Blue Team/Fire Team Osiris vs Age of Ultron Team

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#1 Edited by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio
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Rules and Conditions

  • Spartans have all feats up to and including Halo 5 (As well as the books of course)
  • Both teams have full knowledge on their team, and perfect teamwork.
  • Both teams have a day of preparation time in their respective universes. Avengers can prep at Stark Tower, Spartans can prep aboard the UNSC Infinity. They cannot add more members to their team, but can gain equipment to bring, learn about their opponents, etc.
  • Victory by death of all opposing team members, all hesitations to kill are removed.
  • Master Chief has non-rampant Cortana
  • Age of Ultron team has 50 Ultron Bots as well

Arena

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Teams start at the opposing towers of Valhalla, and are teleported in after their day of preparation is up. They are aware of their enemies' starting positions.

Who will win?

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#2 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio

Halo:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek@cara_hunter@hellionvulcan@thedailybagel@stupid_people@The_Deathstroker@pern

Master Chief:

@monsterstomp@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek@jmarshmallow

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#3 Posted by FatherChaos (2668 posts) - - Show Bio

Vision solos.

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#4 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio
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#5 Posted by FatherChaos (2668 posts) - - Show Bio

@saint_of_origin: Didn't see prep. Will be harder. Still think Avengers win due to heavy hitters like Hulk and Thor.

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#7 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump?

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#9 Posted by JediXMan (42893 posts) - - Show Bio

I know nothing about Halo.

Moderator
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#10 Posted by Chronicplane (9472 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11 Edited by Vivec3629 (446 posts) - - Show Bio

Spartans, particularly book Spartans, have incredible feats of strength, accuracy, agility, reaction time etc. with and without Mjolnir armor. But in essentence they're Cap inside power armor with energy shields. I don't see them having any way to take down Hulk, Thor, or Vision and potentially Stark would give them grief as well. Depends on if their weapon can crack his armor. He also has flight, and they don't.

The fodder Ultron bots and street level MCU go down, though Spartan supersoldiers vs. MCU Cap would be interesting.

Spartans lose.

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#12 Posted by Conner_Wolf (6380 posts) - - Show Bio

Spartans, particularly book Spartans, have incredible feats of strength, accuracy, agility, reaction time etc. with and without Mjolnir armor. But in essentence they're Cap inside power armor with energy shields. I don't see them having any way to take down Hulk, Thor, or Vision and potentially Stark would give them grief as well. Depends on if their weapon can crack his armor. He also has flight, and they don't.

The fodder Ultron bots and street level MCU go down, though Spartan supersoldiers vs. MCU Cap would be interesting.

Spartans lose.

Yeah, Thor, Hulk, or Vision could solo all the Spartans regardless of prep

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#13 Posted by IndomitableRegal (16886 posts) - - Show Bio

Spartans likely lose due to the heavy hitters of the MCU team.

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#14 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio

@vivec3629: Not sure how I feel about the "Spartans are pretty much Cap in Power Armor" statement.

Spartans are much more hardened, trained, experienced, and lethal than MCU Cap. They've been fighting in battles and wars on a scale that MCU Cap hasn't. They have been through training that puts our toughest military training to shame since they were 6 years old. Their super soldier enhancements are also far beyond what MCU Cap has. John effortlessly killed 3 ODST Soldiers when he was fresh out of augmentation and only 14 (IIIRC) years old. Cap wouldn't be able to replicate this feat directly after receiving his Super Soldier serum.

Spartans, even without armor, I would say are beyond MCU Cap.

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#15 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio

@vivec3629: To put experience in perspective, Cap was given his serum at 21, and was frozen at 27 in the MCU. That's 6 years of War Experience at most. He was frozen from 1945 to somewhere between 2005/2010 as he was frozen for "nearly 70 years". We'll go with 2005 since he needs all the help he can get. Age of Ultron ends 2020. That's another 15 years. He wasn't fighting that whole time either, but we'll still give him 15 years of experience. That puts him at a grand total of 21 years, giving him every bit of time we can, and assuming every bit of that was experience in a war.

By contrast Master Chief has anywhere from 30-40 years of military experience, most likely in the upper 30s if you take out his time in cryosleep and such. And this is going through training, fighting battles, winning wars, that live in Cap's worst nightmares.

To say Spartans are just "Cap in Power Armor" is lowballing them like crazy tbh.

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#16 Posted by Vivec3629 (446 posts) - - Show Bio

@saint_of_origin: Well, I was deliberately making a basic, high level comparison to Cap for Spartan augmentation, as many people don't know much about Spartans on this site, and for this fight the MCU victory doesn't depend on Cap. There's certainly room for discussion. And I don't strictly disagree either.

When I have more time than right now and am not on mobile, I'll write a more detailed response.

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#17 Posted by Pipxeroth (9535 posts) - - Show Bio

They really have no way of dealing with characters like Hulk/Thor/Ultron/Vision. Take those out and they'd stomp.

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#18 Edited by Vivec3629 (446 posts) - - Show Bio

@saint_of_origin said:

@vivec3629: Not sure how I feel about the "Spartans are pretty much Cap in Power Armor" statement.

Spartans are much more hardened, trained, experienced, and lethal than MCU Cap. They've been fighting in battles and wars on a scale that MCU Cap hasn't. They have been through training that puts our toughest military training to shame since they were 6 years old. Their super soldier enhancements are also far beyond what MCU Cap has. John effortlessly killed 3 ODST Soldiers when he was fresh out of augmentation and only 14 (IIIRC) years old. Cap wouldn't be able to replicate this feat directly after receiving his Super Soldier serum.

Spartans, even without armor, I would say are beyond MCU Cap.

@vivec3629: To put experience in perspective, Cap was given his serum at 21, and was frozen at 27 in the MCU. That's 6 years of War Experience at most. He was frozen from 1945 to somewhere between 2005/2010 as he was frozen for "nearly 70 years". We'll go with 2005 since he needs all the help he can get. Age of Ultron ends 2020. That's another 15 years. He wasn't fighting that whole time either, but we'll still give him 15 years of experience. That puts him at a grand total of 21 years, giving him every bit of time we can, and assuming every bit of that was experience in a war.

By contrast Master Chief has anywhere from 30-40 years of military experience, most likely in the upper 30s if you take out his time in cryosleep and such. And this is going through training, fighting battles, winning wars, that live in Cap's worst nightmares.

To say Spartans are just "Cap in Power Armor" is lowballing them like crazy tbh.

I agree that with the training since age 6, countless engagements during the Insurrectionist campaigns, Human-Covenant War, and the following events with the Iso-Didact and Praetorians, that the Blue Team Spartan II's certainly have much more combat experience than Cap. Cap may be a better melee fighter, as that's his forte and modern military training focuses on ranged combat more, but they'll be better at range for sure. Osiris is obviously less impressive than Blue Team, given that we have little impression that Locke is anything other than an experienced, though capable, intelligence officer/assassin before his Spartan IV augmentation, and Vale and Tanaka are not particularly experienced soldiers or operatives, being augmented on the basis of their other skills. Buck is a 20 to 25 year marine ODST veteran, and should be quite the combatant himself, more so as an SIV.

Regarding augmentation, we have to consider the differences between the 2's and the 4's. The 2's were much more heavily enhanced physically, while the 4's rely on less expansive enhancements (as they were all adults and the original, more thorough S2 and later Spartan 3 augmentation procedures only worked on children). The 4's make up their fewer physical enhancements through their Gen 2 Mjolir armor, supposedly bringing them to S2 stats through the superior physical enhancements of the Gen 2 armor.

The 2's were able to run at baseline recorded bursts of 34.2 MPH, while the John 117 reached 65 MPH, though that tore an Achilles tendon. Cap should be able t match the baseline 34 MPH based on his running feats in Civil War and Infinity War. Their strength as teenagers outside of armor was lifting 3 times their body weight, which we can assume remained at least consistent through adulthood. Their carbide ceramic amalgamated bones are also extremely resistant to damage, and their reaction times are around 20 milliseconds, I believe. The 2's I think could take Cap even outside armor, though his own significant strength and speed make them work for it. In armor, there is no real contest IMO. I mainly say this as Cap is likely to be stronger than them out of armor, based off his helicopter feat. They'll just be more resistant to damage and extremely well-coordinated.

I do think that Cap could take the Osiris 4's out of armor due to superior physicals and likely skill as well. Buck being the potential exception, along with potentially Locke, though I find him very hard to quantify.

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#19 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio

@vivec3629: Now that I can agree with. The only issue I had was the statement of "Spartans are basically Cap with power armor".

The question is, how do you think Avengers/Ultron will fare against the tech of UNSC? They have some pretty lethal firepower. The heavy hitters of MCU have some pretty impressive feats against modern weaponry, but UNSC weaponry is leagues beyond what is shown in MCU. Plus Spartans are tactical geniuses beyond anything anyone on MCU team has shown. At least Blue Team is. I agree that Osiris is pretty unimpressive when compared but their superior tech should assist as well. I think the prep makes a big difference in this fight, but the question is who can use it better to overcome their enemies strengths and cover their own weaknesses.

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#20 Posted by Vivec3629 (446 posts) - - Show Bio

Well, their various MA5 rifles, battle rifles, and pistols actually use modern caliber rounds or similar. Like the 7.62 of the MA5B or C. They are supposed to use magnetic accelerators instead of gunpowder I think, which may increase the muzzle velocity, but we don't know.

Alien weaponry, especially plasma, would be quite effective if you're taking the books into account. Their heavy weapons like the Spartan laser, hand-held MAC, fuel rod guns, energy swords, etc... would work well against the street level Avengers. Iron Man would probably shrug off the smaller caliber rounds and rockets wouldn't do him in, but portable MAC rounds, plasma weapons, plasma grenades, or potentially hard light weapons may pierce his armor.

I believe that Tony's armor as least prior to IW was some kind of titanium alloy, and UNSC ship, tank, and Mjolnir armor is made of Titanium A, also a titanium alloy, hence the "A". Covenant weapons burned easily through human ship armor with desciptions like "armor running like hot wax under a blowtorch" or something similar. Tony's armor would probably be breached by a number of plasma bolts or a stuck grenade.

The prep time is in favor of the Spartans given that impossible tactical situations are basically a random Tuesday for them. Team work, especially Blue Team, is definitely in their favor too. No drama or interpersonal angst weighing them down, and the Blue's often communicate with very subtle hand gestures and changes of stance. The benefit of working together for almost 30 years all told (not counting cryo of course). I really find myself not considering Osiris, just cause their main draw is tech, but it's not immensely valuable tech either. Like Locke's scanner? So helpful here. I think of them as Blue Team's cannon fodder here, there to keep pressure of the Blues.

Linda would probably be able to snipe more than a few quickly, though I'd have her focus on Scarlet Witch the glass cannon first, like Tony's team should have done in Civil War.

Mainly without bringing in ship based MAC's, I don't see Thor or Hulk going down. And Thor's lightning is a huge problem. Vision is one of those opponents strong on paper who in practice is less effective than he should be, but even if you discount him (and you really can't anyway), I think the Spartans could kill everyone there save those 2 or 3 Avengers.

Ultron himself is dangerous in a vibranium body given his resistance to kinetic weapons (same applies to Vision), but I think enough high explosives or energy weapons may bring him down. Hard to say. Ultron bots are mainly threatening in their numbers. Plasma weapons would make short work of their armor I believe.

What do you think?

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#21 Posted by Vivec3629 (446 posts) - - Show Bio
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#22 Posted by Saint_of_Origin (4790 posts) - - Show Bio

@vivec3629: I agree that Thor and the Hulk are going to be hard to put down now that I think about it. When I think about Vision and Ultron, I wonder if Cortana could perhaps aid in some way. I know that Vision's AI is mixed with the mind stone, so I'm trying to remember that out of the AIs who has more impressive actual feats.

Also I wonder if Blue and Osiris take out the fodder quickly enough, and get it down to just Thor and Hulk, if they could go H2H with them. Strength wise I definitely see an edge for Thor/Hulk, with Hulk's highest feat that I can recall being the leviathan punch from A1, but all the spartans should be much faster, especially Kelly. And they are definitely smarter. Then it's also hard to factor in, but I wonder how John's supposed "luck" would factor into this battle.

Based on everything I know I think team wins, but it's a hard fight, and they lose just about everyone.

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#23 Posted by Vivec3629 (446 posts) - - Show Bio

@saint_of_origin: Cortana could probably pull a Jarvis/Vision and lock Ultron out of the internet or even hack his AI given that she's a 25th century Smart class AI based on the brain of arguably the most brilliant human alive then.

That's Hulk's best quantified strength feat that I know of. His staggering of Surtur is difficult to quantify, especially given he has momentum as well flying into him.

Between Hulk's rampage and Thor's lightning blasts and even strength durability (crumpling IM armor reasonably casually), I just don't think the Spartans can win. Which is no black mark really. The Spartans were originally conceived as reasonably hard science fiction supersoldiers with believable limitations. The Marvel characters were never intended to be realistic or consistent in the same way. Thor is a god,and Hulk is a gamma radiation monster that has all this strength and abilities...cause.