@thedailybagel: Because the limits only applied to the characters themselves, not what they could be amped to during prep. Plus, nothing about him is actually above limits since none of his hax are banned and none of his physicals are even near the limits of the tourney.
Ther's also the magic immunity perk, which would essentially leave Oz with nothing useful on this tier.
"Medaka can essentially copy the abilities of everyone in this battle and fight your entire team at once, while remaining completely intangible."
Anyone else remember the times when tournaments weren't exploited and loopholed, remember when we just picked characters we enjoyed and thought were fair and debated with them instead of trying to cheat the system? Oh, guess all those people left..
And T4V please. :P
To be fair, our opponents are literally attempting the exact same thing via their Amazo strategy...
But. Yours. Was. ANIME.....
But in all seriousness, it is much different. I don't want to argue for either side, but their strategy seems easily debunkable, and it is just not as effective. Plus, your character innately has the feature, they have to attempt some crazy stuff to get close to it.
I mean in the end, they brought Cyborg Superman and you brought some crazy ass Hakai on steroids dude, plus some instant copy no matter what girl with intangibility. Plus whoever the hell D'Spayre is.
I expected people to overreact again but honestly, this time it's not that bad. Granted, I have no idea what D'Spayre brings to the table, but my team can play ball if this is the tier of hax that's gonna be involved.
@mylittlefascist: Maybe. I've always that Oz was extremely overpowered, and likewise found the idea of you doing things like using him in street tourney's amusing. But I guess part of the reason I'm not overreacting now is because I don't have the preconceived bias against anime/manga hax like most people do, and also because while reading your post, I was thinking of several viable counters my team has at our disposal.
doing things like using him in street tourney's amusing
But I don't use his hax abilities in those tourneys. Without hax or access to his rabbit form, there's really not much to put him above spiderman or ken kaneki.
" Created by the Great One Who Dwells in Darkness(Dweller In Darkness) through an event known as "Atlantis' Cataclysm", D'Spayre is one of the Fear Lords and the embodiment of misery, despair(Duh), sadness and grief. A depressed drug addicted who decided life isn't even worth of continue on? Maybe a mother who recently lost her child and started to think that rope is becoming even more "tempting"? D'Spayre is there for all of them, waiting, whispering in the ears, making them do the final step...As long as humanity exists, so will D'Spayre to lead them to their doom."
Or the fact the same Jean couldn't even get over his already placed defenses to probe into his mind and D'Spayre didn't seem like even trying to maintain her out anyway:
Magic & Overall Power:
D'Spayre isn't as physically impressive or imposing when compared to pretty much all combatants here given he's more of a wizard/sorcerer in terms of abilities, so is far behind them in such category speaking truly, but that's compensated by his own magical powers and further by our strategy in to win this battle. He can fight head-on against the Hell-Lord Belasco in the later's realm for a time before losing in Cable#14, but should be noted that D'Spayre wasn't actually beyond his normal levels when that happened:
Something explicitly backed up by DSSS#31 where each Fear-Lord is described to have a power measured on a cosmic scale:
Something also backed up by the handbook Fear Itself: Fellowship of Fear:
I won't lie and say D'Spayre can't become weaker when faced with hope and good emotions, which allows far inferior beings to defeat him, but that won't be the case here as explained by our strategy to win this fight. D'Spayre also possesses a few unique abilities of his own such as his fear touch, which has been described to rip the soul apart and worked even on Doctor Strange( Valkyrie Vol.1#1, Marvel-Team Up#68, Doctor Strange, Master of the Mystic Arts#55 and Uncanny X-Men#144):
Gallery
And his effect/control over souls was shown many times, such as in Valkyrie Vol.1#1 again:
Strategy/Prep:
Now here's where things get interesting. D'Spayre, much like all the other Fear Lords, possesses a unique characteristic that allows them to become far more at the right circumstances and sadly for our opponents...That can be replicated here. First off, D'Spayre now having access to all the despair energy from Oz's Abyssys is full of despair energy will transform one of its structures into his Dark Tower to draw all the energy from said dimension like once easily did with the Forrester Mansion in Uncanny X-Men#144:
It should be noted the tower can indeed send and feed energy even on this battlefield, it was doing that to Dweller when the same was at another dimension as shown in Adventures of the X-Men#11:
So D'Spayre can keep draining almost infinite amounts of energy to feed his powers during mid-battle, but that's not the only source available to him as well. We've got Sinestro, remember? He can simply give D'Spayre a yellow ring to resolve the problem of only relying on an external power source or even bound him to Parallax for cosmic levels of fear even greater...Either way, D'Spayre will have both an external amp with the tower and the yellow ring/Parallax as an "internal one" to impossibility any tactics of weakening him with hope, confidence or faith. Do you guys have ANY idea of how powerful D'Spayre will become then? Of how hopeless your team will be against his power? To start, Phoenix Force Rachel was getting utterly stomped by him during Excalibur#35(Only to be defeated by a plot) after absorbing some of her cosmic fear:
Gallery
Or when D'Spayre using the Cosmic Cube to feed upon and amplify the negative emotions of USA defeated many heroes at the same time during Avengers/Invaders#7, which one of them was none them Doctor Strange himself:
Gallery
Do know what's better though? Parallax and/or the yellow ring can likely amply the fear even more than the CC given it's their purpose/ability after all, so D'Spayre can become stronger even easier. D'Spayre when absorbing despair from the entire planet was easily at Skyfather levels(Which I mean somewhat around Odin's level) given how was more powerful than both Nightmare and Dweller In Darkness combined even in their realms as shown in DSSS#40:
Gallery
He could even straight up and casually one-shot Dweller, which is something that even a heavily amped Nightmare by the Fear Crown in his own realm didn't manage to do and thus proving once again D'Spayre's superiority. You all should keep in mind that Dweller is the guy who even his low-level minions are more than capable of taking on both Thor and Hercules and even an alternate reality Phoenix Force, but still universal regardless in range needed to take an indirect approach against him and was unable to fix his destruction caused on the M'Kraan Crystal which destroyed an entire universe as result in Adventures of the X-Men#12:
Gallery
Even Nightmare in the same storyline where D'Spayre become stronger than him was capable of merging the universe with the Dream World and while still weakened his battle threatens to spill into the Earth's Realm:
Gallery
This is just a glimpse for you all to see how powerful D'Spayre can and will become here, which basically makes the gap between our characters completely leagues apart...Quite frankly, D'Spayre in this state can likely solo every single team in this entire tourney simultaneously. If you still believe this is only a simply feat based on ABC logic, Fear Itself: Fellowship of Fear of confirmed his canonical superiority over both:
Which is interesting is how D'Spayre pretty much becomes immune to the physical and metaphysical once his powers reach a certain state, so there goes all the chances and claims of getting any results with tactics like blitzing:
Gallery
Scans 1,2,3 ) D'Spayre is pretty much immune to physical attacks as I said above(Excalibur#35,76 and Uncanny X-Men#144).
D'Spayre can easily go up to levels far above anyone on your team or this tourney, which means that soloing for me isn't out of question. He's just too far above your characters to the point of making them be no bigger threats than a bunch of ants.
Given my access to Oz's Abyssys and the advantages provided by Sinestro(The yellow ring, for example), none of you can't defeat him by depowerment as usually done in the comics.
Characters like Jin and Cyborg Superman may be too fast for him, but since can't actually effect D'Spayre, one well place illusion like the examples I posted are more than enough to stop them on their tracks to finish the job.
This is the sensation of truly feeling hopeless, my friends. D'Spayre will make short of everyone here and bath himself in your agonizing screams while also drinking the sweet nectar of despair from your rotten souls. Goodbye.
@jucaslucasa: No. You can use a low high tier then amp them yo herald with prep or use a herald. But not use a herald and amp them to teambuster level.
Alright and I thought the manga characters were bad. Both the comic characters are blatantly over the limits.
Take that, Supreme Why do you think so?
D'spayre is hell lord level in base without any prep by the feats presented. And is seemingly star level. That is easily above the limits.
And you are using Parrallax Sinestro. Parrallax is in Sinestro, he isn't some entity that he goes to get during prep, he has his power inside him like Naruto with Kurama. And having Parrallax easily puts him above the limits.
@major_hellstrom: Haven't seen any rules in this tournament about the level at which we can amp our characters. I always assume that anything goes, kinda like in that high tier tourney where you brought weapons that could beat Galactus, Celestials and Cosmic Cubes. If it's not allowed, that has never been made clear to us.
Alright and I thought the manga characters were bad. Both the comic characters are blatantly over the limits.
Take that, Supreme Why do you think so?
D'spayre is hell lord level in base without any prep by the feats presented. And is seemingly star level. That is easily above the limits.
And you are using Parrallax Sinestro. Parrallax is in Sinestro, he isn't some entity that he goes to get during prep, he has his power inside him like Naruto with Kurama. And having Parrallax easily puts him above the limits.
Andromeda is using D'Spayre, so I'm not really sure about him. Gotta ask her.
But Sinestro doesn't start with Parallax, he's going to get him from the Central Yellow Battery during prep, kinda like how he did in the N52 against the First Lantern dude
@jucaslucasa: Yeah, well I hate to break it to you, but you should have asked cause the possibility that you wasted what looks like hours of work is 99% which is kinda sad. Also yes I did use teambusting prep but teambusters were allowed in that tourney, I could have also made tech that deleted parts of the universe but ET said no.
Alright and I thought the manga characters were bad. Both the comic characters are blatantly over the limits.
Take that, Supreme Why do you think so?
D'spayre is hell lord level in base without any prep by the feats presented. And is seemingly star level. That is easily above the limits.
And you are using Parrallax Sinestro. Parrallax is in Sinestro, he isn't some entity that he goes to get during prep, he has his power inside him like Naruto with Kurama. And having Parrallax easily puts him above the limits.
Andromeda is using D'Spayre, so I'm not really sure about him. Gotta ask her.
But Sinestro doesn't start with Parallax, he's going to get him from the Central Yellow Battery during prep, kinda like how he did in the N52 against the First Lantern dude
Nope. After getting him from the Battery the first time Parrallax has been inside Sinestro since. Read his solo series which came out after the Wrath of the first lantern storyline, or really anything after the storyline. He has him inside permanently after he takes him from the battery. He can then activate the parrallax power whenever he needs to.
Unless we are talking about current rebirth Sinetro post Warworld explosion. In which case parrallax isn't even in the battery anymore. And parrallax hates Sinestro and will do everything avoid being trapped by him.
@jucaslucasa: No. You can use a low high tier then amp them yo herald with prep or use a herald. But not use a herald and amp them to teambuster level.
Well one of your team-members, the one who is supposed to be a co-host, clearly didn't get the memo then.
Clearly the person debating for D'Spayre feels differently based on this
D'Spayre isn't as physically impressive or imposing when compared to pretty much all combatants here given he's more of a wizard/sorcerer in terms of abilities, so is far behind them in such category speaking truly, but that's compensated by his own magical powers and further by our strategy in to win this battle. He can fight head-on against the Hell-Lord Belasco in the later's realm for a time before losing in Cable#14, but should be noted that D'Spayre wasn't actually beyond his normal levels when that happened:
@emperorthanos-: Fox got a composite one, so I guess he's going for an unamped version with Parallax still inside the Battery. Though where things actually are is quite confusing when you take into account different contradicting timelines, I just assume it all goes for "standard" version of the universe, since it all changes so much.
@major_hellstrom: Being able to beat characters above Skyfather level is team-busting?
No it's even greater than team busting
Yeah, that's what my point. In your high tier tourney, Major is having his characters build weapons that can beat Galactus, Celestials and Cosmic Cubes.
Clearly the person debating for D'Spayre feels differently based on this
D'Spayre isn't as physically impressive or imposing when compared to pretty much all combatants here given he's more of a wizard/sorcerer in terms of abilities, so is far behind them in such category speaking truly, but that's compensated by his own magical powers and further by our strategy in to win this battle. He can fight head-on against the Hell-Lord Belasco in the later's realm for a time before losing in Cable#14, but should be noted that D'Spayre wasn't actually beyond his normal levels when that happened:
Quite explicitly state that he wasn't beyond base in the first example and was at normal levels in the second one. Unless this is a lie.
Because all Hell Lords have the exact same power level? Belasco was a normal human who got turned into a demon via a deal with the Elder Gods. He's not like Mephisto, Satannish, or Marduk. He's a total scrub. Above Azazel, but far from some teambuster or skyfather. Hell, even Magik is more powerful than him at her base, in fact she has every spell that he knows.
Darkening the sun upon your death isn't a combat feat. It's a showing of importance to the universe that says nothing about standard power levels in combat. Come on man, now you're just grasping. lmao
@major_hellstrom: Being able to beat characters above Skyfather level is team-busting?
No it's even greater than team busting
Yeah, that's what my point. In your high tier tourney, Major is having his characters build weapons that can beat Galactus, Celestials and Cosmic Cubes.
@emperorthanos-: Fox got a composite one, so I guess he's going for an unamped version with Parallax still inside the Battery. Though where things actually are is quite confusing when you take into account different contradicting timelines, I just assume it all goes for "standard" version of the universe, since it all changes so much.
He chose New 52 Sinestro, he didn't speciify that it was Sinestro prior to taking parallax. If he was then why is half his post made of feats of Sinestro when he had Sinestro in his body.
There are no conflicting timelines. Lantern history hasn't changed since the Silver Age. The location of Parallax has constantly changed as well. There is no standard version of his location, and in fact for the majority of New 52 he was in Sinestro. While currently he isn't in the battery.
D'spayre is hell lord level in base without any prep by the feats presented. And is seemingly star level. That is easily above the limits
Incorrect.
He has held his own against Belasco(One of the weakest Hell-Lords by feats) for an unknown period of time, which is something that Magik did as well and I don't believe she's banned from the tourney. Athera's sun is a metaphysical representation of good, so it's not like a real one...It was just to back up his status of power and influence since the same doesn't have as many direct feats as opposed by everyone here. D'Spayre's magic is powerful indeed when used right, but I said at the same time that none of his physicals abilities come close to any of opponents here and that's quite true(As evidenced by Peter, Valkyrie and even Nightcrawler beating the shit out of him).
The problem is that D'Spayre like all the other Fear-Lords can actually become far more powerful when absorbing their energy source such as fear, despair, misery, anger and so on. My character is one who can jump from someone around Shaman's tier to match the power of Strange's most powerful foes when the right circumstances are met. In other words, I simply made him more powerful by using the resources at my disposal, but D'Spayre is very well within the limits at base form(Even below most, to be fair).
Clearly the person debating for D'Spayre feels differently based on this
D'Spayre isn't as physically impressive or imposing when compared to pretty much all combatants here given he's more of a wizard/sorcerer in terms of abilities, so is far behind them in such category speaking truly, but that's compensated by his own magical powers and further by our strategy in to win this battle. He can fight head-on against the Hell-Lord Belasco in the later's realm for a time before losing in Cable#14, but should be noted that D'Spayre wasn't actually beyond his normal levels when that happened:
Quite explicitly state that he wasn't beyond base in the first example and was at normal levels in the second one. Unless this is a lie.
Because all Hell Lords have the exact same power level? Belasco was a normal human who got turned into a demon via a deal with the Elder Gods. He's not like Mephisto, Satannish, or Marduk. He's a total scrub. Above Azazel, but far from some teambuster or skyhfather.
Darkening the sun upon your death isn't a combat feat. It's a showing of importance to the universe that says nothing about standard power levels in combat. Come on man, now you're just grasping. lmao
Well he didn't say that now did he. His implication was clearly that D'Spayre was hell lord level. Don't try to change that.
It still shows star level power which is above the limits. And what about the fact that he was spoken in awe by Dormmamu. Was that just added there for no reason? Stop making excuses for someone clearly above the limits.
@emperorthanos-: You should simmer down. A decision is being made regardless of what you guys are saying here, and no one will ever say they broke the limits. So this debate is endless and pointless.
Log in to comment