Cloud (Final Fantasy) vs Guts (Berserk)

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deactivated-59b4a71696d1f

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Cloud Strife, Guardian of the Lifestream vs Guts, the Black Swordsman
Cloud Strife, Guardian of the Lifestream vs Guts, the Black Swordsman

Conditions

  • Win by Death or Incapacitation
  • Morals On
  • Random encounter, no knowledge
  • No Materia
  • Cloud has the Buster Sword
  • Limit Breaks are usable
  • Guts has his Berserker Armor
  • They begin at a distance of 50 feet

The Battleground

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Callouts

Final Fantasy:@floopay@misterwhisper

Berserk:@princearagorn1@thatguywithheadphones@shenkuei@nyas

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thatguywithheadphones

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Cloud from what I've heard.

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Doctor_Wheatley

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#3  Edited By Doctor_Wheatley

lol Cloud

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NightwingX

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#4 NightwingX  Online

Cloud omni-stomp

Loading Video...

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Eisenfauste

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Eisenfauste

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Cloud does win.

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Marshall_Long

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Cloud

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thatguywithheadphones

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Eisenfauste

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Dygoboy

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Guts gets sliced to shshreds.

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serpinethegreen

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Missmatch cloud wins

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MUVDCU

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#12  Edited By MUVDCU

I think in this setting Guts wins most normally. If he used the Berserker armor it would be a complete stomp. I know Cloud could swing his sword fast enough to make a small tornado but so can Guts.

I think Guts is stronger too. Guts dodged a lightning bolt that is dramatically faster than clouds best reaction feats although due to how the game and movie was he didn't really get a crazy good chance to show stupid awesome reactions. Yeah Cloud was dodging and blocking bullets at really close ranges but Guts has reacted to supersonic attacks and dodging lightning is much better than that.

I would definitely put Guts ahead of Cloud in strength too. With the Berserker armor he becomes Dramatically faster stronger and would break Clouds bones should cloud somehow block if he doesn't block he gets cleaved in half. The limit breaks would help if he could somehow live long enough to use them and Guts didn't have the Berserker armor otherwise they are pointless. I have 100 percent Final Fantasy VII over 14 times, it is my Favorite JRPG so I'm not being biased. The only way I see Cloud winning is if we go by the ridiculous claims of Cloud being able to survive Supernovas just because that was the name of the attack etc.

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katrurius17

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noah_ouellette

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@muvdcu: the attack has been calculated as the size and power of a supernova. Not

The name.

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MUVDCU

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@noah_ouellette: There's no way it's the same power as a supernova If that was true cloud being level one could easily one shot each of the weapons.

After all the Junon canon killed one.

It can't even be one trillionth as powerful as a real supernova. If Spehiroth had that much power he would've just wiped out all the life on their planet and restarted it all without summoning meteor. Why would you bother summoning something that can wipe out the surface of a planet if you have enough power to make a supernova afterall. Based on real quantifiable feats Cloud loses.

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deactivated-5b3daad020468

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I see and hear how Cloud stomps but can I get some non gameplay feats?

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TifaLockhart

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Kadaj used bolt against Cloud. I can't remember if he tanked it or dodged it though.

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Zetsu-San

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@muvdcu: Raw power =\= destructive radius.

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Marishtar

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@youngsoapman: Could people plz stop to put Guts in such missmatches, he is a badass but that's just silly...

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Wewlad80

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#20  Edited By Wewlad80

Guts is Street level...

Quite a few Versions of Cloud could give mid tiers Trouble.

Do the math.

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MUVDCU

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#21  Edited By MUVDCU

@wewlad80: Dude Guts is not street level unless you count 50+ tonners as street level. Do people actually consider Guts to be street level?

The dude can swing a 400-600 lb sword faster than the speed of sound that should easily be low mid tier. I always thought street levelers were just humans albeit peak humans as in the Punisher/Shang-Chi/Batman etc.

Isn't anyone with actual superhuman stats not considered street level?

From what I know of Guts he is superhuman in every possible way.

Yeah sure in his world he is just a human. However he is very obviously hundreds of times faster/stronger/durable than a peak human. That's all before adding in his Berserker Armor.

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Wewlad80

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#22  Edited By Wewlad80

@muvdcu said:

@wewlad80: Dude Guts is not street level unless you count 50+ tonners as street level. Do people actually consider Guts to be street level?

The dude can swing a 400-600 lb sword faster than the speed of sound that should easily be low mid tier. I always thought street levelers were just humans albeit peak humans as in the Punisher/Shang-Chi/Batman etc.

Isn't anyone with actual superhuman stats not considered street level?

From what I know of Guts he is superhuman in every possible way.

Yeah sure in his world he is just a human. However he is very obviously hundreds of times faster/stronger/durable than a peak human. That's all before adding in his Berserker Armor.

No, Guts is street level and he never swings his sword Faster than Sound. Massively FTE ? Hell yes. But theres nothing indicated hes supersonic unless you count him dodging lightning when he was in Berserk form. However Guts Is On par with guys like Rebirth/N52 Deathstroke (a little below because slade cuts down Machine gun fire now days and can tank Multiple Bizzaro's Punching him around who are Superman Villains)

Most of Guts Stats Put him at high street (His raw strength feats can even go up against mid tier fighters) but even then He lacks Speed Alot compared to most people in High Street level.

Low mid tiers such as Wildstorm Midnighter and Blue Beetle would still Obliterate him.

Also being Street level does not mean you are a Normal Human. Tons of Meta's and SuperSoldiers are street level.

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MUVDCU

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#23  Edited By MUVDCU

@ugivemethelulz: Without gameplay feats he has pretty much none.

He's maybe a 20 tonner tops based only on Advent Children (FF7 CG MOVIE) with fairly decent reaction times able to dodge bullets from fairly close range although to be fair it was only one person shooting at him and at the exact same amount of time between each shot (basically 1 a second).

His Sword was able to cut pieces of a falling building in half. He's pretty awesome but without some absurd fan calcs that make no sense based on the entire game showing he us ridiculously weaker than what they think he is.

Yeah based on that whole movie him dodging a single Bolt spell one time is not that good a feat. He was pretty awesome in that movie although I would not say he is better at anything than Guts still. Cloud would need materia to beat Guts normal IMO if Guts has the Berserker Armor I think Clour still dies. I'm using Clouds feats from Advent Children because why would he be thousands of times weaker than he was in FF7.

Also based on the game and just very obvious observation the Cloud from Advent Children is very believably on the same level that Cloud would be from playing the games.

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MUVDCU

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The only thing I would put Cloud above Guts in is agility. Cloud has that Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon style 100 foot leaps etc. Guts is genearly more grounded when he fights.

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Wewlad80

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@muvdcu: Heres a Street level feat that absolutely Outclasses anything Guts has done.

Loading Video...

Hes Not Mid Tier in literally anything but strength and even then hes still outclassed.

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MUVDCU

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@wewlad80: Yeah that's not street level dude lol that's something that if you gave 616 spiderman two swords he couldnt even replicate(he has to do it exactly the same way no using his agility to dodge etc). I wish they never made that scene it's so stupid.

Deadpool blocks like 250 bullets there. That's not even saying that he cuts the one in half to take out the other guys. Also Guts swung his sword so fast he cancelled out a small Tornado so yeah I'm gonna go ahead and say he can swing his sword much faster than the speed of sound.

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Wewlad80

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#27  Edited By Wewlad80

@muvdcu said:

@wewlad80: Yeah that's not street level dude lol that's something that if you gave 616 spiderman two swords he couldnt even replicate(he has to do it exactly the same way no using his agility to dodge etc). I wish they never made that scene it's so stupid.

Deadpool blocks like 250 bullets there. That's not even saying that he cuts the one in half to take out the other guys. Also Guts swung his sword so fast he cancelled out a small Tornado so yeah I'm gonna go ahead and say he can swing his sword much faster than the speed of sound.

Thats Definitely a Street level feat. And No that tornado feat has to do with his damn Hunk of Iron Being so Big that its effectively a Fan, Also Tornados arent supersonic so theres no way the feat is supersonic.

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Guts Just isnt on par with High Tier Streets in speed.

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decaf_wizard

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CLOUD

ISN'T

SOLAR SYSTEM

LEVEL

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MUVDCU

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Yeah it's a fan but you would still have to swing it a lot faster than the tornado was spinning to stop it instantly. Is that seriously what people consider street level?

If so then CW flash was street level up until this season lol. I don't agree with any of that lol.

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Wewlad80

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#30  Edited By Wewlad80

@muvdcu said:

Yeah it's a fan but you would still have to swing it a lot faster than the tornado was spinning to stop it instantly. Is that seriously what people consider street level?

If so then CW flash was street level up until this season lol. I don't agree with any of that lol.

Well thats too bad, Now you learned something today.
Well thats too bad, Now you learned something today.

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Lord_Spectrum

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Cloud.

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MUVDCU

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@wewlad80: Yeah I learned that street levelers are capable of doing some things mid tiers can't do lol.

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thebuckaronatr

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@wewlad80 said:

Guts is Street level...

Quite a few Versions of Cloud could give mid tiers Trouble.

Do the math.

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Itachus17

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@dygoboy said:

Guts gets sliced to shshreds.

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MUVDCU

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MUVDCU

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Ok so can someone please explain to me what puts Cloud above Guts on speed?

Less than halfway through Berserk Guts was able to react to the supersonic insect girl. Guts is much faster later. I absolutely love Cloud but based on his quantifiable feats I don't see him winning.

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MUVDCU

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@wewlad80: Also most people agree midnighter is mid tier not street level and characters like Spiderman and up are low mid tier and that Spiderman is only street level because he holds back all the time. Another words spiderman not holding back isn't mid tier and I would put Guts in Berserker Armor ahead of Spiderman not holding back just my opinion though.

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Wewlad80

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@muvdcu said:

@wewlad80: Also most people agree midnighter is mid tier not street level and characters like Spiderman and up are low mid tier and that Spiderman is only street level because he holds back all the time. Another words spiderman not holding back isn't mid tier and I would put Guts in Berserker Armor ahead of Spiderman not holding back just my opinion though.

Re read my comment if you think i said Midnighter is Street level.

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tparks

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Cloud wins. Guts has just never operated at a level Cloud has. Even if some stats are comparable, there's more to a character then stats, and Cloud's accomplishments are much higher then Guts.

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MUVDCU

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@tparks: Could you explain some of these accomplishments I've only played/watched/read everything on FF7 ever? There must be several feats I forgot about that are much better than Guts because people just keep saying he slices Guts up etc I'm not really seeing it since Guts is stronger and faster than him and one hit from Guts to Cloud will kill him. I could seeing people thinking that if Cloud does omnislash then Guts loses but if we base that on the Game/Movie mechanics he couldn't do that from the beginning so he dies before he gets a limit IMHO.

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tparks

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@muvdcu: The events of FF7 required a character beyond Guts' capabilities. That's why I say there is more then just stats to these two. Guts has never accomplished anything that Cloud could not as well, where the same can't be said in reverse.

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MUVDCU

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#42  Edited By MUVDCU

@tparks: These two characters are two of my all time favorites and I seriously can't say which one I like more but I'm more impressed with Guts.

The young kid in me raises Cloud up on this huge pedistal but if you really look at everything he has done it is not crazy impressive although he is a tough dude.

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MUVDCU

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#43  Edited By MUVDCU

@tparks: I was about to start my 15th playthrough of FF7 I'll recheck everything along the way but I think it's safe to say that Cloud isn't that crazy. They all freaked out when Sephiroth killed the Midgar Zolom and impaled it on a tree Guts could easily do that. As far as defeating weapons and stuff goes it takes absolutely every bit of magic summons etc to do so and that is still just gameplay of course you have that be able to beat them. There is nothing that pops out at me that puts Cloud vastly ahead of Guts and I have played the games a lot. I remember Circle Square X X is the rocket code for the huge materia for christs sakes lol.

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thelocust619

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#44  Edited By thelocust619

Cloud curbs with very little effort. Flight, bullet+ combat speeds and the strength to block building level cuts almost certainly secure the win, limits make losing pretty much impossible.

Btw, bigger Berserk fan than FF7...hell, my notification ringtone is "Tell me why"...but Guts can't win even if he puts his grasses on.

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tparks

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@muvdcu: I can't think of many times in the game where it was portrayed that it took Cloud using his magic and summons to beat anyone.

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MUVDCU

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@tparks: Sephiroth cut a huge piece of the building in off and Cloud never did and he never showed anything near that level he did cut chunks of the building in half. I love that scent but it defies all laws of physics and goes agains everything they showed in FF7 no one ever ran up walls while cutting stuff in half although it was cool looking. I think it would at least be a good fight I do not believe Cloud stomps or any of that.

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MUVDCU

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@tparks: Also Cloud always needed his team and yeah they didn't show him relying on summons but if it was actually depicted properly they wouldve shown him casting a single spell once during the game too. They didn't do that even though he does actually use magic. I like the way they made him a swordfighter only but they should've had him actually use magic in Advent Children.

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tparks

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@muvdcu: I don't think he was supposed to be much of a magic using character. He has the ability to use magic, but I think he was supposed to be portrayed as a sword fighter primarily. Plus, I don't think he'd be using materia all that often, except for in last resort scenarios, since he knows it is not good for the lifestream to abuse magic.

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Christine1958PlymouthFury

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Guts Wins.

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FinalHeaven3

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Cloud with gameplay feats>>>hst and other fodder verses