Cade Skywalker vs RotJ Luke Skywalker

Cade

Cade should win. Holding your own against Krayt >> holding your own against Vader

Luke beat Vader, Cade lost against Krayt emphatically.

Luke beat Vader when he went into a rage last I checked. Also l was talking about Vong Krayt

@decaf_wizard: Cade was getting pretty profoundly thrashed until the implants started taking a toll due to Krayt's exhaustion there.

Something he is allowed to do here, it was still his own inherent power that came into play. He was stalemating Vader before using it. I'm sure if his life is on the line he would find a use for his latent power.

Cade, on the other hand, tends to fight unreservedly and yet I doubt you would ever see him putting that kind of beating on Vader. He's the better ranged attacker with TK, lightning and he also has dark transfer for healing, but I think Luke would win a duel.

Fair enough. I would agree that Cade loses in a raw duel

Why can't Luke go into a rage against Krayt?

Pretty sure there is several sources of Vader holding back, including from Luke himself in the movie. There is maybe two or three that say Vader went all out, but more evidence from canon material and EU state Vader held back and was "Conflicted". So........

I just saw this...

Anyways it was situational.

@decaf_wizard: True

@decaf_wizard: @emperor_jar_jar:

The Emperor goaded Luke into snatching up his lightsaber, and father and son battled in a rematch of the duel they had fought on Cloud City. During the struggle,Vader's resolve began to flicker as he saw the good in his son.

-- The New Essential Chronology

Key words, Vaders resolve faltering.

Darth Vader's internal struggles against the faint spark in his soul that was Anakin Skywalker had been thrown into high relief by the Dark Lord's dealings with Luke. The Emperor demanded utter obedience and unquestioning loyalty. Vader vowed to serve his Master, but the words sounded hollow.

-- Star Wars Fact File 55

Vader internal struggle, obeying the Emperor feels hollow.

Luke states twice, including the fight that Vader hold back and held back. That he was conflicted, during the fight Luke said this. Filoni also states Vader was in his prime before Luke. In the fact Luke cause Vader to struggle due to internal struggles with emotions.

Just saying... the piss poor argument of Luke beating a mentally holding back and hinder Vader is any better than Cade beating Krayt doing the same is a sad argument.

@sirfizzwhizz: Yep. Agree completely also low-key haven't read the fate of the Legacy Dark Horse series in years and can't argue well for it anymore

@sirfizzwhizz:

1. Dang it. If Vader is supposed to be devoid of emotion in Rebels then they did a terrible job of it. He obviously hesitated to kill his former padawan.

2. Does Dave have a say in legends?

3. It's not Luke and Vader were fighting equally before Luke went into a rage. If Vader felt conflict, Luke was really holding back. He was adamant about not fighting his Father. Though when Luke did beat Vader, I agree, Vader's heart wasn't in it.

@emperor_jar_jar:

1. Dang it. If Vader is supposed to be devoid of emotion in Rebels then they did a terrible job of it. He obviously hesitated to kill his former padawan.

he did, however that was Ahsoka, and he resolved himself to kill her. It was stated by the director he WANTED to kill her to erase his past. So he tried on that.

2. Does Dave have a say in legends?

Yes. The guy was working on the "EU" for years before Disney rolled in via Clone Wars stuff. Though this statement of Vader was base on the film ROTJ and ESB movies which are applicable to Legends anyway as well Canon. Not to mention there is the Legends ROTJ novel that backs the fact Vader held back or felt conflicted too. It all kinda adds up.

3. It's not Luke and Vader were fighting equally before Luke went into a rage. If Vader felt conflict, Luke was really holding back. He was adamant about not fighting his Father. Though when Luke did beat Vader, I agree, Vader's heart wasn't in it.

We can agree both held back, which is hard to gauge the fight. What we do know, is Vader holding back > Luke with rage amp. Which is not a good benchmark either.