The Rules:
- Morals: In character
- Prep: 1st Round - None, 2nd Round - 12 hours
- Weapons: Bats can't use any of his vehicles as weapons.
- Location: Harlem, NY (Image Universe)
- No BFR.
- Comic feats only.
Who wins and why?
The Rules:
Who wins and why?
Done before countless times, friend. And was the subject of an interesting 'Does Batman Always Win' article by K4tzman.
BP takes it by a slim majority.
Agreed.
@veshark: Being an article of interest and voted on by its writer does not automatically make one character or the other win. It's all opinions. As for the fight I agree, Black Panther takes the victory.
@veshark: Being an article of interest and voted on by its writer does not automatically make one character or the other win. It's all opinions. As for the fight I agree, Black Panther takes the victory.
I only mentioned the article because it addresses several valid points within the argument, I never stated that it was definite (nor did I say that my decision has any relation to it).
Not to mention that my main point was that this debate has already been done before multiple times, which is a violation of the Battles board rules.
@juiceboks: agreed. T'challa is nearly as skilled as Bruce and as physically gifted as Slade. Pair that with his suit, it's a wrap.
This battle has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/batman-vs-black-panther-10112/
On a side note, who's the brilliant writer who had Black Panther able to use an arm-lock on Silver Surfer? Whaaaaaaat?
@juiceboks: I don't think so...I remember T'Challa was slightly under Cap physically. Cap's strength is superior to Batman's by like 3 or 400 pounds.
This battle has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/batman-vs-black-panther-10112/
On a side note, who's the brilliant writer who had Black Panther able to use an arm-lock on Silver Surfer? Whaaaaaaat?
I remember Dwayne McDuffie saying something that Surfer allowed BP because Surfer was trying to explain something?
@juiceboks: I don't think so...I remember T'Challa was slightly under Cap physically. Cap's strength is superior to Batman's by like 3 or 400 pounds.
I believe Cap himself said that T'Challa was his physical equal - and if we're talking about upgraded BP, he now has superhuman strength.
This battle has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/batman-vs-black-panther-10112/
On a side note, who's the brilliant writer who had Black Panther able to use an arm-lock on Silver Surfer? Whaaaaaaat?
I remember Dwayne McDuffie saying something that Surfer allowed BP because Surfer was trying to explain something?
In the scan it looks like it's BP who's the one wanting to talk, not Surfer. And in any case, isnt BP some kind of genius or something? Would he really expect that an arm-lock would work on a guy who's strong enough to destroy a planet, can phase right out of the arm lock, or could even just mentally command his surf board to whack BP in the back of the head?
This is just PIS, on the part of both BP and the Surfer.
This battle has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/batman-vs-black-panther-10112/
On a side note, who's the brilliant writer who had Black Panther able to use an arm-lock on Silver Surfer? Whaaaaaaat?
I remember Dwayne McDuffie saying something that Surfer allowed BP because Surfer was trying to explain something?
In the scan it looks like it's BP who's the one wanting to talk, not Surfer. And in any case, isnt BP some kind of genius or something? Would he really expect that an arm-lock would work on a guy who's strong enough to destroy a planet, can phase right out of the arm lock, or could even just mentally command his surf board to whack BP in the back of the head?
This is just PIS, on the part of both BP and the Surfer.
Here's a quote from the writer himself explaining it. Take from it what you will:
"Read the scene again and this time pay attention. The Surfer allowed the Panther to "restrain" him in the hope of finding out what the FF was up to. A panel later, the Surfer's assistant blasts the Panther unconscious. The Surfer is irritated because he wanted the Panther to talk, which he thought he might do if the Panther believed he had the upper hand. Most of the people who bitch about this have only seen a scan of one page, or have poor reading comprehension skills." - Dwayne McDuffie
"Read the scene again and this time pay attention. The Surfer allowed the Panther to "restrain" him in the hope of finding out what the FF was up to. A panel later, the Surfer's assistant blasts the Panther unconscious. The Surfer is irritated because he wanted the Panther to talk, which he thought he might do if the Panther believed he had the upper hand. Most of the people who bitch about this have only seen a scan of one page, or have poor reading comprehension skills." - Dwayne McDuffie
I can sort of buy that, just not the part where BP thinks he can use an arm-lock on the Silver Surfer... unless BP was completely ignorant of the Surfer and what he can do, which I seriously doubt.
Done before countless times, friend. And was the subject of an interesting 'Does Batman Always Win' article by K4tzman.
BP takes it by a slim majority.
This battle has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/batman-vs-black-panther-10112/
On a side note, who's the brilliant writer who had Black Panther able to use an arm-lock on Silver Surfer? Whaaaaaaat?
Agreed. That stupid sht's up there with Spider-Man punching out Firelord.
I say Black Panther wins.
I think Batman wins first round, but would argue that T'challa is actually better with prep and has more resources. I mean, Panther has had the crap beaten out of him by Daredevil before.
Edit: Here it is.
"Read the scene again and this time pay attention. The Surfer allowed the Panther to "restrain" him in the hope of finding out what the FF was up to. A panel later, the Surfer's assistant blasts the Panther unconscious. The Surfer is irritated because he wanted the Panther to talk, which he thought he might do if the Panther believed he had the upper hand. Most of the people who bitch about this have only seen a scan of one page, or have poor reading comprehension skills." - Dwayne McDuffie
I can sort of buy that, just not the part where BP thinks he can use an arm-lock on the Silver Surfer... unless BP was completely ignorant of the Surfer and what he can do, which I seriously doubt.
Yea that and silver surfer is a telepath.....But its the explanation the writer gave us and this way surfer isn't low balled as much.
This battle has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/batman-vs-black-panther-10112/
On a side note, who's the brilliant writer who had Black Panther able to use an arm-lock on Silver Surfer? Whaaaaaaat?
Agreed. That stupid sht's up there with Spider-Man punching out Firelord.
I say Black Panther wins.
As mentioned by veshark Surfer allowed it to happen. He was just pretending.
@juiceboks: his debut in Fantastic Four, Black Panther was a strategic gymnast with an extraordinary vertical jump but not much more. He has since become the gold standard for PIS, add-ons, and hyperbole to get him over with readers.
The following is the add-on he has received over forty odd years so that his modus operandi is more reminiscent of a Predator than the mysterious king he once was:
-his suit cannot be cut unless arguably against the grain
-cannot be electrocuted as Vibranium is not conductive
-if he lands from 30 stories his soles absorbed the fall soundlessly
-he can stick to the sides of buildings and run up walls
-he can walk on water
-his suit can absorb and redirect hits from the Hulk and Namor and the momentum of objects
-can absorb and redirect lightning bolts
-cannot be shot as it is just absorbed
-his claws can cut through anything including Adamantium (it's Anti Metal)
-can see the Infrared spectrum with lenses and in the dark without them
-could overhead lift 750 lbs and vertically jump 20' and run 30 mph due to the Heart Shaped Herb
-can cast spells due to Wakandan magic
-Wakanda was later elaborated as being more than a utopia and more so a futuristically advanced nation supplying T'Challa with spaceships, hover cycles, laser guns etc
-his energy daggers can phase through anything all metal including Adamantium
-was reconned from competing in a tournament to determine a Black Panther, to having trained since birth all over the world ala Batman, Mastering all forms of combat for said tournament.
-A second armored suit can eject from his regular Vibranium suit that is reminiscent of Ironman
-can move through time and space with Wakanda's golden frogs
-Priest wrote him as the 8th smartest man on the planet, capable of coopting Richards tech such as gauntlets that allow TChalla to walk around space breathing unaided and not feeling the pressures of space.
-can restrain the likes of Silver Surfer with a simple armlock
As if those add-ons weren't enough Hickman came along. During Shadowland Black Panther didn't possess the peak human attributes granted by the heart shaped herb. However when the Panther Goddess restored him and made him King of the Dead many marks and fan boys took this too mean ridiculous power levels despite Hickman later acknowledging it mostly as hyperbole. "Every Panther that has ever lived, their strength, their knowledge, is now yours!" Anyhow despite Marvel’s stance the fans insist as King of the Dead additionally he can:
-lift 60 tons. Snice yknow there has been a thousand years of BP lineage. Even though he has only been shown tearing a cyborg in half and fighting Namor, things he was capable of before KotD and Shadowland.
-1000 years fighting experience
-has superspeed the likes of Quicksilver explained as when he outran bullets
Now the recent add-ons that have been confirmed are:
-he can teleport due to the Panther Goddess
-create force fields
-has vents so he cannot be gassed despite Deadpool recently gassing him
-enchant objects, see magic
-can turn invisible or camouflage
-suit can technologically collapse over him or change into a suit and tie
-created his own Hulkbuster Panther armor
-is explained as not being limited by a no kill rule as he kills anyone who opposes him if he feels like it
All this from a character originally a strategic acrobat whose charm was that he looked a great deal like Batman. I think the iniative might be racially driven because Now he's basically Predator, Deathstroke, Mr. Terrific II, Quicksilver, Serpentor, Reed Richards and Hawkman in one. At least they haven't slapped the Infinity Gauntlet on him yet or have him beat Thanos or Galactus.
@marvelz0mbie: Half of what you said was inaccurate or just flatout wrong, but regardless why did you feel the need to tell me all of that?
@juiceboks: what am I wrong about? Everything in my statement is based off actual feats in the comics. Priest, Hudson and Duffie basically wrote him as a five year Olds reaction to creating a black character that is superior to every street level character out there. He isn't even street anymore. Not to mention fans have exaggerated his King of the Dead upgrades to be something wholly untrue. He is so far from the mid level peak human strategist gymnast royalty that Kirby created him to be it isn't funny. Hell Kirby didn't originally intend for him to look like Batman either.
@marvelz0mbie: This..
lift 60 tons.
..is not based on any feat in the comics..and this..
can restrain the likes of Silver Surfer with a simple armlock
..only happened because Norrin allowed it. Again I ask..why are you telling me all of this?
@juiceboks: No it isn't based off any feat in the comics. In the comics Hudlin wrote Panther Goddess as stating "Every Panther that has ever lived, their strength, their knowledge, is now yours!" Fans have took this to mean because there have been ten centuries of Black Panther's and about three Black Panther's per century that he has their combined strenth and knowledge and that would put him somewhere in the 60 ton range. Even though he has only been shown to rip a cyborg in half or fight Namor since. Things he was capable of originally.
And this whole Norrin allowed the arm lock thing is bogus. Read the comic. Nothing insinuates Silver Surfer allowed it. If anything the penciler depicts Surfer struggling. That is just some excuse McDuffie said to explain the PIS.
The dude is waffling. Black Panther can never lift 60 tons, he is merely a 2 tonner
@marvelz0mbie: Most of what you just is complete bs. Lol at Black Panther being able to lift 60 tons when Marvel's own Strength Scale lists him as only a 2 tonner and that is AFTER the upgrade coz before BP could only lift 800lbs (equalling Captain America)
@carter_esque: The first round is a mismatch. Black Panther wins by nature of base equipment. Second round...does Batman have access to any of his other suits?
Also you say comic feats. Are we talking across the board or only current?
@pwong: batman has better gear and more skilled and comparable stats going by feats.
T’Challa. Bruce might be a bit more versatile in gear, but the effectiveness is essentially nulled in comparison to the vibranium suit/claws. T’Challa is already physically superior and with a comparable skill edge, he beats Bruce handily.
Gear 2: I can seen argument going either way depending what the other does. I’d back BP just due to better resources and being comparably as intelligent.
@god_spawn: I am agree with T’Challa winning the battle in Round 1 for the vibranium suit/claws, but I disagree with him being physically superior to Batman. Batman "peak human" strength is basically superhuman by feats, I think they might be equal and same in skill.
2nd Round: Here I think Batman should win.
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