CAV: Yuta(PrinceX) vs Yan Sen(InfiniteMass)

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PrinceX

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Rules and conditions

  • Battle takes place in a neutral setting which allows the characters to utilize all their powers.
  • Speed equal.

  • Winner by Death/BFR/Sealing.

  • Random encounter.
  • Both characters at their strongest, but starts in base.
  • Vote based on who debated better, not which character you think would win.

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PrinceX

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InfiniteMass

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PrinceX

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#4  Edited By PrinceX

Most people seem to agree that Yuta stands little chance in this match up, but it will be fun to argue for the underdog here.

𝓨𝓾𝓽𝓪 - 𝓣𝓱𝓮 𝓣𝓻𝓾𝓮 𝓚𝓲𝓷𝓰

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TermsExplanation
Rakshasa

The child of a Nastika.

Nastika

The original suras of the universe, they were born at the start of the universe.

Sura

A race in the universe.

First kings

The strongest sura of a specific clan inside the sura species.

Premival god

one of the four creators of everything, every multiverse to ever exist and everything that encompasses.

Who is Yuta?

Yuta is the child of Kali a premival God and Garuda a first king Nastika. Kali however created a fake mother for Yuta, Kali was also the king of the Taraka clan which is the "Taraka clan". This fake mother was then presented as Yuta's real mother while Kali disappeared, when she left Yuta became the real king of the Taraka clan, not his fake mother. Kali's whole reason for doing all of this is because she wanted to create something that could destroy the whole "universe" that even the other primeval gods can't stop. So it can be said that his "purpose" is to destroy everything.

Rakshasa

As said earlier Yuta is technically a rakshasa. There are also other species and interspecies beings ect, but i'll only explain the Rakshasa and anything else that is relevant to Yuta himself to not make it too long.

To start it off, a Rakshasa is first born as a 1st stage as they are called and can continue to grow as a being in a very similar way to how a human turns from a baby to a child to a teenager to an adult ect. There are exactly 5 stages of a Rakshasa's development, and with each stage their powers also grow exponentially too. The author says "In their 1st stage of development, they grow the same way as human babies. The point at which they stop growing is where their 2nd stage begins, and from then on they jump in appearance. At 2nd stage they appear about elementary school age, 3rd - middle school, 4th - high school." And at 5th stage they appear as fully grown adults. Yuta also follows this path, we first meet him in the story when he is a second stage Rakshasa untill he became a 4th stage which is the highest stage we have seen Yuta in. Every Rakshasa has human like characteristics in the same way that Nastikas do. A Nastika has a "human form" and a "sura form", in their human form they look human like, but have 1 feature of their Nastika self. In this form their power is severly decreased, and when they transform into their sura form they gain massive power and turn into a "monster" like creature in our eyes. And everything i just said about nastika's can be said for Rakshasa's too, they have their human form and their sura form which boosts their power too.

Now that i have laid the groundwork for who Yuta is and his background and roots as a being in the kubera verse i'll talk a little about his situation, Yuta himself doesn't actually want to destroy everything like Kali had planned, Yuta is in a situation where one side of him wants to destroy everything as his nature is with being a Taraka and Kali's son, while the other side is his love for the people he has befriended ect. So he is mostly holds back his power because he will go berserk if the other side takes over. As a result of this some of the strongest beings in the verse has him tied up/sealed and nullifies his power so he doesn't destory everything, this is in addition with his own will of trying not to destory everything. With this said we have still gotten glimpses of Yuta's power through statements or feats which i will go over.

𝕋𝕙𝕖 𝕖𝕪𝕖 𝕠𝕗 𝕥𝕙𝕖 𝕋𝕒𝕣𝕒𝕜𝕒

In this section i will go over the Taraka clan and its characteristics and abilities that comes with being from the clan and Yuta being the king of said clan. I will focus on the Taraka's eyes since that is its trademark abilitiy, but other abilities will also be brought up.

Well to start of i can say that the Taraka eyes are a form of power nullification that works on basically anything, firstly i'll show his eyes nullifying the magic of normal humans in the world of Kubera. Here we can see everyones magic being nullified, so his powers even works on a group of people which i'll also talk more about later.

Next we can look at Yuta nullifying the power of a 5th zen god. These gods are the highest and strongest tier of gods, expect for the primeval gods. These beings are basically fundamental concepts of the universe kinda, if we look at Agni as an example he is fire, the concept of it anyways, we also have other gods such as Yama the god of death who embodies the concept of death and is an abstract existence. Yuta has shown to nullify the abilities of these gods in multiple occations but i'll show him nullifying the abilities of Chandra the 5th zen god of darkness. The 5th zen gods has control over their concept throughout the entire universe too, so these beings are very powerful. The 5th zen gods go from 1th zen to 5th zen with the 5th being the strongest.

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We have also seen the Taraka eyes nullify the abilities of Nastika the strongest suras in the verse. Here we can see Yuta nullifying the abilities of Sagara a high ranked Nastika from the Ananta clan. So the eyes have been shown to nullify the abilities of literally every race in the verse and is applicable to any opponent Yuta might come across. The eyes have even been shown to stop transformations from happening, the nastika's sura form got nullified by the eye. The Taraka eye is truly special as it will take away everything the opponent tries to do. Another crazy thing about the eye is the fact that Yuta doesn't even need to look at the opponent for it to work, the range of the eye is also amazing considering he doesn't even need to see you for it to work which also suggests he can sense any opponenet. Their abilities even get sealed so they can't use them for a very long time afterwards too.

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Next i'll go over other abilities of the Taraka and how this will help Yuta in this matchup. Another one of the Taraka's abilities is seemingly to make any attack miss, this works even if the eyes of the Taraka doesn't work or they don't have eyes. I also have to add that Yuta has the abilities of the false Taraka god and the abilities of everyone in their own clan. So this Taraka monster making the attacks of the 5th zen's miss will also be applied to Yuta himself. What makes this even more impressive is the fact that the gods can manipulate their own luck, and they still can't land a hit on that Taraka who is fodder to the king Yuta.

𝕋𝕙𝕖 𝕔𝕙𝕒𝕣𝕒𝕔𝕥𝕖𝕣𝕚𝕤𝕥𝕚𝕔𝕤 𝕠𝕗 𝕒 𝔾𝕠𝕕

Yuta himself is of course the son of a primeval god and such he has the characteristics of one. This means Yuta gains many abilities and innate traits that gods themselfs have.

Insight

This is a trademark ability of every 4th and 5h zen god we have seen in the story. What this ability does is it makes the user able to look into the past, present and future of another being, Understand their state of mind and understand everything about that person.

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This will make Yuta able to understand the opponent's background, motivation and anything that can help him in a battle. Insight will also help him predict what the opponent will do and how they will attack, its a crazy precognition and retrocognition with added power to it. Insight is normally restricted by the user having to look the person into the eyes, but Yuta doesn't have this restriciton and can see into the opponent without looking into their eyes.

Immortality and Regeneration

As Yuta has the characteristics of a god he also gains their immortality and regeneration which makes him an insanely difficult person to kill off. I will start by explaining how a 5th zen god's immortality and regeneration works then explain Yuta's own feats and scaling to that.

As a god you have a jurisdiction over something in the universe, i will first start by explaining the difference between the zens and how that effects their abilities. I will put more focus on the 5th zens and Yuta is closer to them than any other zen. A 5th zen's jurisdiction encompasses the entire universe which has many realms and dimensions inside itself. So if we take Agni as an example he is the concept of fire, so everything that is fire inside any of these realms is Agni in a way, and with this being the case for someone to completly end his existence they would have to destory the concept of fire from every realm and dimension in the entire universe.

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We can also take a look at another example of a 5th zen god in Yama, he is the god of death and is the embodiment of death who will survive as long as the concept of death still exists.

If we now look at a 4th zen god their jurisdiction, they also seemingly has a jurisdiction over the entire universe, with Marut and Asvins being examples. They both embody "decay" and "ressurection". Looking further down you will start to see gods who only has a jurisdiction over a galaxy or a solar system or even just a planet which are 1-3 zens.

Now over to why the 5th zen gods have very impressive regeneration and immortality. There is a place in the kubera universe which is called "the 0th dimension" i will also give a description of the place "Vritra is the first king of the Vritra clan, and Fathomless Fire is his unique transcendental skill. It moves targets to a 0-dimensional space. Their destination is a boundless dimension of nothingness where nothing is permitted to exist, and every form of existence in mind, body and soul that enters it is disintegrated for return to non-existence." Now that we know what this place does we can look at how it interacts with the different god classes.

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The author establishes that only the 5th zen gods are able to survive in this place, this also means that the 4th zen gods or 3rd zen gods won't be able to survive there. And like i already explained earlier the 4th zens and lower do also have jurisdictions, despite this they will die without being helped by said jurisdiction and have their whole being erased from existence despite their ability to ressurect through their jurisdiction. This means this place negates the ability to ressurect through your body, mind, soul or other things such as concepts ect. The only reason 5th zens can survive here is because as a 5th zen they had reached Nirvana within the kubera verse. The gods are also structured in a different way than any other being, everything about their being is just one concept like explained here:

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Now back to why all of this matters to Yuta himself, firstly we know that he has the characteristics of a god and is the son of a primeval god. I also showed that Yuta posesses insight which is an ability that only 4th and 5th zens have. Yuta himself has also shown the ability to survive in the 0th dimension where only 5th zen gods have been able to survive which also makes him superior to all the 4th zens who will die by going there.

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Yuta even survived the 0th dimension as a child at the 1st stage of his development and got stronger with every stage since then. This means Yuta survived erasure in soul, body, mind and conceptual as a kid. Everything about Yuta is also one concept in the same way the gods are, this makes sense with him surviving the 0th dimension, being the son of a primeval god and having the characteristics of one. Its even said that Yuta has better ressurecting abilities than gods themselfs.

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Another thing about Yuta is the fact that anti-regen doesn't work on him, so there is a sword in the series called "sword of return" which was created by Kali, Yuta's mother. Its said that this sword has the ability to negate the regeneration of Gods and Sura's(but didn't work on Shiva another primeval god). I'll talk more about this sword later.

So the sword is able to neutrulize gods and sura's regeneration which includes 5th zens of course which we know has insane regen which can come back from everything i mentioned earlier. It can also negate the regen of suras which can even regenerate from literally nothing. And this sword is useless against Tarakas and their regen/immortality.

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And to end of this section i'll add 3 different abilities to Yuta's arsenal that relates to his connection with the gods, firstly i'll add that no mind altering abilities or anything of the sort would work against Yuta as a 5th zen god is completly immune to such attacks.

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And like established earlier Yuta has the characteristics and all the other connections to a 5th zen like i explained earlier. And because Yuta's connection with the gods is like this, this would also mean he has the ability to manipulate his luck like they can.

For the last part of this section i want to add the fact that beings who returned from the 0th dimension literally trancended existence and non-existence and returned from that place. So the duality of existence and non-existence itself was trancended by Yuta when he returned from that place which further adds layers to his survivability and insane defenses that can't be broken by Yan Sen.

And this was him doing this as a child/baby.

𝕋𝕙𝕖 𝕊𝕨𝕠𝕣𝕕 𝕠𝕗 ℝ𝕖𝕥𝕦𝕣𝕟

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As mentioned earlier this is what the sword of return looks like, this weapon is mainly used by the protagonist of the story Leez, but Yuta has used it on multiple occations too so i'll add this to his arsenal as a weapon he can utilize. As the sword was made by Kali, Yuta's mother as mentioned earlier Yuta himself is also able to use the sword without any restrictions, he isn't even bound by the swords rules like other, but can use it like his mother did.

Now over to what the sword itself is capable of, i went over this a bit earlier but now i'll try to explain everything its capable of. Firstly the way its able to negate the regeneration of the opponent. The purpose of the sword was to kill Shiva(A primeval god) but it wasn't capable of doing so, but the sword is still able to negate the regeneration of every other creature shown in the series such as the gods and suras.

So even 5th zen gods such as Agni, Yama ect can have their regeneration negated by this sword. As i talked about earlier a 5th zen god is able to come back from the 0th dimension where everything is erased in mind, body, soul and conceptually. So being able to negate the regen of such beings is very impressive, i won't go over the whole 5th zen god thing here as i already did it in the Yuta's connection to the gods section. But the sword is also able to negate the regen of suras who can regenerate from literally nothing. This is the main purpose in this fight as we haven't seen the sword been used by a powerful being such as Yuta, but by a much weaker character in Leez. Another feature of the sword is the fact that it will return to its user hand without the user having to do anything. And the second last important thing the sword has been shown to do is absorb attacks, this can be seen when Leez uses the sword to absorb attacks from a 5th stage rakshasa. Finally we have the fact that the sword can open portal to travel between dimensions and realms, Yuta can travel anywhere he wants with this power.

𝕆𝕥𝕙𝕖𝕣 𝔸𝕓𝕚𝕝𝕚𝕥𝕚𝕖𝕤

In this section i'll just go over some other abilities and resistances that Yuta may have but isn't big enough to warrant their own section. To start with Yuta can obviously survive in space, fights between Gods and Suras happened in space, not on planets ect. So destroying the planet or destroying anything won't help with a fight against Yuta, this also means he doesn't need oxygen or something to breathe either. Movement in space would also be easy for Yuta, Yuta can also fly with his wings on a planet too like seen here. Another thing about Yuta is his vision, this could have probably been in the Taraka eye section, but yes Yuta has amazing vision, he can see a human in a cloudy mountain range instantly from the sky. Yuta's being can also ignore universal laws of the universe based on what was said by the "monster" inside Yuta. In his 3rd stage he could also break out of a space created? by god Kubera a 5th zen god that controls all land in the universe. Lastly Yuta also has access to teleportation without the sword of return, he can just teleport with his own being without any help which can be a very useful ability, but he also has the sword which will return to him so idk if it matters much.

𝕋𝕙𝕖 𝕤𝕚𝕫𝕖 𝕠𝕗 𝕥𝕙𝕖 𝕌𝕟𝕚𝕧𝕖𝕣𝕤𝕖

For this section of the post i'll just focus mostly on the size of the universe instead of other cosmetic things about universe. To start of i'll introduce the major realms of the universe which are the Human realm, Sura realm and the God realm. As hinted at by their names its where the different races live, many characters from all races can travel between these realms by some means or other, this was before Visnu a primeval god closed of all the realms to each other and made it way harder for people to travel between said realms. And "the universe" in Kubera does indeed have multiple space-times so its actually more like a multiverse which i will explore further. You can alse scale the kubera universe with higher dimensional stuff, Which i will do here to have Yuta match or should i say surpass the firepower of Yan Sen himself. The universe of Kubera is built up by different dimensions as they are called, these go from the 0th dimension all the way to 15+ dimensions in its higherarchy. And each of the realms mentioned either encompasses 1 of these dimensions or multiple of them. I have already explained the 0th dimension earlier with Yuta's Regen and immortality.

Before i start to explore the cosmology i want to establish the fact that each dimension in its higherarchy has additional spatial axes compared to the last one. When we get introduced to the concept of dimensions in the series its explained like this:

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The author even confirms the aditional spatial axes of the dimensions when talking about a circle being a 2d thing and a 1d being wouldn't be able to understand it, just like a 3d being wouldn't be able to understand a 4d thing like was shown in the series. And like said in the series "some can intuitively understand dimensions greater than the one you are residing on" Which only implies one thing and that is the dimensions in the series that i will go over in the next part. The translation for the raws of the dimensions in the series also use the mathematical terms and symbols for actual dimensionality:

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So i'll start with the 1st dimension which is their hell. Its basically just their hell in the universe which is pretty simple.

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We haven't been introduced to the second dimension in the story yet so i can't way anything about it, but then we come over to the 3rd dimension which is the human realm.

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And this also supports the argument for the higher dimensionality as the 3rd dimension is where the humans reside and would in turn be a universe with 3 spatial axes just like real life. This also counts for all the rest of the dimensions i will further show. Its pretty simple, like i said its where the humans live. Now for the 4th dimension its confirmed to be the sura realm, we don't have a graphic like with the other dimensions shown but its said in the series that the Sura realm is above the Human realm. Another important thing about the sura realm is the fact that its confirmed to be an infinite space.

Now about the other realms, we also have the 0th dimension space called an endless space by one of the characters in the series, this would obviously imply it being infinite. We also have blanket statements of the universe itself being infinite too which further supports the idea of every dimension being infinite/endless.

With all of this in mind its pretty safe to assume all of the main dimensions in the universe are infinite in size, especially since the 0th dimensions is a never ending space and its the lowest out of all the main dimensions in the universe. Before i talk a little more about the other dimensions ect, i also want to bring up the fact that time flows differently in all of the different dimensions which means they are different time spaces if it wasn't already obvious.

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We also have the fact that people have stated different places to be different both spatially and temporally which also support everything being different time-spaces.

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Continuing with the dimensions, we dont really know anything about the 5th one, at the 6th dimension we enter the god realm. The god realm itself ecompasses many different dimensions, But the base of the gods realm is the 6th dimension.

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As confirmed by the author there exists multiple dimensions inside the gods realm, and your zen level decides how far up you can go, so a 5th zen god can travel to every dimension in the universe which is impossible for all others, but every zen can come to the 6th dimension.

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The scan above basically explains everything, but like i said the 6th dimension is the base for the gods realm and it goes further, the author even says there are many more dimensions in the gods realm than just 5 for each zen. The author even says that there are many more than just 5, so i'll just assume its something like 15 total including the dimensions below it, which would be many more than 5(low balled), it could also be a higher number, but i wanna stay low balled on this topic. This would mean that there exists about lets say 15 whole time-spaces in the universe of Kubera and the highest level of the god realm would have 15 spatial axes low balled.

We also get the 7th dimension which is where Yama the god of death resides, and knowledge about Bhrama the primeval god staying even higher than that too.

I think this is a pretty short explanation of the universe in Kubera and everything that's needed to explain the firepower of Yuta himself. And just to be clear in Kubera when they say "the universe" they are referring to its multiverse as we would qualify it as since it has multiple space-times just to make this clear. They even say that "the sura realm is in this universe universe". So everything mentioned in this part makes up "the universe" of Kubera, so later statements about destroying the universe includes everything mentioned here.

𝕋𝕙𝕖 𝔽𝕚𝕣𝕖𝕡𝕠𝕨𝕖𝕣 𝕠𝕗 𝕥𝕙𝕖 𝕂𝕚𝕟𝕘

This section won't be that big because Yuta himself doesn't really have any fights in his strongest form(the form im using in this fight). So i will more so go over statements and other ways to gauge his power, there is a reason why i established the universe of Kubera before writing about Yuta's power.

I can start by talking about different statements about Yuta destroying different things, we already know Yuta was destorying the Sura realm in a timeline and killed the entire Kinnara clan(one of the big clans of the sura realm). Yuta also made all the Nastika of the sura realm run away because they were scared to fight Yuta and knew he would beat their ass and kill them.

We also have other statements of Yuta being able to destroy the entire universe itself when he reaches that threshold of power and not stopping himself like he has been through the series so far.

Yuta is also a being which has existed for countless universes and destroyed them all.

All of this obviously means Yuta has the power to destroy a multiverse that holds minimum 15 space-times which is where i will scale him to for now. There isn't really anything else to go over in this section as its pretty clear that Yuta at his strongest has the power to destroy the Kubera universe, as said Yuta doesn't really have any fights that would be useful for this post since he has never fought at his strongest in the series so far.

Also if you wanna argue that there aren't 15 space-times, sure: However its 100% gonna be more than 12 which already makes Yuta clear of Yan Sen either way, no matter how you wanna argue that point. As the god realm has way more dimensions than just 5 like said by the author themselfs which makes it 5+5+way more, unless you think "way more than 5" is less than 3 which doesn't make sense. The lowest of low balls would be 15 for that point which is what im arguing.

Inital counters

For this section in my first post i just want to go over some things that i think Yan Sen doesn't have and gets overhyped with by readers of the series when he showed way less than what people think.

"The setting"

In this section i want to go over "the setting" which both Henry and Yan Sen utilized as their powers in their fight and argue for the fact that it isn't really "plot manipulation" and just a power that allows you to copy your enemy or gain strength.

First i want to establish what the setting really is, this was kindly explained to us by Yan Sen himself: "So that's what the setting means. An infinite power to overtake your opponent." So this power is just something that can increase your own power through this ability. Henry then says that he "is the setting" and that "no matter what book, comic ect you are in you can't defeat him."

So all this really means is that he "is this power" and hypes up his ability to power up above everything he said. But we should relax and look at what this ability has actually done, he can't just get extra tiers of powers above what he has actually shown with the power despite saying everything he did. You would have to argue he could power up to boundless based on it which doesn't make sense, you should just go by what the power itself has shown not just some hyperbole said by the characters themselfs, its literally just like Saitama being called "one punch man" and arguing he can one punch anyone in fiction when it doesn't work like that, we have to go by what has been shown and their feats.

And with all this in mind, its definitly not some grand power that makes you able to manipulate the plot itself like some may suggest when talking about these characters. Its simply an ability that lets you power up to an unknown degree. Also remember that Yan Sen never actually used this exact setting power himself, i will go over what Yan Sen did now.

For Yan Sen himself he actually used a power called "creation setting power", this allowed him to make copies of Henry which fought for him and had all the abilites of Henry. This is indeed a good power, but Yan Sen won't be able to use this power due to the Taraka eyes taking away his immortal emperor form and would also take away this ability either way.

Also just to finish off this section, Henry later wanted to learn qi from Yan Sen, but he wasn't able to. Yan Sen the best teacher("and can also manipulate the plot") wasn't able to teach him qi, Henry the student("who can manipulate the plot") wasn't able to learn it.... Henry says "could it be that our original system is different" which will probably be what is argued. But that doesn't make sense as other superheroes was able to learn qi and Yan Sen himself gets mad and doesn't seem amused by that thought. And if they really had "plot manipulation" that wouldn't matter, they would literally just manipulate the plot so it worked.

12D

The second thing i wanted to go over here is a contentious one, but i'll argue it and see how the opponent responds which will be interesting. So i want to argue that we never actually saw anyone destroy or create a 12d space like some may assume happened. The only time 12d was involved was when Henry used it BFR someone.

There is no indication that Henry created the 12d space, or that it was ever destroyed. Its likely that its just some kind of hax that allows Henry to BFR someone to an already exisiting 12d space that wasnt created by Henry, i know its called "henry's space" but i don't think that is sufficent enough when no other feats in the series are on that level or even close. Its likely just a 12d hax that has no relevance to their actual power shown in the story.

If there is actual evidence of either creation or destruction of the realm i will drop this point of course.

I will wait for the counter posts to really dig into Yan Sen and what he can and can't do, so for now this is all in this section of the post.

Inital conclusions

  • To start with Yuta should automatically have better scaling from an ap/dc standpoint, even if the opponent somehow manages to argue the 12d stuff for Yan Sen, Yuta would still scale higher.
  • Yuta's Taraka eyes have crazy power null to the point that it can even supress actual transformations of characters, Yan Sen's immortal emperor form won't even be used here since he won't be able to resist the Taraka eyes. And yes Yan Sen has never been shown resisting power null on the level of Yuta in the series. This means he also disables all the other abilities than Yan Sen will show in this matchup whatever he argues for on that front.
  • Yan Sen has absolutly no way of putting Yuta down, he can come back from the 0th dimension which erases your body, mind, soul and conceptually yet Yuta was unnaffected and came back from that place as a child. He also has better ressurrection abilities than the gods themselfs and better regen than any god or sura like already explained.
  • It will be very sad for Yan Sen when he gets all his abilities restricted and has to deal with an immortal monster with higher dimensional scaling and ap than him, i don't see how Yan Sen has any chance here.
  • All the win conditions won't work on Yuta, for BFR he can just dimensionally teleport with either his own power or the sword of re, Sealing wont work either as Yuta already already broke out of the space god Kubera created for him and the sword of re/his tp abilites. And forget about killing Yuta....
  • I'll go into further detail in later posts, but there won't be much new information as Yuta has almost no showings himself as we almost never see him fight, but he has shown enough to beat Yan Sen imo.
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PrinceX

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Hopefully CV copied everything correctly.

@infinitemass

I already had the post finished basically, i just had to adjust it to Yan Sen, i could post it very fast, the next post will take way longer lol.

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InfiniteMass

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@princex: Looks good, I'll try to get something up in these 2 weeks got a lot going on but will update soon!

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Taep & T4V.

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PrinceX

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TAEP