices them to bits

@in-sidiousvader:

Funny enough that theory is supported by Jedi Apprentice Ties That Bind - the blind Jedi Master Tahl was in danger from seeker droids because she can't sense non-living beings.

That however was honestly was bad writing - as much as admire Watson's work. It was established as early as ANH that Jedi can sense machines even without their sight - that's how Luke and all Jedi accolades train.

But have you noticed that the only ones able to do that are proficient with Mechu Duru, Maul in shadow hunter, Luke in ANH, Vader all the time. Just saying maybe that theory holds some merit still.

@decaf_wizard:

Just like Maul dices Kun to bits? :)

Listen here. I'll get around to you soon enough

@in-sidiousvader:

With his sonic emitter he can easily completely disable GG, and his gear is strong enough to rip GG to pieces given enough time.

Proof for both?

Jango is overkill, GG is good, but it is worth noting that Jango Fett did much better against Windu in the AOTC novel than GG did against WIndu in LOE.

There are some relative factors you need to think about. I.e, in the source you're talking about, the AotC novel (which is extremely generous to Jango compared to other sources depicting the fight), the author also thought that the reek was a formidable enough opponent to give Mace issues:

"The reek followed Mace, and he had to slash wildly to fend it off. He did manage to drive it back, but was butted and lost his lightsaber in the process. He came up facing the reek, and figured that he could outmaneuver it to get his weapon back easily enough, but then an armored rocket-man flew down in his path, blaster leveled.

So is the the argument? The reek disarmed Windu, so it must be better than Grievous too? Obviously not, but you see my point. AotC is an extremely generous source for Jango because it is also an extremely generous source for other beings that Windu should have no issue destroying. Not all that different from how in one source Maul can literally solo the Black Sun and in another be driven away by a dozen or so pirates.

Also, in LoE, despite the fact Grievous wasn't able to move his legs (because he anchored them to the moving train they fought on), and despite the fact he only used two of his four potential lightsabers, he still caused Windu plenty of issues: Windu opted to cut out the floor beneath Grievous' feet (which again, were locked in place). If you think that's a worse performance than Jango getting his head cut off after running away briefly, by all means, but I don't think anyone else would agree.

Since both of them can dodge around him and have equipment to deal with him I don't see GG taking a majority, thus Fetts take it in an 8/10.

Who have either of them kept up with that can fire off 20 attacks in under a second, or speedblitz groups of Jedi Knights? What equipment do they have that can harm someone that shrugs off laser cannons?

Not sure how this is relevant, GG is not going to stealth kill these two LOL. I actually have a theory for that, though it has never been confirmed in any source we do know that GG is almost completely droid and based on the E.U. Jedi have an incredibly difficult time detecting droids, so it is likely that they couldn't detect him because he is basically a droid.

By your logic, Jedi should never be able to sense or react to any non-organic object that is going to hurt them. This would include droids, blasters, thrown objects, slugthrowers and much more... yet, obviously, Jedi have no issue at all using their precog to sense and react to all of the above. The only beings they have ever had issues sensing are the Vong and other species who are just not detectable through the Force. So no, the Jedi are in a position to predict and sense Grievous, and there are countless examples of Jedi's Force senses alerting them to threats they should never see coming but do because they "have a feeling."

Not that Grievous would even need to use stealth to stomp them, but he can. Unless you think Ki-Adi-Mundi and Shaak Ti have poorer senses than the Fetts? (Not even mentioning that even without the Force, Shaak Ti's species has an omnidirectional sense thanks to her montrals).

Also... they most definitely did detect him as soon as he dropped from the ceiling.

Again, people who can sense the future and have superhuman speed... barely dodged him... while preparing for his next attack.

If you can show me one feat suggesting Boba and Jango can:

• Even hurt Grievous
• Even react to Grievous
• Even tank one hit from Grievous

I'll be waiting.

Dude... if Jedi can't sense non-living things how the hell was Luke deflecting blaster bolts with his eyes covered, the first time he held a lightsaber? How can you get through one star wars movie, book comic or tv episode and leave with the impression that Jedi can't sense anything that isn't living?

@decaf_wizard:

Been about a month and a half since the original deadline for your response, but sure.

GG tears them shreds.

This is why one shouldn't use TCW as a whole as a Legends source(nor mix both Canons together tbh), Dave kinda threw a monkey wrench into what had been established.

@wolfrazer: I think the relative placement of characters can still be judged, e.g Ventress will always give Obi-Wan a good fight in canon or legends, but in terms of how fast, strong or powerful they are, legends is always going to beat canon, non-Force users are always going to be more powerful and Force users will be less powerful in canon, and even within Legends itself, different authors give the same characters different power levels.

No two writers in SW have the same character at the same power level. But using the best versions of Legends Force users tends to have them stomping the likes of Boba and Jango. And even if we go by canon, there's never been a time someone like Boba or Jango squared off against a Grievous-tier and came out winning.

@wolfrazer:

Powerscaling's always been inconsistent tbh. We have people like Watson who are fairly conservative in Jedi/Sith abilities, especially when dealing with multiple foes - Maul is still badass in the Journal but has be cautious when faced with 30 Tusken raiders(though Wrath of Darth Maul sort of retconned the hesitation to being fear of making too much noise and alerting the Jedi). And then we have stuff like OCW turning Mace and Yoda into demi-gods.

Totally agreed on timeline though. Wookiepedia will never be the same. Ah well at least the multimedia project was mostly complete before TCW so it doesn't really ruin any potential storylines for me. I'm not really bothered by it overall and it's still good on it's own.

I won't say there haven't been inconsistencies beforehand, it just seems more prevalent with TCW. I certainly can't find any justifiable reason for TCW Grevious being the Micro-Series, comics and novels Grevious as an example.

Though the timeline certainly is thrown out of wack.

>Boba's armour
>Durasteel

Yikes. Watch Star Wars Rebels: Episodes Sixty and Sixty One please, if you think Canon Mando Armour is Durasteel

Boba's is Duraplast, Duraplast >>> Durasteel. Jango is screwed if GG gets close though.

I am agreeing GG wins. Doesn't mean Boba has to be lowballed this badly

@in-sidiousvader:

Fine...

Proxy is only a droid: Grievous is an organic being with a droid skeleton. The main issue is that Grievous' body is linked to his brain through several computers. So theoretically, those computers could be shut down even if his organic brain and droid body would remain operative (the sonic blast disabled Kota's ears; Grievous would not share this issue, he doesn't hear organically).

So sure, in theory, this could let Boba beat Grievous. But honestly I'm sceptical because Grievous was built to a far, far higher standard than Proxy, and while we've never seen him tested against a sonic emitter, he has been directly electrocuted as well as blasted omnidirectionally with blaster energy, and while it may not seem obvious, blaster bolts actually act as an EMP when they make contact with electronics: this is why Separatist droids appear to "power down" suddenly when hit with blasters: the blasters act as an EMP and shut down their internal CPU.

So while Boba has this one weapon that might be enough to defeat Grievous, or might not, I'd argue Grievous can definitely defeat Boba in a large number of different ways.

There is no proof that Jango could tear GG apart my bad, however for Boba he has these feats of destroying a large (likely durasteel) war droid. It is likely that with enough fire Fett could blow GG's armor apart. Also his flamethrower can ignite the fluids in GG's gutsack which is an instakill. Even if you don't believe that GG's armor would be damaged by their weapons, you can't deny that while GG is convulsing in pain on the ground they couldn't just put a barrel to his his head and pull the trigger.

Well, I respectfully have to disagree here. I'm all for Boba and Jango getting their due, I just have to point out how insanely durable Grievous' armor is. This droid Boba destroys with his wrist-rocket: I'm not convinced it is as durable as Grievous, not even close. Grievous isn't just made out of durasteel. He is "Sheathed in metal more suited to a starfighter," and his armor is made from not just durasteel but also a "Ceramic armorplast-plated duranium." alloy. His armor "can stop a burst from a starfighter's laser cannon." Dooku spent, something north of millions, billions, trillions, you name it of credits on creating Grievous, he's not really comparable to your standard droid. Which is apparent when you look at the difference between duranium armor plating and simple durasteel:

duranium

A metallic alloy with high tensile strength used in the construction of prison cells and cages.

―The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

durasteel

Used to build everything from space vehicles to dwellings, this ultralightweight metal could withstand radical temperature extremes and severe mechanical stress.

―The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

Durasteel is a fairly standardised material used for a wide variety of designs: duranium is an alloy that incorporates durasteel purely to make it as tough as possible, which is why it's used for starfighter plating, prison cells, and Grievous' own armor.

Aside from all that, what about Grievous' durability feats? Aside from the fact he can stop a laser cannon, which are designed to destroy other duranium-plated starfighters through their shielding, as well as turret fortifications... how about the time he tanked the explosion of a fuel factory, right at it's centre, an explosion so powerful it compromised the surface of an entire planet?

Gallery

While I can't quite find the clips, in TCW, Grievous repeatedly shrugs off point blank explosions. Obi-Wan blows up a fuel barrel on him point blank, it has no effect. Grievous is inside a shuttle, it is blown up by a thermal detonator: again, he shrugs it off. Boba and Jango combined do not have as much explosive power as an exploding fuel factory or a point-blank starship explosion. Or a laser cannon for that matter. Forget about regular blasters, or since you mentioned flamethrowers, the simple fact that Grievous has been inside omnidirectional explosions, which would have covered every inch of his body, and still his organs were kept intact, I doubt a flamethrower would be able to do much.

Grievous won't be convulsing in pain on the ground for several reasons, namely: he cannot feel pain because he no longer has a central nervous system, Boba and Jango cannot put him down, and they will likely be killed before they get the chance to hurt him.

True enough, though I still think that it is consistent with Jango's other depictions in the E.U. he singlehandedly killed Komari Vosa after passing through an entire Moon full of Bando Gora, and Vosa as you know was able to contend (albeit briefly) with a wounded Maul.

That's fair. Bare in mind though, that Maul, after getting angry, appeared so fast to Vosa that she thought he was hitting her from every angle all at once. While Jango can take the likes of Vosa down, he wouldn't last long against Maul... and Grievous is a lot faster than Maul once you remove precog.

Lets not forget Mace was hindered too, he presumably had to expend his force reserves to hold himself on the train.

Sure. Still, I don't think it's a great comparison for Jango. Windu spoke very highly of Grievous after that fight with him.

No one with 20 strikes per second, but both of them as previously mentioned have kept up with Windu. Boba did even while he was only about 15

To be fair, Windu was holding back a lot because as you point out, Boba was 15 at the time. He didn't want to kill a child. So while Jango and Boba have two pretty generous sources showing they can keep up with Windu (one that is derived from canon, where all Force users are much slower, and the other being a time where Windu held back), Grievous has a proven track record of blitzing groups of Jedi. In the quote below it's suggested that Grievous "granted" four Jedi knights and a squad of other guards a moment to activate all of their weapons, implying that if he chose not to, he could have just killed them all on the spot.

The astonishment registered by Palpatine and his quartet of Jedi Knights assured Grievous that he could not have made a more dramatic entry. A large desk dominated the circular room, and banks of communications consoles formed the circumference. Centered in the curved wall opposite the entrance was a second door. Posing for effect in the polygonal opening, Grievous granted his opponents a moment to activate their lightsabers, force pikes, and other weapons. Also for effect, he deflected the initial flurry of blaster bolts with his clawed hands, before drawing two of his lightsabers.

―Labyrinth of Evil

In the two quotes below, Grievous is described as being so fast that he when he moves he would "literally vanish", "an imitation quantum event", and even Obi-Wan "could not move remotely as fast as Grievous." Grievous "seemed to teleport" just with his movement speed.

The electrodrivers that powered Grievous's limbs could move them faster than the human eye can see; when he swung his arm, it and his fist and the lightsaber within it would literally vanish: wiped from existence by sheer mind-numbing speed, an imitation quantum event. No human being could move remotely as fast as Grievous, not even Obi-Wan - but he didn't have to.

―Revenge of the Sith

Grievous moved so swiftly that he seemed to teleport from the window to half a meter in front of Gunray. "How much use is your money," he said, flexing his hand of jointed duranium in the Neimoidian's face, "against this?"

―Revenge of the Sith

When Grievous was fighting Obi-Wan he was attacking faster than Obi-Wan could "realize exactly what was happening, attacking faster than thought" - I'm not using this to calculate his speed based on how fast neurons fire, it's just to hammer home the point that even though Obi-Wan has superhuman combat speed, Grievous would be able to blitz him if he did not have the Force guiding him.

Grievous stayed right with him, attacking before Obi-Wan could even realize exactly what was happening, attacking faster than thought -

But Obi-Wan didn't need to think. The Force was with him, and he knew.

―Revenge of the Sith

Boba and Jango do not have the Force, and don't have superhuman speed either.

Senses no, hearing yes. Fett has heard a blaster drawn from Luke on bespin. Both of them have sound systems that are extremely advanced, and the Fett's have omni directional vision as well. Also there is this,

That's fair actually, his helmet's sensors could pick Grievous up, I'll concede here.

For Boba, I have a few other than TFU which I know you'll dispute as game mechanics. For Jango there is this, this one also applies to Boba Fett

Game mechanics are n-canon for the most part. As for that gif with Vader, the intent of the scene was that Vader's shoulder was grazed. It's just poor effects that make it look like he was cut through the neck. Durasteel is not lightsaber proof, Vader and Boba are not lightsaber proof anywhere on their body, apart from perhaps some phrik that Vader has in his armor. When Boba was having his beskar armor made, he specifically had a beskar collar put around his neck to prevent himself having his head cut off like his father: if he could already survive a lightsaber cutting through his neck he wouldn't need the upgrade.

As for Grievous' physical strength: as you've seen in the old cartoon, he was so strong he could leap dozens, maybe up to a hundred feet in the air, and then throw himself from a wall with such force he creates craters in the ground with his landing, producing enough force to throw Jedi off their feet. He has also marched through winds that were so powerful they tore up the duracrete beneath his feet. He has smashed through marble, cracked transparisteel on capital ships, smashed through phrik staves, crushed Jedi into lifeless bodies with one claw, dented starfighters with his punches, thrown Obi-Wan around like a ragdoll, crushed skulls in his hand, ripped through Mandalorian armor, thrown Durge who is absolutely massive, with such force that he smashed through three museum displays, and was then embedded in a car, and then the car kept going for a while. He has easily picked up entire computer consoles (which is basically a large table filled with nothing but electronics and metal) and thrown it at people, and ripped open durasteel doors. If he even connects with one strike, whether it's with a lightsaber or a fist, he will crush Boba or Jango in one hit. Two, they're definitely dead.

@in-sidiousvader: Its been explicitly called Mando armour and that was called Beskar in rebels, so I don't really know why any canon source would call it Duraplast unless its repurposed Neo-Crusader armour, which is also canon again for some reason

That images was also published in 1998 so its almost assuredly a legends source

Boba getting beskar armour in LOTF also makes no sense canonically (canon to legends) because Luke's saber explicitly bounced off his head back when he still was using Anakin's saber

Yes it is a legends source, but this is composite is it not?