discuss
Batman
Character » Batman appears in 23635 issues.
Bruce Wayne, who witnessed the murder of his billionaire parents as a child, swore to avenge their deaths. He trained extensively to achieve mental and physical perfection, mastering martial arts, detective skills, and criminal psychology. Costumed as a bat to prey on the fears of criminals, and utilizing a high-tech arsenal, he became the legendary Batman.
who does Bruce Wayne/Batman has more love, for Catwoman or Talia?
If his speech to a recovering Selina is to be believed, it's Catwoman. And I think Talia has acknowledged this, even to Catwoman herself. Also, I think numerous alternate universe stories depict Bruce and Selina as a married couple.
Batman loves Talia too. But not completely. I think it's because of Ra's' influence on Talia. Talia loves Bruce/Batman for what he is, Catwoman loves him for who he is. Talia is willing to be the second thing Bruce focuses on after The Mission, Selina isn't.
Suppose Bruce did love Talia more, theoretically, her father is a fundamental part of her life and has always interfered usually with Talia at his side.
Bruce knows this and it makes Talia emotionally unavailable to him in a major way so even if there were a chance it's usually squandered by an inevitable conflict of interest.
I would say Selina is the love of Bruce's life. The two of them aren't exactly fully recovered from their traumas and fears but when they're together they allow themselves to relinquish control and give into their own humanity. Bruce's dialogue with Selina always starts of being Batman but he crumbles down around to her and reveals more of the Bruce in himself. In a way, Catwoman's the only "villain" of Batman's that he doesn't mind being defeated by.
I want to say Zatanna but i know it's a lie. Then I want to say Talia but alas also untrue. I hate to say this but it's the Cat
I had a big debate with CitizenBane about this. I'll just link to my original post to save re-posting EVERYTHING I wrote.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/gen-discussion/1/join-citizenbane-and-raineffects-talia-vs-catwoman-debate/638798/
@Croaker: @HexThis:
Just so you guys know, every time Talia has had to choose between Bruce and Ra's, she's chosen Bruce. Every time. I don't think it has been stated that Bruce doesn't trust her, if anything, he trusts Selina less.
*Waits for CitizenBane to bringeth it* <3
@Croaker said:
Zatanna could be a love interest, but Batman is highly suspicious of metas and magic wielders. And for a good reason. Didn't she alter his memories once?
Yeah she did but he forgave her and a relationship between them would be IMO much cooler than anything with talia or the cat
Huh?@iLLituracy: actually he was until his fiance was shot by a man he thought he could trust
@iLLituracy: Really? He can't love? He doesn't love like a father all his Robins? He doesn't feel a thing about Alfred? The fact he's Batman is irrelevant to the love he had for his parents, that a criminal took away from him? So, he's human, he feels. Now, is he capable of loving a woman? He's in love with Selina, it's written all over his face, his actions, his everything. Does he put her above the mission? Only once and for a while. That means he's incapable of love? For me, it shows his dedication to his cause, willing to sacrifice his personal happiness in order to achieve his goals. I can't find a line from any writer I know, showing he can't love. That's my opinion. Take care!
Wasn't there just a big debate on this?
@HexThis said:
Suppose Bruce did love Talia more, theoretically, her father is a fundamental part of her life and has always interfered usually with Talia at his side.
Bruce knows this and it makes Talia emotionally unavailable to him in a major way so even if there were a chance it's usually squandered by an inevitable conflict of interest.
I would say Selina is the love of Bruce's life. The two of them aren't exactly fully recovered from their traumas and fears but when they're together they allow themselves to relinquish control and give into their own humanity. Bruce's dialogue with Selina always starts of being Batman but he crumbles down around to her and reveals more of the Bruce in himself. In a way, Catwoman's the only "villain" of Batman's that he doesn't mind being defeated by.
This right here sums it up
Who are Bruce Wayne's major love interests? What I could find:
- Selina Kyle
- Talia al Ghul
- Vicki Vale
- Zatanna (or was this only in the Animated Series?)
- Silver St. Cloud
- Julia Pennyworth (briefly)
- Natalia Knight (briefly dated both Batman and Robin without knowing it)
- Rachel Caspian
- Shondra Kinsolving (the telekinetic who healed Bruce's back after Bane broke it)
- Vesper Fairchild
- Sasha Bordeaux
- Chase Meridian (films)
- Julie Madison (the original, predating even Catwoman, also in the films)
- Rachel Dawes (films)
- Pamela Isley? (kind of. some tension there, although I don't think anyone would actually forward her as a serious interest.)
- Diana Prince? (hinted at in various media but never explicitly explored as far as I know.)
Hmm. I thought this list would be longer. I wonder how long Grayson's would be. Hey I should make a list out of this.
...@iLLituracy: Really? He can't love? He doesn't love like a father all his Robins? He doesn't feel a thing about Alfred? The fact he's Batman is irrelevant to the love he had for his parents, that a criminal took away from him? So, he's human, he feels. Now, is he capable of loving a woman? He's in love with Selina, it's written all over his face, his actions, his everything. Does he put her above the mission? Only once and for a while. That means he's incapable of love? For me, it shows his dedication to his cause, willing to sacrifice his personal happiness in order to achieve his goals. I can't find a line from any writer I know, showing he can't love. That's my opinion. Take care!
@iLLituracy said:
@luckydomino1: I was kidding...mostly.I remember typing this. I typed this like...a whole five hours before you replied to me. Why would you even...
Wait. Let me make it bigger so you can see it better.
@iLLituracy said:
@luckydomino1:Still not big enough? Hold on...I was kidding
...mostly.
@iLLituracy said:
@luckydomino1:I was kidding
...mostly.
@iLLituracy said:
@fodigg: Pretty sure Zatanna hasn't had anything with Bruce. I remember they entertained the thought of having something more not that long ago but that was pretty much it.
Paul Dini's Tec,the recent JLA 80 page giant and an arc in Superman/Batman.
i know this is off topic but what about wonder woman they were flirting with each other what happened to that
@RainEffect said:
I had a big debate with CitizenBane about this. I'll just link to my original post to save re-posting EVERYTHING I wrote.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/gen-discussion/1/join-citizenbane-and-raineffects-talia-vs-catwoman-debate/638798/
@Croaker: @HexThis:
Just so you guys know, every time Talia has had to choose between Bruce and Ra's, she's chosen Bruce. Every time. I don't think it has been stated that Bruce doesn't trust her, if anything, he trusts Selina less.
*Waits for CitizenBane to bringeth it* <3
Already discussed this. Justice > Catwoman >>> Talia. Also, in Batman Incorporated, Bruce told Selina she was one of the few people on Earth he completely trusted.
Batman loves Tailia, but because she is who she is, he knows that it'll never works
CATWOMAN IS THE ONE...she understands Bats and loves him, in hush, she's tries to be there for him. she love bruce, and he trusts and loves her,that's why in alternate futures, they're always married
Before he and Selina got so close, it was Talia. But then he realized Selina could actually be in his life without much trouble, and Talia was still playing the "marry me and join my fathers evil clan and rule the world" card, which he has always considered crazy no matter how hot she was... and thats that.
so now, he Loves Selina. but in the new 52 i dont think he loves anybody. I think if hes into anyone seriously, its probably back to the mother of his child. But i think it could happen again eventually
Is it just me or is it annoying when people make a thread and say "Discuss" without giving their own point of view first.
This is why male writers should colab with female writers when writing a love story into a hero's storyline. Men are messy.Talia is a crazy,hot girl that he slept with. He doesn't love her. He was thinking with his bat pee pee.Or more accurately the writer was probably fantasizing about it after a Bond marathon on TBS or something.Look at it like this Talia is like Darla from Dinner with Schmucks only smarter and deadlier. As for Damian, this is a horrible plot twist the writer did because......
A. he wanted to piss off female readers
B. he ran out of ideas and probably used his best friends baby mamma drama as inspiration.
Catwoman is the REAL love interest. Everyone knows that just because she is a thief she is still a good guy. Talia CLEARLY is not a good guy. Even in early Catwoman comics Selina would give some of her loot to charity. Selina does good deeds because she wants to and because she is inspired by (not obsessed with) Batman. Talia only does good when it is in the interest of that little STD Damians welfare or her obsession with Bruce Wayne. Batman sees a female version of himself in Catwoman & if a brilliant writer could take over and write a death match between Talia vs Catwoman with Batman deciding on who lives you better believe Selina would win hands down.He sees good in Catwoman, where all he sees in Talia is a mistake.
@War Killer: I don't know Bruce seemed to pay the most attention to talia in the game granted he was using her for the cure but still
@War Killer: I do agree that if Bruce was gonna settle down then vicki vale woul probably be the best choice but out of the three main love intrest i'd rather see talia come out on top but we can both agree Bruce gets around. I did find it intresting that AC wrote Catwoman off so easily thats the first medium i've seen with Catwoman being that weak of a love intrest.
@War Killer said:
@BlackArmor said:Yeah, I did feel her presence in the game was a bit weak even though she does have a few side-missions that apparently interlock with the main story...but since I don't have the download for her character I'll never know, but from what've heard she still doesn't have as big a role in the game as it would have appeared when she was first announced. Before the game came out I wondered why they picked Tim as Robin and not Damian (seeing as I would've expected DC would want to let people know more about him as he is the current Robin) but with Talia's involvement in the game I could wee where having Damian would have been a bit tricky.@War Killer: I do agree that if Bruce was gonna settle down then vicki vale woul probably be the best choice but out of the three main love intrest i'd rather see talia come out on top but we can both agree Bruce gets around. I did find it intresting that AC wrote Catwoman off so easily thats the first medium i've seen with Catwoman being that weak of a love intrest.
Yeah personally i was happy to see Tim get some screen time outside of comics so i never really thought about Damian but you make a good point. Don't worry about the Catwoman code she's fine to have in challenge mode but in Free roam mode youre better off without her. Her detective mode does more harm than good and how she gets around vs grappling is actually pretty frustrating that along with the fact that her combat is unfocussed and pretty uneffective against small groups of thugs playing as Catwoman is kindof a deathtrap. still her missions aren't bad (well 2 out of 4 are good the other two are better left passed up)
I was glad to see Tim, but there's no denying that his look was based off of Damian's :P Yeah, I'd rather have had Robin be playable in the main game instead of only the challenges seeing as his combat is pretty different from Batman's but still just as fun. Haven't played as Nightwing, but from what I've seen I would say the same from Dick as well.@War Killer said:
@BlackArmor said:Yeah, I did feel her presence in the game was a bit weak even though she does have a few side-missions that apparently interlock with the main story...but since I don't have the download for her character I'll never know, but from what've heard she still doesn't have as big a role in the game as it would have appeared when she was first announced. Before the game came out I wondered why they picked Tim as Robin and not Damian (seeing as I would've expected DC would want to let people know more about him as he is the current Robin) but with Talia's involvement in the game I could wee where having Damian would have been a bit tricky.@War Killer: I do agree that if Bruce was gonna settle down then vicki vale woul probably be the best choice but out of the three main love intrest i'd rather see talia come out on top but we can both agree Bruce gets around. I did find it intresting that AC wrote Catwoman off so easily thats the first medium i've seen with Catwoman being that weak of a love intrest.
Yeah personally i was happy to see Tim get some screen time outside of comics so i never really thought about Damian but you make a good point. Don't worry about the Catwoman code she's fine to have in challenge mode but in Free roam mode youre better off without her. Her detective mode does more harm than good and how she gets around vs grappling is actually pretty frustrating that along with the fact that her combat is unfocussed and pretty uneffective against small groups of thugs playing as Catwoman is kindof a deathtrap. still her missions aren't bad (well 2 out of 4 are good the other two are better left passed up)
@War Killer: Haven't played as either Nightwing or Robin because I haven't been to gamestop. It does seem cheap to limit them to challenge mode I also hope Jason and Damian pop up in later downloadable content
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