CCC Gilgamesh vs Arjuna alter

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Lilgodperv

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I want see who is stronger

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chasekilleen

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#2  Edited By chasekilleen  Online

Gilgamesh CCC as he was able to one shot an 8 dimensional being easily and Kiara which is predicted to be 9 dimensional, as they stated that Kiara is beyond the Mooncell and also BB herself.

Arjuna Alter has no counter to Gilgamesh's EX ranked stats and also his speed, which is stated to be faster than the concept of time itself.

Gilgamesh's Ea, Enuma Elish at small output was able to destroy an infinite sized Reality Marble created by the Mooncell and also was able to obliterate both BB and Kiara in one shot and both of them are stated to be multiversal when going up against Gilgamesh.

Gilgamesh can destroy the entire Mooncell and also a higher dimension if he really wanted as BB was threatening to destroy the infinite universe and higher dimension, he was still confident that he was able to defeat her. He was able to resist and counter anything BB threw at him. So Gilgamesh CCC easily.

I think he can or cannot resist BB's C.C.C

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chasekilleen

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#3  Edited By chasekilleen  Online

Probably @ecoblitz@zgtfreak@swagpack@devoidruby Can answer this thread far better than me as I am still reading the dialogues at the moment 😂

And probably correct any mistakes that I put in my answer.

To my knowledge Arjuna Alter is only a planet buster, as Gilgamesh CCC is far beyond that. Even in Strange Fake, summoned as a Fake Archer, Gilgamesh was stated to be able to destroy the Earth 7 times, while Enkidu was able to mend Earth 7 times, as Enkidu's Age of Babylon literally summons an infinite number of Noble Phantasms Holy Weapons from Earth itself and Enkidu is able to control Earth to its liking.

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zgtfreak

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Is this a joke thread?

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SwagPack

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@chasekilleen:

From what I know Arjuna Alter's best feat is resetting his universe and the fact that he has Indian pantheon absorbed, but that's it. Not really on a level of Extra CCC.

Some of those gods might scale to someone like Saver though, but still not enough.

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chasekilleen

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#6 chasekilleen  Online

@swagpack: is Gilgamesh CCC stronger than Saver?

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SwagPack

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@chasekilleen:

Don't know. The scaling chain isn't properly presented in Nasuverse. You could bring arguments for both sides.

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Sy8000

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How is repeatedly destroying and re-creating the universe not better than anything Moon Cell related..ugh I really just need to go through CCC.

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MrBallins

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@swagpack: Kamijuna reset the Indian Lostbelt, which was just the Indian texture

Absolutely nothing in the Nasuverse so far can affect the universe on a large scale, maybe with the exception of Buddhas who have it as a right just because they are Buddhas. I have no idea why that is so, but it seems that the physical universe itself cannot exactly be harmed, even if characters can oneshot an infinite multiverse

At best, Arjuna would be able to destroy recreate the Universe of Man

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SwagPack

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@sy8000:

There are several reasons.

1. Moon Cell creates, stores and sustains infinite amount of universes in its Core through its power alone.

2. Moon Cell is capable of creating higher dimensional constructs (Far Side and 8-dimensional barrier around its Core). Higher dimensional things in Fate are treated as infinitely superior to lower dimensional ones. Universe is a 4-dimensional constructs and is really an insignificant feat for something like the Moon Cell.

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SwagPack

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@mrballins:

I don't know where you got that idea though.

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Lilgodperv

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@swagpack: everything in the moon cells are basically simulation and doesn't effect the real world what-so-ever.

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Lilgodperv

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@mrballins: godjuna should be above the likes of saver cause Arjuna absorbed all the gods of Hindu pantheon who are basically equal or stronger than saver.

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Lilgodperv

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#14  Edited By Lilgodperv

@swagpack: some gods are equal to saver but the Trinity and some other gods are absolutely above the likes of saver in every possible way.

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MrBallins

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@lilgodperv: Source for that? It hasn't been stated anywhere that the Hindus are stronger than Saver so that is just an assumption on your part

Kama also lacks Anti-Saver, so you cannot even make the argument about her having advantage against him

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MrBallins

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#16  Edited By MrBallins

@swagpack: You are assuming that the regular Nasu universe is just 4D when we know nothing about it for the most part, since when Universe is mentioned it is nearly always in relation to the Universe of Man

Hell, Astarte is a higher dimensional entity and she is just a galaxy enshrined as a goddess

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Lilgodperv

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#17  Edited By Lilgodperv

@mrballins: don't have And have no reason to start any religious wars so I will refrain from answering. kama is a psyudo-servant and a beast class servant. And isn't saver class supposed to be above and stronger than beast class.

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Lilgodperv

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MrBallins

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@lilgodperv: >don't have And have no reason to start any religious wars so I will refrain from answering

Is it the whole "Gautama is an avatar of Vishnu" thing?

Because I am pretty sure that this is not the case in the Nasuverse

> And isn't saver class supposed to be above and stronger than beast class.

Not exactly, Beasts do not have a linear power level

For example, CCC Kiara will always lose to Saver because he not only counters her but is superior to her in power, Beast Kiara meanwhile will win because she has Anit-Saver as a skill

>who is astrate?

Not completely sure, but from what I know of Saber Wars she is a galaxy that got enshrined as a goddess and is also the primordial universe from which the Servant universe comes from or something along these lines

I am not too familiar with her bacstory, I just know about her powers

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SwagPack

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@lilgodperv:

The "simulation" argument is so bad, boring and nonsensical that it's tiresome. It was addressed countless time and nobody wants to deal with that again.

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SwagPack

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@mrballins:

Regular universe is 4D unless stated otherwise. It's like saying "you're assuming regular Fate humans have the same biology as real world humans". Of course they do, it's logical. You don't need the author to say "yes, humans are the same as real world humans".

When something isn't "normal", Nasu says so, as is the case with the Far Side, which you would assume is 4D, but is actually higher dimensional (so 5D or above).

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Lilgodperv

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#22  Edited By Lilgodperv

@swagpack: cause no one has any proof and likes to blabber nonsense. It is a simulation cause nothing from extra verse effects the real world directly.

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SwagPack

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MrBallins

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@lilgodperv:The Moon Cell is the planet's observer and can prune timelines

@swagpack:There are several things pointing out that the regular universe may not be fully normal, first of which is the fact that pretty much no one has had any massive effect on it even though there are multiple multiversal characters in Nasu

There is also the fact that even a galaxy like Astarte can be an infinite conceptual universe while Buddhas being capable of managing something as small as a Solar System is considered impressive even though Saver and Kiara are both multiversal

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zgtfreak

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@swagpack: everything in the moon cells are basically simulation and doesn't effect the real world what-so-ever.

You've been debunked on this several times. Get lost.

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Lilgodperv

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@zgtfreak: lol when? When I said that a object that can supposedly Create 8D space and can exist in a lower dimensional universe without changing it's laws or when you were saying why can't it exist. Man try something else cause you debunked nothing.

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zgtfreak

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#27  Edited By zgtfreak

@lilgodperv: You flat out conceded to me, then randomly went back to spouting the same nonsense a few weeks later. And I've sent you scans of the Moon Cell effecting reality. You just have selective memory because you're mad that the characters from your poorly written little phone game that is a stain on Type-Moon gets Ain Sophed out of existence by CCC Gilgamesh's mere presence. This thread is actually lock worthy.

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Lilgodperv

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@zgtfreak: oh you mean this;

"You debunked it yourself. Moon cells isn't any 7-8d space. Before you say something i would like to remind you that the moon cell which according to you is highly intelligent a.i and can create multiverse is watching the earth from nearby should possibly not have higher dimensions. It exists on the similar 3 dimensional plain as the earth in the universe.

So according to you the mooncells which can supposedly create 7 to 8 dimensional universes actually exists in a 3 dimensional universe. WTF logic is that. I have never seen an object that supposedly creates 7 to 8D universes exist in a 3 dimensional universe in any fiction. They mostly exists detached from the multiverse or on a higher plain of existence. So your theory is wrong."

"You assume that dimensions work the same in every fiction, but they don't. There is nothing wrong with higher-dimensional objects existing in lower-dimensional spaces. When They Cry and Marvel have done it many times. Nice try, buddy; but you need to learn what you're even talking about before you come challenging me. I can tell you are extremely inexperienced when it comes to multiverse level entities."

In this we can already see that how you react without giving any proper response other than your outbursts.

I asked you to prove an higher dimensional object present in a lower dimensional universe without breaking the universe and you give this;

"Voyagers going to the Golden land and the 3-D parts of the Human Domain, Beyonder going in the Marvel multiverse, ect. lol"

And I ask you what were the consequences of that? Yet you fail to prove that moon cells affecting anything outside it's own a.k.a the real world. I agree that it may be 7-8D inside the moon cells but compared to the outer world it is nothing.

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zgtfreak

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#29  Edited By zgtfreak

@lilgodperv: I've dealt with this on multiple threads. You have no idea how cosmologies work/can work. You are extremely small minded. You are a waste of time talking to further. And Gilgamesh is beyond infinite multiversal without factoring in dimensions. We've been over this.

And I ask you what were the consequences of that? Yet you fail to prove that moon cells affecting anything outside it's own a.k.a the real world.

It was in the very RT you argued in. You are a brick wall. Willfully ignorant. Blocking you now.

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Lilgodperv

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MrBallins

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@zgtfreak: >the characters from your poorly written little phone game

Hey, you can shit on the waifus but don't shit on my boy Kamijuna. He is actually a well written character with an interesting conflict, both in his Lostbelt and after we summon him

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MrBallins

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@lilgodperv: >So according to you the mooncells which can supposedly create 7 to 8 dimensional universes actually exists in a 3 dimensional universe. WTF logic is that. I have never seen an object that supposedly creates 7 to 8D universes exist in a 3 dimensional universe in any fiction. They mostly exists detached from the multiverse or on a higher plain of existence. So your theory is wrong."

Just to note, but that Nasu universe could easily be higher than 4D. Also, there is no thing such as a 3D universe

>Yet you fail to prove that moon cells affecting anything outside it's own a.k.a the real world

The Moon Cell is the Earth's observer, capable of choosing the future that the planet embarks on. Even if you discount that, the Moon Cell was still capable of jamming the entire Milky Way which is a feat of it affecting the real world

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Guzmania

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Gilgamesh should win mid-diff

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Lilgodperv

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@mrballins: man I wasn't telling you. I was calling out on that zgtfreak's bullshit.

I know the universe is 4D in nature if you factor time. I was calling him on his crap about moon cells being 8-9D.Nasuverse might have higher dimensions which aren't explored yet but they aren't involved in extraverse.

And I know what the moon cell is but do you have any posts or links which shows Moon Cell being capable of jamming the entire Milky Way which is a feat of it affecting the real world

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MrBallins

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@lilgodperv: >Nasuverse might have higher dimensions which aren't explored yet but they aren't involved in extraverse.

Except that the Moon Cell's core was stated to have an 8D barrier around it, this is in @zgtfreak's respect thread as well irrc

>And I know what the moon cell is but do you have any posts or links which shows Moon Cell being capable of jamming the entire Milky Way which is a feat of it affecting the real world

It was mentioned in Extella when it talked about the measures the Moon Cell took against Velber, I don't have any screencaps and I am not 100% where exactly it was said, but it was said. If you play the game you should stumble into it no problem

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Syncroniam

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Gilgamesh would still win in the end but it would be a good battle between them.

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GaRbS

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Arjuna Alter recreates the world without Gilgamesh in it.