Her sword reflects power back on intense scale. Here it reflects a city level light/energy blast (Bleach 652/653)
.
Rukia Kuchiki (with light speed perk)
She freezes stuff and can get to absolute zero (that's right, the speed stopper as per DCs Captain Cold and per explanation in the series)
She has an AoE attack I will show in strategy
Bleach 201
creates frozen vertical freeze from ground vertically upward
Bleach 567, 569, 570
.
Charles Xavier
I believe everybody knows. Telepath. Will explain more in strategy. Don't have to waste post space, IMO
.
Shunsui Kyoraku
Shadow manipulator (teleporter and others). If there is a shadow he can teleport through it, even if its on a person Bleach 374
inury sharing. its a city level AoE where any damage within the AoE share injuries. (I have No Friendly Fire perk so my teams injuries do not reflect on my team) Bleach 647 and 648
the AoE also has some emotion manipulation
.
Askin Nakk Le Vaar
he is my damage soaker. when exposed to something he can make it lethal to his opponent in his AoE Bleach 658, 663
He has made things like oxygen, nitrogen, spirit energy, fire, electricity, and blood lethal to his opponent
.
Kisuke Urahara
He is my prep, genius, magic, ninja, matter manipulator
energy magic
magic seals
AoE matter manipulation
.
X-Men team perk (Cyclops, Beast, Gambit, Wolverine, Nightcrawler
.
PREP
Since Asken has an AoE that makes anything he is subject to poisonous as per scan, we will subject Askin to magic
Urahara gives everyone outside of Asken, clones as their real body hides in shadows per Shunsui
STRATEGY
Xavier stalls Jonz with TP
I seal Manhunter with magical seals while in TP battle with Xavier
I have to eliminate speed, so Rukia unleashes her AoE absolute zero and due to my perk of No Friendly Fire, my team is immune to the AoE while Jonz is in a TP battle with Xavier
Zatanna's magic has been made moot since if she uses it it incaps her due to Asken
Shunsui uses his AoE bankai, with No Friendly Fire perk it doesnt effect my team, to take out the entire Chitari force
According to Green Arrow, Zatanna is the most powerful member of the Justice League. She is also considered to be one of the most powerful magic-users in the DC universe. I won't go much into her history because you can easily find that on her CV page. In tribute to her father, she tends to cast her spells by speaking backwards, but she has shown on many occasions that she can cast spells without speaking at all. She is a high-tier reality warper, capable of affecting the entire universe, going up against universal threats, and altering both space & time. Her power is practically limitless.
Powers
Magic:
Elemental Manipulation
Telekinesis
Telepathy
Teleportation/Dimensional Travel
Reality Manipulation
Time Manipulation
Flight
Force Fields
Magical Blasts
Healing
Invisibility
Matter Manipulation
Precognition
Superhuman Strength/Durability
And the list goes on...
Abilities
Hand-to-Hand Combat (trained since childhood; further training by Batman, Martian Manhunter, and various other JL members)
Prestidigitation (Stage Magician/Illusionist)
Hypnosis
Sleight of Hand
Occultism (knowledge of magic)
Martian Manhunter (Pre-52)
Introduction
Martian Manhunter (or MMH) is considered to be one of the most powerful members of the Justice League, and has been stated to be more powerful than Superman on multiple occasions. He is extremely versatile, a "swiss army knife" of superheroes. He is also the most powerful telepath on Earth. Here is his CV page if you need more information.
Powers
Shapeshifting/Elasticity
Superhuman Strength (on par with Superman)
Superhuman Durability
Superhuman Speed (easily MFTL; can keep up with Superman & Wonder Woman)
Superhuman Endurance/Stamina
Superhuman Senses
Invisibility
Phasing
Regeneration
Flight
Telepathy
Telekinesis
Martian Vision
Abilities
Genius Intellect
Brilliant tactician and strategist
Highly-skilled detective
Hand-to-Hand Combat (Advanced)
Perks
I have chosen the Light Speed perk for Zatanna.
Zatanna's main disadvantage in combat is her speed. Since she is human, her reaction speeds are average and she needs to be able to speak her spells backwards (in most cases) in order to cast them. This perk enhances her combat, travel, and reaction times to the speed of light, which is equivalent to roughly 200 thousand miles per second. This will allow Zatanna to speak and cast her spells at light speed, which is significantly faster than the speed of thought. In fact, in terms of miles per hour, light speed is roughly 3 million times faster than the speed of thought. This will allow her to cast multiple spells in the span of a second. It also serves to increase her defensive capabilities, allowing her to react to attacks and either dodge or block them much more quickly. More importantly, this puts her speed way above anyone on your team except Rukia since she also has the same perk .
I also have an army of 200 Chitauri (from MCU's "The Avengers") and 1 hour of prep on the battlefield.
My army of 200 Chitauri will be enough to match your team, at least for awhile. They will serve as a very good distraction since they will become overwhelming if left unchecked. Their use will be explained in the following sections.
Prep
With my 1 hour of prep on the battlefield, I will do a few things.
The first thing I will do is have MMH establish a psychic link for my entire team. This will allow them to communicate telepathically throughout the entire battle. Since Zatanna and MMH are both part of the Justice League and have worked together in the past, they should have a decent amount of teamwork and know of each other's capabilities. A telepathic link will allow them to improve their teamwork, coordinate their strategies and attacks, trade information and knowledge about their powers/abilities with the Chitauri, and integrate the Chitauri into their plans. He will also shield their minds from telepathic intrusions, like he has done so with the JL on numerous occasions.
Next, Zatanna will cast a few spells to prepare for the coming battle:
1) One of Zatanna's more uncommon powers: divination. She can meditate or use a special deck of Tarot cards to see into the future. This divination isn't too specific and isn't as powerful as what Madame Xanadu can foresee, but it is simple enough to give her concepts of what will happen and who might be involved.
In this example, she foresees the Trinity War. She sees someone dying, Constantine arguing with Batman/Superman, superheroes fighting each other, and Constantine shaking hands with Lex Luthor. All of this ends up coming true. Now I'm not saying that she will be able to see specific parts about the upcoming battle, but she will be at least able to see who is involved and have a general idea of what will happen. This gives us the advantage of having "basic knowledge" on your team and will allow us to better prepare for the fight. Due to the telepathic link, Zatanna and MMH will relay this information to the Chitauri. Now, my team knows who we will be fighting and will have a general idea of what you are capable of.
2) Zatanna will then enchant the area around us, putting up protective enchantments as she did with her mansion. As stated by the Nightmare Imp, the enchantments aren't just on the mansion itself, but extend to the area beyond the fence, meaning it can affect an area and not just the building. Those who cross into the enchanted area are teleported hundreds of miles away and transformed into a mollusk for an hour. Although BFR isn't allowed, they can still be transformed into a mollusk and teleported away from Zatanna. Realistically, she could cover as much area as she wants with this spell, but to avoid any arguments about size, I would say her enchantment could at least cover the area of land her mansion is on, which is quite large, at least 500 square feet (the size of an average mansion). No one on your team has the magical capability to detect this enchantment, resist it, and/or remove it.
3) Next, Zatanna will enhance the army of 200 Chitauri. She will turn off gravity in the area as she does in the following scan for her and Batman.
Also a cool showing of how powerful she is, being able to turn night into day and rain into flowers
This will allow the Chitauri to "fly". Batman adjusted to the lack of gravity quite quickly, so the amount of time we have for our prep should be more than enough to get the Chitauri accustomed to the lack of gravity. Now, I have 200 flying Chitauri. Zatanna and MMH are used to flying so they won't need to adjust to this. Your team, however, will not be able to adjust to the change in gravity, unless they are casual fliers.
Next, I will make the Chitauri invisible and create a decoy army of them as Zatanna does in this scan. Now I have 200 invisible, flying Chitauri and a decoy army of Chitauri that will stay on foot to serve as a distraction. These decoy illusions won't be a physical threat (they cannot cause any physical harm and disappear upon being attacked), but they will distract your team.
Zatanna will then make herself invisible, as she has done on multiple occasions. MMH will turn himself invisible as well.
Since Zatanna can now work at light speed, she will be able to do all of this in a very short amount of time. She can then use the rest of the hour to relax, meditate, and restore her energy.
That's about all I will do with my prep. To recap:
MMH establishes a psychic link for my team and shield their minds from any telepathic intrusions
My team will share their powers/abilities with each other
Zatanna will divine the future to determine who we are facing, she will relay this information to the others, and they will then share information about who we will be facing
Zatanna will enchant the area, which will cause trespassers to be transformed into a mollusk for an hour
Zatanna will enchant the Chitauri to be invisible and capable of flight
Zatanna will create a decoy Chitauri army to serve as a distraction
Zatanna and MMH will turn invisible as well
Initial Strategy
Once your team spawns, they will only see an army of Chitauri charging towards them. Since my actual team is invisible, the decoy army will be the focus until your team can determine that my team is invisible. But by then, it will be too late.
My real army of Chitauri will begin firing their energy rifles onto your team. You will see the blasts being fired, but you won't see from who or from where, since they are invisible and flying. Since you provided no real durability feats for anyone on your team, these blasts will severely injure or kill anyone on your team.
Zatanna does not usually kill, but she is certainly not passive about fighting when her life and the lives of others are at stake. She might not necessarily go for the kill, but she will fight with everything she has, as she always does.
Since your team will be under fire from my army of Chitauri, they will be focused on them and not the true threats. Zatanna will cast a spell to freeze your team in place. Again, no one on your team has the magical capability to resist magic on Zatanna's level.
MMH will appear behind them, as they are distracted from my army and frozen in place, and he will phase through your ice field if it is still up even after being frozen. From there, he will phase his hand through your team or just one-shot them with his superhuman strength and speed. You could try and argue that he wouldn't go for the kill right away, but either way, he will have the element of surprise and he has the strength and speed to quickly take out anyone on your team, especially since they will be immobile from Zatanna's spell.
As MMH makes his attack on them, Zatanna will make her attack as well. Zatanna also has the surprise advantage to make the first attack. She also has the light speed perk, making her significantly faster than anyone on your team except Rukia. As I said before, this perk will allow her to assault your team with spell after spell, and even if you do somehow counter, she will be way too fast for you to tag. She would assault your team with magical blasts and lightning:
In the 1st scan, you will notice that Zatanna can strengthen her blasts just by saying so.
In the 4th scan (at the top right), you will notice that her blast can match that of a Green Lantern.
With her light speed, she can fire off dozens of these blasts faster than your team can react.
If for some reason you do counter attack, Zatanna can either teleport herself away or shield herself from the attack:
1st scan: blocks her father's magic
2st scan: blocks an amped Felix Faust and Demon's Three
Although this was just your opener, I'm not going to waste any time countering you because there are many things I want to address...
Nanao Ise: Force field magic, healing, reflecting attacks with her sword...You provided no feats for the first two, and the third one is vague. Does the attack need to hit her sword? Does it redirect in a cone, an AoE? Is she immune to this redirection?
Rukia: Do you have a feat or statement that says her AoE ice field is absolute zero or is that just an assumption? The light speed perk will certainly allow her to perform this attack quickly, but for how long can she maintain it, how big is the AoE? Can she maintain it while frozen in place and under assault?
Xavier: I'm quite familiar with Xavier but you provided no feats for him. All he has is telepathy. MMH is superior to Xavier in telepathy and has a bunch of other powers he can use at the same time while he's "distracted" by Xavier. MMH is also significantly faster than Xavier and any of his attacks will KO him.
Shunsui: His shadow teleportation seems kinda slow....and the injury sharing is vague. How is the AoE "city level", how quickly can he use it, for how long can he maintain it?
Askin: Also vague...What are the limits of what he can take in, how does he use it to harm/kill, how big is the AoE, how quickly can he use it? Because in the scan you showed, it says he needs to be exposed to "massive amounts"...
Kisuke: More vague statements and feats....Energy magic --> how powerful is it, how quickly can he cast it, how quickly does it travel? Magic seals --> do they work on anyone/anything, how are they sealed, how quickly can he do this? Matter manipulation --> Zatanns can manipulate matter and transmute on a much more powerful/large scale.
X-Men Team: Basically fodder. They can be taken down by less than 50 of my Chitauri, and that's me being generous.
Since Asken has an AoE that makes anything he is subject to poisonous as per scan, we will subject Askin to magic
First of all, he needs to be exposed to massive amounts of it. Second of all, how does it make it poisonous? Third of all, I'd like a feat of him absorbing magic. And fourth of all, how would you know to subject him to magic? You don't have basic knowledge and you don't know who Zatanna is...
Urahara gives everyone outside of Asken, clones as their real body hides in shadows per Shunsui
Feats of creating clones of others and feats of hiding bodies in shadows?
Xavier stalls Jonz with TP
Xavier can maybe stall MMH for a few seconds at most before he gets taken out by one of 200 Chitauri, Zatanna, or another attack from MMH.
I seal Manhunter with magical seals while in TP battle with Xavier
He's invisible. How would he be seen by your team? Even if MMH wasn't invisible, how would your team know to target him right off the bat? How would your magic dude survive long enough under the combined assault of my team to cast the seal spell?
I have to eliminate speed, so Rukia unleashes her AoE absolute zero and due to my perk of No Friendly Fire, my team is immune to the AoE while Jonz is in a TP battle with Xavier
I would like some feats of this AoE attack, and proof it is absolute zero. And why would this be her go-to attack to start the fight?
Zatanna's magic has been made moot since if she uses it it incaps her due to Asken
Feats of Asken absorbing magic of Zatanna's level?
Shunsui uses his AoE bankai, with No Friendly Fire perk it doesnt effect my team, to take out the entire Chitari force
You literally provided no feats for this attack. I don't know what it is.
Okay, so I know this was just your opener but you provided zero information on the stats of any of your characters. The only thing I know is that Rukia can work at light speed due to the perk...Without any feats about your team and their stats, they get one-shotted before any of them can react. They are a bunch of fodder to people like Zatanna and MMH, two of the most powerful members of the JL. MMH can go toe-to-toe with Superman. No one on your team comes close to their level. Zatanna's magic is absolutely insane, and you provided no reason for me to think that anyone on your team can resist or survive any of her attacks. You need to provide a lot more information about your characters in order to prove they simply don't get one-shotted by a Chitauri, let alone MMH and Zatanna...
@geekryan: Im back so let me try to answer your questions. Im editing it so Ill tag you again when Im done. Just letting you know Im putting one together today
.What are the limits of what he can take in, how does he use it to harm/kill, how big is the AoE, how quickly can he use it? Because in the scan you showed, it says he needs to be exposed to "massive amounts"...
First of all, he needs to be exposed to massive amounts of it. Second of all, how does it make it poisonous? Third of all, I'd like a feat of him absorbing magic. And fourth of all, how would you know to subject him to magic? You don't have basic knowledge and you don't know who Zatanna is...
I dont need Zatanna magic. He would adapt anyways as show below by your request, but Urahara knows magic and as explained in second row third scan, he just needs the base and then become imune after that
He one shotted Ichigo just on pure power. Its not his power that turns on you. Its your own power that you will be deadly at. Askin is just immune to your level
speed of Askin adaptation
speed of it working. Here is Askin licking his own blood and it effect Oetsu instantly
How is the AoE "city level", how quickly can he use it, for how long can he maintain it?
Its pretty wide in berth by feats
as shown below, everything in the zone is shown by statements but everything in the AoE is effected quite immensely
All that blackness in the background is his power. All the whites in contrast in the other cities are not blackened by the skies
This are others in the neighboring cities feeling its power
As long as how long it is maintained, it lasted until he got hurt in the game
Energy magic --> how powerful is it, how quickly can he cast it, how quickly does it travel?
Magic seals --> do they work on anyone/anything, how are they sealed, how quickly can he do this?
Do you have a feat or statement that says her AoE ice field is absolute zero or is that just an assumption? The light speed perk will certainly allow her to perform this attack quickly, but for how long can she maintain it, how big is the AoE? Can she maintain it while frozen in place and under assault?
I can do both
I'm quite familiar with Xavier but you provided no feats for him. All he has is telepathy. MMH is superior to Xavier in telepathy and has a bunch of other powers he can use at the same time while he's "distracted" by Xavier. MMH is also significantly faster than Xavier and any of his attacks will KO him.
Why do I have show feats for Xavier. You know what he can do and I know what he can do. In a debate a scan is useless in that. I dont need Xavier to take MMH, I need him to distract MMH on a level I know he can. In a physical battle MMH would destroy him, but Im protected under absolute zero and death field from Askin and injury share from Shunsui. Im taking out Zatanna then taking out MMH with sheer numbers
If you want scans I can give you scans of mind freeze and him battling Shadow King on the physical realm
As with my X-Men, they are all trained in astral fighting with Xavier. MMH isnt just fighting Xavier, but the other X-Men
rebuttles
Feats of creating clones of others and feats of hiding bodies in shadows?
Sure. Here he is hiding Shunsui and Nanao
Zatanna's main disadvantage in combat is her speed. Since she is human, her reaction speeds are average and she needs to be able to speak her spells backwards (in most cases) in order to cast them. This perk enhances her combat, travel, and reaction times to the speed of light, which is equivalent to roughly 200 thousand miles per second. This will allow Zatanna to speak and cast her spells at light speed, which is significantly faster than the speed of thought
Every Shingami (Urahara, Nanao, Shunsui, Rukia) are supersonic. I have equipped Rukia with light speed as you know. You can cast a spell at light speed. I can release absolute zero at light speed. The only thing that my clones would be taken out by the spells and I win cuz your real team is frozen
Xavier can maybe stall MMH for a few seconds at most before he gets taken out by one of 200 Chitauri, Zatanna, or another attack from MMH.
All Im asking is a few seconds. Four seconds to be correct. 200 Chitauri are taken out quite easily. MMH is distracted with Xavier and 5 X-Men in astral battle
He's invisible. How would he be seen by your team? Even if MMH wasn't invisible, how would your team know to target him right off the bat? How would your magic dude survive long enough under the combined assault of my team to cast the seal spell?
Technically, my Shinigami are invisble cuz they are souls but for battle purposes they are always seen. They see invisible subjects like spirits all the time. Also, Im not focusing on MMH. You only have two real people. The other 200 are dead from AoE
Strategy:
Ive answered all your concerns. Your team is taken out in around 4 to 10 seconds just on AoE stacking with death and cold field
@boschepg: Okay...Maybe it's because I'm unfamiliar with Bleach and/or maybe it's because you are being vague on purpose, but a lot of what you said is not clear to me. I will do my best to counter what you have said, but I can only do so much with what you have given me...
I dont need Zatanna magic. He would adapt anyways as show below by your request, but Urahara knows magic and as explained in second row third scan, he just needs the base and then become imune after that
He one shotted Ichigo just on pure power. Its not his power that turns on you. Its your own power that you will be deadly at. Askin is just immune to your level
There are so many inconsistencies with this power based on what you have shown. Instead of wasting time debating it, I'll just say that you do not have basic knowledge. You do not know who my team is until the battle starts, and even then, your characters know nothing of mine. Therefore, you have no valid reason to expose Askin to magic during your prep. Your point is moot.
Its pretty wide in berth by feats
as shown below, everything in the zone is shown by statements but everything in the AoE is effected quite immensely
All that blackness in the background is his power. All the whites in contrast in the other cities are not blackened by the skies
This are others in the neighboring cities feeling its power
As long as how long it is maintained, it lasted until he got hurt in the game
The injury sharing aspect of this power is still quite vague based on the limited showings you provided. I would need more context for it.
So my team will feel a little cold and moody? That's it? How does the injury sharing translate to the entire AoE? Are you implying that everyone in that large AoE were also having their injuries shared?
As for the energy and seal magic, I'm not really impressed...It seems to take a few panels to take effect. Furthermore, the scan you provided states that the seal affects the Reiatsu, which isn't something MMH or Zatanna have. Lastly, Zatanna can stop your team with a word at light speed before you can even use it.
I can do both
Now for the ice field, the main component of your strategy...
This would be problematic, but here's the thing: I need to be in the AoE for it to work. As I mentioned in my opener, Zatanna had cast a protective enchantment on the area, causing any intruders within to be transmuted into mollusks. At best, this would mean that my team would be momentarily frozen, while your team would be transmuted into mollusks, assuming we spawn in the same AoE.
It is also highly possible that Zatanna would see this strategy coming, since she was able to see quite a few important elements of the future by using her divination magic, and this is your main strategy for the battle, making it quite relevant and important. If that were the case, she could shield herself and MMH could start off intangible.
Why do I have show feats for Xavier. You know what he can do and I know what he can do. In a debate a scan is useless in that. I dont need Xavier to take MMH, I need him to distract MMH on a level I know he can. In a physical battle MMH would destroy him, but Im protected under absolute zero and death field from Askin and injury share from Shunsui. Im taking out Zatanna then taking out MMH with sheer numbers
You can't assume people know everything about all of your characters. You still need to provide feats for your characters in any debate. Xavier is a sitting duck, who can be taken out in a second by Zatanna, MMH, or one of my 200 Chitauri.
Sure. Here he is hiding Shunsui and Nanao
Fair enough, but where do the clones you speak of come from? Still didn't get any feats for that part. You didn't even explain much about these clones...
Every Shingami (Urahara, Nanao, Shunsui, Rukia) are supersonic. I have equipped Rukia with light speed as you know. You can cast a spell at light speed. I can release absolute zero at light speed. The only thing that my clones would be taken out by the spells and I win cuz your real team is frozen
Can you show that then? Because you provided no feats of physical stats for any of your characters, which means that they have minimum strength, speed, durability, etc. They can be one-shotted by even a Chitauri blast.
All Im asking is a few seconds. Four seconds to be correct. 200 Chitauri are taken out quite easily. MMH is distracted with Xavier and 5 X-Men in astral battle
How exactly are they being taken out?
As I said before, Xavier and the 5 X-Men are sitting ducks while in the astral plane, making them vulnerable to attack from Zatanna, MMH, or my Chitauri. It's not even in character for Xavier to immediately pull the X-Men into the Astral Plane, so by the time the battle starts and he does that, he'll already be tagged and killed.
Technically, my Shinigami are invisble cuz they are souls but for battle purposes they are always seen. They see invisible subjects like spirits all the time. Also, Im not focusing on MMH. You only have two real people. The other 200 are dead from AoE
What? Just because they can see spirits doesn't mean they can see my invisible team...
You have no reason to immediately focus on MMH. You do not have any knowledge on my team. All you will see are a decoy magic army of 200 Chitauri, and then the real army will be invisible and flying as they start shooting at you. Zatanna and MMH will be invisible as well. Even if you COULD see my team, why would you target the one human girl at the back when you are being confronted by a green alien and 200 other aliens?
Ive answered all your concerns. Your team is taken out in around 4 to 10 seconds just on AoE stacking with death and cold field
You actually failed to answer many of my concerns. You only answered the ones that suit you.
Let's assume your cold field and Zatanna's protective enchantment and her first spell go off at the same time. Your team is frozen in place and transformed into a mollusk, and my team is momentarily frozen. As soon as my spells take effect, yours will end, my team is unfrozen, and we destroy your team.
Lets assume your cold field and Zatanna's protective enchantment and her first spell go off at the same time
That is logical since we both have light speed perks on said characters
Your team is frozen in place and transformed into a mollusk and my team is momentarily frozen. As soon as my spells take effect yours will end, my team is unfrozen and we destroy your team
No. Ive mentioned before but maybe it was missed, my team has the No Friendly Fire perk, thus none of my attacks effect my team. My AoE attacks: Rukia cold field, Shunsui injury share, Askin' death field, Urahara matter manipulation and none will effect me in the slightest, but they effect you
Thus if both Zatanna and Rukia set off their light speed attack at the same time, which you have stated, you have mollusked my clones, you are frozen and my team is not. By the battle mechanics in which you have described, I pretty much win on incap since you and your team are frozen and I am not
You have no reason to immediately focus on MMH. You do not have any knowledge on my team. All you will see are a decoy magic army and 200 Chitauri, and then the real army will be invisible and flying as they start shooting at you. Zatanna and MMH will be invisible as well. Even if you could see my team, why would you target the human girl at the back when you are being confronted by a green alien and 200 other aliens?
Its a moot point, but I would target the human girl cuz like you said she has the light speed perk and her attack would be fired first and just set of a magical attack thus she has mystical energy which Shinigami detect
How many invisible people does not matter. You are invisible going into an AoE. You are invisible but the cold field, death field, injury share, and matter manip would obliterate you anyways into dust along with the other stacked AoEs even if you could survive the cold field AoE. I don't have to target anything cuz my attacks are Areas of Effect encompassing the entire area
As I said before, Xavier and the 5 X-Men are sitting ducks while in the astral plane, making them vulnerable to attack from Zatanna. MMH or my Chitauri. Its not even in character to immediately pull the X-Men into the Astral Plane, so by the time the battle starts and he does that, he'll already be tagged and killed
You just stated that with perk that Zatanna's attack is the fastest on the board on your team to your battle mechanics which Im not disputing. How are they in astral battle when you stated and I agreed that Zatanna's magic would turn my clones into mollusk while your team is frozen from cold field AoE?
With my team Im showing how many different ways Im defeating you as all the AoE are stacked. I was giving you the battle purpose of Xavier's TP and the X-Men. I need Xavier to stall and he has done so even against the Phoenix Force since you wanted scans...twice
Xavier is only 2 points cuz he can only do telepathy. MMH is 6 points not cuz his TP is three times stronger, but cuz he can do more things like shapeshift, matter density, and strength. Im asking Xaiver to do what he done against the Phoenix force itself just to stall time. If Xavier can stall vs the Phoenix Force by feats, than he can stall MMH even if he did get past the cold field and then ensuing AoE attacks
Can you show that then? Because your provided no feats of physical stats for any of your characters which means that they have minimum strength, speed, durability, etc. They can be one-shotted by even a Chitauri blast.
I only post physical stats when it is relevant for my characters in battle. Since I was more relying on their powers and the light speed perk, I didn't find a need to post supersonic speed. But since you requested
This Gin explaining to Ichigo that his attack was 500 times the speed of sound. Though it was hyperbole, in context the reader knows it was fast since everyone was established to be supersonic
This is Ichigo not knowing Rukia's brother even attacked him. Ichigo was not supersonic at this scan Ichigo did not know if he was attacked in front or back and didn't even see Byakuya draw his sword
These are two different battle scenes were speed leaves after image even though they feel the attack
I can do this forever but I don't want to clog the post. Obviously there are different levels of their supersonic speed, if you want to get technical what feats do the Chitauri have that beats Shinigami base speed
If you want something more direct, this is Shunsui dodging multiple energy attacks. Its only 3 minutes long
Loading Video...
Fair enough, but where d the clones you speak of come from? Still didn't get any feats for that part. You didn't even explain much about these clones...
I did not explain cuz they are a clone and have the power of the original. Its probably better to post another video since there is a lot of context to your question related to the gigai (clone) If you go to the 2:50 minute mark Urahara explains it since he created them
Loading Video...
Now for the ice field... the main component to your strategy...
This would be problematic but here's the thing: I need to be in the AoE for it to work. As mentioned in my opener, Zatanna had cast a protective enchantment on the area causing any intruders within the area to be transmuted into mollusks. At best, this would mean that my team would be momentarily frozen, while your team would be transmuted into mollusks, assuming we spawn in the some AoE.
As stated in the 2nd reply above, according to your battle mechanics both teams fire at light speed. Your team gets frozen is a given. You transmute my clones causing my real people to come out and start their AoE
Also, your strategy for your prep is outside your prep zone. You are talking about prep the battlefield with your enchantment in which is a perk you do not have. You have basic one hour prep just like me.
The battlefield is pretty vague on distance of spawn but it is usually, almost battle law, that on a battle we spawn at the same time
It is also highly possible that Zatanna would see this strategy coming since she was able to see quite a few important elements of the future by using her divination magic and this is your main strategy for the battle, making it quite relevant and important. If that were the case she could shield herself and MMH could start off intangible
She could see it, but as you stated in her opener, her divination is very vague and only sees aspects of the future.
Also, most importantly, so are you protecting your team with shields at light speed or trying to cast your mollusks spell? You cant do both thus why I place how more of my team attacks you as a whole.
Also, in my prep I made magic poisonous to your team and my team is unaffected by it by my No Friendly Fire perk.
I also have to established better prepper who thinks of thousands of scenarios ahead and preps for it with Urahara
To be honest, your whole line of thinking here causes a lot of problems as stated. Is Zatanna using her shields to protect or is she casting an offensive spell? You cast a spell Zatanna dies cuz of Askin making magic poisonous
So my team will feel a little cold and moody? That's it?
No. As per scans all your molecules are frozen and you get blown to frozen dust
How does your injury sharing translate to the entire AoE? Are you implying that everyone in that large AoE were also having their injuries shared
That is how the power is described and why Shunsui does not use it when friends are in the area. In fact, when he unleashed it on the scan provided, he actually had to go to another city were no one was at to not effect them. As stated, with my No Friendly Fire perk, I have no restrictions with such an AoE.
Also on the Shunsui scan, Shunsui entered the AoE with injury and it was instantaneously placed on Baro
There are so many inconsistencies with this power based on what you have shown. Instead of wasting time debating it, Ill just say that you do not have basic knowledge. You do not know wo my team is until the battle starts and even then, your characters know nothing of mine. Therefore, you have no valid reason to expose Askin to magic during your prep. Your point is moot
Its not moot. It would have been defended by Urahara. Since Askin can eliminate magic and has made basic magical energy in reiatsu poisonous in multiple battles he went across and it usually ended in a one shot for Askin
Okay...Maybe it's because Im unfamiliar with Bleach and/or maybe its because you are being vague on purpose, but a lot of what you said is not clear to me.
I was not trying to be vague on purpose. I was trying to post something before the time limit cuz my ipad broke as I informed both you and the OP. I actually quoted every single question from your post and answered it which should clear everything
CONCLUSION:
We both have people with light speed attack but you want Zatanna to shield both your team from cold field and use mollusks divination (which I can teleport back cuz of Urahara) which I find highly unlikely if not impossible
You think absolute zero just makes people cold when it is established to stop molecules and as scan showed, to dust, which is a low ball tactic
You are also low balling my prep since I have a prep master in Urahara to properly utilize my teams power but your team can properly prep with vague divination as said by you
I have shown Xavier can stall Phoenix to stall MMH
I just think you are over extending the capabilities on your team in the amount of time established with everything coming at you.
You have invisible Chitauri and clones that all get taken out by cold field, but if you shield cold field with magic, than Zatanna gets taken out due to Askin/ Shunsui injury share
While I have clones and multiple AoEs that only effect your team while protected in shadow dimension.
There are really only two outcomes:
As you stated, your team gets frozen my clones get turned into mollusks leaving my real team protected
or you shield the cold field which unleashes Askin's death field on magic and the inury share takes out everyone else
I'm restricted because of the rules. No BFR, no reality warping, no time manipulation, etc.
I think the statement itself kind of places your characterization of Zatanna in a negative light since its an open critique of you using her and may effect votes. I think you are doing fine though but I would have asked for it to be deleted, but you do you. When you place your closing post then tag the OP for votes
@boschepg: To make it easier for the readers, my initial comments have quotation marks and italics, and what Bosche responded is quoted underneath. My response is under that.
"Your team is frozen in place and transformed into a mollusk and my team is momentarily frozen. As soon as my spells take effect yours will end, my team is unfrozen and we destroy your team"
No. Ive mentioned before but maybe it was missed, my team has the No Friendly Fire perk, thus none of my attacks effect my team. My AoE attacks: Rukia cold field, Shunsui injury share, Askin' death field, Urahara matter manipulation and none will effect me in the slightest, but they effect you
Thus if both Zatanna and Rukia set off their light speed attack at the same time, which you have stated, you have mollusked my clones, you are frozen and my team is not. By the battle mechanics in which you have described, I pretty much win on incap since you and your team are frozen and I am not
You misunderstand. I meant that your team is frozen in place due to Zatanna's spell, not your cold field. The second part of your statement is also wrong, but I will address that shortly.
"You have no reason to immediately focus on MMH. You do not have any knowledge on my team. All you will see are a decoy magic army and 200 Chitauri, and then the real army will be invisible and flying as they start shooting at you. Zatanna and MMH will be invisible as well. Even if you could see my team, why would you target the human girl at the back when you are being confronted by a green alien and 200 other aliens?"
Its a moot point, but I would target the human girl cuz like you said she has the light speed perk and her attack would be fired first and just set of a magical attack thus she has mystical energy which Shinigami detect
You don't know what perks I have... For all you know, Zatanna's speed could be baseline. You have no knowledge of anyone on my team.
One vague statement of "more or less" feeling a specific person's Reiatsu means nothing. First of all, this doesn't necessarily apply to a combat situation. Second of all, Shinigami could have possibly only detected Ichigo's Reiatsu due to them knowing each other. Third of all, Reiatsu doesn't necessarily translate to Zatanna's magic, since it is spiritual energy and is not the same. Lastly, she will be invisible, as I have stated multiple times.
"As I said before, Xavier and the 5 X-Men are sitting ducks while in the astral plane, making them vulnerable to attack from Zatanna. MMH or my Chitauri. Its not even in character to immediately pull the X-Men into the Astral Plane, so by the time the battle starts and he does that, he'll already be tagged and killed"
You just stated that with perk that Zatanna's attack is the fastest on the board on your team to your battle mechanics which Im not disputing. How are they in astral battle when you stated and I agreed that Zatanna's magic would turn my clones into mollusk while your team is frozen from cold field AoE?
With my team Im showing how many different ways Im defeating you as all the AoE are stacked. I was giving you the battle purpose of Xavier's TP and the X-Men. I need Xavier to stall and he has done so even against the Phoenix Force since you wanted scans...twice
Xavier is only 2 points cuz he can only do telepathy. MMH is 6 points not cuz his TP is three times stronger, but cuz he can do more things like shapeshift, matter density, and strength. Im asking Xaiver to do what he done against the Phoenix force itself just to stall time. If Xavier can stall vs the Phoenix Force by feats, than he can stall MMH even if he did get past the cold field and then ensuing AoE attacks
I wasn't agreeing with you, I was going along with what you said about them being in an astral battle.
It's extremely debatable how MMH and Xavier's telepathy match up. Most people on CV would favour MMH. But the thing is, while Xavier is "stalling" MMH, he is still vulnerable to attack by Zatanna, the Chitauri, or even a simultaneous attack from MMH, since he can use more than one power at once. This stalling would last no more than a second, even with the X-Men helping Xavier. Their physical bodies would be destroyed, and you lose 6 people.
"Can you show that then? Because your provided no feats of physical stats for any of your characters which means that they have minimum strength, speed, durability, etc. They can be one-shotted by even a Chitauri blast."
I only post physical stats when it is relevant for my characters in battle. Since I was more relying on their powers and the light speed perk, I didn't find a need to post supersonic speed. But since you requested
This Gin explaining to Ichigo that his attack was 500 times the speed of sound. Though it was hyperbole, in context the reader knows it was fast since everyone was established to be supersonic
This is Ichigo not knowing Rukia's brother even attacked him. Ichigo was not supersonic at this scan Ichigo did not know if he was attacked in front or back and didn't even see Byakuya draw his sword
These are two different battle scenes were speed leaves after image even though they feel the attack
I can do this forever but I don't want to clog the post. Obviously there are different levels of their supersonic speed, if you want to get technical what feats do the Chitauri have that beats Shinigami base speed
If you want something more direct, this is Shunsui dodging multiple energy attacks. Its only 3 minutes long
Loading Video...
Not covering physical stats in a battle puts your characters at the very minimum level of stats, which makes them slow, weak, and able to be one-shotted.
Regardless, the physical stats of your team are nothing compared to MMH and Zatanna. You also only provided speed feats, which does put them above the Chitauri, but I have a decoy army of 200 Chitauri and a flying/invisible army of 200 Chitauri. With your strategy in mind, your team are sitting ducks and will be obliterated by an assault from 200 Chitauri.
"Fair enough, but where did the clones you speak of come from? Still didn't get any feats for that part. You didn't even explain much about these clones..."
I did not explain cuz they are a clone and have the power of the original. Its probably better to post another video since there is a lot of context to your question related to the gigai (clone) If you go to the 2:50 minute mark Urahara explains it since he created them
Loading Video...
I'm very glad you provided a video of these so-called "clones", because it makes debunking it so much easier now...
1) The portable gigai is an object, a piece of gear. Unless it is standard for your character, you cannot use it.
2) The only "clone" it makes is of Urahara, so it can't be used for your entire team.
3) There is no proof or feat that more than one can be used at once
4) Urahara (at 3:45) even says he made it himself and that it is difficult to control
5) He also says that no one but him could use it effectively
6) They are not clones, but decoys. They do not have the same stats or powers as the original. Urahara replaced himself with it before he was struck.
All of these points render your clones argument completely moot. You do not have any clones at all.
"Now for the ice field... the main component to your strategy...
This would be problematic but here's the thing: I need to be in the AoE for it to work. As mentioned in my opener, Zatanna had cast a protective enchantment on the area causing any intruders within the area to be transmuted into mollusks. At best, this would mean that my team would be momentarily frozen, while your team would be transmuted into mollusks, assuming we spawn in the some AoE."
As stated in the 2nd reply above, according to your battle mechanics both teams fire at light speed. Your team gets frozen is a given. You transmute my clones causing my real people to come out and start their AoE
Also, your strategy for your prep is outside your prep zone. You are talking about prep the battlefield with your enchantment in which is a perk you do not have. You have basic one hour prep just like me.
The battlefield is pretty vague on distance of spawn but it is usually, almost battle law, that on a battle we spawn at the same time
You have no clones.
All prep takes place on the battlefield, unless you got the prep anywhere perks. Since we both have prep on the battlefield, when the battle begins, both of our preps merge into the battlefield, which includes my protective enchantment. These are the typical rules for CaVs, tournaments, etc. This means that your team will be within the area of my enchantment, thus turning your team into mollusks. Since you do not have any real clones, and you haven't proved you can hide your entire team in the shadows, your team gets incapped.
"It is also highly possible that Zatanna would see this strategy coming since she was able to see quite a few important elements of the future by using her divination magic and this is your main strategy for the battle, making it quite relevant and important. If that were the case she could shield herself and MMH could start off intangible"
She could see it, but as you stated in her opener, her divination is very vague and only sees aspects of the future.
Also, most importantly, so are you protecting your team with shields at light speed or trying to cast your mollusks spell? You cant do both thus why I place how more of my team attacks you as a whole.
Also, in my prep I made magic poisonous to your team and my team is unaffected by it by my No Friendly Fire perk.
I also have to established better prepper who thinks of thousands of scenarios ahead and preps for it with Urahara
To be honest, your whole line of thinking here causes a lot of problems as stated. Is Zatanna using her shields to protect or is she casting an offensive spell? You cast a spell Zatanna dies cuz of Askin making magic poisonous
Yes, she sees aspects of the future. In your case, your cold field is your main element of your strategy and your claim to victory, so it is very possible Zatanna would see this.
I can do both actually, because the protective enchantment that turns your team into mollusks was placed during my prep. This will result in your team being transformed as the battle begins, which will then stop my team from being frozen by your cold field. Zatanna then has free reign to cast spell after spell (at light speed) to assault your team or protect her own.
I've said this like twice now but it seems I need to repeat myself: you do not have any knowledge on my team. You have no reason to expose Askin to magic because you do not know that my team has any magic-users. In your previous fight in the first round, you did not expose Askin to magic because your opponents had no magic-users. Once the battle starts and your team figures out Zatanna is a magic-user, it will be too late for you to expose Askin to magic and make it poisonous to Zatanna. You have not shown that Askin can be exposed to multiple things at once and make them all poisonous, so you couldn't even just expose him to everything in order to try and account for all situations.
You can have the best prep in all of fiction, but if you do not know who my team is and you do not have any knowledge, you can't do anything to specifically counter my team. In our specific situation, this is the case.
"How does your injury sharing translate to the entire AoE? Are you implying that everyone in that large AoE were also having their injuries shared"
That is how the power is described and why Shunsui does not use it when friends are in the area. In fact, when he unleashed it on the scan provided, he actually had to go to another city were no one was at to not effect them. As stated, with my No Friendly Fire perk, I have no restrictions with such an AoE.
Also on the Shunsui scan, Shunsui entered the AoE with injury and it was instantaneously placed on Baro
Where is it described as such? You provided like one feat/scan of this injury sharing.
CONCLUSION:
We both have people with light speed attack but you want Zatanna to shield both your team from cold field and use mollusks divination (which I can teleport back cuz of Urahara) which I find highly unlikely if not impossible
I disputed this already. The protective enchantment that transforms your team into mollusks was cast during my prep. The divination also took place during my prep.
You think absolute zero just makes people cold when it is established to stop molecules and as scan showed, to dust, which is a low ball tactic
I wasn't referring to the cold field, I was referring to this
You are also low balling my prep since I have a prep master in Urahara to properly utilize my teams power but your team can properly prep with vague divination as said by you
Funny how you say you have a prep master but only bring up this "master prep" in your last post, and you don't even provide any specifics or details about it.
I have shown Xavier can stall Phoenix to stall MMH
Xavier, with all his power, can momentarily stall an inexperienced Cyclops with the Phoenix Force. Xavier will be an open target as he is stalling MMH and will get quickly obliterated by Zatanna or the 200 Chitauri.
I just think you are over extending the capabilities on your team in the amount of time established with everything coming at you.
I completely disagree.
You have invisible Chitauri and clones that all get taken out by cold field, but if you shield cold field with magic, than Zatanna gets taken out due to Askin/ Shunsui injury share
Your cold field gets stopped immediately because you get transmuted.
While I have clones and multiple AoEs that only effect your team while protected in shadow dimension.
You don't actually have any clones, and your AoEs won't take place since you will all be transformed. You also didn't show that you can hide and protect multiple people in the shadows, and if they are hiding, they won't be able to attack or use any of these AoE fields.
There are really only two outcomes:
As you stated, your team gets frozen my clones get turned into mollusks leaving my real team protected
or you shield the cold field which unleashes Askin's death field on magic and the inury share takes out everyone else
You have no real clones, Askin has no reason to expose himself to magic since you do not have any knowledge that my team possesses a magic-user, and the injury share gets negated when you are transformed and can't even attack.
Log in to comment