Is Lady Shiva the most powerful street level character currently?

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Alexander505

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According with her feats she seems to be the most powerful street character these days, she stomped Cassandra Cain two times, Nightwing, despite he's good enough to defeat Mother.

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ironbart

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No one of the most skilled but not the most powerful street leveller.

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Alexander505

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One of the most skilled yep, definitely more skilled than Cassandra, maybe even more Batman, but I'm not sure yet, we still have to see a decent fight between these two. Overall, she's one of the best and most dangerous street characters currently.

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DCfan2015

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I would have said yes but batman seems to be on a rule lately beating the shit out of deathstroke and repeat it again with red hood

I don't know tbh.

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Alexander505

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#5  Edited By Alexander505

Bats stomped the future Tim, able to stomp Nightwing, Tim, Jason and Damian at the same time. Nice feat.

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DCfan2015

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Michaelbn

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which version? pre52 or new52/rebirth

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#9  Edited By Michaelbn

@dcfan2015:nope, deathstroke matched him and let him kick him. about hood, this #25 issue of RHATO ?? it's really funny to call it a fight when all things he did was joking with bruce and after a kiss and losing his GF, throwing a desperate kick and another bat PIS which he sent todd flying and cross a rooftop. these days no one can write comics and showing batman being a fool in a fight.

@alexander505: stomping all of birdkids?? when he did that? show the scan

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Bat_Girl_CC

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#10  Edited By Bat_Girl_CC

@alexander505 said:

One of the most skilled yep, definitely more skilled than Cassandra, maybe even more Batman, but I'm not sure yet, we still have to see a decent fight between these two. Overall, she's one of the best and most dangerous street characters currently.

LOL, Lady Shiva has stomped Batman twice, on the 2 fights that they've had on the current continuity...on their last fight, she easily beat him into submission in 2 panels...

Cassandra didnt do much better either, her fights were longer, but mostly because Shiva was toying with Cass, in the moment that she got serious Cass could no longer keep up...although it should be noted that much like Batman, and unlike Shiva, Cass holds-back alot not to kill...which its worse for Cass than for Batman...because besides being trained in a special way in order for her to be able to read body language fluently, Cass was also trained to be the ultimate assassin/killer...so, in terms of full capacity, a killer being in a fight and not being able to go for the kill, its kinda of a handicap...it was stated on their fights that it Cass fought with the intent to kill the outcome would be different...anyway, on their last fight Cass did much better, she overwhelmed Shiva, although Shiva alone was fighting Azrael, Clayface, Batwoman, Batwing, Batman and Cass, at the same time...eventually it came down to Cass vs Shiva, but a argument could be made that Shiva was maybe a bit tired out, but Cass was also fighting hundreds of ninjas before arriving on that spot, so...anyway, its clear that a serious Cass is a match for Shiva.

In my mind, a no-holding-back Cassandra Cain is the most powerful street-leveler (deppending if you consider characters like Poison Ivy and Calyface "street-level") for those Cass would need prep...

Batman, Deathstroke, etc, Cass is superior to them, the one that comes closer is Lady Shiva.

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ironbart

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@bat_girl_cc: The first fight batman was poisoned so it doesnt count and when did Shiva fight Azrael, Clayface, Batwoman, Batwing, Batman and Cass at the same time?Was there any context?

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Cerberus369616

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Unless there is some context Shiva was shown to be outright superior to Bruce in there last fight and Bruce has been pretty hit or miss lately. Either really OP or Jobbing with a few notable exceptions. I think in Pure H2H Shiva is the best right now, Cass did better than Bruce against her and karma but still lost pretty decisively. That being said if Bruce (and others) fights smart and use Gear I think Cass and Shiva start falling behind really quickly. Shiva did crush "something" Bruce tossed at her but we have no idea what it was or what it was even meant to do. He stalemated Death Stroke with a home field advantage and gear which is impressive cause DS did minimal prep in the cave as well. Then we have things like Jason Todd having a built in omnidirectional taser for his suit that has one shot Batman something Cass and Shiva have no real answer for. DS has the IKON suit, which while it has really OP showings has been bypassed by Street Level threats enough times to leave him in the Tier imo. Cass and Shiva just don't have a lot of answers for people not fighting on their terms of H2H/projectiles in the tier.

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Bat_Girl_CC

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@ironbart said:

@bat_girl_cc: The first fight batman was poisoned so it doesnt count and when did Shiva fight Azrael, Clayface, Batwoman, Batwing, Batman and Cass at the same time?Was there any context?

It counts as standard gear vs standard gear...Shiva used 1 single poisoned shurinken, and it was on the spot...its not like she used prep or anything...

" when did Shiva fight Azrael, Clayface, Batwoman, Batwing, Batman and Cass at the same time?Was there any context? "

From: Detective Comics #955 - League of Shadows Part 5: Fists of Fury and Detective Comics #956 - League of Shadows Finale: The Duel

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To be fair they were talking alot while fighting, and it seemed more like Lady Shiva was more trying to prove a point, than actually trying to kill any of them...but to fully understand the context, honestly you would have to read not only the full issue but also the entire League Of Shadows arc...im going to sum it up, a big plot-point in this arc was that Cass could kill effortlessy anyone, she was trained to so, also her Body-Reading now works more as weakness-finder and as soft-spots-finder, than as pre-cog, she literally sees hundreds of ways to kill her opponents in every fight, but shes sworn to never take a life ever again, so she has the trouble to ignore all of those easier ways to finish of her fights, which come first to her as natural, and instead focus on other ways to beat her opponents (regular hits, submission, etc)...in Shivas oppinion Cass thinks this way because shes just a young girl, and she wantted to see Cassandra's full potencial, and was disapointed when she found out that Cass always holds-back alot...appart from this, Shiva was already decided to destroy Gotham-City which she saw as being corrupted (and well, it kinda is…).

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deactivated-5edd330f57b65

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Most skilled but not most powerful. For some reason no one uses their gear effectively when fighting her it seems.

I do like Batman being the best at everything but it is nice that current Shiva can actually decisively beat top street levelers as opposed to Post Crisis Shiva.

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Kevd4wg

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That would be Spider-man

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ironbart

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@bat_girl_cc:Yeah and batman didnt use any of his own stuff and was distracted by wirth. The fight doesnt count as normal fight between them.

Since you said they were talking a lot and shiva was trying to prove a point im going to say that this is not how she can fight normally and even if there wasn't any context then id still consider inconsistent to fight that many skilled characters at the same time. Not saying she isn't the most skilled but shes not good enough to fight that many characters in my opinion.

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Alexander505

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#17  Edited By Alexander505

Shiva is most skilled, but Bruce and Slade are more powerful, with gear and smartness advantage.

About fight skill, the hierarchy would be:

Shiva

Batman/Cassandra

Deathstroke/Nightwing

I don't know where to put Cass exactly, but there's no proof she is more skilled than Bruce, so for now I'll put her at the same Bruce's level

Power hierarchy (skill, physical status, smartness, gear)

Batman/Deathstroke

Shiva

Cassandra/Nightwing

I still don't know where to put Azrael in all these hierarchies tho..