Avatar: Who is the best firebender

Are you aware that Zuko and Azula are siblings, and that Azula defeated Zuko the last time after three panels, as she was holding back?

The Sun Warriors don't channel anything in Zuko, he just imitates their style to a degree.

Azula impressed me the most.

His fire was more powerful, never said it wasn't. She is still a far better firebender. She would beat him 10/10 times. She was far more versatile with her bending and far more skilled in using the element.

It's like a fighter that is stronger vs someone that is more skilled. Just because you are stronger doesn't' mean you would win in the fight because the skilled fighter would beat you because of his/her skill.

@corapvp said:

@alsimmons77: why 'easily' ? I don't recall her doing anything to say she got THAT much better that she is now above Ozai. Zuko could still match her firebending, Mai dodged her lightning and she can still miss. Sure she's definitely better than before and better than Zuko, but it wasn't an insane jump that she's now over ozai

Zuko couldn't match her, Azula just didn't try to hurt him too much, and she literally threw the lightning casually to the ground. What is even your point in the third scan?

And Azula was always a better firebender than Ozai to be honest, all he had was neat lightning and raw but very unrefined power.

Ozai >/= Iroh > Azula > everyone else.

@jedixman:

In terms of power: Ozai = Iroh > Azula

In terms of skill: Iroh = Azula > Ozai

Still Azula of course, Ozai might have more power, but she is overall the better Firebender and combatant.

Including all subskills P'li is the best by feats.

From the list here, Ozai by hype and logic, Azula by feats. Normally id go Azula but the lack of lightning made me vote Ozai.

@alsimmons77:

Azula surprised him with redirection and beat him with H2H. In terms of pure firebending, they're still equal as of S&S.

@alsimmons77: Azula is of course better than Zuko overall but in terms of pure firebending they are equal as evidenced by that first comic scan.

bump

As much as I love Azula I have to go with Iroh for his overall versatility and knowledge.

Oh lol.

Topic:

Still Azula, lol at Zuko being on par with her. Him just once matching her attack in a casual confrontation don't makes up for her superior feats, the same already happened in the chase in Book 2, because Azula obviously don't always even tried to overpower Zuko.

CW Arrow enters the universe and automatically becomes the best fire bender in the history of Firebenders.

Charizard

Zuko - was a very basic firebender as he was growing with no exceptional skills. It was only till he got older that he became a bit of a late bloomer. He would have become more and more powerful but due to his showings i would say he is 5th maybe 6th on the list.

Uncle Iroh - strange one. Iroh was considered the only other person who was strong enough to defeat the Firelord, however Iroh didnt think that. But he has hardly any feats, my only negative about ATLA is that they always built him up with words instead of showings, i'd put him 3rd solely due to the fact he was even considered as being able to defeat the firelord.

Jeong Jeong - Very much sleeped on. Jeong Jeong was a master firebender, a prodigy and was also recognized throughout the Fire Nation as a genius in its usage. His showings during Sozin's comet were impressive, his jets were continuous and was basically standing in air and with relative ease as well, his fire walls both amped and non were massive and powerful, tbh all his showings were impressive only problem was the lack of them. Solid 4th imo.

Azula - Azula was one of the most skilled and powerful firebenders of her time, which was recognized by Iroh, Zuko and Ozai. Of course her most famous feat is the fact she is still the only firebender to produce blue flames which were much more powerful and intense than the usual Orange/Red/Yellow. She was the first to show many feats such a Jet propulsion, whirling disks, blades of fire. Only second to Ozai throughout the series, however due to her age at the time she most definitely would have overtaken Ozai. However 2nd on this list.

Ozai - Confirmed by the writers and the series itself, Ozai was the most powerful firebender of his time. His showings during Sozin's comet were the most impressive and was beating the Avatar before the Avatar state kicked in. During the comet it is said that Ozai was creating the most powerful some of the largest known plumes of fames. A solid 1st place.

Korra - Was very proficient with her firebending, probably her most favoured element as well. She had some great feats whilst using the element, however compared to the others she falls short.

Mako - Talented firebender, due to learning most of his fighting on his own he was actually very powerful. If he had the same training as the others on this list i think he'd be fairly high.

Aang - Once getting over his fear for the element was actually a very skilled firebener, however due to his nature the aggressive attitude required for firebending was hard to come by. However Aang was capable of powerful plumes of fire. His showings against the fire lord also proved that he had a skill for the element. However he personality i think hindered his ability.

My list :

1. Ozai
2. Azula
3. Iroh
4. Jeong Jeong
5. Zuko
6. Korra
7. Aang
8. Mako

I would almost agree with your list, but Azula is number 1 now due to the comics that anyways put any series statements about Ozai into the past, and Mako should be higher than Aang even if just due to his lightning.

I agree, Azula would be number 1 due to comic feats along with Zuko climbing above Jeong Jeong due to feats he has displayed.

The reason for Mako being below Aang is due to the thread not including lightning feats.

If this were the case then yes i would also agree that Mako would be above Aang and potentially Korra as neither have shown lightning feats and Mako was very proficient with lightning.

Zuko would still be higher however due to his feats with fire weighing more with what he has shown in the comics even though he still hasn't produced lightning. But that can also be up for debate.

Fair enough, i forgot that Mako has no lightning for this thread.

@elijames: It is confirmed that Ozai was the most powerful firebender.

where am i , finals calculator

Good for him, but Kemurikage Azula is the best firebender.

Actually, Avatar Wan is the best firebender.

Currently, Azula is the most well rounded firebender in the mythos.

Pound for Pound Azula always wins.

Most diverse, most unique, and with power feats behind her as well. It's gotta be her, even if others might match or surpass her in a single stat like power.

How is Azula leading the poll wtf? It was establish din canon that Ozai was the strongest fire bender in the world. Every piece narrative leads to that conclusion

Someone brought it up in the previous page and people responded that that was referring to the time of the cartoon, and that Azula improved a lot during the comics

Lightning is restricted per OP, so Azula doesn't get any of her best comic feats, and I don't recall any of her regular firebending being better than her EOS version. Ozai is top dog under these conditions.

Still Azula, Ozai was it just in the past but he anyways never had her skill and versatility to be perfectly honest.

Iroh probably, despite Ozai being the most powerful. Although Iroh himself didn’t know if he could actually beat him

Iroh has even worse feats than Mako to be perfectly honest.

I don't think Azula's firebending has really improved much. Most of her new feats are in H2H and lightning - all she's really shown above her show version is slightly better firejets.

Current Azula > Ozai > former Azula > Iroh >= Jeong Jeong > Zuko.

Anyways, here's my case for Wan:

First, I'd argue that he is much more powerful than Azula (who seems to be the favored choice) by feats:

But it's not just that can generate a lot of fire (although he can generate more than Azula) casually, it's that he can damage Vaatu with it:

He was able to consistently injure Vaatu with basic fire blasts, fire slices, and enormous plumes of flame. Now why is this impressive?

Because even a much weaker version of Vaatu can literally no-sell impacts hard enough to knock massive chunks out of hills made of solid rock. Azula can't even replicate that level of power with firebending, let alone exceed it like Wan was doing consistently and casually against Vaatu.

Now, Wan does not have the wide variety of feats that Azula has because he had two episodes as opposed to two seasons + comics, but I'd argue that what he has shown is extremely impressive skill-wise:

Wan is a highly skilled firebender, and much more powerful then his competition here.

This is still going on?

Azula, and that will not change until they create a third series or bring some Amon type of firebender into the comics.

In terms of pure firebending, ignoring Roku and Sozin:

Wan > Ozai >= Iroh >= JJ > Zuko = Azula

Ridiculously lowballing Azula is your hobby, no?

Or why do i never see you do anything else?

There are solid reasons for believing Ozai and Iroh to be above Azula, even if you disagree. Zuko has shown firebending prowess equal to Azula's since the Catacombs - both are equal in power with different move sets. I laid out my case for Wan a couple posts above. JJ I admit is speculative, but his firewall and escape move were both incredible, and his Comet feats were better than those of the siblings.

I better go into a healthier place, before someone also tries to make a case for MCU Mysterio against the Pre Retcon Beyonder or some other shit.

@wrathofthebrad said:

@mialthefencer said:

In terms of pure firebending, ignoring Roku and Sozin:

Wan > Ozai >= Iroh >= JJ > Zuko = Azula

I better go into a healthier place, before someone also tries to make a case for MCU Mysterio against the Pre Retcon Beyonder or some other shit.

No need to be insulting. Which part of what I wrote is completely unreasonable?

@mialthefencer:

No need to be insulting.

That wasn't an insult, i'm just done with the shit i currently read here.

Which part of what I wrote is completely unreasonable?

Azula's position is completely unreasonable, and i'm pretty sure you are smart enough to know that.

Wan has impressive raw power, but has not nearly enough feats to be the best.

Ozai is hype and amped feats, but has not enough skills to be reliably the best.

Iroh is just walking hype with shitty feats.

Jeong Jeong was very impressive a few times, but also lacks feats in general.

And Zuko is the most obvious case of being inferior you could find, it is literally part of their character interaction.

Azula Fanboys: Bring up feats and make it solely about skill to gloss over the fact that according to the lore and writers, that Ozai and (by extension ) Iroh are far better firebenders than she is. Having the most fine control and verstaility doesn't make you the best fighter.

It's either Ozai or Iroh.

That wasn't an insult, i'm just done with the shit i currently read here.

You compared what I wrote to MCU Mysterio beating PR Beyonder. That's pretty insulting.

Azula's position is completely unreasonable, and i'm pretty sure you are smart enough to know that.

There are solid reasons for putting everyone I put above her above her. That's not unreasonable.

Wan has impressive raw power, but has not nearly enough feats to be the best.

I don't see what sheer number of feats has to do with being the best. Korra and Mako both have far more feats than JJ or Ozai, and Zuko has more feats than Azula. Quality > Quantity. Wan's power is far beyond Azula's (as in Azula wouldn't even scratch Vaatu with her firebending) and he has several good skill feats, two of which remain unreplicated by Azula and one of which is unique to him alone.

Ozai is hype and amped feats, but has not enough skills to be reliably the best.

I think it's pretty clear that in-universe and narratively Ozai is above series Azula by a wide margin, and his amped feats support that. He lacks high end skill feats, but I think that's more of a function of lack of screen time and lack of necessity then a lack of skill. As I mentioned above, I don't think Azula's firebending improved much in the comics, so their previous standing is still valid.

Iroh is just walking hype with shitty feats.

Iroh scales to Ozai, and he has probably the single best firebending feat in the series (with the Comet and extensive charging, so not exactly combat applicable, but it lends credibility to his standing).

Jeong Jeong was very impressive a few times, but also lacks feats in general.

It's true that JJ lacks feats, but every single feat he has is highly impressive. Again, quality > quantity.

And Zuko is the most obvious case of being inferior you could find, it is literally part of their character interaction.

That hasn't been true since the Crystal Catacombs, where Zuko and Azula fought as equals, and it certainly hasn't been true since S3 of AtLA, where Zuko reaching Azula's level was a big part of his character growth. Zuko is every bit as powerful a firebender as Azula, as their fights have demonstrated numerous times, along with being every bit as versatile as she is. Both have moves the other lacks, but I think that they're over all equal in terms of firebending. Azula's advantages lie in her lightning, H2H skill, and agility, all of which are irrelevant to this thread.

Could you please post any evidence for these very interessting claims?

Where was written that Ozai is a far better firebender than Azula, let alone that Iroh is? And about which Azula are we even talking here, the 14 years old show version, or the 3-4 years older comic version?

Because if there is no evidence, would i need to assume you are just a salty Ozai or Iroh fanboy considering that you honestly just dismissed feats and skill to determinate the best firebender.

has azula been sucking avatar fan boys at night? first it was best combatant speed wise now fire bending, she had to cheat in her agnikai against zuko, and she is better than ozai, and iroh... jheong jheong? Really!!! this is ridiculous.

Has Azula somehow hurt your feelings?

Zuko was fighting against a much worse crazy version, nobody is talking about that Azula.

Kemurikage Azula, regardless if that hurt some butts. Oh and Jeong Jeong is amazing and should have at least a few percent.

He is blatantly lying XD, there exists only one quote from the Avatar Extras that Ozai was the most powerful firebender during the time of B3. Nothing about Iroh, nothing about the best firebenders and especially no direct comparisons to Azula.

@morbusgrav:

Could you please post any evidence for these very interessting claims?

Where was written that Ozai is a far better firebender than Azula, let alone that Iroh is?

Let's start with the fact that Iroh was stated to be the only one capable of beating Ozai aside if the Avatar couldn't. That alone implies that both Ozai and Iroh > anybody else alive at the time, let alone every other firebender.

Josh Hamilton, one of the episode writers also stated that Ozai was the most powerful firebender.

"Fact: Ozai is the most powerful firebender. Period."

So not only is Ozai the most powerful firebender, the only ones capable of beating him at the time were the Avatar and Iroh...which implies the only other firebender good enough to beat him is Iroh. Not Azula or anyone else.

And about which Azula are we even talking here, the 14 years old show version, or the 3-4 years older comic version?

Is there a fundamental difference here that would make her greater than Ozai or Iroh?

Because if there is no evidence, would i need to assume you are just a salty Ozai or Iroh fanboy considering that you honestly just dismissed feats and skill to determinate the best firebender.

Its not contentious in the least to say Iroh or Ozai would whoop Azula. Just like power and potency, fine control and versality are only part of what makes a good firebender, and not the whole. I'll side with the ones who stated unbeatable to everyone else, but the Avatar and each other.

I never made claims about Iroh, I said Iroh should be the same by extensions as he was stated to be the only one aside from the avatar to be capable of beating Ozai at the time. Frankly, you'll have to tell me where I'm lying.