Why doesn't Batman cripple the Joker?

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joshmightbe

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#1  Edited By joshmightbe

I'm not talking about killing him but Batman knows enough about human physiology to put Joker in a wheel chair without killing him. It'd make life much better for Gotham considering it'd be much more difficult for Joker to do the things he does if he couldn't walk.

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moywar700

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#2  Edited By moywar700

"On several occasions, he has been known to survive explosions and crashes. His bones heal quickly, and it has been hinted in a few comics that he does not physically age."

This is from his comic vine page. He'll just heal up and be back on the streets in no time.

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royale_with_cheese

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@moywar700 said:

"On several occasions, he has been known to survive explosions and crashes. His bones heal quickly, and it has been hinted in a few comics that he does not physically age."

* Facepalm* Whoever came up with this idea should be shot repeatedly in the face until their own mother fails to recognize them. Does the Joker take calcium supplements or something? WTF.

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entropy_aegis

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#4  Edited By entropy_aegis

@royale_with_cheese said:

@moywar700 said:

"On several occasions, he has been known to survive explosions and crashes. His bones heal quickly, and it has been hinted in a few comics that he does not physically age."

* Facepalm* Whoever came up with this idea should be shot repeatedly in the face until their own mother fails recognize them. Does the Joker take calcium supplements or something? WTF.

It's his off screen power like all classic villains.

and Joker makes money,why would DC cripple a cash cow? and even if Batman did it still would'nt matter because the Joker would return anyway and makes Bruce look even more stupid.

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MuyJingo

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#5  Edited By MuyJingo

I think it would make more sense for him to do to Joker what he did to Ra's...keeping him drugged and locked up. Although that is much harder with Joker being so distinctive.

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joshmightbe

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#6  Edited By joshmightbe

@entropy_aegis: I'm not asking why DC doesn't do it. I understand that, I'm asking why Batman as a character chooses not to do it

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ReVamp

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#7  Edited By ReVamp

@joshmightbe said:

@entropy_aegis: I'm not asking why DC doesn't do it. I understand that, I'm asking why Batman as a character chooses not to do it

Because of his morals.

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joshmightbe

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#8  Edited By joshmightbe

@ReVamp: It's not like he's killing him and by now if he doesn't realize that Arkham is useless then he isn't near as smart as he's supposed to be. It's not immoral to do something to permanently make people slightly safer

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ReVamp

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#9  Edited By ReVamp

@joshmightbe said:

@ReVamp: It's not like he's killing him and by now if he doesn't realize that Arkham is useless then he isn't near as smart as he's supposed to be. It's not immoral to do something to permanently make people slightly safer

That's subjective. Some would claim its not immoral to kill him, given the circumstances. The point is that harming someone purposely is immoral for Batman's character and that's really all there is to it.

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InnerVenom123

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#10  Edited By InnerVenom123

Plot.

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DarthShap

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#12  Edited By DarthShap

@joshmightbe said:

I'm not talking about killing him but Batman knows enough about human physiology to put Joker in a wheel chair without killing him. It'd make life much better for Gotham considering it'd be much more difficult for Joker to do the things he does if he couldn't walk.

Because he is not the All Star Goddamn Batman. He does not kill, he does not torture, he does not cripple, he does not kidnap little kids and have them eat rats etc...

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joshmightbe

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#13  Edited By joshmightbe

I will drop this if one person can give me any reason that Batman and Joker's catch and release game actually does any good. At this point considering Joker's body count the fact that neither Batman nor the people of Gotham have done anything to stop him has moved beyond a moral issue.His existence is a threat to their survival. Killing or crippling him at this point would be nature taking its course. How long can one guy go around killing people and destroying lives with virtually no meaningful consequences and still have people feel anything but apathy toward any of Batman's temporary victories over him?

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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#14  Edited By Avenging-X-Bolt

Because he's not a tyrant.

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Funrush

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#15  Edited By Funrush

I'd like to see a story where Joker gets in an accident during a fight with Batman and gets his legs cut off or something. As gruesome as that sounds, seeing Joker in a wheelchair, and seeing how Batgirl would react would be interesting.

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joshmightbe

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#16  Edited By joshmightbe

@Avenging-X-Bolt: At this point he'd be no more a tyrant than a vet putting down a rabid dog

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hectorsquall

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#17  Edited By hectorsquall

@joshmightbe: I agree 100% with everything you said. I kind of like the Joker, I really do, but the fact that he's still alive and well in the comics makes Batman and every other characters look like freaking idiots, which is quite annoying.

I know that "Batman doesn't kill" rule and it makes sense with some criminals but not with the Joker. The fact that no one could put an end to his reign of terror is stupid IMO. If Batman didn't kill him there's a lot of cops, anti-heroes, vigilantes or just other criminals who would have already killed him. And the fact that Batman saved his life numerous times is unbelievable when he could do like in Batman Begins and just let him die without saving him but without killing him either.

Not to mention that the Joker crippled Barbara Gordon and killed Jason Todd with a crowbar. If somebody killed my adopted son with a crowbar I would kill him without hesitation (or worse). Batman doesn't want to kill, I get that, but sometimes what you want doesn't matter. I would prefer to kill a guy like the Joker and live with it for the rest of my life rather than letting him live another day knowing that he will kill again because I didn't "neutralize" him. The only thing it proves is that Batman is being selfish. Killing someone in a situation like this, or when the lives of your loved ones and innocents are at stake, isn't being "a tyrant" or a monster... and to anyone who think so, I wouldn't want to be a member of your family for all the money in the world.

In the end, it's comic book logic and we have to live with it. Despite all these things that do seem ridiculous, Batman is still one of my favorite character and as long as I don't think too much about it, I can still enjoy a lot of those stories (as long as the writing is good, that is)

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joshmightbe

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#18  Edited By joshmightbe

@hectorsquall: I wasn't even talking about killing him, just putting him in a position where he either couldn't hurt anyone or at least it would be more difficult for him to. Locking him up doesn't work, it barely slows him down.

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Dark_Vengeance_

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#19  Edited By Dark_Vengeance_

@joshmightbe said:

@entropy_aegis: I'm not asking why DC doesn't do it. I understand that, I'm asking why Batman as a character chooses not to do it

BECAUSE I"M BATMAN THAT'S WHY!

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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#20  Edited By Avenging-X-Bolt

@Joshmightbe: I know I was just kidding\trolling.(I can't believe that you actually think I would defend the Joker!?!, I'm slightly insulted).

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moywar700

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#21  Edited By moywar700

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hectorsquall

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#22  Edited By hectorsquall

@joshmightbe: Well, the only other option would be to lobotomize him. Anything less and he would still be able to kill, it's the Joker after all.

In "Do You Understand These Rights?"(Batman Confidential #22-25) he was able to kill a lot of people in some unusual but creative ways while he was still locked up! That was awesome to read but really creepy.

My point is, even if it's not really realistic that Batman doesn't kill the Joker, crippling him wouldn't change anything because he would still be able to kill. That leaves only 3 options:

  1. Kill or lobotomize the Joker (but DC would never allow it and that would piss everyone off)
  2. Stop reading Batman (no way!)
  3. Hope that they find a better way to use the character. There's a lot of good stories that they could write with him without making Batman look like an idiot.

It looks like they are preparing some big thing with the Joker since the debut of the New 52 and I'm looking forward to it :p

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hydrabob--defunct

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I'm pretty certain Batman has put him in a full body cast a few times. So, he does injure him a great deal, but I guess over time he recovers and goes back out to do some more crime.

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Funrush

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#24  Edited By Funrush

@hectorsquall said:

@joshmightbe: I agree 100% with everything you said. I kind of like the Joker, I really do, but the fact that he's still alive and well in the comics makes Batman and every other characters look like freaking idiots, which is quite annoying.

Yeah, I know. The other day in school, I was talking with my friends about recent events with Joker in Detective Comics with a few friends, and one asks why Batman doesn't kill Joker already. I replied that if he did, he wouldn't be able to control himself, and he'd end up just like Red Hood. He then asked why Gotham Police hasn't executed him yet. Me nor any of my friends had a response.

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nickzambuto

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#25  Edited By nickzambuto

1: It's been hinted at several times that, thanks to being dumped in dem chemicals, Joker has a bit of a healing factor going on. It's not nearly as advanced as Wolverine's or even Deathstroke's, but it's enough to heal from broken legs.

2: This is The Joker. It'll take him an hour to come up with some kind of metal implants or braces or whatever to replace/strengthen his bones.

1: Putting Joker in a wheelchair will not solve anything. It's not like his legs are even that important, he can't walk now, so what. As long as Joker still has his mind, he can get other people to do whatever the hell he can't.

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joshmightbe

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#26  Edited By joshmightbe

@nickzambuto: So you're saying there's no way to leave him alive and stop him from hurting people without a total lobotomy

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nickzambuto

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#27  Edited By nickzambuto

@joshmightbe said:

@nickzambuto: So you're saying there's no way to leave him alive and stop him from hurting people without a total lobotomy

Not any that I can think of. Again, all Joker needs is his mind and his mouth. Eyes and ears would also be helpful.

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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#28  Edited By Avenging-X-Bolt

Let's face it, there's absolutely no way to get rid of the joker,he probably has some plan set in place in case a lobotomy does happen

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Primmaster64

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#29  Edited By Primmaster64

I always found it stupid. Not sure why Batman hasn't done it. Jason could have done it, but he let it pass.

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Funrush

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#30  Edited By Funrush

@Primmaster64 said:

I always found it stupid. Not sure why Batman hasn't done it. Jason could have done it, but he let it pass.

Yeah, Jason of all people. You figured he'd be the first to kill him, especially with all his whining over wanting Bruce to do it for him.

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Primmaster64

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#31  Edited By Primmaster64
@Funrush said:

@Primmaster64 said:

I always found it stupid. Not sure why Batman hasn't done it. Jason could have done it, but he let it pass.

Yeah, Jason of all people. You figured he'd be the first to kill him, especially with all his whining over wanting Bruce to do it for him.

LOl Jason could have killed the Joker...But he didn't...Tsk.
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the_stegman

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#32  Edited By the_stegman  Moderator

The real question is, why doesn't he cripple the idiots running Arkham who can't keep a clown locked up for more than 24 hours.

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joshmightbe

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#33  Edited By joshmightbe

@The Stegman: Arkham needs to be shut down and replaced by some place with competent security

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the_stegman

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#34  Edited By the_stegman  Moderator
@joshmightbe: Honestly, whenever someone asks me, "Why doesn't Batman just kill such and such?" I say blame it on Arkham, Batman does his job, he catches the crooks time and time again, I blame A. the courts for not putting them in PRISON, and then I blame that joke of an asylum for not being able to detain mostly human prisoners with no weapons on them.
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KenTheProfile

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#35  Edited By KenTheProfile

@joshmightbe: proabably because it's a little to close to One of Joker's most dusgusting acts actually seen in the comics.

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LordofUnholyDarkness

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He could just take him to superman and have him imprisoned in the phantom zone.

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ratman19

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#37  Edited By ratman19

because batman needs joker as much as joker needs batman

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FuZySLiPeRz

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#38  Edited By FuZySLiPeRz

I agree completely, Batman is more villain than he is hero, because he is never able to permanently keep the evil-doers from committing their crimes. I respect characters like the Punisher, because he makes sure he permanently keeps the city safe, even if it means killing...

Also ome of these retarded comments in this thread, like the ones said by

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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#39  Edited By Avenging-X-Bolt

@FuzySLiPeRz:hmm hate the world huh?. Sounds like a problem. Maybe you should fix that.

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JonSmith

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#40  Edited By JonSmith

@joshmightbe: He did in the Dark Knight Returns. Twisted Joker's neck just far enough to paralyze him. Joker forced himself to twist his own neck a bit farther so it snapped and killed himself, thus framing Bats for murder.

As for why he doesn't cripple Joker in the mainstream continuity: Plot.

Now for an actual reasonable in-universe explanation: Joker breaks out around every six months and kills around a hundred people. Max. He goes out, stretches his legs, kills a few puppies, gets an ice cream cone, suffocates the ice cream man in the bucket, etc. Batman pops up, and beats him up, sends him back. Joker recovers and does it again. Here's what you've got to understand about the Joker though: He's not doing any of it because it benefits him in some way. He's not doing it for some complicated, tragic reason, like revenge, or love (debatable, not getting into that). He's doing it because he thinks it's fun. He finds it hilarious that these peoples hum-drum lives end so quickly, that something so many people place such great value on, their lives, is snuffed out so easily. That's good. He SHOULD find it funny. You WANT him to find it funny. Why? Because while he's laughing, he's playing. It's a big joke.

Now tell me, can you imagine a thing possibly more terrifying than a Joker who ISN'T joking around? Imagine for a moment if Joker, the psychopathic murderer, the Clown Prince of Crime, stopped laughing, stopped joking around, and got deadly serious. Take a wild guess where the emphasis in that sentence lies. Say Bats crippled him, took away his legs like Joker took away Barbara's. Joker's in a wheelchair. And he won't find that funny. The mad dog has been leashed. Joker IS a joke now, because anyone who might be scared of him now see's a clown in a wheelchair. He's not going to find that funny at all. Which means he's going to get very serious.

So why does Bats not cripple him? Because you should never wound what you can't kill. Crippling the Joker would be shoving him into a corner. You don't want the Joker getting serious. You don't want him putting some of that crazed mind of his to order and focusing it on a true goal. So maybe Joker kills a hundred people. It's better than a thousand. Joker's a force of nature, chaos and evil incarnate. And you don't want the wrath of something like that brought to bare.

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htb106

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#41  Edited By htb106

If Batman wants to stop the Joker he should leave him in a room with Jason Todd.

I actually think if Batman stopped the Joker he would start to get lazy, the Joker is always a big threat for Batman and Gotham and if he was gone I don't think Batman would try as hard to keep up with the criminals.

Joker might see being crippled as a triumph because he's forcing Batman to break his moral code.

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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#42  Edited By Avenging-X-Bolt

Yup the punisher totally keeps the city safe. That's why we have the kingpin killing people everyday in the mu. Despite the fact that the punisher kills his goon. And Batman yup, he's a total villain yup. That's why he puts himself at risk every fucking day saving people lives and whatnot when he could just stay at home and watch tv. Yup, having discipline and self control makes him such a horrible person. Next time you want to call someone retarded go look in the f&$.)ng mirror. And if you hate the world so much,do yourself a favor and take yourself out of it.

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moywar700

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#43  Edited By moywar700

@JonSmith said:

@joshmightbe: He did in the Dark Knight Returns. Twisted Joker's neck just far enough to paralyze him. Joker forced himself to twist his own neck a bit farther so it snapped and killed himself, thus framing Bats for murder.

As for why he doesn't cripple Joker in the mainstream continuity: Plot.

Now for an actual reasonable in-universe explanation: Joker breaks out around every six months and kills around a hundred people. Max. He goes out, stretches his legs, kills a few puppies, gets an ice cream cone, suffocates the ice cream man in the bucket, etc. Batman pops up, and beats him up, sends him back. Joker recovers and does it again. Here's what you've got to understand about the Joker though: He's not doing any of it because it benefits him in some way. He's not doing it for some complicated, tragic reason, like revenge, or love (debatable, not getting into that). He's doing it because he thinks it's fun. He finds it hilarious that these peoples hum-drum lives end so quickly, that something so many people place such great value on, their lives, is snuffed out so easily. That's good. He SHOULD find it funny. You WANT him to find it funny. Why? Because while he's laughing, he's playing. It's a big joke.

Now tell me, can you imagine a thing possibly more terrifying than a Joker who ISN'T joking around? Imagine for a moment if Joker, the psychopathic murderer, the Clown Prince of Crime, stopped laughing, stopped joking around, and got deadly serious. Take a wild guess where the emphasis in that sentence lies. Say Bats crippled him, took away his legs like Joker took away Barbara's. Joker's in a wheelchair. And he won't find that funny. The mad dog has been leashed. Joker IS a joke now, because anyone who might be scared of him now see's a clown in a wheelchair. He's not going to find that funny at all. Which means he's going to get very serious.

So why does Bats not cripple him? Because you should never wound what you can't kill. Crippling the Joker would be shoving him into a corner. You don't want the Joker getting serious. You don't want him putting some of that crazed mind of his to order and focusing it on a true goal. So maybe Joker kills a hundred people. It's better than a thousand. Joker's a force of nature, chaos and evil incarnate. And you don't want the wrath of something brought to bare.

well said

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Rumble Man

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#44  Edited By Rumble Man
@JonSmith:

Kinda disagree with that line of argument really, with joker getting serious batman will finally get a challenge once in his life. Something that will give him the greatest risk, joker wants to end the bat now this is his motivation. All lights are green and both men are in to end each other, Joker gets serious and batman will be ready to end his miserable criminal career behind bars. It will end with joker planning in impotent rage as batman saves gotham again, when the stakes are at its peak as he always does. Both of them are not to be underestimated but batman has done more things than joker. Batman becoming the joker to end the clown prince would be more frightening, but we will enjoy it too (probably in elseworlds). Putting a joker in a corner is a good idea if one is batman, sure the cornered animal bites back but the hunter with the gun will find it to be an easier target. Batman is also a force of nature, justice and an avenging angel. He can deal with the clown.

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JonSmith

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#45  Edited By JonSmith

@Rumble Man: Batman's already had a challenge with a laughing Joker. Joker's already killed people near and dear to Bats, and he did it as a gag. A serious Joker wouldn't be out to end the Bat. That's not how you truly BREAK the Batman. You break his city. You turn every person in the city into desperate savages and watch them tear themselves apart. Bats has fought for so long, block by block, thug by thug, boss by boss, to stop them. To some extent, he's succeeded. But when Joker gets involved, he immediately has Batman's full attention, because he's just that dangerous. Joker won't be planning in impotent rage. He'll be stewing in his own insanity. The difference? Impotent rage is childish, an immature, though natural, response to a situation. The most quick and easy revenge. Joker's mind doesn't work like that. He'd sit there and stew in his own crazy, til he knew he had something good. This wouldn't be about getting Batman's attention, or some grandiose scheme to get at Bats. This would be about taking the city. And Gotham always has one leg off the cliff to fall into madness. Batman is trying to hold it up. What happens when Joker cuts off the hand he's holding it up with? Gotham falls. Yeah, you can put down a cornered animal. With a gun. But I think you forgot something rather important.

Batman doesn't use guns.

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Rumble Man

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#46  Edited By Rumble Man

@JonSmith:

But would that be a problem for the bat? nope, he's fought gods and even kicked around some top level metahumans. The only thing that the joker got going is unpredictability and insanity, bane broke him before but all that did was to make the bat an even stronger person. He will do it again, again ad infinitum. Batman is a deus ex machina in itself, he is the treatment for gotham and the joker is just a lingering virus for the common cold.

True that bud, minus the darkseid bit in pre DCnU and his early run

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JonSmith

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#47  Edited By JonSmith

@Rumble Man: ... We are NOT discussing discrepancies on Batman's apparent feats. And sure he can fight gods. Sure he can kick around top level metahumans. That's easy. Punching things always is. The Joker presents a very different threat. And in regards to Bane breaking him: What doesn't kill you, usually succeeds in a second attempt. Or something like that. As for Joker being a disease for Gotham... Funny thing about cures? Sometimes the disease wins. Like, say. Cancer.

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Skunkstein

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#48  Edited By Skunkstein

Its comic book logic, it really isnt anymore or less than that.

If you wanted a realistic (as much as you can get it) world in comic books, the Joker would be dead a long time ago, in fact a lot of if not almost all villians would be dead.

On another note, i dont even blame Batman for not killing the Joker i blame arkham for not actually putting a stop to him.

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Jonny_Anonymous

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#49  Edited By Jonny_Anonymous

The same reason Superman doesn't lobotomise Lex or Spider-Man brake Green Goblin

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Rumble Man

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#50  Edited By Rumble Man

@JonSmith: Not discrepancies bro, but amounts and bats has more than his rogues. Then batman is the miracle cure he is a panacea. He is also one of DC's smartest.

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