Aizen's Kyoka Suigetsu Weakness

Following up the events of the Light Novel Bleach Can't Fear Your Own World III:

Tokinada tried to activate Kyoka Suigetsu again, but something was hindering the release of its Shikai.

"Do you remember how Kyoka Suigetsu gets disabled?"

This time it was Aura who spoke; a small smile on her face, her voice emotionless.

Kyoka Suigetsu was an extremely powerful zanpakuto that provided the wielder with absolute superiority once activated. However, it had one single weakness. As long as the target is touching the blade from the front, it is impossible to activate 'complete hypnosis'. Had it been Aizen, it would have been possible to keep the others in check by maintaining the Shikai; the condition being that the opponent had to witness the moment of release of the Shikai just once. Since it was being used by someone other than Aizen, someone whose reiatsu was lower than Aizen's, another weakness of Kyoka Suigetsu is born. The stronger the reiatsu of the opponent, the initial condition of the Shikai itself changed accordingly. Tokinada had gone to great lengths to dexterously display the moment of release of the Shikai to strong warriors such as Kyoraku and Yoruichi; whose collective reiatsu was higher than Tokinada's. Currently, there were quite a few people whose reiatsu were greater than Tokinada's. The place was overflowing with the reiatsu of various people. Ubuginu Hikone. Zaraki Kenpachi. Ginjo Kugo. And finally Michibane Aura.

{t/n: this bit really explains why Kyoka Suigetsu is so lethal when used by someone like Aizen. In Aizen's case; he just needed to show his opponents the Shikai release only once. Once is enough for his opponent to forever be under its spell. It's different in Tokinada's case. If the blade is touched, then the entirety of his hypnosis collapses. But in case of Aizen, he still retained his abilities even after Gin de-activated it. Wielded by Aizen, Kyoka Suigetsu is flawless}

We learned a new weakness of Kyoka Suigetsu, which means we are now at four weaknesses. Though three of those are negated by Aizen's own immense Reiatsu and intellect.

1. Touching the sword prior to the spell release.

2. Using it on multiple people drains Reiatsu faster, Aizen was a war potential for his absurd amount of Reiatsu thus this weakness was hidden from us.

3. The user is responsible for that the victims see. If the illusions are not perfect, then the victim is going to notice flaws. Using it on multiple people means you have to focus a lot. (This brings the question of how Aizen knew about Ichigo's and Renji's new Bankai looked like when he used KS against Yhwach.)

4. When deactivated once, the spell completely ends and those with higher Reiatsu have to be put under the spell again, ie they have to see the Shikai again. This also applies to groups. Then it is enough that the collective has more Reiatsu.

It is possible that the fourth weakness affected Aizen during his fight with Yhwach. After piercing Aizen, Kyoka Suigetsu ended and Yhwach had noticed that the hypnosis was gone, allowing Yhwach to easily consume Aizen.

Source.

Genjutsu is better than KS.

Goku still one shots.

Who?

Anyone in the bleach verse.

But Goku is bullet level.

What new weakness? That someone not even a fraction of Aizens power or intellect can't wield it properly after using it for a few minutes?

yes

I said a weakness to KS, not Aizen. Read clearly.

@standardized said:

@cocoussybreaker said:

@standardized said:

@cocoussybreaker said:

@standardized said:

Goku still one shots.

Who?

Anyone in the bleach verse.

But Goku is bullet level.

yes

Soifon solos.

The excerpt you posted quite literally states that KS is flawless when aizen uses it. Not sure what OP is going for here.

Because everyone else in the verse is weaker than Aizen, thus when used in an argument against another character stronger than Aizen the weakness apply to Aizen.

@cocoussybreaker: How did that guy get kyoka suigetsu? Aizen’s sword fused with his body, nobody should be able to use it now but him.

now i really wonder what would have been if kubo wasn't forced to finish bleach earlier.

@alextheboss: His Zanpakuto can copy other people's abilities

Also we still don’t know what the bankai does, lol

KS's weakness is everyone that has TP resistance.

It seriously took this long for people to understand this? Every hax ability in bleach is based primarily off Reitsu. Therefore those with higher reserves than anyone in the verse (Meliodas, edo-madara, hell even Sakura) are blatantly immune to most if any hax they could hope to deal, as per the very mechanics of Bleach.

The only exclusion I have seen from this is seals and Ichibei's hax. This verse has no form of quantification and is just a heap of inconsistent scaling. FT is honestly more consistent.

@hope_w: @joviolma: @alextheboss:

Read the TL;dr

It was because tokinada was the one using it and his Zanpakutō doesn’t copy abilities perfectly. The reiatsu requirement doesn’t apply to Aizen and having higher reiatsu definitely doesn’t grant you immunity to all powers.

It would be a stretch to state that Aizen’s reiatsu was higher than that of the entire gotei combined, including yamamoto who he himself stated was stronger than him. There’s also the fact that it worked on Yhwach who higher reiatsu than him.

@ourmanuel: Why you tag me ?

I was trying to make people aware of the reason why tokinada’s couldn’t work.

@ourmanuel: What this even have to do with what I said, I'm just saying that anyone with good TP resistance could arguable counter KS.

I know, I’m talking about the post in particular.

make you smell roses in the air, or make you feel all your skin burning has nothing to do with TP

@cocoussybreaker: it seems you misread the excerpt. This difference btwn tokinada and aizen's KS is that in aizen's case, he only needs to show the opponent(s) once and they are in it for life whereas tokinada needs to keep reactivating KS once it's been broken. It's less about the strength of the opponent and more about the ability to keep maintaining it indefinitely.

Aizen had the entire gotei 13 under KS for a better part of a century including Yamamoto who alone >> aizen but KS never broke. Even after gin discovered it's weakness, it still remained.

Same thing which ywach who would rip aizen to shreds in a heartbeat.

Also you should read the chapters that followed said excerpt.

What's the most amount of people aizen has ever had under an illusion at once?

@gabrielbelmont:

Telepathy is often short hand for any kind of mind hax.

This is flawed reasoning.

What are you talking about? My point was proven.

The stronger the reiatsu of the opponent, the initial condition of the Shikai itself changed accordingly. Tokinada had gone to great lengths to dexterously display the moment of release of the Shikai to strong warriors such as Kyoraku and Yoruichi; whose collective reiatsu was higher than Tokinada's. Currently, there were quite a few people whose reiatsu were greater than Tokinada's. The place was overflowing with the reiatsu of various people. Ubuginu Hikone. Zaraki Kenpachi. Ginjo Kugo. And finally Michibane Aura.

Only number 1 applies to aizen. All of the other were explicitly stated to be tokinada weakness.

Tokinada doesnt actually wield KS so it has more weaknesses and he has much less reiatsu which also gave him additional problems

@cocoussybreaker: and as I pointed out aizen had the entire gotei 13 and the vaizard (whose collective reitsu certainly far surpasses his own) under KS for almost a freaking century.

Also, as I said, read the chapter that followed. I'll post the excerpt

"As he spoke, Tokinada tried to activate ‘Kyoka Suigetsu’; but once more; he could not perform Shikai.

“...?”

“What’s wrong? Is that a chink in your armour that I see?”

Tokinada flew backwards as Ginjo’s attacks increased in both speed and force.

“Impossible.. Are you still suppressing it? Aura...”

Even though more than half of her reiatsu was sucked away, a part of Aura’s body was still kept diffused in all directions; continuing to touch the various blades of Tokinada. One of the blades was ‘Ruri’iro Kujaku’; but Aura had not let go of it even when it continued to absorb her reiatsu.

“Why are you still touching it? You wish to just die meaninglessly here?”

Then Aura responded, standing up.

“There is meaning.”

“What is it?”

“Perhaps I am... it’s strange...”

Whilst Tokinada kept Ginjo’s attacks in check, Aura seemed to pour all her life force into stopping the invocation of ‘Kyoka Suigetsu’."

https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/comments/at5dul/?utm_content=comments&utm_medium=post_embed&utm_name=ef38f166c8884a849b91a89315ffe8ff&utm_source=embedly&utm_term=at5dul

As we clearly see, the sole reason tokinada simply couldn't just reactivate KS was due to aura using her unique abilities to stop him.

@kroczilla: that's the first weakness nothing to do with the earlier part.

"Since it was being used by someone other than Aizen, someone whose reiatsu was lower than Aizen's, another weakness of Kyoka Suigetsu is born."

"The stronger the reiatsu of the opponent, the initial condition of the Shikai itself changed accordingly."

Anyone stronger than Aizen will make KS flicker with this weakness just how Yhwach prove against Aizen's KS during the final fight.

Note: Entire Gotei 13 having more reiatsu than Aizen is BS because he was a war potential for his reiatsu while Yamamoto wasn't even consider a war potential.

GG

This thread should be in Gen.Discussion.

Aizen was a war potential after hogyoku amps.

Aizen got Yhwach under KS and held him under it for quite a bit, despite the gigantic difference in Reiatsu. By what you’re saying, it shouldn’t have ever happened.

Aizen admitted that yamamoto was stronger than him. Still KS’d

Aizen had too many powerful people under KS at the same time for reiatsu to matter.

Tokinada's copying has its limitations, like being unable to replicate ichigo’s zangetsu properly.

yeah, kinda sucks that people like hisagi and shinji get theirs revealed.

Maybe a new databook could help.

@cocoussybreaker: except if the first weakness was still a thing, there would have been no need for aura to go the extra mile of literally risking her life to stop KS by holding it.

Also FYI, aizen was a war potential AFTER merging with the hogyuku. Before that he was scared of fighting a zanpaktou less Yamamoto despite using KS.

The collective gotei 13 far >>> base aizen in terms of reitsu as Yamamoto alone was superior to him in that regard. And that's without even bringing up the vaizard and the espada all of whom aizen had under KS simultaneously

Aizen lost the Hogyoku amps. Novel said Aizen is just a Shinigami even after becoming stronger, and it doesn't contradict anything since he was able to keep everyone on KS in Karakura Town including Yammamoto providing evidence that he had more Reiatsu. Even Unohana stated that the only one that could match Aizen was someone with double the reiatsu of a Captain which Aizen said to have to awaken the Hogyoku in the first place. Having Yhwach under KS doesn't affect the rules and Aizen wasn't that far weaker than Yhwach, otherwise, Hado 99 wouldn't had clean Yhwach'' reiatsu from the battlefield.

Kenpachi is physically stronger than Aizen but that doesn't mean he has more Reiatsu than Aizen. GG

Zangetsu cannot be copy because is a hybrid sword which means Ginjo sword shouldn't be possible to copy either. Not a weakness for Tokinada. A feat for Zangetsu.

1. Aura didn't know what that others did and she was suicidal since she decided to save Hikone.

2. Already answered in post #36

3. False. Go to post #36

Never change Hope, never change.

@cocoussybreaker: 1. Yhwach out haxed KS once he realized he was under it.

2. Tokinada himself says that him being weaker than aizen is what caused the weakness to develop

3. Aizen was only a war potential post hogokyu amp. Before that he didn't even have more reiatsu than yama let alone the entire gotei. He had shunsui levels of reiatsu tbh.

4. Aizen had everyone under KS since he was a lieutenant so unless you think lieutenant aizen has more reiatsu then the entirety of the gotei. That weakness doesn't apply to him

1. Yhwach admitted to not knowing why it ended.

2. Same thing would happen if Aizen fought a being stronger than him because it will require Aizen to spent more Reiatsu reaching a level where he will become weak from lack of energy.

3. That was debunked. Aizen and Ichigo were the only two pwopeo with double the reiatsu of a Captain.

4. The spell isn't infinite. He can desactivate the spell and activate again. Manga says no one had more reiatsu than Aizen occasionally.

@cocoussybreaker:

1) it didn't matter what the others knew or not. Their reitsu was still present which was exactly what hindered tokinada from reactivating KS (aizen as stated never had any need to reactivate KS as his own version lasted indefinitely). Yet aura was certain tokinada could reactivate it once he understood what was going on and actively tried to stop him.

2) I have never such an extreme case of fan canon since my time here.

Literally not sure where to start.

Aizen was used permanently with the hogyuku. It's the entire reason he's become immortal. No where does the novel even imply that this fact has change. If it had, aizen would have been executed on the spot.

Aizen had had the entire gotei 13 under KS even before the manga began (he had them under KS for at least a century before ichigo was born).

Also aizen and ichigo weren't the only people with double the reitsu of a standard captain.

Unohana never made such statement in that context. Rather she was referring to the fact that ichigo apart from his high reitsu (which was still far below aizen talkles of Yamamoto at the time) was also the only person who had never seen KS and thus was their only real chance of stopping aizen.

Lol @ aizen being in anyway comparable to ywach. What aizen cleaned up with hado 90 was basically reitsu that leaked off ywach while he was preoccupied with absorbing to soul king. In the final battle ywach not only destroyed the chair which aizen couldn't even put a scratch on but also made aizen (save for his KS buying time for ichigo's arrival) a non factor.

@cocoussybreaker: 1. Forgot he said that. Still don't see how that isn't out haxing it unless aizen was nearly dead from that one attack which is possible.

2. Current aizen doesn't have that problem since he has a near infinite amount of reiatsu

3. That was not debunked. Yama had more spiritual pressure than shunsui and ukitake in their first encounter. Nanao was even sure they could do anything to him because of how high it was. You could even argue that shunsui and ukitake had more reiatsu than people like tousen or toshiro. Kenpachi also has more than twice a captains reiatsu. The only reason ichigo was relevant on that last fight was because he hadn't seen KS yet

4. Lieutenant aizen didn't have anywhere close to the amount of reiatsu as the entire gotei...not even close

@alextheboss: by pure indisputable feats, you know as well as I do I can quite easily prove Sakura to have superior reserves to anyone in bleach.

1. Because all of their reiatsu together is stronger than Tokinada. This is basically said in the book. Lmao

2. Aizen was born stronger than everyone like the Royal Families prodigies.

Everything else you posted is non-essential. Unohana did refer to Ichigo and Aizen said to Orihime that he needed double reiatsu of a Captain to awaken the Hogyoku.

1. Aizen nearly dead? Lmao he is immortal.

2. It was never mentioned that he had that much. Headcanon right there boi.

3. That doesn't mean anything.

4. Prove he didn't because when his backstory was read by Ichigo he said that Aizen had that kind of power from birth and that's why he felt lonely.

@cocoussybreaker:

1) and except their reitsu suddenly disappeared, your point holds no water.

2) *facepalm* aizen admitted that he couldn't take on Yamamoto and thus had wonderweiss as a back up plan. And there's a big difference btwn being born a prodigy and having more reitsu than the combined gotei 13 made up of several prodigies and Yamamoto himself (who again aizen was scared to take on 1v1)

3) ichigo was relevant because he hadn't seen KS.

In the novel it's also said that people of a much higher reiatsu level than the user can resist the illusion (Releasing Aizen-level reiatsu would dispel Tokinada's Kyouka Suigetsu).

So I speculate that Aizen can't hypnotize people who are say, large planet level+ because they got too much energy.

@phantomrant: ??? Really ?

@cocoussybreaker: 1. Either he nearly killed aizen or he out haxed it. KS stopped working on him and was never reactivated and those are the only 2 reasons why

2. Actually mayuri stated he does have infinite reiatsu because as long as his heart beats it will keep making reiatsu and he is immortal so it will always beat

3. That means that yama and kenpachi for sure have twice the reiatsu of a captain and you could argue that shunsui and ukitake do as well

4. That's easy to prove. Captain aizen didn't have more reiatsu than yama so therefore lieutenant aizen didn't have more then the entire gotei

This is from the release after the one that OP posted.

Hisagi was no longer operating in the dark, he was looking straight at Tokinada. But his visual, auditory and olfactory senses as well as reikaku should not be functioning properly. Therefore it should have been impossible to grasp Tokinada’s exact location from just his conversation with Ginjo and Aura. It was impossible to attack unless one could cancel out the hypnosis by releasing reiatsu of Aizen’s level.