CaV Serrure vs Thedailybagel VOTING

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serrure

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#1  Edited By serrure

Gladiator, Majestor of the Shi'ar empire, has to come to Earth seeking old Geezer Steve Rogers. Hulk mistaking this for an attack intercepts him and before Kallark could explain Hulk attacks. It's ON!

No Caption Provided

Serrure- Gladiator

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vs

Thedailybagel- Hulk

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Morals On

Win by KO/Incap/Death

Current Versions

Start 100 meters apart

No Caption Provided

battle begin

Rules

No ignorant comments among the likes of "____ Should win" or "This should be a stomp" wait for the end

Plz keep de-railing to a funny minimum

let me know if you want to be tagged

dont make me call a mod

(im in class so these are to the point)

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serrure

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BlueBeetle1

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lol can we just vote already? ok, ok, I'll wait. should be an up hill battle for hulk, but good luck to the both of you.

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Lvenger

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Excellent, thanks for tagging me. Is this current versions of both characters?

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chaos911

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Kingant27

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#6  Edited By Kingant27

Tag me for voting please.

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Thedailybagel

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Thedailybagel

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#8  Edited By Thedailybagel

@kingant27: will do!

@serrure do you want to do the opener?

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serrure

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@thedailybagel: sure

@lvenger said:

Excellent, thanks for tagging me. Is this current versions of both characters?

yes

lol can we just vote already? ok, ok, I'll wait. should be an up hill battle for hulk, but good luck to the both of you.

please leave.

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Apocalypse3

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Thedailybagel

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Thedailybagel

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BlueBeetle1

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Thedailybagel

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BlueBeetle1

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serrure

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#16  Edited By serrure

Gladiator

Majestor of the Shi'ar empire. and he got the title by being the baddest, most dangerous man they have. (and hes a natural leader but shoosh!)

he was made leader of the Shi'ar Imperial Guard because he was willing to follow orders even if it involved killing the innocent (sadly he's kind of broken off of that but still)

No Caption Provided

as you can see here. his powergrid is pretty spot on. he is a Stronian and that makes him near impossible to kill. Ronan confirms this

No Caption Provided

I like to to keep my openers short. saves good debating material later on.

Strength

there are maybe a handful of people who can hope to match Hulk in pure physicals. i deem Gladiator one of them. Hulk will eventually surpass him (as he will almost anyone) but Gladiator can go toe to toe with Hulk.

nice lifting feat. quantifiable but obviously allot

<img src=
<img src="http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_super/11113/111133231/4094886-gladiator+17.jpg">

he destroys a planet in 3 strikes. in terms of Striking feats he dwarfs people like Superman and Wonder Man.

Durability

another thing that Gladiator is rather amazing in. his Stronian heritage makes him extremely difficult to hurt (relatively, i mean if Hulk hits him he'll feel it no doubt)

<img src=
<img src="http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_super/11113/111133231/4094891-gladiator+12.jpg">

he chills in a star for fun

Speed

he fights Hyperion in nano-seconds.

he has feats of Bull-rushing and speed blitzing

Bull Rush

&lt;img src=
&lt;img src="http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_super/11113/111133231/4094908-gladiator+65.png"&gt;

he hurls himself at near-lightspeed against Ego

Speed Blitz

see what he does to Thor here

Energy Projection

hes matched several people with his Heat. Tyrant and Cyclops to mention

and he uses it often

This is Gladiator

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serrure

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Just a reminder these are the rules

No ignorant comments among the likes of "____ Should win" or "This should be a stomp" wait for the end

Plz keep de-railing to a funny minimum

let me know if you want to be tagged

dont make me call a mod

plz everyone follow them or ill be forced to use the last one (and they are busy people)

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BlueBeetle1

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Kingant27

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#19  Edited By Kingant27
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Brucey_25

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Wanna tag me?

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Comicdude360

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@bluebeetle1: don't say that on cavs they're for the debate not the people fighting.

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BlueBeetle1

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@bluebeetle1: don't say that on cavs they're for the debate not the people fighting.

i know. i acknowledged that and said it should be an up hill battle for whoever is supporting hulk. and then i wished them both luck.

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serrure

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@comicdude360: its ok bro. i wouldnt have agreed to this fight if i didnt think it was fair. and actually im at a disadvantage i have to overcome Hulk already beating Gladiator

@brucey_25: absolutely my good man

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termiteone4ever

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Going on pretty well :)

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dondave

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#25  Edited By dondave

Some of out context scans

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juiceboks

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#26  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@dondave said:

Some of out context scans

lol already?

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serrure

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#27  Edited By serrure

@dondave said:

Some of out context scans

lol already?

my bet is hes talking about the Thor scans or the Juggernaut scan

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dondave

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@serrure Yeah, the Juggernaut scan is from the comic book adaptation of the X-Men cartoon. And Gladiator wasn't chilling in the star, as your scan shows the pain of being in the star was tremendous.

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serrure

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@dondave said:

@serrure Yeah, the Juggernaut scan is from the comic book adaptation of the X-Men cartoon. And Gladiator wasn't chilling in the star, as your scan shows the pain of being in the star was tremendous.

just a heads up next time I'd prefer if you PM'ed me (you can include my opponent and in fact id prefer you do that also). about the Jugg scan yes you are correct (and i was waiting to see if Bagel would get that or not) but the Star scan it does not bother him. the Tremendous pain does not cause him to leave.

but weve had a pretty good amount of interruptions in this thread, despite my clear and to the point rules, and i just want to keep this organized. this is supposed to be fun and me and @thedailybagel both agree this should be a good CaV and we'd just like to enjoy comparing 2 of the most powerful heroes marvel has to offer. (sure there are 50 others that are more powerful but still)

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Cregan_Stark

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Should be good. Tag for voting.

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Shot

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Great opener.

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Thedailybagel

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#32  Edited By Thedailybagel

@serrure

Sorry I took so long mate, I was kind of busy. Anyway, here it is:

Intro

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Yes, its the green scar in the picture. It looks cool so im using it.

Yes, the hulk. what can I say? the jade giant is still the big, green killing machine that we all know and love. except exponentially more powerful than he was 20 years ago. Hes strong, fast, and hard to kill. I dont know what else to say but lets get right into it.

  • Hulk draws blood and has an extended fight with hyperion, all whilst not being very angry (he was being mind controlled). The same hyperion who survived the collision of two earths. This feat alone should suffice that he can damage gladiator.

Before I go any further id like to bring gladiators and hulks previous encounter into the fray and how it will benefit hulk for two reasons. The first is fairly obvious, whilst the fight was under very dodgy circumstances (im not using this to say that hulk will beat the kallark by the way), hulk still won. Having to fight hulk again will at the very least lightly dampen gladiators confidence meaning he will perform below his optimum level. The second is an even bigger advantage...

Take a look at this scan:

No Caption Provided

As you can see glads is tearing through hulk with his heat vision and would have killed him if hulk didn't grab him. Whilst im no expert on kallark I know that he has a decent tactical mind, strangely enough that will be his downfall... In this instance Hulk was weakened, greatly. Ill cite acidskulls and ghostravages context files hulk thread for an in depth explanation on the feat:

This is very often used instance by Superman supporters when arguing against Hulk, they say Hulk would be highly affected by Superman's heat vision because Hulk almost "died" by taking Gladiator's heat vision. The notion might seem applicable at first glance, but when a few contextual factors are mentioned then it doesn't seem right to claim such statements.

The statements start when this scan from Incredible Hulk Annual '97 is posted out of context in the forums...

No Caption Provided

In this issue Gladiator was fighting Hulk and the moment of using Gladiator's HV came and he was literally burning Hulk's insides quite easily with it, however, Hulk's powers were seriously fluctuating during this time, for the exact same reasons as Apocalypse restraining him... He was the nexus between 2 universes and the energies flowing through him were killing him. In fact, one of his most affected attributes was his durability which coincidentally was precisely what he lacked in this instance. This drop on his durability is first showcased in Deadpool #4 when he is harmed with with astonishingly ease...

The scans are self-explanatory, if Hulk is easily impaled by a street sign, then there's absolutely no doubt he was seriously affected. Which only makes Gladiator's instance even more impressive since Hulk fought Gladiator head on while having his durability and healing factor greatly dampened even taking his heat vision which is stated to burn as hot as the core of stars, which essentially, is even hotter than Superman's.

~GhostRavage

The thing is that glads didnt know hulk was weakened, he will come into this fight thinking he can finish this with his heat vison and rather quickly as well, that will be his downfall. Not only was hulk weakened but since then he has been amped making him even more powerful, again, something gladiator isnt aware of. The amp was referenced in two biographical entries (I will try find the scans) and is the main reason he is such a powerhouse nowadays.

Another tactic hulk can employ is a quick bull rush, something gladiator also isnt aware of him being able to do. And believe me, Hulk willblitz him and its entirely in character to do so.

  • Blitzes through a group of soldiers
  • Blitzes again
  • Blitzes an ice giant
  • keeps pace with mjolnir
  • Blitzes through a wall of absolute zero
  • Blitzes corvus and proxima

Thats pretty much my intro, now for my response.

as you can see here. his powergrid is pretty spot on. he is a Stronian and that makes him near impossible to kill. Ronan confirms this

No Caption Provided

Good, just like hulk then :P

another thing that Gladiator is rather amazing in. his Stronian heritage makes him extremely difficult to hurt (relatively, i mean if Hulk hits him he'll feel it no doubt)

<img src=
<img src="http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_super/11113/111133231/4094891-gladiator+12.jpg">

he chills in a star for fun

The narration made it pretty clear that the pain he suffered was almost unbearable, not to mention he was there to test his limits. besides, all hulk has here is blunt force, whilst its a good feat it wont do much to help him against hulk.

he fights Hyperion in nano-seconds.

Yet more recently thanos could react to a speed blitz from him:

No Caption Provided

And by feats hulk is has a better reaction time than thanos.

he hurls himself at near-lightspeed against Ego

Again, a rather old feat and one that contradicts his more recent showings.

see what he does to Thor here

Thor manages to react to him mid blitz, he throws him over his shoulder. Not to mention hulk is physically stronger than thor and has an arguable better reaction time. That scan works against your more than it does for you.

there are maybe a handful of people who can hope to match Hulk in pure physicals. i deem Gladiator one of them. Hulk will eventually surpass him (as he will almost anyone) but Gladiator can go toe to toe with Hulk.

nice lifting feat. quantifiable but obviously allot

Hulk lifting a mountain in the secret wars is also quantifiable:

No Caption Provided

150 Billion tons to be precise. Not to mention that was actually a weaker version of savage hulk, he had banners mind and the leader tested him to see how powerful he was and came to the conclusion the new hulk wasn't a threat to his plans:

  • The leader wants to test the new hulk
  • He comes to the conclusion that the new hulk is weaker and wont threaten his plans.

hes matched several people with his Heat. Tyrant and Cyclops to mention

  • Tyrant is superior to thanos, your telling me that glads heat vision surpasses that of thanoses energy projection?
  • Wha-? Scott is powered by the pheonix force there and is almost definitely holding back. Hes trying to calm glads down whilst kallark is explicitly threatening to kill scott. You cant quantify that feat mate.

and he uses it often

Of course he does, however hulk also has ridiculous heat resistance.

He completely shrugged off Johnny's supernova which is consistently said to burn at around 1 million degrees. Whilst im sure glads can surpass that he will have to surpass it greatly to hurt hulk.

he destroys a planet in 3 strikes. in terms of Striking feats he dwarfs people like Superman and Wonder Man.

A ridiculously high end feat mate, luckily hulk has durability feats to match it. I have two in mind but ill avoid using them for now since i want to save them for later.

Well this is my intro mate, sorry for taking so long. Good luck with your reply ;)

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serrure

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@thedailybagel: Hulk truly is a bad-a$$. not sure if i like how they are going with him as "Doc Green" and if i find out he depowered A-bomb ill kill him. my response may have to wait until tomorrow cuz im still on this date we're just at her place now ;)

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Thedailybagel

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@serrure: to each his own, I'm optimistic about doc green but I don't like the idea of depowering other hulks. Marvel have been doing a female thing lately so all femi-hulks should be safe, sadly I think one or two of the male hulks will be on their way out.

And he knocked the crap out of a-bomb, they show the fight in previews. Whether he depowers him awaits to be seen.

And good luck!

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Thedailybagel

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Cregan_Stark

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Looking good so far fellas

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Thedailybagel

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serrure

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#38  Edited By serrure

Round 1

No Caption Provided

Everyone keep calm and call Majestor

As you can see glads is tearing through hulk with his heat vision and would have killed him if hulk didn't grab him. Whilst im no expert on kallark I know that he has a decent tactical mind, strangely enough that will be his downfall... In this instance Hulk was weakened, greatly. Ill cite acidskulls and ghostravages context files hulk thread for an in depth explanation on the feat:

this is more CIS then anything else... its was blatantly obvious that Hulk was supposed to win that fight because Gladiator didnt use his single greatest advantage over Hulk... flight. the analysis behind Hulk winning may be sound the problem is it was blatant CIS.

  • Tyrant is superior to thanos, your telling me that glads heat vision surpasses that of thanoses energy projection?
  • Wha-? Scott is powered by the pheonix force there and is almost definitely holding back. Hes trying to calm glads down whilst kallark is explicitly threatening to kill scott. You cant quantify that feat mate.

1. im saying he matched Tyrant. he didnt do it for long but he did do it.

2. oh yeah

definitely in the "talking down" mode.

The thing is that glads didnt know hulk was weakened, he will come into this fight thinking he can finish this with his heat vison and rather quickly as well, that will be his downfall. Not only was hulk weakened but since then he has been amped making him even more powerful, again, something gladiator isnt aware of. The amp was referenced in two biographical entries (I will try find the scans) and is the main reason he is such a powerhouse nowadays.

Another tactic hulk can employ is a quick bull rush, something gladiator also isnt aware of him being able to do. And believe me, Hulk willblitz him and its entirely in character to do so.

we dont use CIS in battles

2. Gladiator has re-acted in nano-seconds. Hulk has not moved that fast yet despite his speed boost

Yet more recently thanos could react to a speed blitz from him:

1. there was no indication that Gladiator was even slightly going full speed. its not quantifiable how fast he was going.

2. Thanos has re-acted to several speed blitzes before. Surfer, and the fallen one to name a couple

Again, a rather old feat and one that contradicts his more recent showings.

Thanos sent him some 200 hundred million light years away and at the end of that issue (which i had read in great detail) they were worried about him coming back. lets say the issue lasted 72 hours (which i think is 60 hours to long) thats nearly 2.7 light years per hour. and like i said im taking into account the whole issue assuming that during the Infinity revelation, where Warlock pretty much remade the universe, Gladiator was still flying towards the planet (which i dont think he was so we could theoretically cut it down to 2 hours)

The point is no it doesnt contradict more recent showings

more bull rushes (the second scan is to show how big the first one is)

No Caption Provided

another bull rush that shows him tearing through a nova corpsman

Thor manages to react to him mid blitz, he throws him over his shoulder. Not to mention hulk is physically stronger than thor and has an arguable better reaction time. That scan works against your more than it does for you.

Thor got one hit in and it did nothing. he didnt touch him for the rest of the blitz. after this Thor wins through CIS because Gladiator thinks he won and starts celebrating (completely out of character for Kallarak)

he broke out of Surfers grip and then reacted to a board blitz. Surfer had to use matter manipulation to put him down temporarily

No Caption Provided

he takes Supreme into space before he can re-act. some people claim Supreme is = SA Supes (its bull crap) I place him around Nu 52 Supes (being Generous)

150 Billion tons to be precise. Not to mention that was actually a weaker version of savage hulk, he had banners mind and the leader tested him to see how powerful he was and came to the conclusion the new hulk wasn't a threat to his plans:

Hulk can lift more sure... but Gladiator has the better striking feats here

hes slightly below Thor but his speed makes up the difference.

A ridiculously high end feat mate, luckily hulk has durability feats to match it. I have two in mind but ill avoid using them for now since i want to save them for later.

not really Gladiator suffers from the same crap that Thor does... He holds back often. when he cuts lose he can destroy planets

No Caption Provided

he holds back far too often

when he cuts lose

he is capable of 1-hit KO'ing Black Bolt. now Context. Black Bolt was stunned but still Gladiator 1 hit KO'ed him. the punch also caused the infrastructure around them to collapse

the last scan shows you how good Black Bolt looks at the end of the issue (which is the next time you see him conscious)

He'll cut loose, because he knows the Hulk can take it.

using his speed (which he does utilize in fights) he can take the Hulk out. a series of speed blitzs and then using his range should allow him to win

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johnfrank120

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Can you please tag for votes?

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uugieboogie

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Good luck you guys. And tag me for votes!

@thedailybagel could you PM with the link from where you get your Hulk scans? thanks.

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Thedailybagel

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@serrure: my computer keeps screwing up whenever I try to make a post, I'll try to have a reply up tommorow if the problem persists,

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Thedailybagel

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#44  Edited By Thedailybagel

@serrure

Round 1

this is more CIS then anything else

Completely irrelevant to what I said mate... I explicitly said that im not using it as a way of saying hulk would win due to the dodgy circumstances surrounding it. What I said wouldhelp is that glads will try to employ a strategy (except not being as much of an idiot this time) that is bound to fail since who knows nothing about hulk. A strategy that thus far you have yet to counter and is entirely valid.

its was blatantly obvious that Hulk was supposed to win that fight because Gladiator didnt use his single greatest advantage over Hulk... flight. the analysis behind Hulk winning may be sound the problem is it was blatant CIS.

Again, completely irrelevant to what I said...

1. im saying he matched Tyrant. he didnt do it for long but he did do it.

Fair enough then, mind showing me the scans after glads doing that? (I havent read the instance myself so I dont know what happens next).

2. oh yeah

definitely in the "talking down" mode.

For one, that's emma and colossus delivering the beat down, not scott. For two, yes, he was in the talking down mood. Most of the pheonix 5 were reluctant to hurt people they considered friends and held back against them. This is evident when colossus holds back against spiderman:

No Caption Provided

"This is pathetic, why do you hold back brother?"

So yeah, the pheonix 5 (or most of them anyway) were reluctant to hurt their friends and considering Scott said he didn't want to hurt kallark Its safe to assume he wasn't going all out.

For the record, hulk also seriously injured emma frost who had half the pheonix force and procceded to tank her best shot, allowing scott to take all of it (I think it just weakened her enough so scott could take it though) so theres that to chew on...

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

we dont use CIS in battles

Yeah mate, we do... Its literally said on the description page of pis cis and wis. We dont use WIS and PIS but we use CIS, im surprised you overlooked that mate... And again, completely irrelevant to what I said.

2. Gladiator has re-acted in nano-seconds. Hulk has not moved that fast yet despite his speed boost

Yet more recently couldnt react to thanos. Are their any other feats of him fighting that fast? Its a rather old scan to be honest and feats werent taken as literally back then, if you can find a more recent one i will happily concede my point.

1. there was no indication that Gladiator was even slightly going full speed. its not quantifiable how fast he was going.

Then why would he go any faster against hulk? He was itching for a fight an couldn't react in time so I highly doubt he was just floating towards thanos. If anything that makes me think he has a lower reaction time than expected.

2. Thanos has re-acted to several speed blitzes before. Surfer, and the fallen one to name a couple

As has hulk, thor, surfer and quicksilver to name a few.

Thor got one hit in and it did nothing. he didnt touch him for the rest of the blitz. after this Thor wins through CIS because Gladiator thinks he won and starts celebrating (completely out of character for Kallarak)

He still reacted to it, its irrelevant what happened afterwards. Hulk has an equal if not better reaction time than thor and far greater strength, He could do the same but with a more devastating effect.

Hulk can lift more sure... but Gladiator has the better striking feats here

Other than the planet busting strike you haven't shown anything that allows him to overcome hulks durability an healing factor, for the record, guess who korg thought hit harder out of hulk and thor...

No Caption Provided

As you can see, clear on panel evidence that hulk hits harder than thor! Im joking by the way, just having a quick dig at thor fans ;).

In all seriousness though, he hits hardand has some crazy feats to prove it, to name a few:

  • Causes earthquakes around the world whilst casually punching a few gamma irradiated boars
  • (2-3) breaks nate greys TK sheilds when its never been done before.
  • Casually breaks a mountain being dropped on him.

Hes an all out tank an hes no slouch in the healing factor department either.

  • Heals from being reduced to muscle mass in a few seconds.
  • Heals back half his head, cause you know, logic.

not really Gladiator suffers from the same crap that Thor does... He holds back often. when he cuts lose he can destroy planets

Coincidentally so does hulk, except if he knows you can take it he will hit harder...

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and considering how it went last time he knows kallark can take it.

when he cuts lose

he is capable of 1-hit KO'ing Black Bolt. now Context. Black Bolt was stunned but still Gladiator 1 hit KO'ed him. the punch also caused the infrastructure around them to collapse

the last scan shows you how good Black Bolt looks at the end of the issue (which is the next time you see him conscious)

Black bolts durability nowadays is questionable, besides the fight seemed to be going evenly. I could use the scan of hulk one shotting thor during infinity but im not going to, why? Because thor was completely not expecting it, a characters durability can seriously diminish when they are stunned or not expecting something.

using his speed (which he does utilize in fights) he can take the Hulk out. a series of speed blitzs and then using his range should allow him to win

For one, kallark isnt the type of guy to blitz, rince and repeat, and judging by thanos and thor reacting to him mid blitz its a falacity to claim hulk couldnt react to him. Furthermore you completely ignored my point about their last encounter. Kallark didnt know hulk was weakened, he doesnt know hulk has since been amped. he will come into this fight with dampened confidence and a strategy that wont work, he also wont be expecting a bull-rush from hulk since the best hulk could manage was a slow lumbering walk in their last encounter and remember how devastating being caught off guard can be? If kallark manages to continuously dodge hulk then big green can just rack out a thunderclap, something thats entirely in character for him to do against speedsters. Thunderclaps that can do this to hyperion:

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and I believe this is the same hyperion that went toe to toe with gladiator

From then on all it takes is a quick speed blitz to get to glads while he is stunned and the beat down of a life time. Or hulk can just hold him there with his vastly superior strength that I havent showcased much yet, so heres a few scans:

  • Holds apart two spheres of matter and anit matter when the attraction force was greater than that of a neutron star. An average neutron star has about 1.3 times the mass of our sun so its pretty damn heavy.
  • Lifts, pushes and pulls the tectonic plates of a planet named sakaar which is (or was, it was destroyed :( his son caused it!) bigger than earth. Its worth noting that the warphole that took him to sakaar weakened him to the point where ordinary spears could hurt him so he was nowhere near the top of his game.
  • Rips open the earth like its nobodys buisness, not a great feat but looks cool nonetheless.

I would also like to add that I wholeheartedly agree with your analysis on physical strength although I believe it is a major advanatage. It benefits hulk in grapples and can help him resist speed blitzes, speaking of which...

Hulks resistance to speed blitzes

Yep, hulks strength has on occasion allowed him to resist speed blitzes. Whilst he only weighs around 1000 pounds hes been able to utterly ignore the blitzes of 100 plus tonners such as wonderman and ironman:

joe fixit Quite easily shrugged of their attempts and didnt even budge. Im not comparing glads to ironman or wonderman by the way, if kallark blitzes hulk he wont bounce off or anything, it'll be effective but not as devastating as it could be. Especially if glads trys it more than once since hulk can brace himself.

Oh, and this:

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Its not that relevant but it looks awesome so im using it.

And if this comes down to a war of attrition (which is doubtful but you never know) Hulk wont start tiring before glads will:

  • Hulk spent entire days exerting himself without fail. Fun fact: Hulk has once matched namors swim speed, irrelevant but something i wanted to brag about.
  • Proffesor hulk spent days fighting the forces of hel.
  • Mindless hulk spent weeks trying to climb a mountain

Its also worth noting that this was back when hulk actually needed air to breather and wanted to be left alone allot, He would have much better stamina nowadays.

To summarize

  • Hulk has the striking power to hurt glads and deal some serious pain
  • Their previous fight is a valid encounter to consider for reasons ive already outlined
  • Gladiators speed blitzes wont be as effective as they could be.
  • Hulk smash!
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Lvenger

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Bump for more views.

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This being continued?

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Thedailybagel

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@lvenger: yup, I just never got round to finishing my post and serrure had some computer trouble, it's all good now though.

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@thedailybagel: yeah bro just let me know once your done. i have to say im thoroughly enjoying your post though (i mean that in a good way) keep it up

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FIGHT

i chose hulk btw

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