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#1 Edited by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio
Mori Hui represented by Highaccuser
Mori Hui represented by Highaccuser

VS

Gamora represented by Multiversity
Gamora represented by Multiversity

Rules:

  • Gamora has access to current and classic feats.
  • Hui is prior to his power up from the King and receiving the original Yeoui.
  • Standard gear/weapons.
  • Both sides are in character.
  • Fight takes place here (uninhabited):
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#2 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity it's up. Are you good with the OP?

Also you should probably go first, I still have to read through Hui's appearances again for feats.

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#3 Posted by EmperorThanos- (16056 posts) - - Show Bio

t4v

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#4 Edited by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser: Looks good to me, I should have a post up today or tomorrow.

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#5 Posted by Primez0ne (9811 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't do this much, but this looks very interesting.

T4V

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#6 Posted by Redzkz (3684 posts) - - Show Bio
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#7 Posted by BeelzebubGOH (84 posts) - - Show Bio

T4V

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#8 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser: My post will be up just now, so I just wanted to confirm if it's fine that Gamora uses her current gear? It's simply just a new staff she uses.

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#9 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser: My post will be up just now, so I just wanted to confirm if it's fine that Gamora uses her current gear? It's simply just a new staff she uses.

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That's fine unless it's OP.

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#10 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser: Not at all, it's just a staff with some additional charge at the ends.

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#11 Edited by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

Introduction

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Marvel's deadliest assassin and one the most skilled fighters the marvel universe has.

Powers & Abilities:

Gamora is essentially a skilled superhuman combantant.

  • Superhuman physicals
  • Superhuman speed, reflexes
  • Extremely great hand to hand fighter (very good in nerve striking)
  • Extremely proficient in close quarter combat, swordsmanship, and marksmanship

Initial Thoughts:

Before I start, I want to make it clear that I think both of our characters hold distinct advantages in this fight. I don't remember everything Hui can do. I've read all of God Of Highschool, but I only remember certain parts of the story. I do know for a fact that Hui holds the advantage in raw strength and defensive capabilities, but that's all I can think of at the top of my head. Given that, I think I'll make it pretty clear what Gamora is capable of so you can do the same in return for your opener.

Capability:

Strength

Since I already know Gamora doesn't have the strength Hui does, I don't think it's really in my interest to go over too much detail a point that won't hold much weight. Not only is she physically weaker, but physical strength shouldn't play too much of a role in a battle of skill and striking anyways. In Annihilation: Ronan #3, Gamora was able to toss Ronan the accuser a considerable distance with one hand. Not only that, but the force of her throw seemed to have been enough to cause him some pain.

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For now, this should be enough to show that Gamora does have some high levels of physical strength, which should allow her to hang in there against Hui.

A much more important point would be the incredible striking power Gamora possesses which is more than capable of saying she has the physical strength to harm someone of Hui's level. This is important for me to get out from the beginning because once Gamora works around his skill and defense, she's going to need to land as much damage as she can quickly before he has a chance to counter attack (Hui is really good at that). Just to put one of her more impressive feats out there, here is one from Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 4. #13, where she is shown taking on Captain Marvel. Gamora is able to harm Carol with her blows enough to draw blood on each of them, which is impressive given Carol has gone to become more powerful since she dropped the Ms. Marvel guise.

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She's not only limited to these types of showings. Gamora in the Infinity War was able to kick the Power Gem out of Drax the destroyer's mouth who had swallowed it. She accomplished this with one kick to the gut I might add.

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This also wasn't a one time showing because she harmed Drax with a punch to his nose, which also made it bleed.

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Durability

Gamora's ability to dish out punishment is more so than what she can take, but that doesn't mean she can take some powerful blows and get back up from them. She is by no means a glass canon and should be capable of recovering from the blows Hui dishes out against her.

She's walked off a blast from Captain Marvel. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 4. #13.

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She's also walked off a punch from Ms. America and then a blast from Monica Rambeau. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 4. #17.

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Speed

One of Gamora's biggest attributes is her speed. Gamora is an incredibly fast combatant, which allows her to not only evade, counter and maneuver around her opponents but flat out out-speed them like she did to Ronan the accuser inAnnihilation: Ronan #3.

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Fast enough to react to and deflect two of Monica Rambeau's heat blasts. The first time she reflected it back at Sasquatch and it had enough power to go through his body and wound him. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 4. #17.

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Skill

This is probably going to be the most debated aspect in our entire debate given both of our characters rely heavily on their skill. Personally, I think she's more than skilled enough to challenge him and likely more so overall than he is in combat too. Gamora is regarded as one of the most skilled fighters in the marvel universe and she definitely has the showings to back that up entirely. For starters, here's another feat for her from Infinity War. She was capable of making a fool out of both Rogue and She-Hulk without even trying. In fact, it takes multiple X-Men to even attempt to try and fight her off.

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Those two aren't the most skilled, so let's go with a character who has trained Gamora himself, Thanos. She was not only able to out-speed him but also out-skill him and get a nerve strike to his chin, which would be detrimental to Hui if she got it on him.

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Gamora is incredibly proficient in nerve striking as I've shown above and will show more of just now. She was able to one-shot Rage and the Thing with one nerve strike each. Infinity Crusade #5.

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Conclusion:

I tried to make this post as informative as I could without going over the top. This should give you an idea of what you're dealing with. I'll definitely go into more detail as the debate progresses as well as show more skill with her weaponry itself. You're up @highaccuser.

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#12 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: Cool. I should be able to have a full response in a couple days. My opener will likely longer than yours most likely because I need to establish gear and skill with other information from Hui's verse to put it in context.

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#13 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: Cool. I should be able to have a full response in a couple days. My opener will likely longer than yours most likely because I need to establish gear and skill with other information from Hui's verse to put it in context.

Sounds good.

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#14 Posted by BeelzebubGOH (84 posts) - - Show Bio
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#15 Posted by AtheistKnowledge (9595 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't know you did CAV's. @highaccuser

Good luck to the both of you.

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#16 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't know you did CAV's. @highaccuser

Good luck to the both of you.

I usually don't and rarely follow through when I do, but I have sometimes.

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#17 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@beelzebubgoh: Hard to say for a character like her, but hopefully my representation can give you an idea.

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#18 Edited by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity:

Intro:

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Hui Mori is a clone of Jin Mori created by his power of "not" kagebushin no jutsu. Hui himself isn't near as powerful as the original due to circumstances and has confirmed as much by his own admission. This is what he has to say exactly about how their powers compare:

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I'm not sure where he got those numbers because he's a lot weaker by feats. Regardless though he gets an amp later as well as the original Yeoui for this CaV he will be at the level of power he was while Jin was in Oraeguk leaving him weaker stats. Hui is still a very respectable combatant with the stats he's alloted.

Hui has two forms: base and Jecheondaeseong (Monkey King) form which he fights in with armor suit and all. Monkey King form has a time limit however it recharges and Hui is capable of fighting without it.

Hui has the following gear and abilities in this match:

  • Superhuman stats in all aspects.
  • Weapons: Yeoui (his staff), Geunwoodun (a magic cloud which he controls) and his armor suit.
  • High end martial arts skill (Re-Taekwondo, Nabong Needle Ryu and Plumba Verses)

Initial Thoughts:

From the feats presented so far, Gamora's main advantage is showings against established characters which she has a bit more of. However I believe Hui has a large advantage in stats (strength and durability) with far better gear and Destructive Capacity that will overpower Gamora.

Weapons:

Before going into Hui's feats and stats it is somewhat important to establish his gear/weapons which he has here as they are important factors in several of them.

Yeoui:

Yeoui is Hui's staff which he uses as a weapon in melee. It has the capacity to shrink and expand growing in length and thickness allowing it to be used at range and in melee. Jin uses it here giving a display of what it looks like and how it can be used in combat:

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He calls it Ruyi Jingu because of translation stuff...I'm calling Yeoui here.

It is also precise enough to expand inside the body of the First Crown Prince while just being a small shard enough to defeat him with internal attacks (for the record those are clone Yeoui Jin is breaking on Natak).

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Hub's feats and applications for Yeoui will come later.

Geundoowun:

Geundoowun is a magic cloud which Hui controls. He can use it to fly around for better travel speed and summon lightning. It can also be used to directly attack and trap opponents while being spawned from his hand:

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As far as lightning goes Hui the kind Hui summons is powerful enough to cause a blackout and light up several city blocks at 30% power (Hui is holding back to avoid harming spectators which won't be an issue here.

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This seems like a very effective way to combat Gamora seeing as how he can blast her at range and avoid melee. Gamora could probably react based on reacting to Spectrum's blasts (assuming neither of those are at natural speed they should compare proportionately) but Hui's lightning is way larger and wider so she won't have a way to block it.

Armor Suit:

Hui's Armor Suit is what he is seen wearing in Monkey King form. It is in fact a symbiotic suit of shapeshifting armor that protects Hui. It appears automatically to protect from damage and shape shifts around attack:

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The suit is sentient and acts independently of Hui as shown when it protects him from swords whilst he was unconscious and causes the swords to break on him:

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The armor is very flexible and durable against piercing attacks shown here when it shifts around bullets defending Hui from them and even morphs around his strands of hair giving as fine protection as possible:

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Regarding the power of these bullets they were shown to cause large craters on walls so they clearly had much more power than standard bullets to not penetrate at all:

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The armor should also have the useful function of preventing Gamora from making contact with his skin and flesh for a nerve strike. That out of the way let's move onto stats.

Strength:

Regarding raw lifting strength there's not very much material for Hui. Regardless he should have a comfortable advantage in this area just comparing the feats they do have. Specifically that he's shown able to lift his staff Yeoui even when it's expanded to large sizes (towering over buildings here):

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So he should easily have the advantage if they grapple.

Regarding striking power which is the more relevant factor, he's shown to cause a large and destructive shockwave while striking Hercules.

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He's also sent Sang Man Duk flying across water like a pebble causing a very large splash.

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This is just with his body. Using Yeoui he can strike hard enough to send John across the island they were fighting on sending him through solid ground in the process and destroying a building.

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Looking at Gamora's feats she does not seem capable of contending. Harming characters is nice but without harming them to a significant degree (and she did not do so there) it can't be quantified. Furthermore Hui has better striking and damage output feats I'll go into later that have him easily harming far more durable characters than Captain Marvel so Gamora's feat of only making her bleed slightly won't hold up.

Durability:

Hui gains additional durability from his Armor Suit, but has very significant feats without it as well. First off he has shown very good piercing durability so Gamora using bladed weapons will be at a disadvantage. Here a large sword breaks on his back without causing any damage:

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Taking it a step higher he tanks an arrow to the chest that sends him flying through 4 buildings with enough force to make them collapse and appears unscathed. Again in base form without Armor Suit

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Hui has also been unharmed by direct contact with Subject M when he was melting into a biomass:

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For reference Subject M's flesh was melting stone in this instance.

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Quantifiably speaking these feats look better than Gamora's which compose of tanking blasts and strikes of unidentified power. But more importantly when combined with Armor Suit Hui's durability will be too much for Gamora to cut with piercing weapons.

Speed:

One of Gamora's biggest attributes is her speed. Gamora is an incredibly fast combatant, which allows her to not only evade, counter and maneuver around her opponents but flat out out-speed them like she did to Ronan the accuser inAnnihilation: Ronan #3.

Ronan doesn't have speed feats to my knowledge. Hui has a similar feat of moving as a fast blur but it was performed in a more impressive manner, with him also leaping from building to building and crossing city blocks in a short frame of time.

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For reflexes Hui casually swatted away two arrows fired at him from the Bow of Hercules point blank (about a foot away from him)

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In terms of speed and power arrows fired from the Bow of Hercules, one of them travelled from inside the stadium to Hui about a block outside it and through a truck with enough force to cause a large explosion on contact with the water which would require hypersonic or highly supersonic speed:

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Going back to the instance where Hui extended Yeoui in response to R's arrow (reposted here for connivence) it should be noted he was able to straight up react to the arrow in time, and that it was powerful enough to shatter Yeoui and destroy a city block.

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Gamora's quantifiable speed feats from what have been posted so far seem lacking in comparison. Not to mention Hui doesn't even need to be faster than his opponent. He's already easily outfought an opponent that was handily outspeeding him via skill.

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Hui should have a comfortable edge here by not even needing to have an actual advantage.

Skill:

Hui as with all characters from God of Highschool is an absurd Wuxia character when it comes to martial arts, performing feats that defy all logic using skill. Though he is not a practitioner of dozens of martial arts the styles that Hui does know are far more advanced than real ones or even those that exist in Marvel through the sheer superhuman insanity they make possible. Hui has three main martial styles he uses with skills copied from other characters used intermittently. His main styles:

  • Renewal Taekwondo (standard hand to hand)
  • Nabong Needle Ryu (acupuncture and pressure points)
  • Hallyang Style/Pumba Verses (Staff fighting)

Renewal Taekwondo

Re-Taekwondo was developed as an answer for Itf Taekwondo. Itf Taekwondo itself is an incredibly refined martial art which draws from Kung Fu and numerous other techniques picked out for their various strengths to achieve perfection. A skilled user can defeat 50 martial artists without any damage or difficulty.

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Re-Taekwondo is developed successfully as a counter and superior style to Itf.

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Mori (the original, before regaining memories and god powers) lived up to this by quite soundly defeating an Itf Taekwondo user who displayed the strength to cause large and powerful shockwaves that filled the ring and sliced outwards toward the arena (remember that neither Jin nor his opponent are superhuman in-universe and this is all a tier of stats achieved by skill).

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To confirm Hui has access to these skills and memories he's shown remembering Re-Taekwondo and performing one of the moves to escape Subject M's biomass.

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Re-Taekwondo is extremely potent to the point of being extremely superhuman. Taejin, Mori's teacher and the creator of the style is capable of kicking away island busting swords thrown at him from orbit by giant angels without effort:

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For confirmation of size they can be seen towering over mountains:

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Mori has never been compared to Taejin so I won't use scaling to claim he can replicate these feats. The point is to put into perspective the level of feats attainable in God of Highschool via skill, and Mori is a master of one of the most potent martial arts in the verse. I'm confident this is a more advanced style than anything Gamora has and Mori has feats of using it to its fullest which are already above Gamora's feats.

Nabong Needle Ryu

Bongchim Nah is needle-less acupuncture. Fitting in with the other martial arts in God of Highschool it allows extreme Wuxia-tier effects such as nullifying pain and healing injuries which Hui himself has shown. Here he heals Alex's injury swiftly and in mid-combat:

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For context, Alex had a hole in his chest which was reasonably held off by Bongchim Nah healing.

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Also Hui knows pressure points which shut off any feeling of pain letting him fight through damage being done to his body. By using this he's capable of using the most absurd of the techniques Nabong Needle allots: Jaebongchim/Limit Removers. These are pressure points which multiply the users stats at the cost of doing damage to their body which Hui can mitigate through pain killer. Pressure points which multiply strength is exactly the sort of absurd martial technique available in God of Highschool that puts into context that the characters are simply capable of achieving greater feats than those in fiction limited to the realm of logic like Marvel. Here Hui displays this in combat by repeatedly multiplying his stats while shutting off pain to overwhealm his opponents and beat down Dante (a healer) until he could heal no longer.

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Pumba Verses

Pumba Verses are a set of moves used for staff fighting which Hui uses when wielding Yeoui. For some explanation it's shown one factor of it is to make use of all the users muscles:

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Hui has shown knowledge of Pumba Verse 19: Dog Seller, a move which involves creating cyclone force by spinning the staff in one's hand which he uses effectively here:

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To demonstrate the physics bending absurdity this style can achieve Hallyang Seo (Hui's teacher) actually makes his staff bend around and smack Hui in the back of the head. Nothing suggests the staff had special capabilities or that this was achieved by anything other than god tier skill. Again not trying to scale Hui off him but show what level GoH martial arts can attain (although Hallyang has admitted he is incapable of beating Hui).

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Conclusion:

With the feats for Gamora that have been provided, I would have to conclude Hui has a very comfortable advantage over her. He has feats of strength, speed and durability outside of her range and can widen the gap with weapons. His DC and range achieved via Yeoui and Geundoowun would easily overpower Gamora.

Her skill feats at the moment consist of outfighting physical brutes and harming them with nerve strikes. Hui and Jin have feats of outfighting characters with their own high level of skill and achieving superhuman absurdity through martial arts. While harming Thing is a good feat for pressure points I would say Hui is on a higher level in that regard when can magically magnify his own physicals with pressure points.

Overall in this matchup Gamora would get easily overpowered in melee and have no skill advantage capable of making up for it and has to deal with the gap in harmability (armor suit vs flesh) and range/DC.

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#19 Edited by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: Sorry if my post is a bit long, I wanted to lay out all factors that will be discussed in the debate and also provide the context of the GoH verse.

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#20 Edited by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser said:

@themultiversity: Sorry if my post is a bit long, I wanted to lay out all factors that will be discussed in the debate and also provide the context of the GoH verse.

Nice post, it's going to take some time to respond to. Also don't worry about it.

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#21 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio
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#22 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio
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#23 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio
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#24 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio
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#25 Edited by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser: Sorry for the wait, but here it is.

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Strength:

Regarding raw lifting strength there's not very much material for Hui. Regardless he should have a comfortable advantage in this area just comparing the feats they do have. Specifically that he's shown able to lift his staff Yeoui even when it's expanded to large sizes (towering over buildings here):

I agree that in raw strength, Hui has Gamora beat. She isn't really a character who relies on raw physical strength anyways, it's always been between her skill and speed which has gotten her the win over many characters. Gamora is strong, but I don't think it's worth going into this because well, Hui is just much stronger. Gamora has done things like flip over tanks and such, but nothing that would lead me to believe she could pull off what Hui does.

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So he should easily have the advantage if they grapple.

It would be hard for me not to agree with this, however, judging by Gamora's fighting style and skill, I don't think she's necessarily going to try and grapple. I'm sure she'll see his overwhelming physicals pretty early on in the fight and will try to avoid anything of this sort.

Striking:

Regarding striking power which is the more relevant factor, he's shown to cause a large and destructive shockwave while striking Hercules.

This is impressive, but the thing is Gamora doesn't have these form of destructive feats. She more so has feats against established characters taking damage from her blows. I'm going to assume that this is going to be quite the difference between Hui and her feats. Not to say that she can't compete with him, you see, Gamora accomplishes her feat via strength and skill as she knows the right way to hit someone and where to hit them to cause more damage. This is precisely why she can deliver powerful blows on characters more stronger than herself.

He's also sent Sang Man Duk flying across water like a pebble causing a very large splash.

Gamora's blows have given Carol more damage than given credit for. Every blow she landed drew blood from her and caused her a good deal of harm, which is impressive given it wasn't the same vice versa when Carol hit Gamora. Take the final blow she gave Carol as an example.

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She's even been able to harm Classic Drax.

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This is just with his body. Using Yeoui he can strike hard enough to send John across the island they were fighting on sending him through solid ground in the process and destroying a building.

With Yeoui he does indeed strike harder than Gamora but without it, I think they are much closer. I think with her nerve striking, the striking difference isn't much of a problem.

Looking at Gamora's feats she does not seem capable of contending. Harming characters is nice but without harming them to a significant degree (and she did not do so there) it can't be quantified. Furthermore Hui has better striking and damage output feats I'll go into later that have him easily harming far more durable characters than Captain Marvel so Gamora's feat of only making her bleed slightly won't hold up

I'll await those because at the moment I think he only surpasses Gamora with Yeoui.

Durability:

Hui gains additional durability from his Armor Suit, but has very significant feats without it as well. First off he has shown very good piercing durability so Gamora using bladed weapons will be at a disadvantage. Here a large sword breaks on his back without causing any damage:

Yeah, I'll agree that Hui's amour suit provides him with quite the defense, however, I'm not sure this showing is enough to prove Gamora's weapon isn't enough to pierce him. For all we know the sword used against him here simply couldn't have been that sharp and just looked threatening due to it's size. Gamora's weapon has harmed class 100 beings like Sasquatch from Alpha Flight who was slashed across his back in Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 4. #17.

Also, it did appear to harm Jin as his HP went down and there was a small gash and blood left on his back. I think Gamora's weapon would do more harm if it pierces or slashes him.

Taking it a step higher he tanks an arrow to the chest that sends him flying through 4 buildings with enough force to make them collapse and appears unscathed. Again in base form with Armor Suit

That's quite a showing of durability, but Gamora has something comparable of her own. How about her falling from her spaceship while fighting Angela on to the moon with relatively little to no damage. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol.3 #5

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Gamora was able to take a beatdown from the Monster of Badoon for a day. Guardians of the galaxy Vol.3 #15-17.

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Hui has also been unharmed by direct contact with Subject M when he was melting into a biomass:

For reference Subject M's flesh was melting stone in this instance.

This is cool and all, but this just shows his body can resist that substance which is toxic or something of that sort. Not really showing he can Gamora's blows. It can melt stone, which is kind of low end, but how would it deal with blows from Gamora which can harm characters like Carol Danvers or She-Hulk? That's not even accounting the nerve striking in there.

Quantifiably speaking these feats look better than Gamora's which compose of tanking blasts and strikes of unidentified power. But more importantly when combined with Armor Suit Hui's durability will be too much for Gamora to cut with piercing weapons.

I think with the feats I presented now, Gamora's feats are better. The blasts were quantifiable because when Gamora deflected Monica's, it hit Sasquatch and hurt him which just goes to show what level of power she was intending to blast her with. Gamora tanked a blast after from Monica.

Speed

Ronan doesn't have speed feats to my knowledge. Hui has a similar feat of moving as a fast blur but it was performed in a more impressive manner, with him also leaping from building to building and crossing city blocks in a short frame of time.

Ronan isn't know for his speed, but I wouldn't say he's a completely slow character. He's done well against group of heroes, some who have notable speed feats that are impressive. I agree your feat is impressive, but it looks more like he's just traveling while Gamora was actually blitzing Ronan with her speed which shows she can do it within combat.

For reflexes Hui casually swatted away two arrows fired at him from the Bow of Hercules point blank (about a foot away from him)

This is a feat I think Gamora has easily out-done. During the Infinity War she was able to react to a stone thrown by Thanos with a good amount of force.

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Another feat to show Gamora can fight at incredible speeds, she was able to hold her own and combat Angela extremely well despite how fast Angela is. She was parrying her blows and keeping up with her without issue. Also, keep in mind that Gamora always carries really durable and sharp weapons which never really have difficulty piercing her opponents as shown when it pierces Angela. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol.3 #6.

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For an idea of how fast Angela is in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol.3 #10 when she was moving so fast in a fight with a large amount of Badoon's, they were all aiming/looking/firing at a spot they thought she was, but she had actually moved away long ago. She even states I wonder how long it will take them to know she moved.

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Not only that but she's been described as being faster than the speed of thought and lightning while she was blitzing the Disir in Angela - Asgard's Assassin #6.

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Gamora's quantifiable speed feats from what have been posted so far seem lacking in comparison. Not to mention Hui doesn't even need to be faster than his opponent. He's already easily outfought an opponent that was handily outspeeding him via skill.

Here's the difference though. That character he took down wasn't as skilled as Gamora is, so for him to use his skill to overcome the speed advantage won't be the best counter for someone who already has skill in spades.

Skill:

Re-Taekwondo was developed as an answer for Itf Taekwondo. Itf Taekwondo itself is an incredibly refined martial art which draws from Kung Fu and numerous other techniques picked out for their various strengths to achieve perfection. A skilled user can defeat 50 martial artists without any damage or difficulty.

This is a good start, but I don't think it's enough. Street levelers all the time go against many martial artists and over come them which is something Gamora can also do given she has fought and trained some of them in Marvel.

Mori (the original, before regaining memories and god powers) lived up to this by quite soundly defeating an Itf Taekwondo user who displayed the strength to cause large and powerful shockwaves that filled the ring and sliced outwards toward the arena (remember that neither Jin nor his opponent are superhuman in-universe and this is all a tier of stats achieved by skill).

I don't think gauging them having superhuman moves is fair to say it's from skill alone given it's seen in God Of Highschool characters are much stronger than your typical human in Marvel. It's just how they were written to be. Just because they have superhuman moves doesn't mean they are more skilled than others.

Re-Taekwondo is extremely potent to the point of being extremely superhuman. Taejin, Mori's teacher and the creator of the style is capable of kicking away island busting swords thrown at him from orbit by giant angels without effort:

Same as what I stated above.

Mori has never been compared to Taejin so I won't use scaling to claim he can replicate these feats. The point is to put into perspective the level of feats attainable in God of Highschool via skill, and Mori is a master of one of the most potent martial arts in the verse. I'm confident this is a more advanced style than anything Gamora has and Mori has feats of using it to its fullest which are already above Gamora's feats.

I disagree. Gamora is regarded as one the most adept fighters in the Marvel universe and yes that puts her up there with guys like Iron Fist and Logan. It's to the point characters actually go to her for training which doesn't come as a surprise given she's known throughout the galaxy. I feel like Mori is going to come off more skilled because he has techniques with names and his skill somehow gives him superhuman stats for above human expectations which doesn't necessarily make him more skilled than Gamora. Heck, as I showed she can use nerve strikes on characters far surpassing her strength level and it proves effective.

I'll present some showings that will show that she's much more skilled than given credit for. You presented a great example of Hui overcoming a character faster than him with his skill which is impressive, but Gamora has done the same against a character stronger and more durable than her. Let's take the Monsters of Badoon which are often used as punishment against Badoon enemies in gladiator matches. These Badoon in the past have been physically strong and durable enough to brawl with classic Thing who of course isn't as strong as he is today, but still quite a powerhouse. The Monster of Badoon was able to tank Thing's best blow and deliver one that one-shotted him. Marvel Two In One #4.

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In fact, in Silver Surfer Vol 1. #2, they were shown to be fast enough to surprise the Silver Surfer (Surfer remarks a microsecond slower and he would have been tagged) and strong enough to temporarily restrain him.

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Yet Gamora and Angela alone are capable of not only fighting them off but killing loads of them too. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol.3 #15-17. Keep in mind she's been fighting them for an entire day now.

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You may say you don't actually see her killing any here, well here is her doing so in Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol.3 #10.

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Really and truly I don't think it's even debatable if Gamora's weapon should be able to pierce Hui's skin now as I've shown it pretty much pierces everything it comes to whether it be street levelers to high tiers.

In Warlock & the Infinity Watch #17, Gamora was able to temporarily make a fool of Maxam. She's skilled enough to point out that his eyes narrow a fraction of a second before he throws a punch which shows she can adapt to people's skill and movement while fighting.

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Keep in mind that Maxam was capable of casually tossing Hercules into an ocean during the Infinity War as well as Drax in this issue. Even Moon Dragon states he has strength superior to that of the Hulk.

Conclusion

  • Gamora has striking force which is enough to harm Hui, which can do even more damage if she goes for nerve strikes.
  • She's durable enough to take his blows and fight on.
  • She's fast enough to keep up with Hui
  • I believe she's the more skilled fighter of the two.
  • Her weapon shouldn't have any issue in piercing his body.
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#26 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity:

This is a feat I think Gamora has easily out-done. During the Infinity War she was able to react to a stone thrown by Thanos with a good amount of force.

I was reading over your post and I think you meant to put something here?

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#27 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity:

This is a feat I think Gamora has easily out-done. During the Infinity War she was able to react to a stone thrown by Thanos with a good amount of force.

I was reading over your post and I think you meant to put something here?

Thanks, I guess the scan didn't get posted.

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#28 Edited by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: It seems I will have to go into Hui's best feats. Although I planned to save them for later it seems they're necessary to show the tier I'm arguing Hui at.

Round 2:

Hui after this post
Hui after this post

Strength:

Regarding lifting strength I'm glad we can come to a conclusion about how they compare. However lifting strength is actually a significant factor here given Hui can pin opponents down under Yeoui's weight:

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If Gamora isn't strong enough to lift Yeoui this would incapacitate and possibly crush her via weight very easily. Between this and lightning Hui has at least two tactics for stopping Gamora without ever getting into melee.

Striking:

This is impressive, but the thing is Gamora doesn't have these form of destructive feats. She more so has feats against established characters taking damage from her blows. I'm going to assume that this is going to be quite the difference between Hui and her feats. Not to say that she can't compete with him, you see, Gamora accomplishes her feat via strength and skill as she knows the right way to hit someone and where to hit them to cause more damage. This is precisely why she can deliver powerful blows on characters more stronger than herself.

The problem with this claim is that unlike some ranged martial arts moves in Hui's verse his attacks don't actually revolve around destructive force and AoE. He uses precise martial strikes same as Gamora. This been noted about Re-Taekwondo in-universe:

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His wording is a little vague because of translation but it's clarified range is what he's referring to when Mori learns to compensate with a ranged blow that attacks using air pressure:

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The point of this is that the nature of Hui's attacks is the same as with Gamora. From this you would have to conclude he causes more damage simply because his blows have excess power she lacks.

Gamora's blows have given Carol more damage than given credit for. Every blow she landed drew blood from her and caused her a good deal of harm, which is impressive given it wasn't the same vice versa when Carol hit Gamora. Take the final blow she gave Carol as an example.

A small bloody lip isn't indicative of much harm being done to Carol. Namor has done the same with Thanos, Wildcat with Modru, everyone and their mothers with Superboy Prime etc. It's negligible damage which means nothing in comics. Mori has better striking feats from a quantifiable perspective, even Chapter 2 Jin who Hui is far superior to could create a tornado with a martial kick:

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You would also have to prove Carol is of a durability tier where vastly greater hits than this wouldn't phase her to argue Gamora has the advantage here.

She's even been able to harm Classic Drax.

Drax in Infinity Watch had nerfed stats and a childlike persona.

With Yeoui he does indeed strike harder than Gamora but without it, I think they are much closer. I think with her nerve striking, the striking difference isn't much of a problem.

Hui's armor suit should stop nerve strikes by preventing Gamora from actually touching his flesh. Hui himself has noted the exact same issue while fighting Hercules:

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I'll await those because at the moment I think he only surpasses Gamora with Yeoui.

Firstly Hui has shown the stats to attack opponents from a distance simply by punching the air in front of him. I frankly struggle to imagine Gamora being written at a strength tier where she would be able to do this. Also note that this is a Re-Taekwondo move and those have been noted as lacking range, so Hui using it in this manner is especially impressive given it's likely not even made for this:

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That out of the way it seems I need to get into Hui's high end feats to put this debate into perspective. First off Hui can enhanced his strikes by wrapping his fist with Geundoowun and amplifying the force with lighting. He uses this to bludgeon the hell out of Mandeok Sang.

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Mandeok is a character with durability far above the characters you've used as a benchmark for Gamora's striking power. He tanked 567 amped nuclear missiles detonated by a meteor strike. As far as I'm concerned Carol, Sasquatch and Ben Grimm aren't even in this tier of durability. Gamora cannot contend with a hit like this and I daresay you haven't yet shown durability feats to suggest she could even tank it.

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Next I am going to expand upon the striking power of Yeoui, both to solidify it is out of the range of what Gamora can handle and because it explains one of Hui's other strength feats.

The attack tanked by Duk above also hit an angel summoned to the battle. The angel was in fact the target of the attack and it is somewhat implied all the nukes had to be amped and backed up by a meteor strike just to take it out. The angel actually survived the attack albeit damaged.

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Nephilim are much high tier angels. Hui's Yeoui is powerful enough to extend all the way to one off in orbit and both penetrate its chest and also expand once inside there (remember this). This happens to be a very good showing of lifting strength for Hui given he held his staff when it extended all the way to orbit with width comparable to a city (based on the size of the Nephilim's body when it falls to Earth and Yeoui being seen from Seoul). Note the expansion appears to cause a small Earthquake as well.

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You're going to need to show more from Gamora to suggest she won't be splattered by this level of force being applied to her. Yeoui extends to orbital heights instantly (before the Nephilim could even throw a sword he was about to fire) so Gamora will likely be unable to react to it let alone avoid it completely given its size and width. While striking power is a separate discussion, Hui's damage output blows her out of the water and should easily overwhelm her.

But this isn't why I brought up this feat. Let me elaborate first.

Hui shows a striking feat trading blows evenly with Hercules, each of them causing equivilent damage to each other:

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As far as striking feats for Hercules go, he was able to cause a large crater and send tremors throughout the city by slamming Hui. I do not believe Gamora is city-tier in strength by any stretch so this is a feat of fighting well out of her wheelhouse.

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A more important demonstration of strength here, Hercules was twice capable of stopping Yeoui's expansion with his grip strength. The same expansion which plowed right through the Nephilim's chest in exactly the same manner. This means Herculesgenerates more resistance than the nuke proof chest of a Nephilim with his fingers.

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This display is consistent with Hercules' capabilities throughout the fight. He replicated this showing in the context of a striking feat by swatting away Yeoui's expansion.

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Hui was a consistent stat match for this character. This is a striking showing allowing him to go into multi-city level slugfests. Even characters like Carol are not capable of this, you will have to do a lot more to prove Gamora can compete with or without Yeoui, considering it's been shown Hui's strikes even without Yeoui are on the same level as with it.

Durability:

In regards to the showings above there is a significant durability showing from that fight. Hui actually tanked with seemingly no damage Hercules' city level suplex:

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Considering Hercules is vastly above nuclear tier with his fingers I would say a named full body effort would carry quite a lot of force. But onto the piercing damage discussion:

Yeah, I'll agree that Hui's amour suit provides him with quite the defense, however, I'm not sure this showing is enough to prove Gamora's weapon isn't enough to pierce him. For all we know the sword used against him here simply couldn't have been that sharp and just looked threatening due to it's size. Gamora's weapon has harmed class 100 beings like Sasquatch from Alpha Flight who was slashed across his back in Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 4. #17.

The point of the feat wasn't the sword Hui tanked it was to show he had piercing durability to being with at a level where standard blades will break on him. I seriously doubt it was a below average weapon given John who was using it also had those suped-up bullets and a cloak that blocked Yeoui rag dolling him across the island. Hui is far more durable than bricks in Sasquatch's tier and I would need to see piercing durability feats from him.

Also, it did appear to harm Jin as his HP went down and there was a small gash and blood left on his back. I think Gamora's weapon would do more harm if it pierces or slashes him.

Hui had only recently recovered from injuries at the time and did not have his Armor Suit on. For the purposes of this battle that showing won't help.

That's quite a showing of durability, but Gamora has something comparable of her own. How about her falling from her spaceship while fighting Angela on to the moon with relatively little to no damage. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol.3 #5

I brought up the feat to showcase piercing durability. Regardless this is a good durability feat, however the Moon's gravity is very weak compared to Earth's. So to scale this with falling from heights on Earth they would have to be 1/6th as high up as they were there and I don't believe a fall from that height would have been able to collapse and break in half 4 large buildings like R's arrow.

Gamora was able to take a beatdown from the Monster of Badoon for a day. Guardians of the galaxy Vol.3 #15-17.

What strength feats do these Badoon have?

I think with the feats I presented now, Gamora's feats are better. The blasts were quantifiable because when Gamora deflected Monica's, it hit Sasquatch and hurt him which just goes to show what level of power she was intending to blast her with. Gamora tanked a blast after from Monica.

Gamora deflected the blast rather than tanking it and Hui is much more durable than Sasquatch. I don't see how Gamora had comparable durability with the limited feats presented. Hui tanked getting thrown out of the stadium by Rosinante (who was borrowing Hercules' power but hadn't become him yet) with enough force to send him flying through 6 solid pillars and outside the stadium walls, ricocheting for about a block at high speeds.

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Speed

Ronan isn't know for his speed, but I wouldn't say he's a completely slow character. He's done well against group of heroes, some who have notable speed feats that are impressive. I agree your feat is impressive, but it looks more like he's just traveling while Gamora was actually blitzing Ronan with her speed which shows she can do it within combat.

Fighting opponents with super speed without displaying similar speed to them is commonplace in comics, unless speed is being referenced from Ronan's opponents this is a non-feat. Ronan has even been unable to keep Medusa from disarming him in Secret Invasion: War of Kings.

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This is a feat I think Gamora has easily out-done. During the Infinity War she was able to react to a stone thrown by Thanos with a good amount of force.

Not very quantifiable, the stone itself didn't display notable speed there and Thanos clearly wasn't trying to kill her. Regardless Hui himself easily outdid his own feat by replicating it against Hercules who was wielding a more powerful version of that bow. Hui moves to block it with Yeoui but inches before it reaches Yeoui he realizes it will shatter the staff on contact and catches it from that uncomfortable position:

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When discussing arrows their destructive force relates to speed, so having sufficient speed to shatter Yeoui (supported by the statements of two characters) would be very impressive given it's durable enough to withstand going through the Nephilim's chest and for more of a high end feat block slashes from the sword of Tathagata which are country level with only a cut.

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This isn't the version of Hui being used here as he was amped by life energy, but that shouldn't affect Yeoui.

Another feat to show Gamora can fight at incredible speeds, she was able to hold her own and combat Angela extremely well despite how fast Angela is. She was parrying her blows and keeping up with her without issue. Also, keep in mind that Gamora always carries really durable and sharp weapons which never really have difficulty piercing her opponents as shown when it pierces Angela. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol.3 #6.

Now, I know for this debate you're using composite Gamora, so I won't try to lowball with Gamora with low showings from her current incarnation. But likewise you should understand being able to fight only on-par with Gamora in her modern post-Bendis depiction would actually be a low showing at this tier. This is the same Gamora that Winter Soldier kept up with fine in Original Sin #4, so her being able to match Angela isn't very telling of Angela's stats.

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What piercing durability showings does Angela have?

For an idea of how fast Angela is in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol.3 #10 when she was moving so fast in a fight with a large amount of Badoon's, they were all aiming/looking/firing at a spot they thought she was, but she had actually moved away long ago. She even states I wonder how long it will take them to know she moved.

Hui has performed this feat on a higher scale over a longer distance multiple times. When he was thrown out of the stadium he ran that distance back to the fight seemingly instantly. He did the same when R shot him across a city block and he ran back immediately.

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These feats are on a higher level than Angela given he crossed city blocks while she only crossed a large room. Also I must stress this is all done in Base Form which is seriously depowered compared to Monkey King mode.

Not only that but she's been described as being faster than the speed of thought and lightning while she was blitzing the Disir in Angela - Asgard's Assassin #6.

Hui's staff extends into orbit instantly and would be easily faster than this. Hercules reacted to Yeoui's expansion and Hui kept up with him fine.

Here's the difference though. That character he took down wasn't as skilled as Gamora is, so for him to use his skill to overcome the speed advantage won't be the best counter for someone who already has skill in spades.

The other difference is that Hui's movement and reflex speed outclass Gamora's and a tactic like this would only widen the gap. Regarding reflex speed even human Jin fought an opponent fast enough to make the air ignite with friction and reacted to that particular attack. Il-Pyo uses updrafts to make the air catch fire easier but it would still require speed to achieve initial ignition:

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Skill:

This is a good start, but I don't think it's enough. Street levelers all the time go against many martial artists and over come them which is something Gamora can also do given she has fought and trained some of them in Marvel.

Gamora has a significant physical advantage compared to most martial artists. Hui does too within his verse, but Jin didn't in Chapters 1 and 2 and Hui has all his skills and experiences. Not only that he learned to avoid reliance on stats.

Regardless the point is Hui has access to very good martial arts which apparently allot the ability of anyone possessing them to beat groups of martial artists at fodder levels. This is still an advantage when, from what you've presented, Gamora's training and fighting styles aren't nearly as fleshed out.

I don't think gauging them having superhuman moves is fair to say it's from skill alone given it's seen in God Of Highschool characters are much stronger than your typical human in Marvel. It's just how they were written to be. Just because they have superhuman moves doesn't mean they are more skilled than others.

The moves are no different from real martial moves for breaking bricks and such. They achieve results through timing, precision, speed, and occasionally air pressure. The difference in scale is a byproduct of the higher level people in God of Highschool can fight at. This is why you won't find any God of Highschool characters at this tier with particularly high lifting strength bar Borrowed Power users and Hui (who has amped stats compared to peak humans of his verse), they achieve feats through skill and most martial artists aren't weight lifting champions.

This isn't like Dragonball where the techniques simply amp the users stats removing skill from the question, with the exception of moves like limit remover (which are nothing but advanced pressure points and clearly a result of martial knowledge) none of these characters have enhanced stats nor do they enhance their own stats. Skill remains the factor in performing these feats on a higher level. It's not as if the average human in stronger than normal in the verse.

I disagree. Gamora is regarded as one the most adept fighters in the Marvel universe and yes that puts her up there with guys like Iron Fist and Logan. It's to the point characters actually go to her for training which doesn't come as a surprise given she's known throughout the galaxy. I feel like Mori is going to come off more skilled because he has techniques with names and his skill somehow gives him superhuman stats for above human expectations which doesn't necessarily make him more skilled than Gamora.

Mori is more skilled than Iron Fist and Wolverine. More to the point you're putting quite a bit of stock into Gamora's skills being the reason she can achieve her combat showings, which is a double standard when being critical of Hui for the same reason: they both have enhanced stats by the standards of Marvel characters. Especially when Gamora at one point failed to beat a moderately sized gang and this was the reason she was given cybernetic enhancements...

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I won't hold this too heavily against Gamora given she was an inexperienced teenager at the time. But it's clear Gamora's feats involve her stats too. Mori's fights show a lot more explicit skill. And no his skills don't give him superhuman stats except in the sense of speed and striking power (both which are dictated largely by skill).

Heck, as I showed she can use nerve strikes on characters far surpassing her strength level and it proves effective.

Effecting physically imposing characters is a good display of pressure points but I would say healing vital injuries and somehow magnifying physical stats with a tap to the head is more advanced. Bongchim Nah gives Hui a range of options in melee considering this is what opponents look like to Jin:

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I'll present some showings that will show that she's much more skilled than given credit for. You presented a great example of Hui overcoming a character faster than him with his skill which is impressive, but Gamora has done the same against a character stronger and more durable than her. Let's take the Monsters of Badoon which are often used as punishment against Badoon enemies in gladiator matches. These Badoon in the past have been physically strong and durable enough to brawl with classic Thing who of course isn't as strong as he is today, but still quite a powerhouse. The Monster of Badoon was able to tank Thing's best blow and deliver one that one-shotted him. Marvel Two In One #4.

This was in the original Guardians of the Galaxy's timeline not 616.

In fact, in Silver Surfer Vol 1. #2, they were shown to be fast enough to surprise the Silver Surfer (Surfer remarks a microsecond slower and he would have been tagged) and strong enough to temporarily restrain him.

This would be a legitimate feat. However Hui has shown feats far above the microsecond range enough to be unworried about this feat.

Yet Gamora and Angela alone are capable of not only fighting them off but killing loads of them too. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol.3 #15-17. Keep in mind she's been fighting them for an entire day now.

You may say you don't actually see her killing any here, well here is her doing so in Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol.3 #10.

Your own scans seem to undo this argument a bit. There's a clear difference between the Badoon we see Gamora kill and the ones she and Angela killed considering she had a lot of trouble with it and even failed to pierce it at the beginning. Also her dialogue suggests it's different. Furthermore she didn't exactly go untouched and didn't even land the first hit.

Really and truly I don't think it's even debatable if Gamora's weapon should be able to pierce Hui's skin now as I've shown it pretty much pierces everything it comes to whether it be street levelers to high tiers.

Based on piercing the Badoon? Not only is Hui far and away durable enough to replicate the alternate Badoon's showing but the 616 ones don't have piercing durability feats, or durability feats in general, that you've presented. When Subject M stole Hui's armor suit it was too durable for Mira and Kyoichi to cut more than shallowly.

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Mira is capable of splitting far away mountains and clouds simultaneously with a single slash via cutting power. Although she didn't use this particular move against Subject M it shows the level of stats and cutting power she's capable of. Also this was performed while Mira was suffering from the rebound caused by limit remover and is fighting unconsciously so extremely weakened:

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While Kyoichi is capable of slicing through laser blasts with enough force to push them in half, then cut through a building and cut a deep gash into the earth. For clarification he cut through a clone of Subject M there not the original.

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Also even if Gamora makes a similar gash that they did here she wouldn't be able to exploit it as the Armor Suit repairs itself:

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In Warlock & the Infinity Watch #17, Gamora was able to temporarily make a fool of Maxam. She's skilled enough to point out that his eyes narrow a fraction of a second before he throws a punch which shows she can adapt to people's skill and movement while fighting.

Keep in mind that Maxam was capable of casually tossing Hercules into an ocean during the Infinity War as well as Drax in this issue. Even Moon Dragon states he has strength superior to that of the Hulk.

Jin in Chapter 2 had a similar feat, performing a full kick on his opponent from a standing position before she can move or retaliate. The strike also serves to shake her brain with air pressure which would likely mess up Gamora if it happened to her. Although no "fraction of a second" time span was given here his opponent was a skilled martial artist within his universe so a degree of speed is expected. Not to mention Maxim actually tagged Gamora despite her being able to see through his moves.

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Regarding reading fight patterns and adapting Jin has done so in martial combat with an opponent equal to him in skill. This seems more relevant and combat applicable than doing so against a brute (Maxim). Warning: lots of scans here (I have to stack them because the order gets scrambled and they're too tall to read as thumbnails anyway).

At the start Il-Pyo is outfighting Mori and puts him at a severe disadvantage. He knows Re-Taekwondo's weaknesses and exploits the hell out of them.

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After this exchange Mori is able to effectively outfight Il-Pyo briefly and outmaneuver him enough to land a powerful attack (Truth Tornado). Of course Il-Pyo cuts the tornado in half because he's just that good.

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After Mori loses balance from the tornado clash Il-Pyo reverses the fight again and keeps beating on Mori while exploiting another weakness. Il-Pyo keeps outfighting him until Mori reveals he was building up for a more powerful move but Il-Pyo doesn't even give him that, revealing the final weakness of Re-Taekwondo and that this wasn't a fair fight to begin with and that his teammates had neutralized Mori's fighting style in advance.

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At this point the fight has become one-sided but Mori compensates with copied skills. Mori can copy moves after seeing them and uses them effectively here. Note one of them is an attack for cutting an opponent without a blade using precise air pressure which would be very difficult to replicate. Anyway Mori determines weaknesses in his opponents fighting style and figures out a way to soundly outfight him using it.

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By the end of this exchange Mori has learned Re-Taekwondo's weaknesses and developed ways to counter them. He uses this to push Il-Pyo enough that he resorts to ranged fire attacks.

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So Mori has shown skills that would be directly relevant to martial combat, analyzing fight patterns and finding a way out of a situation he was at a severe disadvantage. He also showed the ability to replicate moves and even follow every technique in one after seeing it once as Mira notes:

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As opposed to Gamora who has showings against bricks.

Now you can comment on physicals being a factor over skill, but in turn I have to ask what exactly you imagine fights on a higher level than this looking like. There's clearly a lot of stylistic and technical aspects to the fight factoring in, and use of skill and combat intelligence over stats to win. Asking for a display of say, beating large groups of opponents seems pointless when the level displayed here would be enough to easily do that, and asking for feats against superhumans seems equally unnecessary when Mori and Il-Pyo can actually use skills to achieve the same effects as those superhumans. You would have to conclude that the fight here is skilled based.

Versatility:

This is a wider point which seems to have been neglected. Hui has a lot more options than Gamora here. She is restricted to melee while he can hit her with lightning, Geundoowun and Yeoui. To elaborate Hui can just strike her at range with lightning which is what he did to Hercules while holding back. He only lets up to avoid damaging the audience.

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I should also repost my early scans with Geundoowun, where Hui uses it as well as Yeoui to handle a numbers disadvantage, trapping one opponent in it while he combats the other one.

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Geundoowun is strong enough to lift up the remains of a destroyer island so I don't believe Gamora will be able to break free of it:

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Aside from these two I believe I have shown enough examples of Yeoui being used as a ranged weapon or means to pin down the opponent. That makes three ways Hui can attack Gamora while not even getting close to her that she has no counter for. Even in melee Hui seems more versatile with the variety of techniques and copied skills he has, which I will go into later. Gamora is one-dimensional in comparison.

Conclusion

  • Hui outstrips Gamora heavily in strength, durability and striking power being multi-city level.
  • With Yeoui and lightning he dwarfs her in damage output.
  • Between durability and Armor Suit he will be extremely hard for Gamora to damage.
  • In terms of speed Jin and Hui have better travel/movement speed and also better reflexes and combat speed.
  • Hui's skill seems on a higher level and is definitely more proven in martial combat than Gamora's.
  • Hui has much better versatility with several ways to attack Gamora from range while she can only engage in one-dimensional melee. He has no reason to not be able to attack her from a distance without giving her a chance.
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#29 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio
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#30 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: So you're still interested in doing this? To be honest I wasn't sure if you would if Hui's feats were presented in full context and scale because I don't believe Gamora is on this level, but if you want to continue I'm down.

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#31 Edited by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: Wait shit, I just realized some of the images I uploaded are gone probably because I had to drag them around to get them in order...I'll try to fix this.

EDIT: Okay fixed, the feats should be clearer now and aren't missing scans.

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#32 Posted by TheMultiversity (1242 posts) - - Show Bio

@themultiversity: So you're still interested in doing this? To be honest I wasn't sure if you would if Hui's feats were presented in full context and scale because I don't believe Gamora is on this level, but if you want to continue I'm down.

Yeah, now that I think about it, I don't think I can overcome what Hui brings forth. It was a good debate while it lasted.

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#33 Posted by Sy8000 (35086 posts) - - Show Bio

@highaccuser said:

@themultiversity: So you're still interested in doing this? To be honest I wasn't sure if you would if Hui's feats were presented in full context and scale because I don't believe Gamora is on this level, but if you want to continue I'm down.

Yeah, now that I think about it, I don't think I can overcome what Hui brings forth. It was a good debate while it lasted.

Yeah, I understand. It's a shame and I did really like the debate but if you don't think Gamora can contend it's probably not best to continue.

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#34 Posted by Lvenger (36335 posts) - - Show Bio

I can't say I blame you for dropping it, Highaccuser is very formidable in using Jin and Hui in a debate. Did the same in your tourney after all.

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#35 Posted by dami24434 (4317 posts) - - Show Bio

you failed gamora dude.