Bill but it's REALLY close.
@apex_pretador: Ok maybe not weak powerhouse. Weak powerhouse is someone like Red Hulk and Blue Marvel. Still Gladiator is below people like Superman, Thor, Green Lantern and the Hulk.
I believe I'm somewhat ready to counter that.
@apex_pretador: The first time his fight wasn't any better than Thor vs BE Iron-man.
Okay so? Both of them were even AND stated even.
The second one was against Masterson who is weaker than Thor yet he still lost.
He was beating on Masterson and lost by interference, right? And Masterson Thor should be equal to regular Thor because Mjolnir gives one the "powers of Thor".
The third time he defeated Thor because he was just about to turn into his human form making him weaker.
And he was the one who forced Thor leave his hammer, and Thor could;ve called his hammer back if gladiator is really puny.
The fourth time he was taken down pretty easily.
Do you know who consistently gives Thor a fight and is regarded as his equal? Hercules and he is way weaker than Thor.
In wrestling and arm wtrstling, not in strkinig power (mjolnir) and durability.
Also Feats > Showing Between Characters unless that character has zero feats what so ever (Doomsday for example) which is not the chase for Gladiator.
Feats like 3-shotting a planet?
Do you know who is consistently regarded as Superman's equal? Shazam even tho he has Zero feats to prove he is his equal what so ever.
Billy is irrelevant here.
This is sooo dumb because Gladiator is only a point of reference .. Meaning that his strength is only needed to be as strong as the story needs it.. remember when he came to pick up kid gladiator and got ROLFSTOMPD... Yea, exactly.. Terrible fight...
Going by fights with both Beta Ray and Gladiator against Tyrant who knocked out Beta with one attack while it took three to deal with Gladiator, Thanos stated outright Gladiator is more dangerous than Beta ray is and the rest of the Annihilators besides Surfer. Without wis Gladiator ragdolls Beta night and day without being noticed or touched by Beta since Gladiator's combat speed is superior to Beta Ray's.
@krleavenger: Also going to continue the discussion from the other thread
They can be stated to be Universal busters. They are not.
They are not stated universe buster. The fact is, they have been shown and stated equal on multiple occasions.
Gladiator is not his equal by any means.
Maybe in durability but he is weaker when it comes to strength, striking power and is not coming close to being as powerful as Thor.
Gladiator vs BRB in durability:
- Bill gets punched to face once, and gets knocked out clean.
- Gladiator gets eye-beamed to face after tyrant overpowers him in beam clash, and says "Now I have taken measure of him". Briefly later, Gladiator gets hit from Tyrant's eyebeams to face again, and yells "Aaargh, it takes more than that to fell me" and Tyrant needs to personally punch him with effort.
- With one eyebeam, Tyrant knocks out Surfer.
I can give more showngs of gladiator, but not needed.
As for speed, Gladiator is faster but it is not like he operates in span of nanoseconds. Having only ONE SINGLE FEAT is not helping him.
What about moving in frozen time?
What about counting 10 billion micro-sentinels in a blink of an eye?
What about his handbook entry saying he can run faster than light?
What about him flying intergalactic distances?
What about blitzing the hell out of nova corpsmen, who each are speedster?
What about all that?
My point is Thor was more pissed at Iron-man than he was when he fought Gladiator and he could still hold his own against Thor. Wonder Man could also hold his own against Thor and he even overpowered him but when Thor got serious he one shotted Wonder Man. My point is, the only powerhouse who fought evenly with Thor with Thor going all out is the Hulk.
You are forgetting how Gladiator was backhanding Tony in Earthfall, despite holding back and fighting multiple other opponents, compared to Thor being pissed off against Tony.
Wonder man is leagues below gladiator. Gladiator punched him to core of the planet once. Gladiator once punched simon so hard that he stated it could've taken off his head clean.
Mjolnir gives Jane powers of Thor as well yet I don't see her going above Ms. Marvel Level or little bit above her
Jane stalemated unworthy thor, who has the same stats as worthy thor.
Do I really need to show all the feats of masterson to how he (as Thor, not as thunderstrike) atleast is on the same level as real thor if not his equal?
Masterson is not Thor's equal by any means yet Gladiator failed to put him down and it took only a lightning and a hammer blow to put him down. Much weaker Hulk tanked lightning from real Thor who was not holding back plus tanking the full force of his blows (before and after lightning) and he was not really damaged at all while Gladiator was not only severally hurt by Masterson's lightning but was KOed right after with one blow Mighty Thor #445
Do I really need to show you hulk getting knocked out by Thor's lightning? It doesn't happen often but it happened once.
Back to masterson, it was NOT MASTERSON'S lightning. It was itself. What do you expect from a living lightning amped up by the power of mjolnir to do to Gladiator? It knocked him out. To confirm the knockout, masterson hits him with his hardest hammer blows.
In the next issue, Thor vol. 2 #35. Gladiator actually had problems with Thorgirl which actually gave Amanda just enough time to give KOed Jake Olsen Mjolnir to turn back into Thor and he pretty much stomped him.
And he punched him in less than a second after he just turned from KOed Jake Olsen so weak he can't even move his fingers to Thor and was actually ready to take down Thor. I'm missing five scans which happened between scan 1 and scan 2 which shows the two stopping a falling plane. Either way, Gladiator failed to dodge attacks from Thorgirl and he failed to KO her when he threw something at her before this fight happened.
This is the same instance when he blited Mjolnir off Thor from what I remember.
So, Gladiator took half dozen blows from non holding back Thor (planet busting strikes) and then an energy blast to face from a "power which rivals omnipotent Odin" to get knocked out, and that was after he has just fought twice (Thor and Thor girl).
As for gladiator failling to KO Thor girl, there is always plot at the fights. If not for plot, Gladiator could've killed Thor when he turned mortal, rather than Knocked out. And he still dominated and beat her.
Yet they were stated equals even tho we know they are not. Same goes for Gladiator. He does not have feats on consistent level which indicate his power level is comparable to Thor or The Hulk.
What are you talking about?
Hercules has consistent feats which put him below Hulk. Hercules is as strong as Thor. Hulk is stronger than Thor.
Outlier/High End Feat. He does not have consistent showing to prove he is a planet buster
Like matching Thor everytime they fight? Taking his non-holding back blows to face? One shotting the thing? It is definitely a high end feat but not an outlier.
Now let's get back to annihilators earthfall
Beta ray bill was having difficulty with red hulk, while gladiator was shrugging off everything Tony had, and Tony stomped rulk in the same armor. The only instance of "hurt" was Logan stabbing him, and I'm sure you won't doubt Logan's claws.
He did say "Logan d--" but that was AFTER he was stabbed.
Speed? Quasar was tagged by Spiderman twice in the same comic, and Quasar needed to go as fast as he can, to get magus's cocoon. Tell me isn't this plot?
This is not even including the fact that Thanos flat-out called him more dangerous than Beta ray bill, despite being only physicals and no versatility.
I don't think they did and I don't think they are. Gladiator won only once and Thor was weakened in that instance.
Thor wasn't weakened. Thor was forced to be turned weakened by Gladiator blitzing him and Mjolnir off him, and keeping it away.
Thor also won only once, after Gladiator just finished two battles, and with help from "power which rivals even Odin"
Extremely inconsistent. Beta Ray Bill was capable of no selling planetary explosion and survived a blow from WM Thor that destroyed the planet in the process. He also tanked a beating from WM Thor (without Mjolnir but he is still 10x stronger) without much damage while Gladiator was hurt by a single blow from the Hulk who was overpowered by Apocalypse.
I thought you should've known better that WM isn't 10x regular Thor. If you are talking about B&T before thor gets PG, then he was amped by insanity. That strike also knocked out bill. And gladiator has feats to prove he can tank planet busting hits, like the Thor fight you yourself showed.
Thor never unleashed planet busting strikes. Even when he is not holding back. Not to mention he was weakened in that instance. In the next issue he had no problem taking down Gladiator
So, you are saying thor fought gladiator one after another three times, and fought Thor again after getting hit by "power rivalling Odin"?
When did he one shot the Thing?
In one of the old F4 comics. I'd check them out and post the scan when I find it.
He failed to one shot Wonder Man,
Yes he is below Gladiator but he is not leagues below him. Also Gladiator needed to consistently punch him to planet's core in order to KO him. If he really is a planet buster he should one shot him, like Thor did
Colossus (written by his creator actually),
So, just because it was written by his creator means all other showings are invalid? Does that mean hulk stomping herc in WWH is invalid because stanlee wrote him as weak, grey hulk?
And WWH failed to one-shot colossus. But both of them easily won their fights against him.
Gladiator fought hulk once, and it was gladiator who was weakened not hulk. He did not throw a single punch or kick in the entire "fight". If anything, barring one inconsistency, that fight is a great showin for kallark.
He also failed to KO Cannonball despite the fact that he claimed he used his STRONGEST BLOW in Uncanny X-Men #341.
Cannonball somehow absorbed the full power of gladiator's blow.
He then throws it back at gladiator, who was weakened due to confidence issues and still did not get knocked out.
I find it funny because you used Tyrant instance. Tyrant actually one shotted Surfer in that same mini series and Surfer is someone who no sells Super Novas. Unless you think Gladiator is so durable he can tank a blast that can one shot someone as durable as Surfer, that feat is totally invalid
Supernova is very large. Surfer takes only a small portion of that, no the full force. Surfer has been consistently hurt by Thor's strikes which are planetary when non-holding back.
Then why was "AGHH!" written after "Logan d..."?
Because gladiator noticed logan has stabbed him, before he felt getting stabbed.
Sure. Galactus had trouble with Thanos,
Thanos who himself stated his power is lilliputian compared to big G, and was 2-shotted despite shields and spared of his life.
Galactus only needed to exert him in breaking Thanos's shields. Bill actually stated that he is having difficulties with rulk, and got hurt by him.
Thor had trouble with Iron-man...
Impressive feat for Tony.
Red Hulk is not weak. He is capable of giving real powerhouses like Bill trouble. Look at his fights with Savage Hulk for example.
So, rulk isn't weak but gladiator is?
Despite the fact that he handled Tony better than bill handled rulk, Gladiator is weak?
He dodged a repulsor what Iron-man was shooting while distracted, trying to get away from Heat Vision. Stark did not really hit him IIRC.
Stark himself said he hit him with everything he got and not the entire fight was on panel, because the panel was focused not on these two but 13 heroes and several villains and magus's cocoon. Obviously most of the fight took place off-panel.
Either way, durability has nothing to do with this topic. I already said Gladiator has high tier durability, it is just not planetary level like with Beta Ray Bill, Superman and The Hulk
And I showed you gladiator's durability against Tyrant himself, against non holding back Thor (you yourself showed scans lol) , hulk punching him twice when kallark was weakened to no effect , and thunderclapped his ears which kallark shrugged off.
He's not as durable as Hulk, but is close to Bill/Thor if not better.
That is the same thing that happened to Hulk and Sentry and neither of the two are coming close to being planet busters.
I thought you believe sentry is planet buster?
And both of them are high tiers, while you believe gladiator to be a weak joke.
So, Hulk/sentry stalemate Thor = powerful, gladiator stalemates thor = weak?
Nova Corpsmen are not speedsters by any means. Only Nova Prime is.
Yes they are. Check the issue in which worldmind remakes nova corps on earth (vol 4 ,issue number is somewhere between 18 to 21)
He stomped Thor before. It is not like he tanked any significant damage to become weaker. He was not hurt by Thorgirl either but he failed to KO her and failed to dodge her strikes.
He still exerted effort.
"Rivaling power of Odin" is a joke and we both know that.
Not necessarily. Thor knows Odin better than both of us, and it is obviously more of a "waving his hand" level effort rather than full power of Odin.
It does not change the fact that Thor was taking him down without full effort. He was even in a disadvantage, getting blitzed right after he turned into Thor.
And he got the first hit in, and he explicitly stated that he is not holding back at all. And he hit his non holding back strikes (which are planet-busting) five times to his face repeatedly. And gladiator still was not KO'd only downed.
Wendell actually has more than three nanosecond speed feats.
And over a dozen "below spiderman level" speed feats. Obviously I won't want to bring them out because those will be used by others to lowball him, but this is inconsistency, worse than gladiator.
I would like to see proof of him holding back because Gladiator is not holding back. He is ruthless
Ikon's armor analyzed Gladiator having self-restrains so that he doesn't accidentally kill someone. That was in the comic prior to earthfall.
Quasar explicitly told annihilators to hold back, and only ronan did not listen.
Gladiator was the one who refused to allow ronan to kill magus's hosts in the same story, and would rather die himself.
Fair enough. But do you explain Gladiator one shotting him when he failed to one shot him in every single fight they had. Guess plot worked against Thor this time.
Thor took multiple hits before gladiator blitzed mjolnir off him.
It does not take an attack that rivals the power of Odin to take down Gladiator.
I never said it is the minimum required.
If it really does rival his power Gladiator would be killed, not KOed.
How many times does Odin have defeated Thor, Surfer, Bill, Drax and other herald level ?characters without killing them?
Also there is only one attack that can rival Odin's power and that is God Blast.
So Thanos, Zeus, King Thor etc don't rival the power of Odin?
Thor may have won only once but guess who never won? Gladiator. He defeated Thor with one punch.
He hit Thor multiple times, then blited Mjolnir away, then he one shotted him AFTER he turned mortal due to whatever curse Odin implanted on him.
He failed to KO Eric Masterson.
In one page, so? Real Thor would not KO masterson thor in 1 page either.
It takes way less than planet busting force to take down Thor as we saw in Incredible Hulk Annual 2001 where Hulk took down Thor with his punches
And Thor has taken above planet busting strikes to face and survived, Bill took multiple planet-busters to face in B&T and survived.
Hell to provide some context, in Thor Vol. 2 #35 (the issue that came out right after their fight where Gladiator one shotted Thor), when they saved the plane Thor fired a blast from Mjolnir which actually hurt Gladiator.
This is infact a durability feat for gladiator. He takes "mjolnir's raging fury" without a scratch.
That same Thor was powerful enough to throw Silver Surfer around. He KOed Bill before he had the Power Gem but how do you explain Thor being powerful enough to take down Surfer that way? Yes WM amps him. Either because it is a pure amp or because the insanity boosts your adrenaline rush with boosts your strength. Hell how much can average woman lift? Maybe half of average human's weight. I think you heard of woman's baby being stuck beneath the car so she was strong enough to lift a car which weights 2 tons. That is ridiculous strength amp. It does not really translate to Asgardian Physiology but their physiology is not that different. I mean Mantis took down Thor with same pressure points that work on humans.
Either way, Thor was bloodlusted when he was fighting Bill and with his strength being amped or not, he was hitting with full force which is pretty much enough to shatter planet to pieces with shockwave of his blows while cracking a nearby Moon despite the fact that it is far away. And that same Thor overpowered Silver Surfer
Atleast read what I said. That was not warrior madness thor but was amped by madness. He WAS amped.
Because he holds back. He EXPLICITLY STATED THAT HE IS NOT HOLDING BACK AT ALL any more.
Even less fodders like Masterson. I guess Iron-man can tank planet busting strikes because Odinforce Thor needed two strikes to take him down despite the fact that he said he is no longer holding back Thor vol. 3 #3.
He two-shotted him, what more do you need?
Or how weakened Hulk is a planet buster because he hurt Gladiator so much he wasn't able to continue with a Bullrush Incredible Hulk Annual 1997.
Hulk has consistenely hurt people with planet-busting durability, like Thor, for example. How many times has Hulk harmed Thor? Yeah, a lot of times.
Hell, in case of gladiator, he took a THUNDERCLAP to his EARS, which are enhanced with super hearing, and still shrugged it off. He shrugged off being hit twice by pissed off hulk.
Ok sorry for my harsh words. I'm just saying how Thor does not unleash planet busting attacks and how Gladiator does not have feats that are putting his durability on planetary level. Not even Thor does. The only people who actually has planetary durability are Post-Crisis Superman and Post-Core Breach Hulk.
So Thor and beta ray bill do not have planetarydurability?
He won via one shot. That worked for the plot. I hate using a word but it is strait up PIS. Later Gladiator could just kill Jake so it was either PIS or CIS (or both). Those two comics were written pretty badly but based on consistency and further context,
And you are ignoring how Thor took multiple hits before Gladiator blitzed his hammer away?
Thor was slowly losing power after mjolnir was away , so it is not necessarily PIS. Infact it is NOT PIS.
Him not killing mortal thor, it just shows how gladiator was not bloodlusted.
Gladiator failed to dodge Thorgirl's attacks and failed to KO her
Did gladiator actually attempt to dodge her attacks and failed? Because by that logic, superman fails to dodge bullets in every comic.
Him failing to KO her?
- Thorgirl is weak compared to characters like Thor, Superman, Gladiator, but she isn't really a complete fodder. Hell, not even iron man is. Would you put her below Iron man?
- That's what PIS is, PLOT induced stupidity. Plot called for Thorgirl to survive till Thor turns back to full power.
and wasn't hurt by Thorgirl at all
Then why would he dodge?
he was blitzed by Gladiator into the ground. He might not be fully aware of the situation yet he could still counter Gladiator's bullrish/blitz. Which kinda says something considering the fact that Thor is not coming close to operating in span of nanoseconds. Anyway I'm reposting the scan.
No, gladiator blitzed him and they then talked for some time, before Thor landed his first hit.
He even blitzed him when he was going in between Jake and Thor yet he showed no damage or discomfort what so ever and right after rushed through quick counter attacks. Yet a blitz from Sentry and a punch that were felt all across the planet hurt Thor pretty badly in Uncanny Avengers #10.
Death seed sentry is above Gladiator. Hell, I give him a win over WB Hulk in a pure physical fight.
What Gladiator did with intention of killing Thor
Gladiator had no intention of kiling Thor, otherwise he could'e killed him in mortal form.
Thor actually reacted just after which shows the lack of planetary striking power and nanosecond level of speed on Gladiator's part
Thor's reaction speed is more inconsistent than Rulk's power level, and you know that. Half the time, he gets speedblitzed by street levelers, and the other half time, he is speedblitzing and outreacting Surfer, Quasar, Warlock, Gladiator, and catching speedsters like makkari.
I'm getting a little bit tired of that "power that rivals Odin" thing mate. It is truly hyperbolic in nature based on showing and lacking evidence to back it up.
Maybe but it still doesn't change the fact that it was Thor who said it, and this shows that this particular attack is >>> Thor's regular power level.
Not sure what are you showing me. The same scan from issue 445? All I see is Gladiator punching Simon two times and he was still strong enough to unleash a counter attack powerful enough to sent Gladiator flying away.
I'm showing Simon saing that gladiator was too fast and too hard, and if the punch connected, his head would've been punched off clean.
I'm saying how his creator Chris Claremont did not wrote him as a powerhouse you think he is. Fact that it was written by his creator is making it more valid than any other showing. Also this is just another counter for those "other showings". I'm looking at consistency.
And stanlee wanted hulk to be grey hulk, who would lose to current ben grimm, and current hulk is wayyyyyyyy above ben grimm.
And Superman's creator created him to be strong enough to leap buildings and stop trains, not to bench planets.
Again context. Hulk needed to consistently punch Wolverine in order to KO him World War Hulk: X-Men #2.
Correction, he did not do this to KO wolverine. He did this to turn his insides of his skull to paste. Hulk does this because he wants to permanently defeat wolverine because if he just KO'd him, he'd have recovered and started fighting again. He overtaxed his healing factor so much that even after he recovered, got healed and got back up, he could still not stand properly, because his insides were still heavily damaged.
It is clear as water Hulk was holding back in that story
Only to not kill.
t was actually stated by Amadeus Cho (one of the smartest people on the planet) more than once but here I have the scan from Hulk vs Hercules #1
- Cho is a massive hulk fanboy and behaved like that in the entire WWH story.
- Hulk was only holding back to not kill anyone.
Again it does not matter if the Hulk failed to one shot Colossus. He needed more than 5 shots to KO someone he could one shot in much weaker incarnation before his upgrade
Hulk "almost" one-sehotted the thing. He has never, or rarely shown the capability to do so in his previous incarnations, and same with opening half the face of hercules in 3 hits.
Also, the wolverine thing covered above.
supported by statements from one of the smartest people on the planet who was actually on the scene of pretty much every fight during the story. You know that if you read World War Hulk Tie-Ins with Amadeus
That is not what happened. Gladiator was weakened at the end of the fight before when he was hit by radiation which actually helped Hulk KO him with few strikes. The only part of the fight after this one was Hulk beating him up, everything before that was not weakened Gladiator.
- You have read the issue? Before gladiator even arrived on the scene, it was mentioned that the hulk was in the nuclear power plant.
- It was also mentioned that there were high levels of radiation in that area, leaking out.
- Hulk hit gladiator thrice, gladiator did not hit hulk even once. (Before using heat vision)
Hell, hulk even said that his face should've been turned into pizza by now. Gladiator was unharmed.
Hulk on the other hand was indeed weakened in that instance. This was Bannerless Hulk who was dying of being the nexus point between Earth 616 and Heroes Reborn, a Universe created by Franklin Richards where he resurrected all of Earth's heroes who died in their fight with Onslaught, including Bruce Banner who was separated from the Hulk at the time Onslaught's armor exploded. We saw Hulk dying in Incredible Hulk #460
Actually he was so weakened that even Apocalypse was capable of overpowering him without much effort Incredible Hulk #456.
Actually this same Hulk was hurt by street sign in Deadpool #4.
Hulk was weakened?
- Not once in the entire issue was the hulk stated, implied or hinted to be weakened. If he was weakened, and facing a powerhouse, the author would have atleast once reminded us that "how will the weakened hulk handle Gladiator" but, not a single hint, implication, narrator statement.
- Infact, the converse is implied. Hulk is stated to be causeing small earthquakes with his leaps.
- That was NOT bannerless hulk. In the entire issue, he is referred to as Bruce, and Doc Samson EXPLICITLY states that hulk and banner have re-integrated
- Need more proof it wasn't bannerless hulk?
- Radiation, which is present in large quantity there, amps the hulk.
- Hell, hulk healed from his insides being turned out and heavily damaged in 3 pages.
Even if it is a sucker punch, Gladiator should be capable of reacting to someone who does not even operate on span of microseconds. That is, if Glads really is a nanosecond timer which I'm still confident he isn't.
So, how does hulk hitting him when he does not see it coming mean gladiator is slow?
Hulk was standing right besides him.
Why should he be able to react to a sucker punch? I'm pretty sure even I can "sucker punch" flash if he does not see me, or I punch him from behind.
I am well aware of the context of that scan. Thing is, Cannonball never showed the ability of absorbing such a massive level of kinetic energy every again. By "that level" I mean enough ti topple a country, shake the planer or wipe out the celestial body. He does not possess such a high degree of absorption abilities. If Gladiator really punched him with planet busting blow, counter attack should KO him as you have yet to show me Gladiator being capable of tanking such force, especially because he lost his confidence after he failed to KO Cannonball (yes he lost it after the punch, not before).
Has canonball ever tried to absorb this level of energy and failed?
Surfer was shrugging of Thor's attacks like nothing in Mighty Thor series and Thor actually had intention of killing Surfer. It does not matter if he tanked a small portion. The whole explosion has the force of exploding star. Why do you think it is impressive when someone tanks planetary explosion? Even if you don't tank the full force, the force of the blow is ridiculously destructive.
Thor has hurt Surfer many times.
Gladiator also has a feat of tanking energy of a Nova capable of wiping out half a solar system, and he actually was able to contain it.
That is just your opinion man. Also it is without logical explanation because the amount of time you need feel pain is lower than the amount of time you need to say a word, especially because Gladiator's mind is around millions of times faster than the human brain.
No, we actually see that Gladiator noticed Logan only after his claws went through his body.
Should that actually change anything? It is Gladiator we are talking about, not Bill. It is flawed logic to assume Gladiator was holding back just because Bill did, especially becase IT IS IN CHARACTER FOR HIM NOT TO HOLD BACK.
Sure because it is in character for Gladiator not to hold back while Bill does not always cut loose
In general, both of them have loose morals.
And why are you forgetting it was gladiator who refused to allow Ronan wiping out the surface of US with every magus body?
And since you like to bring out authors,
- Both Annihilators and annihilators earthfall was written by Dan abnett and Andy Lanning.
- According to these authors, in their stories, Gladiator holds back due to self-restrain
- Both stories are basically in continuation to each other, as Earthfall is sequel series of annihilators
So, Gladiator held back in earthfall because that's what the same authors indicted in the previous comic, because Quasar told him to do so, and because he has now become a hero (Gladiator was never a proper hero in the past)
No Gladiator is not weak and I never said he is weak. He is above people like Blue Marvel, Red Hulk, Iron-man...
Rulk is weaker than Iron man, who is weaker than blue marvel.
All I'm saying is he is below Thor, Hulk, Superman, Green Lantern
So, where would you put him? Around Wonder Woman and Shazam? That is, low end of high-high tier? Basically in the same tier as Superman, but below him?
Maybe he was hitting him with everything he got but Glads was dodging? I never claim he lacks super speed. I said he lacks consistent nanosecond showing.
Dodging =/= shrugging it off.
He is around Thor level I never denied it.
@asgardianbrony: Actually this is an easy win for Bill. Gladiator is not coming close to being a real powerhouse like the Hulk, even less people above him like Beta Ray Bill.
Gladiator is nothing more than a weak powerhouse who would get taken down by any real powerhouse easily.
Striking Power? No. Energy Projection? Yes.
Yes they are and no I never said it. I'm saying Gladiator is more like Shazam. He is not a weak joke but he lacks feats on consistent level to be ON PAR with greatest powerhouses of Marvel and DC.
Shazam hasn't destroyed large mountains, let alone moon to put him on Superman level. He has never moved a moon, let alone a planet. Gladiator on the other hand:
- Has solo nanosecond feats
- Has contained an explosion capable od annihilating half solar system without any scratch and redirected its energy to create a star
- Matched Thor everytime they fought.
Ok I will check it out. Still it is traveling speed feat, something I never argued against actually.
Blitzing feat. Every nova centurion has a high level of enhanced perceptions, reactions and combat speed.
Now, another showing I'd like to add is, Gladiator's sister was able to speedblitz Ravenous so hard she was totally invisible to him, and make him look helpless, while playing around. Ravenous went toe to toe with pre annihilation surfer, and put up a fight agains post annihilation surfer, in annihilation arc.
She was even with Nova prime in combat speed and much superior in strength and toughness. And not once was she hinted or implied to be above gladiator. Infact, during the entire time, it was implied that gladiator is atleast as good, if not better than her.
"I'm the cousin of GLADIATOR"
"She is a strontian. Gladiator is the only other one of her kind. I don't think it is possible to kill one of their kind"
I doubt he has more lowshowings that high showings. Also I hope you are not planning to post Pre-Annihilation instances.
Why? He rarely has appearances and feats post annihilation . Anyways, I'm not planning to post any instances because I don't want Quasar to be lowballed using those showings.
That is on particular instance. Gladiator never holds back In Character which was showed multiple times under the pencil of his own creator Chris Claremont. As I said, a guy was supporting the idea of killing Jean Grey, he had no problem killing his masters just because he was told to, he was doing what his evil new Emperor Vulcan was telling him to do,
He was holding back against avengers in earthfall, and that's what we are discussion, not if he holds back in character or not. His creator's opinion is irreplevant because the author of that comic shws gladiator holding back/self restraining himself.
and killed Nova Corpsmen in cold blood who was just trying to talk to him.
He killed one corpsman,who said he'd attack him, and he let atleast 2 dozen of them live, if they surrender. He asked atleast 3 times for them to surrender.
Anyways, it is irrelevant.
Never had so much fun debating without doing a CaV. Sorry if I made some typing errors.
I feel good too, that we can continue this without having the burden of a CaV.
Just because you’re holding onto Mjølnir, doesn't mean you possess the same strength, power, etc as Thor. Eric Masterson (with Mjølnir) admittedly that Thor likely held the strength advantage - https://m.imgur.com/faZUtar
It just means they receive the same power set, and to a very powerful degree, but not always as powerful as Thor himself.
There’s also that whole ordeal with War Thor, which helps us compare different Thors in terms of power, as well as Beta Ray Bill.
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