CaV N52 Superman(GhostRavage) vs Thor(Thor_Parker82)GR won!

@ghostravage: I'll give a vote in an hour or so.

Lmao ouch a harsh response from Dondave.

Ghost won this one. All around the better debater in this thread. He showed the versatility and speed advantages that Superman will bring to the table in order to keep himself from getting tagged. He also had more clear counters to Parker contesting the speed disparity. Ghost also showed that although Superman doesn't have the hitting feats that Thor does he is at least strong enough to do serious damage to Thor.

Nice debate for the ages.

@thor_parker82: It's a tie.

Too close to call

~MiB

I never said it was, but yours is still terrible

Things getting tense in here..

Anyway how much longer is voting open? I haven't read all of this

@jayc1324: Lol, yeah they are.

Voting is going to be open for one week, I guess.

ThorParker. his presentation was more efficient, linking the bullet points to pictures

So says "one word" guy.

@amazingwebhead: Thanks

@ghostravage: great. I will need to find a moment in the next days to read all that!

@thor_parker82: you're welcome :)

I'm casting my vote for @ghostravage. Plain and simple he was the better debater this time around, and really pressed hard when it came to the speed advantage and quickly shot down several of Parker's key points that would have claimed that battleground if they went unopposed. I knew from the get-go this debate would be all about speed for the most part and while everything else went back and forth the speed argument and a focus on Supermans perception and combat skills were the main consistent things I thought ghostravage excelled at claiming/defending. To offer a little constructive criticism @thor_parker82 if you'll hear me out, I would have pressed harder on recent examples when it came to perceiving and subtly reacting to FTL objects/attacks. Remember when it comes to combat speed you don't need to always supply examples of actual combat demonstrations to prove reaction time (which is what ghostravage took advantage of). An example would be simply tracking an object moving in space at FTL speeds would suffice IMO of proving said character who moves FTL won't be an unstoppable blurr compared to a character who can easily perceive objects moving at FTL speeds, and can react at those speeds. Even if said reaction is something as simple as turning his/hers head.

Good job to both of you :)

@micah: Thanks for the advice :)

Ghost-Ravage took this by quite a fair bit, in all honesty. But Thor-Parker was able to put up some good points.

Presentation = better debate now? This is one of the reasons I quit debating.

GhostRavage ravaged this CaV. My vote goes for him.

Jesus... the douchebaggery cost you at least one vote.

@makhai: You call ME a douchebagg when GhostRavage spent the entire thread being agressive towards me ? You call ME a douchebagg when a guy that I have never talked to comes and says bullsh*t about me ?

Doesn´t seem reasonable.

I don't care. You are being hostile with voters. That's pathetic and shows a complete lack of respect for the purposes of these types of debates. If you want to leave it to voters and then accost the voters for voting against you, you definitely don't deserve to win even if you had the better arguments. Dondave doesn't debate. So insulting his posting style is terrible form.

I personally vote for @thor_parker82 because he actually had quite a few responses for GhostRavage's arguments about speed, and all of them seemed legitimate. It's a fair point, if using low-end feats of Thor are legitimate, than Thor's use of low-end Superman feats should be the same, unless you're bias of course.

Thor_Parker82 wins this one for being capable of countering his opponent, and giving very legitimate reasons for Thor being able to tag Superman.

@thor_parker82: Anytime.

The only person I have been hostile was towards DonDave because he was that way towards me. So yeah, I am being hostile towards a guy who was the same way to me.

@thor_parker82: lol Dondave is hall of fame

I'm going to give my vote to ghost ravage as well. Thor parker did a nice job but in the end Thor was too slow for Clark and the power/strength advantage that he had wasn't enough to compensate.

Good job to both.

Dondave is entitled to judge a CaV in accordance to however he sees how the debate went. He believes your arguments were terrible. Personally, I am seeing very little from you that makes me want to disagree with him. You certainly lack the ability to take any kind of criticism with grace.

You'll win, because you apparently have more friends to beg votes from. But if how you are responding to users is the measure of your debating ability, you certainly didn't beat Ghostravage. But I'll still do you the courtesy of reading the debate tonight when I have the time.

@conner_wolf: Thanks :)

I know, and that, is beyond comprehension, literally 99% of his posts have one word.........LMAO.

@makhai: It's not exactly easy to take criticism when everyone's criticism is "YOUR DEBATE SUCKED, YOU SUCK"

@thor_parker82 :

Good presentation but too much things out-of-context, moreover you keep using scans that I debunked during our CAV.

@ghostravage

Well documented. Presentation at the top. You show the full context. Very good job. You have my vote @ghostravage

I am not saying he has to thank Dondave and then ask for another. But votes are cast based on the opinions of the battles. Dondave read through the debate and feels a very certain kind of way about how it went. His vote is valid and insulting him because he dared to offer an opinion on the debate is just poor sportsmanship. It's like fighting with the ref after you fumbled the ball.

@makhai: More like fighting with the ref when he called you a dumb sh*thead for doing what you did. I'm personally a guy who doesn't like to take crap from people so I see his point, my philosophy is, you're allowed your opinion, I'm allowed to call you an *ss for it.

He was being hostile towards me, he could have give his opinion on the CaV without being agressive, please read the votes again, @micah criticized me and I thanked him for doing it, but what DonDave did wasn´t criticize.

GhostRavage is winning, where the hell are you getting this idea that I am calling my friends and begging for votes ?

I can´t understand, my mind can´t comprehend, I can´t conceive why I am the one getting bullshit, when there are two guys here who spent all the time being aggressive towards me.

Lol, I know you are trying to help me, and I thank you, but just one person said that my debate sucked :P

Anyway, I appreciate a lot that you are trying to help me and your vote, thanks a lot man.

@thor_parker82: No problem, but I was just paraphrasing my friend.

Even if your comparison is the better one, it changes nothing. Being an internet tough guy isn't going to win votes from anyone that isn't easily impressed and in fact, it will cost him more than just mine. Mark my words on that. I have seen CaVs where the superior debater got crushed in the votes because he was an utter turd the entire time. It's not a normal debate, a certain exercise of self-control is expected.

By reading this, I know for a fact you haven´t read the debate, people who have read it will understand what I am talking about.

@makhai: Oh I understand that, I try my best to be polite, but sometimes people just tend to push you over the edge, ya know? I for one am in a CAV right now where both I and my opponent are being very polite, but people started just taunting both of us with "Superman solos" when he wasn't even in the CAV and my opponent decided to just tell them to GTFO, I personally had no problem with it, nor did any other voters, but he wasn't doing it to try and get votes nor do I think he'll lose votes because of it, sometimes it's not about getting votes, it's just about speaking your mind.

My vote goes to @ghostravage. He was on-point, had a straightforward yet highly potent strategy which exploited Thor, and good counterstatements which held his ground.

Nonetheless, good job to both debaters.

@thenaughtytitan: Yeah, you can call me an ass for whatever you want, it's called Freedom of Speech man, but the point of that is targeted more towards one person being an ass to begin with, in this case, it's you.

And yes, I do think he can, because every Flash holes back in combat.

He wasn't though. He made a singular comment that was nothing more than his opinion and you obviously lacked the ability to let it roll off your back, you lacked the ability to be 'above it all', so to speak.

I have been reading the comments, thank you. You're not changing anything by asking me to read the comments. You have proven that you deal exceptionally poorly with any kind of negative opinions. Your skin is extremely thin for someone that thinks of himself as some miraculous debater.

I said you will win. It's a future tense comment, so using current vote count is irrelevant.

You are getting 'bs' because I don't like that you have no respect for CaV. Quit being a victim, Dondave made 2 or 3 replies to you and only because you goaded him into replying more with insults of your own. As for possible other aggression from a second user, I haven't really seen that. Unless you are referring to me, which is amusing because I haven't been aggressive to you at all.

And there is the rub. You lost your mind when one person, just one, said that your debating sucked. How is that becoming of a HoF debater? How is that becoming of a CaV debater?

Cool points made by both sides; however, I found myself nodding in agreement more with Ghost's arguments more-so than I did with Parker's, thus GR gets my vote.

What are you talking about? I outright said I haven't read it yet... twice. One of which was in a direct reply to you. I said I would be reading it tonight when I have the time to carefully evaluate the debate. You really are that desperate to 'prove me wrong'?

It's the nature of debating. Sometimes things can get a little heated. The trolling is also something that is unavoidable lol. I can't remember the CaV where people turned against the superior debater but it wasn't too long ago. Anyway, from my experience here so far, people expect just a little bit more composure from the debaters in a CaV.

After reading a second time around I have to go with @ghostravage, he just had a better debate and better counters. @thor_parker82 had some good points at times but a lot of the stuff you were putting out was easily debunked by ghostravage. Ghostavage was just the better debater in this thread.

(would ho into more detail but I gotz groceries to put away.)

Good job to both of you.

Oh you, as funny as ever.

@makhai: Indeed they do, I used to debate on YouTube before getting a comicvine account, I think the most common response I got was "SHUT THE F*CK UP YOU FURRY B*TCH" because I have a wolf in my profile picture. Although I just try not to fault a debater if they respond to a troll, or a rude debater in their own rude way. I blame the spark, whoever was rude first.

Oh and Ghostravage. I will pretty upset if he doesn't make the HOF this time round.

You debated on YouTube?! You sir, are a braver person than I.

As for me, I normally love users that want to offer negative comments towards me. It allows me to exercise my debating ability just a little bit more and gives me a chance to stretch my own ad hominem attacks. However, I don't offer that same behavior on CaVs because I respect the intended purpose and the prestige associated with it. It's supposed to be a higher form of debating. Typically petty behavior that is not only expected, but welcome in regular debates has no place here. Getting heated with your opponent is one thing, swinging at someone in the bleachers for saying you suck leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

He said my debating sucked, how is that not being hostile ?

I tell you again, @micah criticized me and I thanked him for doing it, what DonDave did wasn´t criticize.

I ask you again, where are you getting this idea that I am calling my friends and begging them to vote for me ?

Nope, you are not the second user who is being aggressive towards me, GhostRavage is, he spent the entire debate being aggressive, once you read the debate you´ll know what I am talking about and why I am genuinely surprised that I am the one who is getting bullshit.

What are you talking about? I outright said I haven't read it yet... twice. One of which was in a direct reply to you. I said I would be reading it tonight when I have the time to carefully evaluate the debate. You really are that desperate to 'prove me wrong'?

Well, sorry, I honestly don´t remember you saying that, once you read the debate, you´ll know what I am talking about and why I feel the way I do.

• It's not hostile at all. It's a negative comment regarding your debating ability. Grow thicker skin if you want to be a debater.
• So you can only take polite criticism? See my above bullet point.
• I know some of your associates and the associates of your associates. CV is a surprisingly active rumor-mill. It's comparable to The View in terms of girl-gossip.
• Ghostravage is your opponent. Aggression is expected. You need to learn how to handle yourself under fire, it seems, if you are so easily shaken by an aggressive opponent. Why are you debating if you can't handle the heat?
• I only addressed you personally because of how you chose to conduct yourself with some that are not your debating opponent. My opinion is still out on the way the debate went, for obvious reasons. But I will admit, that I am tempted to vote against you purely on how you reacted to negative comments.