Baryon Mode Naruto vs Raditz and Nappa

@gelato_exotic: Most Likely, but @rdcdesmond needs to learn the difference in Combat, Flight, Movement, and Reaction speed.

They do not have LS hand to hand combat speed lmao

Nor do they have feats of it

Speed is simply how fast a character can move in a given amount of time. There are five types of speed used for VS purposes: Attack Speed, Combat Speed, Reaction Speed, Travel Speed, and Flight Speed. The term "Speed" normally refers to Combat Speed.

Attack Speed

The speed at which an attack moves. For example, X character is hypersonic, but he can do an attack that is a natural beam of light, the speed for the attack is different from the speed of the user, hence the attack would be lightspeed even if its user isn't.

Combat Speed

The speed at which a character can fight.

Reaction Speed

Reaction speed is the speed at which a character can react to an event or action. This usually only grants a short movement upon reaction, whereas several movements at the same speed switch it to combat speed.

For example, let's say that character A shoots at character B with a gun and character B dodges. That is reaction speed. Keep in mind, sometimes a person aim dodges and it is not as good of a feat.

As another example, let's say that character A uses a minigun on character B, but the minigun takes a second or two to charge up and Character B sees this. If Character B dodges it is considered aim dodging since he/she knew that the attack was going to happen.

Reaction speed is reacting to an attack that you don't know is going to happen, or at a very close range. The reaction speed of a character also tends to be higher than its movement speed.

Travel Speed

The speed at which a character or object can move by running, or through similar means that do not involve flight or teleportation.

Flight Speed

The speed at which a character or object flies a certain distance, like going from the earth to the sun for example.

High flight speed logically requires similar reaction speed in order to maneuver when approaching different objects.

Hand to Hand Combat speed, never.

Attack Speed, Maybe.

Feats. Go get @rdcdesmond

Below Average Human (0-5 m/s)

Normal Human (5-7.7 m/s)

Athletic Human (7.7-9.8 m/s)

Peak Human (9.8-12.43 m/s)

Superhuman (12.43-34.3 m/s)

Subsonic (Faster than the Eye) (Mach 0.1-0.5) (34.3-171.5 m/s or 76.7-383.6 mph)

Subsonic+ (Mach 0.5-0.9) (171.5-308.7 m/s)

Transonic (Mach 0.9-1.1) (308.7-377.3 m/s)

Supersonic (Mach 1.1-2.5)

Supersonic+ (Mach 2.5-5)

Hypersonic (Mach 5-10)

Hypersonic+ (Mach 10-25)

High Hypersonic (Mach 25-50)

High Hypersonic+ (Mach 50-100)

Massively Hypersonic (Mach 100-1000)

Massively Hypersonic+ (Mach 1000-8810.2)

Sub-Relativistic (1%-5% SoL)

Sub-Relativistic+ (5%-10% SoL)

Relativistic (10%-50% SoL)

Relativistic+ (50%-100% SoL)

Speed of Light

FTL (x1-10 Speed of Light)

FTL+ (x10-100 Speed of Light)

Massively FTL (x100-1000 Speed of Light)

Massively FTL+ (x1000+ Speed of Light)

Infinite (The ability to move infinite distance in finite time without the aid of teleportation.)

Inaccessible (The ability to move distances, whether finite or infinite, in zero time without the aid of teleportation. This is usually achieved by moving in places outside of time or places where time doesn't flow.)

Immeasurable (The ability to move all throughout time and space with virtually no limitations whatsoever; all abilities do not count, and statements are generally required, otherwise it's quite often time travel, teleportation or portal creation.)

Irrelevant Being so fast that the concept of speed is irrelevant. Speed qualitatively beyond the concepts of distance and time, exceeding the entirety of the speed formula itself. Note while it is uncommon, it isn't impossible to achieve this speed while not being 1-A or above.

@monstar572: How does being able to hit someone who has LS reactions faster than they can react to not translate to LS attacking speed? Isshiki was charging at Naruto and Naruto reacted and instantly smacked him onto the ground for example.

And Isshiki blitzed and one shotted Naruto and Sasuke earlier, that should also be a LS attack speed feat.

LOL these people think Naruto is FTL+

I swear man ...

@thegodmadara: Thanks for posting the speed stuff though. I can see it clearly now.

No problem

Isshiki was charging at Naruto and Naruto reacted and instantly smacked him onto the ground for example.

And Isshiki blitzed and one shotted Naruto and Sasuke earlier, that should also be a LS attack speed feat.

Charging Is = To Movement/Attack speed which Isn't impressive to Smack tbh.

Blitzing, on the Other Hand, is LS Combat speed if the Person has LS reactions.

There is a big difference in dodging an attack and throwing combinations and having long drawn out battles at that speed

Sasuke can reach higher speeds and blitz Madra when he is dashing

He CANNOT however, remain stationary and throw combinations at that same speed

And the feats directly prove it

Sasuke could fight Kinshiki hand to hand

That very same Kinshiki could get tagged by a Kurotsuchi

Sasuke is also relative to Naruto in hand to hand combat.

Simply put, the feats show otherwise.

Dragon Ball characters h2h combinations in contrast are shown to fight as fast as they fire off ki blast as they casually sprint to and smack each to their ki blast away all the time

The same ki blast that could reach moon in seconds

Therefore, they actually have feats of doing so

Naruto hand to hand wise, does not.

Weaker forms of naruto stomp

*Visible Confusion*

By feats, Saiyan team wins

But investing all of your stock into guidebook statements and misinterpreting canon ones, you get Star Level 40x FTL Naruto like RCD

I already explained that to him yesterday

No where does it say Frieza's beam was light speed

Just a light that moves at super speed, just like any to other ki blast

I know this one wasn't kept in Kai and only applies to Z/GT, but Goku had some feats while travelling Namek that were demonstrably faster than his FTL spaceship.

Was King Kai being unable to perceive Frieza and SS1 Goku's fight yet being able to watch Goku's spaceship while it travelled to Namek kept in Kai too? That'd be another pretty solid FTL feat for the Namek Saga.

Nobody in the entirety of DBZ has any Light Speed feat. They don't get FTL until Super.

OT: Naruto stomps.

@aldoronthegoat: I already explained to you DBZ wasn’t LS or FTL until Namek Frieza and zenkai Base Goku

frieza death beams are said to be beams of light by canon source

Tiers weaker than final form Frieza and base zenkai Goku cannot react fo Frieza LS or FTL death beams

Characters weaker than Zenkai Goku and FF Supressed Frieza do not have LS or FTL reactions

Base Naruto is already on par with Base Zenkai Goku in speed reactions

Goku Kaio Ken x 10 boosts his speed to 10 times

Naruto with just KN1 boosts his speed to 10 times

Naruto Base is already faster than Raditz and Nappa

Then you’re allowing him to stack on his strongest transformation which is over a 40 times boost ? Lol

Raditz and Nappa both can solo the verse

@rdcdesmond:

Are your comprehension skill really that bad?

That's not what the scan says.

Light with Super Speed. Not Blast with speed of light.

@rdcdesmond:

And just like what he many other people have already brought up

Feats >>>> Guidebook statements

By feats they already have them in Saiyan Saga

Just like how by feats, star level Naruto is not acceptable

@wushu59:

It’s obviously saying light speed indicating the word light and LS is super speed faster than one can comprehend.
And Piccolo statements in manga of it being like a flash of light is what supports this as well.

Star Level Naruto lmao.

What Ki blast isn't Light??

Stop taking statements and trying to interpret them your own way to fit your premise

Feats >>>> Statements always by the end of the day

By feats, they factually reach FTL during Saiyan Saga scaling off Piccolo's moon blast

Using indirect Guidebook Statments rather then actual feats is as valid as using Naruto guidebooks to claim they are such & such without feats to prove it

@antonio_1996:

Yup he killed someone who created a dwarf star With his own chakra

Naruto Rasengan overpowers and kills same guy that creates dwarf star

Naruto consistently kept up and damaged Kaguya who was running low on chakra but still caught solid blows and drew blood from her during lava planet battle

Kaguya is at least small star level Naruto has just reached and slightly surpassed it since he was already dwarf star level as adult SPSM now baryon mode is at least small star level

( Statements + Feats that back it up, prove it to be true = Undeniably Valid )

( Statements + No Feats to Back It Up = Debatable Validity )

( Statements + Contradicting Feats = Invalid )

Star level Naruto WTF

@thegodmadara: No idea how

Creation Doesn't = Ap or Durability or DC

@wushu59: Piccolo moon feat is low Relavistic it’s not LS or FTL

the mushroom clouds takes 10 seconds to dissappear

But even if you want to say Piccolo IS LS and use non linear power levels

Piccolo- 300

Blast- 400

Blast Speed- PS

Raditz- 1,200 - 1,500 ( 3 - 3.5 x LS)

Nappa- 4,000 (10 x LS)

Naruto is still much faster than them if we used this flawed logic

No

You can't Calc Stack random numbers with untold boosts unless it's Bankai or Resurreccion and others that have told numbers that scale to it.

Nappa raises his fingers and destroys Naruto with negligible difficulty, the only way you could say that Naruto survives this is if you think Kaguya's durability scales to the AP of her ESTB, around at least Large Planet+, and that Naruto scales to this, which doesn't hold up to scrutiny given that no one in Naruto has consistently shown anything even close to planet level physicals and that the only attack in the Naruto/Boruto series with AP above planetary is the ESTB. Nappa stomps, Raditz wins with some degree of difficulty.

Lol what ??
Bankai is useable but not other stacks 😭that’s kind of biased

Bankai is a 5-10X Stack from Shikai. It's been told. It's not even Biased.

Flaws, Flaws, Flaws.

Anyone else done getting their argument destroyed on this holiday

@rdcdesmond: Thats not how Creation Works.

Creation =/= Ap, Dc, and Durability

It's getting wrecked because it doesn't work that way unless Chakra = Durability/Offense From literal statements which it doesn't.

Beings Who Created Their Own Star with Their Own Energy Do Scale Especially if they can destroy their own creation as well.

This is like saying Prime Soul King doesn’t scale to beyond planetary despite him having created 3 realms.

Except one problem that you are overlooking.

• Raditz dodged it at close range.

So he would have to be MUCH faster then beam

The moon is several thousands times further away from Piccolo then to where Raditz was.

So even if you want low ball speed to 10 seconds or whatever, it doesn't make a difference (actually 4 seconds, but whatever)

2x That amount if automatically FTL

And even if we skip Nappa in scaling, Kaio Ken x2 is already a direct multiplier of guess what....?

TWO.

The PSK has the Power to Scale Beyond Reality and Such and Destroy Anything he Creates as he is "god"(Don't want to bring religion into this). Energy Doesn't Scale to AP/DC Unless there are Direct Statements. I can Make something but Can I destroy the exact same thing even if My Verse hasn't shown those feats?

Creation doesn't = Destruction at all.

Energy needs to Scale to Direct power. Say I create a House, I can't automatically destroy the said house. Creation =/= Destruction let alone AP/Durability.

Creation Doesn't scale to AP/DC at all.

Using the PSK is a Bad Example. Read CFYOW or tag @naruto_buster and learn his feats.

Super Toxic

@emperorthanos-

@rdcdesmond: Don't post that man. Everyone can now see it, dude. Just tag the mods and they can see the stuff, I did the same thing once and got off with a warning. If I wasn't new worse may have been done.

@highmantra_x0sp: It’s not just something that’s thought up

Its done with their chakra they can create said time space with chakra and destroy it with chakra

And it’s a whole star bruh you using a house as a analogy is a horrible counter tbh

@highmantra_x0sp:I think you tagged the wrong person lol you should be telling god Madara not to post such trollish comments and break the rules

@rdcdesmond: wanking piece of garbage as usual. Dbz team stomps

@rdcdesmond: It's not a horrible counter lmfao.

Entire star? When and where first. Chakra doesn't scale to Durability at all but somewhat scales to offense. It's not Reaitsu. Literally not even making sense at this point. Creation =/= destruction let alone Durability/Ap.

@highmantra_x0sp:also Kaguya about to destroy her time space is the counter for creation = destruction

I know y’all Naruto haters hate to acknowledge it but Kishimoto did that 🔥👌🏾