ace vs katakuri

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deactivated-66668859dc4c2

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Poll ace vs katakuri (34 votes)

portgas d ace 24%
charlotte katakuri 76%
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Edgelord91

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I don't see how axe deals with his future sight

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PlagueDocter

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1) I don't see how axe deals with his future sight

Superior stats, aoe, proficient haki usage.

OT: Ace with his Ace novel feats which are canon and even without slams any Sweet Commander.

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MasterBuster666

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Ace claps bruh.

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DerTilt

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God damn ace wankers.Katakuri murks that loser

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Edgelord91

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@plaguedocter: Ace has better DC and stamina. That's it. Katakuri has better speed and haki and has shown to dunk on basic haki users like Ace

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Tunometecabrasa

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What has Ace done to this be debatable?

Katakuri destroys him.

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deactivated-6672dc4dc7827

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BigSnacks785x

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PlagueDocter

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@edgelord91 said:

1) Ace has better DC and stamina. That's it.

Nope he has plenty more, you do know of the Ace Novel and Manga adaptation of it.

A Rookie Ace who just went against Jinbe could take a swing from Whitebeard, and he could survive 100 duels with Whitebeard.

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2) Katakuri has better speed

Huh... Ace can dodge some swings from Whitebeard...

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3) and haki and has shown to dunk on basic haki users like Ace

Huh... just because you are a "basic haki user" doesn't mean Katakuri will dunk on him... heck Katakuri's armament is just basic armament just a higher potency than most (like WCI Luffy's excluding G4 Boundman).

Young Ace could burn Jinbe and a later ace could burn Whitebeard's palm twice and even have him use a bit of his devil fruit that's an insane level of offensive power and ace could clash with Whitebeard. Katakuri's got nothing on that his peer WCI Luffy got oneshot by Base Kaido.

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Ace could also though against a younger weaker Yamato could combat her and clash in a pretty even fight.

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Death8Dragon

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Kata should win low diff his attack spam + future sight and speed will let him win

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PlagueDocter

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@bigsnacks785x said:

1)How powerful is novel ace just curious to know?

Just read my Post #9.

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monkey_d_joe

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Use some logic

Ace stronger than luffy at all stages in their life

He would grow up to be an absolute beast

He would brush aside karakuri

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StrawDiv

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Ace wins since he has superior stats.

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#14 pics  Online

Katakuri wins.

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Enemybird

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Ace loses mostly due to lack of feats.

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nassergrant19

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@strawdiv said:

Ace wins since he has superior stats.

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Akumu

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#17  Edited By Akumu
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Captain_Redfists

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Katakuri stomps

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kgb725

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@strawdiv said:

Ace wins since he has superior stats.

Liars

@bigsnacks785x said:

1)How powerful is novel ace just curious to know?

Just read my Post #9.

A biased analysis A. This is not prime white beard B. Whitebeard one shot him in his sleep if he wanted to kill him he could've done so rather easily. C. Snakeman is faster than Whitebeard D. We've seen commanders (Queen , Marco) push Yonko slightly and then getting absolutely folded.

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S22Sabo

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KGL

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#21  Edited By KGL

Katakuri stomps.

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Edgelord91

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@plaguedocter: white beard wasn't trying to kill ace and one shot once he got serious just like kaido did to Luffy. This doesn't prove he's stronger.

2- Not as impressive as outmaneuvering snake man.

3- Yeah it does that's how haki works. Stronger haki user has the advantage provided there isn't a a significant stat difference. Armament is debatable given Ace's lack of showings but observation is a landslide in katakuri's favor and it DID allow him to dunk on Luffy.

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PlagueDocter

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#23  Edited By PlagueDocter

@edgelord91 said:

1) white beard wasn't trying to kill ace and one shot once he got serious just like kaido did to Luffy. This doesn't prove he's stronger.

Kaido never got serious with Luffy not until far into the Onigashima rooftop fight and Act 1 Kaido didn’t really care to kill Luffy either he just like he did to Kidd threw him into Udon to try to break him and have him join his crew (oddly familiar to Ace hmm).

2) Not as impressive as outmaneuvering snake man.

It's vastly more impressive one is dodging strikes from a Yonko the other is dodging strikes from WCI Luffy who once again a stronger Luffy got oneshot and blitzed by Base Drunk Jobbing Kaido... like are we serious right now?

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3) Yeah it does that's how haki works. Stronger haki user has the advantage provided there isn't a a significant stat difference. Armament is debatable given Ace's lack of showings but observation is a landslide in katakuri's favor and it DID allow him to dunk on Luffy.

Haki isn't everything strength, devil fruit, etc can beat it just look at Luffy vs the Snake sisters... and like I said Ace has far better offense than Katakuri he could hurt Whitebeard twice in a striaght up duel burning his hand and could clash with his Supreme blade, etc.

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Eredin12

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Either way

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alextheboss

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Even excluding the Ace novel, I feel like Oda would have Ace win this... At the very least it should be close.

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Edgelord91

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@plaguedocter: 1- he got one shot once a yonko actually tried which was my point. Ace has the power advantage but it's not a massive difference.

2-Dodging normal swings isn't as impressive. Luffy did that on rooftop and still got blitzed by thunder bagua. Even WCI Sanji and Luffy could intercept a punch from big mom and katakuri blitzes them.

3- I said UNLESS THERE'S A SUBSTANTIAL STAT DIFFERENCE. Ace isn't faster than katakuri and has blatantly inferior observation haki so he is at a disadvantage there. Especially with katakuri's no touch preemptive fighting style (If Ace goes for entai kat will try to stop him)

In terms of power Ace's fellow commander Jozu drew blood from kuzan but couldn't break out his Doffy's strings. G4 boundman successfully did that while heavily fatigued. Katakuri stomped this gear 4th

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deactivated-6667c426763e4

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Use some logic

Ace stronger than luffy at all stages in their life

He would grow up to be an absolute beast

He would brush aside karakuri

no logic here hahaha.even if ace is still alive he cant be stronger than G5 luffy nowadays so ace was going to be outdated.all you talk it was about if ace never died horever this was no a argument for ace winning and katakuri would beat this fodder.katakuri>>>ace

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deactivated-6667c426763e4

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kata wins.ace is a loser only

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deactivated-6667c426763e4

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katakuri

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PlagueDocter

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@edgelord91 said:

1) he got one shot once a yonko actually tried which was my point. Ace has the power advantage but it's not a massive difference.

Kaido didn't even need to try and he oneshot Luffy. Act 1 Luffy couldn't pressure Yonko or any some such.

Whitebeard had to use his fruit and try a bit. Ace could put pressure on Whitebeard.

I don't think it gets any clearer than that.

2) Dodging normal swings isn't as impressive. Luffy did that on rooftop and still got blitzed by thunder bagua. Even WCI Sanji and Luffy could intercept a punch from big mom and katakuri blitzes them.

WCI Big Mom wasn't right in her mind in the least like the entirety of WCI between the picture smashing, Jinbe leaving, wedding cake destroyed, Germa marriage failure, hunger pangs, Poneglyph stolen, Cracker defeated, Whole cake Chateau destroyed, Bege betrayal, etc... she was literally crazed out her mind starving barely conscious near the end of the arc.

3) I said UNLESS THERE'S A SUBSTANTIAL STAT DIFFERENCE. Ace isn't faster than katakuri and has blatantly inferior observation haki so he is at a disadvantage there. Especially with katakuri's no touch preemptive fighting style (If Ace goes for entai kat will try to stop him)

Why isn't he faster. WHY... dodging multiple swings from a Yonko >>> WCI Luffy/Katakuri levels of speed... as evident when a fresh Act 1 Luffy whose stronger than his WCI self got bodied by a single swing from a jobbing base Kaido...

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Meanwhile Ace even by his 99th duel no longer was in a onesided battle against Whitebeard and like I said he could burn whitebeards palm twice and clash with him his offense is >>> Katakuri and any sweet Commander.

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Ace is directly said to be able to apply pressure to Whitebeard and even burned Whitebeard despite him using his fruit.

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4) In terms of power Ace's fellow commander Jozu drew blood from kuzan but couldn't break out his Doffy's strings. G4 boundman successfully did that while heavily fatigued. Katakuri stomped this gear 4th

I hate when people say this it takes it so out of context...

Jozu hit an Aokiji who was in the middle of a fight with Whitebeard and he had Whitebeard's haki infused supreme blade Murakumogiri lodged in his chest when he got body slammed by Jozu and his body shattered... Jozu doesn't even scale to that you could easily equate a majority of that damage due to Aokiji getting hit while the haki infused blade was y'know LODGED in his chest... not to mention it was like a literal drop of blood.

Also Jozu ain't Ace why does he even matter... the commanders ain't even ranked via strength and even if they were Jozu's a bit down on the list anyways.

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monkey_d_joe

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@deactivated-6667c426763e4: lots of power house characters are featless

Oda is not great at battles or displaying feats of strength

But you best believe Ace had he lived would be a top tier character

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MonvieZ3

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Katakuri one shot this fodder then put a jelly bean into his head,

Ace is such a fodder commander out of bunch that he gets rocked by physically low tier like Pre-TS Blackbeard,

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and fight fodder Jinbei in full 5 days who is tiers below even Base Doffy,

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While stronger version like Awakened doffy can't even react, hurt nor tank G4 Luffy,

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Then here kata literally dodged the fastest G4 form with fastest attack amped by Future sight,

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Even Ace has aokijii level of AP in his sleeve he's not going to tag kata in a million times while kata could literally drill mogura to his chest or paste him with chikara mochi.

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#33 pics  Online

@monviez3:

Ace is such a fodder commander out of bunch that he gets rocked by physically low tier like Pre-TS Blackbeard,

I agree Katakuri wins, but there's hardly any logic in your reasoning. Blackbeard is not a "low-tier" nor is his physicals meant to be undermined. Blackbeard’s physical prowess was noted by Shanks, emphasizing the fact that when he fought Blackbeard he wasn’t even careless, gaining a scar that Mihawk or anyone Shanks had fought couldn’t inflict. Shanks warns Whitebeard of Blackbeard, not only for Ace’s sake but Whitebeard too because eventually, Whitebeard’s position will be his. Simply put, if Blackbeard prior to obtaining any devil fruit scarring Shanks is being used as a metric to detail his strength especially to another Yonko then it sets a pretty good picture of the rightful threat that Blackbeard is soon and meant to be. So Ace getting physically dawged by Blackbeard is not an anti-showing, as a matter of fact even Katakuri would get physically washed.

and fight fodder Jinbei in full 5 days who is tiers below even Base Doffy,

How do you use the Ace Novel and use this as a way to cap Ace's power for fighting Jinbei as a rookie? Ace explicitly got stronger from that point on. Jinbei even notes how he's a completely different person since their fight. Jinbei isn't on Ace's level by his peak.

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LilacPlasmaBeam

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What has Ace done for this to be debatable?

Katakuri destroys him.

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Edgelord91

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@plaguedocter: 1- he got kaido to use a serious named attack. Your own scan makes it clear Ace got stomped by a suppressed white beard. Katakuri explicitly has Greater AP than bound man who forced big mom to block with amarment haki. The gap isn't that big.

2-Big mom was still sane for that encounter same with blocking boundman.

3- all ace did was dodge standard swings which Luffy also did in ch 1000. It was a named attack (thunder bagua) that blitzed him in the next chapter.

4- The stab blatantly did nothing because of him morphing around it. My point is Ace and Josh both did minor damage to top tiers (kuzan is relative to akanui who killed Ace) White beard is obviously stronger but katakuri stronger than jozu.

Not saying who wins or loses but katakuri has a clear advantage in terms of haki and isn't far behind in terms of DF mastery and stats. It's not a stomp for either.

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PlagueDocter

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@edgelord91 said:

1) he got kaido to use a serious named attack. Your own scan makes it clear Ace got stomped by a suppressed white beard

Whitebeard doesn't have named attacks he has techniques and moves but they aren't named as he just doesn't name things.

And like I said it was a jobbing Kaido at no point was he "serious" he was literally drunk and as soon as he did went on the offensive he blitzed and oneshot a fresh and stronger Luffy than the Luffy who beat Katakuri... Kaido didn't even need to use his Devil Fruit he was just in base.

Meanwhile Ace can make Whitebeard use his Devil Fruit, and can pressure Whitebeard.

Also where does my scan say he got stomped please tell me he lost yes but stomp nope. A stomp is Act 1 G4 Luffy vs Kaido... Ace could last, could pressure WB, could dodge some of his attacks, etc Luffy couldnt even harm Kaido and it was a one amd done and Luffy was KO'd and almost dead.

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It was literally no longer a complete one-sided stomp in Whitebeard's favour by the last couple duels between the two... Whitebeard used his a bit of his Devil Fruit and still got burned when he clashed.

2) Katakuri explicitly has Greater AP than bound man who forced big mom to block with amarment haki. The gap isn't that big.

Katakuri literally doesn't in fact he EXPLICITLY doesn't have better Ap than Boundman why are you just straight up lying Edgelord.

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3) Big mom was still sane for that encounter same with blocking boundman.

And what does this prove even if I were to say that yes she still wasn't really trying.

4) all ace did was dodge standard swings which Luffy also did in ch 1000. It was a named attack (thunder bagua) that blitzed him in the next chapter.

Rooftop Post Udon Luffy >> Act 1 G4 Boundman Luffy > End of WCI G4 Luffy > Katakuri.

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A much stronger Luffy could dodge basic swings from Kaido... Katakuri in no way scales to that.

5) The stab blatantly did nothing because of him morphing around it.

Bruh you don't understand what I'm saying at all do you.

It was still inside his body while infused with haki... then he got body slammed... I hope I don't have to explain why getting body slammed while having a Yonko's haki infused Supreme Grade Blade in your chest would be bad for Aokiji...

6) My point is Ace and Jozu both did minor damage to top tiers (kuzan is relative to akanui who killed Ace) White beard is obviously stronger but katakuri stronger than jozu.

And like I said Jozu can't even really be attributed with the literal drop of blood that Aokiji bled. And even if he were... still very different... one was a literal drop of blood from an distracted non defending opponent (Aokiji) while the other is burning a Yonko's (Whitebeard) hand multiple times while in a direct duel and locked in combat with eachother.

One is magnitudes more impressive of a feat than the other and I hope I don't have to explain this either.

And yes I agree Katakuri > Jozu but neither scale to or off of Aokiji's drop of blood.

7) Not saying who wins or loses but katakuri has a clear advantage in terms of haki and isn't far behind in terms of DF mastery and stats. It's not a stomp for either.

It's a landslide victory for Ace he's better in almost every way except Observation Haki mastery, Devil Fruit Mastery (Awakening), and maybe Armament... but all of those don't matter as he's significantly faster and his Observation Haki is still really good, his devil fruit is better, and his overall offense is massively better than Katakuri's not to mention the rest of his stats.

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BigBaby

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#37  Edited By BigBaby

Ace gets stomped. He's not winning this at all because he has no counters to haki, can't harm logia types, and doesn't have any counters to future sight.

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diydeath

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Katakuri wins due to his superior haki. That's literally the decider in this fight.

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Edgelord91

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#39  Edited By Edgelord91

@pics: so why do you think katakuri wins?

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nassergrant19

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#40  Edited By nassergrant19
@bigbaby said:

Ace gets stomped. He's not winning this at all because he has no counters to haki, can't harm logia types, and doesn't have any counters to future sight.

Wdym no counters to haki? He has his own haki that has better feats.

He‘s faster than Kata so he doesn’t really need a counter to it.

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nassergrant19

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Dolchio

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In terms of devil fruit match-up, Ace is in a better position than Luffy was. Fire should work fairly well against most of Katakuri's long range mochi based attacks.

However Ace is definitely lacking in the haki department compared to Katakuri.

The fight will likely move into melee range pretty quickly in which Katakuri will win most if not all exchanges due to superior physicals and haki.

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#43  Edited By pics  Online

@edgelord91:

Glad you asked. I think it’s silly that Katakuri is being portrayed as slower than Ace for reasons that have to do with fighting a Yonko that is putting an unknown amount of effort and even then, that same logic should be applicable to WCI Sanji and Luffy that stopped attacks and reacted to attacks from Big Mom, Jinbei and Luffy avoided attacks earlier too from a Big Mom who intended to kill them. Big Mom is also quantifiably faster than Old Whitebeard. The most I’ll give Ace’s speed is the fact that he has actually shown to compete with Aokiji’s attacks, while the effort is unknown we at least have a good metric to understand that just his casually expanding his Ice is more than fast enough to complete speed-blitz people like Doflamingo

One Piece: Chapter 699

I don’t think this allows Ace to compete speed-wise or be faster than Katakuri due to this however because the Aokiji metric is still hard to place where the speed of that attack he used on Ace caps at. Meanwhile I’d argue Katakuri is faster and a more efficient fighter. Combating Snakeman Luffy in their fight, especially when Luffy had just unlocked future-sight in that fight in such a way you completely weave through the constantly accelerating, aim-botted punches and then tagging that person showcases a speed-feat I don’t see Ace replicating at all

One Piece: Chapter 895
One Piece: Chapter 895

Katakuri having future-sight and being able to combat future sight users easily makes his effective-speed better than Ace, in addition to Katakuri being able to outright summon donut-punches from blindspots that can follow your choice of movement and come at different angles. Combined with an awakening that is as simple as Katakuri pointing his hand towards the area he wants to transmute and it becoming Mochi which will attack you, effective against someone that has potent-heat based attacks with good AoE, future-sight gives Katakuri the leverage of knowing the type of attack, when to prepare and how to act like diverting the attacks Ace intends to utilize. The crux of it all is that this fight ends up being melee where Katakuri will at every turn counter-attack nearly everything Ace can do and the moment there is a gap in distance, Katakuri easily closes it up by turning himself into a spinning donut (it has legit tagged Snakeman Luffy twice) and then hits Ace with a spinning, spiked Haki coated, slamming attack.

Chapter: 895
Chapter: 895

Ace’s endurance to intake attacks of Katakuri’s level doesn’t have the feats for an extended period of time so a single Buzz Cut Mochi likely ends the fight once Katakuri previously built up enough damage to stick on Ace.

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Desolater

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@dolchio said:

In terms of devil fruit match-up, Ace is in a better position than Luffy was. Fire should work fairly well against most of Katakuri's long range mochi based attacks.

However Ace is definitely lacking in the haki department compared to Katakuri.

The fight will likely move into melee range pretty quickly in which Katakuri will win most if not all exchanges due to superior physicals and haki.

This tho aces dc is pretty large so katakuri might have a hard time dodging some of his attacks.

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Edgelord91

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#45  Edited By Edgelord91

@pics: Plus haki is confirmed to be able to counter fire attacks including ACE'S

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BigBaby

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#46  Edited By BigBaby

@nassergrant19: Where did he ever demonstrate Haki? The man couldn't grasp that Luffy awakened COQ before him, and then he got killed by Akainu four to five panels later.

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nassergrant19

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@bigbaby:

Where did he ever demonstrate Haki?

Against WB and Yamato.

The man couldn't grasp that Luffy awakened COQ before him,

Ace awakened CoC first…..

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and then he got killed by Akainu four to five panels later.

Akainu would do the same to Kata lol.

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BigBaby

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#48  Edited By BigBaby

@nassergrant19: That one instance of him doing COQ is very contextual and done by accident. He has never replicated a single feat after that on conscious effort from what I remember. I haven't watched/read One Piece in some time, nor have I caught up to Wano, but can you post the scans for WB and Yamato? I would still honestly argue that his haki won't prove much in this battle against someone as experienced on Katkuri's level.

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BBNakedSnake

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Ace gets stomped, I don't even think he's stronger than Cracker lmao

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PlagueDocter

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1) Ace gets stomped, I don't even think he's stronger than Cracker lmao

Huh?!

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Ace stomps any Sweet Commander.