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Posted by jashro44 (51888 posts) 1 year, 11 months ago

Poll: Battle Of The Week: Winter Soldier VS Moon Knight (107 votes)

Winter Soldier 56%
Moon Knight 36%
Too Close To Call 7%
No Caption Provided

For this weeks battle of the week we have two street levelers going against each other! We have Bucky Barnes (as the Winter Soldier) Versus Moon Knight! Who will win? You decide!

This battle of the week was suggested by @buildhare!

Rules

  • Combatants are in character.
  • This is a random encounter (no prep for either side) and both characters have standard gear.
  • They're fighting in a generic city setting. It takes place during the day and they start roughly 100 feet apart and visible. Everything in the city (let's say the city is the size of Manhattan and surrounded by ocean) is on limits.
  • Incapacitation, knockout, BFR (battlefield removal, which means knocking someone so far away that the fight cannot continue in the very near future) or death all count as elimination. Making a tactical retreat counts as a loss, too. "What's a tactical retreat?" It's leaving the fight with the intention of not returning to the battle in the immediate future. Going to another spot in the environment to catch your breath for a moment or two or for a tactical advantage is not a tactical retreat.
  • Treating everyone else in the debate with respect is a sign of a good debater. If you think someone's saying something that just isn't true, go ahead and stick to the facts to point out why. There's no need at all to drop insults just because you disagree with someone. This is just talking about a fictional fight, there's no need for immaturity and mudslinging about fan fic.
  • If you think the poll isn't going how it should, making an informative post about why a character is being underestimated and spreading the word is far more useful than complaining.
  • One more thing: you don't need to write an essay to have your post highlighted in Friday's article. Sometimes concise posts can be way more effective than a flood of paragraphs. Viner posts that stand out will be included at the end.
  • Votes last till late Friday, and the votes will be posted in the OP to see where combatants stand by Friday. Votes do not determine who wins, only who the majority at the time sides with.

Special thanks to @k4tzm4n for allowing me and other users to continue making these battle of the week threads

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#1 Posted by SirFizzWhizz (37749 posts) - - Show Bio

Huh, I doubt this will even be close, but we will see.

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#2 Posted by Amendment50 (15011 posts) - - Show Bio

Neat-o.

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#3 Edited by Apocofist (3028 posts) - - Show Bio

Bucky wins with a bit of a struggle.

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#5 Posted by buildhare (8515 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 YES, Thanks so much for picking this!

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#6 Posted by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

Huh, I doubt this will even be close, but we will see.

seconded the only way Moon Knight lasts for an extended period of time is if he has his Carbonadium Gear... otherwise Bucky kinda curbs

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#7 Posted by Rag_man (1377 posts) - - Show Bio

Bucky's strength is as an assassin since they start visible to each other this favors Marc IMHO.

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#8 Posted by jashro44 (51888 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 YES, Thanks so much for picking this!

No problem. Any thoughts on the fight currently or do you want to see the debate first?

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#9 Posted by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: what gear does Moon Knight have? actually same for Bucky as well?

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#10 Posted by buildhare (8515 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44:

I want to see the debate first but I'm leaning towards Bucky in a very close fight, maybe too close to call. Which era of gear does Marc have?

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#11 Posted by tparks (11807 posts) - - Show Bio

MK should win. He's actually more dangerous from range, being one of the better bullet timers in Marvel, and extremely accurate with crescent darts.

Then in close quarters, he has a sizable skill advantage, to counter Bucky's strength advantage.

MK's advantages match up well against Bucky. Bucky may generally be the more dangerous of the two, but Marc wins this one.

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#13 Posted by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

@tparks said:

MK should win. He's actually more dangerous from range, being one of the better bullet timers in Marvel, and extremely accurate with crescent darts.

Then in close quarters, he has a sizable skill advantage, to counter Bucky's strength advantage.

MK's advantages match up well against Bucky. Bucky may generally be the more dangerous of the two, but Marc wins this one.

shit deleted my post

1. no Bucky is more dangerous... Bucky has guns that insantly makes him more dangerous... i believe hes also tagged bullet dodgers no problem. its my understanding hes shot Wolverine before

2. Bucky is far more skilled. Marcs feats cant even begin to compare to Buckys

3. Marc has no advantages except for potentially gear and since it wasnt specified im going to assume current which puts Marc at a sizeable disadvantage.

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#14 Edited by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, Bucky has the tech advantage, skill advantage and he recently got a arm upgrade with a flame thrower and a built in knife and claws like Wolverine.

Sure Moon knight has a high pain tolerance, it just gives him a few more seconds before he gets beat

Winter Soldier takes it handily.

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#15 Posted by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

@slimj87d said:

Yeah, Bucky has the tech advantage, skill advantage and he recently got a arm upgrade with a flame thrower and a built in knife and claws like Wolverine.

Sure Moonnight has a high pain tolerance, it just gives him a few more seconds before he gets beat

he got new stuffs? ooooo post scans pretty please or at least issues so i can go find em

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#16 Posted by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio
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#17 Posted by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

@slimj87d said:
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ok thats insanely bad ass.

i dig it... definitely supporting Bucky here

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#18 Edited by jashro44 (51888 posts) - - Show Bio

@buildhare: @warlockmage:I'll say he has his armor from Ellis run, crescent darts, staff, his truncheon which doubles as a grappling hook and nunchucks, and spiked knuckles.

@slimj87d said:

Yeah, Bucky has the tech advantage, skill advantage and he recently got a arm upgrade with a flame thrower and a built in knife and claws like Wolverine.

Sure Moonnight has a high pain tolerance, it just gives him a few more seconds before he gets beat

Winter Soldier takes it handily.

I did not know about this so for the sake of the thread ignore the upgrade.

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#19 Posted by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

@warlockmage: it does a lot more actually here are the rest of the scans

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#20 Edited by tparks (11807 posts) - - Show Bio

@warlockmage said:
@tparks said:

MK should win. He's actually more dangerous from range, being one of the better bullet timers in Marvel, and extremely accurate with crescent darts.

Then in close quarters, he has a sizable skill advantage, to counter Bucky's strength advantage.

MK's advantages match up well against Bucky. Bucky may generally be the more dangerous of the two, but Marc wins this one.

shit deleted my post

1. no Bucky is more dangerous... Bucky has guns that insantly makes him more dangerous... i believe hes also tagged bullet dodgers no problem. its my understanding hes shot Wolverine before

2. Bucky is far more skilled. Marcs feats cant even begin to compare to Buckys

3. Marc has no advantages except for potentially gear and since it wasnt specified im going to assume current which puts Marc at a sizeable disadvantage.

1. MK has easily avoided Punisher, has jammed guns by throwing darts to stop the triggers from pulling, and has sliced bullets in half in mid flight by throwing a crescent dart at them. Wolverine is not as good of a bullet timer on a consistent basis, and just because Bucky is accurate with guns, doesn't mean he is instantly more dangerous. If that was the case, everyone in comics would be dead every time a notable marksman starts shooting. How many named characters has Bucky shot and killed?

2. Marc knows every martial art on the planet. That was established in his very first appearance. Not to mention him doing thins like curb stomping Swordsman, who has beaten Black Panther in one on one. And he curb stomped Deadpool with absolute ease. Bucky could arguably put up a fight and maybe beat characters like this with skill, but he could never be considered a character who can completely curb stomp characters like that. Not to mention him being capable of fighting hand to hand with WBN. And neither of those instances had him with super strength. I don't think a Bucky vs WBN thread could be made and have it not get locked, even if Bucky was given some silver to play with. What feats does Bucky have that make him so much more skilled? The only one I can think of is a huge moment of terrible writing where he was able to fight Gamora for a few short moments during Original Sin. But Jason Aaron was the writer, who had never wrote Gamora, and he was working with post-Bendis Gamora, which makes everything about that instance a mess.

3. The gear is noted as standard. That doesn't mean current. He won't have the crazy Batman-like tech that he used in his classic days, or carbonadium, but he will have his standard gear, crescent darts, truncheon/staff, maybe spiked gauntlet, but honestly, I'd probably only argue his crescent darts and staff, and say that's enough.

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#21 Edited by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

1. MK has easily avoided Punisher, has jammed guns by throwing darts to stop the triggers from pulling, and has sliced bullets in half in mid flight by throwing a crescent dart at them. Wolverine is not as good of a bullet timer on a consistent basis, and just because Bucky is accurate with guns, doesn't mean he is instantly more dangerous. If that was the case, everyone in comics would be dead every time a notable marksman starts shooting. How many named characters has Bucky shot and killed?

Yeah and Black Widow deflected a sniper shot from Punisher that doesnt impressive me att al.

Wolverine literally jammed the barrel of a gun after the trigger was pulled but before the bullet left the gun, thats instantly faster than anyone here. and since you seem to claim thats not consistent with street level Nightcrawler, Iron Fist,Ben Reilly, Peter Parker, Mayday Parker, Jessica Drew, and T'challa all have similar feats so it is consistent for marvel street level.

why does it matter how many characters hes killed? shouldn't it matter how many people hes tagged and beaten

he also shot Hawkeyes arrows out of the air but by all means continue lowballing Bucky, it is the only way for Marc to win

Marc knows every martial art on the planet. That was established in his very first appearance. Not to mention him doing thins like curb stomping Swordsman, who has beaten Black Panther in one on one. And he curb stomped Deadpool with absolute ease. Bucky could arguably put up a fight and maybe beat characters like this with skill, but he could never be considered a character who can completely curb stomp characters like that. What feats does Bucky have that make him so much more skilled? The only one I can think of is a huge moment of terrible writing where he was able to fight Gamora for a few short moments during Original Sin. But Jason Aaron was the writer, who had never wrote Gamora, and he was working with post-Bendis Gamora, which makes everything about that instance a mess.

knowing every martial arts does not mean anything... you know better

Moon Knight did not curb Deadpool with absolute ease thats bull shit i read the fight and 2 things were blatantly obvious

1. Deadpool wasnt even remotely trying (even less so than normal)

2. it was not a stomp by any means the fight lasted several pages.

your bias is showing

Bucky fought Sin, Crossbones, and Serpent Squad all at the same time. Taskmaster called Moon Knights skill so crappy he wouldnt even want to coppy it, Bucky also gave a decent fight to Taskmaster. Bucky fought Wolverine, Daredevil, and Hawkeye at the same time (sure they were unorganized but he still managed to hold his own)

Marc doesnt compare

I reiterate... your bias is showing

The gear is noted as standard. That doesn't mean current. He won't have the crazy Batman-like tech that he used in his classic days, or carbonadium, but he will have his standard gear, crescent darts, truncheon/staff, maybe spiked gauntlet, but honestly, I'd probably only argue his crescent darts and staff, and say that's enough.

and that would mean Bucky gets his moddified Handgun... the one that put Ares on his butt.

im still seeing Bucky for a 8/10 majority especially if you've already shown the best Moon Knight has to offer.

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#22 Posted by Major_Hellstrom (17152 posts) - - Show Bio

If I were WS, I'd cut both arms off at this point.

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#23 Posted by AcroKat (7384 posts) - - Show Bio

Winter Soldier ftw.

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#24 Posted by AllStarSuperman (42623 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Bucky wins, but I'll wait for some debate to happen before voting.

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#26 Posted by TheWatcherKing (18044 posts) - - Show Bio

WS

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#27 Posted by Rag_man (1377 posts) - - Show Bio

@tparks said:

MK should win. He's actually more dangerous from range, being one of the better bullet timers in Marvel, and extremely accurate with crescent darts.

Then in close quarters, he has a sizable skill advantage, to counter Bucky's strength advantage.

MK's advantages match up well against Bucky. Bucky may generally be the more dangerous of the two, but Marc wins this one.

shit deleted my post

1. no Bucky is more dangerous... Bucky has guns that insantly makes him more dangerous... i believe hes also tagged bullet dodgers no problem. its my understanding hes shot Wolverine before

Moon Knight is a causal bullet dodger and if Punisher can't hit him I can't see Bucky doing much better:

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2. Bucky is far more skilled. Marcs feats cant even begin to compare to Buckys

I haven't seen anything that puts him above Marc.

3. Marc has no advantages except for potentially gear and since it wasnt specified im going to assume current which puts Marc at a sizeable disadvantage.

Marc has some of the best gear he's ever had. His automated glider and drones are insane:

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#28 Posted by Owie (7103 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll argue for Marc in what I'm guessing will be somewhat of a devil's advocate position.

Bucky is good, and he has the advantage of the bionic arm's strength, and he'd certainly be carrying firearms, which is better gear than what Marc has. He has had some very good fights, but I would point out that the couple times I've seen him fight with Black Widow, they've been pretty even, and I'd argue that Black Widow and Marc are probably about even in H2H skill; maybe she's a bit better than Marc on average. Then just an issue or two ago, Black Widow's new arch-enemy, Recluse, who was trained by the Red Room, was able to capture Bucky, and then she fought both (a somewhat hurt) Bucky and Natasha together without too much difficulty. So Bucky is not on some completely different, undefeatable level from Marc.

Marc has armor covering his most vital parts, and is, I would argue, faster. While I don't think he's displayed this level of speed consistently, his best speed feat is certainly the celebrated cutting in half of a bullet with a crescent. But, he has consistently been shown as fast. In one classic issue, he is shown 10 feet away from a guy on the ground, and distracts the guy for literally a second; when the guy looks up, Marc is facing him from on top of a rooftop maybe 40' away, and it seems to the guy that he just appeared up there. Marc is also more agile and a darn good dodger, and I think most people would not argue that he is more durable/pain tolerant. His best fights include putting down Taskmaster and Deadpool.

Bucky is certainly an accurate shot. Marc is a near-perfect throw with his crescents, which are capable of cutting a gun barrel off, so he may be able to render Bucky's guns useless.

At 100' away, Marc will have a challenge. He's going to have to close in somewhat before using his darts, and Bucky can shoot at him the whole time. But, Marc is a pretty good dodger, like I said, and has the benefit of his armor. I think he can get close enough to disarm Bucky with the darts, and then get in to a physical fight, at which point it's anybody's ball game, with Bucky probably having a slight skill advantage, but having a hard time wearing Marc's durability down. I'd say Moon Knight can win the long bloody rumble by a hair.

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#29 Posted by tparks (11807 posts) - - Show Bio

@warlockmage:

How can you say things like Deadpool wasn't trying? Deadpool prepped for his fight with Marc even. Did you actually read it, or just skim through it? It's fine if you did, but you misinterpretted it pretty bad. The second Marc learned Deadpool had a healing factor and could survive a beating from Marc, Marc curbstomped Deadpool in a single page. It wasn't even a contest. Go back and read it. There's really no debating the way Mark was shown to completely dominate Deadpool in a matter of moments.

Taskmaster never called Marc's skill crappy. He said MK had never seen a punch he wouldn't take then try to avoid, alluding to Mark's toughness and willingness to be punched in a fight, as long as he can push his attack. It wasn't a knock on MK's skill, it was a comment that he wouldn't want to use a fighting style where he intentionally takes punches, since few characters are portrayed with the pain tolerance of MK. It's one of the bigger parts of Marc's character, and has been established for quite some time.

You're comment is half-trolling, which whatever, but there are a lot of holes in your comments that are obvious to people who have read the instances your talking about.

Then when you say that you need to see what the best Marc has, it let's me know that you don't actually know much about Marc, since you would just know what Marc has, and not need to be shown them. Which makes me think you've established your argument based solely off of your knowledge of Bucky. It's pretty obvious from your comment as a whole too. It's hard to take any hard points you're making seriously if your firsthand knowledge is solely about Bucky.

I really don't care if you don't know much about Mark. I'm sure you do about Bucky, and we can have a conversation here and help each other out, but jumping right into a troll debate and saying "my bias is showing" repeatedly because of instances I mention that you are either uninformed about, or completely ignorant of, is a bad start. If this is how you want to continue though, I'll just drop it now.

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#30 Edited by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

@owie: Recluse said Bucky let her capture him. On top of that, Recluse must be enhanced as she took a bit with Bucky's metal and and flew threw a brick wall without any damage.

Regardless, they were trying to just incapacitate her, otherwise why would WAS waste time holding her so long in a headlock when he could have just killed or finished her.

Kinda low balling there.

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#31 Posted by Warlockmage (8489 posts) - - Show Bio

@rag_man:

Moon Knight is a causal bullet dodger and if Punisher can't hit him I can't see Bucky doing much better:

Black Widow has also dodged Punisher... congratulations you have only proven that Moon Knight is as fast as Widow... im unimpressed

I haven't seen anything that puts him above

thats funny because ive seen nothing that puts him above Winter Soldier... however since i actually listed feats maybe you should do something similar but hey maybe thats asking too much

Winter Solider has better skill feats like humiliating Hawkeye (who also beat swordsman), fighting Wolverine, Hawkeye, and Daredevil (even if they were unorganized) or beating fighting Sin, Crossbones, and the Serpent Squad at the same time.

meanwhile Marc's skill was so pathetic Taskmaster was insulting it.

Marc is not anywhere near as skilled, nor does he display it nearly as often as Bucky does.

Marc has some of the best gear he's ever had. His automated glider and drones are insane:

and current Winter Soldier has the best gear hes ever had... too bad the gear was listed by Jashro...

still puts Bucky at an advantage

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#32 Edited by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

@owie: also, WS has beat BW with ease when he needed to. Otherwise they have only spar or BW was brainwash while WS was trying to peacefully stop her and fight the other WS sleeper agent.

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#33 Posted by mrmonster (13642 posts) - - Show Bio

Winter Soldier

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#34 Posted by Owie (7103 posts) - - Show Bio

@slimj87d said:

@owie: Recluse said Bucky let her capture him. On top of that, Recluse must be enhanced as she took a bit with Bucky's metal and and flew threw a brick wall without any damage.

Regardless, they were trying to just incapacitate her, otherwise why would WAS waste time holding her so long in a headlock when he could have just killed or finished her.

Kinda low balling there.

Allowed her to capture him, in the patronizing sense that he wasn't good enough to stop her from capturing him. read the line again--at the top of the scans of the fight, here for others to see. It obviously doesn't mean that he literally let her capture him.

I don't think she's enhanced. She and Widow remark about how she's been training, that's about it. Perhaps she has the same serum as Widow.

Looks to me like they were both trying pretty pretty hard to beat her, and not doing at all a good job of it. Sure, he gets a hold of her, and says he can't hold her long. Even if he was trying not to kill her, he could have put her in a sleeper; he obviously wasn't in a good position and didn't really have her. Calling lowballing isn't called for her, I could be a lot more harsh about how he fared in that fight.

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#35 Edited by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

@owie: I feel like your whole argument is still low balling.

We don't know the context of how WS was captured. Also, WS admits he wasn't on his A game, which isn't the stipulation s here. Both characters are fighting to the best of their abilities. And again, they were jusy trying to incapacitate Recluse because BW needed her alive to figure her plot out. Otherwise,why would WS just headlock and hold her for NAT to shock and incapacitate Recluse.

Again, his fights with BW mean absolutely nothing. How can you conclude that they're even when he's beaten her before, all their other fights were spars and the last time they fought WS wasn't trying to hurt her in addition he was fighting her and Leo.

So I'm not sure how you're connecting BW skill to WS and saying they're equal when they're clearly not.

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#36 Edited by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

It's silly to say that Moon Knight dodges Punisher gunfire, there guns aren't a problem.

HELL YEAH GUNS ARE A PROBLEM.

First off, Punisher and WS fighting styles don't even compare. WS is far more acrobatic and he's more skilled at H2H than Frank. Frank even admits so.

Frank doesn't shoot like WS does, it's actually good to see those Punisher scans trying to shoot Moon Knight because Punisher is stuck there in place and doesn't have the acrobatics or agility to move and shoot but the WS does.

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So MK dodging Frank gunfire isn't the same. They have different fighting styles.

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#37 Posted by Thor_Parker82 (15661 posts) - - Show Bio

Bucky should win a solid majority

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#38 Posted by MarvelBro (649 posts) - - Show Bio
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#39 Edited by tparks (11807 posts) - - Show Bio

@slimj87d said:

It's silly to say that Moon Knight dodges Punisher gunfire, there guns aren't a problem.

HELL YEAH GUNS ARE A PROBLEM.

First off, Punisher and WS fighting styles don't even compare. WS is far more acrobatic and he's more skilled at H2H than Frank. Frank even admits so.

Frank doesn't shoot like WS does, it's actually good to see those Punisher scans trying to shoot Moon Knight because Punisher is stuck there in place and doesn't have the acrobatics or agility to move and shoot but the WS does.

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So MK dodging Frank gunfire isn't the same. They have different fighting styles.

All of those examples are in close range though, where MK can fight back pretty easily. It's not like acrobatics have ever been a problem for MK, and MK's acrobatics rival Bucky's. MK didn't have a problem with Spider-Man's acrobatics when they fought, and he was even capable of dodging Spider-Man's web, and throw a crescent dart to slice the web as it was leaving his web shooter.

And MK has used acrobatics to control battles with the likes of Wonderman and Hulk. Wonder man even compares Marc's acrobatics to Captain America's during their fight.

If anything, I think Marc has been consistently portrayed as the more acrobatic of the two, as well as the more speedy, ever since his early days. Even in one of his first appearances, he was using acrobatics to embarrass Ice Man in a one on one fight, and even managed to acrobatically dodge Ice Man's ranged attacks while being telepathically attacked and slowed by Moon Dragon. Bobby was experiencing the same telepathic attack at that point too, but the point is MK stilll could perform acrobatic dodges to ranged attacks while slowed even.

And when Bushman tried to shoot Marc from near point blank range, and Marc dodges the bullet, his words are something to the manner of "no human can dodge a bullet like that!". I'd have to go back and look up the exact phrasing, but it's in his first series I believe if you want to check.

And his use of ranged attacks on characters with acrobatics better then Bucky's has been successful. Like what I mentioned of Spider-Man earlier, and also the time he cut the cord of DareDevil's billy clubs by throwing his crescent darts while DD was in the middle of mid-air acrobatics, to cut his anchor point and ground DD.

Acrobatics are not going to be a game changer against a character like MK, who has always been portrayed as a pretty high level acrobat. Acrobatics are always a positive in a fight, and Bucky certainly has them, but I wouldnt say Bucky is going to be able to shoot Marc because he's an acrobat. I think that's a pretty big stretch.

Maybe Punisher was standing still in that scan, but that single scan is far from what defines Marc's capabilities.

Does Bucky have any times where he has actually shot a notable character while using acrobatics? Moon Knight actually has feats against notable bullet timers and acrobats like DareDevil and Spider-Man, using his own acrobatics and ranged attacks to fight them successfully. I'm sure Bucky has something better then the scans you show of him against fodder, but I've never read an issue of him using acrobatics and actually shooting a notable character while doing it, but I'm also not current on anything with Marvel in the past year or so.

EDIT: Or maybe I shouldn't say fodder, because I don't like how that term completely dissolves the impact of a feat. What Bucky does is still impressive in acrobatic gun play, I just think it's not really enough to sell anyone that Bucky is going to do the same thing to a character like Moon Knight, who has always been portrayed as an extremely speedy acrobatic bullet timer himself. Even though the characters in those scans arent necessarily all fodder, none of them were acrobats or speedy. In fact, none were even moving at all, besides possibly running in a straight line.

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#40 Edited by Apocofist (3028 posts) - - Show Bio

Why is everyone bringing up the Deadpool and Taskmaster fights?

I find it ironic that Taskmaster would get scared and beaten by Moon Knight.

I find it even more ironic that Deadpool was HOSPITALISED after the fight with Marc.

A load of PIS was spread over those pages.

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#41 Posted by LDM (5359 posts) - - Show Bio
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#42 Edited by buildhare (8515 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay I think Bucky will be able to edge this one out for a couple of reasons.

Firstly the starting distance. Although Moon Knight does have his crescent darts here, they are ultimately inferior to Bucky's firepower. Both are extremely fast, so I doubt the fight will end before either can close the gap, but if it should come to a ranged game the Winter Soldier definitely has the advantage.

In most scenarios it's going to become a close fight, in which Bucky will have an advantage. Bucky is technically trailing when it comes to melee equipment for a close quarters fight (staff and truncheons are better then a combat knife) but I think Bucky's arm negates any edge having a good melee weapon provides. The fact that Bucky has sidearms that he can use in close proximity is going to put Marc on the defensive, as even though he can react to a bullet normally he can't handle someone as fast and accurate as WS firing on him for a sustained period at those kinds of ranges. I saw someone use the argument that perhaps Moon Knight could disable the Winter Soldiers guns with crescents but I don't think that's really possible here for two reasons;

1. Bucky has several weapons. Meaning that if MK does successfully sabotage one of them he has more guns to fall back on.

2. MK disabling gunmen is usually less about the actually gun and more about the men themselves. Just look at how he does it;

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3

Which is going to be extremely ineffective against someone who is using their metal bulletproof arm to fire the weapon.

Ignoring his gun advantage for a second he also beats Marc out physically. Strength should be fairly obvious, he can do this kind of thing very easily;

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Iron-Hand Hauptmann is the puncher, he has striking power sufficient to punch through steel
Iron-Hand Hauptmann is the puncher, he has striking power sufficient to punch through steel

Without his arm I suspect MK is stronger, but Bucky definitely has the striking to compete. His toughness is right up their with Moon Knight's;

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Still conscious after a multistory fall and being hit by the blowback of an RPG.

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Takes blows from Burnside/50's Captain America, who has been stated to be both stronger and faster then normal Cap. In the second scan he has just been thrown through two walls and onto another building below and still is able to get to his feet. Skill might be an edge to Moon Knight due to some good (and some questionable) showings like handily beating Swordsman and defeating Deadpool at one point. But being able to contend with someone physically superior to Captain America (albeit somewhat less skilled), defeating Black Widow while holding back and contending with both Batroc and the Man With No Face (a superhuman with the power of intangibility) at the same time is more then enough to justify him staying in the fight until both his physical and equipment advantages seal the win.

Don't really see Bucky using it unless he's really pressed, but he can also project a high charge electrical current from his bionic arm;

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..which should either KO Marc or have him defenceless long enough for Bucky to end it, given MK isn't exactly resistant to electrical shocks;

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*Scan 1 and 3 should be next to each other*

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#43 Edited by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio

@tparks: I wasn't arguing who is more acrobatic but rather countering the logic of "Moon Knight dodges Frank's gunfire, therefore guns aren't a problem." Frank doesn't fight like WS nor does he shoot like him. So it doesn't really prove anything as their fighting styles are different. That being said, Moon Knight's acrobats aren't on par with someone like Miles Morales so I don't see it being of any concern or issue in addition I fail to see any proof that he's more acrobatic than the WS or in anyway that it matters in the fight as once again he's not more acrobatic than Miles Morales, who WS kept up with quite well.

Has he shot anyone notable? Off the top of my head, he shot Crossbones up and purposely missed every internal organ to bring him in for questioning. He stealthy shot up Wolverine. He's sniped an alien flying a spaceship in space (probably flying at Mach speeds, but nothing was clocked). But no, a lot of his career was as Captain America and he has commented that he didn't want to shoot or kill anyone like when he fought 50s Cap because he was trying to be Captain America.

I don't see Moon Knight's crescent projectiles as a issue either as WS has shot DD's billy clubs out. Hawkeye tried to shoot him from behind with 3 arrows and she shot them all out. He's even caught and thrown Hawkeye's arrows and sliced them in midair with his knife. And Nick Fury and Dum Dum tried to sneak up behind him and shoot him and he's turned around and deflected the bullets with his metal arm. Black Widow has tried to shoot him up with her widow bites and he deflected them all with his metal arm. So WS definitely has the reflexes to shoot, slice, catch, deflect and throw back anything Moon Knight tries to throw.

I recon WS is better than Moon Knight at stealth as well as WS has followed Wolverine for days covering his tracks from Wolverine's enhanced senses. Outsmarted Wolverine twice in a chase. Sneaked in on Dare Devil training and getting close within range of him. Sneaked on on BP and Punisher. So if Moon Knight tries to retreat or looses trace of WS, he'll be at a stealth disadvantage as well.

And his whole thing about Moon Knight knowing "every martial arts" on the planet, his handbook entry doesn't agree.

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I don't completely agree with handbook entries most of the time and I'm sure Moon Knight should be rated higher than his grid shows but I refuse to believe he knows "every" martial arts as that has been claimed by many people, even Steve Rogers has made the claim to only be rated a 6.

WS has better gear, is stronger due to his mechanical arm, is a better fighter due to his showings and is better at stealth than Moon Knight.

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#44 Posted by slimj87d (15634 posts) - - Show Bio
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#45 Edited by Apocofist (3028 posts) - - Show Bio

@buildhare: Good analysis.

Bucky does indeed wins since MK has some rather questionable feats.

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#46 Posted by Pipxeroth (8978 posts) - - Show Bio

Damn, Marc is being criminally underrated here. Sure, Bucky has the gear advantage, but arguing that he'll straight up one shot Marc without a fight is ridiculous.

I'm too lazy to make a post, but just one thing:

@warlockmage:

meanwhile Marc's skill was so pathetic Taskmaster was insulting it.

Just to be clear, you're joking right? Taskmaster insults everyone's skill. That's like saying Batman is funny because Joker laughs around him.

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#47 Edited by GhostRavage (14924 posts) - - Show Bio

@pipxeroth: I think he meant Marc's "skill" was so "dull" that Taskmaster didn't even bother to copy it. He has only made that remark about Marc's fighting style in his entire publication.

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#48 Posted by Pipxeroth (8978 posts) - - Show Bio

@ghostravage: There's a difference between a fighting style being 'dull' and a character being 'pathetically skilled' though. Marc has shown plenty of times to be quite skilled in combat, but he's one of the only heroes out there that likes to take punches rather than avoid them. That doesn't mean he isn't capable of fighting at a high level. Trying to use a single comment from Taskmaster, who shit talks everyone he fights, to try and justify a comment saying that Moon Knight isn't at all skilled in martial arts is pretty far-reaching to say the least.

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#49 Posted by GhostRavage (14924 posts) - - Show Bio

@pipxeroth: I agree, such statement is barely usable as an argument, specially when Moon Knight has his own set of feats regarding skill. Either way, Taskmaster wasn't even referring to his skill to begin with, but his fighting style and judging by his appearances, he's one of the few who can actually take the hit.

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#50 Posted by Sy8000 (34798 posts) - - Show Bio

Winter Soldier handily.