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#151 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio
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#152 Edited by Cull_Obsidian (2204 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador: Didn't you know that the thanos that fought rot was a clone so is not applicable

I also have a better reality warping feat then the reality gem one

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#153 Posted by Helloman (9131 posts) - - Show Bio

T4V this is good.

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#154 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio
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#155 Edited by blackspidey2099 (2742 posts) - - Show Bio

t4v

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#156 Edited by Cull_Obsidian (2204 posts) - - Show Bio
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#157 Edited by Cull_Obsidian (2204 posts) - - Show Bio

@cull_obsidian: do you have a scan saying he was a clone?

First scan is from the OHOTMU Bio of Thanos

No Caption Provided

And this one is from Infinity Abyss

No Caption Provided

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#158 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@cull_obsidian: The infinity abyss scan proves nothing except a clone was involved with avengers at one point.

The guide clears it though. Any other time a clone was used? Will edit it soon.

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#159 Posted by Cull_Obsidian (2204 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador: Well that's not true , the infinity abyss story specifically mentions three instances of thanosi (there are more) that have happened recent to the story and that have actually appeared in comics

These are kazaar, mighty thor and avengers celestial quest, these were to test potential allies in the fight against walker the death God

First was to test how a human (kazaar)was to do against a cosmic threat

Then it was to study mangog as he feeds on souls similar to walker , also to test Thor as an ally

Then finally in reference to the scan it says about Thor and the avengers , this is talking about Celestial quest where Thor is again involved , rather then the scan not proving anything , it actually confirms it as your saying its just some unreferenced and unmentioned instance that we havent heard about , that just doesn't make sense, the most logical answer is that its the instance that is actually mentioned by bios and other sources like the wikia and interviews . Adding to the evidence is that its in the correct timeframe , there's no evidence to suggest its some other unknown event where a thanosi was used rather then an cononically referenced one

In answer to your question, yeah there was a clone against squirrel girl and against she hulk , there are also other times where thanos has used android type clones against iron man and drax and a robot against the grandmaster. Finally thanos actually fought a much stronger doppelganger in infinity war

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#160 Edited by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador:

Post the 3rd: After almost a year of battle... this endeth now!!!

No Caption Provided

I have to give credit where credit is due, you are the foremost expert on the vine when it comes to all things Thanos which is why i have enjoyed debating you immensely so far... however, as most people are wont to do when debating Odin, you have resorted to lowballing a character which you clearly do not know nearly as much about. I would have preffered if we both simply argued for OUR characters and not tried to act as if we are experts on our opponents, but since you have it is my pleasure to debunk your misguided reasoning.

Refuting Fake News

Realms are Universes

*Sigh* Claiming the realms arent universes is the go-to lowball for people when debating Odin and i have found that there is a staunch unwavering section of this site who will never give up their misguided idea, so even after i show you the undeniable proof i bet when voting rolls around the usual lowballers will appear claiming "hurr durr Brony is wanking the realms so he lozes hurr durr". Anyway, enough of an old mans grumblings, time to debunk the debunks.

Thor lifts asgard - Check

There is a difference between Asgard (floating continent) and Asgard/Asgard-Space (the dimension/universe). Marvel has been making the difference between them since forever, even in old comics where things changed from writer to writer Asgard was always a separate dimension:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2

The first scan says "smaller pocket universes", but that was just the old definition and in modern times Marvel has confirmed more than once they are infinite universes. The point is, Asgard has always existed as its own separate dimension; to claim it and the other realms are just planets in the normal universe is blatantly false and debunked by the decades of consistency.

All one has to do is pick up almost any modern Thor comic since the time of Fraction and you will see the term Asgard-Space or something like it used:

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Asgard has always existed as a seperate dimension and in modern times Marvel has confirmed it and the other realms are infinite universes.

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3

There is no questioning this.

Infinity gems of 616 Universe work on asgard - Check

They worked in Mephisto's hell as well yet we all know that it is a different realm/universe.

Speaking of Infinity gems, in Infinity Gauntlet #2 it was confirmed that Asgard exists outside of earths reality, when Thanos with the IG unleashed a wave of power that cut off Asgard's universe from earths universe:

No Caption Provided

More undeniable proof. Asgard's realm is its own universe.

Silver Surfer can fly to asgard - Check

Surfer can warp space-time around him while flying to reach other universes/dimensions, heck, Thor has done the exact same thing. This proves nothing.

In the recent Unworthy Thor comics, entire (old) asgard is trapped by Collector - Check

Just the floating continent, not the dimension!

In the recent Thor comics, Jane Thor and War Thor clash was visible from all the nine realms. None of them are multiversal.

The amount of reaching here is ridiculous. Thats like if someone claimed nobody in Marvel is universal because in marvel shockwaves and sound travel through space, so obviously it isnt an actual universe.

The gods in marvel are metaphysical beings and Thor throughout his career has done things that shouldnt b possible for someone who isnt multiversal, such killing the embodiment of the death of gods who was bigger than Eternity. Thor didnt even exist anymore, he was literally non-existent, wiped from reality and still killed a multiversal abstract deity and came back to life. Metaphysical, mythical and strange things are bound to happen with marvel's gods, it does not invalidate the absolute fact the realms are universes.

Odin recreating asgard - check

And your point is....? That is a universal feat for Odin, nothing more nothing less.

Oh, and surtur threatened nine realms, don't tell me surtur is multiversal.

Well during everything burns when he gained the full power of his eternal flames that is exactly what he was:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2

Also universal+ =/= Multiversal. Surtur has the power to burn the nine realms making him universal or above at full power.

Literally everyone of them confirm that Asgard and the realms are not universes. One statement is not above all feats

No, you actually have no legs to tand on in this matter. Everything confirms the realms are universes.

Even midgard is just a planet. It makes sense for the realms to be planetary like Midgard (earth)

Midgard is a planet. Midgard-Space is the whole of universe 616:

Thor/Loki original sin #2
Thor/Loki original sin #2

That space-ship is being flown by the guardians of the galaxy in the far reaches of the universe and ... my goodness... would you look at that, they are in Midgard-Space, because it is the whole universe.

Even Yggdrasil itself is nowhere near the size of a universe, let alone so large that it dwarfs nine universes which you are suggesting.

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4

The world tree is literally the inter-universal space-time nexus of the nine realms and exists outside of reality in the all-space between realms (though at times it has changed positions)! The space-time continuum of yggdrasil is so vast that even Galactus himself cannot navigate it and couldnt find the world-seed after loki hid it within the roots:

No Caption Provided

Physical size does not apply to the metaphysical manifestation of multiple universes worth of space-time. I hope now that you cease your lowballing and remember you are dealing with metaphysical gods, not mortals and mundane trees.

Except one statement doesn't throw the feats out of window.

Your right, however decades of proof, three statements (1,2,3, plus more im likely forgetting) and an entire story arc centering on the concept (the world-eaters arc) trump your misinformed lowballing.

Summary of Debunk 1

  • The realms are full, infinite universes.
  • Odin's universal feats are universal.

Odin's feats are Impressive

I am sad to say there is A LOT of lowballing and nit-picking throughout your posts regarding Odin's feats, so much that i bet most of this post is going to be dedicated to refuting them. This section will deal with the most pertinent of your transgressions, the Seth and Infinity feats.

SETH FEAT

Except it doesn't say that

It says that

  1. They are shaking distant planets, and the streets below them are also shaking
  2. This is confirmed by sudden eaarthquakes felling stone structures in scan 4 that you posted
  3. The power they are using in the battle is strong enough to extinguish stars

So, Odin and Seth were using star-level power for entire course of the battle, not galaxy level.

You conveniently left out what it says on the next page:

No Caption Provided

So no, they werent just using star level power, they were using galaxy level power. You also cant deny this as you already accepted the statements of the page previous to this seeing as the comic shows that they are indeed unleashing forces shaking throughout the universe. You cannot accept one statement and then disregard the very next statement, you accept one you accept the other.

Also, what does "dead" galaxy even mean? An empty galaxy? A Galaxy with no suns? Because if so, then it doesn't make them galaxy busters.

https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/chandra/news/red-and-dead-galaxies.html

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/2017/hubble-captures-massive-dead-disk-galaxy

Not only are they galaxy busters, but some "dead" galaxies are far, far larger than our milky way galaxy. It literally took my 2 seconds to search this on google, you could have avoided lowballing if you just took a couple seconds to type dead galaxy into your search engine.

There was no emphasis made on the damage done by this battle either. Usually, when a fight destroys galaxy, emphasis is made on the damage.

What? No emphasis? It was creating ripples in reality (1), tearing at the multiverse (2) and the tumult of their fight was shaking planets and extinguishing stars throughout the universe AS YOU YOURSELF ALREADY ADMITTED!

My goodness, the double speak is surreal.

Plus, it was not an energy-projection destructive feat. It was a multi-plane existence battle, affecting reality.

That is simply what happens when skyfathers like Odin go all out, that is how much power they wield. The POWER Odin and Seth were unleashing was causing all the damage and rippling through every plane of reality, we know this is true as when Seth blasts Odin (which i showed last post in his durability section) it is the blast that shakes the entire universe and which Surfer senses.

Also, another problem is that two fodder frost giants gave him trouble and tanked attacks from the same seth TWICE in the same issue,

Oh, and LOKI managed to fight him off for over half an issue. He was defeated but still put up a hell of a fight. And that was a weakened Loki.

This is the lowest and most ridiculous form of lowballing imaginable. So because Seth didnt oneshot kill every character he came across that wasnt skyfather level, that somehow invalidates his on panel feat? No, it doesnt, same way IG Thanos' feats arent invalidated just because Spidey was able to knock him over or Cap was able to fight or when Dr Doom was able to tank an attack from Thanos with the IG.

Man, if i wanted to lowball you this way i could with how many times Thanos has faced the avengers and didnt kill any of them, or the guardians of the galaxy, ect, but i wont. I am going to debate this based on consistency, as one should debate.

INFINITY FEAT

Okay, this looks impressive if we don't know the context.

I love this, i just love when people try to educate me on the context of Asgardians -_-

First of all, this isn't half of Odin vs half of Odin but MUCH more

Infinity is called a foe more powerful Odin has ever faced, and POWER FROM BEYOND

It was again refered as POWER FROM BEYOND and as Odin and Thor confirm, it is a cosmic enchantment to create an Illusion of covering planets and worlds into darkness

And...? Hela took half of Odin's soul and turned it into the monstrous cosmic/mystic being known as infinity, letting it live far out in space and steal/destroy planets. These links do not support your view, all you have done is said "from beyond" means something which it doesnt, blatant context twisting.

and most importantly, when it wsa confirmed to be more than that later:

Also, it was no under Odin's own power, as he was tapping into a fraction of the power of abstract Infinity

Find me a single time in Thor 184-188 where it says Infinity was tapping into the power of an Abstract. You cant because its not there. That scan you show is, IIRC, from a quasar comic and is likely just as much an author mistake as a retcon.

Oh, but there is actually no need for me to argue this. If it truly was tapping into the power of the abstract Infinity, then that makes Odin's feat even more impressive. Not only that, but Odin absorbed infinity into himself when their fight ended, merging and adding its power back unto himself.

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2

So if we listen to you, Odin has both the Odinforce and a fraction of the power of an Abstract equal to Eternity. Thanos gets stomped into oblivion, thank you very much :D

So, basically, ALL THE DAMAGE DONE was infinity consciously reaching out for the planets and hiding them under its own influence.

Except...

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3

Scientists were watching the whole thing, they saw worlds being born and dying, space and time being torn apart and planets throughout the universe getting shaken and broken by the cosmic upheaval and that was only the very outer ring of the conflict where the shockwaves and energy unleashed would be at its weakest!

FACTS

  • Odin and infinity were fighting on the edge of the universe.
  • Scientists saw worlds being born and destroyed.
  • The power unleashed in the fight was so tremendous it pierced time and space throughout the universe.
  • Earth as well as other worlds throughout the universe were being shaken and damaged by the fight, even though it was so far away.
  • The scientists could only see the outer edges of the destruction, in the heart of the conflict Odin confirmed galaxies were being destroyed.

This is what happened when the fight actually started, these are the facts. You have taken scans from before the fight even started and twisted them, disregarding the scans of the actual fight.

Summary of Debunk 2

  • Odin vs Seth were destroying galaxies and shaking the universe.
  • Odin vs Infinity were destroying galaxies and shaking the universe.
  • Odin absorbed Infinity and has all his power (which according to you Apex, would include a portion of the Abstract Infinity).

I didnt expect you to lowball this much man, taking so many things out of context, ignoring scans, ect, its disappointing. Next time just show off why your character should win, dont lowball your opponents.

Previous Battle Context

Mentality - Odin wanted to kill Thanos, being bloodlusted. Why? Because he believed Thanos defeated his son and held him hostage for some reason. On the other hand, Thanos came there to ask Odin for help. Why? Because Thor was suffering from madness and he had the control of power gem at that time.

Not true at all. Odin did not want to kill Thanos, he was not bloodlusted, this can be seen when Odin offers Thanos the chance to yield:

No Caption Provided

If i hated someone and wanted to kill them with every bone in my body id be giving out compliments as well lol!

No Caption Provided

I would also give them the chance to surrender and end the fight peacefully, after all that is what you do when you are bloodlusted and going for the kill... XD!

Was Odin angry? Yes. Was he bloodlusted and trying to kill Thanos by any means necessary? NO, definitely not.

Oh, but im sure Thanos had no interest in fighting at all right? He is just a peachy keen hippy dippy who came to Odin with big puppy dog eyes amiright?

No Caption Provided

Nope, the exact opposite, Thanos wanted to defeat Odin. He even used his versatility (which he hardly ever does) and tried to contain Odin in a block of pure energy, which Odin casually broke out of (1).

So, yea, it was quite a different picture than you paint it out to be.

Odin's attacks: He attacked Thanos 7 times

  • Energy blast 1: Odin blasts Thanos with one hand, Thanos stands there, no-selling
  • Energy blast 2: Odin blasts Thanos with two hands, Thanos is slightly staggered
  • Energy blast 3*: Thanos is charging towards Odin to punch him, but Odin unleashes an energy blast which forces Thanos back. Still unfazed.
  • Rock Throwing 4: Odin uses telekinesis to throw rocks at Thanos, who destroys them with eyebeams.
  • Energy blast 5: Odin now summons Gungnir, his faithful weapon. With a massive blast of energy from Gungnir Thanos is sent flying through a castle, but Thanos has still not been knocked down yet. He still is standing good as new.
  • Energy blast 6: Odin, frustrated, releases a huge energy blast from gungnir again. However, Thanos not only tanks it but he walks through it. He walks through the blast while Odin can't seem to do anything to stop Thanos from advancing. Then he grabs Gungnir's tip.
  • Energy blast 7: When Thanos and Odin are wrestling for Gungnir's control, Odin charges an energy attack, and through the tip of gungnir, he channels the blast right into Thanos (still holding the tip of the weapon), and this blast knocks Thanos down. However, he gets back up with ease, and this display of toughness frustrates Odin and changes his mentality, as now he asks Thanos to give up instead of trying to kill him. Thanos refuses.

Well, that recounting of events isnt unbiased at all, lol! Yes, Thanos tanked most of Odin's attacks, i do not deny that he has great durability, you have changed my mind since last post and i now agree Thanos can withstand several attacks from a going all out Odin. HOWEVER, your recounting of the events is clearly colored by bias.

Firstly, in regards to Energy Blast 3, you say thanos was blasted back but "still unfazed". That is nothing but your own biased opinion, to me it looks like the blast hurt him, he contorts in pain. What you said has nothing substantial behind it, just your wishful thinking.

Energy blast 5, same thing, you say he "has not been knocked down yet and is good as new". Firstly, this is utterly false as we see him get ragdolled and afterwards he has to get out from under a bunch of rubble, so of course he was knocked down. Secondly, "good as new" is just you, yet again, projecting your wishes and bias onto the scene.

Lastly Energy blast 7 where you say Thanos "gets back up with ease." This is patently false to anyone who isnt trying to present the fight in a particular light as to sway people to their side:

No Caption Provided

Does that look like he "got up with ease"? No. His armor's messed up, he is steaming, each panel shows him struggling to get up, first on one knee and then the other. This last blast, or a combination of this blast and the damage accumulated before, clearly took a toll on the mad Titan and he was clearly harmed.

So, your recount of the fight is heavily colored by bias. Sure Thanos showed he has the durability to withstand attacks from Odin, but he was not no-seling everything like you claim and in the end the damage was taking its toll, whereas Odin wasnt hurt in the least.

Thanos took 7 shots from Bloodlusted Odin, got sent flying once, and got knocked down once. However, he also no-sold once blast and walked through one blast amped by gungnir.

Actually he got sent flying twice and by the end he wasnt looking so good.

Odin took 2 energy blast from came_to_ask_for_help Thanos and broke through his stasis field. However, when Thanos wrestled with him, Odin needed to unleash a massive charged energy blast to free himself

"Came to ask for help Thanos" was actually more akin to "determined to win" Thanos.

Also, Odin casually busting out of the thing used to restrain WM/PG Thor, the equal of Thanos, just goes to show the big difference in power.

1. Their previous fight was in asgard. This is more than just a hometown advantage. Odin has all his resources on asgard, all special abilities, moral support, crowd support, and every single bit of asgard's realm contains divine energies which Odin can draw upon or charge his blasts with. In neutral ground, Odin won't be able to be as effective as he would be in asgard (even if the difference is very small). On the other hand, Thanos will be more effective in being able to draw upon cosmic energies when the fight takes place in a neutral grounds from the cosmos itself.

Your claim that Thanos will somehow be more effective than Odin outside of Asgard is quite frankly ludicrous. Odin tore the tenth realm from yggdrasil while off of Asgard, manipulated all the EM particles in the universe while off of Asgard, killed Cul Borson while off of Asgard, ect, ect, ect. The majority of Odin's best feats take place off of Asgard. While he is theoretically more powerful on Asgard, being off Asgard has never been shown to weaken him and for the most part writers act like the difference doesnt exist.

2. Thanos did not use his shields in his previous fight with Odin. In this fight with standard gear, he will. The shield will soak up several attacks from Odin.

Utterly unsubstantiated claim to try and make Thanos fight with Odin more impressive. Thanos always has shields, he uses them almost every time he fights, even against characters like Hulk who are ants compared to Thanos, let alone Odin! There is no proof that Thanos didnt have his shields when fighting Odin, likely it was his shields that allowed him to no-sell the first blast and not his durability.

Odin hasn't suddenly become smarter or stronger and didn't make any groundbreaking discovery in the recent years. On the other hand, Thanos is always exploring out new things again and again, unfolding new secrets about universe in Cosmic powers, Marvel Universe: The end, Annihilation, The Thanos Imperative, Thanos: Infinity Finale as well as he has faced a number of strong foes since then, becoming much more experienced and smarter fighter.

On the contrary, Odin has faced more powerful opponents and garnered more powerful feats since his last encounter with Thanos, such as the dark gods of narcisson, world-eaters of ano-athox or, of course, his battle with Galactus himself.

Odin's power level is pretty much the same, while Thanos recieved a major upgrade in The Thanos Imperative making him much more powerful than he was in this battle.

Will this give Thanos more of a fighting chance? Sure, but going by the feats you have shown i am not convinced Thanos has any real chance of winning, so this is not really an advantage.

Thanos is bloodlusted while in previous fight, he was there to ask for help.

Firstly, Thanos wanted to win that fight.

Secondly, as this is my last post i will be showing off just how mind-mindbogglingly dangerous a truly bloodlusted Odin can be, without his asgardian warrior code morals holding him back from utterly obliterating you in the most unfair ways possible.

Odin is facing a stronger, smarter, better equipped and more experienced Thanos on grounds much more favourable to Thanos, who actually wants to fight Odin for real this time and to kill him.

And Thanos is facing a bloodlusted Odin for the first time, just wait, you are about to see how scary he is.

Summary of Debunk 3

  • Odin was not bloodlusted and trying his hardest to kill Thanos, he was just angry.
  • Thanos was not just their to talk, he wanted to defeat Odin bad.
  • Thanos withstood many attacks but by the end he was worse for wear.
  • Odin ragdolled Thanos around the whole fight and was himself unharmed.
  • Odin will not be any weaker fighting Thanos off of Asgard.
  • Thanos may have gotten stronger, but the feats so far dont show he can beat Odin.

=========================================================================================================================================

There are a lot more mistakes throughout your post that i will address in miscellaneous counters as well as my own arguments, but these were the big fish and they have now been fried.

Now do not get me wrong, dont get offended, i respect you as a debater and think you have done extremely well in debating FOR Thanos so far. I however will not let such lowballing of Odin and his mythos go un-countered and in doing so i may be a tad bit harsh, but it is because i expected better.

Now then, onto the miscellaneous counters and then... the final argument and feats!

Miscellaneous Counters

Counters to Counters 2.0

Thanos has tanked this reality-warping assault before Warlock came to his rescue. I'm pretty sure that Odin has nowhere near the reality warping feats to match the reality gem.

True, that type of reality warping is more on the level of RKT, above what Odin is capable of. I do have some questions though, seeing as this feat for Thanos seems to have happened off-panel:

  • Did Thanos being in his ship help to protect him from the reality warping?
  • Thanos survived, but did he still get effected by the warping of reality?

The context matters a great deal. Odin may not be able to warp Thanos to death, however the reality warping might still be effective. Odin's power is so great that he has been able to imbue a sword with the power to rewrite reality and create an alternate Asgard with its own pantheon of gods:

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It will help him evade some hits and land some hits.

No, it will not. Odin can create attacks that extinguish stars, destroy galaxies and send shockwaves through every plane of reality. Thanos speed is absolutely useless.

Also, Odin has a FTL speed feat but it comes from the horrible writing of Jason Aaron, so id prefer not to show it.

Did Odin deal more damage to Galan? Yes, but he harmed himself more in the process

Did Thanos harm himself? No

Odin may not have fallen into Odinsleep, but he was unable to continue fighting or even stand back up. Within 2-3 pages, Galactus was back up and ready to fight again "Asgardians, you tire me" while Odin had to retort to calling destroyer to keep fighting.

Why is it so hard for people to understand this fight? Of course Odin didnt continue fighting, his soul wasnt in his body anymore! If he had kept his soul in his body he could have stood up right away as he was still concsious unlike Galactus who was KOed.

And the only reason Odin seemed so worn out was because prior to his blast and headbutt Odin and Galactus had engaged in a long mental battle that was visibly taxing them.

So no, Thanos blast that did nothing to Galactus is in no way shape or form comparable to Odin stalemating Galactus in TP and then knocking him out cold.

Physical strength feats of Odin to put him above that version of Thor? Remember Thanos fought him on a pure physical basis. And B&T Thor was stated to be a threat to entire asgard and was stated to become a universal threat with enough time. Hell, if we take self-statements into account, Thor stated he was going to defeat Odin and destroy asgard. Silver Surfer stated that a planet-buster tapping into the power gem can destroy a galaxy.

Actually you already provided the feat proving Odin is superior to B&T Thor (and by extension Thanos) in strength without even realizing it:

No Caption Provided

That was the same block of pure force/energy that Thor was helpless to break out of, yet Odin breaks it with the utmost of ease.

There is also the feat of restraining the skymother Zelia, as well as grappling with Surtur who even without the twilight sword can bust galaxies with a single strike, but the above feat is all that is needed to prove my point.

A few drops on blood mean something? Beast drew blood from WWHulk. Thing drew blood from WWhulk. Blood isn't always a damage indicator especially when its a few drops of nosebleed.

Yes, blood is a damage indicator, that is exactly what blood is used for. It was abundantly clear in B&T that Thanos and Thor were evenly matched physically and as shown above Odin is magnitudes above even Warrior madness power gem Thor physically.

There's nothing to proof that Thanos couldn't have beaten him on his own, he got bored and was just testing his tech, which he integrated into himself later.

Except for the fact they were evenly matched the entire fight. Once again, you are letting your bias for Thanos cloud your perception of a fight.

The scan says Odin has fallen.

Odin was weakened at this time:

No Caption Provided

Now before you go saying "all that means is he wasnt using his powers effectively", let me correct your thinking. How one thinks, the mental state of an Odinforce user makes a huge difference in all things especially durability. For example here are two versions of Odinforce Thor going up against the Destroyer's disintegration beam:

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The first scan is the less experienced straczinski version of OF Thor. He is hit by the destroyer's beam (powered by the life-force of Balder) and survives, though he is hurt, cries out in pain and would likely have died if he hadnt flown out of its path. The second scan is of Jurgens King Thor after having wielded the Odinforce for over a hundred years. King Thor no sells the destroyer powered by Desak who wields skyfather level powers from the designate as well as the souls of countless pantheons.

So as you can see, mind-set matters. In the feat i showed Odin had the mind-set of a mere mortal, yet he was still able to fight against Seth, tanking attacks that destroyed galaxies and even survive an attack that shook the universe! Odin with his normal godly mind-set and centuries of experience is even more durable.

Counters to Counters 2.1

*See the debunking misinfo section for my counters to your views on the nine-realms*

The scan only shows Odin repairing some cracks in buildings, stopping some earthquakes and caling floods. It doesn't look multi-galactic. Hell, it doesn't even look multi-solar. He doesn't even restore any suns and planets.

Also, no suns and planets were destroyed. All Odin did was repair some natural disasters in several planets, a lot of planets.

As explained in an earlier portion of my post, the battle between Odin and Infinity was indeed destroying entire galaxies as well as damaging worlds throughout the universe. So when Odin says:

No Caption Provided

He is indeed fixing the damage on every land and world, that means all the galaxies that were destroyed as well as the planets that were just damaged on the outer ring of the conflict.

Scans of Surtur busting a galaxy under his own power?

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3

While creating the Twilight sword Surtur destroys the korbonite galaxy in a single mighty swing. And before you go saying "it was just the core, so not impressive":

No Caption Provided

^That is what the core of a galaxy is made of, so it is definitely a galaxy busting feat.

And Odin imprisons a defeated Surtur, for which he had to lose all odin force.

Odin did not lose any Odinforce when he absorbed Surtur, what are you on about?

A misrepresntation of the scan. Odin's just giving planet earth its rotation, and that's planetary not universal. And it says cosmos, which may simply mean space.

Giving the earth its rotation by manipulating all the EM Particles in the cosmos and no, cosmos does not simply mean space:

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It means the whole universe. Way to try and downplay -_-

A centrifugal force of this level imprisons Surtur. It suddenly makes the last scan look unimpressive. Also, the heat of the earth's core is stated to be Surtur's heat. Suddenly makes Surtur below planetary.

So. Much. Lowballing.

There are inconcistencies in comics, especially the really old ones, that does not invalidate a feat or make characters consistently portrayed as galaxy/universal level any less than they are.

Obviously recreating a planet. Asgard is planetary just like all other realms including jotunheim etc, and even midgard.

As explained before, Asgard is not just a planet. Even if you are talking about the floating continent of Asgard it is still not a planet as it is a flat landmass! What Odin was doing in those scans was recreating all the planets, stars, ect in asgard space.

Then why was Odin fighting for the possession of scepter like his life depended on it? Why doesn't he let it go like the scans that your provided later on?

Or maybe that Loki scans had some context?

Odin and Forsung wouldnt let go of the scepter because that was the challenge, whoever let go first would lose!

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The scepter, as confirmed in the scans i provided in earlier posts as well as the scan above, is nothing but an ornate stick without Odin to channel his power through it. Like gungnir the scepter, known as Thrudstok, is simply used to channel the odinforce, it has no power of its own. Thus, the feat is valid.

Agreed that theenergy released was powerful, but it is not creating a galaxy-wide explosion. They are flying around the galaxy destroying planets and impressing stars with their heat. Especially since we see that the blast area is barely bigger than Odin and Enchanter's bodies.

You conveniently left out this little gem:

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Odin and Forsung were unleashing so much power that it created new suns! Suns as in plural. That is at the very least multi-solar system level and at the most galaxy+ level.

Anyways, I am not going to lowball this, this is a respectable feat. Possibly the best one so far. The only problem is that it is specifically stated that it comes out to be from the scepter and Odin was fighting with his life on the line for it.

Odin and Forsung were holding onto the scepter because that was the contest, they would fight, channeling their power through the scepter to harm each other, unleashing enough energy to create suns, and whoever let go first would lose.

This is why i get so peeved when debating Odin. People lowball or try to invalidate feats over and over again without knowing the context. Please apex, in your final post, drop the lowballing and focus on your own character.

So if a nearly powerless Odin can restrain someone twice as poewrful as Odin himself, then Thanos sure as hell can restrain Odin (in this thread) who is only once as powerful as himself.

I dont know what kind of logic that is, the feat (along with others shown earlier and will be shown later) proves Odin is stronger than Thanos by a large margin.

I have no counter for that, except the fact that Odin doesn't use TP in combat situations. And Thanos's mind is extremely twisted and well-guarded from TP attacks as even when someone has been able to enter his mind, they have not been able to survive there (Shaman Nate Grey and Spectrum to name a few).

I will be dealing with Odin's willingness to use TP, time manip, ect, in my final argument so i wont adress this here. What i will address is that you think Thanos mind could somehow resist Odin. That is totally untrue. Thanos may be a powerful telepath but he is nothing compared to nigh-omniscient beings like Galactus, who have shown capable of easily overpowering him on the astral plane and could kill him if he didnt flee:

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Odin's mind is the equal of Galactus. If Odin attacks him mentally there is no way Thanos can win.

Counters to Counters 2.2

*see the Odin's feats are impressive section for my counters to your claims about Odin's fights with infinity and Seth*

That attack couldn't even knock thor down to his knees. Odin no-selling it is not impressive when dealing with Thanos the mad titan.

Ok, ive had it, this lowballing has gone on long enough. Thor tanks attacks he shouldnt be able to all the time, so do guys like superman, hulk, ect. That does not invalidate the feats of more powerful characters.

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Thor and other avengers were able to tank attacks from Thanos, so i guess Thanos is a weakling amiright? Wrong, but this is the same kind of reasoning you have been using throughout your second post and i am fed up with it.

Odin no-selling an Odinforce empowered annihilus is a very impressive feat, definitely enough to prove he can withstand attacks from Thanos IMO. Odin has far better durability feats that i have and will show, so i wont continue wasting time on this particular feat, but i had to show how much you were reaching with your lowball.

Ok... now that the lowballing is over...

The same seth getting hurt by a little Rock smashed into him? Okay

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Man... there are no words.

Seth had stolen the power of the entire egyptian pantheon, he was extinguishing stars, shattering galaxies and tearing at the fabric of the multiverse in his fight with Odin and you are trying to lowball him? I literally cant even at this point...

Also, this attack KO'd Odin, and a knockout counts as defeat.

As explained earlier, Odin was far weaker than normal. Peak Odin has tanked a universe shaking attack against Surtur and has several other feats i will show later that are even better and more quantifiable.

Correction : Odin was fallen by Surtur while Thor survived the same attacks. Read your own scan dude.

Correction: Odin had just been knocked down, he was up again on the very same page (bottom panel), that is the definition of tanking.

Also, back on Surtur,

  • Thor was able to hold surtur on bay in the exact same scan
  • He was imprisoned by rotation of earth
  • His flames are equivalent to heat of core of earth

Firstly, Thor (like all top tier heroes) has his high showings, they do not invalidate the feats of characters who are actually galaxy/universal level.

Secondly, once again, thats a low end feat. I showed you Surtur busting a galaxy in a single strike, stop the inane lowballing.

Thirdly, Surtur's fire can burn universes and even a small portion summoned by BRB can burn for millennia in the vacuum of space (1,2). It is far hotter than the core of the earth, it is supernatural flame beyond mortal comprehension, you know this, stop lowballing.

Why is this scan even impressive at all?

"Why is Thanos so impressive, he got staggered by Thor and said he was afraid of hulk" XD

This lowballing does not deserve a serious answer.

And again, realms are planetary at best, as I pointed out above. Therefore it is equivalent to shaking 9 planets

Proven false already.

Unless you are trying to imply that Surtur's blows are multiversal.

Shaking a universe =/= destroying a universe, but at this time Surtur was amped by both the twilight sword and proximity to the eternal flames (which as shown during everything burns, amped him to the level where he could burn the multiverse) so universal+ power is reasonable.

The above counters are mostly all in regards to your claims regarding Odin and the asgardian mythos, which i have refuted to no end. As for your arguments regarding Thanos, the character you are supposed to argue, you have swayed me on some points and other than a couple insignificant instances i cannot find much wrong with your scans or context, thus now we move on to my final argument where i shall see if what you have shown is enough... or if Thanos still gets stomped.

Final Arguments

Firstly, before i get into Odin's feats vs Thanos feats, there is a story from Jurgens run (my favorite Thor run) that is very relevant to this debate and goes to show the big difference between a skyfather like Odin and a teambuster like Thanos.

In Thor vol. 2 issues 22-25 Thor and his comrades fight a Thanosi, who at the time of the writing was meant to be the one true Thanos and only got retconned later. Now before you go claiming "this thanosi is featless so its not relevant" curb thy tongue!

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  • 1,2: Oneshot kills Thor.
  • 3: The Mangog is afraid of him.
  • 4: No sells an anti-force blast (anti-force has caused mangog to scream in pain, harmed an enchanter who fought odin with help from two others and is said to b capable of tearing a planet apart 1,2,3)
  • 5,6,7: No-sells his own energy fired back at him increased 100 fold and then tanks another anti-force blast.

So not only was this Thanosi originally written as the real Thanos (which means the author intended him to be just as powerful) but this Thanosi also has feats to prove he is the equal of Thanos. On top of all that the Thanosi actually amped itself drastically using old Asgardian relics!

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So this is basically a massively amped version of Thanos with power to wipe out all life. What does it take to beat him you ask? Why, a fraction of the Odinforce of course!

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Odin at this time was poisoned and extremely weakened by his prior torture at the hands of the dark gods, so much so that he couldnt enter the battle and his Odinforce was seriously depleted (1,2), however he saved up some of his power and imbued it into an armor for Thor to go and fight the amped Thanosi. I am pretty positive everyone knows the outcome:

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Thor, with a small portion of the odinforce, won in a stomp.

Now im not one of those people who judges a fight based off one instance, but the above example along with their feats shows that Odin is simply on another level compared to Thanos. The power of the odinforce dwarfs anything Thanos can hope to muster, Odin is a divine skyfather while thanos is an alien teambuster. Now with that shown we can delve more into the feats, that solidify and prove without a shadow of a doubt that Odin is superior.

Odin's Power vs Thanos' Durability

Yes, thanos would have eventually been put down by those blasts, but remember those blasts one-shotted a fed Galactus and killed all celestials of 616 universe. If it takes like 6-7 blasts to knock out Thanos, then it's not a bad showing at all, infact very very impressive

There is no proof the blast oneshot any of them, none. A hole in galactus means nothing, it could have taken multiple blasts to make that hole, it could have blasted through but not killed him, ect. The feat does show, along with your other feats, that Thanos can withstand some attacks from a bloodlusted Odin, however even a young and inexperienced version of Odin was capable of harming Celestials:

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So yes, you have convinced me Thanos has the durability to survive for a while, however with the feats i have shown and am about to show it is abundantly clear that in the end Odin's raw power will be enough to defeat and kill the mad titan.

Thanos's DEAD BODY tanks a Galaxy buster point blank, with a fist sized hole in his chest

Omega, TWICE as powerful as Galactus (stated on Panel by Thanos himself), fed on THREE (shown on panel) PLANETS

And Thanos survives a blast from Enraged Omega.

So Thanos tanked an attack which was capable of tearing spacetime into 23 lightyear wide hole (and much greater distortion), and 3 more screams.

Very well, you have indeed convinced me that Thanos has galaxy level durability now and can tank blasts from Odin... HOWEVER, the same can be said of all the enemies Odin has faced and yet he still defeated them, because in the end tanking some blasts does not equal tanking ALL attacks and the all-father's raw power is vast enough to outlast his opponents durability and kill them.

I have been saving the best feats for last, so lets look at them now. Also remember, these feats were accomplished after his previous fight with Thanos, so as i said before Odin has indeed gotten better since then, or at least has gained better feats.

Odin vs Uthana-Thoth

Uthana-Thoth was the skyfather of the world-eaters, the pantheon of Ano-Athox. The world-eaters found, pillaged and eventually destroyed entire universes, siphoning the energies that kept them alive. As the skyfather of a pantheon that destroys universes Uthana-Thoth, unsurprisingly, is universal in power:

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Thoth kept an entire infinite universe from collapsing out of existence by sheer force of will and when he left the universe only died because he allowed it. This proves Uthana-Thoth is indeed a universe level being and as im sure you must remember:

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The number 1 rule when skyfathers fight, what may look like a simple slugfest to us is actually a battle of epic cosmic proportions. More proof of this is when Odin held onto the scepter with one hand through shear strength alone, despite being struck non-stop by power enough to birth numerous new suns.

So to summarize, Uthana-Thoth is a legit universe level being. How does Odin fair against him you ask? Well...

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Odin easily overpowers and is going to kill him, until Phanto and Thela intervene (dont lowball, thela and phanto are the other two most powerful beings in the world eater pantheon). Odin easily overpowered a universe level skyfather with no problem, and Odin at this point wasnt even at his peak, he had just returned to the land of the living and had been expending his power for years (in real world time) fighting Surtur every day so he couldnt get out of limbo.

This feat alone shows just how superior Odin is to Thanos but lets move on to the last perhaps most impressive feat...

Odin vs Majeston Zelia

First a brief history lesson, Zelia is the skymother of the dark gods of narcisson, the literal dark mirror image of asgard. In ancient times Asgard fought Narcisson and the dark gods won for a time, though in a last ditch effort Asgard defeated them and in modern times Zelia and her dark gods actually conquered Asgard, imprisoning Odin:

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Suffice to say Zelia is basically Odin's dark gender-bent counterpart and is roughly his equal in power, as her pantheon is the equal of Asgard. So, what happens when Odin (after much torture) reclaims his Odinforce from her and faces her one final time...?

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Odin in a single blast as big as Asgard oneshots Zelia and her entire pantheon, turning them to dust and dispersing them throughout space. That's right, Odin literally oneshot an entire pantheon with its skymother, this is the kind of fire-power a bloodlusted morals-off Odin will be using.

So unless you seriously want to claim Thanos is superior to an entire pantheon of gods and a skymother, or that he is superior to a skyfather who can keep alive and destroy universes, then Thanos is going to have a rough go of it and likely get oneshot when Odin unleashes his absolute full power.

Odin's Durability vs Thanos' Power

Thanos fights Tyrant toe to toe, even pummelling him before Tyrant gets extremely angry.

First thing i have to point out about this fight, yes Thanos was able to budge Tyrant with some blasts and punches, but the only time he ever makes Tyrant scream out in pain and the only time he is ever seemingly overpowering tyrant is when Thanos has the orb and is using it to attack.

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Yes, i know wiki's can be untrustworthy, but reading the marvel wiki it says that the orb Thanos was using was full of vast cosmic energies, which would explain why he was able to harm Tyrant with it but without it he was at best a nuisance.

Secondly, and this goes with my point above, just like in the infamous scan of Thanos blasting Galactus, the titan was nothing more than a nuisance in this fight. Thanos never actually had a chance of beating Tyrant, he simply had adequate power to be a nuisance and durability to survive long enough to steal the orb and escape.

This fight is once again a great showing for Thanos durability, however it in no way shows he can do any significant harm to Odin. Just as in their first fight, all Thanos can do is bug Odin, not actually hurt him.

With a mild distraction in form of skeet, Thanos easily matches a cosmic cube level being and eventually defeats her by TP

As should be obvious, not all cube beings are equal. There are several ways i could lowball Kosmos from the scans you provided (getting hurt by skeet, getting hurt by a pipe explosion, ect), but i'll just stick to pointing out the context stated directly in the comic:

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Quite clearly this mortal form made Kosmos weaker than other cube beings. If she could be matched by Thanos and TPed to sleep then there is no way she is even close to as powerful as the cubes who are stronger than galactus, for the simple fact galactus himself dwarfs Thanos in raw power and mental power.

So, please provide feats for Kosmos in this form instead of trying to scale her to beings that both you and i know dwarf her in power.

Another thing i should bring up is that Thanos does nothing here to suggest he is actually as powerful as Kosmos, he simply proves he is durable enough to tank her attacks. In response to this you would likely bring up how Kosmos said "you hurt me", however as we can plainly see Thanos mere presence was hurting her mentally (scan) so this does not prove he caused her any real harm with his energy projection.

Thanos fights Phoenix Force Thane equally, planets blown up, moons thrown like balls.

I don't think I need to show feats of Phoenix Force

I may not know as much about Thanos as you do, but i know a bit about the Phoenix Force. The context here is that Thane does not have the full power of the phoenix force, he has a fraction of it. In modern marvel several characters wield pieces of the Phoenix, for example Quentin Quire also has a piece of the Phoenix inside himself:

mighty thor 19
mighty thor 19

I think there is another person wielding the Phoenix force somewhere else as well, but i could be wrong. The point is the Thane that Thanos fought is not abstract or even skyfather level, he is more akin to the power the Phoenix 5 wielded during AvX, AKA Thane is high teambuster level.

So once again, this feat does not prove Thanos can do anything but annoy Odin with his attacks and i think that deep down you agree. Thanos is not portrayed as a galaxy buster, he just isnt. Thanos is consistently shown as a teambuster level threat who fights teams of heroes, powerful heroes to be sure but that is still the level of competition Thanos operates on, whereas Odin for the most part only fights gods, monsters, and even abstracts that destroy galaxies and threaten existence. Yes, i know Thanos has fought powerful beings, but as shown in your own examples he is only able to fight because of his intellect and monstrous durability, he doesnt engage them equally in fire-power.

Now then, this is my final argument not miscellaneous counters, so lets move on and show off some more feats from the all-father, as well as the difference between tanking attacks and true durability.

THE ALL-FATHER'S DURABILITY

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In Thor vol. 2 issue 18 Odin battles the enchanters once again. Earlier in the debate i showed Odin's fight with the enchanter Forsung and as you well remember, Forsung was so powerful he was able to match Odin and the power of their conflict spawned numerous new suns. In this fight Odin faces Forsung's brethren and is able to fight them all at once, tanking their combined power; however what happens next is even more impressive. The enchanters, who are already pushing skyfather level without amps, actually absorb some of the odinforce and turn into energy beings to attack Odin! The enchanters are now 3 skyfather level energy beings and yet Odin is still able to withstand their assault! But it gets better still:

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Odin was actually weakened when fighting the enchanters! A weakened Odin was able to tank attacks and withstand an assault from 3 massively amped skyfather level beings. This feat alone, once again, shows there is no way in Hel Thanos can do any real harm to Odin.

The above feat as well as the others listed in previous posts is enough to prove my position, but there is one more feat i would like to showcase. This feat proves there is a difference between tanking a couple attacks and true, unequaled durability:

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This is the motherstorm, a sentient godstorm the size of a galaxy that can shake black holes, destroy planets and wipe out supernova's. It existed since the dawn of time and would destroy those it deemed worthy of judgement. One day it sought to judge Asgard, but the all-father had other plans in mind:

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Odin fought the god-tempest and defeated it, imprisoning it inside a chunk of uru. Now defeating a skyfather level being is impressive in its own right, but the context of this fight is what makes it truly impressive.

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Odin didnt just fight for a couple panels and tank a few attacks, Odin fought inside the motherstorm for DAYS on end. At the very, very least this fight lasted for 48 hours straight, meaning Odin was being struck by attacks of supernova and even galaxy level force for days on end with no time for rest. That is what i call real durability.

I guess these showings prove Thanos is fully capable of hurting and harming Odin

No, not by any stretch of the imagination. Thanos cannot hope to match the power required to significantly harm Odin, let alone defeat him.

Show me Thanos by his own power unleashing galaxy level force non-stop for days on end, do that and i will concede the entire debate. Of course, you cant, the mad titan simply isnt in the same ballpark as beings like Surtur, amped Seth, amped Enchanters and the motherstorm, which is the kind of power required to stand a fighting chance against Odin.

The Magicks of the All-Wise

Now i have saved most of Odin's esoteric abilities for this my final post. As you know, by the rules of this cav our characters are bloodlusted and may win by any means necessary, so while i have shown that Odin would demolish Thanos in an honorable fight of raw power i would be remiss if i did not show the many underhanded ways Odin can defeat the mad titan.

Now of course in an earlier post you raised concern about Odin's willingness to use such tactics as TP:

I have no counter for that, except the fact that Odin doesn't use TP in combat situations.

Anyways, since Odin mostly doesnt use TP in combat,

You would be right about this, if this fight was in-character or even just bloodlusted, unfortunately for you in this fight Odin is also morals off which means he not only wants to kill you but he has no honor or warrior code holding him back. This version of Odin, if necessary, has the option to kill you any number of cruel ways.

Time-Stop

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Even a far less experienced King Thor was able to stop time and Odin himself has stopped time on the entire planet earth. If necessary Odin can use time-stop and kill Thanos wile he is helpless.

BFR

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Unlike the other esoteric abilities i have and will mention, Odin uses BFR quite a bit. If Thanos is giving him trouble (which he wont) Odin can simply teleport him into whatever deadly realm he wishes, then seal him inside it like he did to the 10th realm.

Telepathy

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Just in case you didnt understand the significance of Odin's mental battle with Galactus, Odin actually got in his mind and started unearthing memories, he was mind-r*ping an abstract! As ive shown and you already admitted last post, if Odin decides to use TP its lights out for Thanos.

Absorption

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If Odin wishes he can simply absorb Thanos just like he did to Surtur and Infinity, both of which are more powerful than Thanos.

Energy Manipulation

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Odin not only manipulated the universe burning (and eventually multiverse burning if left unchecked) power of the eternal flame, he actually NULLIFIED the energy, something impossible by science (it says frigga helped, but Odin is far more powerful so he did most of the work). Odin manipulated and nullified universal energy, whats to stop him from manipulating all the energy attacks Thanos throws at him, or even nullifying the energy Thanos uses to make himself so powerful? Nothing, thats what. Thanos would be helpless.

Once again i would just like to chuckle at this statement.

On the other hand, Thanos will be more effective in being able to draw upon cosmic energies when the fight takes place in a neutral grounds from the cosmos itself.

*Chuckles*

Final Summary

Odin may be perhaps more powerful but Thanos is definitely in the same realm of power. Odin himself said their power reserves are similar.

There is no question who is more powerful, none. Show me Thanos oneshotting a skymother and her entire pantheon, or overpowering a universal skyfather with ease, or busting galaxies on several occasions, ect. Odin is simply a league above Thanos.

Odin's best feats are kinda questionable, and most instances have been debunked.

Totally refuted. Kindly stick to debating the character you know.

Thanos's durability on the other hand, exceeds Odin as well as is more than enough to tank his attacks. He has even done it in the past.

You proved Thanos can indeed withstand attacks from Odin, you did change my mind and i congratulate you. However, i highly doubt that when Odin starts unleashing his full power Thanos can survive very long, unless you want to claim Thanos > entire pantheon.

Thanos has greater raw physicals

Not. Even. Close. Not only did Odin break out of the same thing that kept B&T Thor (equal to Thanos physically) immobile with absolute ease, Odin's one arm is strong enough to overpower forces that spawn stars, he overpowered a universe level skyfather, matched Surtur who busted a galaxy in one swing of his arms, ect (1,2,3,4). Odin is vastly superior physically.

Thanos's raw power is enough to harm Odin when he is trying hard enough

Nay, at best Thanos will inconvenience him for a time. The feats i have shown prove Odin is too durable for Thanos to cause him any significant harm, let alone defeat him.

Most of Odin's showings have been debunked. His best showings shown so far are multi-star level / multi-solar level or higher.

Your debunks have been refuted. As i said before, please kindly debate for your own character instead of lowballing mine. If everyone followed that advice a lot less time would be wasted and there would be a lot less ignorant arguments.

Thanos can handle Odin's reality warping

Well, i need more feats to be shown before i accept it would have no effect on him, but i do agree he would be very resistant to it.

Odin rarely uses his versatility

Good thing he is bloodlusted and morals off ;D

Thanos eventually outlasts Odin and wins this fight

Hilarious and totally wrong. Odin outclasses Thanos in every possible way, especially durability. Thanos has no feat remotely approaching Odin's many day long fight with the motherstorm, not to mention the numerous and consistent feats where Odin fights and tanks attacks from galaxy/universal beings, sometimes even multiple of them at once.

Odin wins because:

  • Odin is stronger: Thanos has no feat remotely approaching Odin's one armed feat against forsung, not to mention grappling with Surtur and Uthana-Thoth, or casually breaking out of the block of pure force.
  • Odin is more powerful: Thanos has never come close to busting a galaxy, let alone busting multiple galaxies on several occasions and oneshotting an entire pantheon of gods including their skymother.
  • Odin is more durable: Thanos has no feats even close to the motherstorm feat. Thanos can tank plenty of attacks, but there is no way he can last a day, let alone several days of constant attacks from skyfather level beings.
  • Odin is more Hax: Telepathy, time-stop, absorption, energy manipulation, BFR, ect, all give Odin a major leg up over Thanos.

In the end Odin is just in another league compared to Thanos. Sure the mad titan got stronger since their last encounter, but the difference in power was already so big that even after getting upgraded this fight is still a stomp in Odin's favor. The big difference in this fight is not Thanos upgrades, it is the fact Odin is bloodlusted and morals off.

The logic is simple!

  • Thanos cant kill Odin.
  • Odin can kill Thanos.

The all-father is supreme. Thanos will likely survive for a bit because of his durability, but he simply doesnt pack the power or hax to harm Odin, whereas Odin wields the raw power and hax to end this fight instantly if he so chooses.

The balls in your park! Im looking forward to your post, hopefully it is full of awesome feats and arguments for Thanos and not lowballing of Odin, id hate for this almost year long debate to end on a sour note.

For Odin and for Asgard!
For Odin and for Asgard!

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#161 Edited by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony: Wow that was fast. Were you working on it at the speed of light?

you have resorted to lowballing a character which you clearly do not know nearly as much about. I would have preffered if we both simply argued for OUR characters and not tried to act as if we are experts on our opponents, but since you have it is my pleasure to debunk your misguided reasoning

No, I just countered your arguments. I still do not believe that realms are universes.

If I was lowballing, I would have used jane, alien bugs and all such low-showings of Odin, yet I did not do that. I just countered the showings you posted, from the scans of the comic they came from.

hate for this almost year long debate to end on a sour note

I will just need to work harder than you because I'm facing a more powerful opponent.

I hope you don't become my enemy just because of this ONE debate. Yet, I promise you my third post is going to be far more brutal, be prepared.

Also, I think that we both should do a summary after the third post, so that you get a chance to address my scans from third post.

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#162 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador:

Wow that was fast. Were you working on it at the speed of light?

XD! I dont know, i usually think it will take me a long time and then "bam", the post is finished.

I still do not believe that realms are universes.

I dont know how thats possible, but ok. I also found some other statements of them being universes from jurgens run.

If I was lowballing, I would have used jane, alien bugs and all such low-showings of Odin, yet I did not do that. I just countered the showings you posted, from the scans of the comic they came from.

"Seth got hurt by a rock, Surtur is only as hot as the earths core, ect".

You lowballed a great deal, just because you didnt stoop to the lowest level possible doesnt mean you didnt lowball.

I will just need to work harder than you because I'm facing a more powerful opponent.

Indeed. Show me why THANOS wins, dont lowball my character.

I hope you don't become my enemy just because of this ONE debate.

No worries man, though i might be really peeved, lol.

Yet, I promise you my third post is going to be far more brutal, be prepared.

Also, I think that we both should do a summary after the third post, so that you get a chance to address my scans from third post.

If you are going to be posting new scans (which i assume you are since this is your last post) then perhaps we should extend the cav to 4 posts and a final summary post. You have more info to show and i do as well, we have had no problem letting this cav go on for this long so i see no need to rush its ending if we can make even better and more informative arguments.

Your choice.

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#163 Edited by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony:

Surtur is only as hot as the earths core

But that's what is stated in the scan you yourself posted.

Also, that seth and a rock thing was a joke. Odin used the same attack on Thanos and he had to blast those rocks away.

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#164 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador:

But that's what is stated in the scan you yourself posted.

You knew you were lowballing and did it anyways, which cheapens your argument.

Also, that seth and a rock thing was a joke. Odin used the same attack on Thanos and he had to blast those rocks away.

I couldnt tell as you had lowballed so much before that.

Anyways, what about this?

If you are going to be posting new scans (which i assume you are since this is your last post) then perhaps we should extend the cav to 4 posts and a final summary post. You have more info to show and i do as well, we have had no problem letting this cav go on for this long so i see no need to rush its ending if we can make even better and more informative arguments.

Your choice.

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#165 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony:

You knew you were lowballing and did it anyways, which cheapens your argument

No, I just quoted what was written on scan.

Anyways, what about this?

If you are going to be posting new scans (which i assume you are since this is your last post) then perhaps we should extend the cav to 4 posts and a final summary post. You have more info to show and i do as well, we have had no problem letting this cav go on for this long so i see no need to rush its ending if we can make even better and more informative arguments.

Your choice

I think 4 post + a summary might be too long. Do you still have more feats to show? You can edit your current post, I'll wait anyways. I have Thanos vs Jiren and Cap vs Black Widow also going on, in addition to PYP high tier tourney of emperorthanos.

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#166 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador:

No, I just quoted what was written on scan.

And i could just quote thanos saying he is afraid with hulk, doesnt change the fact it is lowballing.

I think 4 post + a summary might be too long. Do you still have more feats to show? You can edit your current post, I'll wait anyways. I have Thanos vs Jiren and Cap vs Black Widow also going on, in addition to PYP high tier tourney of emperorthanos.

I have another statement for the realms being universes and i could also try to fit in the feat Odin got during Legacy #1, but mostly i was thinking a 4th post would be needed because you are (i presume) going to be introducing new feats and usually in a summary post i wouldnt be able to address those with new scans of my own.

Anyway, its your choice. If you think its fine for me to add a wee bit to my post (i rushed a bit because of school) and then in the summary for me to be able to counter any new info your provide, then sure, im fine with that.

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#167 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador:

And i could just quote thanos saying he is afraid with hulk, doesnt change the fact it is lowballing.

You can't, because he never said it :D

He did say that he avoided fighting Hulk, and that was before his massive Thanos Quest upgrade by mistress death, when he was barely above a herald, like KC Superman tier or slightly weaker than Magus

And Thanos has avoided fights in past against fodder tier characters. It is in character.

I have another statement for the realms being universes and i could also try to fit in the feat Odin got during Legacy #1, but mostly i was thinking a 4th post would be needed because you are (i presume) going to be introducing new feats and usually in a summary post i wouldnt be able to address those with new scans of my own.

Maybe we can do one post on realms being universes or not,. I think that if we reach to a proper conclusion on that one, this is CaV is pretty much decided.

But again, perhaps it will be better if we don't do it because we will never be able to get to a conclusion.

I will only post 4-5 new feats at max, I pretty much went all out here. So far I only have 3 in mind.

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#168 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador: I think the proper thing would be for me to do a little more editing on this post, then you do your post, then we do summaries. In the summaries we can do a section on why we think the realms are/arent universe.

Does that seem fair?

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#169 Posted by All-Father (4912 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony: @apex_pretador: 4 posts each? That will make near impossible to vote given the fact that both of you presented extremely solid arguments.

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#170 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony: @apex_pretador: 4 posts each? That will make near impossible to vote given the fact that both of you presented extremely solid arguments.

Well, 3 posts and a summary each

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#171 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@all-father: Well, 3 posts and a summary, but yes, we are spoiling you with quality arguments ;D

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#172 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio
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#173 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@apex_pretador:

I beat you by one second

NOOOO! I have been defeated! XD

So...

I think the proper thing would be for me to do a little more editing on this post, then you do your post, then we do summaries. In the summaries we can do a section on why we think the realms are/arent universe.

No Caption Provided

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#174 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony: You edit your post. After I post my 3rd post, we will see if we should include this section in summary or not.

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#175 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio
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#176 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio
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#177 Edited by Sylux (3 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony: What is a CaV? A debate against two people? What does "t4v" mean?

I had fun reading this btw. Both of you guys did good.

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#178 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@sylux: CAV means challenge a viner. Its when two people debate (usually for 3 or 4 posts) then other users vote.

T4V means tag for vote.

I had fun reading this btw. Both of you guys did good.

Glad you enjoyed, hope it was informative :D

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#179 Posted by Sylux (3 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgardianbrony: Thank you!

How do you do that quote thing? When I hit quote it comes out trying to quote your entire post.

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#180 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio

@sylux:

How do you do that quote thing? When I hit quote it comes out trying to quote your entire post.

Copy/paste whatever section you want to quote into your comment, then highlight it, then click the quote button in the toolbar above your comment.

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#181 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio
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#182 Posted by Watcher5000 (7516 posts) - - Show Bio

tag

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#183 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio
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#184 Posted by ASGARDIANBRONY (10407 posts) - - Show Bio
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#185 Posted by APEX_pretador (14461 posts) - - Show Bio