Welcome to a battle of epic proportions! The courageous super soldier and honorable leader in Steve Rogers; the heart of the Avengers takes on the mute psychopath of constant bloodlust. An enraged masked killer derived from a crazed mother and teenage insolence, Jason Voorhees. The Friday the 13th antagonist faces off with the epitome of a true hero -- Captain America! May the most ruthless and conditioned be victorious.
Captain America
Rep. By Mr. Ingenuity
VS
Jason Voorhees
Rep. By Sawed_Off_It
Rules:
No Prep
Random Encounter
No Outside Assistance
Standard Gear
616 Captain America
Jason has access to all feats
Win by Death or K.O.
This is a CaV. Type "T4V" if you wish to be tagged at the end of the debate.
" There's a legend around here. A killer buried, but not dead. A curse on Crystal Lake, a death curse. Jason Voorhees' curse. They say he died as a boy, but he keeps coming back. Few have seen him and lived. Some have even tried to stop him... No one can. People forget he's down there, waiting..."
Mini-Bio
Jason Voorhees was a physically deformed child. His handicaps alienated him from other children, who tormented him both psychologically and physically. This alienation lead to him forming a special bond with his mother Pamela Voorhees, as when Jason was a child his father left in fear of his mother. After his father left his mother was his only true friend and caretaker.
Pamela wanted young Jason to have all of the fun and experiences the other children had, and wanted nothing more than for him to be happy. So one year she allowed little Jason to join a summer camp, at Camp Crystal Lake, Where she worked as the cook. However one fateful day, the two counselors on duty who were meant to be supervising the young campers, left their duties to have sex. While the counselors were having indulging their carnal desires, little Jason was chased down to the Lake by the other kids who threw him into the water. However, Jason didn't know how to swim, and without any adult supervision he drowned.
This was something which his mother could not forgive. Hearing the voice of her dead son, drove her to murderous madness. She went on to kill many camp counselors, in the name of her son who rested at the bottom of the Crystal Lake.
One fateful night however, a Camp Counselor by the name of Alice fought back, decapitating Pamela with her own machete. That night Jason witnessed his mother die, bringing life back into his cold rotting corpse, he would avenge his mother's death. Thus, Jason not only has suffered the abuse, ridicule and humiliation that others caused him throughout his whole childhood, also he suffered the murder of the only person who loved him: his mother. Because of this, Jason developed an animadversion so hellish that he killed, without any distinction (except children), all those who invaded his territory.
Stats!
Strength:
Capable of lifting a car with ease. I might also add that this is a car trying to escape, and Jason stops it like a mere leaf.
He can crush two human bodies with just a step.
He can easily shatter a human skull with just a punch, plus two crushed heads with ease.
Punching through a steel door with no effort
A ripped-off human body quickly followed by a completely crushed human skull.
With some punches, Jason is actually capable of harming his powered-up counterpart from the future, Uber-Jason, and you'll later see the true details of this feat, if you consider how tough Uber-Jason is.
Durability
Severed with the circular saw, then proceeds to fall 2 stories to the ground below. He then casually snaps his own neck back into place.
Stabbed multiple times in the heart.
Healing Factor
Skill:
He's incredibly skilled with arrows.
This is not easy to throw, and it's very hard to avoid.
Jason vs helicopter
Upgraded: Jason X
Uber-Jason:
Jason's genetically and technologically enhanced cyborg version is his upgraded form after being blown and vaporized into bits. An army of healing nanobots increase his powers, healing factor included, by a large margin. Well, you can't really unmake Jason awesome. He was born awesome and he'll stay awesome for the rest of his immortality.
Strength: Jason X
Tossing a human head
Jason's most insane strength feat yet, throwing an Oakwood Tree. A huge one, that is....... A Tree
Durability: Jason X
High voltage, barely a scratch.
He survives re-entry into Earth-II's atmosphere. Again, without a scratch.
Healing Factor:
More impressive feats:
-Stated to have been executed in every way known to man. He survived all executions.
-He has a supernatural connection with the Necronomicon, which is the only given reason to explain his immortality and regeneration powers.
-It's easy to spot, if you watch all the movies consecutively, Jason becomes stronger every time he recovers from any minor or major wounds. He might be a 10 or 15 tonner at this point.
-He's fought Freddy Krueger in his own dimension where he stands as a complete God, yet he was still giving Freddy a good fight.
-After being so much time in the woods, Jason has learned how to protect himself from any animal or person with any weapon, and he has quite the arsenal on Crystal Lake.
-He can fight against two separate prepared military teams with advanced weaponry, and destroy them all with little difficulty.
(There is so much more but I'll save it for now)
Plan/Attack - Considerations
Your character's speed is what will keep him in this fight the longest
However Jason has MKX feats as well. So his speed isn't anything to scoff about. He's able to keep up with fighters like Scorpion, Sub Zero, Johnny Cage and well...anyone.
His ability to teleport will come in very handy here as well as though we begin the fight face to face, I will have Jason teleport (MKX and evident is certain films) into one of the surrounding buildings and stalk you anticipating the correct to attack.
Captain America is respectfully strong and obviously more skilled than the Crystal Lake Legend. However, the reason Jason wins - No Morals, A Deadpool level healing factor, more than enough durability to withstand what you can dish out, and teleportation that can give him an opening for a crucial blow.
Also his strength surpasses your own by a decent margin from what I do know.
This is only to get an understanding of Steve's baseline stats. Considering that Steve routinely displays feats that go beyond the stats listed.
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Strength/Striking power
While the Handbook has Steve listed as 800 lb peakhuman, Steve is capable of lifting a long ton as regular exercise.
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Lifts a steel beam larger than himself after the building comes down.
Gallery
Lifts a car off of himself.
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After Vision disabled Iron-Man's armor Steve was able to crack the face plate with one blow. Then after three more bashes with the shield break it.
Gallery
One shots the Ameridroid
Gallery
Cuts off the turret of a tank with a shield throw.
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Speed/Perception/Agility
Steve most famously stated he bullet times by seeing faster.
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Steve can sense shifts in the air to react to stealth attacks.
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Bullet times while not even looking.
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Moves faster than sight to stop a speeding out of control van. Then goes on to get children clear, catch a little boy and a pie.
Gallery
While in free fall Steve is fast and agile enough to take out Biotrons.
Gallery
Durability/Endurance
Trades blows with Hydra Cap (his evil self) who's further enhanced with armor.
Gallery
Quickly recovers from being tossed and punched by the Ameridroid.
Gallery
Takes a beating from the Red Skull and has a building collapsed on him.
Gallery
Surprisingly suffers no broken bones.
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Opening Strategy
Steve evidently pulls his punches back as to not cause any life threatening injuries. Which is why it's important to note Steve won't be doing so here. I think it's reasonable to assume one hit alone would alert Steve to the caliber of his opponent. However if Jason looks anything like Jason X version it wouldn't even take that. And when Steve fights characters that are superhumanly durable him he doesn't restrain himself. Such as when he fought John Walker (AKA Super Patriot, AKA US Agent). In Steve's first fight with John he makes note of using the edge of his shield, a risk he wouldn't ordinarily take.
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So between Steve's speed & his shield he'll be harder to hurt than Jason. As you've shown Jason was killed by his Jason X counterpart when his head was cut off. So if that's what it takes to put Jason down Steve will do it. Take Steve killing nazi vampires as an example when they refused to surrender. The circumstances are quite different here, since in that story he was convincing the nazi vampires they don't have to be monsters even as vampires (weird story). In this fight the winning conditions are KO or death and given Steve's feats of striking power he can hammer away at Jason an ultimately win.
I apologize for the time it took to get this post up but thank you for being so patient. I should get the next post up soon after yours. Again, thanks for being understanding. Let me dive into it. I'm one of the few people on here who is not well versed in Marvel comics so I'm learning more about Rogers as I go, so I look forward to your response.
Good Luck
Loading Video...
Why Jason, though usually a universal idea, isn't as slow as you believe him to be here
(You didn't give me too much to respond to, so I'm going to be stating reason as to, "how" and "why" Jason will be victorious here. The rebuttle/counter portion will come later. You'll likely have a bit of things you'll need to counter when I post this. So the debate segment will probably be a lot more intense in the following posts.)
I'm given access to all feats as it pertains to Jason here. If i wasn't it wouldn't be fair. He has no weaknesses but he does lack in combat applicable areas. I take the good with the not so good when using composite versions but that doesn't hinder my belief in Jason coming out victorious, at all. I'm fighting Captain America with an adamantium shield, it was necessary. Because of that, allow me to share with you his combat speed via his Mortal Kombat inclusion:
Here this shows Liu Kang skipping across a falling pile of rubble while evading the blade fan from one of Shao Kahn's top assassins in Kitana. He perform all of this, the avoidance of the projectile and the skipping across of the falling stone column before propelling himself towards Kitana with one arm. At a speed that she can't react to. I could easily just show you a regular Mortal Kombat fight between Liu Kang and Jason, which in itself boosts Jasons' speed to a respectable degree, but I will share this cut-scene. Which is far more evident to Jasons' capabilities.
So while I won't claim that Liu Kang is a bullet dodger, his speed is still respectable in terms of H2H fighting. I would put combat speed of both him and Rogers on a near level.
In the next clip I share, we see Jason confront Liu Kang (who is aware of what Jason is capable of) and promptly dispose of him in a rather gruesome fashion. Showing his ability to keep up with Mortal Kombat characters to the point of strangling one of the better ninjas with his own intestines.
My point of this section is to not imply that my character is faster than yours, but to clear up misconception that you or others may have in regards to his combat speed and ability to contend with fighters capable of decent speed.
Jason also has access to a moveset throughout the Mortal Kombat games that see him utilizing teleportation during fight. This idea isn't without merit; since it is a combat saved technique, it's also part of his killing strategy, as viewed here:
Jason tele-porting on film. Essentially, I'm just showing that teleportation will be a factor here, and I'm detailing why he isn't a awkwardly postured and painfully slow brute in this fight. That was just regular Jason Voorhees. Here, he is most certainly going to be alot more impressive via sheer strength and durability that Jason X comes ingrained with.
Jason landing a strike at all is harmful, for even Captain America
How do you think Captain America will fare when taking a strike from Jason?
I think it's reasonable to assume one hit alone would alert Steve to the caliber of his opponent. However if Jason looks anything like Jason X version it wouldn't even take that.
I'd wager that a single hit would not only alert Captain America to the danger he is in, but hinder, if not ruin his ability to counter or defend himself efficiently. Surviving a building collapsing on him is impressive but isn't anything that necessarily prepares him for a fight where his opponent only aims for kill, kill, kill with his attacks. A focused offense on a particular and most likely vital area of the body from an assailant such as Voorhees, doesn't bode well if exactly what he's facing. A teleporting revenant of bloodlust capable of casually ripping through and punching holes in human bodies:
(You will notice that some of these scans play on Jason's tendency to use borrow from the environment around him when in confrontation. Something I find very useful here..)
Rips a woman in 2 and crushes a man's skull with his hands.Rips a children's duck ride from the ground an impales a helicopter pilot from ground level. Showing immense strength and terrific aim (his ability to use anything in his surroundings as a weapon could be an issue here.One swing from his machete slashes through 2 people and a tree.Same as above, but this time uses a clipboard for decapitation.The strength and speed that Voorhees must be attacking with here, must be immense in order to shred a man into tenderloin like sections using a shopping cart.
>>>
As seen above, any piece of random equipment can be lethal in the hands of Jason. Whether it's a machete, shopping cart or a clip board it completely and utterly destroys their body.
Power of his Machete -
Also, here, his machete is plunged through a thick steel chryo chamber door and penetrate a human other side. He's also quite the Marksman with his machete:
Throws his machete in order to dislodge a helicopter stuck there. Intending for it to lose its balance and kill the woman. He does it perfectly. 0This also doubles as an intelligence and improvisational moment for the masked killer.
To the above scan, there are many places in our battlefield that would allow Jason a route of unique offense.
Let Me Get to the Point of sharing these.
Point is, Rogers isn't going to just be hit once and stagger before continuing this fight. Any hit that Voorhees attempts will be geared to either horrendously maim and/or kill outright.And though Rogers is physically enhanced, his piercing resistance shouldn't be above the damage that his machete consistently displays throughout films, comics and games.
No these were not Captain America level of physicals that he was bulldozing through but the feats shared thus far, share his unbelievable strength (in just his normal state) to make victim's nearly unrecognizable after their brief altercations with him. This afford me the right to say that Jason holds the advantage in both Durability and Strength over Rogers. While Rogers is still very impressive in that respect, the only thing I see him holding a stat advantage in is skill and a bit more speed. However, Rogers can't expect Voorhees to teleport mid-combat nor could he know that he possesses such an ability.
Main Reason I win this Battle
Rogers will not be a cake walk; his skill will help him outmaneuver Jason's swings. But to pretend that Jason is going to just stand there and allow him to hit or cut him with his shield is faulty. He has more than enough combat related speed to stop a shield thrust, which would be very bad for Rogers.
When Jason lands a hit, it isn't going to simply hurt him, it's more than likely going to be to a devastating degree.
However if Jason looks anything like Jason X version it wouldn't even take that. And when Steve fights characters that are superhumanly durable him he doesn't restrain himself. Such as when he fought John Walker (AKA Super Patriot, AKA US Agent). In Steve's first fight with John he makes note of using the edge of his shield, a risk he wouldn't ordinarily take.
You're right. He does mention quite a few things there. I have to say though,he seems rather knowledgeable on who he is facing, even if it is their first fight. If he isn't, then he is at least aware that there isn't anything significant his opponent has to offer that would affect the outcome of the fight. Here, there is though.
Yes, Jason X, that's obviously the one that would be used here, is an automatic sign of death and even to those who don't know him, he'd appear as a threat regardless. So there is no argument for me to make that Steve would hold back when confronted by the Crystal Lake undead.
What Rogers does not know however, is that:
1.
All of the feats in the post you see above, are all done by an inferior version of Voorhees. They're all done by a Jason that got manhandled and destroyed by his upgraded counterpart.
There's many other reasons to prove why Jason X out performs Jason by a vast degree, but I'll save those for later. He simply removes his head here. The fight was never really a "fight".
2. Teleportation
This is not something Rogers can possibly be prepared for or have any knowledge of. I mean, in his own universe he may (I'm not an expert on him) but that isn't my point. He can't come into this fight expecting something like that to be a factor.
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Bullet Point Closing
Jason can teleport or move out of the way of a shied throw
He can deflect a shield coming at him.
Rogers skill and edge in speed will keep him surviving for a bit I doubt he hits harder than Jason. And if he does, it isn't by a large degree. Jason X however, easily overpowers Jason and outclasses them both in strength and speed by an insurmountable margin.
From right to left, Jason X destroys a group of them rather easily. Another showing of his superiority to base Jason, who would be a great challenge for Rogers by himself.
Back to bullet points:
Teleportation is a huge benefit here. Both unexpected and difficult to deal with, especially when it is afforded to a monster like Jason.
The environment lends itself to Jason more so than it does Rogers.
Jason has to contend with a a highly skilled character with an adamantium shield. Rogers has to contend with Strength. Durability, No remorse/will kill immediately, a bladed weapon that has shown itself to be potentially as fatal as the shield when wielded by Jason.
Jason is granted a lot more grounded and combat speed in this contest. He competed in Mortal Kombat and strangled Liu Kang to death. It makes an already favorable match-up imo, even more so now.
Here this shows Liu Kang skipping across a falling pile of rubble while evading the blade fan from one of Shao Kahn's top assassins in Kitana. He perform all of this, the avoidance of the projectile and the skipping across of the falling stone column before propelling himself towards Kitana with one arm. At a speed that she can't react to. I could easily just show you a regular Mortal Kombat fight between Liu Kang and Jason, which in itself boosts Jasons' speed to a respectable degree, but I will share this cut-scene. Which is far more evident to Jasons' capabilities.
So while I won't claim that Liu Kang is a bullet dodger, his speed is still respectable in terms of H2H fighting. I would put combat speed of both him and Rogers on a near level.
In the next clip I share, we see Jason confront Liu Kang (who is aware of what Jason is capable of) and promptly dispose of him in a rather gruesome fashion. Showing his ability to keep up with Mortal Kombat characters to the point of strangling one of the better ninjas with his own intestines.
That's a good feat for Liu Kang but when you compare him to Steve the feat becomes subpar. Also since that's the only feat you thought to compare Jason vs Liu Kang you really haven't made your case for Jason dealing with Steve advantage in speed.
Since you're scaling Jason directly from Liu Kang's speed there is no way to avoid Liu Kang's speed vs Steve's speed. With that in mind I might as well display his feats here.
Let's start with how Steve is portrayed to fodder in combat.
Steve crosses a room an knocks out three terrorist in 3.7 seconds.
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Steve's display here is even better since he bursts through a window knocks out three thugs with a shield swipe & the reaming two with a shield throw all in 4 seconds flat.
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This is all pretty consistent with Steve in later years when it comes to blitzing fodder.
Gallery
But wait there's more Steve has even been displayed as faster and more agile in combat to other enhanced humans in speed. Such as John Walker who's a high end aim dodger.
Gallery
Steve vs John
Gallery
But here is the outstanding part of it all. Steve had a five page fight with Spider-Man and only 10 seconds passed. This scan is only to note that in a fight Steve actually uses his speed in combat.
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My point of this section is to not imply that my character is faster than yours, but to clear up misconception that you or others may have in regards to his combat speed and ability to contend with fighters capable of decent speed.
But Steve isn't a fighter capable of decent speed, Steve's speed is out standing.
Jason also has access to a moveset throughout the Mortal Kombat games that see him utilizing teleportation during fight. This idea isn't without merit; since it is a combat saved technique, it's also part of his killing strategy, as viewed here
That teleporting is so slow that it would only be useful to close distances.
Jason tele-porting on film. Essentially, I'm just showing that teleportation will be a factor here, and I'm detailing why he isn't a awkwardly postured and painfully slow brute in this fight. That was just regular Jason Voorhees. Here, he is most certainly going to be alot more impressive via sheer strength and durability that Jason X comes ingrained with.
This doesn't seem like teleporting he just seem to be moving faster than sight comic character do it all the time.
Gallery
While painfully slow seems excessive there is no denying the speed advantage that jason has no way to overcome.
How do you think Captain America will fare when taking a strike from Jason?
I've shown Steve recover after being hit by superhumans that are stronger than Jason in strength. But the only reason Steve took these hit is due to his opponents being just as fast and sometimes even faster.
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Gallery
I'd wager that a single hit would not only alert Captain America to the danger he is in, but hinder, if not ruin his ability to counter or defend himself efficiently.
I think you misunderstood, my statement was in reference to the scan above it where Steve knew how hard he could it John Walker. In that fight he has foreknowledge but in this one Steve would gather that info from Jason's look or having tagged him once.
Surviving a building collapsing on him is impressive but isn't anything that necessarily prepares him for a fight where his opponent only aims for kill, kill, kill with his attacks. A focused offense on a particular and most likely vital area of the body from an assailant such as Voorhees, doesn't bode well if exactly what he's facing. A teleporting revenant of bloodlust capable of casually ripping through and punching holes in human bodies:
Jason aiming for a killing blow doesn't change anything, Steve still has the speed advantage and is infinitely more skilled.
Steve has rolled with a hit while being caught by surprise from a teleporting Nighthawk.
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Steve has gotten out of a hold from Eros, due to skill even with Eros strength being at least 50x greater.
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Power of his Machete -
Also, here, his machete is plunged through a thick steel chryo chamber door and penetrate a human other side. He's also quite the Marksman with his machete:
I don't think the machete will be in play for more than one exchange. It will either be dropped by Jason when Steve goes to disarm him or more likely shattered against the shield. Once it's gone there Jason only option would be to leave the fight an enter one of the buildings. Which doesn seem to be in Jason's character.
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Let Me Get to the Point of sharing these.
Point is, Rogers isn't going to just be hit once and stagger before continuing this fight. Any hit that Voorhees attempts will be geared to either horrendously maim and/or kill outright.And though Rogers is physically enhanced, his piercing resistance shouldn't be above the damage that his machete consistently displays throughout films, comics and games.
No hit from Jason would harm/maim Steve to the extent Steele or Ameridroid has. Steve has recovered from their hits quick enough to dodge the next one or create some distance. Given the fact that Steve is faster and more skilled he'll won't be forced to take a full blow. But that's all assuming Jason can get around the shield.
You think Steve wouldn't first disarm his opponent or atleast render the weapon ineffective?
No these were not Captain America level of physicals that he was bulldozing through but the feats shared thus far, share his unbelievable strength (in just his normal state) to make victim's nearly unrecognizable after their brief altercations with him. This afford me the right to say that Jason holds the advantage in both Durability and Strength over Rogers. While Rogers is still very impressive in that respect, the only thing I see him holding a stat advantage in is skill and a bit more speed. However, Rogers can't expect Voorhees to teleport mid-combat nor could he know that he possesses such an ability.
The only thing worth addressing here is teleportation. Which seems to be more complex tactic then Jason has shown the understanding to use properly. He's only shown to use it to cross distances and get behind opponents. That's the same even if you want to include the film. There is really no argument that Jason will spam it in a fight other than it will give him a better chance here since he's still physically slower than Steve. But the teleport itself is slow, which game mechanics can't be argued against since you've only showed it in game.
Rogers will not be a cake walk; his skill will help him outmaneuver Jason's swings. But to pretend that Jason is going to just stand there and allow him to hit or cut him with his shield is faulty. He has more than enough combat related speed to stop a shield thrust, which would be very bad for Rogers.
I don't think I've argued jason would Stand there and be dismantled. However comparing their speed in combat Steve has the ability to land an block more hits and being without a healing factor means he has more incentive to do both. But let's not act as if Jason is going to be Nightcrawler with teleportation or ignore that fact he'll tank more hit than he'll even attempt to dodge.
But here is the outstanding part of it all. Steve had a five page fight with Spider-Man and only 10 seconds passed. This scan is only to note that in a fight Steve actually uses his speed in combat
I don't believe that I ever said he didn't. I do believe that is based on, yes, his impressive combat speed, but also previous knowledge of who Spiderman is and how he fights himself.
But Steve isn't a fighter capable of decent speed, Steve's speed is out standing
I'll get to why the MK universe as a whole should be at least outstanding, at least in terms of street level characters, later. But I agree. Rogers does have great speed. Just nothing, that due to Mortal Kombat feats applied to my version of Jason, can't properly react to and contend with.
That teleporting is so slow that it would only be useful to close distances.
And where do you think this fight is going to take place? A mile away? we are both using physical brute force style characters. Your guy uses a shield to attack. It's going to be up close combat.
This doesn't seem like teleporting he just seem to be moving faster than sight comic character do it all the time.
It's teleporting... But whether you view it as such, or whether you view it as FTE, either helps my case. Look Below for further clarification.
I've shown Steve recover after being hit by superhumans that are stronger than Jason in strength. But the only reason Steve took these hit is due to his opponents being just as fast and sometimes even faster.
There's no way that mass of being was moving extremely fast.
Also, in that same scan, Rogers explains that he isn't used to competing with those with similar speed. Unfortunately for you, most of the Mortal Kombat universe is casually at his speed or surpassed it. That makes Jason, quite simply a less than desirable opponent.
None of the people you've shown are hardly stronger than even base Jason Voorhees, let alone the uber enhanced version that annihilates the very Jason that we are mainly discussing during this CaV.
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Also, how does that scan prove that this guy is stronger? He dented a car with a shield. Not by his own strength. Not implying he couldn't because I'm not even sure who that is, but burying the edge of a huge shield into the weakest cavity of a car, the roof, is cool to see but not that impressive at all.
Jason Voorhees can smash the hood of a car into itself and collapse it completely into the ground below. Completely destroying the inner mechanics/engine in the process. I mean, his whole body is where the rest of the car used to be...
With his own fists and pure physicals. No weapons or tools used here. This is so much more impressive than what you shared, it isn't even close.
That's a good feat for Liu Kang but when you compare him to Steve the feat becomes subpar. Also since that's the only feat you thought to compare Jason vs Liu Kang you really haven't made your case for Jason dealing with Steve advantage in speed.
Since you're scaling Jason directly from Liu Kang's speed there is no way to avoid Liu Kang's speed vs Steve's speed. With that in mind I might as well display his feats here
Yes. I directly scaled him from Liu Kang because that is who he was directly pitted against, in - game, and who he disemboweled in confrontation. What I didn't share with you is the fact that all MK characters are capable of reacting and combating each other's speed. It's the universe and it is the only way such a tournament would work. Their physicals are very close in terms of capability, but with that, the understanding that they are enhanced humans with super powers, to say the least, has to follow.
For instance. there are a few characters such as Reptile, Kabal, and even Liu Kang (described as a "whirl of motion" and "blurry" with his strikes), whose speed during combat is a bright spot and vital reason as to why they are so formidable. No, they aren't massively faster than anyone else in their verse, but it's widely accepted that there are a few characters whose move sets are built around being fast. Their speed is consistently shown to be one of their best attributes. And this is just warriors that do possess impressive speed.
Others like Quan Chi are shown using magic as his craft. Barriers, hypnotic spells, and portals -- speed is not something you couple with Quan Chi when describing him as a fighter.
Keep in mind that this is just the casual speed of most, if not all, Mortal Kombat characters.
I think you misunderstood, my statement was in reference to the scan above it where Steve knew how hard he could it John Walker. In that fight he has foreknowledge but in this one Steve would gather that info from Jason's look or having tagged him once.
Steve Rogers is a tactical expert when it comes to fighting. He will have an idea that Jason is an oddity due to his appearance but that is about it. I'm certainly not implying that he would make a rookie mistake right off the bat, but to imply that he would know exactly what to do when confronted by Jason, just solely on appearance, is ill advised.
If he gets tagged once, it's not going to be with Jasons' fists, which, even if it was, I have already proved above that it would be significantly more devastating than than that backhand he endured from that one guy. His fists can demolish the entire front end and inner workings of a car.
His teeth would be knocked out and his jaw torn open if Jason tagged him with a focused strike on a very specific area of the body.
That single tag that you are referring to would be with a very heavy duty machete that has proven its worth; from slicing cleanly through human bodies and trees at once, to penetrating a steel chryo chamber door and impaling a victim on the other side.
You still have yet to show me any piercing resistance from Rogers. How would he follow up when he gets sliced deeply, or stabbed by a machete during conflict?
Jason has plenty of it and I have an abundance of scans and scenes to prove that. I've also proven that though Jason does not naturally move as fast and swiftly as Rogers, but reacting to Captain America won't be an issue. When the majority of the entire Mortal Kombat universe are at least bullet timers - I'd argue even bullet dodgers - I can make that claim and be 100% confident in it.
Me being afforded MK feats for Jason = Reacting to your character will not be nearly as difficult as you think it would be. Even without teleportation.
I don't think I've argued jason would Stand there and be dismantled. However comparing their speed in combat Steve has the ability to land an block more hits and being without a healing factor means he has more incentive to do both. But let's not act as if Jason is going to be Nightcrawler with teleportation or ignore that fact he'll tank more hit than he'll even attempt to dodge
I am not saying Jason is going to be performing acrobatics along with Steve as the fight progresses. I'm saying that reacting to his blows is not a tall task, as you seem to be painting that image. And Jason isn't going to be NIghtcrawler with his teleportation.
He just needs to do it once. Rogers has zero prior knowledge on Jason being able to do that. Voorhees using that in mid combat would be a completely unexpected change in a challenger. Not a normal circumstance for even the experience Rogers.
An undead powerhouse capable of teleportation and a genuine Deadpool level healing factor, Rogers can fight, but in this fight, he won't know what happened before it happens.
But now for my Main Points.
Your Speed
The Mortal Kombat feats allowed for Jason, amp his own speed and reaction time to ridiculous levels compared to what he was once was. He can keep up with Rogers just fine but reacting to him will be no issue at all.
Your shield is your saving grace
It's the only reason you don't die as quickly as you otherwise would.
As long as you have your shield up, it's not going to be until Jason either:
A) rips it from your hands and tosses it from you, that he inevitably kills Rogers
OR
B) he utilizes teleportation, just once, and stabs you from behind or removes your head. Not even your head. If he just removed a single limb (which with his strength would be remarkably easy - even against someone like Rogers) or shattered your bones, it isn't going to last long.
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But since you said this:
That teleporting is so slow that it would only be useful to close distances.
It makes me feel like you have a plan to throw your shield at me while doing acrobatics and performing evasive techniques in the background, which while smart, is just prolonging the inevitable.
Teleportation
Teleportation is alot more of a deal than you are making it out to be.
You have no prior knowledge of who Jason is or what he can do. Like wise, I don't possess any information on my opponent either. Problem is, my opponent is a skilled fighter with a shield, your opponent is someone who can survive Earth Re- Entry and arise from the fall, unscathed:
Gallery
If I am on the receiving end of your shield assaults, I'm confident I can tank them and your blunt force for a time, and keep going until you cease squirming away.
You also do not know that teleportation is part of Jason's power set. You aren't prepared for it at all. I'll just need to do it once to have an opening. Even base Jason possesses superior strength and an unbelievable healing ability that you can't plan on the fly for.
Jason X
You aren't dealing with just regular Jason. The guy that I've easily made a case for, and a horror icon whose Mortal Kombat feats make him more than a challenge for Rogers. You're facing the guy who absolutely maimed and causally erased that Jason from existence, then, literally ripped his brain from his head and put it in his own.
Everything I've shared thus far:
Strength
Durability
Healing Factor
All of these are so incredibly enhanced with Jason X, that I want to say a punch from Rogers would mildly annoy him. A shield thrust from Rogers may make him stumble back a bit.
Rogers being an up close fighter also doesn't help your case. You're going to have to get up close to defeat Jason X. That, combined with a healing factor that damn near rivals Deadpool's, far superior strength and durability, and access to teleportation will be what cripple Steve.
He will certainly put up a pesky fight, but with everything Jason has been through, like taring through the entire tournament of warriors in Mortal Kombat, to then facing Liu Kang down and beating him silly to continue his lust/affliction for killing, make him the superior character here in everything but skill. Of which is a category that Jason can over come given everything else he has at his disposal.
I don't believe that I ever said he didn't. I do believe that is based on, yes, his impressive combat speed, but also previous knowledge of who Spiderman is and how he fights himself.
I'm making it clear that Steve consistent combat speed, in conjunction with his skill. Because Jason hasn't faced any opponent with this level of skill. Which makes tagging him without surprising him doubtful at best.
That scan wasn't to highlight success in fighting Spider-Man, but to show consistently of Steve whether it's humans or superhumans.
I'll get to why the MK universe as a whole should be at least outstanding, at least in terms of street level characters, later. But I agree. Rogers does have great speed. Just nothing, that due to Mortal Kombat feats applied to my version of Jason, can't properly react to and contend with.
You've only shown Jason vs Liu Kang and neither of those characters have done anything impressive. So unless you plan on doing some pyramid scaling with Jason, his only option is to brute force this fight.
And where do you think this fight is going to take place? A mile away? we are both using physical brute force style characters. Your guy uses a shield to attack. It's going to be up close combat.
You are using slow teleportation as a means to catch Steve off guard. I'm pointing out due to it being slow it's rather useless, unless it's only to close the gap.
It's teleporting... But whether you view it as such, or whether you view it as FTE, either helps my case. Look Below for further clarification.
Not sure why unless you're going to argue faster than sight makes characters supersonic in speed.
There's no way that mass of being was moving extremely fast.
Also, in that same scan, Rogers explains that he isn't used to competing with those with similar speed. Unfortunately for you, most of the Mortal Kombat universe is casually at his speed or surpassed it. That makes Jason, quite simply a less than desirable opponent.
None of the people you've shown are hardly stronger than even base Jason Voorhees, let alone the uber enhanced version that annihilates the very Jason that we are mainly discussing during this CaV.
I think you're down playing that speed that has proven to be faster than Steve. You really can't refute on panel by stating you don't agree.
Now you're just making stuff, surpassing Steve in combat speed. You haven't even shown Jason combating a bullet timer, and from what I gather bullet timing is the best reaction feats in the vsers. Steve on the other hand sees bullets in flight (supersonic perception tracking small objects). Not only can he track them but in burst of speed Steve can intercept them.
Dives and saves Tony from machine gun spray.
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Crosses a room to intercept handgun shots.
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None of the people you've shown are hardly stronger than even base Jason Voorhees, let alone the uber enhanced version that annihilates the very Jason that we are mainly discussing during this CaV.
Steele is undeniably stronger than Jason he has bent a tank barrel like a pipe, and downed Valkyrie with a knee to the face.
Gallery
Also, how does that scan prove that this guy is stronger? He dented a car with a shield. Not by his own strength. Not implying he couldn't because I'm not even sure who that is, but burying the edge of a huge shield into the weakest cavity of a car, the roof, is cool to see but not that impressive at all.
Jason Voorhees can smash the hood of a car into itself and collapse it completely into the ground below. Completely destroying the inner mechanics/engine in the process. I mean, his whole body is where the rest of the car used to be...
With his own fists and pure physicals. No weapons or tools used here. This is so much more impressive than what you shared, it isn't even close.
Ameridroid throws a car like a baseball, he would palm crush a car. The only thing the shield does is put all that force into a single point.
Even implying Jason is comparable is laughable.
Yes. I directly scaled him from Liu Kang because that is who he was directly pitted against, in - game, and who he disemboweled in confrontation. What I didn't share with you is the fact that all MK characters are capable of reacting and combating each other's speed. It's the universe and it is the only way such a tournament would work. Their physicals are very close in terms of capability, but with that, the understanding that they are enhanced humans with super powers, to say the least, has to follow.
That's really round about way of stating all speed feat should be applicable to Liu Kang.
For instance. there are a few characters such as Reptile, Kabal, and even Liu Kang (described as a "whirl of motion" and "blurry" with his strikes), whose speed during combat is a bright spot and vital reason as to why they are so formidable. No, they aren't massively faster than anyone else in their verse, but it's widely accepted that there are a few characters whose move sets are built around being fast. Their speed is consistently shown to be one of their best attributes. And this is just warriors that do possess impressive speed.
Blur speed and statements, you are really digging. I don't know how far you are willing to go mining for speed feats, but I assure you they won't be more impressive than Marvel street level character. Most of these characters steve has fought on equal footing, and at times beat.
Others like Quan Chi are shown using magic as his craft. Barriers, hypnotic spells, and portals -- speed is not something you couple with Quan Chi when describing him as a fighter.
Quan Chi reacts to and deflects machine gun fire from close range.
Keep in mind that this is just the casual speed of most, if not all, Mortal Kombat characters.
That's the best feat you have, and it in no way applies to Jason. Keep in mind this is a reaction feat with his magic. Which doesn't translate well across characters or even to an entire verse (as you seem to be doing). Even if you scale Liu Kang to have better combat speed than him character don't generally fight at speeds they can react at.
Steve Rogers is a tactical expert when it comes to fighting. He will have an idea that Jason is an oddity due to his appearance but that is about it. I'm certainly not implying that he would make a rookie mistake right off the bat, but to imply that he would know exactly what to do when confronted by Jason, just solely on appearance, is ill advised.
No where did I imply he would understand Jason power set or skills at a glance. I stated and you agreed that steve wouldn't hold back due to Jason's appearance.
If he gets tagged once, it's not going to be with Jasons' fists, which, even if it was, I have already proved above that it would be significantly more devastating than than that backhand he endured from that one guy. His fists can demolish the entire front end and inner workings of a car.
You can stress it all you want but that isn't impressive to even lower tier superhumans.
His teeth would be knocked out and his jaw torn open if Jason tagged him with a focused strike on a very specific area of the body.
This is pure fan fiction to put it lightly. Steve take taking an uppercut to the face by a character stronger than Jason, means his durability is far better than you're suggesting.
And I'll remind you Steve can roll with the punch as to never take the full force. But you've yet to prove how he gets passed the shield.
That single tag that you are referring to would be with a very heavy duty machete that has proven its worth; from slicing cleanly through human bodies and trees at once, to penetrating a steel chryo chamber door and impaling a victim on the other side.
You still have yet to show me any piercing resistance from Rogers. How would he follow up when he gets sliced deeply, or stabbed by a machete during conflict?
You're acting as if massively out skill Jason and hasn't faced opponents with blades. Jason compared to Deadpool with a blade is an amateur. Steve had no trouble reacting to and shattering his blade, which would happen when Jason hits an unbreakable shield.
In simple terms you would have to be delusional to think Steve would allow some skilled brute with a knife to stab him while face to face.
Jason has plenty of it and I have an abundance of scans and scenes to prove that. I've also proven that though Jason does not naturally move as fast and swiftly as Rogers, but reacting to Captain America won't be an issue. When the majority of the entire Mortal Kombat universe are at least bullet timers - I'd argue even bullet dodgers - I can make that claim and be 100% confident in it.
Being confident in something doesn't mean you're right, it means you're insistent and you can be insistently wrong.
Me being afforded MK feats for Jason = Reacting to your character will not be nearly as difficult as you think it would be. Even without teleportation.
Jason can react all he wants I've never argued for steve blitzing him. What I've been stating Steve's shield, skill advantage, noticeable edge in speed allows him to control the direction of the fight. This is a consistent tactic when it comes down to facing superhumans.
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I am not saying Jason is going to be performing acrobatics along with Steve as the fight progresses. I'm saying that reacting to his blows is not a tall task, as you seem to be painting that image. And Jason isn't going to be NIghtcrawler with his teleportation.
Reacting to Steve's hits won't mean much since the skill gap is ever present, steve will always land more hits. That's what I want you to understand. This fight is decided by KO or death. Obviously a healing factor makes KO exponentially hard, so Steve will be aiming to kill.
He just needs to do it once. Rogers has zero prior knowledge on Jason being able to do that. Voorhees using that in mid combat would be a completely unexpected change in a challenger. Not a normal circumstance for even the experience Rogers.
Yeah and I've shown Steve being taken by surprise with faster teleportation and reacting to avoid the blow without using his shield. A considerably slower opponent with a slow teleport won't be much worse using his shield. You obviously must think Jason will out think Steve for him to even pull that off. At what point do you think Steve will be too distracted for that to work?
An undead powerhouse capable of teleportation and a genuine Deadpool level healing factor, Rogers can fight, but in this fight, he won't know what happened before it happens.
Steve don't have precog so I agree he won't know what's happening before it happens. But if we just take a moment to think of the tactical mindset these characters have during a fight and Steve's superhuman perception. You would have to be obvious to the feats I've shown, thinking Steve can't comprehend changes in the fight as it happens.
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